Latest on MJJC

What made Invincible such an expensive album ?

mj_frenzy

Proud Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
2,782
Points
113
Location
Greece
Country
Greece
I know that some of the best studios, producers, songwriters were hired for recording Invincible, but 30 million dollars are too much. Which are the other factors that made that album so expensive ?
 
Last edited:
I think they include EVERYTHING in that budget.
Producers, song writers, engineers, studio time, travel expenses, etc.
I dunno if promotion is included in that. They might also include time spent on unreleased material.
 
AtlasAir said:
I think they include EVERYTHING in that budget.
Producers, song writers, engineers, studio time, travel expenses, etc.
I dunno if promotion is included in that. They might also include time spent on unreleased material.
Click to expand...

I am pretty sure that promotion was not included. On the contrary, that 30 million investion was used as a justification for not spending further money promoting it.
But it still doesn't make sense to me the total amount of money they spent in a period when the final countdown for CD-format had already started
 
It was recorded in various places and he worked with various people. Some who never made it to the album. I guess it all adds up (we know he was a big spender), but still, yes, it does seem like a lot.

While I always will feel it was majorly under-promoted, I totally get and believe the things Tommy Motolla said about that era.
 
The planned INVINCIBLE World Tour would have shot up sales by a fair margin i'm sure, it's unfortunate that it was cancelled!
 
AtlasAir said:
It was recorded in various places and he worked with various people. Some who never made it to the album. I guess it all adds up (we know he was a big spender), but still, yes, it does seem like a lot.

While I always will feel it was majorly under-promoted, I totally get and believe the things Tommy Motolla said about that era.
Click to expand...
What did Mottola say?
 
Zakk said:
The planned INVINCIBLE World Tour would have shot up sales by a fair margin i'm sure, it's unfortunate that it was cancelled!
Click to expand...

Was any official info about the (so-called) Invincible World Tour (rehearsals, songs set-list, dates, etc) or just hype & hysteria ?
 
mj_frenzy said:
Was any official info about the (so-called) Invincible World Tour (rehearsals, songs set-list, dates, etc) or just hype & hysteria ?
Click to expand...

Michael Durham Prince confirmed they were gonna Tour with Invincible in the 'THIS IS IT' special features, but it was right when 9/11 happened and all major artists cancelled there tours.
 
That doesn't tie in with the story of MJ refusing to tour. I suspect 9/11 was just an excuse. Michael clearly had little interest in performing around this time. He only did MSG because he was strong-armed into it by the brothers and it was painfully obvious that he really didn't want to be there.
 
For example he paid Rodney Jerkins not to work with any other artist during those 2 and a half years. Rodney was a top producer during that time and MJ paid him his 2 annual salaries. Also Jackson began recording new material for the album in October 1997, and finished with "You Are My Life" being recorded only eight weeks before the album's release in October 2001. That is 4 full years! In very expensive studios. He often booked several studios at the same time and ended up working in just one or none. Also Teddy Riley spoke that MJ build him a new studio for Invincible with all new state of the art equipment. Also, he had very expensive lifestyle (hotels, entourage, bodyguards...).
 
MattyJam said:
That doesn't tie in with the story of MJ refusing to tour. I suspect 9/11 was just an excuse. Michael clearly had little interest in performing around this time. He only did MSG because he was strong-armed into it by the brothers and it was painfully obvious that he really didn't want to be there.
Click to expand...

Very true, and if you compare MSG with previous concerts, MJ gave the impression of not enjoying performing in front of people, more like an ordeal seemed to me
 
OnirMJ said:
For example he paid Rodney Jerkins not to work with any other artist during those 2 and a half years. Rodney was a top producer during that time and MJ paid him his 2 annual salaries. Also Jackson began recording new material for the album in October 1997, and finished with "You Are My Life" being recorded only eight weeks before the album's release in October 2001. That is 4 full years! In very expensive studios. He often booked several studios at the same time and ended up working in just one or none. Also Teddy Riley spoke that MJ build him a new studio for Invincible with all new state of the art equipment. Also, he had very expensive lifestyle (hotels, entourage, bodyguards...).
Click to expand...

