Discussion about Charges against Dr. Murray / all threads merged

Rockin.

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If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

I think it would be useful to have this thread to inform everyone of the steps which come after Murray is charged (if this happens).

I think it is important that everyone can understand what may/will happen next.

Can someone explain please so that all members on the board can understand?

If anyone has any questions about procedures etc., they can also be addressed here.

We all need to be informed.

Thank you for your helpful responses.
 
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Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

I'm a paralegal, although I don't work in the criminal field I know a bit about it. He will be arraigned and more then likely be given bail. His lawyers more then likely will work with the DA and try to plea bargain and avoid a trial. If a trial does happen it will probably be quite a while until that happens.
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

I hope theres cameras in the courtroom ; BTW I meant to ask this before- you think Paris and Prince will be going to the trial??
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

he will be arraigned then u will have prelim (as thought) or a grandjury to decide if it goes to trial charges could change during that. then prob as the same with mj you had hearings approx once a month where motions would be argued about what kind of evidence is allowed in etc then when all the hearings are done with the trial starts with jury selection. talk about ground hog day from 03-05. horrendous
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

I hope theres cameras in the courtroom ; BTW I meant to ask this before- you think Paris and Prince will be going to the trial??

I think, if a trial happens. They may try to get Prince to testify, there were some people saying he saw his father, others said he was just at the stairs. But both have said that Murray did indeed talk to Prince. No one knows what was said though.
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

I'm a paralegal, although I don't work in the criminal field I know a bit about it. He will be arraigned and more then likely be given bail. His lawyers more then likely will work with the DA and try to plea bargain and avoid a trial. If a trial does happen it will probably be quite a while until that happens.

Is it difficult to reach such an agreement? What should be done so that the case goes to trial despite the lawyers' attempts to avoid it?
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

I hope theres cameras in the courtroom ; BTW I meant to ask this before- you think Paris and Prince will be going to the trial??

i doubt it. sitting in courtroom hearing evidence is hardly a good thing for adults to go through. and if they are on the witness list they wont be allowed to attend
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

Is it difficult to reach such an agreement? What should be done so that the case goes to trial despite the lawyers' attempts to avoid it?

its up to the D.A to offer one. i doubt any will be offered this is to big a case with to much fame to made out of it from the D.A justice has to be seen to be done
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

I'm not sure. Lawyers in my firm think they will probably try to reach one. Usually the DA actually wants to plea bargain but alot of times the defense doesn't want to especially when they are adament that they are not guilty. However, the feeling around here is Murray would only take a plea if he didn't have to serve jail time. And the DA will be scrutinized if he doesn't have to serve. It should be interesting for sure.
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

And it will take a while. They will have a lot of hearings for motions and for the purpose of what evidence is permissable, etc. The kids very well be made to testify and if thats the case I hope no cameras are allowed.
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

^^ Yeah, and I'm totally at a crossroads with that, 'cause on one hand, I don't want them anywhere near any of this toxicity, but on the other hand - they have the answers, I can assure you. But after the Grammys, I don't want to open that "should they/should they not" can of worms again, sheesh. :doh:
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

Plea Bargain -

A plea bargain (also plea agreement, plea deal or copping a plea) is an agreement in a criminal case where by the prosecutor offers the defendant the opportunity to plead guilty, usually to a lesser charge or to the original criminal charge with a recommendation of a lighter than the maximum sentence.
A plea bargain gives criminal defendants the opportunity to avoid sitting through a trial risking conviction on the original more serious charge. For example, a criminal defendant charged with a felony theft charge, the conviction of which would require imprisonment in state prison, may be offered the opportunity to plead guilty to a misdemeanor theft charge, which may not carry jail time.
In cases such as a car accident when there is a potential for civil liability against the defendant, the defendant may agree to plead no contest or "guilty with a civil reservation", which essentially is a guilty plea without admitting civil liability.

[edit] United States

See also: United States Federal Sentencing Guidelines
Plea bargaining is a significant part of the criminal justice system in the United States; the vast majority of criminal cases in the United States are settled by plea bargain rather than by a jury trial[6][7]. Plea bargains are subject to the approval of the court, and different States and jurisdictions have different rules. The Federal Sentencing Guidelines are followed in federal cases and have been created to ensure a standard of uniformity in all cases decided in the federal courts.
Plea bargains are so common in the Superior Courts of California that the Judicial Council of California has published an optional seven-page form (containing all mandatory advisements required by federal and state law) to help prosecutors and defense attorneys reduce such bargains into written plea agreements.

