Preliminary Hearing 6/1/11 Day Three. Discussion thread

TheChosenOne

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Re: Preliminary Hearing 5/1/11 Day two. Discussion thread

Please remember that these discussion threads are for the court proceedings for the day. Stay on topic. Remain respectful.

We are all here for justice for Michael.
 
Re: Preliminary Hearing 5/1/11 Day two. Discussion thread

Also let me explicitly state that this thread and this section is not for conspiracy talk. All discussion related to conspiracy should be carried out in the conspiracy forum.

And a reminder drug addict talk is not allowed on MJJC.

Failure to follow above mentioned rules (including the ones TheChosenOne mentioned and general MJJC rules) can result in infractions and temporary/permanent bans.

If you see a member breaking these rules please do not engage them with a response, simply report their posts. Our Moderating Team will actively take necessary actions against such posts and users.
 
Re: Preliminary Hearing 5/1/11 Day two. Discussion thread

Please remember that these discussion threads are for the court proceedings for the day. Stay on topic. Remain respectful.
We are all here for justice for Michael.

I just wanted to say that we have gotten a lot of information over the last year and a half. Some of us have already come to conclusions about what we think really happened. But I just want to remind you that the discussion is for the proceedings today as posted above. If you then want to go into others threads to discuss how this information marries up to theories you had before, that is fine. But please don't do it here. There is a lot of information that will be spoken about in the prelim and we really need to keep this thread with as much factual information as possible.

Also let me explicitly state that this thread and this section is not for conspiracy talk. All discussion related to conspiracy should be carried out in the conspiracy forum.

And a reminder drug addict talk is not allowed on MJJC.

Failure to follow above mentioned rules (including the ones TheChosenOne mentioned and general MJJC rules) can result in infractions and temporary/permanent bans.

If you see a member breaking these rules please do not engage them with a response, simply report their posts. Our Moderating Team will actively take necessary actions against such posts and users.

We are trying to warn you in advance. If you see your posts are disappearing, please do not be surprised. We really cannot have happen what happened yesterday.

If you have personal questions with members, please take it to PMs. Please don't clutter the thread with off topic discussion.

Again, there are other threads in the case forum and in the conspiracy forum where you can more implicitly speak about any theories about what happened. Please utilize them.


Thanks so much to everyone for keeping us updated and contributing.
Thank you very much! :flowers:

We will get through this! :huggy:
 
Hearing is set to resume today at 9:15am. PT/ 12:15 ET.
 
check the first post. the medic senneff will be first up to continue his testimony
 
Thank you Lorraine. I have to work unfortunately.. will be logging in though around 7 pm to check out.
 
I think at this point it's up to the judge. He can do it in the end of prelim if he finds it necessary.
 
i think so too. at this point even if it was IM, there should be extra charge for cover up.
 
Although this is an update about the first day of prelim hearing, I'll post it in the current information and discussion thread so that it won't be overlooked in the no longer active threads.

Trials and Tribulations is following Murray Prelim and they are taking detailed notes. As their notes requires transcribing and typing (which is not an easy task), it consumes some time to post their notes on their website. They do not wish their full notes to be copied and posted so as they post a new entry I'll go through it and post only important additional information and make corrections (if needed) to what we already heard from the press. If you want to read their full posts you can visit Trials and Tribulations website.

Kenny Ortega Testimony

- Kenny says around the time of MJ's death he was attending rehearsals 4 times a week, his schedule was to come late afternoon and he spent 6 hours maximum at rehearsals.

- Kenny says that he met Murray in April or May 09 (soon after Kenny started to work at TII), he was introduced to Murray by Michael at Michael's house.

- In the cross Kenny says he doubts even if TII was bad it would affect his reputation.

- Kenny says he doesn't know who called the June 20 meeting and says heads of AEG wasn't there. (We already know that the people at that meeting were MJ, Murray, Kenny Ortega, Frank Dileo and Randy Phillips)

- Karen Faye : This is the questions that defense asks Kenny : "Do you remember having a conversation with Karen Faye after the meeting? Do you remember telling Karen Faye of reading Michael the riot act? Do you remember telling Karen Faye not to placate Michael? Did you advise Karen Faye in any respect in regard to how to treat Michael after this meeting? Did you discuss with Karen Faye any thing regarding how she should treat Michael?" Kenny responds No or don't remember to this questions.

- Kenny says Michael missed a series of rehearsals (a week) in early June. He says this made him worried because everything needed Micheal's decision and/or approval and without it TII couldn't move forward.

- Kenny says on June 25th Michael was supposed to arrive to rehearsals around 4:00-4:30 PM.

(Kenny also mentions taking TII to international places (India and Japan) and Michael wanting to direct with Kenny after TII)


Michael Amir Williams testimony

- Williams say that at the house there were 2 security 24/7 to open the gate and screen everyone that comes in.

- Williams say that he met Murray in early 2008 in Las Vegas.

- Williams say that it was regular pattern for Murray to be at the house when they came from rehearsals and that he would stay the night.

