Did MJ Find Love In The Dark (continued)

[paisleyCUTtop]

Happy new year everyone!

[Ape]

*****
<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/eP_vJOwGU80" allowfullscreen="" width="560" frameborder="0" height="315"></iframe>hmmm, don't you just have a way with words/music. :) Thanks for posting MP. I've never heard this song before.

[roomdownstairs]

Happy new year to each and every precious heart who posts in this very special thread. :hug:

[Ashtanga]

Happy new year to each and every precious heart who posts in this very special thread. :hug:

:wild: :give_heart:



This thread will always be very special. :girl_sigh: :wub:

[Iceberg]

For 2012, not only for you, but I have repeated numerous times to myself:
KEEP THE FAITH!
So no other human voice would speak so clearly to my ears ...

QUzYa-Wah6U

[MysteriousPhoenix]

For 2012, not only for you, but I have repeated numerous times to myself:
KEEP THE FAITH!
So no other human voice would speak so clearly to my ears ...

QUzYa-Wah6U



Very good! I forgot to add: Faith (in God) ... and Forgiveness!

[Iceberg]

Very good! I forgot to add: Faith (in God) ... and Forgiveness!
This is true, MP! Exactly why I said a human voice.
I'm not in my more optimistic days, but faith in God is what makes me prevail. Where would I be without His mercy and forgiveness.
It is a reflection on forgiveness ....
This thread has the gift of making me think about so many things ...
And I like that;)

Edit:
I just go through the thread http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/threads/118827-Michael-Jackson-Oxford-Union-Speech-March-6th-2001

And I remembered that at the turn of the year, this stretch has not left my mind:


"And now ... with time, rather than bitterness, I feel blessing. In the place of anger, I have found absolution. And in the place of revenge I have found reconciliation. And my initial fury has slowly given way to forgiveness. .. "

[wendijane]

happy new year everyone :flowers:

[Rubi]

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.377163!/img/httpImage/image.jpg

Mike listening to every one of the songs posted to the votes of the New Year ...
Happy New Year!

[Ashtanga]

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.377163!/img/httpImage/image.jpg

Mike listening to every one of the songs posted to the votes of the New Year ...
Happy New Year!

:woohoo: http://www.hornedhalo.org/images/kermit.gif





:cry: *big sigh*

[Iceberg]

Poetry is magically interpreted in several ways, depending on the state state of mind of the reader, but this somehow
touches me, but I think that I could never interpret this poem ....


The Last Tear
Your words stabbed my heart, and I cried tears of pain. "Get out!" I shouted. "These are the last
tears I'll ever cry for you." So you left.
I waited hours, but you didn't return. That night by myself I cried tears of frustration.
I waited weeks, but you had nothing to say. Thinking of your voice, I cried tears of loneliness.
I waited months, but you left no sign for me. In the depths of my heart, I cried tears of despair.
How strange that all these tears could not wash away the hurt! Then one thought of love pierced
my bitterness. I remembered you in the sunlight, with a smile as sweet as May wine. A tear of
gratitude started to fall, and miraculously, you were back. Soft fingers touched my cheek, and
bent over for a kiss.
"Why have you come?" I whispered.
"To wipe away your last tear," you replied. "It was the one you saved for me."

[Lisha]

Poetry is magically interpreted in several ways, depending on the state state of mind of the reader, but this somehow
touches me, but I think that I could never interpret this poem ....

The Last Tear
Your words stabbed my heart, and I cried tears of pain. "Get out!" I shouted. "These are the last
tears I'll ever cry for you." So you left.
I waited hours, but you didn't return. That night by myself I cried tears of frustration.
I waited weeks, but you had nothing to say. Thinking of your voice, I cried tears of loneliness.
I waited months, but you left no sign for me. In the depths of my heart, I cried tears of despair.
How strange that all these tears could not wash away the hurt! Then one thought of love pierced
my bitterness. I remembered you in the sunlight, with a smile as sweet as May wine. A tear of
gratitude started to fall, and miraculously, you were back. Soft fingers touched my cheek, and
bent over for a kiss.
"Why have you come?" I whispered.
"To wipe away your last tear," you replied. "It was the one you saved for me."


Hey, guys, I can't believe no one here responded to Iceberg's good post here with a reply post!

I have been in a discipleship program with a church this month where the requirements are to not be on the internet for any more than about 15 minutes per day...which isn't much...so I have only stopped by briefly here and there. It takes me the whole time if I post, for I am slow in putting together posts.

But I wanted to acknowledge Iceberg's post here and thank her for posting that lovely, The Last Tear, from MJ's book.

It would be quite difficult to interpret, I agree with you, Iceberg. But if one is from the camp of thinking that perhaps MJ did have a "spiritual connection" with his LITD girl (if she exists) then the words could be about how one sad day for him, "she" stopped being present for him through that spiritual connection. Why? Well, from the sound of this "poem" something happened that made him feel hurt by her first. Perhaps she "left" him in this way, not because she meant to, but because he projected something onto her that maybe wasn't even true...and his hurt and negative feelings towards her, shut down his compacity to feel and "hear" her through his "spirit".

So he assumed "she" left, but actually, he became closed to her.

It seems, based on the poem, that as soon as his heart softened toward her again, she was back...in that, the spiritual communication was open to him once again.

Just one out of many ways to look at this. No right or wrong for us in this thread. That's the beauty of it. We just have fun exploring the different possibilities. Right? The good news, is at the end of this poem, MJ communicates that "she" or whoever he is meaning, did in fact care and drew near to the point he could feel it.

Take care, you all! :)

[Ashtanga]

Hey, guys, I can't believe no one here responded to Iceberg's good post here with a reply post!

Well :( ... you know.... The magic is over. :cry: *big sigh*

[Bored]

hey Bored, you asked what this thread was about and I was just thinking it wasn't so nice of me to reply how I did since anyone else would have gotten a reply better than what I gave you and we didn't discuss it offline so... It was all started when AllForMJ (a member here) thought she could see a sparkle in MJ's eye and a little something that would suggest that he had someone in his life. Then she looked at some of his lyrics as well as order songs were released, and photos and such, then took them all together to see that he could possibly be in love even if he hadn't mentioned anyone being in his life. Then we went from there. We've discussed all kinds of things and even made some things up (or at least I have). Sometimes it's just been a fun or nice place to "hang out". There are some amazing posts in here and some really nice thoughts and ideas. It can be pretty mushy and romantic but you might like it anyways. :) Sometimes even goofy in here.
First time I have logged in since then :) sounds interesting I hope to go on more now :P

[Bored]

Hi Bored, nice to see you here on the board.

I wrote that sentence because I was bored.


But... it -is- fun to see you here in this thread which your mom visits and enjoys so much (like the rest of us here). :D

Thanks for stoppin' by. :flowers: You seem fun.
Haha a little late for me to reply but thanks :)

And thanks to anyone else that welcomed me :D

[Iceberg]

Hey, guys, I can't believe no one here responded to Iceberg's good post here with a reply post!

I have been in a discipleship program with a church this month where the requirements are to not be on the internet for any more than about 15 minutes per day...which isn't much...so I have only stopped by briefly here and there. It takes me the whole time if I post, for I am slow in putting together posts.

But I wanted to acknowledge Iceberg's post here and thank her for posting that lovely, The Last Tear, from MJ's book.

It would be quite difficult to interpret, I agree with you, Iceberg. But if one is from the camp of thinking that perhaps MJ did have a "spiritual connection" with his LITD girl (if she exists) then the words could be about how one sad day for him, "she" stopped being present for him through that spiritual connection. Why? Well, from the sound of this "poem" something happened that made him feel hurt by her first. Perhaps she "left" him in this way, not because she meant to, but because he projected something onto her that maybe wasn't even true...and his hurt and negative feelings towards her, shut down his compacity to feel and "hear" her through his "spirit".

So he assumed "she" left, but actually, he became closed to her.

It seems, based on the poem, that as soon as his heart softened toward her again, she was back...in that, the spiritual communication was open to him once again.

Just one out of many ways to look at this. No right or wrong for us in this thread. That's the beauty of it. We just have fun exploring the different possibilities. Right? The good news, is at the end of this poem, MJ communicates that "she" or whoever he is meaning, did in fact care and drew near to the point he could feel it.

Take care, you all! :)


Thanks Shila. I was very pleased with your response.
In time I hope that your discipleship program has been very good.

That's why this thread is so special because we talk about feelings in different angles, without right or wrong, just feelings ...

I liked your answer!
I could not connect to LITD girl, but through his answer was not hard to continue.
And this sense that the poem gives the connection is so strong with the girl LITD, her back to wipe the last tear him in the poem. It seems that YANA is a continuity or answer!

When the poem:
"Why have you come?" I Whispered.
"To wipe away your last tear," you replied. "It was the one you saved for me."

And in music:
" Just the other night / I thought I heard you cry / Asking me to come
And hold you in my arms ...
Something whispers / In my ear and says: / But You Are Not Alone
I am here with you/ Though you're far away/I am here to stay..."

Somehow, the music and the poem: They are not alone, they have each other. Wiping his tears last or listening to your cry!


Well :( ... you know.... The magic is over. :cry: *big sigh*
Ashtanga,
This is especially for you:
For more reasons we have to imagine that the magic was over, our Michael leaves us not forget that the magic never ends!

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9103/magicgo.jpg

[Ashtanga]

Ashtanga,
This is especially for you:
For more reasons we have to imagine that the magic was over, our Michael leaves us not forget that the magic never ends!

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9103/magicgo.jpg


Yes.... :heart: Thanks! :give_heart:



We can not forget the words of Michael... NEVER! :girl_sigh: His words are always in my mind. :wub: But you know :(, sometimes it's hard when I remember that we nevermore see Michael. :no: But OK... move on. :cry: *big sigh*

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Well :( ... you know.... The magic is over. :cry: *big sigh*


A miracle is needed up in heeyah! Hey! Clark Sisters! Can you help us?

Let's all sing together now. Ready? *One ... two ... three*



<IFRAME height=315 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/6EcB4_q7aFE" frameBorder=0 width=420 allowfullscreen></IFRAME>


I'm Looking for a miracle
I expect the impossible
I feel the intangible
I see the invisible
(Repeat to Top)

Bridge:
The sky is the limit
To what I can have
(Repeat x3)

Just believe and receive it
God will perform it today
Hey, Hey
Just believe and receive it
God will perform it today

I'm Looking for a miracle
I expect the impossible
I feel the intangible
I see the invisible
(Repeat to Top)

Bridge:
The Sky is the limit
To what I can have
(Repeat x3)

Just believe and receive it
God will perform it today
Hey, Hey
Just believe and receive it
God will perform it today

Vamp:
I expect a miracle every day,
God will make a way out of no way
(As Directed)



Edit: BTW, is that you in your avatar, Shila? Cute pic, whoever that is. And ... thanks for spending your whole alloted 15 minutes on us! Very nice post!

[Lisha]

MP...you crack me up! SOOO optimistic! What was it that Susan said over and over again with that mundane voice in The Miracle of 34th Street, was it, "I believe, I believe, it's silly but I believe.." Somethun like that anyway.

Okay, MP, I'm gonna repeat these lines then, and I'll let ya know if it works,

"I expect a miracle every day,
God will make a way out of no way!"

I like that. And we all probably need to repeat to ourselves what I know we all in here already know, "All Things Are Possible With God."

I would like to respond to Ash's and Iceberg's posts more but...I can't right now. Time's UP! Plus I'm sick with the stomach flu. If it's not one thing, it's something else...Ooohh boy.

And, yes, MP, that's me at age 14 being silly-ish, I would say. Thanks for thinking it's cute. :) :hug: I ran across it and it made me kinda smile. We need to stay young a heart like that. It was a reminder to me. We can stay fun and silly even as the years go by. I'm gonna try to do just that.

So for now I'll say,

Later all.

*waves*


PS: Hi there, Bored! Say hi to your momma for me! :)

[MysteriousPhoenix]

MP...you crack me up! SOOO optimistic!

Well, this song has become my new anthem for my life. I sing it every day. I'm trying to do what David did in the bible. Didn't it say something like when there was no one around to encourage him he encouraged himself? That is what I am trying to do -- encourage myself! Hey, I think this is pretty good for someone who has long had a propensity for being an incurable pessimist. See ... I'm trying to change my evil ways! lol!





What was it that Susan said over and over again with that mundane voice in The Miracle of 34th Street, was it, "I believe, I believe, it's silly but I believe.." Somethun like that anyway.

Yeah, yeah! That's exactly what I tell myself every day! (And after seeing the clip of the movie again, I think I may have been a lot like "Suzy" when I was a kid. Too serious of a kid! lol!) I bellieve if you keep sayin' it, one day it'll kick right in! Haven't you ever heard of, "Fake it 'till you make it"? lol! Or ... as it says in the one bible passage we have been studying in church (and I think you even brought it up here), "I believe; help thou my unbelief." Pretty much sums it up for me.

Hope your discipleship class is going well. Only 15 minutes on the computer, eh? Wow! Talk about Will Power!




<IFRAME height=315 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/VCefdkufNmY" frameBorder=0 width=420 allowfullscreen></IFRAME>

[MysteriousPhoenix]

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/dsYuqffq4GM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[windy09]

I wish there were someone else as interesting, as good, and who deserves as much respect as Michael out there who I could be a fan of or just be interested in but he is the best. It's not even about his music because I love all kinds of music and his isn't necessarily my favorite. I just miss there being someone out there as creative and fascinating and wonderful. He was a good man, loving father, fun, unique... so unique that nobody really compares. He was fun to be a fan of. He made it all a mystery and like a game but not. Like an important game... maybe game is the wrong word. An adventure. That's it. He made it all a big adventure that felt like it had a very important outcome. Maybe parts of that weren't even a direct result of his doing but it surrounded him. The horrible accusations weren't good, but even that gave us all something to stand up against and fight for because we could easily see it was so wrong and such an injustice because he has done all kinds of good for this world. He's influenced this world heavily in a positive way. Who can be that for me now? I had such admiration for him and what happens now? It's sad.

In many ways, the only one who was like him to me was my father. I didn't realize it until recently but there were so many similarities. If you met the two in person I'm sure you would think I'm nuts for saying it. My dad was a cowboy and carpenter and jack of all trades and in the end he was a sailor, but no one in the world had ever taken me on an adventure like Michael had but my own father. He also loved to sing and create his own music. He loved children and always beamed with pride when holding one of his newborn grandchildren and loved to play with them as they got older. Dad loved to dance and was the best dance partner to have, a great leader. He was creating and inventing things all the time. He had big dreams and was a child at heart for his whole life but could also be serious and give the best advice in any situation. Dad could get furious over injustice but he wanted to take care of things in a non-violent way if possible. He took care of situations. If someone was in trouble, you called my father and he would take care of it. He did that for a stranger just as often as for his own family, but would give his life for my brother and I if he felt it necessary. Nothing intimidated him or if it did, he would face it head on anyways. He had a genius IQ and though he was proud of it, he was humble in his own way too...but could also be cocky about his abilities as well. He also loved my mom throughout his whole life even though they had split up when I was just 6. So he never did remarry or find another to love the way he had with my mom. He died single and we all wished he would have found someone who could have taken care of him, just as we here wish Michael had found someone to be that for him. There are also many ways they aren't alike, but both are so unique and much too much to ever have to lose. I feel lost without a good man around to look up to. To admire. To make me still have hope that maybe there's more out there like them as well.

I don't know why I am writing this here. I hope his kids keep that love of adventure and curiosity in life that their father must have instilled in them, as well as that humanitarian need to help others when they can despite time and time again of people taking advantage of that. It's a good trait to have despite those who will abuse it and despite those who would advise them against having. There are enough good people in the world that it's worth spreading some benefit of the doubt and trust around. Yes be aware of the possibility of bad happening, but be open to all the good as well. I miss having my father around to help me when someone would take advantage of me, but I don't want to quit believing in people just because he isn't here to bail me out or give advice when someone does hurt me.

I miss being the girl my dad raised. This world tries to make skeptics of us all. I want to still believe in the impossible, and possible.

Beautiful and heartfelt. I understand what you say here. Unfortunately I was not lucky enough to have a father like yours but we all still have Michael in our hearts. I know it's not the same but we still have him to inspire us. Michael is my inspiration every single day. In everything I do I ask myself what would be the result of this? Will what I do have a positive or negative impact for my fellow sisters and brothers and the greater good. Michael inspires me to do that because he was inspired to create and give. So i understand it is hard because Michael is not here physically but he has never left our hearts and thoughts. You can be the person that your father and Michael inspired. You just need to stay true to what your learned from them and to yourself. By the way you are not alone. We are here with you. Keep the Faith!

[windy09]

Just want to say that I've been reading through a few posts and I absolutely love this thread. I feel like there is a big hug going on here. I will come back again later today. Need to resume my job search. Much love to everyone <3

[Lainy]

Oh MP this song is so beautiful it is hard to control and hide the tears. You speaks through the songs and do it so masterfully .
I'm too sad by the loss of Whitney. I'll miss her terribly. :sad2:
windy09 this thread is really special. I hope you can feel the warm, loving hug I am sending to you right now! :huggy: I wish you success in your job search.

[hannahmilano]

Ashtanga,
This is especially for you:
For more reasons we have to imagine that the magic was over, our Michael leaves us not forget that the magic never ends!

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9103/magicgo.jpg


Yes.... :heart: Thanks! :give_heart:



We can not forget the words of Michael... NEVER! :girl_sigh: His words are always in my mind. :wub: But you know :(, sometimes it's hard when I remember that we nevermore see Michael. :no: But OK... move on. :cry: *big sigh*

Wow, what a great thread! So far this is my favorite, but I only had time to read a little bit tonight, and since I am new - I have SOOO much reading to do here, there and everywhere!

And a very BIG thank you to AllForMJ for starting this thread and for sharing your thoughts and insight! Truly fantastic!

And to Iceberg, girl - you hit the nail right on the head! The Magic will never end! (loved the link to that beautiful picture!)

To Ashtanga, just wanted to say that I think I understand what you mean here . MJ will never, ever be forgotten - no way! But since his passing, I have had different feelings, different emotions, while listening to his music or watching videos. Just after his passing, it was almost way too painful to even listen to his songs or watch anything with him in it - b/c it would just jolt me into the realization that he was no longer here, that there would never be a new video again, or concerts, or hope of ever meeting him in person! (a hope I held onto every single day, until that horrible day) :(

Then, as time went on, it became a bit easier to do all this. Yet even to this day, there are times when I'm watching some of the videos from the Home Movies- where they usually make me laugh or smile so big- or listening to particular songs (for me, they are Stranger in Moscow, I'll Be There, Will You Be There and Earth Song)...I cry so hard, right down from the center of my soul! :cry:

Indeed, there are times when it's just really, really hard. ((hugs))
I'm just so glad that we have each other and ALL the gifts that MJ left for us!

[Ape]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmsClQ1H0ME

I really like this song and thought maybe it may fit in here. Maybe how many fans have felt. Maybe even how Michael may have felt.

[MysteriousPhoenix]

What message is the universe trying to send with this "oldie, but goodie"???


<IFRAME height=315 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Gtizr2G_7Bk" frameBorder=0 width=420 allowfullscreen></IFRAME>


Lyrics:

Many a tear has to fall
But it's all in the game
All in the wonderful game
That we know as love
You have words with him
And your future's looking dim
But these things
Your hearts can rise above


Once in a while he won't call
But it's all in the game
Soon he'll be there at your side
With a sweet bouquet
And he'll kiss your lips
And caress your waiting fingertips
And your hearts will fly away


Soon he'll be there at your side
With a sweet bouquet
Then he'll kiss your lips
And caress your waiting fingertips
And your hearts will fly away ...

[Iceberg]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmsClQ1H0ME

I really like this song and thought maybe it may fit in here. Maybe how many fans have felt. Maybe even how Michael may have felt.
I do not know what to do with the post of APE.
I love "IRIS" in a way even immeasurable.
The words I want to shout from the four corners: "And I do not want the world to see me
'Cause I do not think they'd Understand That
When everything's made ​​to be broken
I just want you to know who I am "
And to Michael screaming I also (and already cried a lot .. lol):
"And I'd give up forever to touch you
'Cause I know That you feel me somehow
You're the closest to heaven That I'll ever be "
I think one of my big dreams was always to face the look of Mike, just so he could see the love that we always had. But my comfort was always know that he knows the love of his fans.

Thank you APE! beautiful post




What message is the universe trying to send with this "oldie, but goodie"???


<IFRAME height=315 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Gtizr2G_7Bk" frameBorder=0 width=420 allowfullscreen></IFRAME>


Lyrics:

Many a tear has to fall
But it's all in the game
All in the wonderful game
That we know as love
You have words with him
And your future's looking dim
But these things
Your hearts can rise above


Once in a while he won't call
But it's all in the game
Soon he'll be there at your side
With a sweet bouquet
And he'll kiss your lips
And caress your waiting fingertips
And your hearts will fly away


Soon he'll be there at your side
With a sweet bouquet
Then he'll kiss your lips
And caress your waiting fingertips
And your hearts will fly away ...

MP
I also thank you ...
After this reminder of feelings with IRIS, this your song, not that I knew and loved .. came as a comfort. A return of magic. Thank you for this!
Wonderful words with melody! :)

[DWsoul]

DWsoul is back!! Boo-yah! I can't believe how long it's been, and that I am actually here, and actually ALIVE. But well since it's so freaking late (well, early morning) I need to go to bed in a minute. :P But just so you know, I am out of that dangerous situation I was in a few months ago. I am alive, and I am recovering my health, and immersed in study! It is so satisfying to actually attend classes formally. I haven't done that in soooo long!

Anyway, what's been going on lately in this thread? anything fun and interesting? whats the current major topic? I reallllly don't want to read 10 pages right now of catch up! Call me a romantic fool, but love is where it's at! Without love...what are we?

[Lisha]

^ How strange to see you have posted, DWsoul.

Last night when I was lying in bed before going to sleep I was thinking about this thread and so many of those that have posted in the past and have not returned...and you specifically came to mind. o.O. I was thinking about the line of work you had described yourself in and how it was "dangerous"...but I didn't seem to be able to take it literally, because it wasn't making sense to me, and instead was deciding that you meant it was dangerous for your heart because daily you were seeing such sad things. :(

But now you here seem to be making me think you were literally in some kind of danger? Wow!

Glad you are now doing so well, and are in one piece, and good luck with your studies. You seem to be quite excited about it. Good for you. Looking forward to your "romantic" posts to come. :heart:

Well, Ashtanga has disappeared into thin air, and that is another strange thing.

Moddie, AllforMJ, and summer, they seem to have given up when the server change took place in July and their passwords didn't work for them. All of us pushed through till we discovered what happened and got back in, but they seem to have not done that. :(

Mystygrl, Linda, 8701girl, Mysterygirl7, love.him and SoS, are around, but not into posting in the thread anymore. Shhaaaby flitters about here and there...she may return. Sdeidjs took offense and instead of taking the suggestion to post in a way differently than she had been, she completely left. But that does not mean all of her posts were not appreciated...many were. She posted a very interesting post on "Soulmates," do you guys remember, and one on friendship, and a beautiful post where she talked about her struggles and successes with working hard and making things work out for her and her boy as a single mom. And I will always remember her introducing me to the song "Ribbons in the Sky" by Stevie Wonder. So pretty, and to think I had never heard it before. I always think of her now whenever I hear it. :) Favoritetune disappeared into the oblivion, as did Justus, and that fun, silly poet, MimiK, long ago. Who am I forgetting? Probably a few special others...

But for those who have been posting in here lately...thanks! MP, great songs. Ape, Lainy, and hannahmilano and Iceberg: :clap: Ape, the lyrics to that Goo Goo Dolls' song were so great; they totally fit in here.

I think, DWsoul, the most recent "current topic" has been, can we get the magic back in this thread when MJ is no longer with us? Or...can we still enjoy talking about him and his "maybe" litd girl; is there really any point to that now? Or...are there any lyrics left that we have not discussed that would support the litdg exists and he was referring to her? Or...should this thread be only now for us to talk about things in general that have to do with love or share things about ourselves in a thread where it is safe to do so and our friends here care? Pick one, or any combination of them. :)

The latest album that is supposedly going to be released of Michael motown songs, "Icon" has a few songs on it that I had never heard before, which are quite good, and have lyrics that could give us some things to discuss. True, they are songs that young Mike sang...but if we stick with the idea that God was involving Michael with a Love So Divine perhaps the lyrics being fitting for this future topic of a LITD was no accident.

I may come back later and post one of the songs...

For now, blessings to all of you. :flowers:



PS: oh, some others who have been here lately or are ones to check in with us now and then: roomdownstairs, paisleyCUTtop, bored, Rubi, lulubelle, Lorraine, wendijane, Autumn, Lily, windy09! *waves to all* :)

[DWsoul]

Lisha, thank you so much for posting! Fascinating that you would think of me, just last night! very interesting. I am very sorry to hear of so many gone; from what i have seen of this thread it seems they were the main glue that held this thing together. :( in my humble opinion, ppl really should stick with this thread, not necessarily because of the topic, but because of what i see in the love and comradarie in general, between each other, and of course, toward Michael. This thread doesn't have to die just because Michael is gone. Love doesn't die, does it? I hope not.

[DWsoul]

*~*~*~*~sparkle sparkle~*~*~*~*~ How to resuscitate this thread??? hmmm. EMERGENCY!! DOES ANYONE HERE KNOW CPR???? Breathe life back up in here. Love CAN"T die!! NO! I refuse it! Without it, the world can't turn round. And whether Mike had a mystery girl(s) or not, ok either way it goes. The main point is, Mike knows what love is. And millions (billions??) responded to that love. He soaks it up, and resonates it back. But more important, he also knows intimate love, even when he couldn't be with the one(s) he loves dearly. Love knows no distance. Love is patient, as they say. And if you know love, then you know God (whoever God is to you), because Love = God. And you know how it is said, "Love your neighbor as yourself"? Well, first of all, if you don't love yourself very much, how can you love others very much, truly? Sometimes it seems ironic that a person has to learn self-love before loving others, when we live in a world where to love yourself is portrayed as being selfish!!!. But when u think about it (self love), it makes sense. Second of all, and this will get you... your neighbor (your fellow humans) IS yourself!! We are all part of this cosmic dance. We have all been here forever, well, since time/matter came to exist, anyway, in some form or another, we have all shared each other's atoms over all this time. Just because we are born into different bodies NOW doesn't mean we haven't been part of another BEFORE. So, in the literal sense, if you love yourself, how can you NOT love your fellow man/woman? They are you.

Deep, huh?

Micheal has deep, deep love for his fellow man/woman. Intensely deep. He has had his low points many times in how he has felt about himself, and we all go through that. But, his love for others helped to balance those times out. It's the Love Dance, with it's ups and downs and its all arounds, it's twirls and swirls, its backwards and forwards, its mountains and valleys, its seduction and pain,...you get the idea.

Will this interlude jumpstart this thread? maybe. I hope it is read.

[Lisha]

*~*~*~*~sparkle sparkle~*~*~*~*~

Was this above what you did to indicate you have just touched this thread twice with a magic wand? lol. cute.


I love any excuse I can get to post MJ doin' Another Part of Me from the Bad Tour at Kansas City. Your above post could just give me that excuse...don't tempt me...

[DWsoul]

Too late...u have been tempted. go for it!

[DWsoul]

bibbity bobbity boo!


Was this above what you did to indicate you have just touched this thread twice with a magic wand? lol. cute.

[Lisha]

hahaha...well, hand me some of that pixie dust to sprinkle over Mike here doin' his thing in such a way that makes me reaaaaalllyy regret not seeing him at the end of this tour when he was doin his last few shows in LA. *smacks her head*

ArlcUEEXhhk



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArlcUEEXhhk

Thanks so much for giving me permission to post this...imma feelin' GUILT FREE! *moves some more to the beat*

(you did, btw, DWsoul, make some good points in your post regarding love and loving one's neighbor as oneself)

[DWsoul]

oh he don't need no pixie dust...he's got his groove on enuf as it is! *slaps head remembering the xyz*

[Lisha]

True, his magic came from within him, and he didn't need anything extra sprinkled on him. :) How blessed he was to feel so connected to God's Spirit while he was on the stage performing and so naturally did those wonderful things he would do that was so very enjoyable to watch and respond to.

I get a kick out of watching him do his multiple spins, all through the years at different ages in so many videos, and notice that he seemed to really have no idea where he was going to end up facing when he stopped. Yet, he always very smoothly made his next move in such a way as to get him facing the front again. hahaha. It looked intentional mostly when he ended up facing with his back to the audience, like I believe he does in the above video, it looks sharp with his one arm straight up making a striking pose....but when he kinda ends up facing the side or kittycorner, ...I dunno...lol. ;)


Such an amazing and electrifying performer, as I think the above video demonstrates!

[DWsoul]

The Cosmic Dance...

You do know don't you, that "Another Part of Me" is an extremely deep song? I mean, really, really deep. It seems lighthearted and fun, but the lyrics say EXACTLY what I was mentioning earlier. That we are all part of each other, and he is a part of us/we are part of him. There's a bright future ahead, and he's seen it. He has a MESSAGE, if only we'll listen. In reality, he is a singing philosopher/prophesier. The music is more about the deeper meaning of things, than it is about entertainment. Singing and dancing is just...his way of communicating it. To those who will take heed.

[Lisha]

That's why I said your post reminded me of that particular song. The lyrics are saying the same kind of things your post was communicating. It is a song with a deeper meaning. When God who is all created all, including every single human being who has walked this earth, he gave life to that which was of Himself. Therefore, we are all a part of God, a part of His universe, a part of all creation, and a part of each other.

I do acknowledge I was seeming to be making light of what you were trying to get across, but that doesn't mean I wasn't understanding your intentions to bring attention to us on how important it is for all of us to try to love one another, and to reach out to help others from a place of love when we see the hurting, the needy, etc. Where this kind of love is present, then God can move...nothing will obstruct Him.

[DWsoul]

Here's one that is quite appropriate, don't you all think?

http://youtu.be/FMFP2TCXapg

[DWsoul]

oops here it is

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FMFP2TCXapg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Love You for a Thousand Years

[Lorraine]

PS: oh, some others who have been here lately or are ones to check in with us now and then: roomdownstairs, paisleyCUTtop, bored, Rubi, lulubelle, Lorraine, wendijane, Autumn, Lily, windy09! *waves to all* :) Thank you for remembering me :) I haven't posted that much nor have I contributed much in discussion in this thread so to be remembered was nice. Hope you are all well :hug:

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Well ... I'm glad others are stepping in to resurrect this thread. My wings had grown weary trying to keep it afloat. Now this mysterious bird can go build a nest and set herself ablaze!!! And return sometime in the future - renewed.

p.s. I am worried about Ashtanga.

[MJLoverForEver]

The Cosmic Dance...

You do know don't you, that "Another Part of Me" is an extremely deep song? I mean, really, really deep. It seems lighthearted and fun, but the lyrics say EXACTLY what I was mentioning earlier. That we are all part of each other, and he is a part of us/we are part of him. There's a bright future ahead, and he's seen it. He has a MESSAGE, if only we'll listen. In reality, he is a singing philosopher/prophesier. The music is more about the deeper meaning of things, than it is about entertainment. Singing and dancing is just...his way of communicating it. To those who will take heed.

I was typing and for some reason power went off and I lost everything, but I wanted to still say in brief what I wanted to post.
First I glad you are reviving this kind of discussion. Michael`s songs were about God`s will with us in this world.
I do agree with most of you that, Michael was not about intertainment, but God`s work. Remember Michael said, he was an instrument of God. What he wrote as lyrics in songs came from above, from God and he would let God fill him with words.
Like DWsoul said, Michael was a prophecy and he didn`t sing or write songs for intertainment. His songs lyrics are almost all prophetic. When intertainment wanted him to do his work according to their norms, he refused then he paid the prise. He sticked to his mission on earth until the end. He didn`t clink to life or fame or wealth. He sticked to what God wanted him to do for the same of mankind on earth to understand and get ready for end of days which are very near. Although he lost his earthly body, he gained alot with God and for us, we gain with him for through his death, we can get together and reflect on his work, including, reflecting on meanings of his songs, something we were not able to do while he was on earth.
Jesus said, those who try to make their life secure, will lose it but those who lose their life, will keep it. Michael has managed to keep his life by allowing to loose it, even when there was alot of accusassion and prosecution, he endured till the end

As to the song, Another part of me, it is fascinating. Yes he is calling on us believers not to be afraid, for we are here for a mission of changing and eventually taking over the kingdom of this world for God to rein on earth through us

Another Part Of Me"


We're Takin' Over
We Have The Truth
This Is The Mission
To See It Through

Don't Point Your Finger
Not Dangerous
This Is Our Planet
You're One Of Us

We're Sendin' Out
A Major Love
And This Is Our
Message To You
(Message To You)
The Planets Are Linin' Up
We're Bringin' Brighter Days
They're All In Line
Waitin' For You
Can't You See . . .?
You're Just Another Part Of Me . .

A Rather Nation
Fulfill The Truth
The Final Message
We're Bring To You
There Is No Danger
Fulfill The Truth
So Come Together
We're Mean Is You

We're Sendin' Out
A Major Love
And This Is Our
Message To You
(Message To You)
The Planets Are Linin' Up
We're Bringin' Brighter Days
They're All In Line
Waitin' For You
So Look The Truth
You're Just Another Part Of Me . .

We're Sendin' Out
A Major Love
And This Is Our
Message To You
(Message To You)
The Planets Are Linin' Up
We're Bringin' Brighter Days
They're All In Line
Waitin' For You
Can't You See . . .?
You're Just Another Part Of Me
Another Part Of Me . .

We're Takin' Over
This Is The Truth, Baby
Another Part Of Me

[Lisha]

Thank you, MJLoverForEver, for posting the lyrics to the song, Another Part of Me. And I'm sorry that you lost the first post you typed out. :( That's always maddening when that happens. But thank you for putting out the effort to bring us in another post some of the thoughts you had originally posted. That's very special what you have written there in your sig...I bet Michael would be honored to have been such an influence to you in such a way.



oops here it is

<IFRAME height=315 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FMFP2TCXapg" frameBorder=0 width=420 allowfullscreen></IFRAME>

Love You for a Thousand Years

That's a nice video, and I like the song and its lyrics. Never heard it before. I guess it's associated with Twilight? I'm thinking, though, that you selected this video more for the types of photos of Michael that were used, which show so much his caring, giving nature, than for the song, which is rather lovey-dovey romantic. Or maybe I'm wrong...was it because of the song? Lovey-dovey songs do work in here, that's for sure.

Oh, btw, DWsoul, does that DW stand for Dinah Washington? She was one of my mom's favorites, if not her favorite female vocalist back in the day. I believe I heard her voice often coming from a vinyl record playing on our livingroom hi-fi stereo when I was a very small thing. :)


Thank you for remembering me :) I haven't posted that much nor have I contributed much in discussion in this thread so to be remembered was nice. Hope you are all well :hug:

Lorraine, of course...I always enjoy your visits in here!!! They make me smile.


Well ... I'm glad others are stepping in to resurrect this thread. My wings had grown weary trying to keep it afloat. Now this mysterious bird can go build a nest and set herself ablaze!!! And return sometime in the future - renewed.

p.s. I am worried about Ashtanga.

Sometime in the future....sniff, sniff...byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. *cries*

It would probably put you (and many) at peace if Ash could somehow post and let us know why she stopped posting here on MJJC. Considering how active she was, it is so extreme to have her not here at all. It would naturally make one wonder what could be the reason for it. I hope she is fine and there is no need to worry.

Here is one of the songs from Icon that made me think of MJ and his LITD girl (if there ever was one). It could be viewed now as bitter-sweet, though, since time obviously "ran out for them." But before the sad day of June 25, '09...was MJ trying to get a similar message to "her" that is being conveyed in this oldie motown song? Maybe he was hoping "she'd" hang in there just a little longer until he got his life back where he wanted after his run at the O2. Hm...*sigh*...well, anyway, I really like the lyrics. Not trying to make everyone too sad in all of this...

DfO6xs1U1hI&feature

No matter how hard the task may seem
Don't give up our plan, don't give up our dreams
No broken bridges can turn us around
'Cause what we're searchin for will soon be found

'Cause we're almost there,
Just one more step, just one more step,
don't give up, girl, 'cause we're almost there

Look at the lonely lovers that didn't make it
Life's long hard climb, they just couldn't take it
Don't let it happen to me and you
Hold on together, darlin', we'll make it through

Love, keep on reachin out for me, keep on reachin
Do it for me, do it for me
'cause baby, we're almost there

We're so close I can taste it
A life so sweet, we can't afford to waste it

Can't you feel your hand slippin' from mine?
Just hold on tighter, darlin', keep on tryin'!

Baby...
Just one more step,
Don't give up, just one more step,
baby, baby, don't give up
Keep on, keep on, just one more step,
'cause we're almost there

adlibs... Just one more step, 'cause we're almost there
We've come too far to turn around
Keep on reachin for higher ground
We've had our ups, we've had our downs,
But nothing in the world, darlin', will turn us around...
we're almost there, we're almost there, we're almost there...
etc...


I especially like these two lines for some reason:

Can't you feel your hand slippin' from mine?
Just hold on tighter, darlin', keep on tryin'!

Because, just imagine how hard it would have been for her(our imagined LITD girl) if "her" only way "she" got communication from him was through song lyrics, or as we have talked about before, through dreams or a spiritual connection, or maybe little hints he'd drop that only "she'd" understand in things he did that was caught in the media...kinda like we would watch for in here as signs, that he was aware of us, and this thread (imagine how "she" would be watching for some kind of encouragement or signs, if his fans even do it). So "her" having discouragement and wanting to "give up" or "wake up and smell the coffee"...and "get back into reality"...all that kind of stuff, would be plaguing "her"...wouldn't ya think? So if he was attuned to "her" spiritually, wouldnt he maybe pick up on "her" discouragement when "she" was overcome by it, and figuratively "feel her hand start to slip from his"?

(MP, I'm just trying to feel in for ya till you return...hope I'm doing okay...lol)

Also, as a side note, you all probably have noticed how MJ, when he was interacting with a very young child, would have a instinctive pull to sweetly and softly stroke the back of his hand and fingers across their cheeks. I find I have that pull, too, at times. And looking at this pic of the young man, Michael, that we see in here in this video, while We're Almost There is being played, because... so much more of his life at the time of this pic is ahead of him, and many troubles are coming, which we all know about, and much pain already has happened in his heart by that young age...

well, it makes me wish I could stroke his cheek in the same way to let him know he is seen for who he is and all of that negative stuff doesn't matter anymore. And even at that age, just who he was then was worthy to be loved and be appreciated.

I bet many of you would agree. :)

Anyway, I like his face there.

[DWsoul]

No, it doesn't stand for Dinah Washington (I'm wondering, why are several people trying to figure out what "DW" stands for??? Why is it important? Someone fill me in?) Anyway, the song I posted was really a combination of the song and the montage set to it. Yes, it's from Twilight, but I'm not really a Twilight fan. The song speaks to me more than anything, I love it, (and Christina Perri), and I thought it would go well with something about Mike and his LITD.

[DWsoul]

Sorry, didn't mean to make that sound like it came off as harsh. :( If it did, I apologize.

[Lisha]

^Are several people trying to figure out what the DW is in your name? o.O

I had no idea.

