Ghosts needs to be reintroduced to the general public.

Ms. BlueGangsta

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Anyone else think Ghosts needs to be reintroduced to the general public because I do.
I'm not quite sure how it should be done exactly, but it just needs to be done.
We all know that Thriller in 3D with a different ending is going to happen.
Maybe they should slide Ghosts up in there with Thriller 3D somehow, although I would actually prefer that Ghosts be front and center and not take the backseat to another song and short film when it's reintroduced.
 
I agree. They should re-introduce the short Movie Ghosts. It's waaaay better than Thriller. But I can't come up with anything how they should do it. Re-releasing old songs is not something easy, since the public does not pay much attention to older re-released songs. Which is a shame.
 
Anyone else think Ghosts needs to be reintroduced to the general public because I do.
I'm not quite sure how it should be done exactly, but it just needs to be done.
We all know that Thriller in 3D with a different ending is going to happen.
Maybe they should slide Ghosts up in there with Thriller 3D somehow, although I would actually prefer that Ghosts be front and center and not take the backseat to another song and short film when it's reintroduced.

Honestly, just chuck it on Netflix or something and pay them to display it on the homepage. That would definitely be the best way I reckon.

There's little point releasing it in theatres. It's far too short for general distribution (even if you chuck in Thriller it still comes in under an hour), and 3D won't draw anyone in as it's been a dying fad for years. Can't imagine it making much money - especially when it's all so freely available online - so they might as well embrace the internet age and distribute it through there.
 
^^^

Yeah - remaster it in perfect HD - I guess it was filmed so it is even possible to make it 4K ?

And then add it on all streaming sites. Netflix would be the best - and on the front page it would be great. All MJ's videos should be on Netflix - This Is It and Moonwalker, musicvideos, Spike Lees docs. All of it.
 
Also - if it was remastered into HD widescreen - I guess it was filmed originally in widescreen?? - When they showed the movie first in Cannes, it was in cinema - so I guess it must have been widescreen then - and then afterwards edited to 4:3 to fit home TV's - back then widescreen was very very rare at home TV's.

If it was released in full HD widescreen - I also think more TV stations would show Ghosts if it was HD and full screen.
 
Also - if it was remastered into HD widescreen - I guess it was filmed originally in widescreen?? - When they showed the movie first in Cannes, it was in cinema - so I guess it must have been widescreen then - and then afterwards edited to 4:3 to fit home TV's - back then widescreen was very very rare at home TV's.

If it was released in full HD widescreen - I also think more TV stations would show Ghosts if it was HD and full screen.

Yes, they could do a 4K version if they had the original film negatives. A version is floating around online of a high definition copy that was aired in... Japan was it? Idk some country. Anyhow, to answer your question about Ghosts in widescreen...

I'm going to quoting from this post which I made a year or so back about releasing Michael's short films in widescreen, it includes more in depth explanations if you're curious to know more. First of all, I imagine the version they showed at Cannes was in 4:3 as well, there's no evidence at the moment (as far as I'm aware) that suggests they have a version of the final film in widescreen.

Now, they almost certainly shot Ghosts in 35mm, but it's a teensy bit complicated because it also depends on the type of lenses they used. To keep it really simple I'll base it off That 70's Show. That was shot on 35mm and then presented in 4:3 (for television), and then a few years ago they re-scanned all the film negatives and presented them in widescreen. For a more widescreen picture, they cropped some of the top and bottom, but regained information on the sides that was lost when cropping it for television. What you see here is probably what we could get for MJ's short films:

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If Ghosts was shot on 35mm (most likely) with a similar kind of lenses, theoretically we could have a widescreen version where we would get some more information on the sides, but you'd have to lose information on the top and bottom.
 
