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Lack of songs from the BAD album at the 1987 shows

Rocketeer said:
True, but it probably would have been too similar to the performance of Bad (same outfit, structure of the song, etc.). I can even see him do the same poses he does in Bad. Only addition would probably be to have a body double, like the ones on Thriller in Dangerous and HIStory Tour, dress up as Spike and "challenge" Michael to a dance off on stage at the end. I actually lowkey would want to see how that would play out on stage, despite how silly it may appear. Heck, they could even bring out a motorcycle on stage if they wanted to! But, for Michael's safety, maybe not really activate it? :)
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I would imagine Michael wearing a racer's outfit inspired by F1, as he is performing Speed Demon on stage. He is of coursed joined on the stage by Spike and they do a dance-off similar to one in the music video. Maybe, even a police man makes an appearance and tries to give Michael a ticket.
 
Yeah, the "no choreography" excuse doesn't sit with me. Over the course of the tour we had:

  • Off the Wall
  • Heartbreak Hotel
  • Rock with You
  • Bad
  • Another Part of Me
All rhythm/upbeat tracks with no choreography.

I'd also throw in "Wanna Be Startin' Somethin'," "Things I Do for You," "Lovely One," and "Shake Your Body" since they don't have choreography in the traditional sense; that could be categorized more like movements/beats.

Honestly, I'd gladly sacrifice "Heartbreak Hotel" (as much as I love it) for "Speed Demon".
 
Initially, they (band, backup dancers and the backup singers) focused on rehearsing all the live versions of things that Michael Jackson did on the Victory tour, as Jennifer Batten explained.

Michael Jackson saw video tapes of their rehearsals, and he liked what he saw.

So, with time constraints, and with no urgent need at the time to rehearse new stuff from the ‘BAD’ album since he was satisfied with the rehearsals from those video tapes, Michael Jackson and his on stage team began the Bad Tour in 1987 with mostly familiar songs and dance choreographies.

Also, Michael Jackson’s overall philosophy was that the audience should be already familiar with a song before coming to his concert to watch the song live, so for him a song had to be firstly released as a single and then be performed live.
 
JichaelMackson said:
Not having choreo for it is just an excuse. He didn't have any for BOTDF or Another part of me either. He even didn't know what to do for Billie Jean in Motown 25.
If you're such a natural dancer it doesn't matter if you have choreo or not.
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I'm sure Michael had some choreography for Billie Jean at Motown 25. He did rehearse it:

 
Nite Line said:
Many feel that brothers were holding him back, which is a ridiculous thing to say.
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If we look at the songwriters on the Destiny and Triumph albums it is difficult to ignore the brothers' contribution entirely. Both albums are basically written solely by the group. While it seems that the main songwriters were Michael, Jackie and Randy...and given what Michael went on to do in terms of songwriting I am confident in assuming Michael was the main creative force...it would be remiss to ignore what the brothers brought to the table in this area.
 
Nite Line said:
What I find interesting is that Bad Tour started just a couple of weeks after the release of Bad. In contrast, Dangerous Tour started seven months after the release of Dangerous. History Tour didn't start until September 1996, which was like fifteen months after the release of History.

Maybe, in his later tours, Michael wanted more time to rehearse the new songs, as the early start of the Bad Tour most likely prevented him from performing more Bad songs in 1987.
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More likely he had to be convinced to go on tour
 
Nite Line said:
Many feel that brothers were holding him back, which is a ridiculous thing to say.
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Yes and no.

They piggy backed off Michael's success of OTW & Thriller and they and their father squeezed an album and tour out of him when they had no right to. Michael didn't even appear in videos for their singles from that album. He wanted away from them on an artistic level but, was made to feel emotionally guilty by his family and done the album and tour

Sorry but, biggest pop star in the world, biggest selling album of all time, at the time, groundbreaking black artist, opening doors for everyone and he's touring with his brothers for their album? Ridiculous situation

Not for a second am I casting doubt upon his brothers' contributions to his success or their performing and songwriting ability, I just find that situation ridiculous
 
MOR316 said:
Yes and no.