I only remember teasing you last time you were about, asking if you were Denzel Washington, just to be silly... so... I couldn't resist throwing yet another DW name at ya. I'd love for my own entertainment to think of some other DWs...but I will forgo that most certainly now. :) If one playfully throws a ball at another, and that person doesn't catch it and throw it back in like...there is no point to play further. :)

I like Christina Perri's vocal style in that song. I enjoyed her voice. I can see why you love the song. :flowers: Thanks again for posting the video.


EDIT: Oh, just saw now your second post. btw, do you know how to use the "edit" function so you can add into your existing post instead of making a "double post", or second post in a row?

Anyway, as far as sounding harsh...not sure about that, but your annoyance seemed evident. And annoyance coming through can change the tone of things.

[Lainy]

Well ... I'm glad others are stepping in to resurrect this thread. My wings had grown weary trying to keep it afloat. Now this mysterious bird can go build a nest and set herself ablaze!!! And return sometime in the future - renewed.

p.s. I am worried about Ashtanga.

Aw MP. It's sad to hear it... :( *looking forward to your back* :timer:

I used to keep in touch with Ash on Facebook but she is no longer there. I don't really know what happened... as Lisha has said "I hope she is fine and there is no need to worry".

Last night when I was lying in bed before going to sleepI was thinking about this thread and so many of those that have posted in the past and have not returned...

Moddie, AllforMJ, and summer, they seem to have given up when the server change took place in July and their passwords didn't work for them. All of us pushed through till we discovered what happened and got back in, but they seem to have not done that. :(

Mystygrl, Linda, 8701girl, Mysterygirl7, love.him and SoS, are around, but not into posting in the thread anymore. Shhaaaby flitters about here and there...she may return. Sdeidjs took offense and instead of taking the suggestion to post in a way differently than she had been, she completely left. But that does not mean all of her posts were not appreciated...many were. She posted a very interesting post on "Soulmates," do you guys remember, and one on friendship, and a beautiful post where she talked about her struggles and successes with working hard and making things work out for her and her boy as a single mom. And I will always remember her introducing me to the song "Ribbons in the Sky" by Stevie Wonder. So pretty, and to think I had never heard it before. I always think of her now whenever I hear it. :) Favoritetune disappeared into the oblivion, as did Justus, and that fun, silly poet, MimiK, long ago. Who am I forgetting? Probably a few special others...

The latest album that is supposedly going to be released of Michael motown songs, "Icon" has a few songs on it that I had never heard before, which are quite good, and have lyrics that could give us some things to discuss. True, they are songs that young Mike sang...but if we stick with the idea that God was involving Michael with a Love So Divine perhaps the lyrics being fitting for this future topic of a LITD was no accident.

PS: oh, some others who have been here lately or are ones to check in with us now and then: roomdownstairs, paisleyCUTtop, bored, Rubi, lulubelle, Lorraine, wendijane, Autumn, Lily, windy09! *waves to all*
Too many good people contributed to keep this thread. I miss those times... things just don't seem the same as the used to be but I feel the magic is not over, only sleeping...
Thanks DWsoul, Ape, Lisha, MP, Iceberg, hannahmilano, MJLoverForEver... for keeping this thread.


Originally Posted by DWsoul

You do know don't you, that "Another Part of Me" is an extremely deep song? I mean, really, really deep. It seems lighthearted and fun, but the lyrics say EXACTLY what I was mentioning earlier. That we are all part of each other, and he is a part of us/we are part of him. There's a bright future ahead, and he's seen it. He has a MESSAGE, if only we'll listen. In reality, he is a singing philosopher/prophesier.

Yes. I agree... I think the same.


I especially like these two lines for some reason:

Can't you feel your hand slippin' from mine?
Just hold on tighter, darlin', keep on tryin'!

Because, just imagine how hard it would have been for her(our imagined LITD girl) if "her" only way "she" got communication from him was through song lyrics, or as we have talked about before, through dreams or a spiritual connection, or maybe little hints he'd drop that only "she'd" understand in things he did that was caught in the media...kinda like we would watch for in here as signs, that he was aware of us, and this thread (imagine how "she" would be watching for some kind of encouragement or signs, if his fans even do it). So "her" having discouragement and wanting to "give up" or "wake up and smell the coffee"...and "get back into reality"...all that kind of stuff, would be plaguing "her"...wouldn't ya think? So if he was attuned to "her" spiritually, wouldnt he maybe pick up on "her" discouragement when "she" was overcome by it, and figuratively "feel her hand start to slip from his"?

(MP, I'm just trying to feel in for ya till you return...hope I'm doing okay...lol)

player_embedded&v


Also, as a side note, you all probably have noticed how MJ, when he was interacting with a very young child, would have a instinctive pull to sweetly and softly stroke the back of his hand and fingers across their cheeks. I find I have that pull, too, at times. And looking at this pic of the young man, Michael, that we see in here in this video, while We're Almost There is being played, because... so much more of his life at the time of this pic is ahead of him, and many troubles are coming, which we all know about, and much pain already has happened in his heart by that young age...

well, it makes me wish I could stroke his cheek in the same way to let him know he is seen for who he is and all of that negative stuff doesn't matter anymore. And even at that age, just who he was then was worthy to be loved and be appreciated.

I bet many of you would agree. :)

Anyway, I like his face there.

:girl_sigh:

[MysteriousPhoenix]

"It won't be easy, you'll think it strange when I try to explain how I feel (this song belongs in the LITD thread) ..."

I have been drawn to listen to this song quite a bit lately. This song reminds me of a letter MJ could've written to his LITD. Sure, he wasn't the wife of a South American political leader and her (his LITD's) name probably wasn't "Argentina" either. So, the lyrics may need a little "tweaking," but we here in this thread are good at being able to read between the lines.



<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FCtg29-9GsE" frameBorder="0" width="560" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>


Don't Cry For Me Argentina

Lyrics:

It won't be easy, you'll think it strange
When I try to explain how I feel
That I still need your love after all that I've done

You won't believe me
All you will see is a girl you once knew
Although she's dressed up to the nines
At sixes and sevens with you

I had to let it happen, I had to change
Couldn't stay all my life down at heel
Looking out of the window, staying out of the sun

So I chose freedom
Running around, trying everything new
But nothing impressed me at all
I never expected it to

[Chorus:]
Don't cry for me Argentina
The truth is I never left you
All through my wild days
My mad existence
I kept my promise
Don't keep your distance

And as for fortune, and as for fame
I never invited them in
Though it seemed to the world they were all I desired

They are illusions
They are not the solutions they promised to be
The answer was here all the time
I love you and hope you love me

Don't cry for me Argentina

[chorus]

Have I said too much?
There's nothing more I can think of to say to you.
But all you have to do is look at me to know
That every word is true

[Lisha]

Ooohh, MP...sometimes you and I can be so in sync...you know how you have interesting dreams with songs in the background at times...well, one night, quite a few months ago, a long time ago now, I had a dream where MJ was sitting at the piano and he was playing a song and singing it in French. I thought to myself, "I know this tune" and I started to sing it with him in English, and he joined in singing English as well, and we were singing these lines together:

The truth is I never left you
All through my wild days
My mad existence
I kept my promise
Don't keep your distance

I was thinking to myself as we were singing, as probably any fan would, "Oh my gosh, I'm singing along with the extremely talented singer MICHAEL JACKSON...gaaaaahhhhhhh...what AM I thinking?!" but then I thought, "hey, I'm doing okay, I haven't gone too off key yet" lol, and he even harmonized with me here and there and I didn't go off, wow. Miracle! haha.

The dream had quite an effect on me after I woke up...it really stayed and seemed so real.

Wait, I think I can find the exact date when I dreamt it, for I think I noted it in a journal. It seemed like such a strange dream for me to dream, so I would have written it down. Let me go look...

~Yep, I did jot it down in my journal and I had the dream during the night of April 18, 2010. Wow, that's a while ago.

Anyway, I woke up right at that point, after we held together the last note, and there I was in the middle of the night thinking how odd...that song...those particular words...

So, was the dream telling me ..maybe...the LITD girl is French!...or speaks French? Hmmm....

I don't even know how I knew it so surely it was French since I don't speak it, although I took a semester of it in High School. I remember not a thing! :lol:

Anyway, how fun you bring this very song up and connect it to MJ and his LITD girl. :clapping: HEY...I thought you were on a haitus!!! Sooooo glad you came back so soon. See, you always have good things to share in here! :hug:

If you replace lyrics to represent a guy's perspective and him singing it...it does really fit MJ quite well with things of his life, his celebrity and such. Nice job, MP.

And "hi" Lainy!!! :dancin:

[MJLoverForEver]

Thank you, MJLoverForEver, for posting the lyrics to the song, Another Part of Me. And I'm sorry that you lost the first post you typed out. :( That's always maddening when that happens. But thank you for putting out the effort to bring us in another post some of the thoughts you had originally posted. That's very special what you have written there in your sig...I bet Michael would be honored to have been such an influence to you in such a way.




Here is one of the songs from Icon that made me think of MJ and his LITD girl (if there ever was one). It could be viewed now as bitter-sweet, though, since time obviously "ran out for them." But before the sad day of June 25, '09...was MJ trying to get a similar message to "her" that is being conveyed in this oldie motown song? Maybe he was hoping "she'd" hang in there just a little longer until he got his life back where he wanted after his run at the O2. Hm...*sigh*...well, anyway, I really like the lyrics. Not trying to make everyone too sad in all of this...

DfO6xs1U1hI&feature

No matter how hard the task may seem
Don't give up our plan, don't give up our dreams
No broken bridges can turn us around
'Cause what we're searchin for will soon be found

'Cause we're almost there,
Just one more step, just one more step,
don't give up, girl, 'cause we're almost there

Look at the lonely lovers that didn't make it
Life's long hard climb, they just couldn't take it
Don't let it happen to me and you
Hold on together, darlin', we'll make it through

Love, keep on reachin out for me, keep on reachin
Do it for me, do it for me
'cause baby, we're almost there

We're so close I can taste it
A life so sweet, we can't afford to waste it

Can't you feel your hand slippin' from mine?
Just hold on tighter, darlin', keep on tryin'!

Baby...
Just one more step,
Don't give up, just one more step,
baby, baby, don't give up
Keep on, keep on, just one more step,
'cause we're almost there

adlibs... Just one more step, 'cause we're almost there
We've come too far to turn around
Keep on reachin for higher ground
We've had our ups, we've had our downs,
But nothing in the world, darlin', will turn us around...
we're almost there, we're almost there, we're almost there...
etc...


I especially like these two lines for some reason:

Can't you feel your hand slippin' from mine?
Just hold on tighter, darlin', keep on tryin'!

Because, just imagine how hard it would have been for her(our imagined LITD girl) if "her" only way "she" got communication from him was through song lyrics, or as we have talked about before, through dreams or a spiritual connection, or maybe little hints he'd drop that only "she'd" understand in things he did that was caught in the media...kinda like we would watch for in here as signs, that he was aware of us, and this thread (imagine how "she" would be watching for some kind of encouragement or signs, if his fans even do it). So "her" having discouragement and wanting to "give up" or "wake up and smell the coffee"...and "get back into reality"...all that kind of stuff, would be plaguing "her"...wouldn't ya think? So if he was attuned to "her" spiritually, wouldnt he maybe pick up on "her" discouragement when "she" was overcome by it, and figuratively "feel her hand start to slip from his"?

(MP, I'm just trying to feel in for ya till you return...hope I'm doing okay...lol)

Also, as a side note, you all probably have noticed how MJ, when he was interacting with a very young child, would have a instinctive pull to sweetly and softly stroke the back of his hand and fingers across their cheeks. I find I have that pull, too, at times. And looking at this pic of the young man, Michael, that we see in here in this video, while We're Almost There is being played, because... so much more of his life at the time of this pic is ahead of him, and many troubles are coming, which we all know about, and much pain already has happened in his heart by that young age...

well, it makes me wish I could stroke his cheek in the same way to let him know he is seen for who he is and all of that negative stuff doesn't matter anymore. And even at that age, just who he was then was worthy to be loved and be appreciated.

I bet many of you would agree. :)

Anyway, I like his face there.

Wow, the song is wonderful.
I am hearing it for the first time. I thought I knew most of MJ songs; i am amazed
The song though, doesn't sound like he is talking about a realy girl or woman. Michael played God communicating to people in this song. Like he said, he was an instrument of God to feed on God's word then communicate to us

Remember, He said that, he did not write a single song about him other than Have you seen my childhood?

Childhood lyrics
Have you seen my Childhood?
I'm searching for the world that I come from
'Cause I've been looking around
In the lost and found of my heart...
No one understands me
They view it as such strange eccentricities...
'Cause I keep kidding around
Like a child, but pardon me...

People say I'm not okay
'Cause I love such elementary things...
It's been my fate to compensate,
for the Childhood
I've never known...

Have you seen my Childhood?
I'm searching for that wonder in my youth
Like pirates in adventurous dreams,
Of conquest and kings on the throne...
(From: http://www.elyrics.net/read/m/michael-jackson-lyrics/childhood-lyrics.html)

Before you judge me, try hard to love me,
Look within your heart then ask,
Have you seen my Childhood?

People say I'm strange that way
'Cause I love such elementary things,
It's been my fate to compensate,
for the Childhood I've never known...

Have you seen my Childhood?
I'm searching for that wonder in my youth
Like fantastical stories to share
The dreams I would dare, watch me fly...

Before you judge me, try hard to love me.
The painful youth I've had

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Ooohh, MP...sometimes you and I can be so in sync...you know how you have interesting dreams with songs in the background at times...well, one night, quite a few months ago, a long time ago now, I had a dream where MJ was sitting at the piano and he was playing a song and singing it in French. I thought to myself, "I know this tune" and I started to sing it with him in English, and he joined in singing English as well, and we were singing these lines together:

The truth is I never left you
All through my wild days
My mad existence
I kept my promise
Don't keep your distance


:swoon: Must really mean something, then. Will go back and listen to song again. April 18, 2010, eh? Wow! Almost two years ago and this song has come back around! And yes, that IS an interesting choice of song in the dream to be singing. Can't quite figure out the French connection, though.





If you replace lyrics to represent a guy's perspective and him singing it...it does really fit MJ quite well with things of his life, his celebrity and such. Nice job, MP.


Yes, replace the lyrics to represent a guy's perspective. Although when it comes to the singing part, I kinda envision in my mind's eye her reading/singing it as a letter written by him to her, so it would still be a female's voice. I guess I'm kinda looking at the whole thing like a movie or play with her reading/ singing to the audience the very last and very mysterious letter he had written to her before leaving her. But him singing it himself would've worked, too. Oh, also at the end where the song crescendos after she sings:
"... All you have to do is look at me to know that every word is true." I envision her turning around and seeing him or at least a vision of him. What an imagination, eh? I don't know why I'm getting so involved with this, lol! Maybe it's just the dramatic nature of the song that is inspiring it. Oh, well! *Don't sue me, Andrew Lloyd Webber!* lol!

Edit: Heard this song while grocery shopping. Actually pretty nice song to grocery shop to!

<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/--8Ju1jb8Bw" frameBorder="0" width="420" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>

Our Day Will Come
Ruby & The Romantics

Lyrics:

Our day will come
And we'll have everything.
We'll share the joy
Falling in love can bring.

No one can tell me
That I'm too young to know (young to know)
I love you so (love you so)
And you love me.

Our day will come
If we just wait a while.
No tears for us -
Think love and wear a smile.

Our dreams have magic
Because we'll always stay
In love this way
Our day will come.
(Our day will come; our day will come.)

[break]

Our dreams have magic
Because we'll always stay
In love this way.
Our day will come.
Our day will come.

[TheBadTour1988]

MMMM Great Post Man Thanks

[Ashtanga]

p.s. I am worried about Ashtanga.



It would probably put you (and many) at peace if Ash could somehow post and let us know why she stopped posting here on MJJC. Considering how active she was, it is so extreme to have her not here at all. It would naturally make one wonder what could be the reason for it. I hope she is fine and there is no need to worry.

Aw MP. It's sad to hear it... :( *looking forward to your back* :timer:

I used to keep in touch with Ash on Facebook but she is no longer there. I don't really know what happened... as Lisha has said "I hope she is fine and there is no need to worry".



:o


http://www.messentools.com/images/emoticones/humor/www.MessenTools.com-Humor-pelos-locos.gif


Hey people.... http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/Smileys/popos/bearhug.sml.gif :group: :give_heart: I'M BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!! :woohoo: :shifty: http://www.messbrasil.com.br/imagens_emoticons//Smiley/////035ani-messbrasil.gif

I'm OK, do not worry. :) What happened was that my laptop died http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Na4CPVnGtCk/SNGrGdzmd9I/AAAAAAAABdU/xEnzRzhZYeA/S368/cabecadanocomp[1].gif http://i683.photobucket.com/albums/vv191/L3onardus/Myanimelist/247.gif , I lost many, many, many important files :doh: and had to buy a new laptop. I received it this week and I am organizing it. ;) I also used my laptop to work, but I only had time to be available in MJJC in my home. :( At work it was impossible to be there. :perrin: And as I had no laptop :cry: .... I was disappeared all this time. But now I'm back! http://www.hornedhalo.org/images/kermit.gif I received some pm's of some people :shifty: :fortuneteller: , I'll answer this weekend. ;) Right!? ;) http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif







Wow, what a great thread! So far this is my favorite, but I only had time to read a little bit tonight, and since I am new - I have SOOO much reading to do here, there and everywhere!

And a very BIG thank you to AllForMJ for starting this thread and for sharing your thoughts and insight! Truly fantastic!

And to Iceberg, girl - you hit the nail right on the head! The Magic will never end! (loved the link to that beautiful picture!)

To Ashtanga, just wanted to say that I think I understand what you mean here . MJ will never, ever be forgotten - no way! But since his passing, I have had different feelings, different emotions, while listening to his music or watching videos. Just after his passing, it was almost way too painful to even listen to his songs or watch anything with him in it - b/c it would just jolt me into the realization that he was no longer here, that there would never be a new video again, or concerts, or hope of ever meeting him in person! (a hope I held onto every single day, until that horrible day) :(

Then, as time went on, it became a bit easier to do all this. Yet even to this day, there are times when I'm watching some of the videos from the Home Movies- where they usually make me laugh or smile so big- or listening to particular songs (for me, they are Stranger in Moscow, I'll Be There, Will You Be There and Earth Song)...I cry so hard, right down from the center of my soul! :cry:

Indeed, there are times when it's just really, really hard. ((hugs))
I'm just so glad that we have each other and ALL the gifts that MJ left for us!

:cry: *big sigh*

[Lisha]

Hello, Ash!!! Blessings! And thank you so much for letting us know what happened. Something just didn't seem right without you. :no:

I hope all your laptop troubles will soon be all corrected with this new one you have now; and, oh my gosh, that is so sad you lost many, many files. :( Wait, not all your MJ pics? You had so many! And also you had so many saved articles regarding him. All gone?

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Hey!!! The Ashmeister is BACK!!! Glad your computer just died. Not that I'm glad your computer died, just that it wasn't something worse. Good to hear you were able to get a new laptop. Now you are back in business!

Hope you guys don't mind all of the "oldies" I have been posting lately, but they have such a way of lifting my spirits (and I hope yours, too) ... especially THIS one! (Now just admit there is no possible way you can stay in a bad mood after listing to this classic!)


<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/xBCpcSvxYeo" frameBorder="0" width="420" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>

[Ashtanga]

Hey.... :hiya::give_heart:





Hello, Ash!!! Blessings! And thank you so much for letting us know what happened. Something just didn't seem right without you. :no:

I hope all your laptop troubles will soon be all corrected with this new one you have now; and, oh my gosh, that is so sad you lost many, many files. :( Wait, not all your MJ pics? You had so many! And also you had so many saved articles regarding him. All gone?


Awwwwwwwwwww :girl_sigh:, thanks for the sweet message! :blushing: :heart: http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxforum.com/smf2.0/Smileys/popos/bearhug.sml.gif

Yes, I missed some things from Michael on my laptop. :( But I'll still try to recover them again. I'm being more careful now with my new laptop. I do not want to have the same problem again! :nono:

That's it! ;) We see around the forum. :shifty:http://www.messbrasil.com.br/imagens_emoticons//Smiley/////035ani-messbrasil.gif http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif







Hey!!! The Ashmeister is BACK!!!

:shifty:


Ashmeister???? It's my new nickname? I like it! :lol:







Glad your computer just died. Not that I'm glad your computer died, just that it wasn't something worse. Good to hear you were able to get a new laptop. Now you are back in business!

Yeah!!!!! :punk: :dancing: http://www.messbrasil.com.br/imagens_emoticons//Smiley/////035ani-messbrasil.gif










Hope you guys don't mind all of the "oldies" I have been posting lately, but they have such a way of lifting my spirits (and I hope yours, too) ... especially THIS one! (Now just admit there is no possible way you can stay in a bad mood after listing to this classic!)


<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/xBCpcSvxYeo" frameborder="0" width="420" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>

I love it!!!!!!!!! :wild: Thanks! ;)

[Lisha]

Hope you guys don't mind all of the "oldies" I have been posting lately, but they have such a way of lifting my spirits (and I hope yours, too) ... especially THIS one! (Now just admit there is no possible way you can stay in a bad mood after listing to this classic!)


<IFRAME height=315 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/xBCpcSvxYeo" frameBorder=0 width=420 allowfullscreen=""></IFRAME>

I'm lovin' these oldies you've been postin'! Our Day Will Come...what a great one. It's a nice song to sing, and the melody is so pretty at the part where the lines are "Our dreams have magic/Because we'll always stay/In love this way..." Very pretty. But...for in here, kinda depressing...the "our day will come" bit, when it never did for MJ and the litdg. Oh wait...that reminds me...

I came across in some thread around here that someone asked Frank Cascio if MJ had found love before he died and if someone REALLY loved him back in time. And the fun thing about it, cause of this thread, do you guys remember a long while ago someone named "Dri" from Brazil posting in here. I think she is the very person who was bold enough to ask Frank that question! Wouldn't ya know one of the hopeless romantics from in here would be behind it. haha.

Anyway, he answered her question in the affirmative...so all who have been so sad about him never meeting anyone in time...he apparently did. Was she the LITD girl for sure...hmmm...I dunno. What do you guys think? lol.

Oh, MP, I really like this Temptation song, too, that you've posted. Do you see it more from the perspective that MJ would have begged her to stay, or "she" if there ever was a she-litd, would be the one to have begged him to stay or what is your take on these lyrics, MP, and how they fit in here? :scratch:

Ash....noooo...you lost some MJ related stuff? I'm sorry. Yeah, go about things now in such a way to protect yourself for a possible next time. Good idea. You're thinking. :yes: (as always! :) )


EDIT: OH...and thanks for your post, TheBadTour1988. :flowers:

[Ashtanga]

Ash....noooo...you lost some MJ related stuff? I'm sorry. Yeah, go about things now in such a way to protect yourself for a possible next time. Good idea. You're thinking. :yes: (as always! :) )


Yes, I missed some things. :( But most important is that Michael will be with me forever in my heart and in my life. :girl_sigh: :wub: :blushing: :cry: *big sigh*

[MysteriousPhoenix]

I'm lovin' these oldies you've been postin'! Our Day Will Come...what a great one. It's a nice song to sing, and the melody is so pretty at the part where the lines are "Our dreams have magic/Because we'll always stay/In love this way..." Very pretty. But...for in here, kinda depressing...the "our day will come" bit, when it never did for MJ and the litdg. Oh wait...that reminds me...

I came across in some thread around here that someone asked Frank Cascio if MJ had found love before he died and if someone REALLY loved him back in time. And the fun thing about it, cause of this thread, do you guys remember a long while ago someone named "Dri" from Brazil posting in here. I think she is the very person who was bold enough to ask Frank that question! Wouldn't ya know one of the hopeless romantics from in here would be behind it. haha.

Anyway, he answered her question in the affirmative...so all who have been so sad about him never meeting anyone in time...he apparently did. Was she the LITD girl for sure...hmmm...I dunno. What do you guys think? lol.

Oh, man, someone from in here asked that question? I am so embarrased (NOT!). I admire her boldness!

As for the song, perhaps it should be ... "Our Day Came and Went"? lol! Or ... perhaps their "day" will come in the great beyond? This seems especially true after you brought up the one line that goes:

"Our dreams have magic/Because we'll always stay/In love this way..."

That line was reminding me of something, and I just thought of what it was. It reminds me of the line in Celine Dion's, "My Heart Goes On" where she sings:

"We'll stay forever this way ..."

You ask, "Was she the LITD girl for sure?" I would say she would still be the LITD 'cause we never got a name or anything, so she is technically still "in the dark." Or are we in the dark?:scratch:





Oh, MP, I really like this Temptation song, too, that you've posted. Do you see it more from the perspective that MJ would have begged her to stay, or "she" if there ever was a she-litd, would be the one to have begged him to stay or what is your take on these lyrics, MP, and how they fit in here? :scratch:



Well, as far as "Ain't Too Proud to Beg," it's hard for me to find a justification for it. I'm just really enjoying the "oldies" lately since I think a lot of stuff out today is just weird. There are a few good songs and groups out there, but it's hard to find real "feel good" stuff like the songs from the past. They are just so uplifing. But, if I had to justify it, I would say that I think MJ coulda, woulda very well sung this song to his LITD. And what LITD wouldn't have liked hearing those words coming out of his vocal cords? As far as her "begging," well ... I don't know if women are so good at that since we ARE too proud! lol!



Edit: I like your name, TheBadTour1988! Where is DWsoul?

[Lisha]

Here is a LITD Thread post, from the past, of Dri's. You can see where her heart was concerning MJ even back in Nov. 2008, and how much she hoped he found love, so it is not too surprising she would ask Frank what she did:

I pray that he finds the right person finaly.No matter how she is and or where she lives...I want just she make him happy truly and that MJ allowed yourself be loved, which he also delivered for this love.:heart:


MP,


Oh, man, someone from in here asked that question? I am so embarrased (NOT!). I admire her boldness!
:lol:


As for the song, perhaps it should be ... "Our Day Came and Went"? lol! Or ... perhaps their "day" will come in the great beyond? This seems especially true after you brought up the one line that goes:

"Our dreams have magic/Because we'll always stay/In love this way..."

That line was reminding me of something, and I just thought of what it was. It reminds me of the line in Celine Dion's, "My Heart Goes On" where she sings:

"We'll stay forever this way ..." That line is very close. How did you come up with that so quick. You sure have a large repetoire of songs that you know, MP. :)


You ask, "Was she the LITD girl for sure?" I would say she would still be the LITD 'cause we never got a name or anything, so she is technically still "in the dark." Or are we in the dark?:scratch:


lol. Very true. If there is no name...then her name (and she as well) is "staying in the dark." I can see why some in here have decided when referring to MJ's LITD girl...to include an "s' on there. (I think DWsoul just recently did this, too). Like this: "LITD girl(s)" or "LITD girl/s". Probably most of the girls MJ had flings with, or even longer relationships with but not one to end of in matrimony...were protected and kept out of sight...or stayed "in the dark!"

I remember this term, and I think it was SoS's, that he probably had quite of few "3D" relationships with females. Meaning, that all the while he kept his LITD girl (the one of this thread, if she EXISTS) deep in his heart and was in waiting mode for her, he still in actual life "in the now," "in the flesh," "in real time," "right in front of him," "3D style," he had women to love on and be loved on back.

So the woman Frank was referring to, was she:

1. Not the LITD girl of this thread, but in fact, someone who replaced her...because she was "there" in 3D, and desirable and loyal.

2. She was not the LITD girl of this thread, but was someone he let into his heart to a point, but she did not surplant the LITD girl, for he had faith God would bring them together even still, yet...he kept it quiet and Frank and most hadn't even a clue about her. And in the meantime, he enjoyed this girl that Frank knew about.

3. It was the LITD girl of this thread, and God did bring them together in the end, right before the end...and this is who Frank is referring to, for he was privy of that relationship.

(and we should always leave room for a number four...which is probably the closest to the truth, but we have no idea about. lol.)

Now Ash for one would definitely reject number three, or maybe all of these and maybe is doubting what Frank said even, for it never set right for her that someone who loved MJ could be in his life and let happen what ended up happening. Right, Ash? :)



Well, as far as "Ain't Too Proud to Beg," it's hard for me to find a justification for it. I'm just really enjoying the "oldies" lately since I think a lot of stuff out today is just weird. There are a few good songs and groups out there, but it's hard to find real "feel good" stuff like the songs from the past. They are just so uplifing. But, if I had to justify it, I would say that I think MJ coulda, woulda very well sung this song to his LITD. And what LITD wouldn't have liked hearing those words coming out of his vocal cords? As far as her "begging," well ... I don't know if women are so good at that since we ARE too proud! lol!


I know! These oldies are uplifting and have such good beats...and wow, they just don't make songs like these anymore. I've thinking about this, and how I'm probably showing my age and not relating to the younger generation and the songs they like today (which mostly don't do it for me), but then I remembered about my son. We have never had music playing in our house (this is a great sadness in itself), everyone listened to music on their own in their computers and such. So my son has never been influenced by anyone elses taste in music. So I had no idea what he liked; he used to tell he only liked music with no lyrics like you hear during video games...he liked video game music.

Then for Christmas I asked him what he wanted, and he said he wanted an Earth Wind and Fire album and The Best of Marvin Gaye. I said , "You like that kind of music?" and he said, "Yeah, I guess you could say I prefer R&B." :woohoo: I couldn't have been more pleased since that is my favorite kind of music, other than show tunes, maybe.

So there are some young people out there that have good taste in music! hahaha. (Oh, before I am in too much trouble, I do like some newer stuff, too).


Where is DWsoul?
DWsoul likes to come and tease us with their presence and then leave. lol. Maaaaan!

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Yes, we really don't know what Frank actually knew. He could have seen any woman hanging around MJ and thought, Oh, o.k., he has found love then (and of course, it may have not actually have been his love in the dark at all, just some random woman). Or ... as you said, being as close as they were, perhaps MJ felt comfortable enough to share info about his LITD with him.

As far as people having a tendency of making the LITD plural, I think that is another story. Sure, he may have had relationships with other women that no one else knew about, but I don't think they would actually qualify for being his LITD necessarily since I believe his LITD actually refers to one person only that he felt was the one for him. It may just be easier to take Ash's stance and just believe he never had not even an ounce of desire for anyone and no one ever desired him either. (Just joking, Ash. Don't hurt me!)

But, it does bring up an interesting angle to this - loving your LITD while loving an LITL (Love in the Light). I think this would make your heart feel split and very confused. This could have been or maybe is happening on her end as well - loving her LITD (which of course, would be MJ) and loving an LITL at the same time. Very confusing, heartbreaking and sad situation. I don't know how MJ was able to do it with such ease. That is a terrible situation to be in.

[Lily]

I hope this is the kind of beautiful love Michael found...

“I love you without knowing how, or when, or from where. I love you simply, without problems or pride: I love you in this way because I do not know any other way of loving but this, in which there is no I or you, so intimate that your hand upon my chest is my hand, so intimate that when I fall asleep your eyes close.” ~ Pablo Neruda

:heart:

[claudiadoina]

I hope this is the kind of beautiful love Michael found...

“I love you without knowing how, or when, or from where. I love you simply, without problems or pride: I love you in this way because I do not know any other way of loving but this, in which there is no I or you, so intimate that your hand upon my chest is my hand, so intimate that when I fall asleep your eyes close.” ~ Pablo Neruda

:heart:yes, and much more than that :heart:

[Lisha]

Hi Lily!!! :D *waves*



He did find THE LOVE.The true love. :heart:
He did love and he was loved more than anybody could ever believe or understand.
From the moment he found THE LOVE of his life he was the happiest man on Earth till the end.
What I say next to you, claudiadoina, is gonna make me feel like I'm -just like- MJ :) when he was in the elevator with five year old Prince. Prince was saying Star Wars, Episode 2 was "slow," and MJ rephrased Bashir's question to Prince like this:

"And what makes you so sure you are right about that?"

So, Claudiadoina, lol...as far as what you have posted above:

"And what makes you so sure you are right about that?" :)



Yes, we really don't know what Frank actually knew. He could have seen any woman hanging around MJ and thought, Oh, o.k., he has found love then (and of course, it may have not actually have been his love in the dark at all, just some random woman). Or ... as you said, being as close as they were, perhaps MJ felt comfortable enough to share info about his LITD with him.
Good points!


As far as people having a tendency of making the LITD plural, I think that is another story. Sure, he may have had relationships with other women that no one else knew about, but I don't think they would actually qualify for being his LITD necessarily since I believe his LITD actually refers to one person only that he felt was the one for him. It may just be easier to take Ash's stance and just believe he never had not even an ounce of desire for anyone and no one ever desired him either. (Just joking, Ash. Don't hurt me!)

Well, like you've already brought up, if we are using the meaning of "love in the dark" as being hidden, then yeah, lot's of gals may have been in MJ's life and stayed hidden, just like the LITD girl stayed "hidden" from view or general knowledge (if she exists)...but if we mean "love in the dark" like AllForMJ was intending it, that is, and MP, you are saying this, too, then it means one special lady that God revealed to him at some point in his life as being "the best choice for him" or "the only one for him" or "God's divine choice for him," or his "soulmate," etc.


But, it does bring up an interesting angle to this - loving your LITD while loving an LITL (Love in the Light). I think this would make your heart feel split and very confused. This could have been or maybe is happening on her end as well - loving her LITD (which of course, would be MJ) and loving an LITL at the same time. Very confusing, heartbreaking and sad situation. I don't know how MJ was able to do it with such ease. That is a terrible situation to be in.

I can't imagine doing that. Wouldn't it be difficult, and cause some inner turmoil. But I've always been a one guy at a time kinda gal. I can't love two at the same time, at least, not in the same compacity. The only way I can picture it, if there are two simultaneously (like maybe in MJ's life at any point), then the level of love, or the type of love is different between himself and each of the two.

Isn't that kind of what we were assuming was going on if indeed "You Are Not Alone" when it came out was a message to his LITD girl (if she evah, evah existed)...while he was still married to Lisa Marie? Did MJ love Lisa Marie? Yes, I totally believe he did. Was it the same kind of love he had for the LITD girl...I don't think so. We have talked about the importance of having in place (in fact I think SoS, AllforMJ, and Shhaaby all talked about this) a Love... in all three of these areas: Mind, Body, and Spirit. Do I have the right three? And we talked about how Lisa Marie did not have the same kind of relationship with God that MJ had..so that would indicate that things were not "in place" in the area of "spirit." But then again, if the LITD girl was not "in" his life...(because it was a long distance, spiritual communication, only) then things were not in place in the area of "body" for her and MJ. But, hmm, I think there is a better chance for a deep, meaningful love, from God, that can take place between two people without the "body" connection, if that is the only thing missing, than a relationship with the "spirit" connection missing, at least for such a spiritual individual as MJ.

However, in a marriage relationship, I would think it's the three areas being present that are making it complete.

What do you guys think about all this?

I mean, there are marriages, I should think, where something occurs, like an illness, where the couple cannot be intimate with each other physically...but if their love is strong based also on the "mind" area, and especially the "spirit" area...will they not get through it without their love being jeopardized?

But if in a marriage, a couple is "unevenly" yoked, or there is no connection in the "spirit" area...even though they have had some connection through the "mind" area, and the "body" (physical) area, will love, can the love, if it was ever there truly in the first place, flourish or even survive?

It also seems to me that the mind and body areas of connection will reach their true level of fulfillment, only if the "spirit" connection, with God in the right place in the relationship, is present and where it needs to be. Don't you think that marriage would have a better chance of lasting and the love behind it being superior, that way, than a love that is without the "spirit" area being in place?

Maybe MJ had some lovely 3D interactions with some really fascinating, beautiful, likable, amazing women, but if only some of the areas were there in these relationships, but not all three...it could still be a "love" of sorts, but not "a love so divine," which MJ made clear through his lyrics he longed for. And I think probally prayed for.

[Ashtanga]

:shifty:


http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif








Well.... :fear:





Now Ash for one would definitely reject number three, or maybe all of these and maybe is doubting what Frank said even, for it never set right for her that someone who loved MJ could be in his life and let happen what ended up happening. Right, Ash? :)

It may just be easier to take Ash's stance and just believe he never had not even an ounce of desire for anyone and no one ever desired him either. (Just joking, Ash. Don't hurt me!)

:fortuneteller:




I was thinking other day about everything that people said about Michael :thinking: ..... principally Frank and others. I came to the conclusion that all people around Michael knew just enough, the essential just what Michael wanted them to know, nothing more. I think Michael NEVER spoke everything about himself to everyone around her. One part was only with him and nobody else. To me that's a fact. -_- Or not???? :fear:

[Lisha]

^^^ It's not only that I'm sure he did, I know he did :heart:
Does this possibly mean that you have personally encountered someone who is presenting themselves as the woman that was last in his life, and...

you believe them?


One part was only with him and nobody else. To me that's a fact. -_- Or not???? :fear:
That makes sense, Ashmeister. :)

[Ashtanga]

Does this possibly mean that you have personally encountered someone who is presenting themselves as the woman that was last in his life, and...

you believe them?

:o


:fear:






That makes sense, Ashmeister. :)

Michael was a very private man and I'm sure he did not reveal everything about yourself to everyone around him. Obviously there are many things that these people who were around him and us fans, we do not know and will never know. :nono: -_- :fear:


I think I'll change my username to Ashmeister. :lol: :wild:

[claudiadoina]

Does this possibly mean that you have personally encountered someone who is presenting themselves as the woman that was last in his life, and...

you believe them?




As you know this thread (a beautiful thread BTW) is mostly about speculating about Michael's love life and your beliefs/dreams about if he had or had not met the love of his life so this is not the place for me to answer to your questions.

I know how hard it is to believe something without having any "proofs", without seeing with your own eyes or listening with your own ears , but you have to feel it in your heart and if you do so you couldn't be mistaken.

Someday , hopefully it will be known by the world and everybody will be happy for Michael :heart:

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Well, like you've already brought up, if we are using the meaning of "love in the dark" as being hidden, then yeah, lot's of gals may have been in MJ's life and stayed hidden, just like the LITD girl stayed "hidden" from view or general knowledge (if she exists)...but if we mean "love in the dark" like AllForMJ was intending it, that is, and MP, you are saying this, too, then it means one special lady that God revealed to him at some point in his life as being "the best choice for him" or "the only one for him" or "God's divine choice for him," or his "soulmate," etc.

You stated that very well. Yes, I think that is what has been confusing me - the fact that the term "LITD" can be used either way, when I had just been seeing it one way (the way AllforMJ had intended it). I always viewed it as meaning something far more special than just being involved in a secret relationship with MJ. A matter of semantics, as they say? Perhaps coming up with another term for all the other gals would help.





I can't imagine doing that. Wouldn't it be difficult, and cause some inner turmoil. But I've always been a one guy at a time kinda gal. I can't love two at the same time, at least, not in the same compacity. The only way I can picture it, if there are two simultaneously (like maybe in MJ's life at any point), then the level of love, or the type of love is different between himself and each of the two.

