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Controversial MJ Documentary Leaving Neverland [GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD]

elusive moonwalker said:
Factual ??????????????
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This is ridiculous. If it would be any other "documentary", the slightest doubt about its credibility would result in dissecting every details (perhaps even promoters backtracking and nominations/awards being withdrawn in order to avoid being associated with a possible scam), not to mention it would generate headlines. But there should be at least some kind of reaction to the emerged problems, not just trying to ignore the obvious. Who do they think they are fooling?
 
ScreenOrigami;4292391 said:
It’s Dane Baptiste talking in that piece, not the other guy. ;)
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Yeah but to Nihal, right?

And wow, "factual". That's gotta be a joke.
 
ChrisC;4292546 said:
Yeah but to Nihal, right?
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Appears like it, yes. I couldn’t answer any questions regarding Nihal, though. I’ve never even heard his name before.
 
Just adding a note about the BAFTA's Steering Group (set up on 12th May 2020) looking into lack of diversity, including in its nominations and voting groups (Because (from these nominations) it's clear that BAFTA does have significant problems):

BAFTA unveils new steering group to conduct wide-ranging review of its membership, nominations and voting processes

The British Academy of Film of Television Arts (BAFTA) have today unveiled the formation of a new steering group established to lead the review of the processes and conditions which contributed to a lack of diversity in some of the categories in this year’s British Academy Film Awards.

BAFTA is committed to driving positive change in the entertainment industry and is constantly reviewing its policies across membership, nominations and voting processes to ensure these are fit for purpose.

The steering group is comprised of a range of BAFTA board and committee members, BAFTA staff, external industry figures, independent advisors, and leading diversity advocates and academics.

The Group will be chaired by BAFTA Deputy Chair Krishnendu Majumdar. Other members include:

Kathryn Busby - Executive Vice President of TriStar Television

· Noel Clarke – Actor, Writer, Director, Producer

· Dr Sadia Habib - Academic & Co-founder RizTest

· Anna Higgs - Head of Entertainment Media Partnership, Northern Europe Facebook

· Nahrein Kemp - Film & TV Executive, Film London, runs Equal Access Network

· Kate Lee - Founder & Partner, Freuds

· Dee Poku - Founder & CEO of WIE; founder The Other Festival

· Ade Rawcliffe - Head of Diversity, ITV Commissioning

· Marc Samuelson - Producer

· Tara Saunders - Director of Studio Operations, Sony Interactive Entertainment

· Jennifer Smith - Head of Inclusion BFI

· Sam Tatlow - ThinkBIGGER Talent manager

The steering group will meet regularly during this period to lead an extensive industry consultation that will underpin this rigorous review process. They will also review the latest available research into systemic issues in the industry. In exceptional circumstances if members are unable to attend, appropriate deputies will represent them.

...The review will cover the nominations and voting process, the role of distributors, the campaigning process, and the makeup of BAFTA’s membership and ultimately how these processes and conditions might be improved with solutions can help drive positive change in the wider industry. It will focus on BAFTA’s Film Awards, but will also take into account the BAFTA Television, Television Craft and Games Awards.

Key issues to be examined include, but are not limited to: diversity, under-represented groups, access, fairness and unconscious bias, voting processes, campaigning process, volume of and access to entered titles, and representation in BAFTA’s voting membership.

All the information gathered and the Steering Group recommendations will be reviewed by an independent expert: Professor Doris Ruth Eikhof, University of Glasgow (formerly CAMEo Research

Institute, University of Leicester), who currently leads the AHRC project Everyday Diversity in the UK screen sector.

http://www.bafta.org/media-centre/press-releases/awards-review-steering-group-2020
 