What Is A "Plea Bargain"?

A "plea bargain" is a deal offered by a prosecutor as an incentive for a defendant to plead guilty. If every case in the justice system went to trial, the courts would be so overloaded that they would effectively be shut down. Plea bargaining allows the prosecutor to obtain guilty pleas in cases that might otherwise go to trial.
What Are The Types Of "Plea Bargain"?

There are two types of plea bargain:
Charge Bargain

A "charge bargain" occurs when the prosecutor allows a defendant to "plead guilty to a lesser charge," or to only some of the charges that have been filed against him. For example, a defendant charged with burgarly may be offered the opportunity to plead guilty to "attempted burglary." A defendant charged with Drunk Driving and Driving With License Suspended may be offered the opportunity to plead guilty to just the drunk driving charge.

Sentence Bargain

A "sentence bargain" occurs when a defendant is told in advance what his sentence will be if he pleads guilty. This can help a prosecutor obtain a conviction if, for example, a defendant is facing serious charges and is afraid of being hit with the "maximum" sentence. Typically, sentence bargains can only be granted if they are approved by the trial judge. Many jurisdictions severely limit sentence bargaining.

Sentence bargaining sometimes occurs in high profile cases, where the prosecutor does not want to reduce the charges against the defendant, usually for fear of how the newspapers will react. A sentence bargain may allow the prosecutor to obtain a conviction to the most serious charge, while assuring the defendant of an acceptable sentence.
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

If there is a trial there will be a prosecution against Murray, would this be a random attorney? Would there be someone defending Michael, speaking on his behalf against what the defence is likely to say?

Kind of off topic - Also, don't you think it is likely the FBI would have been involved in investigating this case? They were involved in investigating accusations against Michael, and the stalker/terrorist threats against him. Wouldn't they be involved in investigating his death -as some newspapers expect they have been?
 
Re: If/After Murray is charged, then what happens?

I'm not sure. Lawyers in my firm think they will probably try to reach one. Usually the DA actually wants to plea bargain but alot of times the defense doesn't want to especially when they are adament that they are not guilty. However, the feeling around here is Murray would only take a plea if he didn't have to serve jail time. And the DA will be scrutinized if he doesn't have to serve. It should be interesting for sure.


Thank you.

I thought a plea bargain was done by the DA and not the defense. They do this to keep from going to trial since it is such a long and expense process that may not even get the verdict that you want.

Murray would be a fool to take this to trial because I honestly cannot see what kind of defense he could mount. If he tries to say Michael was an addict, then he will be painted as a gloried drug dealer. Not to mention how he is going to explain him leaving the room in the first place, not calling 911 right away, not telling the MTs all the drugs he gave Michael, and the bad CPR on someone with a pulse.

It will only get worst for him if Michael was long dead before help arrive. He also needs to explain why that revival drugs was not find in Michael's system, even though he claim to have given it to him and why was his doctor bag with all the drugs he gave Michael was hidden in the house.

I try to see where his defense will come from on these issues, but I have been drawing a blank. Since I am no defense lawyer, I can't seem to see that far. All my conclusion says that Murray would want to plea bargain.
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

If there is a trial there will be a prosecution against Murray, would this be a random attorney? Would there be someone defending Michael, speaking on his behalf against what the defence is likely to say?
the prosecution is the district attorney (D.A) and his assistants. they represent mj
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

I try to see where his defense will come from on these issues, but I have been drawing a blank. Since I am no defense lawyer, I can't seem to see that far. All my conclusion says that Murray would want to plea bargain.
if murray could pre bargin to a non custodial sentence then im sure he would go that route but whether a plea bargin happens isnt really upto him. he can make an offer but thats about it. imo theres no way the D,A will offer one. of course thats what i want but knowing how big this case is and how the D.A would want this win on his record and ppl wanting to see that justice is done i just dont see it
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

Someone had a question on another thread -

Emm...what happens if they do not charge CM today at 1.30pm? Are there a sort of 'time limits' till when they can charge him?
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

the prosecution is the district attorney (D.A) and his assistants. they represent mj

Thank you. So if there is a trial will they call witnesses to defend Michael against what Murray may say?
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

just answered that in the other thread. theres statue of limitations but it will be years away so its not an issue
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

If there is a trial there will be a prosecution against Murray, would this be a random attorney? Would there be someone defending Michael, speaking on his behalf against what the defence is likely to say?