Isn't that kind of what we were assuming was going on if indeed "You Are Not Alone" when it came out was a message to his LITD girl (if she evah, evah existed)...while he was still married to Lisa Marie? Did MJ love Lisa Marie? Yes, I totally believe he did. Was it the same kind of love he had for the LITD girl...I don't think so. We have talked about the importance of having in place (in fact I think SoS, AllforMJ, and Shhaaby all talked about this) a Love... in all three of these areas: Mind, Body, and Spirit. Do I have the right three? And we talked about how Lisa Marie did not have the same kind of relationship with God that MJ had..so that would indicate that things were not "in place" in the area of "spirit." But then again, if the LITD girl was not "in" his life...(because it was a long distance, spiritual communication, only) then things were not in place in the area of "body" for her and MJ. But, hmm, I think there is a better chance for a deep, meaningful love, from God, that can take place between two people without the "body" connection, if that is the only thing missing, than a relationship with the "spirit" connection missing, at least for such a spiritual individual as MJ.

However, in a marriage relationship, I would think it's the three areas being present that are making it complete.

What do you guys think about all this?

I mean, there are marriages, I should think, where something occurs, like an illness, where the couple cannot be intimate with each other physically...but if their love is strong based also on the "mind" area, and especially the "spirit" area...will they not get through it without their love being jeopardized?

But if in a marriage, a couple is "unevenly" yoked, or there is no connection in the "spirit" area...even though they have had some connection through the "mind" area, and the "body" (physical) area, will love, can the love, if it was ever there truly in the first place, flourish or even survive?

It also seems to me that the mind and body areas of connection will reach their true level of fulfillment, only if the "spirit" connection, with God in the right place in the relationship, is present and where it needs to be. Don't you think that marriage would have a better chance of lasting and the love behind it being superior, that way, than a love that is without the "spirit" area being in place?

Maybe MJ had some lovely 3D interactions with some really fascinating, beautiful, likable, amazing women, but if only some of the areas were there in these relationships, but not all three...it could still be a "love" of sorts, but not "a love so divine," which MJ made clear through his lyrics he longed for. And I think probally prayed for.

Also very well put. I've been thinking there must have been a reason God said to not be "unequally yoked." However, I think if two people are "unequally yoked," this could possibly be overcome, but not without a lot of help and intervention from God.

But, speaking of being a "one guy at a time" kinda gal, I think MJ and his LITD were probably both "one person at a time" kinda people, also, but like you said, we are mind, body and spirit (which I believe also encompasses the mind), and if you have just the spirit, you probably long for the body part, and likewise, if you have just the body part, you probably long for the spirit. This would probably explain how it would be easy for them to love two people at the same time. Like you said, the love they would feel for each person would be different and on a different level, I suppose. The love they have for each other would be very deep since it would be on a spiritual level, but they might love the other person for other reasons.




I was thinking other day about everything that people said about Michael :thinking: ..... principally Frank and others. I came to the conclusion that all people around Michael knew just enough, the essential just what Michael wanted them to know, nothing more. I think Michael NEVER spoke everything about himself to everyone around her. One part was only with him and nobody else. To me that's a fact. -_- Or not???? :fear:

I agree with that. I think a lot had to do with how much he trusted a person.

[Lisha]

Also very well put. I've been thinking there must have been a reason God said to not be "unequally yoked." However, I think if two people are "unequally yoked," this could possibly be overcome, but not without a lot of help and intervention from God.
Do you think the right thing for MJ to have done as far a shis marriage with Lisa Marie, was to hang in there with the marriage and never cease praying that she would come to the Lord? Then I think of the scripture, where Paul is dicussing some of this in 1 Corinthians 7, and says that if the unbelieving spouse wants to leave the marriage...the believer is not bound in such a situation for God has called us to peace. And the next part brings up the argument many have in regards not only to marriage, but the idea of "ministry dating" and that is:

(Corin. 7:16) How do you know wife, whether you will save your husband? Or, how do you know husband, whether you will save your wife?

In other words, we have no guarentee that any of us can be successful in leading someone over to Christ or even into a deeper relationship with Jesus if they have put other things in more importance in their lives than Him. Prayer is powerful though, and there have been many marriage relationships restored through the spouse praying faithfully for their spouse...but it can take YEARS before their heart is changed. And again, some hearts are so hardened or so deceived they do not turn. :(

But, speaking of being a "one guy at a time" kinda gal, I think MJ and his LITD were probably both "one person at a time" kinda people, also, but like you said, we are mind, body and spirit (which I believe also encompasses the mind), and if you have just the spirit, you probably long for the body part, and likewise, if you have just the body part, you probably long for the spirit. This would probably explain how it would be easy for them to love two people at the same time. Like you said, the love they would feel for each person would be different and on a different level, I suppose. The love they have for each other would be very deep since it would be on a spiritual level, but they might love the other person for other reasons.

Well. when I think of the saying "my heart belongs to them" what does that mean? I would think if someone's heart belongs to another, than that heart will not belong to anyone else. A person can love others, but still, their heart belongs to only one and nothing wold change that...right?

This brings back to my memory a time when I was only 19 and what someone said to me. I had been struggling with bulemia at a time when it was not discussed or read about in articles and so I felt I was the only horrible person in the world weak enough to be doing such a thing to my body. It brought a lot of shame and self-loathing. And my family could tell something was not right with me but I could not share the secret of what I was doing...too shaming. But I told them if they wanted I'd fo see a pyschologist and try to talk wiht them about whatever was amiss with me. I thought maybe it would be interesting.

So they found a counselor, and she was very nice, and as was my norm, I smoothly got the woman talking all about herself and telling me stories form her life. I may seem to share a lot of stories here for you all, but there was a time a didn't share any stories ab out myself with anyone. I have freedom in this area now. But, of course, I pick and choose my stories. :)

I just couldn't get it out of my mouth to her that I was making myself throw up on a regular basis. The only thing I told her that was maybe contributing to my unhappiness wiht life was that my high school boyfriend (after I broke up with him) wouldn't go back with me and instead wanted to play the field as a lifeguard at the beach and party. Which he ended up doing. And I told her I was having such a hard time understanding how someone could love me and then stop loving me and I didn't know what to do with that.

She then told me how she had been in love with a special young man, too, in her past, but they ended up breaking up and he moved across the country. She, pointing to the photo on her desk, said, "I married and you can see me here with him and our children. But, (and I'll never forget the look in her eyes when she said this) I will never stop loving that man who was in a love relationship with earlier on. I will always love him." I asked, "Even though you're married." And she nodded, with conviction. I was blown away by that. And I think her message was, let the guy go, release him, still love him if you must, but get on with life.

And then she told me I seemed like a very adjusted young lady and I probably didn't need to keep seeing her. Haha! I didn't. But...God used the bulemia in my life as one of the ways he brought me to Him. Becuase, I eventually, about a year later, after throwing up one night, and feeling that strange light-headed rush in my head while sitting on the cold bathroom floor by the toilet, with tears running down my face and such strong self-hate, I said in my mind, "God if you are real, please help me stop!" And He graciously healed me completely, overnight. The next day I did not make myself throw up, or the next day, or the next day... or any day up to today,..over thirty years later.

I knew by the way that counselor said it, that even though she loved her husband in some way, and made her life with him, her heart still belonged to that other man.

I got over my high school boyfriend. lol. Too much a partier! haha. I wasn't that type.



I agree with that. I think a lot had to do with how much he trusted a person.

I don't know why MJ would need to tell a lot of people about it. Maybe a few, like you say, trusted people he knows well...or better yet, those who he felt he got the "okay" from God to share it with. And therefore, I would think, very few.

And I would hope it would work the same way with the LITD girl...that she would share with only a couple people she was in close "real life" (not online) relationships with. I know when I had interests in uys in the past I would keep quiet about it or only my closest friend would know...but here we are talking about Michael Jackson, and what that brings about, unfortunately, too often is

EGO.

If some woman is shairng how she has had a relationship with Michalel Jackson to more that a couple close friends, or to people she only knows online...I can think of no other rason for this other than a character flaw, one that involves ego. her identity is somehow caught up in being known as having been connected with Michael Jackson.

And, now we have, if she has told fans, fans getting filled up by thier egos because they are the lucky ones who are privy and, my gosh, have talked to a woman who had a close relationship with MJ! So the fans weaken due to ego and let others know.

It's hard to self-examine our motivations for things...and we don't want to think ego is behind it. But very often when someone is not strong enough to keep things quiet...it's because they are weak in this area. And it does take a lot of inner-strength that needs to be practiced again and again and to say "no" to oneself when they get the urge.

I'm convinced if Michael Jackson found someone who was as close to a mirror image to himself as possible, and this woman was brought into his life by God, she would be like MJ... in that she would be good at keeping things quiet and not share with just anyone, especially those she only knows, as well as someone can know, a person online. And if she is a woman of godly character, that would continue even after he died.
And she would have no need for her ego to be fed by making sure others know she had something to do with Michael Jackson.

[claudiadoina]

^^^^^"if you have ever lost a loved one, then you know exactly how it feels.And if you have not then you cannot possibly imagine it"

Do not judge a person whom you know nothing about.

You're right about a thing though "she is as close as a mirror image "

And you guys here you should know better what an online friend could mean for someone sometimes.

And I'm not weak, my reasons are may be well hidden for you but is definitely not out of weakness .But your very reaction here, although soft and somehow veiled shows to me that I should have shut up as I knew I should have done it before I started.

I am sorry I interfered .


:heart:

[Ashtanga]

I agree with that. I think a lot had to do with how much he trusted a person.

Great! :wild: At least someone agrees with me. :lol: :fear:








I don't know why MJ would need to tell a lot of people about it. Maybe a few, like you say, trusted people he knows well...or better yet, those who he felt he got the "okay" from God to share it with. And therefore, I would think, very few.


:agree:



I think Michael could count on the fingers how many people he could trust blindly, very few. *big sigh*







And you guys here you should know better what an online friend could mean for someone sometimes.

And I'm not weak, my reasons are may be well hidden for you but is definitely not out of weakness .But your very reaction here, although soft and somehow veiled shows to me that I should have shut up as I knew I should have done it before I started.

I am sorry I interfered .


:heart:

:scratch: :fear:

[Lisha]

You know, Claudiadoina, I have been aware of this situation for some time now, and I was expecting someone to post in here eventually about this individual who has managed to convince quite a few fans that they were MJ's love interest at the time of his death.

The reason why I said ego...(or maybe it's just simply some kind of need, like a need for closure or many other things that is going on in the fans who have believed this person) is simply to point out the vulnerability of some fans to believe someone like this online.

No, I do not think it is a justification for this person to claim "to need someone to talk to online," instead I see it like a "hook." Many fans would fall into it...and feel compassion and want to be there for a grieving love of MJ's who lost someone so special, that was also so special to these fans. They want to be there for her online. But it is playing with fan's emotions.

For a mature woman in at least, let's say, her late thirties, or possibly much older,or even around MJ's own age, who knew MJ well and his need for privacy, she would not go the online root for finding confidants. It is not wisdom, it is somewhat illusonary and cannot be counted on, and should not replace trusted, in person, relationships offline. If she does not have at least one trusted offline relationship, then that is suspect. Even MJ, with all his need to be careful and private had those personal relationships where he could trust with certain private things. Why wouldn't she? And even if she didn't, wisdom would tell her not to go online.

The reason I say "weak" is from my own walking out in this area...when I have fallen prey to share things I shouldn't have with someone, I realize it was because I was being weak. When I am strong, I do not have the need to share what I shouldn't be sharing with the person I shouldn't be sharing it with. I can say "no" to myself, and stop myself. I am able to think through the consequences, and I keep what I need to keep private, private. If I slip up, yes, it is because of a weakened moment and I have to ask myself, what made me weaken?

I am bringing these things up so those who are believing that this individual is who she really says she is, to stop and consider how she is going about things, and if one, who was truly involved with MJ, and knew about keeping things private, would handle things in this way.

Obviously, I believe this person is either a poser playing with fans for attention and the game of it, or it is someone who maybe did have some kind of relationship with MJ at one time but has made more of it then was really there and is now going about things in the wrong way...which is kinda sad. :(

But I think it is someone playing with your heartstrings (because you so very much wanted MJ to have love in his life) and this person is having a ball with it. And that is beyond sad...it is ugly.

Claudiadoina, I want you to see the possibility that this person might be playing with you and is not being for real.

But back to this, why anyone would come in here and post in such a way to let all who read in here know that they know for sure MJ had love, implying thye have spoken with the woman...I just question the why they would think they should do that. Why would you do that, Cluadiadoina, if it is not partially at least to let people know you know her and who she is, and obviously this is special for you to know MJ's secret love in his life. It means something to you. Yes? No? So why is it, then, that you posted what you did? I don't mean to offend; I just want you to look deeper into this. :hug:

And yes, I am judging this person's (behavior) because I am discerning something not right about what they have been doing. I don't want you gals played with because you loved Michael so much and it means so much to you for him to have had love...and so it means everything for you that you have found her and are there for her.

Is that at least, true?

I think maybe these fans want so much to feel "near" to Michael, because they miss him so much now he's gone, and thinking that they are near to "her, the one he loved" would make them somehow feel near to Michael. But this person probably knows this, and is using it to their advantage. :(

[Ashtanga]

You know, Claudiadoina, I have been aware of this situation for some time now, and I was expecting someone to post in here eventually about this individual who has managed to convince quite a few fans that they were MJ's love interest at the time of his death.

The reason why I said ego...(or maybe it's just simply some kind of need, like a need for closure or many other things that is going on in the fans who have believed this person) is simply to point out the vulnerability of some fans to believe someone like this online.

No, I do not think it is a justification for this person to claim "to need someone to talk to online," instead I see it like a "hook." Many fans would fall into it...and feel compassion and want to be there for a grieving love of MJ's who lost someone so special, that was also so special to these fans. They want to be there for her online. But it is playing with fan's emotions.

For a mature woman in at least, let's say, her late thirties, or possibly much older,or even around MJ's own age, who knew MJ well and his need for privacy, she would not go the online root for finding confidants. It is not wisdom, it is somewhat illusonary and cannot be counted on, and should not replace trusted, in person, relationships offline. If she does not have at least one trusted offline relationship, then that is suspect. Even MJ, with all his need to be careful and private had those personal relationships where he could trust with certain private things. Why wouldn't she? And even if she didn't, wisdom would tell her not to go online.

The reason I say "weak" is from my own walking out in this area...when I have fallen prey to share things I shouldn't have with someone, I realize it was because I was being weak. When I am strong, I do not have the need to share what I shouldn't be sharing with the person I shouldn't be sharing it with. I can say "no" to myself, and stop myself. I am able to think through the consequences, and I keep what I need to keep private, private. If I slip up, yes, it is because of a weakened moment and I have to ask myself, what made me weaken?

I am bringing these things up so those who are believing that this individual is who she really says she is, to stop and consider how she is going about things, and if one, who was truly involved with MJ, and knew about keeping things private, would handle things in this way.

Obviously, I believe this person is either a poser playing with fans for attention and the game of it, or it is someone who maybe did have some kind of relationship with MJ at one time but has made more of it then was really there and is now going about things in the wrong way...which is kinda sad. :(

But I think it is someone playing with your heartstrings (because you so very much wanted MJ to have love in his life) and this person is having a ball with it. And that is beyond sad...it is ugly.

Claudiadoina, I want you to see the possibility that this person might be playing with you and is not being for real.

But back to this, why anyone would come in here and post in such a way to let all who read in here know that they know for sure MJ had love, implying thye have spoken with the woman...I just question the why they would think they should do that. Why would you do that, Cluadiadoina, if it is not partially at least to let people know you know her and who she is, and obviously this is special for you to know MJ's secret love in his life. It means something to you. Yes? No? So why is it, then, that you posted what you did? I don't mean to offend; I just want you to look deeper into this. :hug:

And yes, I am judging this person's (behavior) because I am discerning something not right about what they have been doing. I don't want you gals played with because you loved Michael so much and it means so much to you for him to have had love...and so it means everything for you that you have found her and are there for her.

Is that at least, true?

I think maybe these fans want so much to feel "near" to Michael, because they miss him so much now he's gone, and thinking that they are near to "her, the one he loved" would make them somehow feel near to Michael. But this person probably knows this, and is using it to their advantage. :(

I know who you're talking about.... :fear: And I agree with everything you said! -_-

[Lisha]

I know who you're talking about.... :fear: And I agree with everything you said! -_-
Thanks, Ash. And it does not surprise me you know about this...you always seem to know about everythign going on. Nothing gets past you! :) Even with you being gone for awhile, you're still in the know! :bow:

That's the Ashmeister for ya. :)


You're right about a thing though "she is as close as a mirror image "

I would like to address this "mirror image" thing a bit. One of the first thing a poser understands is that it is imperative that one knows their subject. Why have so many MJ posers been so successful online like they have been...well, it would seem many are MJ fans (of sort) gone bad..in other words, they know all the facts about MJ just like all of us fans. So they know how to present themselves as a mirror image of Michael Jackson. And some are extremely good at it, never missing a beat. I think a few should be considered for an Academy Award myself. And yet to me, of course, what they are doing is despicable.

Not only MJ, but his children have posers. You all know that. On Facebook, on YouTube, on Formspring, on Instagram, and last but not least, on Twitter. Have some of Paris' posers been any good at it? Yes. Do they know all kinds of facts about her and pay attention to what she herself says on Twitter, and copy away. Yep. Paris recently retweeted this:


Guys, Prince doesn't have a Forsmpring or an Instagram. Don't follow the posers, even if they "seem" real to you.

I suppose if she retweeted this she also agrees with the bolded part. Posers are that good...they have to be to be believed.

So, if someone wanted to pose as a woman MJ was in love with before he died, and they wanted to convince others that "she" was perfect for him...they would make her a mirror image of him. Knowing everything about MJ just as fans do, they could easily give her a personality very close to his, just like MJ posers do. Probably make her almost "perfectly" sweet, just like MJ posers would in texts make him perfectly sweet, because so many fans view Michael as "perfectly" sweet and caring, and never a harsh word and all of that...in other words, not very like a real person, if one thinks about it.

Not long ago Paris had a poser who came off "sweeter" than Paris and then accused Paris of not (before she was verified) being the true Paris because the real Paris would be nicer in her tweets. And, of course, this Paris poser was "unhumanlike almost" in her efforts to be sweet to all those who tweeted them. And boy, it worked, tweeters just loved "her." And she got them to be so loyal to her. And this is how it works. First a poser gets someone to believe them, and then they want to get them to be super loyal and to the point they are defending them. They often get just that.

But Paris, the true Paris, she kept on being what...herself. Real. Not trying to be fake sweet, but kind in her way, sweet in her way, feisty in her way, witty in her way...but real. Not as "consistently" sweet as her poser though...

So this MJ's-love-of-his-life-poser, she has first gotten some fans to believe her by saying things in such a way that sounds like how fans would perceive MJ as being...probably she's consistently super sweet...never an unkind word, super loving....and then, the fans become so loyal they will defend "her." (I'm putting quotes by she because it is hard to know if one is a male or female when they are a poser.

If they can lie about who they are by hiding behind a persona, then they can hide their gender as well.

I bet MJ was capable of saying something that could turn a fan off at times if they saw or heard him...(we just never saw it) and I bet if there was a gal in his life she could too. No one is 100 percent likable in "real" life. Entertainers have to work even harder at hiding the real them, it seems. Always proper, always poised, always kind. That's why I give Paris credit for coming off so real in her tweets. She's refreshing in a way.

But posers, to draw people in, stay "sweeter" than the average joe. On purpose. They can't afford to turn anyone off...they want to keep all hooked in...that's the game.

[Ashtanga]

Thanks, Ash. And it does not surprise me you know about this...you always seem to know about everythign going on. Nothing gets past you! :) Even with you being gone for awhile, you're still in the know! :bow:

That's the Ashmeister for ya. :)

Thanks! :innocent:


Nothing goes unnoticed by me. Eagle eyes. I'm always aware of things. :shifty: :fear:

[claudiadoina]

You know, Claudiadoina, I have been aware of this situation for some time now, and I was expecting someone to post in here eventually about this individual who has managed to convince quite a few fans that they were MJ's love interest at the time of his death.

The reason why I said ego...(or maybe it's just simply some kind of need, like a need for closure or many other things that is going on in the fans who have believed this person) is simply to point out the vulnerability of some fans to believe someone like this online.

No, I do not think it is a justification for this person to claim "to need someone to talk to online," instead I see it like a "hook." Many fans would fall into it...and feel compassion and want to be there for a grieving love of MJ's who lost someone so special, that was also so special to these fans. They want to be there for her online. But it is playing with fan's emotions.

For a mature woman in at least, let's say, her late thirties, or possibly much older,or even around MJ's own age, who knew MJ well and his need for privacy, she would not go the online root for finding confidants. It is not wisdom, it is somewhat illusonary and cannot be counted on, and should not replace trusted, in person, relationships offline. If she does not have at least one trusted offline relationship, then that is suspect. Even MJ, with all his need to be careful and private had those personal relationships where he could trust with certain private things. Why wouldn't she? And even if she didn't, wisdom would tell her not to go online.

The reason I say "weak" is from my own walking out in this area...when I have fallen prey to share things I shouldn't have with someone, I realize it was because I was being weak. When I am strong, I do not have the need to share what I shouldn't be sharing with the person I shouldn't be sharing it with. I can say "no" to myself, and stop myself. I am able to think through the consequences, and I keep what I need to keep private, private. If I slip up, yes, it is because of a weakened moment and I have to ask myself, what made me weaken?

I am bringing these things up so those who are believing that this individual is who she really says she is, to stop and consider how she is going about things, and if one, who was truly involved with MJ, and knew about keeping things private, would handle things in this way.

Obviously, I believe this person is either a poser playing with fans for attention and the game of it, or it is someone who maybe did have some kind of relationship with MJ at one time but has made more of it then was really there and is now going about things in the wrong way...which is kinda sad. :(

But I think it is someone playing with your heartstrings (because you so very much wanted MJ to have love in his life) and this person is having a ball with it. And that is beyond sad...it is ugly.

Claudiadoina, I want you to see the possibility that this person might be playing with you and is not being for real.

But back to this, why anyone would come in here and post in such a way to let all who read in here know that they know for sure MJ had love, implying thye have spoken with the woman...I just question the why they would think they should do that. Why would you do that, Cluadiadoina, if it is not partially at least to let people know you know her and who she is, and obviously this is special for you to know MJ's secret love in his life. It means something to you. Yes? No? So why is it, then, that you posted what you did? I don't mean to offend; I just want you to look deeper into this. :hug:

And yes, I am judging this person's (behavior) because I am discerning something not right about what they have been doing. I don't want you gals played with because you loved Michael so much and it means so much to you for him to have had love...and so it means everything for you that you have found her and are there for her.

Is that at least, true?

I think maybe these fans want so much to feel "near" to Michael, because they miss him so much now he's gone, and thinking that they are near to "her, the one he loved" would make them somehow feel near to Michael. But this person probably knows this, and is using it to their advantage. :(

The truth is that nobody wants to know the truth, sadly.And I am not talking about "my truth" but generally speaking.Everybody claims that they want for Michael to have found the love in his life, the real love but as soon as somebody says something they become offensive.

How would you recognize the truth anyway?

What is the point of this entire thread wich was dragged out for years if you dont want to know if he had or had not loved and been loved, and again I am not talking about "my version" of the truth.
What a woman should do to prove herself to you that she is THE WOMAN (not that she would want to or need to ).There is nothing that she could do.So she is not , not claiming, not talking about not trying to convince anyone.

PS: I am a mature woman too you know, and she is not just an "online" friend. :heart:

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Do you think the right thing for MJ to have done as far a shis marriage with Lisa Marie, was to hang in there with the marriage and never cease praying that she would come to the Lord? That is a very difficult question to answer. It didn't seem that he was up to the task, but it would have been very noble of him. I dunno, I guess every situation is unique and that has to be taken into condideration. Then I think of the scripture, where Paul is dicussing some of this in 1 Corinthians 7, and says that if the unbelieving spouse wants to leave the marriage...the believer is not bound in such a situation for God has called us to peace. And the next part brings up the argument many have in regards not only to marriage, but the idea of "ministry dating" and that is:

(Corin. 7:16) How do you know wife, whether you will save your husband? Or, how do you know husband, whether you will save your wife?

In other words, we have no guarentee that any of us can be successful in leading someone over to Christ or even into a deeper relationship with Jesus if they have put other things in more importance in their lives than Him. Prayer is powerful though, and there have been many marriage relationships restored through the spouse praying faithfully for their spouse...but it can take YEARS before their heart is changed. And again, some hearts are so hardened or so deceived they do not turn. :( This is also the truth - the very sad and hard truth (one of the reasons we have to use wisdom when choosing our mates and make sure we are not unequally yoked, we could be setting ourselves up for years of nothin' but heartache).


Well. when I think of the saying "my heart belongs to them" what does that mean? I would think if someone's heart belongs to another, than that heart will not belong to anyone else. A person can love others, but still, their heart belongs to only one and nothing wold change that...right?

This brings back to my memory a time when I was only 19 and what someone said to me. I had been struggling with bulemia at a time when it was not discussed or read about in articles and so I felt I was the only horrible person in the world weak enough to be doing such a thing to my body. It brought a lot of shame and self-loathing. And my family could tell something was not right with me but I could not share the secret of what I was doing...too shaming. But I told them if they wanted I'd fo see a pyschologist and try to talk wiht them about whatever was amiss with me. I thought maybe it would be interesting.

So they found a counselor, and she was very nice, and as was my norm, I smoothly got the woman talking all about herself and telling me stories form her life. I may seem to share a lot of stories here for you all, but there was a time a didn't share any stories ab out myself with anyone. I have freedom in this area now. But, of course, I pick and choose my stories. :)

I just couldn't get it out of my mouth to her that I was making myself throw up on a regular basis. The only thing I told her that was maybe contributing to my unhappiness wiht life was that my high school boyfriend (after I broke up with him) wouldn't go back with me and instead wanted to play the field as a lifeguard at the beach and party. Which he ended up doing. And I told her I was having such a hard time understanding how someone could love me and then stop loving me and I didn't know what to do with that.

She then told me how she had been in love with a special young man, too, in her past, but they ended up breaking up and he moved across the country. She, pointing to the photo on her desk, said, "I married and you can see me here with him and our children. But, (and I'll never forget the look in her eyes when she said this) I will never stop loving that man who was in a love relationship with earlier on. I will always love him." I asked, "Even though you're married." And she nodded, with conviction. Wow! I was blown away by that. And I think her message was, let the guy go, release him, still love him if you must, but get on with life.

And then she told me I seemed like a very adjusted young lady and I probably didn't need to keep seeing her. Haha! I didn't. But...God used the bulemia in my life as one of the ways he brought me to Him. Becuase, I eventually, about a year later, after throwing up one night, and feeling that strange light-headed rush in my head while sitting on the cold bathroom floor by the toilet, with tears running down my face and such strong self-hate, I said in my mind, "God if you are real, please help me stop!" And He graciously healed me completely, overnight. The next day I did not make myself throw up, or the next day, or the next day... or any day up to today,..over thirty years later.

I knew by the way that counselor said it, that even though she loved her husband in some way, and made her life with him, her heart still belonged to that other man. Wow! This is deep.

I got over my high school boyfriend. lol. Too much a partier! haha. I wasn't that type. The high school boyfriend sounds like a fun guy! lol!




I don't know why MJ would need to tell a lot of people about it. Maybe a few, like you say, trusted people he knows well...or better yet, those who he felt he got the "okay" from God to share it with. And therefore, I would think, very few.

And I would hope it would work the same way with the LITD girl...that she would share with only a couple people she was in close "real life" (not online) relationships with. I know when I had interests in uys in the past I would keep quiet about it or only my closest friend would know...but here we are talking about Michael Jackson, and what that brings about, unfortunately, too often is

EGO.

If some woman is shairng how she has had a relationship with Michalel Jackson to more that a couple close friends, or to people she only knows online...I can think of no other rason for this other than a character flaw, one that involves ego. her identity is somehow caught up in being known as having been connected with Michael Jackson. True. One needs to use wisdom and know when to talk and when to keep mouth closed. Although, sometimes, you may really need to talk - that's where a trusted friend would come in.

And, now we have, if she has told fans, fans getting filled up by thier egos because they are the lucky ones who are privy and, my gosh, have talked to a woman who had a close relationship with MJ! So the fans weaken due to ego and let others know. What a mess!

It's hard to self-examine our motivations for things...and we don't want to think ego is behind it. But very often when someone is not strong enough to keep things quiet...it's because they are weak in this area. And it does take a lot of inner-strength that needs to be practiced again and again and to say "no" to oneself when they get the urge.

I'm convinced if Michael Jackson found someone who was as close to a mirror image to himself as possible, and this woman was brought into his life by God, she would be like MJ... in that she would be good at keeping things quiet and not share with just anyone, especially those she only knows, as well as someone can know, a person online. And if she is a woman of godly character, that would continue even after he died.
And she would have no need for her ego to be fed by making sure others know she had something to do with Michael Jackson. I must have been living under a mushroom. Had no idea this was going on. I used to be sharp, but I have been losing it lately - unlike the eagle-eyed Ashmeister! Thanks for your bravery in sharing your battle with bulimia. I hope it has helped someone.
*****

[Lisha]

How would you recognize the truth anyway?


That's just it, it is impossible with this kind of situation to recognize the truth. That's what gives posers a field day in this area. Michael told his fans not to believe anything unless it came out of his own mouth...because he understood how this all worked (he knew how easy it was for others to lie about him). But Michael isn't here anymore...and that, too, gives posers a field day.

If Michael was in a relationship before he died with the woman he loved and he wanted his fans to know, based on what he told us...he would have told us from his own mouth. And his woman would understand that and the why behind it. Therefore, she would not take an opportunity after he died to start telling fans about him and her. It makes no sense. Could she not even be trusted to know the truth but not to talk about him? To not use him to be special in the fan's eyes? But a poser...would be all over it!

What if MJ loved a woman with all his heart before he died and she kept quiet about it till the day she died, never letting fans know about her or the media, the world, or even contacting his family, maybe, or his children, all because she knew how private Michael was? If Michael had wanted someone to know, he would have told them. And let's say she knew that and so respected that...and even more, she was like that, too, private and careful. And she saw first hand the kind of effort MJ put out to protect her, in the days before he left this world, all to keep her hidden.

So... the day came when she, too, died... and she died a nobody in the world's eyes, and more important, in the fans' eyes; they never knew. But she knew...she knew the love she had for Michael, and him for her, and she knew it was a gift from God, and that was enough for her, and that precious treasure she took quietly with her to the grave.

Now that woman I would respect. That woman I would believe loved Michael for Michael. And that she understood him.



I knew by the way that counselor said it, that even though she loved her husband in some way, and made her life with him, her heart still belonged to that other man. Wow! This is deep.


I know...it's this whole idea about one's heart belonging to someone. How can a heart belong to two people at the same time? To me it seems only one person can have your heart in such a way.

It makes me think of Barry Manilow's song...which is really quite sad for all involved, called Even Now:

U6MpKd_BUBM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6MpKd_BUBM

I was thinking of this song in terms of that counselor, but if we try to tie it in with the LITD girl and MJ...and during that time when MJ released YANA, or even just as his career was taking off but "she" wasn't around, then these lines here sort of work...

Even now, when I come shining through
I swear I think of you...
and how I wish you knew...
Even now.


And claudiadoina :hug: you asked this question, but I think you already know the answer to it:



What is the point of this entire thread wich was dragged out for years if you dont want to know if he had or had not loved and been loved...for your answer is here:


As you know this thread (a beautiful thread BTW) is mostly about speculating about Michael's love life and your beliefs/dreams about if he had or had not met the love of his life so this is not the place for me to answer to your questions.

This thread is for those who enjoy discussing it all without ever knowing one way or the other(it's all speculation and exploring ideas and talking about love, etc)...because... if MJ wanted us to know he would have told the world about "her" (if there really was a LITD girl) and he didn't.

[Ashtanga]

I must have been living under a mushroom. Had no idea this was going on. I used to be sharp, but I have been losing it lately - unlike the eagle-eyed Ashmeister!


:shifty: http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif








if MJ wanted us to know he would have told the world

he didn't.

Again I agree with everything you said. I prefer a thousand times to believe what comes out of Michael's mouth than the mouth of others. And people will continue speculating about this because the truth will never appear. Now it's completely impossible to believe anything they (some people) say about the private life of Michael. He was the ONLY reliable source. And even if Michael were here, none of these people would dare to open mouth to say anything. He had no obligation to tell the world anything about his private life to satisfy people's curiosity. -_- :fear:

[DWsoul]

hi everyone. The current topic in here is an interesting one. My personal stance is kind of neutral, but certainly not passive.

If there are things claudiadoina knows, for a fact, from whatever source, then she has the right to either share or not share that information. There are a number of people on here, I am pretty sure, who "know" certain (and different) things about this issue and about Michael and his loves and personal life. Some ppl here knew Michael personally. sometimes these people share this, and many times they don't. I am pretty sure of this. Often times, even when they do share something they know, they are criticized and "burned at the stake". Michael came here. So what? This is a major site from fans around the world dedicated to him. If I were in his shoes I would have done the same thing. Sooo...some of his friends and family members probably come here too. We just don't know it. A person isn't superhuman just because they know Michael. They are just regular people, like us.

On the flip side, addressing the posers issue. This has become a big problem, admittedly. It's bad. And it makes everyone who claims they know something, suspect. :( and then accusations are thrown, and then those who really DO know something and want to contribute to a conversation, are PUT OFF! Posers are going to be there, and ashtanga (welcome back btw!) addresses a good way to identify them and to be wary.

So basically, if a person claims to know something or whatever, whether they are genuine or posers, don't ask for proof. There is not going to be any. Not much. Don't start attacking. As for posers, they feed off attention, both positive and negative, do they not? If someone claims to know something, true or not, all u can really do is take it with a grain of salt and say something like, "oh, that's cool", and brush it off. The posers will lose their audience, and the genuine people won't be put off. There are going to be both posers and genuine knowers. Thats fine. whatever. they are people too.

We cannot judge what a person who knew Michael would or would not do. We cannot assume those people will stay secret forever, or that they will not go online to talk to people about things. We CAN assume, however, that they are free to do what they want, when they want, and be real about themselves and other people. As I think Ashtanga mentioned, Paris is real about herself. she doesn't pretend. She doesn't hide. She even posts things about herself and her father that other people do not know. She doesn't seem to see the point in faking anything. Same with anyone else who knew anything about him, whether they were kept from the limelight or not (and there are a LOT of people in Michael's life who were kept under the radar, very successfully!). So, they should feel free to post anything they want, shouldn't they?

They SHOULD feel free, but they DON"T. Why? because they know that as soon as they do, they will come under scrutiny and under attack. And this, of all places, should be a place to feel FREEDOM.

Oh, and just because someone posts only partial knowledge and won't say how they know, does not mean they don't know. There is no requirement around here for full disclosure, that I know of. There is a lot of privacy of others to be protected, obviously, not to mention privacy in our own lives. Not everyone here tells everything about themselves. No need to. We are who we are, we know what we know, we live our lives, we say or don't say certain things about ourselves, and thats all.

:)

Claudiadoina, welcome. I had never seen you before but I am not real consistent here myself.

Ok thats all.

[Ashtanga]

Michael came here. So what?

Yes... fact. :) So what? He was quiet and watching everything and everyone here. He stood in silence watching everything we were saying here in the forum. >>> http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif He remained in hiding here. Simple. -_- So much so that today no one knows what his nickname here. :lol: :nono: :fortuneteller: :fear:

[DWsoul]

On a separate note, I want to say that, crazy as it sounds, I KNOW how it feels to be a kind of "love in the dark". Is it hard? YES! Is it painful? YES! Do I wish to disclose who I am to the world? YES! But do I? No. Why not? Because the love of my life is not ready for me to. There are several people out there, who know about us and our relationship and how close and tight we are. But he's got issues he needs to work through in himself, before he is ready to take the leap for my full disclosure. It's like, I don't know, that he wants to unveil me dramatically to the world or something, later. I don't exactly know how he sees it. But right now he just wants us to be private. When he is ready, he will "unveil" me, or whatever. And, if he dies before then, personally, I'll unveil my dang self and let the WORLD know I loved him! Hm. Well, maybe. I am not certain. Thats what I would LIKE to do, but I am not sure if I would, depending on the circumstances, I guess. Maybe it would not be something that was important, in the larger scheme of things. maybe just knowing that he loved me totally, til the day he died, will be enough. I really can't say.

One thing I can tell you all, I am NOT the LITD of this thread. Just to be clear on that point! My point is that, to be a type of "litd" is hard to do. I don't think that most people here can possibly imagine the extreme pain that comes with it, no matter whether the person you love is alive or dead.

Another point: there ARE going to be people here who claim to be Michael's "LITD". There wasn't just one. Period. In the practical, everyday sense of things, there wasn't. he had a bunch of women who he loved, most under the radar and kept "in the dark". That's all there is to it. As for just ONE MAIN LITD, the dream of his life, his soulmate, twinflame or whatever you wnat to call it, I don't think anyone but Michael knows who that really is. But since most of his girlfriends were all "loves in the dark" in their own right, each can easily think and say that they were the ONE, if they chose to. Each has a special place, though. All are special, and none of them can be discounted, for they knew Michael, a different Michael, than almost anyone else here knew.

Kudos, to all of Michael's "LITDs". You know who you are.

[Lisha]

hi everyone. The current topic in here is an interesting one. My personal stance is kind of neutral, but certainly not passive.

If there are things claudiadoina knows, for a fact, from whatever source, then she has the right to either share or not share that information. There are a number of people on here, I am pretty sure, who "know" certain (and different) things about this issue and about Michael and his loves and personal life. Some ppl here knew Michael personally. sometimes these people share this, and many times they don't. I am pretty sure of this. Often times, even when they do share something they know, they are criticized and "burned at the stake". Michael came here. So what? This is a major site from fans around the world dedicated to him. If I were in his shoes I would have done the same thing. Sooo...some of his friends and family members probably come here too. We just don't know it. A person isn't superhuman just because they know Michael. They are just regular people, like us.

On the flip side, addressing the posers issue. This has become a big problem, admittedly. It's bad. And it makes everyone who claims they know something, suspect. :( and then accusations are thrown, and then those who really DO know something and want to contribute to a conversation, are PUT OFF! Posers are going to be there, and ashtanga (welcome back btw!) addresses a good way to identify them and to be wary.

So basically, if a person claims to know something or whatever, whether they are genuine or posers, don't ask for proof. There is not going to be any. Not much. Don't start attacking. As for posers, they feed off attention, both positive and negative, do they not? If someone claims to know something, true or not, all u can really do is take it with a grain of salt and say something like, "oh, that's cool", and brush it off. The posers will lose their audience, and the genuine people won't be put off. There are going to be both posers and genuine knowers. Thats fine. whatever. they are people too.

We cannot judge what a person who knew Michael would or would not do. We cannot assume those people will stay secret forever, or that they will not go online to talk to people about things. We CAN assume, however, that they are free to do what they want, when they want, and be real about themselves and other people. As I think Ashtanga mentioned, Paris is real about herself. she doesn't pretend. She doesn't hide. She even posts things about herself and her father that other people do not know. She doesn't seem to see the point in faking anything. Same with anyone else who knew anything about him, whether they were kept from the limelight or not (and there are a LOT of people in Michael's life who were kept under the radar, very successfully!). So, they should feel free to post anything they want, shouldn't they?

