All Evidentiary Matters /MJ's Finances, Murray's girlfriends, Autopsy pictures, TII Footage, Experts

Dr. Conrad Murray's legal team asked a judge Thursday to prohibit any mention of the physician's purported extramarital affairs, out-of-wedlock children and fondness for strip clubs at his manslaughter trial next month in the death of Michael Jackson.

In papers filed in Los Angeles County Superior Court, the defense argued that such evidence was irrelevant to the question of Murray's guilt and would be used by prosecutors only "to inflame the passions of the jury."

"The prosecution's case involves the treatment and care of Michael Jackson provided by Dr. Murray. It is not about the existence and number of children Dr. Murray has, or about his personal sexual relationship with women," wrote defense lawyer Nareg Gourjian in the documents, which also sought to bar prosecutors from presenting evidence about lawsuits against Murray for failure to pay business debts and his home mortgage.

The defense also objected to the use of pictures of Jackson's dead body at the trial, saying the "graphic, gruesome and highly prejudicial" photos would appeal to jurors emotions and jeopardize Murray's right to a fair trial. Judge Michael Pastor has ordered a hearing on the requests for April 21.

The parties took another step toward selecting a jury Thursday with the finalization of a pool of about 170 prospective panelists. In the run-up to final jury selection May 4, prosecutors and defense attorneys will review 30-page questionnaires completed by the potential jurors.

A copy of the questionnaire was unsealed by the judge Thursday. Panelists were asked 117 questions about their background, life experience and opinions on the case and those connected to it. Among the questions:

Have you ever considered yourself a fan of Michael Jackson or the Jackson Family?
Did you ever watch "This Is It" (the documentary of Michael Jackson's concert tour prep)?
Do you have any positive or negative feelings or opinions about Conrad Murray or Michael Jackson?
The questionnaire also asked if panelists had ever used a laundry list of prescription drugs, including propofol, the surgical anesthetic blamed in Jackson's death.

Murray, 57, faces a maximum of four years in prison if convicted of involuntary manslaughter. He has pleaded not guilty.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lan...otos-michael-jackson-conrad-murray-trial.html

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AP Update

By Associated Press, Thursday, April 7, 4:31 PM
LOS ANGELES — Attorneys for the doctor charged in Michael Jackson’s death are asking a judge to prevent prosecutors from telling jurors details about the physician’s personal life, including his unpaid debts, child support obligations and extramarital affairs.

The filings by lawyers for Dr. Conrad Murray state the details are unnecessary and would unfairly prejudice a jury against the doctor.

Prosecutors called three of the doctor’s mistresses during a preliminary hearing earlier this year.

Murray’s attorneys filed six motions this week seeking to exclude information from an upcoming involuntary manslaughter trial. The motions also seek to keep prosecutors from introducing autopsy photos of Jackson, claiming that showing them in open court would “inflame the passions of the jury.”

Murray has pleaded not guilty to involuntary manslaughter in Jackson’s June 2009 death.

Copyright 2011 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

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Does there HAVE to be pictures of Michael's body in court to present his bruising marks and lividity? Or can the paramedics just describe all thar without pics as evidence? I don't know about these things.

kasume;3331562 said:

Does there HAVE to be pictures of Michael's body in court to present his bruising marks? Or can the paramedics just describe the marks without pics as evidence? I don't know about these things.

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It doesn't have to be. In some cases it can be just explained without pictures and in some cases it can be explained with pictures.

btw - jury seeing the pictures doesn't mean that the public will see them as well. In OJ case the judge didn't allow the media to show the crime scene photos for example. (if that was your concern)

ivy;3331569 said:

It doesn't have to be. In some cases it can be just explained without pictures and in some cases it can be explained with pictures.

btw - jury seeing the pictures doesn't mean that the public will see them as well. In OJ case the judge didn't allow the media to show the crime scene photos for example. (if that was your concern)

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I know. If they show the pictures, pros. will just have to warn the family beforehand so they won't have to be in the room during the photos if they can't take it. I have no problem with showing Michael's photos in court. He may be a celebritiy, but he's a victim of a crime just like any other human being. This IS a manslaughter charge that has all the legal requirements for MURDER. Crime isn't always pretty.

