Did Michael rework "Lovin* You" in 2003?

[Moromete]

As we now, there*s a track, from "Bad" era, on "Xscape" album called "Loving You".
BUT, there*s a track registered in copyright office called also "Lovin* You", Brad Buxer and Michael Prince being credited there.
Now, 2 CDs are being auctioned now: http://www.gottahaverockandroll.com...chael_jackson__lovin_you__original_recordings

So, what do you think? Could Michael have worked on an different song or did he rework the same song, as well as he did on "Cheater" and "Scared On The Moon", which he planned to finish them in 2009? :busted:

 

[Zakk]

As we now, there*s a track, from "Bad" era, on "Xscape" album called "Loving You".
BUT, there*s a track registered in copyright office called also "Lovin* You", Brad Buxer and Michael Prince being credited there.
Now, 2 CDs are being auctioned now: http://www.gottahaverockandroll.com...chael_jackson__lovin_you__original_recordings

So, what do you think? Could Michael have worked on an different song or did he rework the same song, as well as he did on "Cheater" and "Scared On The Moon", which he planned to finish them in 2009? :busted:

I*d love both of these mixes to be released, i adore this song.. L.A Reid said this song was recorded in 2003, maybe they used the BAD Era demo for the original & the recent recording for the new mix by Timbaland?

 

[OnirMJ]

My opinion is that he definitely worked on the song post 1985 when he first recorded it. But like almost all other songs that he worked on later (Scared On The Moon, Cheater, The Way You Love Me, A Place With No Name...), he would just work on the music and he would not re-record the vocals. Vocals sound perfect on 1985 version. So I think that later versions, possibly that one that LA mentioned from 2003, has the exact same vocals with different music/production.

 

[OnirMJ]

I*d love both of these mixes to be released, i adore this song.. L.A Reid said this song was recorded in 2003, maybe they used the BAD Era demo for the original & the recent recording for the new mix by Timbaland?

They used the same vocals. And Matt Forger said they were recorded before Bad sessions started. That is cca 1985.

 

[Themidwestcowboy]

Wow, I wonder how loving you from 2003 sounds. I want to hear them all, now! Lol

Btw I think he even worked on the song with buxer in 89/90

 

[AlwaysThere]

The XSCAPE version of Loving You and the registered title are two entirely separate tracks.

The registration is for a song Brad Buxer worked on with Frank Cascio in 2003. There aren't any vocals. As with a vast majority of the registrations done post-June 2009, it's incorrectly attributed to Michael and Michael Prince, neither of whom ever worked on the song.

Some fans need to sit down and properly think these things out. This is yet another case of one person making an assumption and another person taking it as fact.

 

[Themidwestcowboy]

The XSCAPE version of Loving You and the registered title are two entirely separate tracks.

The registration is for a song Brad Buxer worked on with Frank Cascio in 2003. There aren't any vocals. As with a vast majority of the registrations done post-June 2009, it's incorrectly attributed to Michael and Michael Prince, neither of whom ever worked on the song.


Some fans need to sit down and properly think these things out. This is yet another case of one person making an assumption and another person taking it as fact.

How do you know all this, if I may ask? I always see you post stuff and claim it as facts but never provide an actual source or anything concrete besides your word

 

[Dilan]

The XSCAPE version of Loving You and the registered title are two entirely separate tracks.

The registration is for a song Brad Buxer worked on with Frank Cascio in 2003. There aren't any vocals. As with a vast majority of the registrations done post-June 2009, it's incorrectly attributed to Michael and Michael Prince, neither of whom ever worked on the song.

Some fans need to sit down and properly think these things out. This is yet another case of one person making an assumption and another person taking it as fact.

LOL but you constantly make assumptions and try to make them sound like facts? I remember months ago you tried to sound like you had background information on the 2007 songs because you know an 'engineer thats works for the estate'. You said you'd send me copies of the emails you get sent. Constant reminders and it never happened.

So before you start telling people to 'sit down and properly think' i suggest you do the same until you can back up your claims.

 

[OnirMJ]

He is right this time. He read D.S. article about the song. And D.S. have direct contact with Brad Buxer, Matt Forger and Michael Durham Prince.

So yes, some of us were wrong about Loving You and Lovin' You being the same song. Partly because of what LA Reid said - that MJ recorded it in 2003.

 

[OnirMJ]

D.S. article:

"Questions regarding CDs labelled ‘Michael Jackson “Lovin You” Original Recordings’ being sold at auction answered

In five days time, in the evening of Friday, December 5, 2014, an online auction of several items – including an empty prescription pill bottle and numerous pieces of clothing - originating from the private collection of Michael Jackson’s longtime friend and former personal assistant, Frank Cascio, will end. Another of the items up for grabs in the auction – being held by Gotta Have Rock and Roll - is a set of compact discs labelled ‘Michael Jackson “Lovin You” Original Recordings’.

Some of the Gotta Have Rock and Roll items from Cascio’s private collection come with a purported letter of provenance from him, while others, including the “Lovin You” discs, do not.

The purpose of this article is to shed light on what is on the “Lovin You” discs, in case anyone is planning on placing a bid.