They SHOULD feel free, but they DON"T. Why? because they know that as soon as they do, they will come under scrutiny and under attack. And this, of all places, should be a place to feel FREEDOM.

Oh, and just because someone posts only partial knowledge and won't say how they know, does not mean they don't know. There is no requirement around here for full disclosure, that I know of. There is a lot of privacy of others to be protected, obviously, not to mention privacy in our own lives. Not everyone here tells everything about themselves. No need to. We are who we are, we know what we know, we live our lives, we say or don't say certain things about ourselves, and thats all.

:)

Claudiadoina, welcome. I had never seen you before but I am not real consistent here myself.

Ok thats all.

Obviously I disagree with a lot you are saying.

As far as Paris...she was sharing things as her account was in the process of being verified. Now it is verified. Why would she wish it to be verified...to stop the posers and so fans will know they can count on what she says because she is truly Paris Jackson the daughter of Michael Jackson.

Why would anyone who really knew Michael post anything here, and not realize they will cause the fans some uncertainty because of the way things are. It is inconsiderate. That is why I posted awhile ago in here, that if there was a litdg and she came in here and posted...that she would be being inconsiderate, because she must know no one could believe her just because she says so.

So if a person who really knew MJ is upset with the fact that when they post no one believes them...well, once again, I question their motivation for posting in the first place. Is it due to ego? It might be awfully nice to post in a thread in a popular MJ fansite where all the fans are so often impressed with anyone who has been even near to Michael Jackson, let alone can offer some info about him.

So, DWsoul...why when you first arrived here on MJJC was one of the first things you did was introduce youself in a new member thread and made sure to add at the end a direct message to Michael saying "don't forget who your speech writer is, mister" and "don't forget 'her'?" Did you not think that would raise an eyebrow or two?

Seems like it was no surprise you ended up in this thread soon after, and would be one today to support those who come off knowing Michael to go ahead and post that they do.

EDIT: OH, while I was posting you posted...and *laughs* it was the post I have been waiting for you to post. You took your time. I thought you wouldn't be able to resist.

[Ashtanga]

On a separate note, I want to say that, crazy as it sounds, I KNOW how it feels to be a kind of "love in the dark". Is it hard? YES! Is it painful? YES! Do I wish to disclose who I am to the world? YES! But do I? No. Why not? Because the love of my life is not ready for me to. There are several people out there, who know about us and our relationship and how close and tight we are. But he's got issues he needs to work through in himself, before he is ready to take the leap for my full disclosure. It's like, I don't know, that he wants to unveil me dramatically to the world or something, later. I don't exactly know how he sees it. But right now he just wants us to be private. When he is ready, he will "unveil" me, or whatever. And, if he dies before then, personally, I'll unveil my dang self and let the WORLD know I loved him! Hm. Well, maybe. I am not certain. Thats what I would LIKE to do, but I am not sure if I would, depending on the circumstances, I guess. Maybe it would not be something that was important, in the larger scheme of things. maybe just knowing that he loved me totally, til the day he died, will be enough. I really can't say.

One thing I can tell you all, I am NOT the LITD of this thread. Just to be clear on that point! My point is that, to be a type of "litd" is hard to do. I don't think that most people here can possibly imagine the extreme pain that comes with it, no matter whether the person you love is alive or dead.

Another point: there ARE going to be people here who claim to be Michael's "LITD". There wasn't just one. Period. In the practical, everyday sense of things, there wasn't. he had a bunch of women who he loved, most under the radar and kept "in the dark". That's all there is to it. As for just ONE MAIN LITD, the dream of his life, his soulmate, twinflame or whatever you wnat to call it, I don't think anyone but Michael knows who that really is. But since most of his girlfriends were all "loves in the dark" in their own right, each can easily think and say that they were the ONE, if they chose to. Each has a special place, though. All are special, and none of them can be discounted, for they knew Michael, a different Michael, than almost anyone else here knew.

Kudos, to all of Michael's "LITDs". You know who you are.

Wow! :ph34r: :*****: This whole thing of "LITD girl" is soooooooooooo beautiful and perfect that it looks like a fairy tale. :girl_sigh: :smilerolleyes: But after June 25 My thoughts go very far on this issue because there are other very important and very disturbing behind all this beautiful and perfect thing about "LITD girl" and bla bla bla that goes unnoticed by people. :doh: But never mind. This will stay with me. The best I have to do is shut up. -_-

[Lisha]

MP and I were just starting to get some conversations going to get things back on track and the fun Ashmeister returned and brought some enjoyment and smiles, and then...did you all not notice...posts start coming in to bring up a subject to get this thread derailed....as so often has happened in the history of this thread.

Drama always followed posts where someone comes in suggesting they know WHO the LITD girl is. It is known to cause problems in this thread each time.

Yet, it keeps happening, no matter how many times it was said in this thread (starting with AllForMJ many times) that it is not about identifying "her", or showing anyone here that they know who the LITD girl (or a secret woman/love in his life) is.

Anyone knowing this, and still comes in this thread to do just that, is being extremely inconsiderate to this thread.

[Ashtanga]

the fun Ashmeister returned and brought some enjoyment and smiles

:blushing: :give_heart:





someone comes in suggesting they know WHO the LITD girl is.

I may not be the "LITD girl" :shifty:, but I feel proud to say that I'm the girl of the pin (Thanks dear Michael!!! :girl_in_love:). :D :girl_sigh: :wub: :lol: :fear:

[Lisha]

I may not be the "LITD girl" :shifty:, but I feel proud to say that I'm the girl of the pin (Thanks dear Michael!!! :girl_in_love:). :D :girl_sigh: :wub: :lol: :fear:



Yes you ARE!!! Hey, that might be a better gig than being the LITD girl...I'm not sure that would be easy street. :lol:

Anyway, I hope all this won't keep MP from posting in here. I know how she doesn't like dissention or conflict. :(




EDIT: btw, Ash, did you lose that pic, of MJ wearing "your" Shirley Temple pin during the TII rehearsals, when your computer died?

[Ashtanga]

Yes you ARE!!!

:naughty: :blushing:


Now, many (new members in this thread) will wonder why I'm the girl of the pin. :lol: :shifty: :fortuneteller:






Hey, that might be a better gig than being the LITD girl...I'm not sure that would be easy street. :lol:

http://www.hornedhalo.org/images/kermit.gif







Anyway, I hope all this won't keep MP from posting in here. I know how she doesn't like dissention or conflict. :(

:(


Hey, where's MP when the thread is on fire? MP, do not hide from the fire! :unsure: :wild: :fear:











EDIT: btw, Ash, did you lose that pic, of MJ wearing "your" Shirley Temple pin during the TII rehearsals, when your computer died?

Yes!!!! :woohoo: I saved on a cd all the pictures long before my laptop died. :lol: :wild: It is guarded with great care. :girl_sigh: :wub: For example:


http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg694/scaled.php?server=694&filename=f1gu3ud5wfbsm38d0c4e.png&res=medium

:cry: *big sigh*

[Lisha]

^ I am SO impressed with you. So wise of you to save them on a CD. What a bright girl you consistently are

And thank you for posting it. :) I think in a way you could say you've been "pinned" by MJ. Just like in the fifties guys would pin their school pins onto the girl they wanted to go "steady with." Was MJ getting a message to you he wanted to go steady with you? :wild:

Wait, did he wear a school letterman's jacket at any point in This Is It? I think that would CONFIRM IT!!!! :lol:

(do you have a pic of him in a letterman's jacket?) naaaah...you couldn't have...

[DWsoul]

Well I think Lisha and I can be free to agree to disagree on the "inconsiderate" issue. I'm just leaving that one alone. As for me, it doesn't really matter to me whether or not a person says they knew Michael, or that they know something. Whatever whatever. It is what it is.

Back on track: Ashtanga ~ the girl of the pin. I like that one!
MP ~ come on back in here, girl, its all good. keep on posting stuff.
Lisha ~ I agree with you: I don't think being a litd girl would be easy street, either. just being in my predicament is a confusing and sometimes hellish roller coaster! Imagine what it's like for her/them???? eeeeek! I'd rather be a pin girl any day. It's just that little, quiet hint that says, "I see you. You are special." :)

[DWsoul]

^ I am SO impressed with you. So wise of you to save them on a CD. What a bright girl you consistently are

And thank you for posting it. :) I think in a way you could say you've been "pinned" by MJ. Just like in the fifties guys would pin their school pins onto the girl they wanted to go "steady with." Was MJ getting a message to you he wanted to go steady with you? :wild:

Wait, did he wear a school letterman's jacket at any point in This Is It? I think that would CONFIRM IT!!!! :lol:

(do you have a pic of him in a letterman's jacket?) naaaah...you couldn't have...


lol! just a sec...DID he wear any lettermans jackets in TII? I don't even remember its been so long since i've seen it. I think only in the original Thriller video, right?

but Lisha...you could be on to something...Ashtanga has been "pinned". :)

[Ashtanga]

^ I am SO impressed with you. So wise of you to save them on a CD. What a bright girl you consistently are

And thank you for posting it. :)

Thanks! :blushing:







I think in a way you could say you've been "pinned" by MJ.

but Lisha...you could be on to something...Ashtanga has been "pinned". :)

Yes..... :naughty: :shifty:






Was MJ getting a message to you he wanted to go steady with you? :wild:

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Maybe.... :shifty: :P I think it was some kind of message to me and he found this way to say it to me through the pin: Hey Ash, I'm looking at you, I know about you.... :girl_sigh: :heart:

He knew I would see. :shifty: Think about it always makes me smile. :wub: I think Michael liked my posts here in the thread. :fear:








Wait, did he wear a school letterman's jacket at any point in This Is It? I think that would CONFIRM IT!!!! :lol:

(do you have a pic of him in a letterman's jacket?) naaaah...you couldn't have...

lol! just a sec...DID he wear any lettermans jackets in TII? I don't even remember its been so long since i've seen it.

I do not remember him having used the school letterman's jacket in This is it. :lol: I believe not. :nono: What can I say about the pin that day (June 4, 2009 :P), is that this jacket is the same as he used the press conference. >>>

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/29/article-2054946-0B1241F5000005DC-200_468x601.jpg :cry:











I think only in the original Thriller video, right?

No. :nono: He used it on other occasions as well (But I think when he got older, he used no more). There are a lot of pictures. Like this:


http://favim.com/orig/201108/13/fierce-jacket-king-of-pop-michael-jackson-musician-Favim.com-122568.jpg

http://www.yournextcoat.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Michael-Jackson-in-sports-jacket.jpg

http://michaeljackson8x10photos.com/michaeljacksonphotos1989invarsityjacketse1310a.jpg


And much more..... :in_love: :blushing:










Back on track: Ashtanga ~ the girl of the pin. I like that one!

Lisha ~ I agree with you: I don't think being a litd girl would be easy street, either. just being in my predicament is a confusing and sometimes hellish roller coaster! Imagine what it's like for her/them???? eeeeek! I'd rather be a pin girl any day. It's just that little, quiet hint that says, "I see you. You are special." :)

Me too.... :girl_sigh: :heart:

[claudiadoina]

:mello:

[Lorraine]

:popcorn:

[Ashtanga]

There aren't so many though..you'd be surprised...very surprised


Really??? :scratch: Well, "someone" told me one thing, Frank said another thing in his book, each person says something different, and so on.... So many different information. :*****: :smilerolleyes: Who is telling the truth??? :wtf: :lol: :smilerolleyes: :doh:

I have a totally different view of all of this in relation to what was happening before 25 June and principally what happened on June 25. And nobody seems to notice it and neither dared to think about it carefully. :doh: :sigh:

"LITD girl" :smilerolleyes: :sigh:, friends, whoever it is.... in the end, Michael was completely alone. Nobody was there for him. That is the sad reality of it all. :cry: Thinking about it hurts..... :( *big sigh* Who cares? No one. :( But OK. Move on.... -_-

[Favoritetune]

Hello ladies. I was reading through the pages here and thought I'd add my two cents. I think the concept of this thread is really cool and could be possible cause a lot of writers share what's inside of them when they write and singers often pick songs that relate to them like most people would pick out a greeting card.

Some folks here are wondering about the litd girl and if she exists then I think a good way for someone to presume that person is her self, someone else they know or not is to use his lyrics as either a mirror or picture of what he had in his mind or heart.

See guys may have women in their life but just cause some girl is around that don't mean they mean that much to the guy some women are don't hate me for saying this ladies but some are a convenience. A lot of women will throw themselves at a man and why not just let em stick around. I'm just saying. It's nice to have personal attention but a guy accepting some attention don't mean a guy is in love with you.

Maybe some women are thinking she was this litd girl cause he was constantly singing about finding that someone and some think that it's them cause they weren't there. I guess this scenario leaves things open for most everyone cause not that many women were in Mjs life so with that in mind it could be anyone.

If we go by the songs he was singing there were some things mj said he wanted all the time and that was his someone who was in his heart not just something physical but something divine. Lot of guys will settle for getting some girls in bed but he seemed to know he needed more than that. he wanted more than that. did he get more than that? was he asking for too much? did God actually take the time to make the person he was praying for, wanting and waiting for?

anyway like I said his songs say more than posers can claim. he gave really good descriptions of what he wanted. I'll start with some of that and if it helps to get this thread back on track for us then how about some others share lyrics in songs of his they know and show what he was wanting in a woman. If anyone here feel that's them or someone they know then sweet I'd hope mj would have had that in his life. he needed love.

I'm gonna start with Someone put your hand out if any body any one knows passes this test once his lyrics are spread out then great if not place yourself or someone you know in the maybe one day category but not the you're the litd girl one. if she exists then it's gotta be from God.

Pulled the lyrics off some web site

Someone Put Your Hand Out lyrics

Never try to talk about it
It's got to sound good to me inside
I just think about it

I'm so undemanding
'Cause they say love is blind
I've lived this life pretending
I can bear this hurt deep inside

The truth is I'm been longing
A love that's so divine
I've searched this whole world wishing
She'll be there time after time

So someone put your hand out
I'm begging for your love
All I do is hand out a heart that needs your love

I've lived my life the lonely
A soul that cries of shame
With handicapped emotions
Save me now from what still remains

I'll be your story hero
A serenading ryne
I'm just needing that someone
Save me now from the path I'm on...

Someone put your hand out
I'm begging for your love
'Cause all I do is hand out a heart that needs your love
Someone put your hand out
I'm begging for your love
All I do is hand out a heart that needs your love

When you say we will dance 'til the light of day
It's just like the children running with joy
When we pray will you promise me you'll always stay
It's because I'm needing that someone


Someone put your hand out
I'm begging for your love
'Cause all I do is hand out a heart that needs your love
Someone put your hand out
I'm begging for your love
All I do is hand out
Someone put your hand out
I'm begging for your love
All I do is hand out
Love

I see nobody is having pea fights so thats good

[Lisha]

:popcorn:



Lorraine!!! hahahha. Yeah, get yourself in a comfy seat and get that popcorn...here comes some more!

And see...MP is no where to be found. I kneeeeew it!! lol. Ah, take your time MP. :hug: Wait till all the fires are out. :)

And Ash, I realize that which you bolded in your post above has always been your criteria for how you have come to believe MJ could not have had a special someone in his life at the end, or she could/would have prevented somehow his death. And you do have a point. :yes: It makes for you any discussion on either if there was a LITD girl or identifying her, pretty moot. Neither would apply.

Claudiadoina, (just in case she drops by again, for I have things to more fully explain) the reason I have come off so strongly is that back in July 2011 I became aware of a situation where on Facebook someone was protraying themselves to others in private messages that she was MJ's last love before he died, and I discerned something was not feeling right about it. I also want to say I am not mean, but I am straightforward and am committed to speaking truth, but want very much to stay fair.


She is not sharing with "fans" she is sharing with friends.
The person I am referring most definitely has been talking with fans, that's the concern, lovely sweet souled individuals who a member here PM'd with and then led the to her facebook. Perhaps this is not your lady friend, and she only talks with those who she knows in real life and she would not have necessarily wished for you, or any of her friends she knew to bring her up in this thread. That would be to her credit.

However, the invidual I'm talking about from facebook, I know for a fact was wanting to come in this thread and let us in here know she was MJ's true love and that were right about her (meaning she felt she was the LITD girl of this thread) and for us to be comforted that MJ had love in the end. I think at the time she was given the impression it wouldn't go over but I felt that would not be the end of it and somehow she'd make her presence known again in this thread. I made the assumption you were here to do just that. But, again, maybe we are dealing with two different self-assigned LITD girls.

Anyway, I hope that explains better why I came off the way I did. I have been on my guard. Sometimes the lioness comes over me when I am feelin protectiive of others, and I do feel protective of those who come here and read this thread. I don't want them messed with.

Enough "sharing" for me though, I wasn't planned to do that anyway, I don't seek attention of any kind if I would I would have said something long ago...
If at anytime claudiadonia you had come into this thread and had joined into the ongoing discussion of what this thread is about...looking at lyrics to see if MJ was talking about or talking to a special woman...but not by trying to figure out who she is, then I would understand a little better you saying this. But every post, out of the 11 you have posted in this thread have been focused on "who" the LITD girl might be:

~first post of yours, on 8/31/11, you came out of the blue and copied and pasted in comments on some site of a woman who presented herself as a woman who had a close romantic relationship with MJ. Now to that woman's credit, what she wrote was written in a mature and soft way and she painted MJ in a very good light. It was a good read. BUT...you focus was to come in this thread and get us wondering if this person was the LITD girl:


I have just found 2 comments on a site (not fan forum) on a comment section under an article.I loved it and I wanted to share and this thread seems the right thread to do so.The person who wrote those comments for sure loved Michael and it looks like they had a relationship.They are beautifully written.

Let me know what do you think about it


April 10th, 2011 at 10:12 pm

(btw DWsoul, you had just posted to claudiadoinia):

Claudiadoina, welcome. I had never seen you before but I am not real consistent here myself.

But you were one that made a point a point to thank her for that post of comments:

claudia, thank you, SO MUCH, for that! It was absolutely beautiful, and true to the core. Oh, the side of Michael that so many don't get to see. :)

~second post of yours on 9/13/11
Again, the focus is on -who- the LITD girl is:

I wonder if is there any chance that one of you was Michael's last girlfriend?:thinking:

Silly question huh? :girl_smile:

~your third post just recently and the subsequent posts found on the last few pages here:

He did find THE LOVE.The true love. :heart:
He did love and he was loved more than anybody could ever believe or understand.
From the moment he found THE LOVE of his life he was the happiest man on Earth till the end.

~here's one that shortly followed this last one:


^^^ It's not only that I'm sure he did, I know he did :heart:
It seems to me your only interest in this thread is to get us interested in learning who the LITD girl is and now you are here letting us know you KNOW who she is. You seem to have never been interested in what we discus here, and maybe I'm wrong but you seem to leave us here on kind of a condescending note:

good luck with your assumptions, presumtions, speculations, dreaming, fantasizing......:)

But maybe you were trying to be nice; I see the smiley. But if you feel that you know who the LITD girl is and you are leaving us here to do those things...woudn't it come off like you are being sarcastic with us...especially the "good luck" part?



What a woman should do to prove herself to you that she is THE WOMAN (not that she would want to or need to ).There is nothing that she could do.So she is not , not claiming, not talking about not trying to convince anyone. This is my point, if she, or an MJ insider regarding any info they know, understand this, then why would they even try? There is no way to prove to everyone's satisfaction when dealing with online. This is why celebrities are doing the Twitter root and getting verified. Finally a celebrity can talk for themselves and fans will be comforted that they are not being played with by a poser but it is the actual person. Even MJ was trying, it seems, to come up with a solution long ago when he had his own official website and was going to do short videos with him answering questions. Why? So fans would know it was him and no one was lying to them or posing as him. That was considerate.


PS: I am a mature woman too you know, and she is not just an "online" friend. :heart: I thought you came to the conclusion it was not worth it to try to prove it. Yet here you are purposely dropping another bomb. So are you saying she lives in your country and you are buds in real life?


If there are things claudiadoina knows, for a fact, from whatever source, then she has the right to either share or not share that information. There are a number of people on here, I am pretty sure, who "know" certain (and different) things about this issue and about Michael and his loves and personal life. Some ppl here knew Michael personally. sometimes these people share this, and many times they don't. I am pretty sure of this. Often times, even when they do share something they know, they are criticized and "burned at the stake". ...Sooo...some of his friends and family members probably come here too. We just don't know it.

And it makes everyone who claims they know something, suspect. :( Yes, understandably. and then accusations are thrown, and then those who really DO know something and want to contribute to a conversation, are PUT OFF!
So basically, if a person claims to know something or whatever, whether they are genuine or posers, don't ask for proof. There is not going to be any. Not much. Don't start attacking. As for posers, they feed off attention, both positive and negative, do they not? If someone claims to know something, true or not, all u can really do is take it with a grain of salt and say something like, "oh, that's cool", and brush it off. The posers will lose their audience, and the genuine people won't be put off. There are going to be both posers and genuine knowers. Thats fine. whatever. they are people too.

I agree anyone has the right, but is it the right thing to do? What I have been trying to get across is this is a situation where self-discipline should be practiced.

Consider MJ...and we all like too, haha...he loved his fans, and had the kind of heart where he would bless them in anyway he could. And if he had an opportunity to give their heart a thrill and make thier day special, one to remember always...he would. However, as we know, MJ had to take desperate means due to his great celebrity and many times if he wanted to enjoy something in public without getting mobbed he would put on a disguise and blend in. Just imagine how many times MJ was somewhere where he would know or guess that a good number of the peeps around him were big fans. And he would know, no doubt, that many might even have a heartfelt wish to meet, and maybe touch or hug, or even look in his eyes and smile at MJ just once in their life. And yet, as much as he loves his fans, and would love to give them their heart's desire and give then the thrill of that, he would know it was not wisdom to do make himself known to them. He practiced self-discipline. And there the fans would go home never knowing MJ was so close to them and their dream almost happened. MJ would have realized. He would have been sad probably he couldn't have blessed them, but would know it wouldn't have worked. So he chose wisdom.

Now if MJ had been here on MJJC in a hidden account, just like insides, and friends of his, or family members, and MJ goes into a thread and sees everyone posting inaccurately about a situation involving him...no one knows its him...would the temptation be too great for him to post "partial" information that no one could know unless they had inside info? If he did, MJ himself would have been asked for proof on how he knows. How much strength and self-discipline does it take for an individual to see themselves being posted about inaccurately and still decide not to post to straighten the fans out because they know it wouldn't have worked.



So, they should feel free to post anything they want, shouldn't they? ....No
They SHOULD feel free, but they DON"T. Why? because they know that as soon as they do, they will come under scrutiny and under attack. And this, of all places, should be a place to feel FREEDOM.
Because it is unfair to an online community where no one can know if the person is legit or not. That is why what MJJC has been doing with the Question and Answers with differenlt insiders is helpful. Fans can know that the info they are getting is really from that person.


Oh, and just because someone posts only partial knowledge and won't say how they know, does not mean they don't know. There is no requirement around here for full disclosure, that I know of.
Partial disclousure is unfair. It's teasing...and can come off like playing. Something like "na na na na na na , look what I know but you don't, and I'm not gonna tell you how I know so you can never know if you're being taken for a ride or not...na na na na na na!" The considerate thing is to use self-discipline and not share anything.

I sense that maybe your perspective is what it is because you are some form of an insider and have had the attacks. I come form the opposite perspective because I am not an insider. But I do see how frustrating it would be to not post and clear things up when one has the info to share. But it is better for an insider to feel frustrated and or post and be not believed, than for a game player to mess with the fans. No one should be upset with the fans for wanting to protect themselves from that; that is why they ask for proof. Why would someone not understand their perspective?



As for just ONE MAIN LITD, the dream of his life, his soulmate, twinflame or whatever you wnat to call it, I don't think anyone but Michael knows who that really is. So you don't think he trusted anyone enough to tell them about her?

But since most of his girlfriends were all "loves in the dark" in their own right, each can easily think and say that they were the ONE, if they chose to. Each has a special place, though. All are special, and none of them can be discounted, for they knew Michael, a different Michael, than almost anyone else here knew.

I do agree with you here, in that I do not mean that if there are ladies that MJ had in his life who loved him very sincerely, that if they end up not being his special someone hidden in his heart, and it is someone else, that they suddenly become some kind of second class citizens. With Michael's large heart and capacity to love so fully and generously, I am sure they will always be special to him. Every single one of them. I just have problems with anyone posing as the LITD girl for sport, or someone wanting a little too much for the fans to know of their existence and connection to Michael.

(I can just imagine the typos in here. No way am I gonna proofread this monster-sized post. haha)

http://www.dslextreme.com/users/shioi/artwork/rose.jpg

^I like this one, Ash, because he looks so cute holding that rose. :)

[Favoritetune]

Here's an idea! Maybe the litd girl is Minnie Mouse. Nice pic!

don't mind my humor. Lorraine will you share your popcorn?

[Lisha]

^ haha! I think that could be a good possibility! Awww....lucky Minnie.

Favoritetune, I was busy constructing my long post when you came in here and posted about Someone Put Your Hand Out, and it is such a nice post. It reminds me of the posts in here from long ago. Yay! Thank you! :flowers:

Let me take some time to think over the lyrics and come back to comment...


EDIT: btw, FT, that's hilarious that you gave the reason for editing as "wanted popcorn". :lol:

[Favoritetune]

Hey Lisha thank you. I was hoping I would not upset anyone and get peas thrown at me. Love reading your posts.

[Ashtanga]

Popcorn?????!!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif :shifty:









And Ash, I realize that which you bolded in your post above has always been your criteria for how you have come to believe MJ could not have had a special someone in his life at the end, or she could/would have prevented somehow his death. And you do have a point. :yes: It makes for you any discussion on either if there was a LITD girl or identifying her, pretty mute. Neither would apply.

Those who were around Michael could have avoided somehow. They were there, all completely blind. Nobody knew anything. No one noticed anything strange. Nobody did anything. And bla bla bla..... WTF??? :wtf: :doh: No explanation can make me change my mind on everything I hear from people who were around Michael telling thousands of interviews and bla bla bla. Any explanation NOW makes no sense to me and I will completely ignore because there is no way to explain it. It is quite impossible to explain something so bizarre. -_-

Well, I hate to talk about because it breaks my heart, I do not wanna talk about it, but that's how I see it all. (I feel sorry for you dear Michael....) :cry: *big sigh*










http://www.dslextreme.com/users/shioi/artwork/rose.jpg

^I like this one, Ash, because he looks so cute holding that rose. :)

I love this picture!!! :wild: :girl_sigh: :heart:








Here's an idea! Maybe the litd girl is Minnie Mouse.

:lol:


And good to see you back here! :give_heart:

[Lisha]

Peas, peas,
try our peas,
Our peas
are a delicacy!

Now FT, picture Michelle Pfeiffer singing that just for you. :tease:**




Someone Put Your Hand Out lyrics

Never try to talk about it
It's got to sound good to me inside
I just think about it



This first line would make one think that MJ never did feel comfortable talking about his dream girl, (that God helped him "dream up?")...so maybe he didn't tell anyone like DWsoul was suggesting.






**reference: The Fabulous Baker Boys

[Ape]

I don't really have anything to say... well I have lots to say but nothing all at once. Just posting to say hello to everyone. Favoritetune, I wondered where you were. Nice to see you back. Too bad visiting in here has to be online. It'd be nice to all (everyone here) be sharing popcorn together somewhere. Brazil looks nice. Ash, can we visit at your place?

OK I'll say this... I agree with both sides here. I wish those who knew him for real could share, but I wish there were a way to know for sure that they are real. So... once again, let's all go meet at Ashes place in Brazil to visit and share thoughts and stories and popcorn. :)

[claudiadoina]

:mello:

[Lisha]

I don't really have anything to say... well I have lots to say but nothing all at once. Just posting to say hello to everyone. Favoritetune, I wondered where you were. Nice to see you back. Too bad visiting in here has to be online. It'd be nice to all (everyone here) be sharing popcorn together somewhere. Brazil looks nice. Ash, can we visit at your place?

OK I'll say this... I agree with both sides here. I wish those who knew him for real could share, but I wish there were a way to know for sure that they are real. So... once again, let's all go meet at Ashes place in Brazil to visit and share thoughts and stories and popcorn. :)

Hello, Ape!!!

You know, part of the reason I like to keep hanging in here, even though the thread's hay day might be over is that it is not just about the subject AllForMJ laid out for us, but this place became something more relational for us.

You know, Ape, I was just mentioning to you recently about in real life (offline) how every other week I meet with some ladies, and when together we can share from our hearts and support one another and I end up being blessed every time I go..and they all say the same thing. We pray for each other, we grieve with one another, we are happy hearing good reports, and we sincerely care what is going on in the lives of our children as we share about them. It's a special thing when God brings together a group of individuals to care about and share with one another.

This thread has resembled this on many occasions. Ape, when you got your film role, we all rejoiced with you, but when you were going through tough times ...we cared, and cried with you, sort of speak, and tried to encourage your faith. And this is just an example on how the beauty of on a regular basis the same people spend time with one another. The connection builds as time goes on.

Even if MP and I are the only ones in here chit chattin' back and forth I enjoy it. She is so congenial and pleasant to interact with, and has much wisdom to share as a woman of God. I thought, well, maybe if we here just quietly (for probably not too many would be interested and come read what we're talking about) maybe some others will join us. I don't really require this thread to be hoppin' and popular anymore...but as MP said to me before, she is willing to see what God might be wishing to do here, even still. Maybe it's just about a small support system. Maybe at times what we say will reach someone and bless them, or get them thinking and maybe something will relate to what is going on in their own lives.


The thread is really (loosely speaking) become something like maybe The View or The Talk...where some in here just start talking about some things....but the subjects evolve on thier own as we use the theme of this thread as the springboard.

So if people don't like what this thread has become, they don't have to come and read...and they certainly don't need to post in here, for why would they unless to bring negativity or start problems or try to change the thread or derail it?

I haven't talk to MP about this, but I would guess she would feel the same way, that if AllForMJ PM'd us and said, "ya know, girls, the thread has too far removed itself now from what I had initially wanted it to be as the thread starter, and no offense, but I am going to ask the Mods to close it."

I would respect that and understand. She could even possibly say, "Hey, if you gals after it's closed want to go start your own thread, you could do that."

And that is reasonable...if someone doesn't like the way this thread is and thinks it should be about something else....then they most certainly can go start up another thread...and very possibly it would be a hit and become much more popular than this thread is now. That's more fair than coming in here and posting something off topic. The Mods in fact, often in threads here on MJJC, when some have taken a thread off track, suggest for those members to go start another thread.

Anyway, Ash, Ape, MP, FT (who has just provided us with the type of post that is very on topic...AllForMJ would be pleased, I think...he honored her by staying with the theme)...can we enjoy this thread now for what it is, and just hang a litttle and talk a little and if someone wants to join in with the topic on hand, lovely. :)

And now a

BLAST FROM THE PAST

(just to give MP nightmares)

http://www.dslextreme.com/users/shioi/artwork/ChocolateChocolateChocolateCompanyC.jpg

See any FACES looking at you in there MP??? :lol:

[MysteriousPhoenix]

All we are saaayiiing is give peas a chance ...

*No! I will NOT post my fave Barry Manilow tune, "Copacabana" just because Lisha has tempted me by posting that Barry tune after I had just been thinking of "Mandy" several days ago! I will practice constraint and have discipline. Awww heck! Here I go ... I'm posting it anyway! I know. You wanna know how it "ties into" this thread. Well, it just so happens that I have it on good authority that the LITD's name was Lola, she was a showgirl. MJ was Tony. Or perhaps he was Rico. He woulda fit in either role. So there ya have it! The moral is: "At the Copa, don't fall in love." (This thread isn't too safe of a place to fall in love, either. Just sayin' ...)*






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Oh boy! I am on a roll! I really love this Barry M. song. Man! I wish MJ had sung this one! (As far as how it fits into this thread ... well ... that should go without saying ... ):heart:



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BTW, Ash, how you know you were the only "pinned" girl. There could have been many and I mean MANY Shirley Temple pin girls out there. Oh ... wait a minute ... there WAS only one! Ah, well, nevermind ...

Edit: * I would like some chocolate popcorn. I don't even see "faces" anymore. I am just hungry! Now gimme some popcorn!!!*

[Lisha]

Edit: * I would like some chocolate popcorn. I don't even see "faces" anymore. I am just hungry! Now gimme some popcorn!!!*
:lol: Look how far you've come...no longer seeing faces in Linda's popcorn. I remember she laughed so hard when you said that. :) Linda has a fun and joking personality, and she brightened up the thread when she came (plus, she contributed sober and indepth posts as well...she's observed a lot in her life, you can tell, and her knowledge came out in her posts).


All we are saaayiiing is give peas a chance ...

Yeah! That's all we're sayin! lol.


*No! I will NOT post my fave Barry Manilow tune, "Copacabana" just because Lisha has tempted me by posting that Barry tune after I had just been thinking of "Mandy" several days ago! I will practice constraint and have discipline. Awww heck! Here I go ... I'm posting it anyway!
No, ya didn't....you didn't just weaken and post Copacapana....*sigh* :no: I give up. lol.


I know. You wanna know how it "ties into" this thread. Well, it just so happens that I have it on good authority that the LITD's name was Lola, she was a showgirl. MJ was Tony. Or perhaps he was Rico.

I'm so confused. In the next song it's Melissa...so is it Lola or Melissa? You're making it MORE confusing .... haha.



He woulda fit in either role. So there ya have it! The moral is: "At the Copa, don't fall in love." (This thread isn't too safe of a place to fall in love, either. Just sayin' ...)*

Music and passion were always the fashion
At the LITD thread....don't fall in love

Maybe it isn't all that safe in here :ph34r:; can't say we weren't warned. ;) Haha.


Oh boy! I am on a roll! I really love this Barry M. song. Man! I wish MJ had sung this one! (As far as how it fits into this thread ... well ... that should go without saying ... ):heart:



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I had forgotten how pretty (and extremely romantic) this song is, PLUS, what a long intro it has...it rivals Billie Jean, but this intro doesn't get me dancin'! But the music throughout this song is beautiful. Thanks for posting it!

Just thinkin' here...

How realistic is it to want Magic or to feel something magical with the one you love? Should we roll our eyes at the naivity of some thinking they can have it? Hmm. Would Michael, the way he always loved magic and for things to be magical, and to "catch" the magic, would he have even asked God for not only a love so divine (as the song FT just posted reminds us) but for it to feel magical as well? Would he have been silly, or have a lot of nerve, to ask God for that?

I remember before I had a relationship with God or understood Him at all, my sister, when she was 15 and I was 13, saying outloud while looking at that weeks TV guide, "Thank you, God!!!" I was like, "what?" Well, she had a major crush on an actor who wasn't all that big but from time to time he would appear on a TV show, and she explained that she had just asked God to pleeeeeeeeease let him be in something on TV that week so she could see him, and lo and behold...he was. I was all o.O

And instead of thinking, yeah, God blessed her, I said what the heck kind of thing to pray to God for is that?! He's the God of the universe...he's got improtant things to do, are you kidding...it was just a coincidence anyway!!!

I was being a good example of a killjoy, wasn't I? You know, after I came to know God and have a relationship myself with Him, He brought this back to my memory and explained, you could say, a few things: She had a childlike faith, and that was pleasing to God. She knew that what was important to her, because her Heavenly Father loved her, He would care about it, too. That was hard ot me to get a handle on. I still wanted to criticize her for the she had asked for.

Also, after I became a new believer in God someone invited me to a small prayer meeting at his church. Maybe 15 people were there and at some point they asked, "Does anyone here want prayer about anything that is going on in their life?"

One young gal about 18 self-consciouly rose her hand, and the guy I was with whispered to me that she was new there. She then said she had been to the beach that week and was hoping to really help her tan but she noticed that very day that she was starting to blister and she was worried she was going to peel and lose her tan. She wanted prayer that God would keep her from peeling. I felt the whole attitude of the room change and I sensed, along with me, that all were thinking, "what a shallow thing for this girl to be asking God...how vain!" Well, a rather mature woman of God prayed for her and how she worded things was very diplomatic, but she got somethings in there to remind the girl there are more important things than worrying about tans."

Well, God one day brought this back to my memory and impressed upon me His view on that young believer's prayer request. And that is, because she loved Him and He loved her, and this is what was mattering to her at the time, then it mattered to Him. You see, He meets us always where we are at. I don't know if she ended up peeling or not, but I have confidence that God helped her along in her faith in Him and was pleased with her childlike faith.

So if Michael would have asked God for a love so divine and for it to be "magical" for him and his gal, who are we to say God wouldn't do that for him? I think Michale, MP, would have loved this song and it's talk of magic. :) MJ was one who loved God, what mattered to MJ at any given time would have mattered also to God. I think MJ got that. Nothing's too small to ask God for...and what someone else might say is a silly thing to ask God for, don't listen to them, but listen to your own heart, and if it matters to you, it matters to God, as well.

I don't know why this Barry Manilow song got me thinking about all of this. But I very much enjoyed listening to the song again.


Hey, MP! Are you going to give your two cents worth on any of the lyrics from the song, "Someone Put Your Hand Out"? Or Ape? :)

Ash, time for kermy or more popcorn or a lovely MJ photo? :D



BTW, Ash, how you know you were the only "pinned" girl. There could have been many and I mean MANY Shirley Temple pin girls out there. Oh ... wait a minute ... there WAS only one! Ah, well, nevermind ...

:lol:


EDIT: Oh, I forgot, FT, that I thought it was such a fun coincidence that last night you posted Someone Put You Hand Out, because I was just thinking about that song, for yesterday, on the way home from picking up my son from school, on the radio I heard a Rod Stewart song. It was very pretty and I heard the lyric, "There's a love that's divine, and it's yours and mine." And that made me think of MJ's line, "a love so divine."

This is a very romantic song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQ4NAZPi2js

AQ4NAZPi2js

Have I told you lately that I love you
Have I told you there's no one else above you
Fill my heart with gladness
take away all my sadness
ease my troubles that's what you do

For the morning sun in all it's glory
greets the day with hope and comfort too
You fill my life with laughter
and somehow you make it better
ease my troubles that's what you do
There's a love that's divine
and it's yours and it's mine like the sun
And at the end of the day
we should give thanks and pray
to the one, to the one

Have I told you lately that I love you
Have I told you there's no one else above you
Fill my heart with gladness
take away all my sadness
ease my troubles that's what you do

There's a love that's divine
and it's yours and it's mine like the sun
And at the end of the day
we should give thanks and pray
to the one, to the one

And have I told you lately that I love you
Have I told you there's no one else above you
You fill my heart with gladness
take away my sadness
ease my troubles that's what you do
Take away all my sadness
fill my life with gladness
ease my troubles that's what you do
Take away all my sadness
fill my life with gladness
ease my troubles that's what you do

[Ashtanga]

Oh God......... :doh: :sigh: Now let's leave the world of fantasy and look at reality.... *big sigh*



Hey claudiadoina.... http://i55.tinypic.com/angfw5.gif This whole thing is getting sooooooooooooooooooooo boring. Let's move on... ;) :pray:


Well........ :fear:





Too bad visiting in here has to be online. It'd be nice to all (everyone here) be sharing popcorn together somewhere. Brazil looks nice. Ash, can we visit at your place?

