Controversial MJ Documentary Leaving Neverland [GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD]

Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Seems like something a real victim would do. Harass other "victims" in public directly by name to come forward. This guy is a complete narcissist.
Exactly. And that needs to be put out there for people to see what he is doing. No real victim does that but he is using this for self gain. he will be expose.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

THIS COLD EGO ARROGANT EMPATHYLESS BEHAVIOR RIGHT NOW FROM WADE, CALLING OUT OTHER VICTIMS AND WITNESSES WITH THIS LIST OF PEOPLE HE CALLS OUT MAKES ME NOW BELIVE THAT HE IS THE CREATOR OF MJ FACTS!!!

This is nearly exectly the list they made up in their videos and Homepage!

He needs to be investigated!!!!
I hope that everyone of this list will sue him for deformation and can reache with this an investigation of Wade.
I'm not sure if James likes what he does!!


MJFacts has been around since at least 2012, before any of the new allegations took place. I remember because I tried to find sources for an essay I was writing for my Public Policy/Civil Law class. I chose the Michael Jackson 2005 case, and I thought that a website called MJFacts was created by fans which was going to showcase all the evidence that proved he was innocent, all the court documents, the fact that no evidence was found during the Neverland raid, the fact that Tom Sneddon attempted to make phony evidence by making Gavin put his fingerprints on a playboy magazine (which is on record, not hearsay)

I took one look, and all I saw was tabloid bullshit.
 
ILoveHIStory;4244251 said:
Louis Theroux interview: ‘Michael Jackson had unhealthy interests in children, but I didn’t have enough victim testimony to put forward a forensic case’
.

Louis? I remember him being with Michael's father in some documentary. Joe was going somewhere and he went with him or something. Never thought much of Louis, guess I was ok with him. But seems he's basically a second Martin Bashir?

He says he had unhealthy interests in children, I see. Based on what? Also, if the police with vengeance ridden Sneddon wasn't able to find any "victims" and neither the FBI... you certainly won't Louis. Don't kid yourself.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Seems like something a real victim would do. Harass other "victims" in public directly by name to come forward. This guy is a complete narcissist.

And maybe the sickest part of that tweet is it's clearly (because of the timing) just an attempt to publicise the documentary.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

When are we going to see a documentary about Harvey Weinstein or a documentary about Roman Polanski? Oh, right. I forgot. Hollywood will protect the real pedophiles/predators while the innocent people get smeared. Roman Polanski even got a standing ovation at an award show for f**k sake. And this was after the public knew about the allegations against him and then you had people palling around with Harvey Weinstein for decades. Oprah being one of them
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Dan Reed even hit up PBS news with an interview.. He's so calculated yet so unitellegent.
 
Louis Theroux is another one of those talking heads that jumps on the bandwagon. He wanted to be the one to do the interview with MJ in 2003, but Bashir was chosen instead. He still made an MJ related doc in 2002 and spoke with Terry bloody George.

He he is another public figure who doesn’t do the research.

It’s a shame because I quite like some of his other documentaries.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

MJFacts has been around since at least 2012, before any of the new allegations took place. I remember because I tried to find sources for an essay I was writing for my Public Policy/Civil Law class. I chose the Michael Jackson 2005 case, and I thought that a website called MJFacts was created by fans which was going to showcase all the evidence that proved he was innocent, all the court documents, the fact that no evidence was found during the Neverland raid, the fact that Tom Sneddon attempted to make phony evidence by making Gavin put his fingerprints on a playboy magazine (which is on record, not hearsay)

I took one look, and all I saw was tabloid bullshit.

He shoped 2012 for a book deal.
The MJ Facts YouTube channel was createt on July 1 2013 and their first video aired two days later.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

When are we going to see a documentary about Harvey Weinstein or a documentary about Roman Polanski? Oh, right. I forgot. Hollywood will protect the real pedophiles/predators while the innocent people get smeared. Roman Polanski even got a standing ovation at an award show for f**k sake. And this was after the public knew about the allegations against him and then you had people palling around with Harvey Weinstein for decades. Oprah being one of them
See, these people do not care about the issue of abuse, these people care about MJ who they think will make them $$$$$$$$$. It is so blantley clear. And yesterday, the Washington post was caught lying on the students at covington. They threathen to sue. And now Washington Post issued a half baked apology and that storry was on all media but crickets now. Our media is BS.
 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Louis? I remember him being with Michael's father in some documentary. Joe was going somewhere and he went with him or something. Never thought much of Louis, guess I was ok with him. But seems he's basically a second Martin Bashir?