^^
To be clear I meant even though jurors might be shown the photos they might not be on TV on live broadcast and kept from the general public. I wasn't talking about people in the courtroom.

Yes, I understood the first time. Thank you for your explanation. A crime is a crime, show forth the evidence. It can't be THAT gruesome since Murray said it all just happened...It can't be THAT gruesome since according to conrad Michael was still alive and had a pulse...well, let the jurors see all that. The jurors need to see! The judge needs to see! Michael's fans can close their eyes or look away. That's what I would do.

Pictures speak a thousand words.

Besides, if conrad is truly innocent and telling all the truth and this was all Michael's fault, those pictures shouldn't be that harmful to him. So he should have nothing to be worried about.

Dr. Conrad Murray's legal team asked a judge Thursday to prohibit any mention of the physician's purported extramarital affairs, out-of-wedlock children and fondness for strip clubs at his manslaughter trial next month in the death of Michael Jackson.

In papers filed in Los Angeles County Superior Court, the defense argued that such evidence was irrelevant to the question of Murray's guilt and would be used by prosecutors only "to inflame the passions of the jury."

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Just like Michael's "financial crises" has nothing to do with you not having proper equipment and leaving the room!!??

I'm concerned with conrad's box of tissues and fake tears appealing to the juror's emotions....not. Jurors should be able to see through that.

So Murray's attorneys don't want Murray's dirt out there but they want to talk about MJ's financial matters? If anything Murray's debt, girlfriends etc is the reason why he took the job and threw his ethics out the window by giving a man anesthesia in his house. He did it because of the money to support his girlfriends and to pay off his other financial obligations.

Does anyone know how the prosecution responded to this motion?

kasume;3331590 said:

Yes, I understood the first time. Thank you for your explanation. A crime is a crime, show forth the evidence. It can't be THAT gruesome since Murray said it all just happened...It can't be THAT gruesome since according to conrad Michael was still alive and had a pulse...well, let the jurors see all that. The jurors need to see! The judge needs to see! Michael's fans can close their eyes or look away. That's what I would do.

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and I agree. As sad as seeing the autopsy pictures might be, if they mean justice then let it happen.

StacyJ;3331595 said:

Does anyone know how the prosecution responded to this motion?

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The request just filed today. So there's no response or judge decision as of yet. We'll wait and see.

FYI - Media reports say that Judge will make a decision on April 21st.

The Jury needs to see those pictures, that will help greatly to convict Murray!

He is such a hypocrite not wanting the jury to not know his business when that business is why MJ is dead! So they must know!

ivy;3331620 said:

and I agree. As sad as seeing the autopsy pictures might be, if they mean justice then let it happen..

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seeing those photo's would be VERY sad...but I agree..if it means Michael getting justice..then so be it..

I don't see how all of Murray's affairs can be off limits with witnesses such as Sade Anding & Nicole Alvarez.

^ Yep, their relationship with Murray will come up once they testify and say what's their relationship with Murray is/was in 09 and on! So there's no hiding that! lol

So key facts about his character and motives are off limits, but michael's financial situation should be plastered all over the world, not to mention unsubstantiated theories about drug use. They are really saying let's dirty Michael and keep Murray clean!!

Petrarose;3331743 said:

So key facts about his character and motives are off limits, but michael's financial situation should be plastered all over the world, not to mention unsubstantiated theories about drug use. They are really saying let's dirty Michael and keep Murray clean!!

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That is what the defense is pushing for... The judge has not ruled on it yet.

I think Murray's girlfriends business should be brought up during the trial because he was on the phone with one of them when everything happened and propofol was being delivered to another one's house, so at least two of his girfriends were involved in this matter. The quantity of children and his inability (or unwillingness) to pay child support should also be discussed because it will show that he needed money and that's why he adreed to do the job even though he wasn't capable of doing it right.

and I agree with you, the jury need to see those photos.

The judge has to be fair to both sides. He cannot allow only the defense to have a say about what should and should not be admissable. The thoughts of autopsy photographs sicken me but if they are necessary to obtain justice then so be it.