OK I'll say this... I agree with both sides here. I wish those who knew him for real could share, but I wish there were a way to know for sure that they are real. So... once again, let's all go meet at Ashes place in Brazil to visit and share thoughts and stories and popcorn. :)

Great idea!!! :woohoo: I would love to receive everyone in my house for a session and of course popcorn, a MJ session. It would be great. :heart:










BLAST FROM THE PAST

(just to give MP nightmares)

http://www.dslextreme.com/users/shioi/artwork/ChocolateChocolateChocolateCompanyC.jpg

See any FACES looking at you in there MP??? :lol:

:hungry:




I remember it was Linda who posted this picture here in the past. Do you remember? I hope she's OK. :angel:













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:girl_sigh:


Copacabana.... Rio de Janeiro.... :wild:








BTW, Ash, how you know you were the only "pinned" girl. There could have been many and I mean MANY Shirley Temple pin girls out there. Oh ... wait a minute ... there WAS only one! Ah, well, nevermind ...


:nono: :P


I think I was the only one. :D But one thing is certain, no girl was pinned by Michael as I was. :girl_sigh: :heart:









Ash, time for kermy or more popcorn or a lovely MJ photo? :D



The three things together!! :wild: http://www.hornedhalo.org/images/kermit.gif And a beautiful picture of Michael:


http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/394481_308157602555255_107873779250306_792987_1396 131948_n.jpg :wub: :cry: *big sigh*

[Lisha]

Thanks, Ash, for that MJ pic with his happy smile!

Saint Patrick's Day is almost over, but since I'm part Irish, I'll post something that was sent to me in an email...in fact, it is from one of the girls I was telling you guys about who I meet with every other week.

Here's the link and it is called "An Irish Blessing":

http://www.e-water.net/viewflash.php?flash=irishblessing_en

(it might take a little bit to load...)

The scenery is beautiful, and it can help us understand why MJ fell in love with the beautifully green landscapes. This video is so peaceful. Maybe MJ and his children felt peaceful in Ireland as well.

I've been to Ireland once breifly, but I did not see such beauty where I went. I stayed at a beach resort town called Bray, so it was a different vibe. Lots of sand and beach umbrellas. haha. But this video definitey makes me want to go back!

[Favoritetune]

Dang MP did you just eat up all the popcorn? and Lisha I don't care who is singing about peas I don't want any.

Claudiadoina what does this mean? "I do not have time for this not that it would worth wasting it ...

What bothers me the most and saddens me is that some of you keep saying he was alone and nobody took care of him in his last days.
That is not true.He was not alone, he was immensely loved and taking care of and he was beyond happy on a personal level.So stop saying that.It is disrespectful towards Michael if anything.


PS :And yes I was being sarcastic." Do you mean old gangster style when they say "take care of him" or do you mean brothel style "take care of him" or do you mean pick pocket style "take care of him" or the waitress who caters waiting for a tip style "take care"? or what???

In MJs last days he wasnt alone there were lots of people around "taking care of him." excuse my rude. Can't help but ask this but do you think that you were MJ's litd? Wait, don't answer let's get back to the music and you can see if you fit.

One thing I will say and what this thread proves is yes the man was immensely loved by people all over the world maybe he even had a litd.

Lisha, I was thinking about those words you quoted from someones wording for the song and I thought it was probably very hard for him to tell anyone anything personal for fear it would get sold to the tabloids. and I was thinking that maybe he couldn't keep his love inside so he had to sing about it.

I'm in shock you gals remembered me. Cheesin it up :D now where's my popcorn please???

[Favoritetune]

I'm gonna put out an APB on all the people missing in this thread, let me see who's missing AllforMJ, Steal, Stateofshock, Linda, what was that gals name who kept saying she didn't believe MJ had a litd? i forget, mimick, sumner - who I forget? Where is everyone? I bet you chased em away with all those nasty peas.

Wouldn't it be super if MJ were alive and did have a litd and they invited everyone here to their wedding, Ladies what if MJ did peek in this thread and was happy you all could relate to how he was thinking or if there was a litd girl and you shined lights in her darkness - im poetic :D

[Lainy]

You know, Claudiadoina, I have been aware of this situation for some time now, and I was expecting someone to post in here eventually about this individual who has managed to convince quite a few fans that they were MJ's love interest at the time of his death.

The reason why I said ego...(or maybe it's just simply some kind of need, like a need for closure or many other things that is going on in the fans who have believed this person) is simply to point out the vulnerability of some fans to believe someone like this online.

No, I do not think it is a justification for this person to claim "to need someone to talk to online," instead I see it like a "hook." Many fans would fall into it...and feel compassion and want to be there for a grieving love of MJ's who lost someone so special, that was also so special to these fans. They want to be there for her online. But it is playing with fan's emotions.

For a mature woman in at least, let's say, her late thirties, or possibly much older,or even around MJ's own age, who knew MJ well and his need for privacy, she would not go the online root for finding confidants. It is not wisdom, it is somewhat illusonary and cannot be counted on, and should not replace trusted, in person, relationships offline. If she does not have at least one trusted offline relationship, then that is suspect. Even MJ, with all his need to be careful and private had those personal relationships where he could trust with certain private things. Why wouldn't she? And even if she didn't, wisdom would tell her not to go online.

The reason I say "weak" is from my own walking out in this area...when I have fallen prey to share things I shouldn't have with someone, I realize it was because I was being weak. When I am strong, I do not have the need to share what I shouldn't be sharing with the person I shouldn't be sharing it with. I can say "no" to myself, and stop myself. I am able to think through the consequences, and I keep what I need to keep private, private. If I slip up, yes, it is because of a weakened moment and I have to ask myself, what made me weaken?

I am bringing these things up so those who are believing that this individual is who she really says she is, to stop and consider how she is going about things, and if one, who was truly involved with MJ, and knew about keeping things private, would handle things in this way.

Obviously, I believe this person is either a poser playing with fans for attention and the game of it, or it is someone who maybe did have some kind of relationship with MJ at one time but has made more of it then was really there and is now going about things in the wrong way...which is kinda sad. :(

But I think it is someone playing with your heartstrings (because you so very much wanted MJ to have love in his life) and this person is having a ball with it. And that is beyond sad...it is ugly.

Claudiadoina, I want you to see the possibility that this person might be playing with you and is not being for real.

But back to this, why anyone would come in here and post in such a way to let all who read in here know that they know for sure MJ had love, implying thye have spoken with the woman...I just question the why they would think they should do that. Why would you do that, Cluadiadoina, if it is not partially at least to let people know you know her and who she is, and obviously this is special for you to know MJ's secret love in his life. It means something to you. Yes? No? So why is it, then, that you posted what you did? I don't mean to offend; I just want you to look deeper into this. :hug:

And yes, I am judging this person's (behavior) because I am discerning something not right about what they have been doing. I don't want you gals played with because you loved Michael so much and it means so much to you for him to have had love...and so it means everything for you that you have found her and are there for her.

Is that at least, true?

I think maybe these fans want so much to feel "near" to Michael, because they miss him so much now he's gone, and thinking that they are near to "her, the one he loved" would make them somehow feel near to Michael. But this person probably knows this, and is using it to their advantage. :(



I'd like to highlight this post because I haven't had time to read the following posts. I apologize in advance because this post will not be enjoyable to read. Lisha Thanks for this post. I was waiting for the right moment to talk about some things that were bothering me a lot and you helped me.

People lie all the time and those people who think they know everything and say they are aware at all, are the ones more lying. They are able to commit the most fanciful follies and then come out as "smarts", "someone you CAN always rely on or trust". These people are able to see Michael Jackson in EVERYTHING that does not seem to be fully revealed.
Are people who believe they can and WILL marry Michael Jackson and they do anything to achieve it. I told ANYTHING to achieve.
We must beware of such people. We should not believe everything they say just because they seem fun or cool and kind.
You all probably do not know who I'm talking about and I'm not here to judge anyone neither reveal who is really behind the masks. This really is not my intention. I just want to show my indignation. I've been victim of a lying and sick person. She began spreading rumors created by her own sick and malicious imagination.

" There are many wolves in sheep's clothing " and there are many birds with poor vision who think they are as eagles.
I did not like it. I do not like how this person behaves here, but there is a brazilian popular saying that if you're uncomfortable with something/someone it is you who must move out... And I think it's my moment to out.

[Favoritetune]

Lainy I saw you online when I was writing my post. One of the vicious things about the internet is also one of the things that makes it safe for people and that is its obscurity. No one knows who they are talking to really and people do good things and bad with that. If people had to have their picture posted to leave a message somewhere i dont think i'd write many messages. I'm one of the ones who tries to be as real as me in obscurity as i can be. Some people take that to be fake and will be one way then turn around and be another. those are the ones you have to watch out for but how can you? sometimes i wish people who hide behind screen names would put their names to it but they don't and i hate that but guess what it's what i do but i'm still me. whoever hurt you or upset by whatever they did or didn't do i'm just saying you can't let that hinder you in what you do and where you go.

Edit here

Is it too much to ask what that person did to you? i long determined not to let other peoples hate hinder me and seems to me that's what you are doing. if someone hates you enough to spread lies and slander your name walking away doesn't help. the lie is still there. you have to stand for what's right and true even if youre standing alone. it aint right for people to lie about other people for any reason. its wrong and you should confront the person and if they don't do right give it to God and let deal with them. He can put anyone in check.

[Lisha]

I'd like to highlight this post because I haven't had time to read the following posts. I apologize in advance because this post will not be enjoyable to read. Lisha Thanks for this post. I was waiting for the right moment to talk about some things that were bothering me a lot and you helped me.

People lie all the time and those people who think they know everything and say they are aware at all, are the ones more lying. They are able to commit the most fanciful follies and then come out as "smarts", "someone you CAN always rely on or trust". These people are able to see Michael Jackson in EVERYTHING that does not seem to be fully revealed.
Are people who believe they can and WILL marry Michael Jackson and they do anything to achieve it. I told ANYTHING to achieve.
We must beware of such people. We should not believe everything they say just because they seem fun or cool and kind.
You all probably do not know who I'm talking about and I'm not here to judge anyone neither reveal who is really behind the masks. This really is not my intention. I just want to show my indignation. I've been victim of a lying and sick person. She began spreading rumors created by her own sick and malicious imagination.

" There are many wolves in sheep's clothing " and there are many birds with poor vision who think they are as eagles.
I did not like it. I do not like how this person behaves here, but there is a brazilian popular saying that if you're uncomfortable with something/someone it is you who must move out... And I think it's my moment to out.
Oh, Lainy...I would give anything for this person to have gone after me instead of you. You are such a lovely hearted person, and do not deserve this. I'm used to this sort of thing. Favoritetune is very right about this:


i long determined not to let other peoples hate hinder me and seems to me that's what you are doing. if someone hates you enough to spread lies and slander your name walking away doesn't help. the lie is still there. you have to stand for what's right and true even if youre standing alone. it aint right for people to lie about other people for any reason. its wrong and you should confront the person and if they don't do right give it to God and let deal with them. He can put anyone in check.

Someone better think twice than to mess with one of God's own, and I know you belong to Him!!! And we also are here for you. I hope you don't go. I love your posts in here. :hug: I can't believe how much ugliness goes on behind the scenes in secret. Members need to speak up...find someone to tell. Things like this need to be brought into the light. Thank you, Lainy, for your post. You did good. :yes:





Dang MP did you just eat up all the popcorn? and Lisha I don't care who is singing about peas I don't want any. Ingrate! *sticks out tongue*


Claudiadoina what does this mean? ...." Do you mean old gangster style when they say "take care of him" or do you mean brothel style "take care of him" or do you mean pick pocket style "take care of him" or the waitress who caters waiting for a tip style "take care"? or what???
:lol: Man, one great line after another.


One thing I will say and what this thread proves is yes the man was immensely loved by people all over the world maybe he even had a litd.
It seems to me that Michael had more love while he was alive coming at him than anyone who ever walked the earth...I mean an incredible amount coming his way. Super blessed. And in a post or two back of yours I think you said, FT, that he "needed love", But man...he was so beloved! It's hard to imagine he needed love.


Lisha, I was thinking about those words you quoted from someones wording for the song and I thought it was probably very hard for him to tell anyone anything personal for fear it would get sold to the tabloids. and I was thinking that maybe he couldn't keep his love inside so he had to sing about it.
That makes sense. So more support to AllForMJ's theory...he really was expressing his love for someone in his lyrics because it was his only safe avenue.


I'm gonna put out an APB on all the people missing in this thread, let me see who's missing AllforMJ, Steal, Stateofshock, Linda, what was that gals name who kept saying she didn't believe MJ had a litd? i forget, mimick, sumner - who I forget?
Who's Steal?


Wouldn't it be super if MJ were alive and did have a litd and they invited everyone here to their wedding, Ladies what if MJ did peek in this thread and was happy you all could relate to how he was thinking or if there was a litd girl and you shined lights in her darkness - im poetic :Dum...um...o.O...are you after leaving us all Speechless? I...don't ...quite...know...what..to...say...:lol:

[Favoritetune]

Steal is a really cool lady that was around here but she changed her name.

call me an ingrate if you want i still aint eating none of your peas but i'll take some popcorn.

APB Sdeidjs, MjzPrincess1982, Lily, Iceburg, xThunderx2 who else? Party at Ashs house and she better have a lot of popcorn

I loved AllforMJ's posts. all of you ladies have posted good stuff

i think MJ was expressing love in his lyrics

you? speechless? if i make you speechless somebody better pay me :D i should be able to get a patent or something :D

good night ladies

[Favoritetune]

Dude or lady this is the internet anyone can say, or claim anything they want then get their best friend to go behind them and defend them or even create a different account and defend their self as if they are someone else. There is no way to know what someone said unless you were there when they said it and paying attention. Just cause you see someone a couple of times don't mean you know what they are like. dont get me wrong i'm not judging you or saying you are right or wrong but trust me some women are straight up schemers and will play the bleeding heart just to get you on their side while they are stirring up manure with other people intentionally. I dont know whats going on here or who is posting what where or why but dang i find it quite incredible for someone to come taunt people in here saying they know this and that and then turn away. what's the point? if mj kept them in the dark and was seeing them maybe he had them on the down low cause his heart was else where. do you know how many men creep? is some chick trying to blow his cover? is some chick exagerating maybe a friendship she had with him? who knows but him and her and if he aint around to say shutup she should respect him enough to don't you think? oh wait you said she shared with her best friend whose account was conveniently hacked. okay, maybe that happened, stranger things have happened.

so does this chick want to come in here and say she is the love in the dark mj has been singing about all these years? if so maybe she should match her relationship up to his songs. can we get back on topic as to what mj was saying and not what people want us to believe about this person or that person? His songs speak for themselves. i miss having allformj here cause she really would break down what he was saying and what was going on when a song was written and all that. where you at lady?!?

i think a lot of women loved that man, and he's the man so for one person to come up in here saying it's me, it's me, or it's my friend is presumptious and foolish cause at some point guess what it may not be.

is it wrong for the ladies here to get upset with someone jumping in throwing their hints here and there that they know more than what the songs say i don't see how it could be. there are a handful of women who could come make claims that they were in mjs life and his litd but if his songs are saying anything it's saying his mind was on a divine love and something special something from God not just conveniences so those handful couldn't all be right though many or most could claim quite a bit.

how bout everybody take a chill pill and let's get back to the mans music cause all this stuff about she said, she said is just a waste of everybodys time, i'm with mike, if it don't come from my mouth don't believe.

somebody help me out here. let's start with the songs mj wrote himself in order and let's see where that gets us cool? cool

dang i'm still waiting for popcorn


2

2000 Watts (Michael Jackson song)

A

Another Part of Me

B

Bad (Michael Jackson song)
Beat It
Behind the Mask (song)
Billie Jean
Black or White
Blood on the Dance Floor (song)
Breaking News (song)

C

Can You Feel It
Centipede (song)
Cheater (song)

D

D.S. (song)
Dangerous (Michael Jackson song)
Dirty Diana
Do the Bartman
Don't Stop 'til You Get Enough
Don't Stop the Music (Rihanna song)
Don't Walk Away (Michael Jackson song)

E

Earth Song
Eat It
Eaten Alive (song)

F

Fat (song)

G

Get It (song)
The Girl Is Mine
Give In to Me

H

Heal the World


H cont.

Heaven Can Wait (Michael Jackson song)
HIStory/Ghosts
Hollywood Tonight

I

I Just Can't Stop Loving You
(I Like) The Way You Love Me
Immortal Megamix
In the Closet
Is It Scary

J

Jam (song)
Joy (Blackstreet song)

K

Keep On, Keepin' On

L

Leave Me Alone
Letter 2 My Unborn
Liberian Girl
Lovely One

M

The Man (song)
Mind Is the Magic: Anthem for the Las Vegas Show
Monster (Michael Jackson song)
Morphine (song)
Muscles (song)

N

Night Time Lover

P

P.Y.T. (Pretty Young Thing)
A Place with No Name
Planet Earth (Michael Jackson poem)
Privacy (Michael Jackson song)

R

Remember the Time

S

Say Say Say


S cont.

Scream/Childhood
Shake Your Body (Down to the Ground)
Smooth Criminal
Speechless (Michael Jackson song)
Speed Demon (song)
State of Shock (song)
Stranger in Moscow

T

Tabloid Junkie
They Don't Care About Us
This Is It (Michael Jackson song)
This Place Hotel
This Time Around (Michael Jackson song)

U

Unbreakable (Michael Jackson song)

W

Walk Right Now
Wanna Be Startin' Somethin'
The Way You Make Me Feel
We Are Here to Change the World
We Are the World
We Are the World 25 for Haiti
We Are the World 25 for Haiti (YouTube edition)
What More Can I Give
Whatever Happens
Who Is It (Michael Jackson song)
Will You Be There
Workin' Day and Night

Y

You Rock My World

okay, i found that but don't have the dates yet, maybe we should take it by album. should we start from most recent and work backwards or from early days to recent or something different altogether?

Disclaimer MJ didn't write all of those but that is what wikipedia had listed in the google search

[Ape]

It is interesting to hear a mans point of view in all this (I assume you are a man FT..sorry if that is not so). I think the bottom line for this lady, if she is indeed his love, is that she doesn't need us to believe it. She would know it herself and hopefully would have support from outside of the net. For the rest of us, it would be nice to know (I think, but only if there were a way to know for sure) but it really isn't necessary. For all I can tell, it wouldn't make things better for us or her if we knew ... but I could be wrong. From the first day I was online there were people pretending to be something or someone other than what they are, but there have also been ones who are exactly who they are online as they are in person. Online, I always take things with a grain of salt knowing that it's possibly not at all how I think it is (or who). It's unfortunate that it has to be that way but it is the nature of the net.


I wish everyone well though.


EDIT: FT, looks like a lot of work right now..lol. I'll just read everyone else's responses.

[Ashtanga]

Bla bla bla........... http://www.humorbabaca.com/upload/emoticons/emoticons_487_0484.gif


Oh God.... :wtf: :doh: People really can not be so naive on certain issues.... :nono: Never!!!!






Thanks, Ash, for that MJ pic with his happy smile!


;)






Dang MP did you just eat up all the popcorn?

Cheesin it up :D now where's my popcorn please???

Yes, MP escaped and ate all the popcorn alone. -_- :o :doh: Why do you think that the MP has not yet appeared? She is too busy eating all the popcorn. :hungry: Sorry, but you came too late to eat the popcorn! :P








Party at Ashs house and she better have a lot of popcorn


:dancing:


Lots of popcorn and lots of music (MJ)! :woohoo:







Claudiadoina what does this mean? "I do not have time for this not that it would worth wasting it

She meant that she will no longer waste time here trying to put it in our heads about the girl. :p And you can not imagine who is that girl.... :o -_- :smilerolleyes: :doh: :fear:







People lie all the time and those people who think they know everything and say they are aware at all, are the ones more lying.

Hey Lainy > :better: :hug:




And the worst thing is to think that the person have never heard anything from Michael's own mouth on the issue. You know, see and hear a lot of mouth from other people does not mean you know the truth (Never!) when in reality you have NEVER heard anything from the mouth of the person (in this case MJ). So... >>>> WTF???? :blink: :sigh: :crazy: But OK..... :fear:







Online, I always take things with a grain of salt knowing that it's possibly not at all how I think it is (or who).

Hey Ape > :ciao: :give_heart:


Fact! -_- :fear:





P.S. WAIT!!!! :blink: >>>>>>> I think Moodyblue97 is talking much about something so private.... :blink: :wtf: I think the entire community of fans should already be knowing about it. :lol: :wtf: :smilerolleyes: If it is PRIVATE (should not be shared with others).... >>>> :censored: Gag in mouth! Or not??? :fear: :smilerolleyes: :sigh:






NOW, seriously, let's leave that issue aside http://www.humorbabaca.com/upload/emoticons/emoticons_487_0484.gif and move on. -_- ;)

[Lisha]

Moodyblue97, I am not exaggerating when I say that I have been expecting you here any day now. And here you are. And I think you know darn well I figured you'd end up in here.

.
I moved on, don't worry, I have not even been here. :)
And yet, you're back.

Are you two for real? Unbelievable.





. Just continue in here and stop talking about this woman.

We would love to! And I think we have made that apparent. Now will you please let us do that?

One of you please go make yourselves your own thread. I'm not very good at making up titles, but it can be something like:

"Was There a Woman in Michael's Life at the Time of His Death?"

Now that alone should get some posts.

Then claudiadoina can go in there...that thread, and post the same posts she posted in here and they would not be off topic. Then when she's got everyone interested in who she is talking about, you Moodyblue97 can come into the thread and post exactly what you posted in here and you'd being doiing it in the right thread...not off-topic at all. And then, if Facebook lady likes, she can come in there and post what she had originally wanted to post in this thread awhile back. And again, it would be on topic.

This new thread would take off like crazy...heck, I would go check it out! And the LITD thread would fade in comparison, and hide in the new thread's shadow...but the good side of this...this thread then can stop being volatile and your thread can become the one talking about the hot subject of MJ and the last woman he was with, and the identifying of her.

If you two do not do this, but come back and post in here about this woman again, you will be making yourselves look very, very bad.

Go make your own thread. And have fun. It will be popular, guaranteed!




you? speechless? if i make you speechless somebody better pay me :D i should be able to get a patent or something :D


ha.............................ha................. .............ha.

(but you have a point)

And it -is- nice to have a male's perspective on all of this, Ape is right. :yes: Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

So is Steal gonna come post in here? (but I guess under a dif name)?


I'll have to come back to post more thoughts on Someone Put Your Hand Out later, I've been gone all day, and a tired. Wow, what a long list of songs to consider! "DS"...now there's a romantic song. le's start looking at the lyrics in that one first!!!! :tease:

I'm still very sad and concerned about Lainy. :(

Ape, you're a sweety. I liked your post.

EDIT: Ash, I just read you're post now after finishing mine. *waves* And keep the popcorn comin'. It's in major demand!!!!

[Ashtanga]

I have been expecting you here any day now. And here you are.

I knew it would happen very soon.... :lol: :fear:







EDIT: Ash, I just read you're post now after finishing mine. *waves* And keep the popcorn comin'. It's in major demand!!!!

Thanks! :fear: I'll use this gif > :popcorn: Because the other gif of Michael eating popcorn... I do not think he'd be smiling and happy looking for the latest discussions (if he were here :cry:).... :nono: SURE!!!!!!!!!!!

[Ape]

That's actually a fantastic idea. Way back at the start of this thread it had been said that this is not the place to find out who the LITD girl is or speculate on who it could be. At one time I thought that if there was a lady it would be nice to have her come introduce herself..etc etc.. but it really isn't the place despite the topic. Sometimes an answer is not needed for those not directly affected by it. However another thread on that topic would be great I think. Then more than just us usual posters in here can also discuss and could be met with a different mood I guess.

I don't really know.. but it does sound like a good solution to me. (Thank you Lisha for calling me sweet :) )

[Ashtanga]

However another thread on that topic would be great I think.

:fear:

[Lainy]

Lainy I saw you online when I was writing my post. One of the vicious things about the internet is also one of the things that makes it safe for people and that is its obscurity. No one knows who they are talking to really and people do good things and bad with that. If people had to have their picture posted to leave a message somewhere i dont think i'd write many messages. I'm one of the ones who tries to be as real as me in obscurity as i can be. Some people take that to be fake and will be one way then turn around and be another. those are the ones you have to watch out for but how can you? sometimes i wish people who hide behind screen names would put their names to it but they don't and i hate that but guess what it's what i do but i'm still me. whoever hurt you or upset by whatever they did or didn't do i'm just saying you can't let that hinder you in what you do and where you go.

Edit here

Is it too much to ask what that person did to you? i long determined not to let other peoples hate hinder me and seems to me that's what you are doing. if someone hates you enough to spread lies and slander your name walking away doesn't help. the lie is still there. you have to stand for what's right and true even if youre standing alone. it aint right for people to lie about other people for any reason. its wrong and you should confront the person and if they don't do right give it to God and let deal with them. He can put anyone in check.


Everything you said here is soo true! Thanks so much. I overcame this situation, I just needed to vent. Now I feel much better.


Oh, Lainy...I would give anything for this person to have gone after me instead of you. You are such a lovely hearted person, and do not deserve this. I'm used to this sort of thing. Favoritetune is very right about this:



Someone better think twice than to mess with one of God's own, and I know you belong to Him!!! And we also are here for you. I hope you don't go. I love your posts in here. :hug: I can't believe how much ugliness goes on behind the scenes in secret. Members need to speak up...find someone to tell. Things like this need to be brought into the light. Thank you, Lainy, for your post. You did good. :yes:

I'm still very sad and concerned about Lainy. :( :

Aw Lisha :cry: :hug: though I think I'm not so sweet at all. LOL Since I came here in mjjc you've always been very kind to me. Thanks so much. You don't worry about me, I'm fine, look at me :beach: lol

Thanks again.

[Favoritetune]

Okay ladies here's what i got

Don't Stop 'Til You Get Enough
Working Day and Night
Wanna Be Startin' Somethin
The Girl Is Mine
Billie Jean
P.Y.T (Pretty Young Thing)

Mind you I believe they are in order of oldest to newest but don't hold me to that

now one of the 1st songs mj busted out with was don't stop till you get enough :) who wants to comment on that? made my own popcorn but there was no chocolate on it MP thanks a lot

That Steal lady is pretty sneaky so I;m sure she'll come back when she feels like it, will bite my neck off then be all chill and cool as usual i'm guessing

I saw alma on the screen earlier, i remember your name to ladies why are you all so silent

[qbee]

Mod Note
We ask that members do not Post Private Information about this woman claiming to be MJs love Interest on this board. There is no way to prove such things. So we will not allow it here. This is private information and not your place to be posting about her even knowing MJ. If thats even True. You state she doesnt want to make it public yet you continue to do so. Very odd. Stop posting about her please. It obvious no one in this thread is interested in hearing it. Plus Its an invasion of Michael's privacy either way. So please Dont bring here. Thank You

Please do not reply to this warning it will only further the discussion.



This is a beautiful thread so Lets all get back on topic Please :)

[MysteriousPhoenix]

http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif







I'm so confused. In the next song it's Melissa...so is it Lola or Melissa? You're making it MORE confusing .... haha.

Lola was just her "stage" name. Actually, according to Wikipedia, Meslissa is "a nod to singer Melissa Manchester." What's funny about this song is it reminds me of early mornings getting ready for kindergarten. My mother had a daily ritual of playing the radio in the morning as we prepared for our day, she would listen to pop music and this song was BIG that year. I remember not liking it back then at all. In fact it made me feel a little depressed because of the moody melody, and of course, I couldn't relate to the lyics at all as a kindergartener.

But you know ...

The song kind of reminds me of another song I have always found very romantic. It is more of a latin tune rather than classical, but they both seem to have the same vibe to me.


<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uhYASdXrsMs" frameBorder="0" width="420" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>







Just thinkin' here...

How realistic is it to want Magic or to feel something magical with the one you love? Should we roll our eyes at the naivity of some thinking they can have it? Hmm. Would Michael, the way he always loved magic and for things to be magical, and to "catch" the magic, would he have even asked God for not only a love so divine (as the song FT just posted reminds us) but for it to feel magical as well? Would he have been silly, or have a lot of nerve, to ask God for that?

I remember before I had a relationship with God or understood Him at all, my sister, when she was 15 and I was 13, saying outloud while looking at that weeks TV guide, "Thank you, God!!!" I was like, "what?" Well, she had a major crush on an actor who wasn't all that big but from time to time he would appear on a TV show, and she explained that she had just asked God to pleeeeeeeeease let him be in something on TV that week so she could see him, and lo and behold...he was. I was all o.O

And instead of thinking, yeah, God blessed her, I said what the heck kind of thing to pray to God for is that?! He's the God of the universe...he's got improtant things to do, are you kidding...it was just a coincidence anyway!!!

I was being a good example of a killjoy, wasn't I? You know, after I came to know God and have a relationship myself with Him, He brought this back to my memory and explained, you could say, a few things: She had a childlike faith, and that was pleasing to God. She knew that what was important to her, because her Heavenly Father loved her, He would care about it, too. That was hard ot me to get a handle on. I still wanted to criticize her for the she had asked for.

Also, after I became a new believer in God someone invited me to a small prayer meeting at his church. Maybe 15 people were there and at some point they asked, "Does anyone here want prayer about anything that is going on in their life?"

One young gal about 18 self-consciouly rose her hand, and the guy I was with whispered to me that she was new there. She then said she had been to the beach that week and was hoping to really help her tan but she noticed that very day that she was starting to blister and she was worried she was going to peel and lose her tan. She wanted prayer that God would keep her from peeling. I felt the whole attitude of the room change and I sensed, along with me, that all were thinking, "what a shallow thing for this girl to be asking God...how vain!" Well, a rather mature woman of God prayed for her and how she worded things was very diplomatic, but she got somethings in there to remind the girl there are more important things than worrying about tans."

Well, God one day brought this back to my memory and impressed upon me His view on that young believer's prayer request. And that is, because she loved Him and He loved her, and this is what was mattering to her at the time, then it mattered to Him. You see, He meets us always where we are at. I don't know if she ended up peeling or not, but I have confidence that God helped her along in her faith in Him and was pleased with her childlike faith.

So if Michael would have asked God for a love so divine and for it to be "magical" for him and his gal, who are we to say God wouldn't do that for him? I think Michale, MP, would have loved this song and it's talk of magic. :) MJ was one who loved God, what mattered to MJ at any given time would have mattered also to God. I think MJ got that. Nothing's too small to ask God for...and what someone else might say is a silly thing to ask God for, don't listen to them, but listen to your own heart, and if it matters to you, it matters to God, as well.

I don't know why this Barry Manilow song got me thinking about all of this. But I very much enjoyed listening to the song again.


Hey, MP! Are you going to give your two cents worth on any of the lyrics from the song, "Someone Put Your Hand Out"? Or Ape? :)

Ash, time for kermy or more popcorn or a lovely MJ photo? :D




:lol:




Coming back later to talk about magic. And SPYHO? I love SPYHO! Will have to give the lyrics some "deep thought."





I'm gonna put out an APB on all the people missing in this thread, let me see who's missing AllforMJ, Steal, Stateofshock, Linda, what was that gals name who kept saying she didn't believe MJ had a litd? i forget, mimick, sumner - who I forget? Where is everyone?

I'm gonna imitate God and "call those things that are not as though they were." I call out to the North, South, East and West and call forth all former members of the LITD thread back "home."





Wouldn't it be super if MJ were alive and did have a litd and they invited everyone here to their wedding ...

Wouldn't that be one humdinger of an ending to this thread (as my grandpa would say).

[Lorraine]

Woah! This thread is moving fast! lots to read :popcorn:

It's nice to see it back to how it once was, sometimes it wouldn't have a new post for a long time :bugeyed

Lisha: ;) lol

Favoritetune: Sure :) :popcorn:

[Lisha]

Woah! This thread is moving fast! lots to read :popcorn:

It's nice to see it back to how it once was, sometimes it wouldn't have a new post for a long time :bugeyed

You're right! It is moving fast. Sooo fast that I am not so sure what the song du jour for us to discuss is at the moment. :unsure: :lol:

So FT, should I still take the time to offer thoughts about the lyrics in Someone Put Your hand Out, or would you like us first to discuss Don't Stop Till You Get Enough? I'm game for either, I just want to make sure I'm on track.




Lola was just her "stage" name.
You are SO funny!!!


Actually, according to Wikipedia, Melissa is "a nod to singer Melissa Manchester."
Ah. Interesting tidbit


What's funny about this song is it reminds me of early mornings getting ready for kindergarten. My mother had a daily ritual of playing the radio in the morning as we prepared for our day, she would listen to pop music and this song was BIG that year. I remember not liking it back then at all. In fact it made me feel a little depressed because of the moody melody, and of course, I couldn't relate to the lyics at all as a kindergartener.

Well, why not? Young Michael had no problem singing Climb Every Mountain like he was the Mother Superior himself...so why couldn't you put yourself into that song "as the magically love-filled Barry Manilow?" :lol:

I was so fortunate, now I think about it, to go see Barry Manilow in concert back in the eighties at the Greek Theater in LA. Just picture how lovely to be sitting in an outdoor theater under the blanket of the night sky with all the stars twinkling above and hearing Barry singing smooth songs like this, one after another. :) I was never a "fan fan" of his, I'm not really wired like that, but I sure enjoyed his music. Yet, I was quite tickled when just a few years ago my close friend disclosed to me that she and her friends when young girls were crazy about him and wild fans! haha. It's hard to picture her being like that when considering how even tempered she is today.


But you know ...

The song kind of reminds me of another song I have always found very romantic. It is more of a latin tune rather than classical, but they both seem to have the same vibe to me.


<IFRAME height=315 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uhYASdXrsMs" frameBorder=0 width=420 allowfullscreen=""></IFRAME>



Wow. What a powerful song. :o I'm going to listen to it again...



Coming back later to talk about magic. And SPYHO? I love SPYHO! Will have to give the lyrics some "deep thought."


:clapping:


I'm gonna imitate God and "call those things that are not as though they were." I call out to the North, South, East and West and call forth all former members of the LITD thread back "home."
You have such a way with words, I tell ya. Now you go do that!!! Herd them all in here! :D

[Ashtanga]

http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif

You stole my gif.... :shifty: :P










This is a beautiful thread so Lets all get back on topic Please :)

Thanks for that!!!!!

[MJzPrincess1982]

So without reading through this thread and reading probably over 1,000 pages, what are we now discussing about this topic? lol I've totally lost track :P

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Woah! This thread is moving fast!


It's crawlin' like a centipede ...



<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/oCOUKr3pLGI" frameBorder="0" width="560" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>


Edit:




Well, why not? Young Michael had no problem singing Climb Every Mountain like he was the Mother Superior himself...so why couldn't you put yourself into that song "as the magically love-filled Barry Manilow?"

I know. What an immature kindergartener, eh? lol!





I was never a "fan fan" of his, I'm not really wired like that, but I sure enjoyed his music.

Not a Fanilow, eh? I'm the same way. I'm not like his other fans, but I enjoy his music.





Wow. What a powerful song. I'm going to listen to it again...

Forgot to add that "mi morena" actually means "my dark-skinned one" or perhaps "my dark-haired one." I think it might relate more to skin, though.




You stole my gif....

No, that's not a gif, that's actual footage. I was there at the taping of that video.http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/images/smilies/tongue.gif




You're right! It is moving fast. Sooo fast that I am not so sure what the song du jour for us to discuss is at the moment.

Coming back with a couple of very interesting songs to discuss.

BTW, Happy Spring, Everyone!

[Ashtanga]

No, that's not a gif, that's actual footage. I was there at the taping of that video.:P


http://www.hornedhalo.org/images/kermit.gif :P :shifty:

[Lisha]

Hey Lainy, here's a hug for ya: :hug:Thanks for letting us know you are okay now.




I'm gonna imitate God and "call those things that are not as though they were." I call out to the North, South, East and West and call forth all former members of the LITD thread back "home."
Well, keep doing what you are doing because AllForMJ was around last night, yay, I saw her...now just call her all the way back into this thread! :wild:




Wouldn't that be one humdinger of an ending to this thread (as my grandpa would say).
Yeah, I'm hoping I'll be asked to serve the punch.


So without reading through this thread and reading probably over 1,000 pages, what are we now discussing about this topic? lol I've totally lost track :P
Hi there MJzPrincess. We are starting to look over the lyrics of some early songs like Don't Stop Until You Get Enough.

Before I personally do that, I would like some help in knowing if these lines are accurate or not...do you guys hear these lines this way in DSTYGE? (the below via lyrics posted online):

1. Is the force the vow?

2. Heartbreak is the feeling now?




It's crawlin' like a centipede ...



<IFRAME height=315 src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/oCOUKr3pLGI" frameBorder=0 width=560 allowfullscreen=""></IFRAME>


Did Michael write this song? WE SHOULD ANALYZE IT!



I know. What an immature kindergartener, eh? lol!
But I bet you were cute!


When you were only startin'
to go to kindergarten
You must have made the cutest bow
Well you must have been a beautiful baby,

but baby....look at you now!


(that was the second song I learned to sing when I was little. the first was Rudolph the Red Nose Reindeer. lol I was on a roll!)




Not a Fanilow, eh? Haha. Were his fans really called that way back when? The fan/artist nickname thing didn't start with "beliebers"? I.had.no.idea. You're so full of interesting information, MP. I'm gonna stick around you. :yes:


Forgot to add that "mi morena" actually means "my dark-skinned one" or perhaps "my dark-haired one." I think it might relate more to skin, though.

I was getting ready to ask you about that. I was wondering if "Morena" was the girl's name in the song. So then we'd have Lola, Melissa and Morena to sort through and I was becoming overwhlemed. lol.



No, that's not a gif, that's actual footage. I was there at the taping of that video.:P
Was somebody holding you in their arms?

'cause weren't you only about two back then? :P


Coming back with a couple of very interesting songs to discuss.
Well that is good news, as always! :D

[Favoritetune]

Lisha take your pick, i was just trying to keep the thread on topic.

AllforMJ?!?!? Did you really see her or are you toying with me? AllforMJ lady where are you? I miss reading your posts. You're incredible!

MP looking forward to your song posts.

MJZsprincess I saw your name before. are you Ms. JZ's Princess? a JZ fan :D

edit here

i'm not sure about the force vow things i'm gonna have to listen a bit and i think i'll write what i think i hear in the song but thatll take me a bit so maybe i'll post it tom.

gnight ladies

[Favoritetune]

AllforMJ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[MysteriousPhoenix]

In keeping with the theme of The Family Jackson, this song came out in 1984. It is technically not a "Michael" song. It actually belongs to his brother, Jermaine. As a matter of fact, it wasn't even written by Michael or anyone in his family for that matter. However, Michael definitely has his parts in this song and in keeping with our belief that the realtionship between MJ and his LITD was being divinely guided and the fact that MJ "don't sing it unless he means it," I think this song would very much fit. In fact, amazingly, I think you will hear all of the concepts in the lyrics that we have touched on in this very thread, especially MJ's parts which I have highlighted in the lyrics.