I suppose for fear of having his new material leaked
 
mj_frenzy said:
Very true, and if you compare MSG with previous concerts, MJ gave the impression of not enjoying performing in front of people, more like an ordeal seemed to me
Click to expand...

Definately.

One of the bits that always stood out to me was when MJ first came onstage with his brothers. Just the way he took his helmet off and looked out into the crowd, scratching his face nervously, looking self-conscious and uncomfortable.... a million miles away from the fierce opening of the Dangerous concert.
 
mj_frenzy said:
I suppose for fear of having his new material leaked
Click to expand...

I don't think so. Those were late '90 and early '00. He just had too much money and didn't care for expenses. He thought that everything would come back to him x10 when the album is released. But he didn't think that Sony would think differently.
 
Zakk said:
Michael Durham Prince confirmed they were gonna Tour with Invincible in the 'THIS IS IT' special features, but it was right when 9/11 happened and all major artists cancelled there tours.
Click to expand...

I feel the need to point out that Michael was not contractually obligated to go out on tour, nor did he have any desire to. There were probably tentative discussions at best, but rest assured that Michael didn't lose any sleep over not agreeing to do it.
 
Threatened was one of the most expensive tracks ever produced with it's excerpts from Rod Serling's The Twilight Zone, an american television anthology series. References are also made to other significant Twilight Zone episodes. It's one of the standout tracks but cost an absolute fortune.
Also, as others have said, Jerkins was basically full-time employed by Mike for 3 years, at a time when he was at his peak of being an in-demand producer. Mike was paying him NOT to produce for anyone else as much as he was paying for him to be his righthand man. The project ran over time on numerous occasions, multiple studios were used and a ton of tracks were worked on. Not cheap.

Check out the genius of Threatened, in this brilliant video. You may not agree with all of it, but it's very intriguing & there's some nice moments referring to the Twilight Zone episodes, although It's very out-there & far fetched. But I like the imagination put into it & it's a common theme in Mikes music as far back as Thriller. I disregard Monster though, for obvious reasons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1My6f6vBXeY#t=76
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Man, those BIG samples along with the Serling must have cost a fair bit. Still, I think it is a very good album if not a little too overloaded with ballads.
 
^^Truth! I agree. Too many darn ballads & front loaded with many of the top tracks, but a very good album.
 
aazzaabb said:
Threatened was one of the most expensive tracks ever produced
Click to expand...
Worth it. It's undoubtedly one of the best tracks Michael produced in his last 15-20 years. The things I would do to get my hands on those multitracks... and imagine the short film!!! :girl_sigh:

I actually played it to a young friend of mine for the first time yesterday - both the studio and This Is It version. He dug it and asked me what it was called :D People are always so fascinated when I tell them about how MJ and Jerkins remixed Serling's narrations so that he raps an original rap. It's such an awesome concept!!

An absolute masterpiece of a song.
 
I did read somehere that the studio time was very expensive. Many times the studio was ready but Michael wasn't there.
 
HIStoric said:
Worth it. It's undoubtedly one of the best tracks Michael produced in his last 15-20 years. The things I would do to get my hands on those multitracks... and imagine the short film!!! :girl_sigh:

I actually played it to a young friend of mine for the first time yesterday - both the studio and This Is It version. He dug it and asked me what it was called :D People are always so fascinated when I tell them about how MJ and Jerkins remixed Serling's narrations so that he raps an original rap. It's such an awesome concept!!

An absolute masterpiece of a song.
Click to expand...
Yup yup & yup!

A short-film would have lifted it to a whole new level again & so many people would be like "This is one of the best tracks he's ever made!"

Had he lived & went on to do the This Is It shows, it would have been amazing if he eventually performed this outright, with the Twilight Zone footage mixed with new footage of Mike on the massive screen. Oh well, at least we have the track itself I guess.

Bloody hell, you've got to admire the mans imagination.
 
If only the Rod Serling samples were louder in the mix. Can barely hear him.
 