Kind of off topic - Also, don't you think it is likely the FBI would have been involved in investigating this case? They were involved in investigating accusations against Michael, and the stalker/terrorist threats against him. Wouldn't they be involved in investigating his death -as some newspapers expect they have been?


On the first question, it depends. They usually get attorneys who specializes in cases like this. In this case, they would want someone who dealt with drug related deaths and/or death by doctors.

As for if they would defend Michael, in cases such as this it is usually in the best interest of the prosecution to paint the victim in a sympathetic light. To get the maximum sentence and a sure conviction they would try to paint Michael as a father/brother/son. They would want the juries to understand that a human being has died, not a superstar.


The FBI is a big if. The reason why they looked into Michael for child molestation case is because child abuse is consider a federal crime. If they were other victims of this abuse, the FBI wanted to find them and could actually get Michael on federal charges if anything was found.

Murder/Manslaughter is a state crime, so the FBI may or may not get involve. State crimes is more of a matter for the LAPD.
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

Thank you. So if there is a trial will they call witnesses to defend Michael against what Murray may say?

not really its the other way around. murray is the defendent not mj. the prosecution start their case first.they will state what murray did and have witnesses testify and show their evidence.the defence will cross examine the pros witnesses. then when they have finished the defence calls their witnesses that will counter what the prosecution witnesses said. then cross examination again as above then at the end the prosecution get a rebuttal stage were they can rebute some of the defence witnesses. theres rules about what can be said for example you can bet murray will try and say mj was adruggie and that helped to cause his death. you will have a hearing pre trial where this will be argued b4 the judge then the judge will decide if murray can say that about mj. bascially u cant say anything u want it all has to be allowed in by the judge
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

i presume the FBI would be invovled for state trafficing? murray having drugs shipped
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

if murray could pre bargin to a non custodial sentence then im sure he would go that route but whether a plea bargin happens isnt really upto him. he can make an offer but thats about it. imo theres no way the D,A will offer one. of course thats what i want but knowing how big this case is and how the D.A would want this win on his record and ppl wanting to see that justice is done i just dont see it


Even in big cases, the DA usually do ofter a plea-bargain. For them, it is a sure win instead of an if it goes to trial. Even with a seemly strong case, things can go wrong. Especially when dealing with a doctor which people have a certain stigma about.
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

its something i dont want to think about tbh unless hes charged with murder 1 and admits to murder 2 instead. if its only IM with no add ons then i dont even want to think about what sentence he would get if u plea bargined
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

Even in big cases, the DA usually do ofter a plea-bargain. For them, it is a sure win instead of an if it goes to trial. Even with a seemly strong case, things can go wrong. Especially when dealing with a doctor which people have a certain stigma about.

This is true. It will be interesting to see what happens.
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

i presume the FBI would be invovled for state trafficing? murray having drugs shipped

not really its the other way around. murray is the defendent not mj. the prosecution start their case first.they will state what murray did and have witnesses testify and show their evidence.the defence will cross examine the pros witnesses. then when they have finished the defence calls their witnesses that will counter what the prosecution witnesses said. then cross examination again as above then at the end the prosecution get a rebuttal stage were they can rebute some of the defence witnesses. theres rules about what can be said for example you can bet murray will try and say mj was adruggie and that helped to cause his death. you will have a hearing pre trial where this will be argued b4 the judge then the judge will decide if murray can say that about mj. bascially u cant say anything u want it all has to be allowed in by the judge


If he did traffic drugs, they maybe involve since it is a federal crime here. However, I think that is more in the area of the DOA than the FBI.

Murray would actually be foolish to call Michael a druggie because only his drugs were found in his body at death, he admittedly gave them to him, and no pills were in his stomach. If he was an addict, the logical conclusion would be that that Murray is a drug dealer/pusher. That defense would had worked if other drugs not given by Murray was found in the tox, but that is not the case.

That also would not explain everything he did after he found Michael not breathing.
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

urray would actually be foolish to call Michael a druggie because only his drugs were found in his body at death, he admittedly gave them to him, and no pills were in his stomach. If he was an addict, the logical conclusion would be that that Murray is a drug dealer/pusher. That defense would had worked if other drugs not given by Murray was found in the tox, but that is not the case.