He says he had unhealthy interests in children, I see. Based on what? Also, if the police with vengeance ridden Sneddon wasn't able to find any "victims" and neither the FBI... you certainly won't Louis. Don't kid yourself.

He tried to with the phoney terry george ?in a doc about mj he did in 03 right before bashir.the creep was hanging around mjs hotel in london in june 02 trying to talk to fans for his tinpot docu.

All trying to use mj to make themselves relevant
 
dmehta;4244275 said:
Louis Theroux is another one of those talking heads that jumps on the bandwagon. He wanted to be the one to do the interview with MJ in 2003, but Bashir was chosen instead. He still made an MJ related doc in 2002 and spoke with Terry bloody George.

He he is another public figure who doesn’t do the research.

It’s a shame because I quite like some of his other documentaries.
He know how to research he just does not care. DIRT sells.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

He's so calculated yet so unintelligent.
------------

Excellent ???
 
dmehta;4244275 said:
Louis Theroux is another one of those talking heads that jumps on the bandwagon. He wanted to be the one to do the interview with MJ in 2003, but Bashir was chosen instead. He still made an MJ related doc in 2002 and spoke with Terry bloody George.

He he is another public figure who doesn’t do the research.

It’s a shame because I quite like some of his other documentaries.

Basically dude is trying to ride the wave of shitting on MJ, sad. Especially like because you said he does make good documentaries. Hell, he could maybe have made some nice dollars if he tried to make a actual doc based on the truth and giving th green light by estate, maybe. Ah well.

Speaking of docs, Geraldine Hughes is making one and that's great news. I wonder if it will be a small one, like a fan doc on YouTube or something more big time?

elusive moonwalker;4244279 said:
He tried to with the phoney terry george 😂in a doc about mj he did in 03 right before bashir.the creep was hanging around mjs hotel in london in june 02 trying to talk to fans for his tinpot docu.

All trying to use mj to make themselves relevant

That's really pathetic. I honestly didn't know the guy was that sad and desperate, lol. Him saying this in the media really is no surprise then.
 
terrell;4244277 said:
See, these people do not care about the issue of abuse, these people care about MJ who they think will make them $$$$$$$$$. It is so blantley clear. And yesterday, the Washington post was caught lying on the students at covington. They threathen to sue. And now Washington Post issued a half baked apology and that storry was on all media but crickets now. Our media is BS.
Really? I heard about the incident between the Covington students and the elderly Native American. After the Jussie Smollett incident, and everything that have unfolded, the media been quiet with that too. This thing we’re going through now, we’ll beat this for sure.
 
Any news yet on whether this is genuinely Wades twitter? If so I agree with posters above, bizarre-est development so far. I’ve got a screenshot just incase
 
MJJ2theMAX;4244295 said:
Any news yet on whether this is genuinely Wades twitter? If so I agree with posters above, bizarre-est development so far. I’ve got a screenshot just incase

I’m very sceptical, but in a way would actually be pleased if it was him. That sort of blatant victim fishing will just come back and bite him on the arse.
 
MJJ2theMAX;4244295 said:
Any news yet on whether this is genuinely Wades twitter? If so I agree with posters above, bizarre-est development so far. I’ve got a screenshot just incase

Yes, it is definitely his. He reactivated it last week. He anticipates people will sympathise with him after the doc is aired and does not want to miss receiving all their support and sympathy.

I have just read a comment on Yahoo's article by someone who attended a dance convention with him, after he brought his allegations. the woman says that he spoke about his abuse and she believed him. This guy is a narcissist. He is speaking to anyone and everyone who is willing to listen to get people to sympathise with him and to like him. truly very sick individual. Sociopath to the core. James is very dumb though. That look on his face with his eyebrows always pulled together to show how sad he is, is just terrible acting. Desperation really
 
AlwaysThere;4244257 said:
Some tabloid printed a false story in which Aaron was quoted as saying that Michael gave him wine and cocaine at age 15, which he immediately denied. Other than that one incident, Aaron has always stated that nothing inappropriate ever happened between the two of them.

Notice that the only people Wade lists are people with established profiles; he hasn't done any digging into the hundreds (if not thousands) of children that Michael spent time with over the course of his life. I imagine he's hoping that one of them are strapped for cash.

Sadly for him, each one of those people have gone out of their way to defend Michael form '93 onward. Culkin, Feldman, and Lewis were defending him just last month. Barnes has been tearing the situation apart on Twitter and just filed a lawsuit against HBO. Chandler and Arvizo clearly want nothing to do with it. Bhatti hasn't made many public comments, but he's clearly supportive. The Cascios have been defending Michael for years.