<iframe height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/lGE970BBLZo" frameBorder="0" width="420" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>


Tell Me I'm Not Dreamin'

Lyrics:

Moonlight took me by surprise
'light coming from your eyes
Are you with me
Am I here with you
Are we in paradise
Tell me I'm not dreamin'

I know I've been here before
You go, then you come back for more
It's a mystery how you disappear
Like a shadow in the night
Tell me I'm not dreamin'

Chorus:
Are you too good to be true
Tell me I'm not dreamin'
Are you too good to be true
Tell me I'm not dreamin'

Midnight images of you
You slipped, slipped into my room
Could be magic, could be fantasy
Could it be that we're in love


Your voice whispers in the dark
You're talk, talking to my heart
Are you with me
Am I here with you
Are we in paradise


(Chorus)

When the morning comes
Wake me with your love
Let me know that I'm not dreamin'
Tell me this is real
Show me how you feel
Say it's what we both believe in ...

(Chorus)






Well, keep doing what you are doing because AllForMJ was around last night, yay, I saw her...now just call her all the way back into this thread! :wild:

:wild:

[Ape]

MP I love that song. :-)


(fantasy or not just let me dream for a bit) wouldn't that be such a perfect conclusion to this thread (and beginning to much more). Lisha would that punch be spiked or not? Lol. What would I do? I would want to have one dance with the groom at least. All the litd gals&guys would have to have a slumber party the night before or so. For snacks we'd have chocolate covered popcorn and mushy peas for sure. That's a given. What else??

[Iceberg]

How wonderful to see that I have to dedicate myself to so much reading!
I had some personal problems, my car was stolen. And worse than my work depends on the car ... But that's alright :)

As I update the topic discussed here, I let a song that I love so much ... a lot these days and I love it!

Did you go back from where you came?
If I get there, will they have my name?
If they don't, I'll only have myself to blame
For all these things, true happiness is having wings

90ZcZccUrFQ

[MJzPrincess1982]

MysteriousPheonix;

There are a few songs that michael's brothers have sung that sound like it could have came from MJ about her, surprisingly. I wouldn't be surprised lol

[Ashtanga]

This thread is moving fast.... http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif :shifty: This is very good!!! :woohoo: :heart:

[Favoritetune]

Spiked punch :)

Please no mushy peas but i'd certainly go for lots of popcorn!

What would happen to this thread if that were to happen? Oh i know everyone would post their wedding photos and dances with the groom so those who didn't post in here would be upset that they didn't go. People could throw popcorn instead of rice

Iceburg, that's another name I saw before, What up?

MP I dont know what to say about snakes crawling and centipedes but the mind could wonder. Here's a nice link of a centipede. Edit in Centipede link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSmTPz0t6fk I will say the words are saying that when it's queit at night and the snakes crawling he'll be crying so many tears. if we look at the symbolism for those words that could say a lot but i aint going there.

Tell Me I'm not dreaming :) now see i think this song is a perfect one for AllforMJ to analyze I noticed mj was singing some words you missed cause Jermaine sung part of it. I made it bold along with the other ones you did.

Tell Me I'm Not Dreamin'

Lyrics:

Moonlight took me by surprise
'light coming from your eyes
Are you with me
Am I here with you
Are we in paradise
Tell me I'm not dreamin'

I know I've been here before
You go, then you come back for more
It's a mystery how you disappear
Like a shadow in the night
Tell me I'm not dreamin'

Chorus:
Are you too good to be true
Tell me I'm not dreamin'
Are you too good to be true
Tell me I'm not dreamin'

Midnight images of you
You slipped, slipped into my room
Could be magic, could be fantasy
Could it be that we're in love


Your voice whispers in the dark
You're talk, talking to my heart
Are you with me
Am I here with you
Are we in paradise
(Chorus)

When the morning comes
Wake me with your love
Let me know that I'm not dreamin'
Tell me this is real
Show me how you feel
Say it's what we both believe in ...

(Chorus)

Lisha Don't stop Till you get enough

i was wondering you know if, if you could keep on because, the force it's, it's got a lot of power and, it make feel like a, it, it make me feel like OOOOOOOOOW!

lovin is the feelin now
fever tempertures risin now
power oh power
is at first a vow

that makes it happen
it asks no questions why
get closer, closer now
to my body now
just love me till you don't know how ooh


now to quote mj "you make it something dirty it's not dirty" or he said something like that

Edit

it didnt save my bold parts these lyrics
Are you with me
Am I here with you
Are we in paradise

It's a mystery how you disappear
Like a shadow in the night
Tell me I'm not dreamin' w

[Lisha]

^ It seems pretty clear from those adlibs at the end, that MJ is singing in Jermiane's song, that he is certainly convinced he's not dreaming.

At least, that is what he most often repeats:

I'm NOT dreaming!


P.S. Sorry, Iceberg, to hear about your car being stolen. :( I hope you will get it replaced with little hassle and have convenient transportation back and forth to your work restored to you. You seem to be maintaining a positive attitude with it all. I like your fortitude. :) Thanks for posting that song for us.

[Favoritetune]

here's another centipede i think this one is a female, ladies dont get squeemish http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqb6zX7kryU&feature=related

i think the only way to understand the song would be to figure out who is like a centipede.

[Lisha]

The girl speaking in the video seems to have a real soft spot for critters, even creeping ones.

I just read over the lyrics to the song, Centipede...and to be honest, I don't get it's meaning.

Before I listened to the lyrics and just was going by the name, I thought maybe it was about a girl who went on a first date with some guy who was "all arms" and not leaving her alone and moving too fast. But, nah, that doesn't seem to be what the words are saying at all. :scratch:

[Favoritetune]

haha no sounds more like. well, in the quiet of the night and the snake is in the crawling and the moon starts to glow and disappear when the time is really right and the centipede is crawling he'll be crying in the night so many tears

seems to fit in line with the mystery, are you, am i dreaming, what was the line from pyt about going upstairs, that stuff, this song says like you crawled into the bathroom window to give him all your love, but if someone was physically there would he be crying? song is sort of confusing but in a way it's not.

Edit here "you make it sound dirty but it's not"

[Lisha]

Oh, geesh, maybe I'm getting us sidetracked here with this song...but now that we've gotten started. Confirm for me, if you can, MJ did write the lyrics, yes?


haha no sounds more like. well, in the quiet of the night and the snake is in the crawling and the moon starts to glow and disappear when the time is really right and the centipede is crawling he'll be crying in the night so many tears

seems to fit in line with the mystery, are you, am i dreaming, what was the line from pyt about going upstairs, that stuff, this song says like you crawled into the bathroom window to give him all your love, but if someone was physically there would he be crying? song is sort of confusing but in a way it's not.

Edit here "you make it sound dirty but it's not"

First of all, is this song from the girl's perspective or the guy's? Rebbie is singing it, but if MJ worte it, then well that would explain this line: To give him all your love...which shows it is talking about a female coming to a "him." Right?


The lyrics basically include:


(Centipede)
(Centipede)

Your love is like a raging fire
You're a snake that's on the loose
The strike is your desire
But when the centipede is hot
You're bound to feel the fire
But when the centipede is hot
You're bound to feel the fire

I feel, oh yeah, a longing for your touch
Like you crawled into the bathroom window
To give him all your love
Like a centipede that's hot
The fire is in your touch
Just like a centipede you've got
A lot of loving to touch

Don't you know
In the quiet of the night
Is when the snake is in the crawlin'
And the moon starts to glow then disappear
When the time is really right
Is when the centipede is crawlin'
You'll be crying in the night
So many tears
And crawlin' like a centipede
(centipede)

Gosh, so confusing. Are the snake and the centipede both representing the same person? Or whatever they are personifying? Or is the snake the enemy to the centipede? :blink:

The last section sounds like a warning. Centipedes are poisonous? And some snakes are venomous?


It's not about sensuality then, is what MJ was trying to say?

Because one thing I was thinking is that it's a warning one guy is giving to a girl whose passion and attraction/magnetism he has picked up on, but he thinks if she's not too careful with it, she will attract the snakes that are all too willing to take advantage of it.

But that is probably what MJ was thinking others might interpret it as, and he is saying no to that?

EDIT: actually, now that I think about it, the theme is reminding me a bit of some things about Serious Effect.

The snake is some guy who is on the prowl... and the guy singing has his eye on some girl whose love he's wanting and who he feels ...I guess like some other songs he puts...hot fever, or I feel your fever for miles around, and in CSTYGE, "lovin is the feelin now/fever tempertures risin now" with...and he is imagining this hot fever in her reaching the snake, and that is the metaphore here for that:

I feel, (the guy singing) oh yeah, a longing for your touch(the guy singing)
Like you (the girl, metaphore coming -->) crawled into the bathroom window
To give him (the snake) all your love

Then he goes on to warn her, look, you don't want this kind of guy to pick up on your hot fever...much better ME...for even though I feel it, I won't do you wrong (Something like that). In other words, he's sayin' "Give the love to me, a more worthy recipient."

Maybe it's in the middle of the night...

And the moon starts to glow then disappear

...when he thinks about her, and his attraction to her, and this whole thing with this other guy, the snake.
Maybe he is "feeling her" so strong in his spirit when it is all quiet like that at nght and it gets him thinking about it all.

[8701girl]

First of all, is this song from the girl's perspective or the guy's? Rebbie is singing it, but if MJ worte it, then well that would explain this line: To give him all your love...which shows it is talking about a female coming to a "him." Right?


The lyrics basically include:


(Centipede)
(Centipede)

Your love is like a raging fire
You're a snake that's on the loose
The strike is your desire
But when the centipede is hot
You're bound to feel the fire
But when the centipede is hot
You're bound to feel the fire

I feel, oh yeah, a longing for your touch
Like you crawled into the bathroom window
To give him all your love
Like a centipede that's hot
The fire is in your touch
Just like a centipede you've got
A lot of loving to touch

Don't you know
In the quiet of the night
Is when the snake is in the crawlin'
And the moon starts to glow then disappear
When the time is really right
Is when the centipede is crawlin'
You'll be crying in the night
So many tears
And crawlin' like a centipede
(centipede)

Gosh, so confusing. Are the snake and the centipede both representing the same person? Or whatever they are personifying? Or is the snake the enemy to the centipede? :blink:

The last section sounds like a warning. Centipedes are poisonous? And some snakes are venomous?


It's not about sensuality then, is what MJ was trying to say?

Because one thing I was thinking is that it's a warning one guy is giving ot a girl whose passion and attraction/magnetism he has picked up on, but he thinks if she's not too carefulwith it, she will attrack the snakes that are all too willing to take advantage of it.

But that is probably what MJ was thinking others might interpret it as, and he is saying no to that?

EDIT: actually, now that I think about it, the theme is reminding me a bit of some things about Serious Effect.

The snake is some guy who is on the prowl... and the guy singing has his eye on some girl whose love he's wanting and who he feels ...I guess like some other songs he puts...hot fever, or I feel your fever for miles around, and in CSTYGE, "lovin is the feelin now/fever tempertures risin now" with...and he is imagining this hot fever in her reaching the snake, and that is the metaphore here for that:

I feel, (the guy singing) oh yeah, a longing for your touch(the guy singing)
Like you crawled into the bathroom window
To give him (the snake) all your love








hey guys! thought id come by and say hi and to try get my groove bck in this thread




I was thinking the meaning of that song could be : too much love can be a bad thing

[Lisha]

Hi, 8701girl! *waves*

Hey, that is a good way to sum up the song...which lyrics make you think that? :flowers:


~ when was this song written? Anyone know?

[8701girl]

Hi, 8701girl! *waves*

Hey, that is a good way to sum up the song...which lyrics make you think that? :flowers:

This part of the song is what got me thinking that : Is when the centipede is crawlin'
You'll be crying in the night
So many tears

[Lisha]

Ah...so are you sort of thinking the centipede with all it's legs and all it's crawling is representing "too much" love, or someone trying to live out too much love, and then the outcome is their crying of many tears? Yeah, I can see that. :)

[8701girl]

Ah...so are you sort of thinking the centipede with all it's legs and all it's crawling is representing "too much" love, or someone trying to live out too much love, and then the outcome is their crying of many tears? Yeah, I can see that. :)

The "someone trying to live out too much love then the outcome is their crying of many tears" part is what i mainly kinda thinking of

[Ashtanga]

~ when was this song written? Anyone know?

1984. :)

[Favoritetune]

hey 8701 girl, i remember you.

Lisha you would go and post the lyrics. i'm guessing this song was written when mj was in his raging youth hormone stage and likely had urges he could not address well that left him in tears probably for some girl who wasn't there. my guess is thoughts of some girl had him feeling like a burn from a centipede, crawling like a centipede could mean quickly leaving as thoughts appear and disappear



Oh, geesh, maybe I'm getting us sidetracked here with this song...but now that we've gotten started. Confirm for me, if you can, MJ did write the lyrics, yes?



First of all, is this song from the girl's perspective or the guy's? Rebbie is singing it, but if MJ worte it, then well that would explain this line: To give him all your love...which shows it is talking about a female coming to a "him." Right?


The lyrics basically include:


(Centipede)
(Centipede)

Your love is like a raging fire
You're a snake that's on the loose
The strike is your desire
But when the centipede is hot
You're bound to feel the fire
But when the centipede is hot
You're bound to feel the fire

I feel, oh yeah, a longing for your touch
Like you crawled into the bathroom window
To give him all your love
Like a centipede that's hot
The fire is in your touch
Just like a centipede you've got
A lot of loving to touch

Don't you know
In the quiet of the night
Is when the snake is in the crawlin'
And the moon starts to glow then disappear
When the time is really right
Is when the centipede is crawlin'
You'll be crying in the night
So many tears
And crawlin' like a centipede
(centipede)

Gosh, so confusing. Are the snake and the centipede both representing the same person? Or whatever they are personifying? Or is the snake the enemy to the centipede? :blink:

The last section sounds like a warning. Centipedes are poisonous? And some snakes are venomous?


It's not about sensuality then, is what MJ was trying to say?

Because one thing I was thinking is that it's a warning one guy is giving ot a girl whose passion and attraction/magnetism he has picked up on, but he thinks if she's not too carefulwith it, she will attrack the snakes that are all too willing to take advantage of it.

But that is probably what MJ was thinking others might interpret it as, and he is saying no to that?

EDIT: actually, now that I think about it, the theme is reminding me a bit of some things about Serious Effect.

The snake is some guy who is on the prowl... and the guy singing has his eye on some girl whose love he's wanting and who he feels ...I guess like some other songs he puts...hot fever, or I feel your fever for miles around, and in CSTYGE, "lovin is the feelin now/fever tempertures risin now" with...and he is imagining this hot fever in her reaching the snake, and that is the metaphore here for that:

I feel, (the guy singing) oh yeah, a longing for your touch(the guy singing)
Like you (the girl, metaphore coming -->) crawled into the bathroom window
To give him (the snake) all your love

Then he goes on to warn her, look, you don't want this kind of guy to pick up on your hot fever...much better ME...for even though I feel it, I won't do you wrong (Something like that). In other words, he's sayin' "Give the love to me, a more worthy recipient."

Maybe it's in the middle of the night...

And the moon starts to glow then disappear

...when he thinks about her, and his attraction to her, and this whole thing with this other guy, the snake.
Maybe he is "feeling her" so strong in his spirit when it is all quiet like that at nght and it gets him thinking about it all.

[Lisha]

Thanks, Ash, for posting the date!

Well, Favoritetune, I wish you had said that in the first place! :lol: Gosh, I wouldn't have attempted to figure it all out!

Yeah, that makes total sense, especially seeing how it was writtten in the early 80's and all. He was pretty young.

Was this song a hit in its day?


Oh, FT, since you put it this way:


my guess is thoughts of some girl had him feeling like a burn from a centipede...

It doesn't speak of love so it could just be some cute girl her was attracted to at the time and probably not the LITD girl. Or, were you kinda thinking it would have been the LITD girl (if she exists or existed to him back then). And if so...why?

FT, you also said,

"...for some girl that wasn't there..."

By this are you meaning she wasn't physically there with him right then at the moment when he was feeling his "urges" and wanted to express them, or are you meaning that she wasn't there because she was "out of his life" and was no longer "around," so, he couldn't see her or talk to her anymore in person, and therefore, have any hope at all of expressing his love to her in anyway any time soon? That could make someone cry, sure.

Or was she "around" but he didn't have the courage to "make something happen" so at night when things like this overcame him, he'd be frustrated and very sad?

Left all alone in his love and desire. I guess that would be the case either way. :(


EDIT: btw, I wasn't toyin' with you all; I really did see AllForMJ the other night. :) Now I remember she used to not always have access to a computer, maybe that's still the case. But I thought it was a good sign that since July 2011 this is her first time back, indicating she now once again has a working password and can get in here! Yay! Hope she makes it back real soon.

[Favoritetune]

I feel, oh yeah, a longing for your touch
Like you crawled into the bathroom window
To give him all your love

He wrote love. i imagine he wrote the words i feel a longing for your touch like you crawled into the bathroom window to give me all your love and changed it to him instead of me so someone else could sing it but i'm just guessing

[Lisha]

I feel, oh yeah, a longing for your touch
Like you crawled into the bathroom window
To give him all your love

He wrote love. i imagine he wrote the words i feel a longing for your touch like you crawled into the bathroom window to give me all your love and changed it to him instead of me so someone else could sing it but i'm just guessing

So the line,

You'll be crying in the night

might have been originally,

I'll being crying in the night?

Maybe this is why the meaning in the song is confusing when one tries to break things down because some pronouns he went ahead and changed for the singer (Rebbie), and some just were kept unchanged. So it is difficult to know who the I's and You's, Yours', You're's and the Him, are all referring to.

FT, this song, Centipede, wasn't supposed to be this interesting to talk about...how did that happen? haha. Thanks for being willing to discuss it with me like this. You, too, 8701girl. :)


(and thank you, MP, for posting the song vid for Centipede. Did you have any idea several posts later it would still be the subject of discussion?!!!)

[Favoritetune]

possibly that or i be crying in the night so many tears

you're funny

I didn't make it interesting you are the one who payed attention to it.


So the line,

You'll be crying in the night

might have been originally,

I'll being crying in the night?

Maybe this is why the meaning in the song is confusing when one tries to break things down because some pronouns he went ahead and changed for the singer (Rebbie), and some just were kept unchanged. So it is difficult to know who the I's and You's, Yours', You're's and the Him, are all referring to.

FT, this song, Centipede, wasn't supposed to be this interesting to talk about...how did that happen? haha. Thanks for being willing to discuss it with me like this. You, too, 8701girl. :)

[Lisha]

Well to be perfectly serious, it is the first time in my life I did pay attention to it. :o

Now I think I can safely say I have officially and fully "experienced" the song, Centipede! (that's why I was asking if it had been a hit when it came out. I have no idea)



ps: it makes me kinda sad picturing MJ crying like that over some girl. :( I think I'm mad at her!!! She made him cry!!)

I be cryin so many tears

I wish I could have told him, "Michael, the Lord has collected all of your tears and has put them lovingly in a vial in heaven...on hold. They are not going unnoticed. He is crying with you. And one day, He will redeem those tears, because you Love Him so.

[Favoritetune]

well if their connection is as you ladies say then maybe they were both crying, people cry when they can't be with the one they love. its torture right?

[Lisha]

Sounds like you are saying the "spiritual connection" was already in place back in '84 and it was TwoWay. He could feel her and she could feel him and he could hear her and she could hear him even though they were "far apart."

Is that your take, FT? Way back in the early 80's they both consciously knew of each other and were reaching out to one another through their spirits?

[Ashtanga]

http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif :shifty:





Thanks, Ash, for posting the date!

;)

[Lisha]

http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/produits/141/10983/popcorn-MJ.gif



Just looking at this picture here, and considering what we've been talking about. Hmm...

Here he is, looking all happy and vibrant (stuffing his face with popcorn like we all do in here) and yet, at this time in his life, he was there alone in his bedroom each night, there in the home in Encino, aching for this girl? and crying deep from his heart because she is not a part of his life?

If this was the case, can we not all agree on a big "awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww"? :cry:

This shot from Thriller above would have been taken in late 1983; December, I think...and that's real close to the Centipede's release in 1984 (based on Ash's info).

And amazingly enough, guess what song just came on the radio as I'm sitting here? (not Thriller, but Smokey's Just To See Her) haha. Listening to the words here it just seems to speak about some of what MJ could have been feeling. Here, I'll post it for ya all:

RQz68KYQrp0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQz68KYQrp0

(although this depicts a guy and a girl who were once together than split...that isn't what we have been describing for MJ as far as the LITD girl and him goes. We have talked about them having met but then before the relationship was to begin, she disappeared...which led to Who Is It and Can't Let Her Get Away, etc. Or...something like that)

IF SHE EVEN EXISTS!!!! <-- token disclaimer!

[Favoritetune]

well, during thriller mj said he was lonely, very lonely right? so it's possible. love smokey songs thanks for posting that


Sounds like you are saying the "spiritual connection" was already in place back in '84 and it was TwoWay. He could feel her and she could feel him and he could hear her and she could hear him even though they were "far apart."

Is that your take, FT? Way back in the early 80's they both consciously knew of each other and were reaching out to one another through their spirits?

[8701girl]

FT, this song, Centipede, wasn't supposed to be this interesting to talk about...how did that happen? haha. Thanks for being willing to discuss it with me like this. You, too, 8701girl. :)



Things like that tend to happen with this thread - discussing songs for no random reason lol

Also i got the interpretation of the song as saying that love was too suffocating for him

[Lisha]

well, during thriller mj said he was lonely, very lonely right? so it's possible. love smokey songs thanks for posting that
You're welcome, and so do you have examples of where we might have learned MJ was lonely then...did he mention that in an interview during that time period? Were there any song lyrics from any of the songs on Thriller where he talks about his being lonely? I know during the interview at his Beat It video taping, he mentions how he was just experiencing friendships for the first time and that was obviously very special and important to him then. You could tell by the way he says it, don't you think? You guys know of the interview I am talking about?

We had just talked in here about how he might have not told anyone about his "secret love" because he didnt want that info to get out there, but it's interesting that in the interview I am referring to, he also tells how he and Diana Ross can share all their deepest secrets with each other. Do you think that means she could have known about his loneliness and about this girl he wished could be his girlfriend? Diana seems to have been someone who was "safe" for him to talk to.


Things like that tend to happen with this thread - discussing songs for no random reason lol

True!


Also i got the interpretation of the song as saying that love was too suffocating for him

Now there is another way to look at. That sounds like a negative thing, though, doesn't it? Was it getting to the point where someone was needing a little breather from love? Is that kinda what you mean? Do you think that could be the message of the song? He was being suffocated by it and he needed to remove himself from all that love making for awhile. haha. (love making can be taken a couple ways, of course, not just the obvious...some guys can say "let me make love to you" and mean, let me start wooing you or pursuing you, and show you true romance, baby).

[MJzPrincess1982]

Well to be perfectly serious, it is the first time in my life I did pay attention to it. :o

Now I think I can safely say I have officially and fully "experienced" the song, Centipede! (that's why I was asking if it had been a hit when it came out. I have no idea)



ps: it makes me kinda sad picturing MJ crying like that over some girl. :( I think I'm mad at her!!! She made him cry!!)

I be cryin so many tears

I wish I could have told him, "Michael, the Lord has collected all of your tears and has put them lovingly in a vial in heaven...on hold. They are not going unnoticed. He is crying with you. And one day, He will redeem those tears, because you Love Him so.
She has made him cry and be lonely a ton..she was stubborn, as was he. many many of his songs state that. a few things he wrote in DANCING THE DREAM were written about her. :)

[8701girl]

True!
Now there is another way to look at. That sounds like a negative thing, though, doesn't it? Was it getting to the point where someone was needing a little breather from love?).

Yes thats what i meant cuz like sometimes getting too much love can be a hard thing to deal with for some people. That person may be thinking to them self "this is too much i cant think for myself!" its almost as if you are not yourself and u dont know anything else

[MJzPrincess1982]

Sounds like you are saying the "spiritual connection" was already in place back in '84 and it was TwoWay. He could feel her and she could feel him and he could hear her and she could hear him even though they were "far apart."

Is that your take, FT? Way back in the early 80's they both consciously knew of each other and were reaching out to one another through their spirits?
Yes yes yes!! You got it :) Good job lol you understand..many many close couples feel this way about each other so it is common among close couples who have a good connection :)

[MJzPrincess1982]

Anyone listen real closely to the lyrics "Much too soon"? There is a lot to learn from, in that song, in my opinion.,

[Lisha]

Yes yes yes!! You got it :) Good job lol you understand..many many close couples feel this way about each other so it is common among close couples who have a good connection :)

Don't give me too much credit for that, for this is just me paying attention to what others have brought up in here before. It just seemed like that was what FT might be saying as well so I asked him to confirm if he was. I was mainly wondering if he thought both of them were attuned and not just MJ, because at one point we have discussed that only MJ knew and not her. I think one example was MP discussing the possibility of MJ experiencing her in dreams (maybe even dreams they shared), or maybe some form of spiritual visitation, but the girl woke up not remembering or didn't sense him necessarily when this was going on. I think, MP, you brought up something about MJ's unique situation, because of his celebrity, that God understood his difficulties in connecting with her in more convensional ways so God maybe gave Michael this special kind of gift...to feel and sense her, etc.

Did I remember that right, MP?

So it's Two Way vs. One Way.

And I was wondering which FT was leaning towards. Or... One Way originally but eventually Two Way. And then the question is, when did the Two Way begin for them? Before Thriller, after Thriller, after Bad, after Dangerous, a year before his death? Was YANA a good indication it was going on then? Or could that song still just be referring to a One Way spiritual connection? What do the songs/lyrics say? And can we trust them in this area?

Would you mind MJzprincess sharing your thoughts about Much Too Soon with us, and then we can see if it stimulates more ideas from us as well? :)

8701girl, that is a deep observation. Good for you! It can be very true with some people.

[MJzPrincess1982]

MP and others were just speaking what was already told in his music :)

It's a heartfelt story.. it even kind of sounds like the jacksons sing it a bit in their victory album...I believe it's that album

[Lisha]

^ Can you remember some examples where it was told in his music?

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Wow! A lot of talk going on about some yucky spider! lol! I actually hate those things! But ... I do like the song! Don't ask me to interpret it, though. I don't know what the heck is going on there, but I have to give you ladies a lot of credit for actually making some sense out of it. I even watched the video and still can't quite understand it. Seems like it's about some woman who has some "magical" powers over men. It seems like the men are forming the "legs" of the centipede.


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well if their connection is as you ladies say then maybe they were both crying, people cry when they can't be with the one they love. its torture right?



Ooooooh, now why did you have to say that word? The song, "Torture" had just been running through my mind and now I am tempted to post it.


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Sounds like it's about some dominatrix or something. Hope that wasn't the actual case. Wow! This thread sure takes some intersting turns! lol!

Wonder if they were at all inspired by this Bee Gees tune?


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Here I lie
in a lost and lonely part of town
Held in time
In a world of tears I slowly drown
Goin' home
I just can't make it all alone
I really should be holding you
Holding you
Loving you loving you

Tragedy
When the feeling's gone and you can't go on
It's tragedy
When the morning cries and you don't know why
It's hard to bear
With no-one to love you you're
goin' nowhere
Tragedy
When you lose control and you got no soul
It's tragedy
When the morning cries and you don't know why
It's hard to bear
With no-one beside you you're
goin' nowhere
When the feeling's gone and you can't go on

Night and day
there's a burning down inside of me
Burning love
With a yearning that won't let me be
Down I go
and I just can't take it all alone
I really should be holding you
Holding you
Loving you loving

Tragedy
When the feeling's gone and you can't go on
It's tragedy
When the morning cries and you don't know why
It's hard to bear
With no-one to love you you're
goin' nowhere
Tragedy
When you lose control and you got no soul
It's tragedy
When the morning cries and you don't know why
It's hard to bear
With no-one beside you you're
goin' nowhere (repeat and fade)






Don't give me too much credit for that, for this is just me paying attention to what others have brought up in here before. It just seemed like that was what FT might be saying as well so I asked him to confirm if he was. I was mainly wondering if he thought both of them were attuned and not just MJ, because at one point we have discussed that only MJ knew and not her. I think one example was MP discussing the possibility of MJ experiencing her in dreams (maybe even dreams they shared), or maybe some form of spiritual visitation, but the girl woke up not remembering or didn't sense him necessarily when this was going on. I think, MP, you brought up something about MJ's unique situation, because of his celebrity, that God understood his difficulties in connecting with her in more convensional ways so God maybe gave Michael this special kind of gift...to feel and sense her, etc.

Did I remember that right, MP?

Sounds about right. It is interesting that he started talking this way after Thriller. It seems like that time period was significant. I LOVE discussing this period of time!

[MysteriousPhoenix]

Double post. Sorry. Having technical issues.

[Ape]

Ok I have a question. FT you said a while back that the woman would recognize herself in the lyrics or in many of them, and if a lady was thinking he meant her, even if she was around him and in person that it may not have been about her if she doesn't recognize herself in the lyrics. Aren't many lyrics vague enough that someone could apply it to her life regardless of if its about her or not? Unless things are clearly about her, clearly saying her name or something, then couldn't many woman come to a false conclusion that he was talking (singing) about her all along? Especially if we take the view presented by MP and brought to our attention again by Lisa that perhaps MJ would clearly see her in his dreams and wake up remembering her well, like it really happened and feeling as though she really must exist (and actually all these current songs brought up as well as a number more could support this theory) but for her, it not being as clear, maybe just remembering a few dreams here and there but maybe not even recognizing her dream man as MJ or as a clear image at all; because then we all could dream that it must have been (or could have been) "me"(whomever is ponding this)? I'm wondering how many woman could potentially see themselves in enough of the lyrics that they seriously begin to entertain the possibility that she could be the one he sings about; and if that number is high, could it all have been just a marketing ploy to sucker in vulnerable, lonely imaginative women into swooning over the Jackson brothers? A theme is quite apparent in the songs over the years and if a young girl grew up listening to their music, connections could be made throughout their lives to reinforce a false idea that she and MJ (or another famous person in a similar position) share some mystical connection? What if I take this thought even further...what if even Michael began to believe in these lyrics and the possibility that it could happen and maybe started to really dream about someone in this manner from the time he was a child? He was lonely and I could see it happening. Ok what if all this happened, and God was involved. Would God, seeing Mikes desire for someone heaven sent, meant for him, would He then make someone especially for him? Would they then dream with each other in this seamingly impossible, magical way? And could it still be possible despite it starting out as a marketing ploy to get a loyal fanatical fan base? OR...is it all just business and we've bought into the dream(lie)? Maybe much like the beLIEvers have bought into the dream of him still being alive. OR...is there something to either or both of these theories?I see possibiliies...(just don't know what is just purely fiction and what is actual reality no matter how unbelievable it may be)

[Ape]

Ugh... trying to edit to make it more readable but rather than put it into separate paragraghx, it joined everything together. Im on a tablet and its not as good as a laptop. (My hard drive fried).

[Magicgirl]

Hope everyone is having a nice Sunday. Or is it Monday for 8701girl? :flowers:

I had in just a couple posts back mentioned a few songs about flying and wings and that particular theme, yet I had not been aware of this Jackson5 song, for which I stumbled upon today. It is being played behind the words of that lovely poem, Two Birds.

Qas1gzhF0qk

Just thought I'd share it here.:)



That is a great song, Magicgirl. :yes: We did discuss it quite a few pages back. It would be would wonderful if you'd be willing to share some of your thoughts about it! :wild:

I will say that if we take the lyrics fairly literally, it would seem this woman is the type that AllForMJ was talking about with us when she wrote this very thoughtful post based on a "timeline" of all his songs, and what he seemed to be going through regarding women in each season. She specifically discussed the kind of women who were trying to get his time and attention, and it seems at times some did succeed to get quite close, but they were bad news...either self-centered, after money, not sincere in their feelings towards him, etc. I think the woman in the song, Dangerous, might fit this description, but I think AllForMJ was talking about the season of time around the Invincible album, and what, for her, some of the songs were communicating. I personally do not know well enough the songs off of that album and can't recall the titles, I'm so sorry. But I know mysterygrl7 is very familiar with that album and has thought about the songs on there quite a bit. Maybe she can refresh our memory on the songs that speak of his being hurt or taken advantage of by some "not worthy of him" female (is that a good way to put it?):unsure:

Anyway, at face value, the woman in Behind the Mask sounds like that type of female who he is having trouble seeing as sincere.

So, Magicgirl, are you thinking, by bringing up this song, that the BTM gal could be the LITD girl and be the way he viewed her at some point in their relationship? (if she exists)

This song was written a long, long time ago...the 80's. And of course, there are usually(which is fun) a couple ways to interpret things, so is it possible the lyrics are not being so straight-forward, and it is not necessarily saying the woman is all bad news, but maybe she is just coming off confusing to him?

I think it was Favoritetune who had an interesting take on the way the song ends on this latest version. The female vocalist sings louder and louder "I love you, Michael" and FT was suggesting it could represent that even though maybe MJ and his LITD girl only connected through a spiritual connection(and sadly never actually got together literally before time ran out :( ), MJ still, towards the end of his life was beginning to hear her more loudly and clearly, and therefore, could hear better than ever in his spirit, her strong, loud and clear, I LOVE YOU, MICHAEL!!!!.

I thought that was a cute take on it.:)




btw, I like all the TIT clips in that BTM vid, Magicgirl!


Thank you Lisha for your great interpretation, it was a pleasure to read it. Sorry for the delay in answering but I could read it only right now as I gave up my attempts to restore the access to this forum with this username before, but finally I got my new password few days ago and can read it now again.

[Magicgirl]

Actually, because MJ loved Disney stories very much, it does kind of seem like he was hoping to be rescued in a way that is similar to what happens in a fairytale. In a fairytale, it often happens in a very mystical and magical way.

Look at what he said here many years ago about being rescued...

"Girls want to rescue me from loneliness, but they do it in such a way that they give me the impression they want to share my loneliness, which I wouldn't wish on anybody, because I believe I am one of the loneliest people in the world.

"She's Out Of My Life" is about knowing that the barriers that have separated me from others are temptingly low and seemingly easy to jump over and yet they remain standing while what I really desire disappears from my sight."

Now, notice that the song "One More Chance" which he selected as the new song to release in 2003 on his "Number Ones" CD has a line that says, "Come and rescue me out of this storm." Then, in "The Way You Love Me" which is the love song he released in 2004 during the trial, he said, "I was alone. There was no love in my life. I was afraid of life and you came in time." Notice that he also said, "I thank the Heavens above that I met you." Additionally, he said, "The world's a better place 'cause you came in time. You took away the rain and brought the sunshine."

It is very apparent, from looking at the way that he actually started cheering up, putting out positive love songs, smiling, laughing, giggling, and looking very vibrant again before our very eyes, that someone figured out how to do what he wanted done.

I've gathered some photos that will show just how much he had cheered up, but I'm still trying to do some other things before I post them. I want to make an attempt at doing what Ashtanga calls designing for all to understand. *waving at Ashtanga*

:yes:


Michael is with God...

Here is something that I posted in December of 2003. It will show you that God helped MJ to win the court battle.

Dec 06 2003, 02:29 AM

Recently, I went back to the Bible to see if there are other passages that shows that Heaven opens.

I found this one...

Acts 10:9-13
9 The next day, as they went on their journey and drew near the city, Peter went up on the housetop to pray, about the sixth hour.
10 Then he became very hungry and wanted to eat; but while they made ready, he fell into a trance
11 and saw heaven opened and an object like a great sheet bound at the four corners, descending to him and let down to the earth.
12 In it were all kinds of four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, creeping things, and birds of the air.
13 And a voice came to him, “Rise, Peter; kill and eat.”

And I also found this one...

Matthew 3:16-17
16 As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and lighting on him.
17 And a voice from heaven said, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased."

The way that MJ won the trial even though Sneddon had the entire DA's department behind him; the entire police department behind him; the entire sheriff's department behind him; the laws of the land on his side; the judge doing the majority of the rulings in his favor; had spent millions of dollars to assist him in trying to convict MJ; and had the media working along side him by only putting out negative stories during the trial, proves that God said MJ was innocent and also proves that God had defended MJ Himself. Even Mesereau felt God's presence or he would not have said, "God was with us." And there were also doves being released to go along with MJ being exonerated.

I really do not think that God would exonerate MJ and then not allow MJ to come and live with Him once MJ has left the earth. Therefore, it is safe to say that God has MJ with Him. If God has been revealing through His very own actions that He is indeed real, then it means that Heaven, His home, is real as well.

:yes:

Thank God for God, and thank God that Michael Jackson is someone that loves God very much.

Thank you for your great post, sorry for the very late reply, but it seems I post something and then never come back in time to read the replies. Your supposition is right! It never came to my mind before. Michael is of course living by God in Heaven at god's island. You are right.

[Magicgirl]

Ok I have a question. FT you said a while back that the woman would recognize herself in the lyrics or in many of them, and if a lady was thinking he meant her, even if she was around him and in person that it may not have been about her if she doesn't recognize herself in the lyrics. Aren't many lyrics vague enough that someone could apply it to her life regardless of if its about her or not? Unless things are clearly about her, clearly saying her name or something, then couldn't many woman come to a false conclusion that he was talking (singing) about her all along? Especially if we take the view presented by MP and brought to our attention again by Lisa that perhaps MJ would clearly see her in his dreams and wake up remembering her well, like it really happened and feeling as though she really must exist (and actually all these current songs brought up as well as a number more could support this theory) but for her, it not being as clear, maybe just remembering a few dreams here and there but maybe not even recognizing her dream man as MJ or as a clear image at all; because then we all could dream that it must have been (or could have been) "me"(whomever is ponding this)? I'm wondering how many woman could potentially see themselves in enough of the lyrics that they seriously begin to entertain the possibility that she could be the one he sings about; and if that number is high, could it all have been just a marketing ploy to sucker in vulnerable, lonely imaginative women into swooning over the Jackson brothers? A theme is quite apparent in the songs over the years and if a young girl grew up listening to their music, connections could be made throughout their lives to reinforce a false idea that she and MJ (or another famous person in a similar position) share some mystical connection? What if I take this thought even further...what if even Michael began to believe in these lyrics and the possibility that it could happen and maybe started to really dream about someone in this manner from the time he was a child? He was lonely and I could see it happening. Ok what if all this happened, and God was involved. Would God, seeing Mikes desire for someone heaven sent, meant for him, would He then make someone especially for him? Would they then dream with each other in this seamingly impossible, magical way? And could it still be possible despite it starting out as a marketing ploy to get a loyal fanatical fan base? OR...is it all just business and we've bought into the dream(lie)? Maybe much like the beLIEvers have bought into the dream of him still being alive. OR...is there something to either or both of these theories?I see possibiliies...(just don't know what is just purely fiction and what is actual reality no matter how unbelievable it may be)

I like your suppositions, maybe connected not through dreams but through some telepathic power like they have it in science fiction films? Concerning the recognition in lyrics... I was writing some poems myself and it was always based on something or someone, so is possible that MJ did that as well in some songs and put a definite message so one could recognise herself in that. But of course there are many women that would want to believe as well that she was meant though she was not. I think it was easier for MJ to put a message in a song than to write a letter on paper. As the letter can be lost or stolen or he wouldn't dare to send it and the song will always reach the receiver. God! This forum site works so slow that I guess I will soon give up on this thread.

[Favoritetune]

Okay, how did i miss all for mjs post?

when was that written?