That also would not explain everything he did after he found Michael not breathing.
yeah i agree, its like u say above what defence will he take? and everything u can think of just isnt logical or isnt even factual.but look at the quote he keeps running with, nothing i gave him should have killed him. so whats he saying someone else gave it to him or mj gave it to himself or there was something else in his system. such a strange quote is obviously leading somewhere interms of his defence
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

yeah i agree, its like u say above what defence will he take? and everything u can think of just isnt logical or isnt even factual.but look at the quote he keeps running with, nothing i gave him should have killed him. so whats he saying someone else gave it to him or mj gave it to himself or there was something else in his system. such a strange quote is obviously leading somewhere interms of his defence


It is a strange quote, especially since he admittedly gave him the drugs that killed him.

If he is going to say he was frame or Michael woke up somehow and turn the drip on himself, that statement does not make much sense. Even then, he still gave Michael something that could of killed him.

Okay, if we go with the frame theory, he will have to answer who frame him? Who was upstairs at the time Michael stopped breathing and how Murray and the rest of the staff miss this person. Only Michael, his kids, and Murray were allowed upstairs. So, this person would had been seen somewhere where they didn't belong and someone should of saw him/her.

Also, the chief said that Murray usually came down at 9am to get Michael and his breakfast. On the 25, he didn't do that. So if someone else did OD Michael, he should had found out about it much sooner than 11 or 12pm.

He runs into the same problem if he tries to say Michael woke up and OD himself, he still should had discovered him sooner. With both, he still had to explain why he left the room to begin with when his patient is under medication.

However, the above is moot because these events could not had happen according to the timelines he gave. That also would not explain everything he did after Michael stopped breathing.
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

:reading:

On the first question, it depends. They usually get attorneys who specializes in cases like this. In this case, they would want someone who dealt with drug related deaths and/or death by doctors.

As for if they would defend Michael, in cases such as this it is usually in the best interest of the prosecution to paint the victim in a sympathetic light. To get the maximum sentence and a sure conviction they would try to paint Michael as a father/brother/son. They would want the juries to understand that a human being has died, not a superstar.

The FBI is a big if. The reason why they looked into Michael for child molestation case is because child abuse is consider a federal crime. If they were other victims of this abuse, the FBI wanted to find them and could actually get Michael on federal charges if anything was found.

Murder/Manslaughter is a state crime, so the FBI may or may not get involve. State crimes is more of a matter for the LAPD.

Thank you.

So the terrorist threat would obviously be a federal crime, but the stalker death threat?

I really would have thought that the FBI would be involved with such a high profile person's sudden death. Especially Michael Jackson's, considering things that have happened in the past etc. Anyway..

not really its the other way around. murray is the defendent not mj. the prosecution start their case first.they will state what murray did and have witnesses testify and show their evidence.the defence will cross examine the pros witnesses. then when they have finished the defence calls their witnesses that will counter what the prosecution witnesses said. then cross examination again as above then at the end the prosecution get a rebuttal stage were they can rebute some of the defence witnesses. theres rules about what can be said for example you can bet murray will try and say mj was adruggie and that helped to cause his death. you will have a hearing pre trial where this will be argued b4 the judge then the judge will decide if murray can say that about mj. bascially u cant say anything u want it all has to be allowed in by the judge

Thanks.

I'm a bit confused about this:

he will be arraigned then u will have prelim (as thought) or a grandjury to decide if it goes to trial

I don't want to sound stupid, but I'll remain stupid if I don't ask, and this thread is for these kinds of questions, so..

Is the preliminary/grand jury where the plea bargaining happens?
Is it that there will be either a preliminary hearing or grand jury or is the preliminary just before the grand jury? If it is either/or what decides which one it will be? What exactly happens? :blink:
 
Re: If/When Murray is charged, what happens next?

for example you can bet murray will try and say mj was adruggie and that helped to cause his death.

Ugh, I know. Trying to prepare myself for this. Hopefully these jurors have some logic, because honestly whether or not MJ was a druggie (He wasn't.) is irrelevant to this. I mean, he could've been on tranquilizers from morning til night, getting Demerol shots from Klein 10x a day, snorting coke in between songs, smoking crack in his dressing room, and building a meth lab in his backyard...that does not tell us anything about whether or not Murray was fully equipt to administer and 100% committed while Michael was under his care - and - whether or not he tried his damnest to help save Michael while he was dying. [God, that last sentence was hard to type...]

Everything else is just ethics,...should he have been giving this outside of a hospital?, should he have been administering without a license?...and, of course, should he have been prescribing for an addict?....:smilerolleyes: - and while the answer to all of those questions is "no" - that is not the big picture here.

I hope they understand the gravity of this case. Most people I talk to don't seem to. They think it's simply a case of "enabling". Smh. I am so sick of that word...
 
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