Of all the things I've seen come out of Leaving Neverland, I sincerely think this might be the craziest.

Thanks for letting me know! It looked really bad back then and I remember I was active on MJJC in that thread too. Good to know there are at least people who are genuine and real and that aren't stabbing their friend in the back for money.

WildStyle;4244260 said:
Seems like something a real victim would do. Harass other "victims" in public directly by name to come forward. This guy is a complete narcissist.

It's truly disgusting. Just throwing those names out there for everyone to see. Absolutely not something a real victim would do. Then again, all his moves along with Reed and Safechuck have been nothing what you'd expect from "victims" and a director who's not in it for the money.

Silverstone;4244261 said:
I could make a new one but deleted rather than deactivated my account as I had made my mind up I wouldn't be using it again.
It's just now with what's happening I feel I'd like to be there putting the truth across.

I'm glad to read on here and have seen it myself that many online,including non fans are seeing through these two,that's something I dont think we've had in the past so I'm slowly but surely hoping this backfires big time and may not be as bad as I first thought.....keeping my fingers crossed and in the meantime we all will battle on.

Yeah it's fantastic to see the messages from people that have their head installed the right way, lol. Sadly there are tons of complete idiots too who parrot the tabloids and condemn Michael because they are foolish enough to believe that and take it as fact.

Hopefully we keep seeing these level headed comments after LN has aired.

elusive moonwalker;4244264 said:
Theroux is an idiot. Still upset that bashir stole his thunder in 03. Bandwaggon jumper who can only get any attention by talking about mj. Saville had hundreds of allegations made against him was never properly investigated because the bbc (how ironic) and police covered it up. so was never put on trial. theroux had no problem hanging out with him but no doubt had heard all the whispers that those high up in the bbc covered up.

The only ppl that ever accused mj were paid by the press,the police filed lawsuits for money or never even met him. Yet grand juries the FBI and a jury found no credible evidence against him. Maybe that tells you something god forbid. But then as normal mj is used as a deflection tactic.

Jesus, the more you know. I didn't know the slightest about Saville but to hear BBC was in on it, wow. Why did the BBC and police cover it up?

At the end of the day, the ones that actual matter, like you said the FBI, grand juries and a jury saw it for what it was. That is actually well said and something these doubters should think about for a few minutes. Let it sink in.

MJJ2theMAX;4244295 said:
Any news yet on whether this is genuinely Wades twitter? If so I agree with posters above, bizarre-est development so far. I’ve got a screenshot just incase

I think it's the real deal. It was yesterday I believe that someone here said Wade had a new account on Twitter and told us to keep calm and ignore it. Also I remember that someone here said he was using the background from his fundraising thing for abuse on his Twitter.

Anyone know if that background is indeed from that fundraiser thing?
 
I think it’s crazy that he would call out all those other guys publicly on twitter like that. Very strange.

He is overplaying his hand.
 
Dan Reed keeps selling his doco with "it isn't about Michael Jackson, it is about grooming."

Grooming Dynamic

Perpetrators of child sexual abuse (CSA) may gain the trust of potential child victims and their caregivers by methodically “grooming” them. This process begins with identifying potential victims, gaining their trust, and breaking down their defenses. These grooming tactics are often directed at potential youth victims as well as the adult caregivers—parents, other youth-serving professionals, and the community-at-large. After gaining access to children and youth by achieving this trust, the perpetrator initiates some kind of contact that s/he finds sexually gratifying. This sexual contact may range from voyeurism to rape and other forms of child sexual abuse. Grooming helps the offender gain access to the victim, and sets up a relationship grounded in secrecy so that the crime is less likely to be discovered.

Perpetrators of child sexual abuse are often individuals known to the family; they may be acquaintances, influential members of the community, trusted friends and even family members. Sometimes the offender is known to the family through association with an organization or activity in which the child or youth participates, such as school, a community club, sports team, recreation center or camp.

One reason that the perpetrator is able to exploit the child is because he or she holds the power in the relationship based on age and experience, size and strength, and adult status. A perpetrator may manipulate and use those power differences to gain the youth’s trust and confidence, and/or to create fear that enables the perpetrator to coerce the child or youth. (Note that this is not common in all cases of CSA; in many scenarios, there is NO trust at all, only coercion and fear.)

Grooming steps include:

-Identifying and targeting the victim.
Any child or teen may be a potential victim. Some predators may be attracted to children and youth with certain characteristics or may target youth with certain co-existing factors—such as vulnerable parents—to facilitate the crime.