I have mixed feelings bout mj's autopsy pics being shown to the jury.....to see mj like that my god....poor mj

kasume;3331590 said:

Yes, I understood the first time. Thank you for your explanation. A crime is a crime, show forth the evidence. It can't be THAT gruesome since Murray said it all just happened...It can't be THAT gruesome since according to conrad Michael was still alive and had a pulse...well, let the jurors see all that. The jurors need to see! The judge needs to see! Michael's fans can close their eyes or look away. That's what I would do.

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I agree. For everyone else, he is just a celebrity. But we are talking about a MAN who was KILLED. I certainly don't want to see any of those at all, that for sure! But a crime scene must be shown in court. Horrible as it might be. If it was that wrong, then nobody would take pics of crime scenes to then show them in court. Please!! Those guys working for CM are just so.... agggg :angry:

I totally agree.. Murray's girlfriends do need to be mentioned especially Anding and Nicole Alverez because he was calling them and talking to them when he should've been monitoring his patient. Nicole is definitely a major witness because he was sending propofol to her house, so what the hell is he talking about ? it is definitely relevant

kasume;3331562 said:

Does there HAVE to be pictures of Michael's body in court to present his bruising marks and lividity? Or can the paramedics just describe all thar without pics as evidence? I don't know about these things.

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I think the lividity photos would be most useful if the prosecution tries to establish a window regarding time of death or "neglect" during the golden hour. If the science is clear on that, it could be used to dispute Murray's claim about how much "life" was still in Michael when he "allegedly found him" or, perhaps, moved him. Doesn't make sense that Michael would consciously lie asleep with those beads under his butt for any amount of time. They'd be too uncomfortable for anyone to tolerate in a conscious state.

If the photos will help convict Murray, I would hope the prosecution be allowed to use them. If they have to warn the family, I hope they do that. Many gruesome crimes where people were butchered to death have been used in court regardless of passions being inflammed or the heinousness of the crime. If it's valid evidence...then it's admissible.

Having said that from a legal standpoint, I still cringe at the thought of this.

bluetopez;3331688 said:

^ Yep, their relationship with Murray will come up once they testify and say what's their relationship with Murray is/was in 09 and on! So there's no hiding that! lol

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Absolutely! One of the questions will definitely be "How did you become acquainted with Conrad Murray...When/Where/how did you meet?" no doubt the jury will get the message what Murray was up to. Didn't he buy Sade a "nice dress"? I wonder how many men on the jury will have bought a "nice dress" for a female friend he had NO sexual interest in...or how many female jurors will have had a male friend purchase a "nice dress" for them for NO reason except to be sweet (as Sugar Daddies tend to be).;D

Even if the defense has decided to NOT go the route of defending Murray's "character", I agree that a lot of this stuff will come in just by asking basic questions to establish when, where, and how he met the ppl testifying. It's unavoidable.

I wonder if the prosecution plans to call Rev. F.N. Williams who Murray consulted about taking the job as MJ's doctor for the shows. The Rev. said he advised Murray NOT to take the job, however Murray had a "need". Well, we're experiencing the end result of that need which obvioiusly trumped his oath as a doctor. Should be interesting to see if this "need" led to Dr. Adams not being called back to assist? More $$$$ for Murray if he didn't have to split it with anyone? Hopefully, the prosecution can and will make the connection.

The thing about Murray going to strip clubs makes me think again about where was he that night?

Do the jury need to know about Murray's love of producing children and not paying for them, and his love of strip clubs-only if its relevant. It can be argued the child support is relevant as Murray was so desperate to keep his job he would do anything. The judge will decide what is important to the case and if autopsy pictures are relevant, which they will be, then in the name of justice it will have to happen.