MP I put MJ before the verse he sings, in the song torture it’s not about love it sounds to me more like someone who is there taking advantage of his loneliness. Someone who was there and from the lyrics “here to serve all masters” sounds like she got busy with plenty. Definitely not a love in the dark.
"Torture"
It was on a street so evil
So bad that even hell disowned it
Every single step was trouble
For the fool who stumbled on it
Eyes within the dark were watchin'
I felt the sudden chill of danger
Something told me keep on walkin'
Told me I should not have gone there

Baby, 'cause you cut me like a knife
Without your love in my life
Alone I walk in the night
'Cause I just can't stop this feeling
It's torture
It's torture
It's torture

MJ

(She was up a stair to nowhere
A room forever I'll remember
She stared as though I should have known her
Tell me what's your pain or pleasure
Every little thing you find here
Is simply for the thrill you're after
Loneliness or hearts on fire
I am here to serve all masters)

She said, 'Reality is a knife
When there's no love in your life
Unmerciful is the night
When you just can't stop this feeling'
It's torture
It's torture
It's torture

And I still can't find the meaning, no
MJ (No, no, of the face I keep on seeing)
Was she real or am I dreaming
MJ (Did the sound of your name
Turn a wheel
Start a flame in me)

Baby, 'cause you cut me like a knife
Without your love in my life
Alone I walk in the night
And I just can't stop this feeling
It's torture
It's torture
It's torture

Listening to this song now has got me analyzing it and as I’m listening to it I’m not sure if mj wrote it or not. There is parts in it that could fall with your theme and that is in the other verse mj sings in but first before I forget the first part he sings is this
(She was up a stair to nowhere
A room forever I'll remember
She stared as though I should have known her
Tell me what's your pain or pleasure
Every little thing you find here
Is simply for the thrill you're after
Loneliness or hearts on fire
I am here to serve all masters)

Not sure why but that along with the first part of the song reminded me of how people said people locked him in a room with prostitutes. I copied the lyrics from a site but to me it sounds like he’s singing she said as though I should have known her tell me what’s your pain or pleasure. It would make perfect since if that was about a prostitute, plus the part where he sings a room forever I’ll remember. Whatever the case the 1st part he sings is in my opinion not about litd but an opportunist, someone who plays love to get paid or something.
The second half of the song could have to do with a litd they are singing can’t find the meaning of the face I keep on seeing was she real or was I dreaming and that reminds me of karosel where he says something like that.

And I still can't find the meaning, no
MJ (No, no, of the face I keep on seeing)
Was she real or am I dreaming
MJ (Did the sound of your name
Turn a wheel
Start a flame in me)

Baby, 'cause you cut me like a knife
Without your love in my life
Alone I walk in the night
And I just can't stop this feeling
It's torture
It's torture
It's torture

So when I say torture I mean being without the one you love is torture. Notice how the song starts with a street so evil and ends with baby cause you cut me like a knife without your love in my life alone I walk in the night and I just can’t stop this feeling, he even mentions knowing a name in the 2nd part he sings cause he asked did the sound of your name turn a wheel start a flame in me
So maybe part of it is about a litd


Lisha I think a lot of things are possible. What you ladies are saying here about how mj has been singing songs for a while now as if trying to reach someone sounds true. Mj was very lonely and though I don’t know a certain video to post for you right now when he said that we all know he said it and it’s true. So I think it is divinely possible that he and his lady could feel each other in the spirit. There are a lot of things that happen in the world that can’t be explain by science. Was it in the 80’s? well if he did have someone in his heart that would explain why he let Latoya in his video. He was even gonna let her have the part in twymf. Maybe he was trying to protect someones heart or maybe he just didn’t want to hurt his female fans in general or both.
Dang lisha that’s a lot of questions I’d say the spiritual connection if you want to call it that probably began a long time ago if we guess from his songs and certainly I’d think you are not alone is a good example of that cause he’s singing to someone it seems even though r Kelly wrote it and who knows what mj told him he was looking for or if he picked it out cause it related like a greeting cars.

Ape how you doin? I think many of the songs have a general since to them but when a man is singing about divine love and many of the things he has been singing then I think some people would need to realize it’s not about them. The sad thing about all this is some ladies really wanna get with mj but should he be alone cause he can’t get with all the ladies? Should ladies who wanna be the one be alone cause she’s hoping she’s the one for him? i don’t think the songs are marketing strategy cause love songs are less popular than dance tracks. I do think that maybe mj made some songs about some women and that he sung them in such a way that a lot of women could know he’s not singing to them and maybe the litd lady as you say can clearly see herself in his lyrics. Other women could too and I guess that would make it hard for litd as well as other women cause the whole concept is unconventional. Any lady that’s ever liked him probably saw herself in his songs.

MJzprincess what stuff are you thinking bout from dancing the dream? I have listened to much too soon and I think it’s saying an awful lot. People who worked on it said mj kept bringing it out considering releasing it on different albums through the years so it shows it really meant something to him and I bet hearing it if it made sense to her probably meant a lot to litdg too.





Thank you for your great post, sorry for the very late reply, but it seems I post something and then never come back in time to read the replies. Your supposition is right! It never came to my mind before. Michael is of course living by God in Heaven at god's island. You are right.

[Lisha]

Wow, FT, that was a nice long post. Thank you.



So I think it is divinely possible that he and his lady could feel each other in the spirit. There are a lot of things that happen in the world that can’t be explain by science. Was it in the 80’s?

I’d say the spiritual connection if you want to call it that probably began a long time ago if we guess from his songs....

I think I can be on board with the idea that MJ had a special woman in his heart and it was a divine love and therefore, MJ, through God's help, could feel her in his spirit. And I'm trying to be open to the idea of a couple being able to feel each other back and forth through a spiritual connection. And I can believe MJ might have felt "her" this way back in the 80's, if he had already been aware of her.

What I am asking you, FT, specifically, is if you think back in the 80's the lyrics support it being a Two Way over being a One Way (or one-sided connection via MJ only) connection. Did only MJ feel her, or did she feel him back and it was a two way spiritual connection? Savvy? ;)


~ btw, the reason I am asking for this to be made clear, is because, FT, you have been suggesting ladies look to the lyrics to see if they line up or not with them, in order to support they are the LITD girl or not.

If you can support that MJ had a Two Way spiritual connection with the LITD girl, starting all the way back in the early to mid-eighties, then that would eliminate all, and I mean all, but one lady, and that would be the true LITD girl.

For anyone would know if they were having a Two Way spiritual connection going on with MJ in the 80's. I mean, that would stand out in someone's life, wouldn't it?

If anyone was not born then or was too little or was even older but did not spiritually pick up on, feel, and hear MJ through the spiritual realm, by God's divine assistance...then they can no longer see themselves as MJ's LITD girl...the one he asked God for years and years ago.

Right?

Look, I can take this test myself as an example:

Even though I was around, alive, and doing my thing in the 80's, I most certainly did not ever pick up on MJ connecting with or trying to connect with me in any spiritual way...therefore, if it is shown through the lyrics that he did have this going on with his LITD girl back in the 80's, then I am not the LITD girl.

See how this works?

[8701girl]

Anyone listen real closely to the lyrics "Much too soon"? There is a lot to learn from, in that song, in my opinion.,

I can kinda vaguely remember the lyrics but i havent listened to that song in a while

[8701girl]

It was on a street so evil
So bad that even hell disowned it
Every single step was trouble
For the fool who stumbled on it
Eyes within the dark were watchin'
I felt the sudden chill of danger
Something told me keep on walkin'
Told me I should not have gone there

Baby, 'cause you cut me like a knife
Without your love in my life
Alone I walk in the night
'Cause I just can't stop this feeling
It's torture
It's torture
It's torture

MJ

(She was up a stair to nowhere
A room forever I'll remember
She stared as though I should have known her
Tell me what's your pain or pleasure
Every little thing you find here
Is simply for the thrill you're after
Loneliness or hearts on fire
I am here to serve all masters)

She said, 'Reality is a knife
When there's no love in your life
Unmerciful is the night
When you just can't stop this feeling'
It's torture
It's torture
It's torture

And I still can't find the meaning, no
MJ (No, no, of the face I keep on seeing)
Was she real or am I dreaming
MJ (Did the sound of your name
Turn a wheel
Start a flame in me)

Baby, 'cause you cut me like a knife
Without your love in my life
Alone I walk in the night
And I just can't stop this feeling
It's torture
It's torture
It's torture


Omg thank you for posting the lyrics to "torture" as i have always wandered what they are as i could only make out some of it. This songs to me could represent the pain of losing the one u love from a break up , although it kinda also shows mj/jacksons seeing a woman for the first time & feeling a sense of wary of who this woman is they see

[Favoritetune]

Thanks Lisha, i don't think God would have it as one way. i think litdg would feel his love as well and imagine they both had to have a lot of faith in God to bring it about. maybe mj was as his lyrics say " i was alone in the dark when i met you" and maybe he was talking to God about his loneliness, "you took my hand and you told me you loved me" well if she took his hand she either took it, held it or one of those old fashion things they use to say back in the day when a guy would propose as in "will you take my hand in marriage" she didn't literally take his hand cause he still has it so she either took his hand in marriage and agreed to marry him or she held his hand or both. if they met literally an easy guess would be she held his hand and told him she loved them unless of course there was that love at first site knowing if such a thing exists and maybe he proposed to her then. that would be wild then i guess but no matter what it was i'm certain it would have had to be two way.

something else about torture when i went away it came to me how they did that video and near the end they show a glove like mj glitter grab the whip that this evil looking woman is swinging all over the place and luring men to their doom and the lady changes to normal and her whip is gone. when i walked away i thought of the rest of that story about mj being locked in a room with prostitutes and how they say people think he shared the gospel with her. that's what that scene reminded me of but mj isn't in that video

magicgirl hadn't seen you around before but i'm guessing sometimes servers just drag hope you don't give up. tell us what do you think about much too soon

mjzprincess?

now who is soundmind? i saw you tell us what you think about mjs love songs


Wow, FT, that was a nice long post. Thank you.



I think I can be on board with the idea that MJ had a special woman in his heart and it was a divine love and therefore, MJ, through God's help, could feel her in his spirit. And I'm trying to be open to the idea of a couple being able to feel each other back and forth through a spiritual connection. And I can believe MJ might have felt "her" this way back in the 80's, if he had already been aware of her.

What I am asking you, FT, specifically, is if you think back in the 80's the lyrics support it being a Two Way over being a One Way (or one-sided connection via MJ only) connection. Did only MJ feel her, or did she feel him back and it was a two way spiritual connection? Savvy? ;)


~ btw, the reason I am asking for this to be made clear, is because, FT, you have been suggesting ladies look to the lyrics to see if they line up or not with them, in order to support they are the LITD girl or not.

If you can support that MJ had a Two Way spiritual connection with the LITD girl, starting all the way back in the early to mid-eighties, then that would eliminate all, and I mean all, but one lady, and that would be the true LITD girl.

For anyone would know if they were having a Two Way spiritual connection going on with MJ in the 80's. I mean, that would stand out in someone's life, wouldn't it?

If anyone was not born then or was too little or was even older but did not spiritually pick up on, feel, and hear MJ through the spiritual realm, by God's divine assistance...then they can no longer see themselves as MJ's LITD girl...the one he asked God for years and years ago.

Right?

Look, I can take this test myself as an example:

Even though I was around, alive, and doing my thing in the 80's, I most certainly did not ever pick up on MJ connecting with or trying to connect with me in any spiritual way...therefore, if it is shown through the lyrics that he did have this going on with his LITD girl back in the 80's, then I am not the LITD girl.

See how this works?

[Lisha]

If, FT, you can then support in lyrics in here, about the Two Way happening in the eighties, then you would help many who have hoped they were MJ's LITD girl to stop thinking they were. And I can already think of a few songs with lyrics from the 80's that could very well support it; and they have been mentioned before in this thread. But I post too much in here already and I wish for others to contribute these things. :) I'll take a break and defer to others.

[Favoritetune]

why am i thinking of linda right now are you around?

no breaks lisha. you want me to pick out songs that support mj having a litdg connection in the 80s to help women here realize it aint them? i aint even gonna try to convince anyone that, help or nothing. none of that. they'll try to feed me peas or something if i even thought of it. lips closed and shaking my head saying no way.

[Ashtanga]

http://www.gifanatics.com/files/Jackson_popcorn.gif :shifty:

[8701girl]

I'll join in on the :popcorn: too :)

[Lisha]

you want me to pick out songs that support mj having a litdg connection in the 80s to help women here realize it aint them? i aint even gonna try to convince anyone that, help or nothing. none of that. they'll try to feed me peas or something if i even thought of it. lips closed and shaking my head saying no way.


FT...

COWARD!!!

I'm only kiddin', but you were saying in quite a few posts that it could be a good idea in here to talk about the lyrics for those who think they might be the LITD girl to see if they align with them or not. And I thought, "Here we go. This is something clearcut...either they had a Two Way spiritual connection in the eighties with MJ or not, and then they'll know."

Isn't that what you wanted? And I guess for their own sakes? ...For them to find something in the lyrics that woud show them they could not be the LITD girl because they don't "match?"

Did I understand you wrong?

[Favoritetune]

first i'm gonna write real quick no that aint what i wanted and then i'm gonna come back an edit in my reason why

edit here

okay i think if a person wants to realize that they will on their own. i think its probably an incredibly hard thing to feel that way about someone for a litdg and those who want to be that girl but arent and i don't want to hurt anyone. i'm not a coward i'm considerate. i was just saying if some lady wanted to figure that out she could look at his songs and that could help some realize its not them and maybe another lucky guy will get a chance with them, thats all im saying, mj has a lot of wonderful women who care a lot for him and even though if as we think God planned and purposed a divine love for him to be with as a real true love its up to each woman to realize shes not the one or if she is the one but there's just one or else it wouldnt be so divine. i'm sure mj had love for all of his fans and some of them knew his love on some level and he theirs but as for him having a love so wonderful that its undisputably divine and a gift from God then a lady who is wanting to know will either see that she is or she aint. please no peas



hey ash i like those eyes of yours looking side to side, 8701 don't hog the popcorn

[Lisha]

^ *Twiddles thumbs*

(Hey, Ash, I watched The Muppets movie last night. It was SO good seeing Kermy again. He is so sweet and kind to everyone. And everytime I hear him sing Rainbow Connection I get tears in my eyes (LOVE that song!).

In a minute I'm going to watch the flick, Hugo. Hope it's good. It seems like it might be a fantasy adventure.)



EDIT: FT, *stops twiddling thumbs cause you've posted, or edited your post, I mean*

Please know I was kidding about the coward thing, just playing off your post. Maybe it was too bold of a joke.

I'm glad you wouldn't want to hurt anyone. I like it when people post in here who do not want to hurt anyone.

~ movie time!

[Favoritetune]

lisha i think the posts people make in this thread will either help some girl feel like she's not crazy if she is the litdg or will help one see shes not the litdg and i think all you ladies have done a great job at sharing what you think about those songs that mj did a great job of singing. enjoy your movie tell kermie hi

80's love songs the ones that comes to my mind that mj wrote are i just can't stop loving you and the girl is mine.

[MJzPrincess1982]

what is the movie? I am so lost. why does this thread always go off topic??

[Magicgirl]

There are 2 films connected as I think with this theme, I enjoyed both, it's Monkeybone and The Artist.

[Favoritetune]

girl are you crazy? how are you gonna compare mjs divine love with some movie about bringing a monkey to life? that sounds sick to me and i haven't seen the movie so i don't have a clue of what you are talking about but i will say this that it sounds twisted and you got your mind on something other than God, mj and his litdg.

i think what's going on with mj and the lady he's been writing about has got to be from God and he's wrote songs concerning that. love is wonderful and it is good for people in this world to believe in. one of the problems with the world is everybody wants what God meant for someone else and some stop at nothing in efforts of efforts of trying to get it or them. people don't respect love, they don't wait for love and when they see what God has created as love they covet it and try to destroy it but how can someone love another person and try to destroy love in their life. they can't when it's from God they'd sooner destroy their own self.

michael's life may seem like a cartoon but God is michael's God and God loved him, heard his prayers, watched over him and let him know im sure His will for mjs life. love and all nand the only monkeys in mjs life were the people he had around pretending to be his friend when in actuality they were coniving and diabolic but peoples true colors always come shining through and someday they'll have to gaze at their own reflection in the mirror.

but tell me just in case that's not what you're implying what do you mean by the movies you posted? help us to understand where you're coming from




There are 2 films connected as I think with this theme, I enjoyed both, it's Monkeybone and The Artist.

[MysteriousPhoenix]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/5e2jx4Q0sUs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
*****

[Magicgirl]

girl are you crazy? how are you gonna compare mjs divine love with some movie about bringing a monkey to life? that sounds sick to me and i haven't seen the movie so i don't have a clue of what you are talking about but i will say this that it sounds twisted and you got your mind on something other than God, mj and his litdg.

i think what's going on with mj and the lady he's been writing about has got to be from God and he's wrote songs concerning that. love is wonderful and it is good for people in this world to believe in. one of the problems with the world is everybody wants what God meant for someone else and some stop at nothing in efforts of efforts of trying to get it or them. people don't respect love, they don't wait for love and when they see what God has created as love they covet it and try to destroy it but how can someone love another person and try to destroy love in their life. they can't when it's from God they'd sooner destroy their own self.

michael's life may seem like a cartoon but God is michael's God and God loved him, heard his prayers, watched over him and let him know im sure His will for mjs life. love and all nand the only monkeys in mjs life were the people he had around pretending to be his friend when in actuality they were coniving and diabolic but peoples true colors always come shining through and someday they'll have to gaze at their own reflection in the mirror.

but tell me just in case that's not what you're implying what do you mean by the movies you posted? help us to understand where you're coming from

just watch the movie till the end, that's all.

[Lisha]

MP, I'm so enjoying these Barry Manilow tunes. This last one has lyrics that really talk about what we were for a bit discussing, and that is MJ wanting to touch his LITD girl and longing to be with her, but for some reason...can't. I wanted to last night respond to your others posts and some other people's, but I got sidetracked and this thread is now kinda hard to keep up wth. So I hope posters won't feel overlooked or rejected if we can't always acknowlege their posts.


All right, FT, listen (since you were how I got sidetracked). I asked you if that was what you wanted, meaning for those who are not the LITD girl to see in the lyrics that they are not "her." I also suggested that you wanted this for these gals "own sake." And you answered me, "That is not what I want" and one of the things in your response to explain how it is not what you want, you put this:


.... i was just saying if some lady wanted to figure that out she could look at his songs and that could help some realize its not them and maybe another lucky guy will get a chance with them, thats all im saying

Which sounds like you would want them to see that they are not the LITD girl through the posts and lyrics, so they can give some nice guy in their life a chance, and that would be for their own sake, instead of waiting on a dream that won't come true. Right?

and you also added this:


lisha, i think the posts people make in this thread will either help some girl feel like she's not crazy if she is the litdg or will help one see shes not the litdg. 80's love songs the ones that comes to my mind that mj wrote are i just can't stop loving you and the girl is mine.
So it still seems to me it is what you want to happen through this thread. And, again, I thought if we found some things in the lyrics to support a specific thing that only the true LITD girl could match with then, what you want as you've stated above, could happen. And only one person could have had a Two Way spiritual interaction with MJ in the 80's, I should think, and so it is a good thing to use as support in lyrics for this cause.

And yes, I Just Can't Stop Loving You, is an obvious one, but I think you brought up another that STATEofSHOCK liked to use as well to support this idea, and that is the more obscure original lyrics in P.Y.T. and yes, the "girl" coming in through the bathroom window and "visiting" the guy in Centipede has a similar feel to those lyrics in P.Y.T. You and SoS are surprisingly in step. And I have thought that before.



then a lady who is wanting to know will either see that she is or she aint.

This is key. Do many in this situaton WANT to see? And this is the real concern. How many fans throughout MJ's career have thought they were destined to marry MJ? Some even feeling God told them this was so. And now after he is gone many might be believing deep within themsleves that they are the one MJ belonged with and they are his LITD girl. They can't be right, though, for only one girl can be "the one." So this is what is sadly known as delusion.

Because I know how illusionary online life is, for it is hard to know what is real and what is pretense, and even for offline as well, for there can be duplicity going on anywhere, I daily pray to God for Him to protect my mind from fantasy, and delusional thinking. One obvious scripture that can be prayed is; to cast down anything that would set itself up against the knowledge of God, and take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ (2 Cor 10:5), and the simple praying against "vain imaginings" or falling into any "folly/fantasy" is a good idea. The battlefield is in the mind. We have to fight to keep our minds on whatever is true, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, etc. If we don't, we can be sucked into a delusion...anyone is susceptible.

You say the LITD girl could be kept from thinking she is crazy from the posts in here; I think if she doesn't protect her mind, she will more likely think she IS crazy from reading the posts in here, for a lot of what's unreal, and pure fiction, and delusion and deception visits regularly in this thread, and it is very hard to sort through. A lot of game playing and personal agendas go on in here. If the LITD girl knows God and has gotten to the place where she hears His voice fairly accurately (like we think MJ did), then she will do better to check in with her God and what He is saying to her, than base her beliefs in what goes on in this thread or how anyone interprets the lyrics.


There are 2 films connected as I think with this theme, I enjoyed both, it's Monkeybone and The Artist.
Do you mention The Artist because it is a romance going on between two people with a strong chemistry, that took years before they finally got together? And do you mention Monkeybones because the main character has a series of events that cause him to have the ability to travel in the spiritual realm to see and visit others and it also is a long time with opposition occuring inbetween before he and the girl he loves get togehter? (I have not seen either film but did read up a little on them).


girl are you crazy? how are you gonna compare mjs divine love with some movie about bringing a monkey to life? that sounds sick to me and i haven't seen the movie so i don't have a clue of what you are talking about but i will say this that it sounds twisted and you got your mind on something other than God, mj and his litdg.
Ooooookay now, FT, was this theatrics and a purposely overblown reaction or was this for real?


I think what's going on with mj and the lady he's been writing about has got to be from God and he's wrote songs concerning that. love is wonderful and it is good for people in this world to believe in. one of the problems with the world is everybody wants what God meant for someone else and some stop at nothing in efforts of efforts of trying to get it or them. people don't respect love, they don't wait for love and when they see what God has created as love they covet it and try to destroy it but how can someone love another person and try to destroy love in their life. they can't when it's from God they'd sooner destroy their own self.
Do you have a bone to pick with someone in particular? You are coming off like this hits you a little too personally.


michael's life may seem like a cartoon but God is michael's God and God loved him, heard his prayers, watched over him and let him know im sure His will for mjs life. love and all nand the only monkeys in mjs life were the people he had around pretending to be his friend when in actuality they were coniving and diabolic but peoples true colors always come shining through and someday they'll have to gaze at their own reflection in the mirror. Wow. Well, hmmm, I'm sure you are very right about this: God loved MJ and MJ loved God. And God could have let MJ know clearly these things you mention, but not too many see that clearly from God. Is this still you reacting to Magicgirl's suggestion of a comparison between The Monkeybone and MJ's and the LITD girl's situation? I don't think anyone is calling MJ a monkey or that he is being reduced to some cartoon character. Is something else going on that I'm missing?


but tell me just in case that's not what you're implying what do you mean by the movies you posted? help us to understand where you're coming fromOh. Now that softens things. That was nice that you put this. :)

I think I might have mentioned before in this thread that I don't like being taken for a ride, and FT, I think you are a little bit into taking others for a ride. Where are you taking us?

[Favoritetune]

how was kermie lisha?

when i said it wasn't what i wanted i meant that i don't want to be the one to tell some ladies that i would hope for their sake they would know on their own. for their peace of mind i would want that for them. and yes if they wanted to know the truth they could see it.

when i said this thread would probably help the litdg i meant the fact that if so she was thinking she was getting messages from songs then others picking up on that would probably make her feel less crazy cause you gotta admit it's different.

as for that movie, first off the title itself seemed odd and when i saw a short clip of it and the craziness of the cartoon it just seemed like a big joke or something wrong and that's why i asked what the persons intentions were cause only a mirror of self shows what's in a persons mind or heart. it just didn't sit right with me. magic girls response is just watch the whole movie so seems like she's dodging sharing what's in her mind and heart and hiding. but i'm already thinking comparing some whacked out monkey movie to love is odd and without a real incentive i don't see a reason to watch it. Lisha you make it sound kind of interesting though but i'd need to know more about it before i waste my time. i imagine i probably would have enjoyed the movie had i seen it before someone compared it to the best love story i ever heard. i mean between a man and a woman in our day and time. mj influenced so many people in such wonderful ways imagine how great it would be if he helped people to believe in love again and to see that it was real and worth waiting. most guys will just get what they can get and girls just yall just don't know what this world has come to as my grandma use to say.

Lisha why you think i'm taking folks for a ride?

MP barry manilow is an incredible song writer. thanks for sharing that.


MP, I'm so enjoying these Barry Manilow tunes. This last one has lyrics that really talk about what we were for a bit discussing, and that is MJ wanting to touch his LITD girl and longing to be with her, but for some reason...can't. I wanted to last night respond to your others posts and some other people's, but I got sidetracked and this thread is now kinda hard to keep up wth. So I hope posters won't feel overlooked or rejected if we can't always acknowlege their posts.


All right, FT, listen (since you were how I got sidetracked). I asked you if that was what you wanted, meaning for those who are not the LITD girl to see in the lyrics that they are not "her." I also suggested that you wanted this for these gals "own sake." And you answered me, "That is not what I want" and one of the things in your response to explain how it is not what you want, you put this:



Which sounds like you would want them to see that they are not the LITD girl through the posts and lyrics, so they can give some nice guy in their life a chance, and that would be for their own sake, instead of waiting on a dream that won't come true. Right?

and you also added this:


So it still seems to me it is what you want to happen through this thread. And, again, I thought if we found some things in the lyrics to support a specific thing that only the true LITD girl could match with then, what you want as you've stated above, could happen. And only one person could have had a Two Way spiritual interaction with MJ in the 80's, I should think, and so it is a good thing to use as support in lyrics for this cause.

And yes, I Just Can't Stop Loving You, is an obvious one, but I think you brought up another that STATEofSHOCK liked to use as well to support this idea, and that is the more obscure original lyrics in P.Y.T. and yes, the "girl" coming in through the bathroom window and "visiting" the guy in Centipede has a similar feel to those lyrics in P.Y.T. You and SoS are surprisingly in step. And I have thought that before.



This is key. Do many in this situaton WANT to see? And this is the real concern. How many fans throughout MJ's career have thought they were destined to marry MJ? Some even feeling God told them this was so. And now after he is gone many might be believing deep within themsleves that they are the one MJ belonged with and they are his LITD girl. They can't be right, though, for only one girl can be "the one." So this is what is sadly known as delusion.

Because I know how illusionary online life is, for it is hard to know what is real and what is pretense, and even for offline as well, for there can be duplicity going on anywhere, I daily pray to God for Him to protect my mind from fantasy, and delusional thinking. One obvious scripture that can be prayed is; I cast down every imagiination that would set itself up against the knowledge of God, and the simple praying against "vain imaginings" or falling into any "folly/fantasy" is a good idea. The battlefield is in the mind. We have to fight to keep our minds on whatever is true, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, etc. If we don't, we can be sucked into a delusion...anyone is susceptible.

You say the LITD girl could be kept from thinking she is crazy from the posts in here; I think if she doesn't protect her mind, she will more likely think she IS crazy from reading the posts in here, for a lot of what's unreal, and pure fiction, and delusion and deception visits regularly in this thread, and it is very hard to sort through. A lot of game playing and personal agendas go on in here. If the LITD girl knows God and has gotten to the place where she hears His voice fairly accurately (like we think MJ did), then she will do better to check in with her God and what He is saying to her, than base her beliefs in what goes on in this thread or how anyone interprets the lyrics.


Do you mention The Artist because it is a romance going on between two people with a strong chemistry, that took years before they finally got together? And do you mention Monkeybones because the main character has a series of events that cause him to have the ability to travel in the spiritual realm to see and visit others and it also is a long time with opposition occuring inbetween before he and the girl he loves get togehter? (I have not seen either film but did read up a little on them).

Ooooookay now, FT, was this theatrics and a purposely overblown reaction or was this for real?


Do you have a bone to pick with someone in particular? You are coming off like this hits you a little too personally.

Wow. Well, hmmm, I'm sure you are very right about this: God loved MJ and MJ loved God. And God could have let MJ know clearly these things you mention, but not too many see that clearly from God. Is this still you reacting to Magicgirl's suggestion of a comparison between The Monkeybone and MJ's and the LITD girl's situation? I don't think anyone is calling MJ a monkey or that he is being reduced to some cartoon character. Is something else going on that I'm missing?

Oh. Now that softens things. That was nice that you put this. :)

I think I might have mentioned before in this thread that I don't like being taken for a ride, and FT, I think you are a little bit into taking others for a ride. Where are you taking us?

[Lisha]

Lisha why you think i'm taking folks for a ride?

Because I already know of you having another account you used in here, and too many of your thoughts in here sound like SoS's.

This, for example, sounds exactly like SoS:


i imagine i probably would have enjoyed the movie had i seen it before someone compared it to the best love story i ever heard.

and this below is something she had said more than once in here, too. (you have to understand I have read through this thread a few times and things can be familiar sounding to me)


when i said this thread would probably help the litdg i meant the fact that if so she was thinking she was getting messages from songs that others are picking up on that would probably make her feel less crazy

Your persona in here has often felt "put on" to me.

Forgive me if I am totally wrong, but I am just explaining where I am coming from here. You should know me by now that I'd be honest.



how was kermie lisha?

I watched the movie with Kermit two nights ago. Last night I watched Hugo. I think Kermy would have seemed out of place in that film. I already posted that Kermy in The Muppets was so nice to everyone in the film, and that I loved him singing The Rainbow Connection.

[Favoritetune]

I am not SoS, i use to post here as Itsjustmenothim but one time i tried to log in and couldnt. i'm not trying to take you ladies on a ride i'm just being me and yes sometimes im a little silly and sometimes a little serious up in here but if you knew me you'd know i'm still being me. that may seem put on to you but i guess on a message board its hard to totally be yourself. doing my best though for the most to be me. youre getting most of my stupid attempts at being funny side. sorry it seems put on.

someone getting messages in a song come on, you gotta admit the whole concept sounds otherworldy. when men hardly will pick up a pen and write a poem for you ladies i mean come on. chivalry aint dead but it's like mangled on the floor. so mj raised the bar. but on the real i'm not trying to take nobody on a ride just kicking back and enjoying listening to the concepts of the songs. people ask me this or that i usually answer. no malice. no rides.

never saw hugo

hope were cool

goodnight ladies


Because I already know of you having another account you used in here, and too many of your thoughts in here sound like SoS's.

This, for example, sounds exactly like SoS:



and this below is something she had said more than once in here, too. (you have to understand I have read through this thread a few times and things can be familiar sounding to me)



Your persona in here has often felt "put on" to me.

Forgive me if I am totally wrong, but I am just explaining where I am coming from here. You should know me by now that I'd be honest.



I watched the movie with Kermit two nights ago. Last night I watched Hugo. I think Kermy would have seemed out of place in that film. I already posted that Kermy in The Muppets was so nice to everyone in the film, and that I loved him singing The Rainbow Connection.

[Lisha]

^ Oh. So you were trying to be funny in the way you responded to Magicgirl regarding the Monkeybone thing? I thought you were serious.

Several things you have said echo SoS's thoughts that she has shared. But if you say you are not SoS, then I will leave it at that. But I hope you can understand why I might think it. And I'm glad you are not being "put on." I have just been discerning something since you've returned and I can't put my finger on it. But I have been praying about it. When you first came in the thread as " Itsjustmenothim" you were all nonchalant and came off like you stumbled on the thread by accident and were trying to figure out what it was all about. And when you posted as Itsjustmenothim it seemed you were really stretching to come up with things to share just to fit in sort of thing...but now you act like you are emotionally invested into this love story...and you haven't even been in here that much.

Are you and SoS in communication with each other or something, and that is why you share so many of her views...because you talk a lot?

Anyway, I don't mean any malice to you either...things just are not making sense for me. I do apologize if I have been out of line in anyway through my honesty, though.

It just seems different to me that a guy comes in here and posts and makes a statement like this, "...before someone compared it to the best love story i ever heard." No one even knows exactly yet what the love story is, if there is even one, and do guys normally get so into these things anyway? :scratch:

[andrea72]

There is a song that comes to mind that makes me think of MJ & his LITD girl.
Its by China Black, Searching, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZMX8_9C3p8

Searching lyrics

ad lib
You're mine
You're mine

You're mine......

Verse
Searching, for that something that I'll never find
In another place another time
Searching
For that something that I can believe
And without a doubt that I can see

Bridge
All the many roads I've travelled
None so far and none so much
It leads me back to you again

Verse
I'm searching
When I'm lost and need to find myself
Where this road will lead no one can tell

Searching
For that something that I've left behind
Make me see that I've been far too blind

repeat bridge

Coda
I've got a woman who loves me, baby. x 4 (ad lib)

Verse
Searching
For that something that I'll never find
In another place another time
Searching for that something that I left behind
Makes me see that I've been far too blind

repeat bridge

Coda II
You're mine (you're something, baby)
ad lib

[Favoritetune]

man you'd be surprised what guys get into. don't you think some of the people that never post are men? when you say "do guys normally get so into these things" that could keep a guy a guy away. as for Sos i remember her state of shock and maybe things she said sound like what i'm saying cause i read her posts, i've said hi to her here but that's been a while, if you're around what up Sos? glad your accepting i aint her and leaving it at that cause id hate to go round and round. thank you for real.

not sure how i came off before but i feel more comfortable now. thanks for making me feel that way


edit here
as for being vested girl i've read a lot of pages

see you online, you're cool with me Lisha

missed this part "the best love story i ever heard." No one even knows exactly yet what the love story is, if there is even one," if there aint then why are we all here? somethings going on his music and AllforMJ talked about his life that was for real. We may not know everything but id say his songs alone are great enough


^ Oh. So you were trying to be funny in the way you responded to Magicgirl regarding the Monkeybone thing? I thought you were serious.

Several things you have said echo SoS's thoughts that she has shared. But if you say you are not SoS, then I will leave it at that. But I hope you can understand why I might think it. And I'm glad you are not being "put on." I have just been discerning something since you've returned and I can't put my finger on it. But I have been praying about it. When you first came in the thread as " Itsjustmenothim" you were all nonchalant and came off like you stumbled on the thread by accident and were trying to figure out what it was all about. And when you posted as Itsjustmenothim it seemed you were really stretching to come up with things to share just to fit in sort of thing...but now you act like you are emotionally invested into this love story...and you haven't even been in here that much.

Are you and SoS in communication with each other or something, and that is why you share so many of her views...because you talk a lot?

Anyway, I don't mean any malice to you either...things just are not making sense for me. I do apologize if I have been out of line in anyway through my honesty, though.

It just seems different to me that a guy comes in here and posts and makes a statement like this, "...before someone compared it to the best love story i ever heard." No one even knows exactly yet what the love story is, if there is even one, and do guys normally get so into these things anyway? :scratch:

[Favoritetune]

the way this lady rights and the heart that mj puts in his songs and the story line behind them is what makes it the best

Allformj where you at girl?

I see you Sos! you been lurking?


(Four-page post originally posted on 5/18/08. Updated to five pages today)

In 1995, he released “Stranger In Moscow.” It’s a song that describes how he felt after being betrayed in the worst way possible. The song begins with the sound of rain pouring down before he sings...

I was wandering in the rain
(Mask of life feelin' insane)
Swift and sudden fall from grace

(Sunny days seem far away)
Kremlin's shadow belittlin' me
(Stalin's tomb won't let me be)

On and on and on it came
(Wish the rain would just let me be)

(How does it feel)
How does it feel
(How does it feel)
(How does it feel)
When you're alone
And you're cold inside

Notice how he was wandering in the rain…how sunny days seemed far away…how he wished the rain would let him be…and how he felt alone and cold inside.

The rain signifies days of dreariness. It was the start of a storm. Feeling alone and cold inside means he felt deserted and unloved.

He released “Invincible” in 2001. It’s an album about people trying to break him; unfulfilling relationships; the desire to be intimate; being taken away from love; being stalked by those that write bad stories about him; feeling like his voice wasn’t being heard; his concern about missing children; his concern about the state of the world; and being unjustly viewed as a threat. But, within all of this, there was also a song about things eventually getting better.

In 2002, not long after he released “Invincible,” the ’93 court document describing the details of the lie that started his plight, surfaced out of thin air. It caused the media to behave like it had finally found a valid reason to attack him relentlessly. But at the same time, something else was taking place. He was starting to show he was no longer accepting mistreatment. He was engaged in a battle with the CEO of his record label. Something about him was different. He was no longer looking as weary as he did in ‘01. He even had a sweet smile on his face in a photo that was taken of him the day he spoke to an audience about the unfair treatment of recording artists. It’s like he was happy that he was in a fighting mood.

In early 2003, more misfortune came his way. Something that was meant to be informative, fun, and entertaining, turned into something grueling and malicious. It added to the pressure and pain that he had already endured for so long. It was the wickedly edited documentary that was given the title “Living With Michael Jackson.” Because of this sham of a documentary, the storm of ’93 was now starting to merge with a brand new storm.

He released “Number Ones” in October of the same year. On this album was a brand new love song entitled, “One More Chance.” It is one of 18 tracks. The song begins with him singing…

Uh-huh…alright
This time, I’m gonna do my best to make it right
Can't go on without you by my side, hold on
Shelter, come and rescue me out of this storm
To get out of this cold, I need some warmth

In the above verse, it seems like he had made a vow that he was going to strongly stand up for himself this time, which is why he had said, “This time, I’m gonna do my best to make it right.” But, he was also telling his lady confidant that he wanted her with him while he was doing it. Also, in the chorus he is plainly saying what he needed in order to do it. He was saying, "All I need is one more chance at love."

He was most likely asking for love because it's warm. Warmth combats cold. Love combats hate. Love provides strength. He told her, “To get out of this cold, I need some warmth.” It seems that he was still feeling cold inside from ’93, but he was now ready to break free of being publicly scorned, and was also ready to finally bring to an end what was causing his pain.

Page 1 of 5

[SoS]

:busted: well goodness gracious all I was trying to do was lurk in peace hay there FT howya doin' and why is queen_g/Shila/Lisha giving u such a hard time I'm not AllforMJ but Hay everybody … hope all are well! I just cannot get into this thread and post like I once did and since I have been called out and in this most bizarre context I have no choice but to come out of “lurkdom”, and respond but just so you know….lurking works better for me due to my sadly limited time, and is just as well that I, at this time have no song analyses to share, just for the record. With that said, and I’ll have to make this as brief as I can, I have a question ………… queen_g, I mean Shila…I mean Lisha …Please help me out here. it seems u r saying u have cornered the market on changing your name a billion times and we're all obligated to trust you and your motives but other folks get the squint eye ...is that basically what u're saying here? on another note, cureiously, what meanings are you assigning to my previous postings that you would feel the need to compare them with someone else’s like you are with FT? What do u mean by someone 'echoing' SoS, What if I and someone else do seem to think similiarly about a topic then..>> so what? I don’t get it. That is not unusual in a discussion thread, in fact it is par for the course doncha think? Why are you even making it sound like a “bad” thing? Or even a “thing” at all??? and queen_g, I mean Shila? I mean Lisha – don’t you remember that “Love Story” is EXACTLY the phrase everyone has always used as they've referred to this “LITD” "theory", beginning with AllForMJ, continuing with (I'll leave some out ...so sorry!! this is SO rushed!) Moddie, Linda, MP, Shabuya I think, Mystygirl, MysteryGirl777, Sdjeis, MiMik and the whole gang of us so I am now confused by what u could mean by making it sound like something “foreign” when FT refers to it as such ? What is that about??? I can only suppose it is because you are desperately missing my “books”. :sigh: Please no PMs. I have no ability to respond. :blush: :unsure: :scratch: Good to see everyone by the way :hiya: God Bless

[Favoritetune]

i hope you two don't start arguing

good to see you sos and thanks for stepping out of the lurks

[Lisha]

Hey, yeah, Im cool with you, FT, I'm just being watchful, which is my way...especially in here. And like Ape and I said, it's truly nice having a male perspective. :yes: And maybe you have a point that my words about "why a guy would get so caught up here" would deter guys from coming in, and that's not a good thing, true. I hadn't looked at it in that way.