HIStoric said:
Worth it. It's undoubtedly one of the best tracks Michael produced in his last 15-20 years. The things I would do to get my hands on those multitracks... and imagine the short film!!! :girl_sigh:

I actually played it to a young friend of mine for the first time yesterday - both the studio and This Is It version. He dug it and asked me what it was called :D People are always so fascinated when I tell them about how MJ and Jerkins remixed Serling's narrations so that he raps an original rap. It's such an awesome concept!!

An absolute masterpiece of a song.
Click to expand...

What's the TII version? I only know of the bit tacked onto the end of Thriller.
 
For example he paid Rodney Jerkins not to work with any other artist during those 2 and a half years. Rodney was a top producer during that time and MJ paid him his 2 annual salaries. Also Jackson began recording new material for the album in October 1997, and finished with "You Are My Life" being recorded only eight weeks before the album's release in October 2001. That is 4 full years! In very expensive studios. He often booked several studios at the same time and ended up working in just one or none. Also Teddy Riley spoke that MJ build him a new studio for Invincible with all new state of the art equipment. Also, he had very expensive lifestyle (hotels, entourage, bodyguards...).
Click to expand...
Mj shouldve toned down his ego & made cheaper vids for promo. You dont need big budget to make good film, look at Terminator vs T3, T1 is creative guerilla filmmaking by genius director & T3 is expensive retread mess. Mj is creative genius and couldve made good vids without mega $$$$
 
MJ was a big spender. Everything had to be over the top. Best hotels, best studios, best producers - he wanted all the best to create the best. And that costs a lot of money.

Also how many times was Invincible delayed?

I actually think I read once that MJ wanted Invincible to be the first album released in the new millenium, so he planned to release it 00:01 on january 1st 2000. (first it was planned earlier of course, but when delayed I read this was the plan) - Then it was pushed back again and again. And as time went, more money went into the record, producers standing by, record studios, hotels etc. etc. Many people involved was paid for longer time and so on.

When it came to his art MJ spared no expense.
 
OnirMJ said:
For example he paid Rodney Jerkins not to work with any other artist during those 2 and a half years. Rodney was a top producer during that time and MJ paid him his 2 annual salaries. Also Jackson began recording new material for the album in October 1997, and finished with "You Are My Life" being recorded only eight weeks before the album's release in October 2001. That is 4 full years! In very expensive studios. He often booked several studios at the same time and ended up working in just one or none. Also Teddy Riley spoke that MJ build him a new studio for Invincible with all new state of the art equipment. Also, he had very expensive lifestyle (hotels, entourage, bodyguards...).
Click to expand...

Although Rodney Jerkins rejected (at that time) some important projects (LeAnn Rimes, Celine Dion) was still working as a producer for Spice Girls (Forever), Lionel Richie (Renaissance), Da Brat (Unrestricted), Brian McKnight and Will Smith.
 
Yeah, Rodney didn't just stop working. That story is bogus.
 
Darth Sidious said:
Mj shouldve toned down his ego & made cheaper vids for promo. Mj is creative genius and couldve made good vids without mega $$$$
Click to expand...
I don't think it was Michael's ego that made the videos more and more elaborate and expensive. Yes, Michael did have an ego and knew he was divinely talented, but at the same time, always giving credit and thanks to God for giving it to him. So don't think that had anything to do with his drive for bigger and better.

I really think that the excess was because he thought his audience demanded it. That each new video had to be more spectacular than the last-each new album had to top Thriller in quality and sales, because that's what the audience wanted.
Just think of the arguments here on the HIStory tour and all the people who don't care about the lip synching or the fact that he was sick, but the fact that the show itself was so spectacular-tanks were on the stage. He flew in on a rocket ship. So maybe he was right-that IS what most of the record buying demographic wanted.

Personally, I prefer nothing but Michael and a spotlight, and a mic and a fedora as props-that's it. All of his performances alone far outweigh everything else he does with a cast of thousands, IMO. And I love the videos that are simple-like SOOML, DSTYGE, Rock With You. Blame It on the Boogie is wonderful.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top