The other issue here is CGI special effects.
While Ghosts was probably shot on film and so the source film reels (if they still exists) could theoretically be scanned in at 4K resolution, the special effects (skeleton etc) would probably look horrific on modern displays in their original form. Therefore the Estate would need to spend money redoing those special effects at 4K resolution. Ghosts is only 40 minutes long and the amount of special effects is minimal by today's standards but redoing the digital effects is an extra cost that the MJ Estate may not want to pay on a product that holds very little nostalgia value with the general public. Also, if they DO rework those special effects there will always be fans who don't like the 'improved' look. If we look at the skeleton scene, it's very possible that the original motion capture data for MJ's dance has been lost. Even if it hasn't been lost it's possible that modern systems won't be able to work with it. So to recreate that skeleton dance they may need to employ an impersonator or it may be possible to generate the appropriate CGI by screen grabbing frame-by-frame from the released movie. I guess the latter would be the best option for most fans.

Issues also apply to other MJ Short films as many of them were shot in the 90s. Up to the late 80s films and TV shows were shot and edited on film, producing a compiled film master. This makes those films and TV shows easy to scan and re-release in HD or 4K. In the late 80s as technology improved it became possible (and much cheaper) for editing work to be done directly on tape rather then on film, so many TV shows started using analogue video tape instead of film to produce the master tape, compiling in the special effects as they worked. Those master tapes could not be used to produce 4K videos. Up-scaling them will not work as it won't produce the results consumers expect these days. MJ always loved the latest technology and Sony would have been keeping an eye on costs so it's possible that they agreed to work on tape rather than film for the masters. Again, this is no good for HD or 4K releases.

So assuming MJ's short films were shot on film and stored well over the last 20 - 30 years, then the MJ Estate would need to find the unedited film source material, rescan them and edit them, and also produce new special effects at 4K resolution. It's like starting from scratch and it'll be expensive, even for videos with no special effects at all (e.g. They Don't Care About Us - Brazil Version).
Perhaps we could tell by looking at the various "making of" videos that were played on MTV in the 90s which MJ short films were originally shot on film but that won't help us if the Estate cannot find the original source film and if they don't want to spend money converting them.

We know from the BAD25 concert release that MJ's filmed material has not been well looked after over the years and so I fear we may never see a comprehensive HD or 4K release of MJ's short films.

We know Thriller is coming. It was shot on film. It was probably edited on film. It contains no CGI. The MJ Estate have quickly and easily rescanned the film master and probably reproduced the title screen and disclaimer. Quick and simple. PLUS Thriller has widespread public appeal so it almost guarantees a return on their investment. Ghosts by all accounts would cost FAR more to produce and has far less general appeal than Thriller. If the re-released Thriller doesn't bring in a sh!t-tonne of cash Ghosts will NEVER be updated.
 
The other issue here is CGI special effects.
While Ghosts was probably shot on film and so the source film reels (if they still exists) could theoretically be scanned in at 4K resolution, the special effects (skeleton etc) would probably look horrific on modern displays in their original form.

It depends. The visual effects in Michael's music videos such as Black or White/Scream (for example) would need to be redone as their final output would be tape and therefore at standard definition. So those would look terrible in HD in their current state as they'd be upscaled, however Ghosts was shown at Cannes on film, so the visual effects would have been rendered at a resolution suitable for 35mm, and there is high definition and thus wouldn't need to be upscaled. I'm talking about this from a technical point of view mostly.

Like sure, artistically they're absolutely nowhere near as detailed as today's CGI of course, but they don't need to be. Nobody expects a 1996 film to have 2017 CGI anyway and its still watchable. It's basically the same situation as say, Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace or any other late 90s film with CGI. Shot on film, has 90s CGI that was rendered at said high resolution and then output to film as well :)

So assuming MJ's short films were shot on film and stored well over the last 20 - 30 years, then the MJ Estate would need to find the unedited film source material, rescan them and edit them, and also produce new special effects at 4K resolution. It's like starting from scratch and it'll be expensive, even for videos with no special effects at all (e.g. They Don't Care About Us - Brazil Version).
Perhaps we could tell by looking at the various "making of" videos that were played on MTV in the 90s which MJ short films were originally shot on film but that won't help us if the Estate cannot find the original source film and if they don't want to spend money converting them.

Indeed, it's quite a project. If they still have the EDL's lying around however, it should definitely help quicken up the process when they're editing the original negatives. I do worry if they even have access to the original negatives and I would love to see Michael's films in high definition... it's evidential they have access to a number of negatives, just look at what we got in Bad 25.