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Message to <a href="https://twitter.com/BAFTA?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@BAFTA</a>:<br><br>That your committee has seen fit to support <a href="https://twitter.com/Channel4?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Channel4</a> &amp; <a href="https://twitter.com/HBO?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@HBO</a>&#39;s submission of <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/LeavingNeverland?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#LeavingNeverland</a> in &quot;factual&quot; categories, is an abomination to the name of <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GeorgeFloyd?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#GeorgeFloyd</a> and the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BLM?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#BLM</a> movement when they need MJ&#39;s voice more than ever. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/TheyDontCareAboutUs?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#TheyDontCareAboutUs</a></p>&mdash; &#11088; David Appleby &#11088; &#55349;&#56810;&#55349;&#56788;&#55349;&#56806;&#55349;&#56795; &#55349;&#56812;&#55349;&#56802;&#55349;&#56808;&#55349;&#56805; &#55349;&#56795;&#55349;&#56788;&#55349;&#56801;&#55349;&#56791;&#55349;&#56806;! (@ybelppa) <a href="https://twitter.com/ybelppa/status/1268495652981485568?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">June 4, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
The BAFTA have just announced their list of Nominees for 2020 and it is with great regret but no surprise that “Leaving Neverland” is nominated 3 times for “Director: Factual”, “Editor: Factual” and “Factual Series”.

It is really a disappointment that such institution will recognize such a monstrosity and call it “Factual”. I guess we have a different definition for that word!

We have decided to write to the BAFTA and here it is:

Dear BAFTA,
As an institution of art and Entertainment, we look to you to guide us through the film and tv art. We look to you as a serious institution recognizing true artists and talents.

However, I cannot express how disappointed you have become since you are now guided by money and greed!

Factual Documentary: “Leaving Neverland” – SURE! Did you at least look at the authenticity of those behind this film? Did you check if they were actually telling the truth or just making a movie to be a sensation and grabbing as much money as possible?

People around the world have spend the whole 2019 debunking this so called documentary. All the documents and proofs are available for you to see and proving that this is NOT a documentary but based on lies of 2 individuals and guided by the greed of an opportunistic director!

An opportunist director, Dan Reed that you have a clear affiliation to, as you have always rewarded him with awards.

“Leaving Neverland” is against other true documentaries which shows that those involved were jailed for the crimes they have perpetrated. “Leaving Neverland” is going after a voiceless man that cannot prove his innocence.

And now you want to award those involved! Living in a “Fake News” society, where black men get judged without any proofs, BAFTA should have check the authenticity of this Dan Reed’s so called documentary.

But I guess your integrity is of no value to you. So it is clear that BAFTA has no value to me and to millions of people around the world!

Have fun in your little gathering and tapping each other on the back for doing a good job while true victims and oppressed people see you for what you are: hypocrites, opportunists and liars!

MJVibe

Feel free to contact the BAFTA and express your feelings:

T: +44 (0)20 7734 0022
E: info@bafta.org

British Academy of Film and Television Arts
195 Piccadilly
London
W1J 9LN

http://www.bafta.org/television/awards/tv-2020
 
^ It's not very well written.

'How disappointed you have become' ???? 'People around the world have spend' ??? 'BAFTA should have check'???

I hope fans are not copying this to send to Bafta.
 
This is slightly off-topic, but if the new awareness of 'Black Lives Matter' helps to stop some of the MJ abuse (including mockery and trivialisation) by comedians, hopefully people might start listening to real evidence a bit more, instead of just going along with the crowd:

Leigh Francis apologises for playing black characters on Bo' Selecta in Instagram video

Comedian Leigh Francis has issued a tearful apology for portraying black celebrities on sketch show Bo&#8217; Selecta.

The comic played stars including king of pop Michael Jackson, singer Craig David and talkshow host Trisha Goddard on the show, which first aired in 2002.

Francis &#8211; who is now best-known for playing Keith Lemon &#8211; used latex facemasks for his caricatures of famous faces.

Amid a renewed focus on the Black Lives Matter movement following the death of George Floyd, Francis said he had &#8220;done a lot of talking and learning&#8221; and decided to apologise.

In a tearful video posted to Instagram, he said: &#8220;It&#8217;s been a weird few days, I&#8217;ve sat and thought about things and what I could post to try and help things.

&#8220;Back in 2002 I did a show called Bo&#8217; Selecta, I portrayed many black people. Back then I didn&#8217;t think anything about it, people didn&#8217;t say anything, I&#8217;m not going to blame other people.

&#8220;Been talking to some people, I didn&#8217;t realise how offensive it was back then.

&#8220;I just want to apologise, I just want to say sorry for any upset I caused whether I was Michael Jackson, Craig David, Trisha Goddard, all people I&#8217;m a big fan of. I guess we&#8217;re all on a learning journey.&#8221;

In the caption, Francis, 47, apologised again and used the hashtag #blacklivesmatter.

https://www.standard.co.uk/showbiz/...TAp-BhbKHkYW4cPw#Echobox=1591340132&gsc.tab=0
 
myosotis;4292690 said:
This is slightly off-topic, but if the new awareness of 'Black Lives Matter' helps to stop some of the MJ abuse (including mockery and trivialisation) by comedians, hopefully people might start listening to real evidence a bit more, instead of just going along with the crowd:

Leigh Francis apologises for playing black characters on Bo' Selecta in Instagram video
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The Guardian has picked up the story, too. :)

I was surprised that he says he’s a big fan of these people. I never thought any of these offensive comedians would actually be fans of MJ. Certainly not fans the way we are fans, but let’s say casual fans. Still, I didn’t expect that. Much respect to him for making that Instagram video, and I hope it helps others to come forward now. :)

But I absolutely hate it when people follow up their apologies with that “learning journey” crap. Dude, you’re not on a scenic boat trip to the Caribbean. You better break out that speed boat and catch up immediately.

EDIT: I just saw a snippet from that show. OMG. Do yourselves a favor and don’t look it up. :puke:
 
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He has nothing to apologise for imo. He always sended up ppl he was a fan of. There was never anything malicious racial or anything else about it.lots of the celebs joined in m on the show.and thought it was funny. Mj up the giving tree in central park was a classic. Supposedly mj thought it was a funny as !@$/ aswell. Hes a slap stick comedian who does send ups of lots of things including his own (mine) city. Always light hearted and non malicious unlike many today. Agree with famous ex footballer john barnes on this
 
elusive moonwalker;4292703 said:
He has nothing to apologise for imo. He always sended up ppl he was a fan of. There was never anything malicious racial or anything else about it.lots of the celebs joined in m on the show.and thought it was funny. Mj up the giving tree in central park was a classic. Supposedly mj thought it was a funny as !@$/ aswell. Hes a slap stick comedian who does send ups of lots of things including his own (mine) city. Always light hearted and non malicious unlike many today. Agree with famous ex footballer john barnes on this
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Every message has a sender and a receiver. If you&#8217;re sending to an audience that already has a problem with racism, jokes like those (no matter the intention of the sender) will further fan the flames of racism.
 
Leigh is legit a MASSIVE MJ fan. Honestly, the vast majority of his work around Michael has come from his sheer affection towards him.

When Michael passed, he did a special on British TV that ended on a touching note and he vowed from then on never to do the character again out of respect for the man he loved. But Leigh continues to infuse Michael's spirit in most of his work. The titles to the most recent seasons of Celebrity Juice are a riff on the Leave Me Alone video.

I am disappointed, personally, as I feel his apology was unnecessary and having some impression of Leigh's character.
 
ChrisC said:
Leigh is legit a MASSIVE MJ fan. Honestly, the vast majority of his work around Michael has come from his sheer affection towards him.

When Michael passed, he did a special on British TV that ended on a touching note and he vowed from then on never to do the character again out of respect for the man he loved. But Leigh continues to infuse Michael's spirit in most of his work. The titles to the most recent seasons of Celebrity Juice are a riff on the Leave Me Alone video.

I am disappointed, personally, as I feel his apology was unnecessary and having some impression of Leigh's character.
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Really?

 
Have MJ fans taken over QAnon? :fear:

(I've seen some recent MJ-related postings, and they were nothing new, so I don't know if this is meant to be a bad joke).

obxPAoJ.jpg
 
ScreenOrigami;4292720 said:
I can&#8217;t even watch the entire thing. It&#8217;s &#8211; for the lack of a better word &#8211; horrible.
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I didnt like his later sketches.he did one of mj in prison. That left a bad taste. It was as bo selecta was coming to an end so he was prob starting to scrape the barrell. but his early ones were very funny. He caricutured all sorts of famous ppl. There was never any intention of been anything in them. He just did OTT caricutures of celebs as you can see in the masks he weared which are like the caricutire drawings you can get made. If ppl viewed his act as racist or anti scottish or attacking his own city then thats a shame as that was certainly never his attenion. Still got my cha'mone mutha ****** t.shirt. somewhere lol
 
elusive moonwalker;4292733 said:
I didnt like his later sketches.he did one of mj in prison. That left a bad taste. It was as bo selecta was coming to an end so he was prob starting to scrape the barrell. but his early ones were very funny. He caricutured all sorts of famous ppl. There was never any intention of been anything in them. He just did OTT caricutures of celebs as you can see in the masks he weared which are like the caricutire drawings you can get made. If ppl viewed his act as racist or anti scottish or attacking his own city then thats a shame as that was certainly never his attenion. Still got my cha'mone mutha ****** t.shirt. somewhere lol
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Did you see my earlier comment?

ScreenOrigami;4292706 said:
Every message has a sender and a receiver. If you&#8217;re sending to an audience that already has a problem with racism, jokes like those (no matter the intention of the sender) will further fan the flames of racism.
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Also, racism and being &#8220;anti-Scottish&#8221; is far from being on the same level.
 
xenophobia ( prejudice against someone because of the country they come from) is just as bad as racism or anti semitism islamaphobia etc. All the above lead to the same horrible things.

But the skits were never racist to begin with. If you are only calling a skit racist because the person being caricutured is black then im not sure thats a valid argument. He caricutured everyone the same regardless.he caricutured their personalities. The skit of mel B took the pee out of her accent and the city she came from which is the same as Lee. Nothing to do with her race.

We will have to agree to disagree on this one?
 
Same treatment for everyone is equality. What we need is equity. Jokes that are funny when they are about a white person aren&#8217;t necessarily funny when they are about a black person, because of the history of 400+ years of oppression of black people.
 
True. But some may see something when there is nothing because that is what they are looking for.

Anyway we are going way off topic here . ? out.
 
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myosotis said:
Have MJ fans taken over QAnon? :fear:

(I've seen some recent MJ-related postings, and they were nothing new, so I don't know if this is meant to be a bad joke).

obxPAoJ.jpg
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That's... interesting. I'm not holding my breath, from what I've seen QAnon is hit or miss with their leaks and I wouldn't bet my money on them being a real gov insider. What's more, they don't come with the receipts, so I wouldn't expect any actual proof outside of their word. Assuming it's a legit account of course, I never was interested in Q enough to do my research on it.
 
ScreenOrigami;4292720 said:
I can&#8217;t even watch the entire thing. It&#8217;s &#8211; for the lack of a better word &#8211; horrible.
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It's a shame because actually, the way Uri and Michael's friendship dynamic is portrayed in that particular set of sketches is bang on the money for me. If you take the time to view it and understand it you can totally see how Leigh is massively critical of Uri and completely in Michael's corner.
 
ChrisC;4292887 said:
It's a shame because actually, the way Uri and Michael's friendship dynamic is portrayed in that particular set of sketches is bang on the money for me. If you take the time to view it and understand it you can totally see how Leigh is massively critical of Uri and completely in Michael's corner.
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Thanks, but I&#8217;d rather find a less repulsive way to explore their &#8220;friendship&#8221; dynamic. ;)
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">“Kings don’t swat flies...and he’s a fly.”<br>“No, but we shoot monkeys, though.”<br><br>This had me screaming. &#128514;<br>He had all the smoke for Wade. <br><br>I need Siggy to start a YouTube channel. Lol <a href="https://t.co/ZFIswnqWWn">pic.twitter.com/ZFIswnqWWn</a></p>&mdash; PHOENIX (@PhoenixLaNegra) <a href="https://twitter.com/PhoenixLaNegra/status/1269408711690371073?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">June 6, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
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