They piggy backed off Michael's success of OTW & Thriller and they and their father squeezed an album and tour out of him when they had no right to. Michael didn't even appear in videos for their singles from that album. He wanted away from them on an artistic level but, was made to feel emotionally guilty by his family and done the album and tour

Sorry but, biggest pop star in the world, biggest selling album of all time, at the time, groundbreaking black artist, opening doors for everyone and he's touring with his brothers for their album? Ridiculous situation

Not for a second am I casting doubt upon his brothers' contributions to his success or their performing and songwriting ability, I just find that situation ridiculous
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Wasn't that part of MJ's contract? One group album in between his solo releases? Do you conisder the Destiny Tour piggy backing Off The Wall as well?
 
Themidwestcowboy said:
Wasn't that part of MJ's contract? One group album in between his solo releases? Do you conisder the Destiny Tour piggy backing Off The Wall as well?
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I don't understand this piggy backing point. When the Jacksons were initially signed by Motown in the late 60s, they were signed as a group. Nobody envisaged Michael having the level of solo success that he did. But once Michael's solo career took off with Off The Wall, all of a sudden every album that he did with his brothers was MJ doing his poor "untalented" brothers a favour. Honestly, what a load of BS some Michael fans come out with.
 
Phil

MOR316 said:
Sorry but, biggest pop star in the world, biggest selling album of all time, at the time, groundbreaking black artist, opening doors for everyone and he's touring with his brothers for their album?
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What's wrong with that? Phil Collins was really successful as a solo act, yet continued to do records & tours with Genesis.
 
DuranDuran;4290995 said:
What's wrong with that? Phil Collins was really successful as a solo act, yet continued to do records & tours with Genesis.
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I believe there is a difference between the Phil Collins/Genesis case and the Michael Jackson/The Jacksons case.

Michael Jackson’s brothers were trying to take monetary advantage of him at every given opportunity.

The Victory album is one example, the Victory Tour is another example, The Jacksons’ planned reunion concerts in Korea (in 1988) is just another example.

His brothers also wanted to follow him during his BAD Tour and to perform with him on stage for The Jackson 5 Medley part.

They were pressuring him for reunion concerts in the late 90s.

They even were pressuring him for reunion concerts meant to take place after his ‘This Is It’ residence shows.

On the other hand, Phil Collins as a successful solo artist rejoined the Genesis band (when the band reunited later) because he wanted to.
 
Fuzball;4290920 said:
A live performance of Speed Demon would have been a disaster for Mike. Just imagine, "Spike" stealing the show.:D
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hahahaha that would of been interesting.

Rocketeer;4290927 said:
This is why I have a love-hate relationship with the 87 leg of the Bad Tour. He sung live more, a lot more, and energy was great, but there were hardly any songs from the Bad album. It’s frustrating!
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Agreed.
 
Nite Line said:
I would imagine Michael wearing a racer's outfit inspired by F1, as he is performing Speed Demon on stage. He is of coursed joined on the stage by Spike and they do a dance-off similar to one in the music video. Maybe, even a police man makes an appearance and tries to give Michael a ticket.
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hahahaha i love your idea.
 
the bad tour was the best tour in my opinion. i wish he dropped some songs and did only a few old songs on the tour then the other way around. Michael was very busy during 1986. so much was going on this year. i think if he had more time he could of added more new songs on the list and some ideas to put with the songs on stage.

imagine a captain eo set up with another part of me on stage? that would of been awesome also the fact the ride was popular during the time. also a good BAD set up. him jumping on stage just like on the short film.