It really is an issue of cost versus return, like you said this project is going to be very expensive. There's no winning too, if they only did some eras at first (a much more cost effective approach to test the waters), fans would complain they hadn't done the rest or even wait for a complete boxset, but if they do all of his music videos at once... it can be a rather risky project for them financially.

Thankfully the VFX issue only really effects his music videos from Dangerous-era onwards. I think your earlier question of updating the VFX actually comes into play for these short films, since they're going to be re-rendered anyway. I don't see much point in spending the money to re-do Ghosts' VFX... but if we're already re-rendering the spaceship in Scream to be at a higher resolution, do we go in and update those to modern day standards? Decisions, decisions.
 
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Honestly, just chuck it on Netflix or something and pay them to display it on the homepage. That would definitely be the best way I reckon.

There's little point releasing it in theatres. It's far too short for general distribution (even if you chuck in Thriller it still comes in under an hour), and 3D won't draw anyone in as it's been a dying fad for years. Can't imagine it making much money - especially when it's all so freely available online - so they might as well embrace the internet age and distribute it through there.

Isn't Thriller supposed to be released theatrically this year? If it is, I think it makes sense to put Ghosts in there with it, perhaps with the behind the scenes on both (?), because is anybody really going to pay to watch a 15 minute short film?
 
Isn't Thriller supposed to be released theatrically this year? If it is, I think it makes sense to put Ghosts in there with it, perhaps with the behind the scenes on both (?), because is anybody really going to pay to watch a 15 minute short film?

Well that's what I've heard, but I have no idea what their model is. It's extremely hard to market paid exhibition of Thriller now given how you can watch it for free on literally almost any internet connected device now. The rumours/upcoming Thriller project at this point in time are yet to interest me in the slightest.
 
Honestly, just chuck it on Netflix or something and pay them to display it on the homepage. That would definitely be the best way I reckon.

There's little point releasing it in theatres. It's far too short for general distribution (even if you chuck in Thriller it still comes in under an hour), and 3D won't draw anyone in as it's been a dying fad for years. Can't imagine it making much money - especially when it's all so freely available online - so they might as well embrace the internet age and distribute it through there.
Not a bad idea.
I didn't have a theatrical release in mind when I made this thread anyways tho.:)
 
Well that's what I've heard, but I have no idea what their model is. It's extremely hard to market paid exhibition of Thriller now given how you can watch it for free on literally almost any internet connected device now. The rumours/upcoming Thriller project at this point in time are yet to interest me in the slightest.
Yeah 3D isn't really a selling point IMO.
I honestly think main selling point for it will be the different ending.
It's the main thing that has my interest piqued as far as the Thriler project.
 
Yeah 3D isn't really a selling point IMO.
I honestly think main selling point for it will be the different ending.
It's the main thing that has my interest piqued as far as the Thriler project.

I wonder what the alternative ending is. I have a sneaking suspicion it's going to be quite short :bored:
 
I have never heard MJ talk about them making and alternative ending. - But I sure hope it's a lot of new footage of MJ.
 
Just for interest..... I happened across a Fred Astaire film where Fred dances up the walls and across the ceiling (in 'Royal Wedding'). Most of Fred's dancing is quite different to that in 'Ghosts', but there is a short section from about 2mins 23 here, where Fred is 'crawling up the wall'', that makes me wonder if MJ was inspired in part by this...?

In this version, there are two 'mini screens' that show how the effect was achieved for Fred. There are other versions on YT that show only the main (cinema screen) view.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0g3g6AvLtM

 
Just for interest..... I happened across a Fred Astaire film where Fred dances up the walls and across the ceiling (in 'Royal Wedding'). Most of Fred's dancing is quite different to that in 'Ghosts', but there is a short section from about 2mins 23 here, where Fred is 'crawling up the wall'', that makes me wonder if MJ was inspired in part by this...?

In this version, there are two 'mini screens' that show how the effect was achieved for Fred. There are other versions on YT that show only the main (cinema screen) view.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0g3g6AvLtM
I have no doubt.

This was a HUGE dance number and it was years before the secret of how it was done got out. Quite certain that Michael would have used that as another homage to Fred.