- Williams say on June 24th Michael went to rehearsal around 6-7 PM , MJ was in great spirits and wanted to be there on time. He says the rehearsal ended past midnight. They drop Michael off as always and Williams went home.

- Williams say he was at his house when Murray called. Faheem had left MJ's house to go to the bank and Alberto Alvarez was at the front door.

- Williams say that no security/no staff was allowed upstairs perhaps with the exception of housekeeping to clean.

- Children's nanny is identified as "Rosalie"

- Williams describes the scene at the hospital : Doctors working on Michael behind a curtain, the kids are waiting in a room. Security and nanny is waiting outside in front of the room. Murray and doctors come out , tell them Michael is dead. Murray, Dileo and Williams walk into the room where the children are. Prince tells them "make sure to tell the doctors daddy's allergic to X, Y". Frank tells them "your daddy had a heart attack and died". Murray says "don't tell them that (heart attack?). We don't know".

- Williams say that he discussed Murray's request to go back to MJ's house with Faheem and decided to say "police have our car keys". He also says he called the security detail at the house and said "don't let anyone in, don't let anyone out".

- In cross examination member's of security's connection to Nation of Islam and "Security Measures" is questioned. He says the housekeepers and 3-4 of the security wasn't related to NOI.
 
thank u ivy.i have to study but i will be checking in time to time :hug: to everyone and stay strong guys.
 
ivy;3177563 said:
Trials and Tribulations is following Murray Prelim and they are taking detailed notes. As their notes requires transcribing and typing (which is not an easy task), it consumes some time to post their notes on their website. They do not wish their full notes to be copied and posted so as they post a new entry I'll go through it and post only important additional information and make corrections (if needed) to what we already heard from the press. If you want to read their full posts you can visit Trials and Tribulations website.

Thanks for the notes. I went to the website and read them in detail, and the one other thing I noticed that stood out for me was when Williams testified that when Frank said Your daddy had a heard attack and died. Dr. Murry said, “Oh, no don’t tell them that; We don’t know.” Of course, Murray knew that at that point. I'm not sure what to make of that comment by Murray.
 
MJFan07;3177637 said:
Thanks for the notes. I went to the website and read them in detail, and the one other thing I noticed that stood out for me was when Williams testified that when Frank said Your daddy had a heard attack and died. Dr. Murry said, “Oh, no don’t tell them that; We don’t know.” Of course, Murray knew that at that point. I'm not sure what to make of that comment by Murray.

thank you for pointing it out. I added that point to my summarized notes.

and yes you are right it seems like Murray was constantly refusing his role/responsibility in MJ's death.
 
What is the sentence for voluntary manslaughter?

im not sure... it may be at the judges discretion.. he is the wikipedia def:
-Voluntary manslaughter occurs either when the defendant kills with malice aforethought (intention to kill or cause serious harm), but there are mitigating circumstances which reduce culpability, or when the defendant kills only with an intent to cause serious bodily harm. Voluntary manslaughter in some jurisdictions is a lesser included offense of murder. The traditional mitigating factor was provocation; however, others have been added in various jurisdictions

i think its easier to charge him with Invoulntary Manslaughter and add other felony charges so he could recieve more time
 
sometimes I think that Murray is crazy and belongs to a mental institution. Just read his latest words about Michael's mom. I am speechless he dares to behave like that and say things like that.

or probably he wants to appear crazy to avoid conviction?
 
Yes thank you for the detail update and the reference to the website. Yes it does appear that Murray is taking no accountability whatsoever. :no: He truly is only thinking about himself.
 
CNN In Session reports that Katherine and Latoya is at court.
 
it starts in 30 mins. i hear the medical experts are testifying today, i want to see if they clear up that mike wasnt no addict.
 
"This is the first time I've given mouth to mouth but I 'HAD' to do it because he's my friend. This sentence alone is manic for a doctor, if someone had a heart attack in the street he wouldn't give mouth to mouth because he didn't know them, Did he or did he not take an oath to preserve life?:bugeyed
 
As i said in another thread they need to inject his butt with the same crap he gave mike, leave him alone for two mintues, then when he gets his allergic reaction wait twenty mintues to call 911, just remember to give him cpr with only one hand on the bed. choice number 2, they need to charge his lying ass with first degree murder! IMO

I agree.. I said that from the very beginning. He should be used as a demonstration. He should allow the same amount of drugs along with propofol to be injected in to him and be left alone and let's see if he survives.
I bet he would never take propofol as a sleeping aid for himself
 
why is murray saying this bout katherine? did i miss something? oO

IMO Murray is desperately trying to do some damage control on his image. What a lame and pathetic attempt.

Sorry, Conrad, we're not buying it. -_-
 
C'mon guys, let's try to reserve personal feelings like this for now and try to focus on factual information from the testimony provided today so that the thread does not get derailed.

Thanks.
 
Paramedics are going to continue to testify today. This is what I heard. Be prepared to hear some more unpleasant details.
 
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