Michael could of done so many things. ugh. i still love the bad tour but i really wish we could go back in time and made these things happen. we can only imagine now.
 
eh... i really don't like Michael family much. he didn't like them much either expect Janet. Michael was force to do things he didn't want to do. and the fact he was a grown man. he was so happy at the end of the Victory tour saying this was their last tour. congrats he got the heck away.

his brothers are okay with music. they not the best. they okay. Michael pretty much did everything and gave them ideas.

his family mistreat him since he was a little boy.

you can basically say the Victory tour was the "Thriller" tour.
 
Nite Line said:
I don't understand this piggy backing point. When the Jacksons were initially signed by Motown in the late 60s, they were signed as a group. Nobody envisaged Michael having the level of solo success that he did. But once Michael's solo career took off with Off The Wall, all of a sudden every album that he did with his brothers was MJ doing his poor "untalented" brothers a favour. Honestly, what a load of BS some Michael fans come out with.
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Michael spent years trying to get away from them. That is a fact.
Michael had just come out with one of the best album of all time and he's doing that farcical tour to emotionally please his mother?

Anyone who attended the Victory tour, none of them bought a ticket to see Marlon or Jermaine or to hear ABC

As I said in another thread, it shows how naive Michael could be. His family, his mother included, tried to pressure him into having the Bad tour about them too.
 
Michael was a grown man. he could of said no to his mother. he was freaking 24. he was right all along and it fail. the tour was great but everything before it and after was awful. :(
 
mj_frenzy;4291019 said:
I believe there is a difference between the Phil Collins/Genesis case and the Michael Jackson/The Jacksons case.

Michael Jackson’s brothers were trying to take monetary advantage of him at every given opportunity.

The Victory album is one example, the Victory Tour is another example, The Jacksons’ planned reunion concerts in Korea (in 1988) is just another example.
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I will never understand this argument to be quite honest. You do realize that the Jacksons were a group right? They had every right to want to record, release an album and then later tour to promote it. Their last album was four years prior to Victory coming out. So why shouldn't they want to record a new album? Of course they had to wait on MJ because MJ was the lead singer of the group! If i recall correctly it was even stipulated in MJ's contract pre thriller that there would be a group release in between his solo albums.

At the end of the day MJ was still very involved with the Victory album. It would be naive on his part if he expected the brothers to not want to tour with that album for whatever reason. It wasn't the brothers fault that they didn't promote the Victory Tour with songs from the actual victory album, that was at MJ's behest. I'm sure there are other shady moments were they were pressuring him into doing stuff and all of that jazz but I don't see how Victory was one of them.
 
MOR316 said:
Michael spent years trying to get away from them. That is a fact.
Michael had just come out with one of the best album of all time and he's doing that farcical tour to emotionally please his mother?

Anyone who attended the Victory tour, none of them bought a ticket to see Marlon or Jermaine or to hear ABC

As I said in another thread, it shows how naive Michael could be. His family, his mother included, tried to pressure him into having the Bad tour about them too.
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He was doing this tour because he was part of the group. Just because he made it big as a solo star, it doesn't mean that he could just turn his back on the group that allowed him to make his mark on the music industry in the late 60s and early 70s.
 
NatureCriminal7896 said:
eh... i really don't like Michael family much. he didn't like them much either expect Janet. Michael was force to do things he didn't want to do. and the fact he was a grown man. he was so happy at the end of the Victory tour saying this was their last tour. congrats he got the heck away.

his brothers are okay with music. they not the best. they okay. Michael pretty much did everything and gave them ideas.

his family mistreat him since he was a little boy.

you can basically say the Victory tour was the "Thriller" tour.
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Where do you come up with this nonsense that he didn't like his family? He loved them. Just because he had issues with them at times, it doesn't mean he didn't like them. Stop talking nonsense as usual.
 
There is one thing that The Jacksons pushed through probably during the Victory tour. It is said that Thriller didn't sound good live but that I don't believe, I reckon it was not in the setlist because then people would call it the thriller tour.

Regardless of all the struggles before conceiving the tour all brothers were professional enough to make it work, it was a good tour.
 