The handwritten date notations on the discs timestamp them as being from 2003, and the “Buxer” notation on the bottom is in reference to Jackson’s longtime collaborator/composer, Brad Buxer. The “Frank” notation refers to the discs’ original possessor, Frank Cascio.

Some fans have speculated that the discs could contain a 2003 re-working of the mid-80s track “Loving You” – a song released on the Xscape album earlier this year. It is a well-documented fact that Jackson would often bring old songs out and re-work them years (and even decades) after their initial conception.

However, that is not the case in regards to the “Lovin You” discs up for auction. The track being auctioned is completely unrelated to the “Loving You” on the Xscape album, which was never worked on again after being mixed by Matt Forger at Jackson’s Hayvenhurst studio prior to the Bad album sessions.

In fact, the contents of the auctioned discs are instrumentals of a different song altogether, also titled “Lovin You” (but without the ‘g’ that the Xscape version has). The music on the discs was composed by Brad Buxer in 2003, who worked with Frank Cascio in an attempt to embellish the track. In his spare time Buxer often worked with Jackson’s friends on their own personal music ideas and projects, including the King of Pop’s driver, Gary.

When working on “Lovin You,” Buxer recorded Cascio attempting to perform a series of beat box sounds, moans and finger snaps as he tried to come up with something that could be applied to the track before presenting it to Jackson. While these appear in the multi-track session files, they were not used on the track itself.

What will interest Jackson fans the most is that there are no Michael Jackson vocals on any version of this track. Not 2.7 (pictured above on the left) or 9.1 (on the right).

A copyright claim for “Lovin You” – along with a collection of other ideas, demos and songs in various states of completion, found on Buxer’s hard drive – was filed with the Library of Congress U.S. Copyright Office in March 2010, nine months after Jackson’s death. Cascio is not listed as a copyright claimant, author or rights and permissions holder on the copyright application/registration.

The “Lovin You” music remains unreleased, unheard by the public, and there are currently no bids on Gotta Have Rock and Roll‘s online auction."

 

[AlwaysThere]

How do you know all this, if I may ask? I always see you post stuff and claim it as facts but never provide an actual source or anything concrete besides your word

I expected such a comment. As Onir pointed out, this comes from a ****** ******* article over at his website that (evidently) comes from the mouth of Buxer himself.

LOL but you constantly make assumptions and try to make them sound like facts? I remember months ago you tried to sound like you had background information on the 2007 songs because you know an 'engineer thats works for the estate'. You said you'd send me copies of the emails you get sent. Constant reminders and it never happened.

So before you start telling people to 'sit down and properly think' i suggest you do the same until you can back up your claims.

I'll probably get flagged for arguments, but so be it.

Explain to me why I, of everyone on this board, is expected to prove what I know. There are several members who make comments on unreleased music as if they know exactly what they're talking about, yet they're passed without question. That list over at MJJ Village, for example. Folks look at that like it's the Holy Grail and use it as a point of reference time and time again, despite the fact that it has a huge list of incorrect information. Someone comes to this board, throws out a quote from that website, and members start speaking like it's complete fact. Yet when I (and others) actually contribute real information that can be proven, we're shot down with claims of lies.

From here on out, if it'll keep you at bay, I'll start providing "proof" with my posts. I've already been credited with the Lovin' You story, which you could have figured out yourself if you took the time to look rather than go with what everyone else says.

 

[Themidwestcowboy]

I expected such a comment. As Onir pointed out, this comes from a ****** ******* article over at his website that (evidently) comes from the mouth of Buxer himself.

Thank you. That was all I really wanted to know.

 

[Dilan]

I expected such a comment. As Onir pointed out, this comes from a ****** ******* article over at his website that (evidently) comes from the mouth of Buxer himself.



I'll probably get flagged for arguments, but so be it.

Explain to me why I, of everyone on this board, is expected to prove what I know. There are several members who make comments on unreleased music as if they know exactly what they're talking about, yet they're passed without question. That list over at MJJ Village, for example. Folks look at that like it's the Holy Grail and use it as a point of reference time and time again, despite the fact that it has a huge list of incorrect information. Someone comes to this board, throws out a quote from that website, and members start speaking like it's complete fact. Yet when I (and others) actually contribute real information that can be proven, we're shot down with claims of lies.

From here on out, if it'll keep you at bay, I'll start providing "proof" with my posts. I've already been credited with the Lovin' You story, which you could have figured out yourself if you took the time to look rather than go with what everyone else says.

By MJJVillage I take it you mean the unreleased songs wikipedia page (if not where is this site)? With some of the strange collaborators included on that list I don't think its reliable and i'd be surprised if anyone else is stupid enough to. When you say their are members who make comments on unreleased music who particularly are you talking about? People like Korgnex and a few others who make claims I do question its just a matter of whether or not I get a response and if it is worth persisting.

I am not intentionally trying to make your life more difficult but when you feel like it I and am sure many others would appreciate you providing 'proof' with your posts (as I see you have just done in the other thread) because they are interesting things to read. I've seen their that all information you provided on all of those songs can be traced through the internet.

However, for 'exclusive' information you have that can only be sourced through the elite links that you, would it be possible for you to give an example of a claim that you have made based off an exclusive source and then provide your evidence eg the email (or whatever with blurred names obviously.)