-Gaining trust and access.
The perpetrator may observe the child and assesses his/her vulnerabilities to learn how best to approach and interact with the child. Perpetrators may offer the victims special attention, understanding and a sympathetic ear, and then engage the child in ways that eventually gain their friendship and trust (they may play games with victims or give them rides, provide them with gifts and/or special treats).

-Playing a role in the child’s life.
The perpetrator may manipulate the relationship so that it appears he or she is the only one who fully understands the child or meets the child’s needs in a particular way. A perpetrator may also exploit a youth’s empathy and convince the young person that s/he is the only one who understands the perpetrator and reinforce that the perpetrator “needs” the child or youth.

-Isolating the child.
Offering the child rides and/or taking the child out of his or her surroundings is one way that the perpetrator may separate the child from others and gain access to the child alone, so that others cannot witness the abuse. (Note that in other instances, perpetrators have been successful in molesting victims without detection while other adults were in the room.)

-Creating secrecy around the relationship.
The perpetrator may reinforce the special connection with the victim when they are alone or through private communication with the victim (such as letters, emails or text messages), and strengthen it with admonitions against telling anyone, lest others be unhappy about it. The perpetrator may threaten the victim with disclosure, suicide, physical harm to the child or loved ones, or other traumas if he or she tells.

-Initiating sexual contact.
With the power over the child victim established through emotional connection coercion or one of the other tactics, the perpetrator may eventually initiate physical contact with the victim. It may begin with touching that is not overtly sexual (though a predator may find it sexually gratifying) and that may appear to be casual (arm around the shoulder, pat on the knee, etc.). Gradually, the perpetrator may introduce more sexualized touching. By breaking down inhibitions and desensitizing the child, the perpetrator can begin overtly touching the child.

-Controlling the relationship.
Perpetrators rely on the secrecy of the relationship to keep it going, and to ensure that the child will not reveal the abuse. Children are often afraid of disclosing the abuse. They may have been told that they will not be believed, or that something about the child “makes” the abuser do this to them. The child may also feel shame, or fear that they will be blamed. Often, the perpetrator threatens the child to ensure that s/he won’t disclose the abuse.

http://victimsofcrime.org/media/reporting-on-child-sexual-abuse/grooming-dynamic-of-csa

Michael Jackson may have shared his home, his bed, his amusement park, his train, his theater with less fortunate children, whether financially or physically. But it was to be an Inspiration, not to take advantage of them. Jimmy and Wade came from poorer families. It seems the greed bug has bit them hard. Are they trying to groom us?!
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Dan Reed keeps selling his doco with "it isn't about Michael Jackson, it is about grooming."

Bullshit. It's 100% about Michael
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Surely WR naming other 'victims' should be a red flag for HBO and Channel 4 (and any channel broadcasting this thing). If they are really on the side of victims how can it be justifiable to publicly identify potential victims of abuse. WR and JS supposedly didn't come forward until the time was right for them. With such a sensitive issue, surely people can see that forcing victims into a worldwide public spotlight is extremely dangerous for survivors of such a traumatic experience. Or it would be if it were true!
 
Boltzmann;4244303 said:
I think it’s crazy that he would call out all those other guys publicly on twitter like that. Very strange.

He is overplaying his hand.


This is what respect77 posted on another forum:

Robson is a narcissist sociopath, he has no conscience, he won't crack. But he might get overconfident since sex abuse accusers in this era can do no wrong in the media's eyes, especially if the accused is MJ. So he might try more and more outlandish stuff that will expose him to the general audience.

That's what his latest post suggests. He is acting over confident now and harassing all mi's young friends (including the accusers) to come forward and help him gain more credibility. Or maybe he is saying he is braver than everyone else on that list after all he is "the Chosen One". "MJ chose me from among all the children in the world" it must have been devastating to him when MJ went on tour without taking the "Chosen One" with him that's why Joy was so upset with MJ and cut him off for six months so he would know better next time. How dare he leave her ugly son behind. She pushed him on MJ but MJ was never interested in them. I wish he was not as kind as he was.


 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Can someone tell the names of the other ''victims'' that have been named on Twitter?
 
Boltzmann;4244303 said:
I think it’s crazy that he would call out all those other guys publicly on twitter like that. Very strange.

He is overplaying his hand.

It's nuts, and at the same time I definitely wouldn't be surprised if he did this. If this is him, it really has to backfire. Can't imagine all these dudes being happy with being called out like that.

By the way, the MJ Facebook posted about the Bucharest show and it being free. But....isnt that a HBO production?
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

This might be a newbie question but do Robson/Safechuck have ongoing lawsuits against the estate?
Thanks
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

According to the Estate, they're appealing the Judge's dismissal now
 
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