Nite Line said:
I don't understand this piggy backing point. When the Jacksons were initially signed by Motown in the late 60s, they were signed as a group. Nobody envisaged Michael having the level of solo success that he did. But once Michael's solo career took off with Off The Wall, all of a sudden every album that he did with his brothers was MJ doing his poor "untalented" brothers a favour. Honestly, what a load of BS some Michael fans come out with.
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Having a different opinion is not BS and certainly not "hating" on the brothers, and anyway, being an MJ fan doesn't make it obligatory to care about his siblings too.

The Jacksons worked very well as a group for years, but... it stopped after some point, when MJ skyrocketed to another level. And I don't only mean his success, but rather that he had his very own vision about the future of his art, which simply couldn't be achieved with his brothers anymore. Not because they weren't talented enough, but because in a giant personal project like this they could only function as instruments in realising MJ's ideas, which wouldn't have been fair towards them. It's nobody's fault really, but it happened.

And I'm a big J5 and Jacksons fan (I actually prefer Destiny and Triumph over Off The Wall), I like Jermaine's mid-80's work, I think the 2300 Jackson Street album is an underappreciated gem, and I love the Victory album which is like showcasing the brothers' individual ideas.
 
Nite Line said:
Where do you come up with this nonsense that he didn't like his family? He loved them. Just because he had issues with them at times, it doesn't mean he didn't like them. Stop talking nonsense as usual.
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Yes MJ loved his family but he loved everyone. Whether he had a high opinion of them is a different story. He might've liked them but he refused to work with them if not for Katherine for a reason.

It's ok to like the Jacksons as a unit but we can't avoid the obvious.
 
MOR316 said:
Michael spent years trying to get away from them. That is a fact.
Michael had just come out with one of the best album of all time and he's doing that farcical tour to emotionally please his mother?

Anyone who attended the Victory tour, none of them bought a ticket to see Marlon or Jermaine or to hear ABC

As I said in another thread, it shows how naive Michael could be. His family, his mother included, tried to pressure him into having the Bad tour about them too.
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Thank you!!! I thought this was obvious.

Mike was so unhappy with that money scheme shambles of a tour and it was painfully obvious. Yes he performed it but he was a showman. Buying tickets in sets of 4? Come on.
 
JichaelMackson said:
It is said that Thriller didn't sound good live but that I don't believe, I reckon it was not in the setlist because then people would call it the thriller tour.
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I thought he didn't perform Thriller at the time because of the Jehovah's Witnesses. The JW's were the reason for the disclaimer on the music video.
 
Nite Line said:
Where do you come up with this nonsense that he didn't like his family? He loved them. Just because he had issues with them at times, it doesn't mean he didn't like them. Stop talking nonsense as usual.
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What your attitude? you can't face the fact people don't like Michael brothers? does it hurt you? not everybody gonna like everything. if you like the brothers then fine. but don't expect everyone else here too. you are a cool person but you have an attitude sometimes.
 
NatureCriminal7896 said:
What your attitude? you can't face the fact people don't like Michael brothers? does it hurt you? not everybody gonna like everything. if you like the brothers then fine. but don't expect everyone else here too. you are a cool person but you have an attitude sometimes.
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My issue is that you said that Michael didn't like his family, which isn't true. I don't care if some fans don't like his family. Stop twisting my words.
 
Nite Line said:
My issue is that you said that Michael didn't like his family, which isn't true. I don't care if some fans don't like his family. Stop twisting my words.
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If Michael was a fan of his family why was Randy refused entry into Michael home

Everything MJ did was always with Katherine in mind
 
dam2040 said:
If Michael was a fan of his family why was Randy refused entry into Michael home

Everything MJ did was always with Katherine in mind
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Like I said he had some issues with his family at times, but that doesn't mean he hated them. And God forbid that Michael thought about his mother when doing something. It's too bad that he was being a good son.

Reading some of the comments by some MJ fans, it gives me the impression that you guys have horrible relationships with your families.
 
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