PS not aimed at Sophielo, but at the Thread title:
Ridiculous...the defence are going to ask that the word 'death' isn't used next! What do they think the jury imagine is at the centre of a manslaughter trial?
No doubt any mention of the children and the nanny would be potentially 'emotionally influential' too..where would this all end.......perhaps the court could just sit down and have a nice discussion about the world economic situation instead, and not worry about the case at all!

hypocrites. murrays lack of money and 20 mill kids and not paying child support is an obvious reason as to why he was so reckless. didnt call back adams etc. its ok to go after ms finances but not the killer.


its coming in either directly or not. you have alverez that was stocking the diprivan and sade. when they get on the stand they will be asked how they know murray. wont take much for the jury to put 2 and two together. look forward to hearing the pros responce to this

As horrible as it is the autopsy photos need to be shown to the jury to get justice for Michael.

Also ALL Conrad Murray's dirty dealings should be told to the jury and laid out before the court. It is Murray who is on trial here NOT Michael-the defence keep seeming to forget this minor point.

angelofinnocence;3332726 said:

Also ALL Conrad Murray's dirty dealings should be told to the jury and laid out before the court. It is Murray who is on trial here NOT Michael-the defence keep seeming to forget this minor point.

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well said.his actions towards mj are directly connected to his money issues.it shows motive.adams is a good example of that and how he ignored his calls/texts and also his affairs effect his credibility considering he lied to all his women and they didnt seem to know about each other. and how he lied to the medics etc

EEverything should be made public about this Conrad Murray character need to be put out there, from the time this bastard was born, everything needs to be opened in front of the court of law, it is his effing trial

wendy2004;3332380 said:

I think the lividity photos would be most useful if the prosecution tries to establish a window regarding time of death or "neglect" during the golden hour. If the science is clear on that, it could be used to dispute Murray's claim about how much "life" was still in Michael when he "allegedly found him" or, perhaps, moved him. Doesn't make sense that Michael would consciously lie asleep with those beads under his butt for any amount of time. They'd be too uncomfortable for anyone to tolerate in a conscious state.

If the photos will help convict Murray, I would hope the prosecution be allowed to use them. If they have to warn the family, I hope they do that. Many gruesome crimes where people were butchered to death have been used in court regardless of passions being inflammed or the heinousness of the crime. If it's valid evidence...then it's admissible.

Having said that from a legal standpoint, I still cringe at the thought of this.



Absolutely! One of the questions will definitely be "How did you become acquainted with Conrad Murray...When/Where/how did you meet?" no doubt the jury will get the message what Murray was up to. Didn't he buy Sade a "nice dress"? I wonder how many men on the jury will have bought a "nice dress" for a female friend he had NO sexual interest in...or how many female jurors will have had a male friend purchase a "nice dress" for them for NO reason except to be sweet (as Sugar Daddies tend to be).;D

Even if the defense has decided to NOT go the route of defending Murray's "character", I agree that a lot of this stuff will come in just by asking basic questions to establish when, where, and how he met the ppl testifying. It's unavoidable.

I wonder if the prosecution plans to call Rev. F.N. Williams who Murray consulted about taking the job as MJ's doctor for the shows. The Rev. said he advised Murray NOT to take the job, however Murray had a "need". Well, we're experiencing the end result of that need which obvioiusly trumped his oath as a doctor. Should be interesting to see if this "need" led to Dr. Adams not being called back to assist? More $$$$ for Murray if he didn't have to split it with anyone? Hopefully, the prosecution can and will make the connection.

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Exactly! Defense attorneys (especially) will throw out any motions (and especially in this high-profile case), because so far they have been trying to sew the seeds of doubt in the minds of a prospective jury--knowing the media is reporting most every word said in court. Gamesmanship is all it is. Murray's character will be exposed by the Prosecution's questions to witnesses. Most likely, the autopsy photos will be shared with the jury when the Coroner testifies (the family will be warned).

wendy2004;3332380 said:

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I wonder if the prosecution plans to call Rev. F.N. Williams who Murray consulted about taking the job as MJ's doctor for the shows. The Rev. said he advised Murray NOT to take the job, however Murray had a "need". Well, we're experiencing the end result of that need which obvioiusly trumped his oath as a doctor. Should be interesting to see if this "need" led to Dr. Adams not being called back to assist? More $$$$ for Murray if he didn't have to split it with anyone? Hopefully, the prosecution can and will make the connection.

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Who is Rev. Williams and did he give an interview??