You know, when you entered the scene recently, I thought of those lyrics in the song you posted, Someone Put Your Hand Out, where MJ sings,

I'll be your story hero

And I was thinking to myself at the time,

"You know, Favoritetune is being like our story hero in here, by coming in this thread, at this time when two posters in here are causing some hassle, and posting an "old-fashined kind of post, just like the ones on lyrics from the ol' days... to help get things back on track :)"

Thanks for beng so timely and being the hero like that for us in here, FT.

And andrea72,


There is a song that comes to mind that makes me think of MJ & his LITD girl.
Its by China Black, Searching, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZMX8_9C3p8

IZMX8_9C3p8

This song is great for here based on the lyrics. Nice find. Thanks! Hm, 1994 tune, huh? Is it a cover? And thank you for posting the lyrics, too!

And...

[QUOTE=Favoritetune;3614102].
...people don't respect love, they don't wait for love and when they see what God has created as love they covet it and try to destroy it but how can someone love another person and try to destroy love in their life. they can't when it's from God they'd sooner destroy their own self.


This is confusing....um, first I thought you were speaking of people in the world in general, then I was waiting for it to relate to in here, then you brought up coveting, and then this last bit...trying to destroy...

So are you talking about someone trying to destroy MJ's chances at love? Or was this maybe all brought on due to Lainy's brief mention in her post about someone doing -anything- to be married to MJ and basically not letting anything stop them?

I'm just wondering if you are connecting this to MJ and the LITD girl in some way.

I'd like to discuss this "covet" thing a little more, I have some thoughts on the subject, but I will first wait for clarity on what you said in this, quite jam-packed, little paragraph. :nerd: <-- this is a cute smiley, I don't think I've ever used it before!




EDIT: Oh goodie!!! SoS and I get to fight! Hey, you WOULD post while I was posting so now I have to edit in my response...gaaaahhhh!

And, I'm quite pleased I got you to POST! :tease:

And, this here chick, Lisha, Shila, queen______________g, and you forgot, Lashi...well, this here chick has told you what her real name is, so I hardly think you should have a prob with my user names. You know I'm for real.

And, I make big deals out of all kinds of things, you know that, too. :)

And, I was just being honest about my observations with FT, and I stand by what I said...they were "uncomfortably" familiar sounding to me. Take it as you may.

But, I'm glad you stopped by and posted your two cents!!! And we do miss your books!

[Favoritetune]

"Thanks for beng so timely and being the hero like that for us in here, FT." you are very welcome and any of you ladies wanting to thank me may do so with some of that choclate covered popcorn.

i just wrote whatever came to my mind, it was all about people not respecting love and different things men and women do in their disrespect to love. ever heard a player ask for your number when your boyfriends out of town? disrespect. some of my homies do that mess and its wrong


Hey, yeah, Im cool with you, FT, I'm just being watchful, which is my way...especially in here. And like Ape and I said, it's truly nice having a male perspective. :yes: And maybe you have a point that my words about "why a guy would get so caught up here" would deter guys from coming in, and that's not a good thing, true. I hadn't looked at it in that way.

You know, when you entered the scene recently, I thought of those lyrics in the song you posted, Someone Put Your Hand Out, where MJ sings,

I'll be your story hero

And I was thinking to myself at the time,

"You know, Favoritetune is being like our story hero in here, by coming in this thread, at this time when two posters in here are causing some hassle, and posting an "old-fashined kind of post, just like the ones on lyrics from the ol' days... to help get things back on track :)"

Thanks for beng so timely and being the hero like that for us in here, FT.

And andrea72,

[QUOTE=andrea72;3614504]There is a song that comes to mind that makes me think of MJ & his LITD girl.
Its by China Black, Searching, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZMX8_9C3p8

IZMX8_9C3p8

This song is great for here based on the lyrics. Nice find. Thanks! Hm, 1994 tune, huh? Is it a cover? And thank you for posting the lyrics, too!

And...



This is confusing....um, first I thought you were speaking of people in the world in general, then I was waiting for it to relate to in here, then you brought up coveting, and then this last bit...trying to destroy...

So are you talking about someone trying to destroy MJ's chances at love? Or was this maybe all brought on due to Lainy's brief mention in her post about someone doing -anything- to be married to MJ and basically not letting anything stop them?

I'm just wondering if you are connecting this to MJ and the LITD girl in some way.

I'd like to discuss this "covet" thing a little more, I have some thoughts on the subject, but I will first wait for clarity on what you said in this, quite jam-packed, little paragraph. :nerd: <-- this is a cute smiley, I don't think I've ever used it before!

[Favoritetune]

sorry ladies made my last post twice

Lisha that video says its not available and you may have to wait a few minutes if you just up loaded it

and when did lainy make a post and i miss it?

Sos i know you here now so don't be so quiet. who else is hiding in the lurks

[Favoritetune]

Great posts Allformj we all love and appreciate your writing


After the sham of a documentary touched off a brand new media storm, I think he knew deep down inside things were going to get worse…like he felt he was going to have an even harder time trying to convince the public that he’s been innocent all along. The below verse shows he had a gut feeling things were going to get worse, but I don't think he was able to tell exactly when. And it sure doesn't seem like he was expecting anything like what happened the following month after he had released his new song and CD. There's no way he would have started shooting a video if he knew all hell was about to break loose in the manner that it did.

Searching for that one who’s gonna make me whole
Help me make these mysteries unfold, hold on
Lightning about to strike and rain only on me
It hurt so bad, sometimes it’s hard to breathe

Notice that he is saying he’s searching for her. But also notice that he’s searching for her at the same time he’s expecting more rain to come along with a lightning strike.

Because of what he says in this next verse, it seems like he had told himself he was going to pursue her love no matter what.

And I will walk around this world to find her
And I don’t care what it takes, no, why

Notice that he put emphasis on “And I don’t care what it takes…” Also notice that he ends the song singing the words, “I can’t stop loving you.” This shows his determination to persevere.

Not only did his new glow in 2002 give a hint that he was having feelings for someone, and not only did the words of “One More Chance” reveal he was in love before the trial that had put his inner strength to the test, but the way he laid out the tracks of his “Number Ones” CD also pointed to a clue that he was in love.

There are 18 tracks on the “Number Ones” CD. All of the tracks are in chronological order, except one. The song at the end of the CD should have been the first song listed. And notice that it followed "One More Chance." The last song listed is “Ben,” and it’s the version where he’s singing in his mature voice, not his kid voice.

Although "Ben" was originally about a pet, it is the only song on the CD that says, "I used to say, I and me, now it's us, now it's we." It also says, "The two of us need look no more. We both found what we were looking for." This is where he’s telling her she’s the one for him, and he’s the one for her.

Fortunately, his friend had come into in his life before the madness had reached its peak. He had already fallen in love with her as well. It’s being revealed at the end of “One More Chance.”

The late night comedians going full throttle with their twisted jokes about child molestation was a sign of the madness increasing. It was their ill-chosen way of taking advantage of the situation created by the wickedly edited documentary. It was comedy at its worst.

In addition to this, the world later witnessed a shameful press conference that was conducted like a Broadway show gone wrong. This bizarre press conference was the first of its kind. It was also the very first indicator that the DA’s case was bogus and built on multiple lies. What DA would laugh about being in pursuit of a so-called predator? Not the honorable DA’s. Not the upstanding ones. But still, the case went forward, bogus and all, even after the DA was advised to drop it.

In 2004, the year that MJ was hit with two different sets of counts after being unduly charged, another love song was released that mentioned his needs. This song that came out later that year was “Fall Again.” In this song, his needs were very specific.

* I need you around for every day to start
* I need your love in my life
* I need us to carry on

Notice that he said "us." Also notice that he says this…

There’s something about you
I stare in your eyes
Everything I’m looking for, I seem to find

He sings the word “something” in a way that shows he was beginning to really check her out. It’s like he started noticing things about her that he hadn’t noticed right away…like it was just starting to dawn on him.

Page 2 of 5

[8701girl]

earching
For that something that I'll never find
In another place another time
Searching for that something that I left behind
Makes me see that I've been far too blind


That verse in particular makes me think that maybe cuz of michael's schedule of his music career he had to leave his LITD girl behind and had to somehow deal with her not being around him all the time

[MJzPrincess1982]

Some of you gals make me giggle lol :P

[SoS]

In 2002 MJ was in process of producing his baby :yes: That is an upswing moment for a guy like MJ. How could it not be.

[MJzPrincess1982]

Producing what baby o_O

[Lisha]

Producing what baby o_O

This is for SoS:


The youngest of his three.


:)

[Magicgirl]

how was kermie lisha?

when i said it wasn't what i wanted i meant that i don't want to be the one to tell some ladies that i would hope for their sake they would know on their own. for their peace of mind i would want that for them. and yes if they wanted to know the truth they could see it.

when i said this thread would probably help the litdg i meant the fact that if so she was thinking she was getting messages from songs then others picking up on that would probably make her feel less crazy cause you gotta admit it's different.

as for that movie, first off the title itself seemed odd and when i saw a short clip of it and the craziness of the cartoon it just seemed like a big joke or something wrong and that's why i asked what the persons intentions were cause only a mirror of self shows what's in a persons mind or heart. it just didn't sit right with me. magic girls response is just watch the whole movie so seems like she's dodging sharing what's in her mind and heart and hiding. but i'm already thinking comparing some whacked out monkey movie to love is odd and without a real incentive i don't see a reason to watch it. Lisha you make it sound kind of interesting though but i'd need to know more about it before i waste my time. i imagine i probably would have enjoyed the movie had i seen it before someone compared it to the best love story i ever heard. i mean between a man and a woman in our day and time. mj influenced so many people in such wonderful ways imagine how great it would be if he helped people to believe in love again and to see that it was real and worth waiting. most guys will just get what they can get and girls just yall just don't know what this world has come to as my grandma use to say.

Lisha why you think i'm taking folks for a ride?

MP barry manilow is an incredible song writer. thanks for sharing that.

It's maybe vague, but it is in the movie. It's hard to tell because it is more on a feeling level. I just got a feeling that some episodes of the film, not the whole movie, have a connection. In the movie the man who was in coma and locked in his mind in a dreamworld all the time tried to reach his girl through her dreams, at the end he asked Death to let him go for 1 day to be able to tell her what he was trying to tell. The movie is really funny, especially the last part with the sportsman, romantic as well when he finally gave her a ring. The part about the monkey... Monkey was somehow part of main character's personality which separated from him and started acting on his own, and the monkey prevented the main character from being with his girl. When I first read about the film I didn't want to watch it, but as I had nothing better to watch I have watched it and changed my mind about it.

[8701girl]

Producing what baby o_O

Blanket :)

[SoS]

the subject matter had a baby around that time. I've never seen a reason to assume anything about what was going on. The man was having a baby. Females actually have them ya know. :sigh: = happy moment in a man's life

[Lisha]

Oh boy, SoS. *sigh*

Maybe if you had worded it as "producing one of his babies" then MJzprincess would have probably thought, 'Oh, one of the three...I know who they are" and therefore, she might not have felt the need to ask,

"Producing what baby o_O "

Her response was worded, seems to me, like she thought there was some juicy secret she hadn't been aware of.

I personally thought just telling the fact of who the baby was you were meaning, would take that immediately away. I wanted to nip that in the bud.

So I feel maybe we both are a bit good at making a big deal out of nothing. Whatcha think, girl? :) No one posted an unauthorized photo of the boy...now that would have been different and against the rules.

BUT it is so good seeing you post!!! :flowers:

[MJzPrincess1982]

Blanket :)
Nooo, blanket was 'produced' in 2001 and born in Feb of 2002. Hence the confusion. He was BORN in 02

[MJzPrincess1982]

Oh boy, SoS. *sigh*

Maybe if you had worded it as "producing one of his babies" then MJzprincess would have probably thought, 'Oh, one of the three...I know who they are" and therefore, she might not have felt the need to ask,

"Producing what baby o_O "

Her response was worded, seems to me, like she thought there was some juicy secret she hadn't been aware of.

I personally thought just telling the fact of who the baby was you were meaning, would take that immediately away. I wanted to nip that in the bud.

So I feel maybe we both are a bit good at making a big deal out of nothing. Whatcha think, girl? :) No one posted an unauthorized photo of the boy...now that would have been different and against the rules.

BUT it is so good seeing you post!!! :flowers:
According to the letter, 4 kids and one produced in 02, sounds like FOUR

[Lisha]

Regardless of who the baby was, to get back on track...

what I believe SoS's point was...is considering that Michael is one who would be thrilled about another baby to have and to love, once learning one was on its way, he would understandably walk around noticably happy. And SoS, I believe, was responding to the post of AllForMJ's that Favoritetune just reposted, where AllForMJ says this:


Not only did his new glow in 2002 give a hint that he was having feelings for someone...

A coming-soon-baby, and after the arrival of said baby, might be another, or perhaps the only and true, reason MJ was seeming to glow in 2002.

Is that all you were trying to point out SoS?

[Ashtanga]

http://www.gifanatics.com/files/Jackson_popcorn.gif










hey ash i like those eyes of yours looking side to side

Thanks! :D :shifty:







I watched the movie with Kermit two nights ago. Last night I watched Hugo. I think Kermy would have seemed out of place in that film. I already posted that Kermy in The Muppets was so nice to everyone in the film, and that I loved him singing The Rainbow Connection.

I'm sure you loved Hugo. :wild:






^ *Twiddles thumbs*

(Hey, Ash, I watched The Muppets movie last night. It was SO good seeing Kermy again. He is so sweet and kind to everyone. And everytime I hear him sing Rainbow Connection I get tears in my eyes (LOVE that song!).

Kerminho.... :girl_sigh: :wub: I loved the movie. :heart:

[8701girl]

Nooo, blanket was 'produced' in 2001 and born in Feb of 2002. Hence the confusion. He was BORN in 02


According to the letter, 4 kids and one produced in 02, sounds like FOUR


Regardless of who the baby was, to get back on track...

what I believe SoS's point was...is considering that Michael is one who would be thrilled about another baby to have and to love, once learning one was on its way, he would understandably walk around noticably happy. And SoS, I believe, was responding to the post of AllForMJ's that Favoritetune just reposted, where AllForMJ says this:



A coming-soon-baby, and after the arrival of said baby, might be another, or perhaps the only and true, reason MJ was seeming to glow in 2002.

Is that all you were trying to point out SoS?

I dont think there was a fourth child after blanket

[SoS]

Edited my post for clarity. My point about personal names is that I thought it was agreed that we didn't want this thread reduced to a speculation thread per se as much as just an analysis of what we could discover via the music. That's all. I just thought it was agreed because this thread is different.

[SoS]

Nooo, blanket was 'produced' in 2001 and born in Feb of 2002. Hence the confusion. He was BORN in 02 He was born in 2002 = his dad was aglow in 2002. sry I should have combined the posts

[Ape]

(EDIT: oops, my other edit didn't work so I'll change some colours)

Some interesting parallels. I read the book from MJs close friend Frank Cascio and went back to the start of this thread to read. Most of the quotes at the start are from allformj's posts and the red ones are from Frank's book. I was going to fix them up and make sense but im tired and its past 5 am. no sleep yet. So you can all read and see if you see what I see.

" In early 2003, more misfortune came his way. Something that was meant to be informative, fun, and entertaining, turned into something grueling and malicious. It added to the pressure and pain that he had already endured for so long. It was the wickedly edited documentary that was given the title “Living With Michael Jackson.” Because of this sham of a documentary, the storm of ’93 was now starting to merge with a brand new storm.

He released “Number Ones” in October of the same year. On this album was a brand new love song entitled, “One More Chance.” It is one of 18 tracks. The song begins with him singing…

Uh-huh…alright
This time, I’m gonna do my best to make it right
Can't go on without you by my side, hold on
Shelter, come and rescue me out of this storm
To get out of this cold, I need some warmth

In the above verse, it seems like he had made a vow that he was going to strongly stand up for himself this time, which is why he had said, “This time, I’m gonna do my best to make it right.” But, he was also telling his lady confidant that he wanted her with him while he was doing it. Also, in the chorus he is plainly saying what he needed in order to do it. He was saying, "All I need is one more chance at love."

He was most likely asking for love because it's warm. Warmth combats cold. Love combats hate. Love provides strength. He told her, “To get out of this cold, I need some warmth.” It seems that he was still feeling cold inside from ’93, but he was now ready to break free of being publicly scorned, and was also ready to finally bring to an end what was causing his pain." -AllForMJ

"In early 2003, when I heard the song "You Are My Life" from his “Invincible” CD playing at the end of his "Private Home Movies," my first thought was that it was very sweet that it was chosen as the song to play while he was showing his children. I also felt it was very fitting. Yet, after the rest of the events played out in his life from there on up until the end of the trial, I noticed something else about the song and started seeing it in another way.

Many of the things mentioned in “You Are My Life” had come to fruition."

"When I now listen to “You Are My Life,” I see that it describes all the things he needed to get through a tough time that had not even occurred yet. This is why I now feel “You Are My Life” is prophetic. It is as equally prophetic as the song “Will You Be There.” The things about his friend comes through clearly as shown here in a summary of the lyrics of “You Are My Life.”

* He was once all alone
* He was lost in a world of strangers
* There was no one to trust
* She suddenly appeared [In “The Way You Love Me” he said she came in time]
* She took away the fear [He had to be courageous to stand up for himself]
* She brought him back to the light [If she brought him back to the light, she came to him in the dark]
* She gave him strength [He needed strength to get through the trial]
* She gave him hope [He needed hope to get through the trial]
* He’s singing the words “I love you” near the end of the song. He’s singing these three words in a strong tone as if he’s trying to make sure she understands just how much. [There’s a correlation between this and the way he was releasing beautiful love songs while he was defending himself in real life]
* She opened his eyes when he couldn’t see that love was always here waiting for him. [He needed to know that he was not hated as much as he thought he was. A sign that his eyes have been opened can be found in the booklet of “Thriller 25”]

Notice in the song “You Are My Life,” he said she is the sun. He also said she is the moon. Well, the sun brings warmth, just like love brings warmth, and both combats cold. The moon shines light in the dark of night. If she is the moon, she is providing light at night. Also, notice that in “The Way You Love Me,” he said she took away the rain and brought the sunshine. Well, if she is the sun, as he says in “You Are My Life,” then she brought herself and whatever is within her to provide him with comfort and warmth. She is in this manner sharing her life. She’s been providing light as well as warmth. This falls in place with the words, “A light to keep you warm…” as he mentions in “Someone In The Dark.”

He’s been smiling more than he did in 2001; he doesn’t appear to be shedding tears as he once was; the look of pain has left his eyes; and one of his family members have said he’s happier than he’s ever been. These are things that were predicted in the song, “You Are My Life.” The words, “Now, I wake up everyday with this smile upon my face. No more tears, no more pain, ‘cause you love me” have come to pass.":) -AllForMJ (from here up is from ALLFORMJ but all pulled from parts of posts, it's not one continuous post)

It upset him, but he always saw the aspersions that were cast on him as examples of false judgment, never true reflections of who he was. In a way, I agree with him. I saw this dynamic at work in the Bashir interview the same way I saw it in the treatment of the infamous baby-dangling episode. Brief glimpses of a life, taken out of context, can easily be manipulated to make a person look crazy. None of us are subject to the type of harsh scrutiny that Michael faced every day of his adult life, and sadly, the effect of that scrutiny only served to intensify the eccentricities. Perhaps the biggest tragedy of the Bashir video was that Michael had entered into it with the best of intentions. His willingness to do the interviews showed his optimistic belief that given the right context and the right explanation, the public would love and accept him as he was. In the same way he wanted to straighten out his finances by taking them back under his control, perhaps he had also wanted to straighten out the false impression the world had of him by communicating directly with his audience. He had hoped the Bashir interviews would connect him with his fans and the wider public. He wanted to be open about his life and to be understood. He thought the interview would be something he could be proud of, something he would show to his children one day, a part of his legacy.

Instead, for the second time in his life, the world took Michael’s greatest passion—helping kids—and accused him of doing the opposite—hurting kids. I thought this was beyond ****ed up. It was horrible. I had known Michael for most of my life. He was the most magical person I had ever met. And the world had a completely distorted picture of him when it came to his relationship with children.

When we learned about the press’s and public’s responses to the video, Michael was disappointed more than anything else. “I trusted Uri,” he said. “I trusted Martin Bashir. I can’t believe this is happening. It’s all twisted. I was supposed to have final edit.” Michael never spoke to Uri Geller again, but he blamed himself for trusting the wrong people. He didn’t say so, but I saw in his disappointment the realization that, at the end of the day, the disaster was his fault. ....


My focus now became using that footage Michael’s crew had taken in order to clear Michael’s name. I immediately began working with Marc on The Michael Jackson Video: The Footage You Were Never Meant to See. We scrambled to release a film that showed Bashir’s manipulative editing, then the real version, so viewers could see exactly how Michael’s words had been blatantly twisted to show him in a negative light.
...............
on February 23, 2003, our rebuttal aired, just three weeks after the telecast of Bashir’s documentary. It was well received, and there was a flood of press condemning Bashir’s journalistic tactics. ......



THERE WAS RAMPANT SPECULATION IN THE MEDIA about the huge emotional toll that Bashir’s video had taken on Michael, with reports declaring that he’d never recover from it, but this absolutely wasn’t so. In the months following that savage telecast, Michael was in great spirits.

For the next six or seven months he stayed at Neverland. Vinnie and I were there, too—back and forth between Neverland and Marc Schaffel’s house in Calabasas—and everyone had a fun time. Energy was high. At Neverland, Vinnie and I were helping the filmmaker Brett Ratner put together a longer version of the rebuttal, Michael Jackson’s Private Home Movies, which incorporated footage from the Bashir video, Michael’s own videos, and new interviews with Michael’s friends and family in the hope of creating a true portrait of him—the one he had wanted to show the world. Every now and then, Brett would bring some beautiful women to visit, which kept things interesting. The actor Chris Tucker, a close friend of Michael’s, was living in a huge bus parked on the ranch. We filmed the whole project on-site—we didn’t want anything to leave the ranch; so there was an entire production team at Neverland—me and Vinnie, Brett Ratner, Marc Schaffel, and others. Together we weeded through hours and hours of footage. When it came to putting together the private home videos, Michael was hands-on. We showed him cuts; he gave notes. He’d always been interested in filmmaking, and the collaboration gave a much-needed boost to his sense of controlling the way he was represented to the world and ensuring that it was accurate. On April 24, 2003, when Home Movies aired on Fox as a two-hour special, many viewers tuned in and Michael felt vindicated by the ratings. Of course, positive images don’t get as much attention in the press as the negative ones. We had to rely on people taking the opportunity to form their own opinions. We hoped they would. ......

<tbody>
The press during that period portrayed Michael as a man trapped in a downward spiral.
The bus-top protests against Sony, the baby dangling, the Bashir video, his changing
appearance… To the outside world, these issues had come to overshadow Michael’s life,
his talent, and his career.

But to those of us who actually knew Michael, such a portrayal couldn’t have been further
from the truth. There was no sign that he was losing control, no sign that he was heading
downhill. In reality, he was more vibrant and engaged than he had been in years. I felt like
he’d turned a corner, and I wasn’t the only one. Everyone around him felt the same way.


If you compare the footage of Michael in Home Movies to what you see of him in Bashir’s
video, you can get a sense of what we saw: how much happier he was during that spring a
nd summer at Neverland. In Home Movies, he is back to being himself again. He is joking
around and happy. His whole demeanor is relaxed. Working on music in the dance studio
with Brad by day, he had dinner and socialized with everyone at night—Brett Ratner, Chris
Tucker, me, Vinnie, some of Michael’s cousins, and Brett’s beautiful female guests. He
would join us in the game room or lead everyone to the movie theater to watch music
videos. Sometimes in the past, when Neverland was full of people, Michael had retreated
to his bedroom, but not this time. He was absolutely present, a proud host.

On August 30, Michael celebrated his forty-fifth birthday with his fans. He didn’t perform
—the fans performed his songs—but when he thanked them, he mentioned some of the
projects that he was looking forward to: the new merchandising line that Vinnie and I
were developing, resort hotels, and a new charity project that involved mentoring. He
pledged to make Neverland more accessible to his fans; that announcement got the
biggest cheer, of course. He was also studying 3-D technology—he knew that was where
movies were going next—and planning a huge charity event at Neverland to be held in
September 2003. The next chapter in Michael’s life promised to include his diverse
interests, which extended far beyond the hit albums the world expected from him.
He was back to his dynamic old self. He was in command of his life. And I, for one,
could not have been more excited to be a part of it all. -Frank Cascio's book




"He choses to release or work on very romantic and meaningful songs that
paint a picture and tells a story.Michael Jackson is in love and this lady is
someone of whom he has gone through a great deal with. hissongs and lyrics
suggest [I]this is it for him. He recognizes what they have and what he must
do in order to keep it this time." -Moddie777 (this I liked, since he used this
as a name for his concerts)

</tbody>

[Lisha]

Thanks, Ape. :flowers:

That was really interesting. I am a little confused by who wrote that very last, in smaller text, paragraph, and even within it, it seems kinda unclear. Would you mind clarifying it for me? I realize putting together a post like that takes some work. Thanks for your effort!

So what are your conclusions? Can you summarize what you think AllForMJ's words and Frank's words together are summing up?

Frank's seems to be referring mostly to 2003, covering January and February, on through the spring and the summer (including his birthday) and MJ's positive outlook in place in the fall of that year. And what got in the way of this up demeaner happened at the same time he was filming the One More Chance music video (November 17, 2003).


EDIT: SoS, you're cracking me up! Just reading through your edits from your last few posts...

You make your point about not using "names" in here


Edited my post for clarity. My point about personal names is that I thought it was agreed that we didn't want this thread reduced to a speculation thread per se as much as just an analysis of what we could discover via the music. That's all. I just thought it was agreed because this thread is different.

And then what made me chuckle is in this edit you sooooo kept with what you were saying...


the subject matter had a baby around that time. I've never seen a reason to assume anything about what was going on. The man was having a baby. Females actually have them ya know. :sigh: = happy moment in a man's life

...that you wouldn't even say Michael's name right out!!! aahahahahha!

Oh, Sos, you're somethun' else. :) (but why are ya coming off like such a cool cucumber?)

[Ape]

It didn't take much effort,that is why it's such a mess of a post..lol. I was just reading things last night (or morning..didn't get to sleep) and cut and paste them into one place intending to make a thread out of them and to look at and didn't want to lose it so posted it here because I was too tired to get a proper post together...aw well.

I think AllforMJ was saying that he looked noticeably happier sometime between 2002-2003 and through his music, determined it was due to love. While I read Frank's book, I had this in mind, and it really sounds like there was a noticeable positive change in Michael after Bashir's interview despite it being a time the media presented otherwise and where most would think, logically, he would be depressed or not doing well. What can bring about that happiness in demeanour? Love does a pretty good job of it (or meeting someone who really makes an impression/impact and a connection with one's self). There is also a timeline that I can now follow of when the Bashir interview all took place and from what I remember it sounds like sometime in November to January. There was a change even from there to after it all aired. He also put his side out there with take two. I'll have to watch it again but it seems to me there was even a remarkable difference between that and his next "Private home movie". That could be due to it all being filmed surrounded with friends and by friends instead of an outsider reporter as well but he did seem so playful and even dressed in a flirty sort of outfit. Anyways, it was interesting to see that what Frank had written really seemed to confirm what AllforMJ was saying, but without putting a reason to it as she had.


That's mostly what I noticed with what I had posted here.

[Lisha]

Oh, Ape, that really helped for clarity, thanks. Your post is lookin' good. :)

So you think that based on what Frank was sharing regarding the MJ of most of 2003, that he had some special woman in his life (heart) that was making him happier? Frank describes MJ as being quite busy with a project/s and entertaining others at this home, while being very hands on with the work they were doing. How do you think he "fit her in"? Are you thinking emails, and online? Or phone calls? Are you supporting the "long distance" kind of relationship going on?

Seems you think Frank's shared views on this time period, and AllForMJ's post above, would support his "glow" not simply being about the birth of his son and the fun of taking care of him along with his other two children? You think it was due to a love for a woman who was now part of his life at some level?

[Ape]

I also want to bring something up that surprised me. I remember when I first heard the Invincible CD I thought it was prophetic. I can't remember why I thought this but it's why these next quotes interested me; one from AllforMJ way back, and another from this book.

We sat and listened to the songs he’d recorded for Invincible. We still had to decide which would make the album and which would not. That night, I wanted to listen to “You Rock My World,” but Michael said, “Please, we are going to listen to that song all day tomorrow. Let’s not listen to it now.”

As we played various tracks that night, Michael said, “People will not understand this album right now. It’s ahead of its time. But trust me, Frank, ten years from now they will understand and the album will live on forever.”

Neither of us suspected that ten years later he wouldn’t be around to see if his prediction came true. But I believed in the timelessness of his music, believed that all of his albums—Off the Wall, Thriller, Bad, Dangerous, HIStory, Invincible —would live forever. I believed it then, and I believe it now. -Frank Cascio's book

""When I now listen to “You Are My Life,” I see that it describes all the things he needed to get through a tough time that had not even occurred yet. This is why I now feel “You Are My Life” is prophetic. It is as equally prophetic as the song “Will You Be There.” The things about his friend comes through clearly as shown here in a summary of the lyrics of “You Are My Life.” " -ALLFORMJ
Which isn't exactly saying the same thing but it seems there is a similarity.

[Ape]

Lashi, no idea, but I am noticing some things that at least seem to be adding up or supporting certain theories. His children were around during this time and before but maybe he was just enjoying being a dad and having friends around.

[Lisha]

I also want to bring something up that surprised me. I remember when I first heard the Invincible CD I thought it was prophetic. I can't remember why I thought this but it's why these next quotes interested me; one from AllforMJ way back, and another from this book.

We sat and listened to the songs he’d recorded for Invincible. We still had to decide which would make the album and which would not. That night, I wanted to listen to “You Rock My World,” but Michael said, “Please, we are going to listen to that song all day tomorrow. Let’s not listen to it now.”

As we played various tracks that night, Michael said, “People will not understand this album right now. It’s ahead of its time. But trust me, Frank, ten years from now they will understand and the album will live on forever.”

Neither of us suspected that ten years later he wouldn’t be around to see if his prediction came true. But I believed in the timelessness of his music, believed that all of his albums—Off the Wall, Thriller, Bad, Dangerous, HIStory, Invincible —would live forever. I believed it then, and I believe it now. -Frank Cascio's book

""When I now listen to “You Are My Life,” I see that it describes all the things he needed to get through a tough time that had not even occurred yet. This is why I now feel “You Are My Life” is prophetic. It is as equally prophetic as the song “Will You Be There.” The things about his friend comes through clearly as shown here in a summary of the lyrics of “You Are My Life.” " -ALLFORMJ
Which isn't exactly saying the same thing but it seems there is a similarity.

Wow, this is some good stuff right here!

Very interesting the way you are seeing the support for some of the songs on Invincible as being prophetic. There does seem to be a similarity to what Frank is saying and these words you quoted from an AllForMJ post. Good job, Ape. You're really thinking some things through. And THAT'S always appreciated in here! lol. It does hurt the head some times, though. *speaking for myself, of course* :)

Keep doing what you're doing' I think you are seeing some things here that maybe we should pay attention to, as we are exploring ideas together.

Would it surprise anyone in here that Michael could write lyrics or sang lyrics that later could be seen/proven as being prophetic?

Thanks for sharing all this today, Ape. :hug:


EDIT: *laughs* Just noticed you called me "Lashi." Hey, pick a name, any name.....:lol:

[Ape]

Lol! Well you are certainly welcomed to call me something other than Ape... (What was I thinking???lol)

God uses us as vessels if we are open to it, so no, wouldn't surprise me. Wouldn't surprise me if any of us did though. In fact I think that's often a way I see if something in my life is making sense or not. When I look back at something that's happened or that I've written, and with the experience I've had, I can see more meaning in something that wasn't initially intended. Sometimes something entirely new. I guess it's that hindsight is 20/20 expression, coupled with looking back to moments of anyone's own history they took the time to write down or just remembered. More or deeper meaning can be drawn from these things that perhaps were initially brought about in a shallower context.

Even taking one example of just before fathers day in 2009 I had this anxiety over needing to reach my father. I had an incredibly strong feeling that he would die. Then Michael "died" or died and I thought maybe that's all it was, but exactly one year later, my father did die. There was no reason for my feelings back then that I could tell but looking back, maybe there was. It's just not something that can easily be understood. It was the only time I felt that fear over my dad, though the day he died, my day was just off and when my brother called me, before he said what it was about, I knew. My only explanation for myself is God was communicating with me. I just didn't understand it at the time. Or maybe I did understand it partially but I was quick to dismiss it when I found out dad was ok back then. It certainly wasn't anything that I wanted to think about.

[Lorraine]

I love reading all of your posts in here, you a put so much thought and effort into everything posted it amazes me.

Thank you all for sharing your thoughts and making such an enjoyable read :flowers:

Ape, long time no speak girlie!! hope you and yours are well :hug:

[Ape]

Thank you Lorraine, they are well. I've been pretty busy most days with work and raising the family. Today was nice to get stuff done at home and hung out on here more than usual. Hope you and your family are all well as well. I'm in another play too so lots of rehearsing.

I've been enjoying this thread again too. Last night (one reason I was up too late) I listened to the music as I read and there does seem to be a progression from a dreamt of relationship or more fantasy (in the mind with no solid person) to the realization of that dream but a new spark, to falling deeper, to a real solid relationship. One can follow the relationship from the songs and at times it feels very clear how it must have been for them from his side. It really is a fantastic love story, possibly the greatest love story I've ever heard of (just watching from the outside).

[8701girl]

""When I now listen to “You Are My Life,” I see that it describes all the things he needed to get through a tough time that had not even occurred yet. This is why I now feel “You Are My Life” is prophetic. It is as equally prophetic as the song “Will You Be There.” The things about his friend comes through clearly as shown here in a summary of the lyrics of “You Are My Life.” " -ALLFORM


Lashi, no idea, but I am noticing some things that at least seem to be adding up or supporting certain theories. His children were around during this time and before but maybe he was just enjoying being a dad and having friends around.


Well its been rumored that You are my life was about michaels children

[Ashtanga]

OMG people!!!! :o

800 pages!!!! :woohoo: http://www.messentools.com/images/emoticones/humor/www.MessenTools.com-Humor-pelos-locos.gif http://www.hornedhalo.org/images/kermit.gif http://i683.photobucket.com/albums/vv191/L3onardus/Myanimelist/247.gif :P

Great job!!! :clapping: :blushing: :heart: Soooooooooooo... >>>> http://www.gifanatics.com/files/Jackson_popcorn.gif http://www.messbrasil.com.br/imagens_emoticons//Smiley/////035ani-messbrasil.gif :shifty:






:fear:

[8701girl]

OMG people!!!! :o 800 pages!!!! :woohoo: http://www.messentools.com/images/emoticones/humor/www.MessenTools.com-Humor-pelos-locos.gif http://www.hornedhalo.org/images/kermit.gif http://i683.photobucket.com/albums/vv191/L3onardus/Myanimelist/247.gif :P

Great!!! :clapping: :blushing: :heart: So... >>>> http://www.gifanatics.com/files/Jackson_popcorn.gif http://www.messbrasil.com.br/imagens_emoticons//Smiley/////035ani-messbrasil.gif :shifty:






:fear:


LOL! hey kermit!



Whoo hoo 800 pages yay! :clap:

[Ashtanga]

LOL! hey kermit!



Whoo hoo 800 pages yay! :clap:

:punk: :dance: :dancing: :woohoo: :jump: http://www.hornedhalo.org/images/kermit.gif

[Lisha]

Lol! Well you are certainly welcomed to call me something other than Ape...
Will do!

Hi there, Lorraine!! :wild:


Well its been rumored that You are my life was about michaels children

The only way I can make this work, because I reeaaaallly like the idea that this song is for and about his children**, and not written for and about some lady, is that it -is- prophetic and he had no idea at the time of writing that it would speak one day of something more.

And this is pretty much what you've been addressing, Apers, that God could very well have done that through MJ, in this song, and many others.

ASHTANGA...I think you're bringing a PARTY in here! :jump:


~ ~ Par-teh, Par-teh... Par-teh in the LITD thread!~ ~ :punk:


:holiday: *throws confetti* :holiday:



** because I think it is so special that he would write a song -just for them- to let them know how very precious their love for him and his for them is to him.

[Ape]

I could fully see that it's for his kids. Somehow it could fit in other situations as well.

Lisha, lol were you just calling me Lorraine? That could get confusing ;-) :p just teasing. I know you were just saying hi to Lorraine.

When I first heard Invincible I thought the whole album was prophetic..lol. I went through many different thoughts back then and probably still do.

You know how it says that Chris Tucker and other friends of Michael's were there at Neverland with him around the private home movies time? There used to be this guy who would come in mjchat and said he was Chris Tucker, and he was so funny and FULL of energy that I could actually see the possibility of it being him for real. Does anyone else remember that? I wonder what ever happened to that guy. Did anyone else here ever go there? (Sony mj chat and MJNO chat and a few others?) I miss those days, and everyone who used to go there. So easy to lose touch with everyone.

[Lisha]

^ why...aren't you Lorraine?

:tease:

Nothing makes sense anymore!!! I feel like I've entered Wonderland when I'm in here!!! :lol:


So maybe Chris and MJ for some down time and relaxation (during that time period at Neverland), would come on mjchat and goof off? That sounds amusing. Chris is very funny. And I believe MJ could be funny; I'm not positive about that. Do most think he had a good sense of humor? Oh wait, did Elizabeth Taylor say he was "wildly funny" or something like that?

[Ape]

No, I'm just me. A different person than Lorraine, living in different sides of our earth. :)

I don't know what his sense of humour is like other than the playfulness shown. Has anyone seen him tell jokes or something? I don't know if Chris went to the chat for real or not, but reading that made me wonder again. I could imagine they'd fill their time with all sorts of fun things; none of which would be in front of a computer...though I could also imagine them all playing around in a fan chat just having fun, maybe during relaxing time. It could also have been other people just having fun in a chatroom taking on the persona of someone well known. Butttt....I digress. Back on topic? Was fun remembering to way back then, no matter who all was or wasn't there. Nice (and not nice as well) thing about online is that the imagination is free to play around uninhibited.

[Lorraine]

Look at my name getting thrown all over the place :lol: