The Will.i.am tracks [Discussion]

OnirMJ;4308103 said:
It wasn't about the money directly. It was about songwriting credits. The guy from Yellow Magic Orchestra wanted more share of the royalties and MJ and his management wanted 50-50 equal split which I think was fair share.

The 50-50 equal split that Michael Jackson and his management wanted was not fair share.

Chris Mosdell (the lyricist of the song) explained why it was not fair share:

“…I didn’t know who Michael Jackson was - I wasn’t into that whole soul disco stuff … When Michael Jackson recorded it [the ‘Behind The Mask’ song], he also added an extra melody line and a few extra lyrics, so they wanted to split the royalties - which is quite impossible. You can’t take a Beatles song and add a melody line, a few more lyrics, and ask for fifty percent…” (Chris Mosdell)

Derek1984;4308081 said:
Not to derail the topic but I doubt Behind The Mask was in serious consideration for the Thriller album. First off, it never would've fit on the album. They had to condense the album as it was and what are you leaving off? Baby Be Mine? Second, you mean to tell me if they REALLY wanted that song on the album, they didn't have the money to make it happen?

‘Behind The Mask’ was in serious consideration for the ‘Thriller’ album, and the proof for that is the fact that Michael Jackson and his management legally tried so hard at that time to resolve the song's royalties disputes in order to include it on the ‘Thriller’ album.
 
mj_frenzy;4308151 said:
The 50-50 equal split that Michael Jackson and his management wanted was not fair share.

So now you are Chris Mosdell? It's HIS opinion, nothing more.


mj_frenzy;4308151 said:
Chris Mosdell (the lyricist of the song) explained why it was not fair share:

…I didn’t know who Michael Jackson was - I wasn’t into that whole soul disco stuff … When Michael Jackson recorded it [the ‘Behind The Mask’ song], he also added an extra melody line and a few extra lyrics, so they wanted to split the royalties - which is quite impossible. You can’t take a Beatles song and add a melody line, a few more lyrics, and ask for fifty percent…” (Chris Mosdell)


How arrogant. I love some YMO, but comparing himself with the Beatles like that? And Michael "added a few lyrics"? The original has NO lyrics apart from the vocoder refrain, which basically only serves as background vocal in Michaels version. A 50-50 share would for sure have been fair.

Would be interesting to know, exactly when Mosdell said that. Seems he (or rather YMO as a group and/or their record label) already thought differently a few years later, when they found agreements with Greg Phillinganes and Eric Clapton to release their covers of Michaels version.

To further cite from Chris Cadman's "For The Record":
"Phillinganes, who also played with his band, brought the song to Eric Clapton's attention. Clapton's cover version, on which Phillinganes played keyboards and sang backing vocals, hit no. 15 in the UK in 1987. This version, curiously, failed to credit Michael as one of the song's co-writers - but Chris Mosdell has confirmed Michael does takes 50% of the song-writing royalties. "
https://issuu.com/sasha_nikitin/docs/for_the_record




I also doubt that "Behind The Mask" was seriously considered for Thriller, to a degree that it would have made the final cut. It would have been so out of place style-wise.

We don't really know how hard Michael and Quincy fought for it, if so. Cadman only vaguely states "Legal battles meant Michael's version didn't make his Thriller album and remains unreleased". But what "legal battles"? If you change someone's song, and the original author says "no", then that's the end of story. There are no legal grounds to force him to agree to get your uncalled remix/edit/version released.

With "legal battles" Cadman probably simply meant to say that the copyrights could not be cleared with YMO / YMO's record label at that time. It doesn't make sense otherwise, or we're missing a chunk of the story.
 
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Who modernised Behind The Mask. Never knew the story behind the 2010 mix of that one
 
Who modernised Behind The Mask. Never knew the story behind the 2010 mix of that one

It was re-produced by Estate co-executor John McClain, who also modernized/remixed "This Is It," "Much Too Soon," and the solo version of "Love Never Felt So Good." There isn't much background on it beyond that.
 
So are we ever going to get the 1982 original version of Behind The Mask?
 
mj_frenzy;4308151 said:
The 50-50 equal split that Michael Jackson and his management wanted was not fair share.

Chris Mosdell (the lyricist of the song) explained why it was not fair share:

“…I didn’t know who Michael Jackson was - I wasn’t into that whole soul disco stuff … When Michael Jackson recorded it [the ‘Behind The Mask’ song], he also added an extra melody line and a few extra lyrics, so they wanted to split the royalties - which is quite impossible. You can’t take a Beatles song and add a melody line, a few more lyrics, and ask for fifty percent…” (Chris Mosdell)



‘Behind The Mask’ was in serious consideration for the ‘Thriller’ album, and the proof for that is the fact that Michael Jackson and his management legally tried so hard at that time to resolve the song's royalties disputes in order to include it on the ‘Thriller’ album.

Have you heard their version? MJ didn't add "few extra lyrics". He wrote all the lyrics except for the vocoder chorus that he basically sampled from the original.
 
mj_frenzy;4308151 said:
The 50-50 equal split that Michael Jackson and his management wanted was not fair share.

Chris Mosdell (the lyricist of the song) explained why it was not fair share:

“…I didn’t know who Michael Jackson was - I wasn’t into that whole soul disco stuff … When Michael Jackson recorded it [the ‘Behind The Mask’ song], he also added an extra melody line and a few extra lyrics, so they wanted to split the royalties - which is quite impossible. You can’t take a Beatles song and add a melody line, a few more lyrics, and ask for fifty percent…” (Chris Mosdell)



‘Behind The Mask’ was in serious consideration for the ‘Thriller’ album, and the proof for that is the fact that Michael Jackson and his management legally tried so hard at that time to resolve the song's royalties disputes in order to include it on the ‘Thriller’ album.

Knock it off man, MJ wrote all the lyrics for the song. 50/50 was a more than fair split.
 
Bobi MJ;4311465 said:
Some useful information about the tracks and the album they worked on! http://moonwalker58.com/2008e.html

Thank you for this! I know these have been circulating for years, but it’s nice to have them all in one place.

So, a timeline of Will’s comments:

- Feb. 2007: Will tells Rolling Stone that he and MJ outlined eight songs together and recorded one, “I’m Dreamin’.”
- Aug. 2007: Will tells reporters during a South Korean press conference that he and MJ recorded a second track, “The Future,” and are working on a third, “Still the King.”
- Aug. 2007: Will tells Ryan Seacrest that he and MJ have worked on “three or four” songs, of which two are finished. He reveals that he wrote two tracks, MJ wrote a third, and they collaborated on a fourth.
- Sep. 2007: Will tells Rolling Stone that they’ve “finished some songs.”
- Oct. 2007: Will tells reporters during a Pepsi press conference that he’s “done three songs” with MJ.
- Oct. 2007: Will tells an internet journalist that MJ has recorded vocals at his home studio.

So, basically, up until MJ’s death Will has been insisting that they finished at least two tracks together. Then suddenly his tone changes, and nothing is finished. And then he won’t release anything because MJ isn’t here to approve it. And then he’ll only consider releasing them if Katherine Jackson herself asks him to. And then he tries to get the tracks on his own album. And, as of 2018, he’s back to “I’ll never release them.”

He’s full of it. They have finished music together and he’s just being an idiot.
 
AlwaysThere;4311471 said:
Thank you for this! I know these have been circulating for years, but it’s nice to have them all in one place.

So, a timeline of Will’s comments:

- Feb. 2007: Will tells Rolling Stone that he and MJ outlined eight songs together and recorded one, “I’m Dreamin’.”
- Aug. 2007: Will tells reporters during a South Korean press conference that he and MJ recorded a second track, “The Future,” and are working on a third, “Still the King.”
- Aug. 2007: Will tells Ryan Seacrest that he and MJ have worked on “three or four” songs, of which two are finished. He reveals that he wrote two tracks, MJ wrote a third, and they collaborated on a fourth.
- Sep. 2007: Will tells Rolling Stone that they’ve “finished some songs.”
- Oct. 2007: Will tells reporters during a Pepsi press conference that he’s “done three songs” with MJ.
- Oct. 2007: Will tells an internet journalist that MJ has recorded vocals at his home studio.

So, basically, up until MJ’s death Will has been insisting that they finished at least two tracks together. Then suddenly his tone changes, and nothing is finished. And then he won’t release anything because MJ isn’t here to approve it. And then he’ll only consider releasing them if Katherine Jackson herself asks him to. And then he tries to get the tracks on his own album. And, as of 2018, he’s back to “I’ll never release them.”

He’s full of it. They have finished music together and he’s just being an idiot.

Yeah, well the bottom line is this is about money. Both the E$tate and Will just can't agree, so they agree to disagree and these tracks are just left in a vault. There might be a time in "the future" (no pun intended), Will needs the money and they work something out.
 
In my opinion Will isn't full of it. he just wanna respect Michael's wishes. if Michael told him to released the songs then we wouldn't be here talking about them. if will wanna release the songs he need to ask his mom while she's still on this earth.
 
NatureCriminal7896;4311479 said:
In my opinion Will isn't full of it. he just wanna respect Michael's wishes. if Michael told him to released the songs then we wouldn't be here talking about them. if will wanna release the songs he need to ask his mom while she's still on this earth.

I would be inclined to agree if he didn’t spend three years slamming the Estate for going against Michael’s wishes and then making a full 180 and asking permission to release “I’m Dreamin’” on his own album (and then proceed to continue his “I’ll never release them” spiel thereafter).
 
AlwaysThere;4311471 said:
Thank you for this! I know these have been circulating for years, but it’s nice to have them all in one place.

So, a timeline of Will’s comments:

- Feb. 2007: Will tells Rolling Stone that he and MJ outlined eight songs together and recorded one, “I’m Dreamin’.”
- Aug. 2007: Will tells reporters during a South Korean press conference that he and MJ recorded a second track, “The Future,” and are working on a third, “Still the King.”
- Aug. 2007: Will tells Ryan Seacrest that he and MJ have worked on “three or four” songs, of which two are finished. He reveals that he wrote two tracks, MJ wrote a third, and they collaborated on a fourth.
- Sep. 2007: Will tells Rolling Stone that they’ve “finished some songs.”
- Oct. 2007: Will tells reporters during a Pepsi press conference that he’s “done three songs” with MJ.
- Oct. 2007: Will tells an internet journalist that MJ has recorded vocals at his home studio.

So, basically, up until MJ’s death Will has been insisting that they finished at least two tracks together. Then suddenly his tone changes, and nothing is finished. And then he won’t release anything because MJ isn’t here to approve it. And then he’ll only consider releasing them if Katherine Jackson herself asks him to. And then he tries to get the tracks on his own album. And, as of 2018, he’s back to “I’ll never release them.”

He’s full of it. They have finished music together and he’s just being an idiot.

William is a phony and I don't trust a word that comes out of his mouth anymore. All this talk about 'he would only consider releasing songs he did with MJ if Katherine gave her approval' is complete nonsense. It's all about the money.

Frankly speaking, I am starting to lose my interest in the Will-i-am tracks. I'm desperate for some unreleased music, but because of Will-i-am changing his tone regarding the MJ songs, I don't really care if these songs stay in the vault forever.
 
AlwaysThere;4311484 said:
I would be inclined to agree if he didn’t spend three years slamming the Estate for going against Michael’s wishes and then making a full 180 and asking permission to release “I’m Dreamin’” on his own album (and then proceed to continue his “I’ll never release them” spiel thereafter).

oh wow.
 
Well i don't believe him much anymore either if he release one track and not the others. like others said, if he gets low on money we probably gonna see those tracks in the future.
 
I'm dying to hear them simply because they're original post-trial songs, of which we have none. I don't care for Will as a producer or songwriter, but I want to hear anything and everything Michael was working on at that time.
 
AlwaysThere;4311508 said:
I'm dying to hear them simply because they're original post-trial songs, of which we have none. I don't care for Will as a producer or songwriter, but I want to hear anything and everything Michael was working on at that time.

Me too. Anything after 2005 is absolute gold to me and probably the era I’m most interested in hearing. I wonder just how close we were to any official releases at any point from 05-09.
 
Will.i.am has also said he has unreleased songs from Prince but will never release them either. If the MJ songs are completed enough vocally then the estate should work something out with him. Would be great to hear some of the recent stuff.
I'm dying to hear them simply because they're original post-trial songs, of which we have none. I don't care for Will as a producer or songwriter, but I want to hear anything and everything Michael was working on at that time.
 
How arrogant. I love some YMO, but comparing himself with the Beatles like that? And Michael "added a few lyrics"? The original has NO lyrics apart from the vocoder refrain, which basically only serves as background vocal in Michaels version. A 50-50 share would for sure have been fair.

Would be interesting to know, exactly when Mosdell said that. Seems he (or rather YMO as a group and/or their record label) already thought differently a few years later, when they found agreements with Greg Phillinganes and Eric Clapton to release their covers of Michaels version.

To further cite from Chris Cadman's "For The Record":
"Phillinganes, who also played with his band, brought the song to Eric Clapton's attention. Clapton's cover version, on which Phillinganes played keyboards and sang backing vocals, hit no. 15 in the UK in 1987. This version, curiously, failed to credit Michael as one of the song's co-writers - but Chris Mosdell has confirmed Michael does takes 50% of the song-writing royalties. "
https://issuu.com/sasha_nikitin/docs/for_the_record




I also doubt that "Behind The Mask" was seriously considered for Thriller, to a degree that it would have made the final cut. It would have been so out of place style-wise.

We don't really know how hard Michael and Quincy fought for it, if so. Cadman only vaguely states "Legal battles meant Michael's version didn't make his Thriller album and remains unreleased". But what "legal battles"? If you change someone's song, and the original author says "no", then that's the end of story. There are no legal grounds to force him to agree to get your uncalled remix/edit/version released.

I agree with every word. I was thinking the exact same thing about Chris Mosdell - arrogant.
He didn't know who Michael Jackson was?? Really?? I highly doubt that is true.
 
I'm dying to hear them simply because they're original post-trial songs, of which we have none. I don't care for Will as a producer or songwriter, but I want to hear anything and everything Michael was working on at that time.

Same for me.
 
I agree with every word. I was thinking the exact same thing about Chris Mosdell - arrogant.
He didn't know who Michael Jackson was?? Really?? I highly doubt that is true.

I guess it's possible. Pre-Thriller Michael was 'just' one of many black soul/disco artists.
And Mosdell's home was rather the international artsy eclectic music scene back then.

YMO were HUGE in Japan back then, but still, comparing the song he wrote for them to a Beatles classic is off. :D
 
Dude, I also really want to hear anything after 2005. I really want to hear "The Future", "I'm Still The King", "D.I.E", and "Water". They all are recorded after 2005.
Dude, I also really want to hear anything after 2005. I really want to hear "The Future", "I'm Still The King", "D.I.E", and "Water". They all are recorded after 2005.
hold my hand, best of joy are tracks that were released after 2005)
 
Always do you know who is the most reliable source , I don't know nowadays but back in the this is it days/making last album?
That person is on this forum!
 
Re: The Will.I.Am Tracks

Wow, some of you guys are really harsh with those tracks, not wanting them to be released at all. I can understand being cautious. I don't like Will.I.Am at all, either. But I really wanna hear those tracks, they are one of the most recent songs MJ recorded. It would be awesome if it's true that 3-4 tracks were nearly completed. Remember, there aren't many finished post trial songs!
Also, don't forget that MJ himself worked on those songs. I'm sure they don't sound like Will.I.Ams shallow recent songs.
I agree with you .. I really want to hear them. But it might be selfish. I want them to be as michael planned off course.
 
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