Both Fred Astaire and Gene Kelly were unbelievably innovative.
 
I have no doubt.

This was a HUGE dance number and it was years before the secret of how it was done got out. Quite certain that Michael would have used that as another homage to Fred.

Both Fred Astaire and Gene Kelly were unbelievably innovative.

I started watching Gene Kelly movies last year and have not turned back since. The man was a phenomenal mover, and the definition of a movie star.

he is magic.
 
I love spotting the origins of some of MJs influences in old Fred Astaire clips. It's littered everywhere in MJs work, but always done with a touch of class and a new spin.
Me too. Gene Kelly's as well.

I remember seeing Smooth Criminal the first time-and I could really hear Michael saying "I know how much you like the Girl Hunt Ballet-here's my version." Yeah, I think I'm crazy sometimes too. Lol.
 
Both Fred Astaire and Gene Kelly were unbelievably innovative.
Agreed.:D
I love how Michael always talked about those that inspired him.
If he hadn't I may not know as much as I do about people like Gene Kelly or Fred Astaire.
Michael talking about them made them much more interesting to me.:yes:
 
I remember putting Ghosts on one time when I was working in a day care center for adults with learning difficulties. It was a cold, wet day and we had a projector showing random Youtube videos which neither the clients nor the staff were really watching. Then I decided to put Ghosts on. People started to stop talking and pay attention. By the end of it, you could hear a pin drop.

This is wonderful story, and shows the profound effect that Michael has on people.:D

On an off and rather random note when I read pin drop I couldn't help but think of that rain drop drop top meme that's been going around on social media.:lol:
 
I just watched Ghosts yesterday... it really is great.

The dancing is out of this world. Costumes are great too.

I know Thriller is far more iconic and much more known - but Ghosts is really superior. It's so sad it does not get more praise and is much more known.


Had the 1993 stupid case never happend and MJ's popularity had just kept rising I think Ghosts could have been a new Thriller. Iconic and praised by critics.

1993 really did a lot of damage...
 
Agreed.:D
I love how Michael always talked about those that inspired him.
If he hadn't I may not know as much as I do about people like Gene Kelly or Fred Astaire.
Michael talking about them made them much more interesting to me.:yes:
Same here! Michael talking about people/things he liked/was inspired by, made me want to study it myself
 
Had the 1993 stupid case never happend and MJ's popularity had just kept rising I think Ghosts could have been a new Thriller. Iconic and praised by critics.

1993 really did a lot of damage...

Would Ghosts even exist, I wonder? Wasn't he intending for the tracks to be for some Addams Family movie instead of his own work?
 
It is insane to me how many people don't even know about Ghosts.... Perfect example how his great work through the 90's gets undervalued
 
I agree. They should re-introduce the short Movie Ghosts. It's waaaay better than Thriller. But I can't come up with anything how they should do it. Re-releasing old songs is not something easy, since the public does not pay much attention to older re-released songs. Which is a shame.


Thriller is the greatest music video Michael Jackson ever did....

as Lionel Richie said, it's the Gone of the Wind of music videos

the very next day after that video premiered, kids, teenagers, and adults were dancing to the choreography and tried to ace every single dance move from every corner of the country.
 
Smooth Criminal > Ghosts > Thriller

One thing I can admit though is that the camera work on thriller, the editing of the dance sequence in thriller is more fluid and flows better than the dance sequences in Ghosts.
 
Would Ghosts even exist, I wonder? Wasn't he intending for the tracks to be for some Addams Family movie instead of his own work?

The original Ghosts from 1993, as far as they got (with a different director etc) before hell broke lose...


It was intended to be a music video for a song off the Adams Family movie soundtrack.
 
IMO Thriller is considered the greatest because it was the first really big spectacular, big budget video, but I think MJ actually topped it several times during his career - Smooth Criminal and Ghosts are even better than Thriller IMO. (I actually also prefer Beat It to Thriller.)


Smooth Criminal was awesome but had some gaps in it

Ghosts was solid but is mainly talked of in regards to the technological advances

That Thriller was non stop entertainment from the opening bell unto the very end

It wasn't as if Thriller was the first video ever made. The storyline was A1
 
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