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Thread: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

   
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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    The Arvizos were not even good at lying... stories hardly ever made sense.. How bout the one where they never new what time it was at Neverland..
    http://blog.homeadverts.com/blog/wp-...Sotehbys-2.jpg
    https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...e04d810b32.jpg
    http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/...5_1436034a.jpg
    ...and so on!


    Or how bout when Mez showed a porn mag to Gavin and asked if that was the magazine Michael showed him... "yes" it was dated after he ever was at Neverland..

    And wasn't there surveillance of them jumping the fence at Neverland to retrieve a ball where they were 'trapped'..

    Or when they'd be in public, and the limo driver stays outside while Janet gets a bodywax...

    Also when she simply asked a Neverland employee to take her to her and her kids to her parents house.. they left! that's not trapped.. Keep in mind she asked this request in the middle of the night!
    Walk in truth, stand IN JUSTICE https://twitter.com/rasheedKOPV?s=09

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    Quote Originally Posted by KOPV View Post
    The Arvizos were not even good at lying... stories hardly ever made sense.. How bout the one where they never new what time it was at Neverland..
    and this:




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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    That got me too about the clocks. How can you not tell what time it was.


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    elusive moonwalker
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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    The huge clock at the train station.

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    ^ oh wait... and lets not forget about mobile phones.. Didn't Janet Arvizo have a cell phone? phone records... they have clocks on them lol
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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    Lol i reckon had sneddon asked bout those clocks gavin wouldve said mj "moved them"

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    hey, I'm glad the stories the Arvizos and team came up with did not add up and were beyond ridiculous.. it helped MJ's case and showed many fans that may have had 'wonder' in there heads KNOW it was not possible..

    I'm sure many fans that had some type of wonder of what really happened in 1993 - made the switch in there minds from 'believing' to 'knowing' Michael was innocent.. thanks to the 2003-2005 allegations.
    Walk in truth, stand IN JUSTICE https://twitter.com/rasheedKOPV?s=09

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    I'm glad bout that too :) as it proved what liars they really are

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    Quote Originally Posted by #MJforever57 View Post
    That got me too about the clocks. How can you not tell what time it was.
    Star Arvizo claimed that they didn't know the time because the clocks were all wrong.
    One showed 1 o'clock the other 5. Yes this was his explanation. First he said they were kept from
    the clocks then he said we saw the clocks and they all showed different times.

    Imagine Mj's employees or MJ himself setting all his clocks to different times just so the Arvizos wouldn't know the real time.
    Let's assume they did this. What about the watch MJ gave Gavin? That was wrong too? Or MJ didn't let him wear it?
    What about their own watches? They were not allowed to bring watches to Neverland?
    So let's assume before their first "escape" all the clocks were wrong and they realized that MJ doesn't let them
    know the time. Why didn't they just took watches with them the next time they came back to Neverland?
    to be falsely imprisoned again, obviously.

    Back to Chandler something just hit me regarding what Chandler said about Brett Barnes (Tommy Jones is his codename in the Gardner interview)

    "Do you think that Tommy Jones was lying when he went on television?"
    "Yes."
    "Why do you think he's lying?"
    "Because Michael told me they did."
    "Okay, but Michael said he did these things - - "
    "I mean it could be that Michael could be lying to me."
    "Somebody is lying. Right? Because Michael was lying to Tommy by saying the opposite things, right?”
    "Yeah, well one of them is lying.”
    “Who do you think is lying?”
    “Tommy.”
    "Why do you say that?"
    "Because in public, when he’s with Tommy, they're very close together physically and
    verbally and relationship-wise. And if one were to observe things in public, how they acted to
    each other, one would come to that conclusion, that it was more then just a friendly relationship."
    The only time when Chandler could see MJ and Brett Barnes together - physically and
    verbally and relationship-wise close as he puts it - was in Feb 1993 there was no other occasion when MJ was with the Chandlers and Brett Barnes at the same time. So supposedly right then and there Chandler came to the conclusion that it was "more then just a friendly relationship"?

    But we know for June Chandler's testimony that in March Jordan kept nagging her to let him
    stay in MJ's room because all the other kids were there and so why can't he?
    Brett Barnes most likely stayed in MJ's room during that weekend in Feb and Jordan knew that. He apparently
    wanted to do what Brett and the Cascios did: sleep in Mj's room.

    If he saw something fishy was going on between MJ and Brett and he knew Brett was sleeping in Mj's room
    why did he want to be there too? In fact why did he want to hang out with MJ at all if he saw Brett and MJ
    having a "more than just a friendly relationship"?

    And let's not even talk about June Chandler not becoming concerned after seeing this "more than just a friendly relationship"
    When he talked about that trip with Brett and MJ in the limo she didn't mention anything odd about it.

    There is also the issue of MJ getting Brett and Jordan together. If someone is planning to molest Jordan
    why would he want him to hang out with an already molested boy Brett Barnes? Why would a pedophile
    arrange such a meeting and risk losing his next prey by potentially exposing him to a victim who
    could spill the beans any moment, tell him what MJ had been doing to him or just ask Jordan
    are you doing that with you too? Things like that could easily happen when kids get together why would
    a pedo take that risk when he could easily avoid it by keeping his victims and targets separate?

    According to Chandler MJ arranged Wade (Billy) and Macaulay (Peter) to be with Jordan too.

    "So he was talking about how all these kids masturbated in front of him, and he said that - -
    Oh, by the way, I met Tommy and Billy during that time period, and Peter Davis as well. So
    he was saying that all these kids masturbate and it feels really good,
    They never bother to explain why MJ had a habit of arranging his supposed victims to be
    around him at the same time. Once again he did something repeatedly which needlessly increased the chance
    of him being exposed but somehow he was so lucky he was not. None of those molested kids ever wondered
    looking at the other kids whether they were molested too and none of them asked such questions from the others.
    This is what we are supposed to believe.
    Instead of just taking Occam's razor: he had no problem with having all those kids in the same place at the same time because they were not victims at all.
    Last edited by redfrog; 10-07-2017 at 01:40 AM.

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    ^^2003? He never saw Brett before that?

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    Quote Originally Posted by barbee0715 View Post
    ^^2003? He never saw Brett before that?
    Sorry I meant 1993. Chandler saw Brett only once in Feb 1993
    when MJ went to Disneyland with him and the Chandlers
    and they spent the weekend in Neverland after that.

    And obviously neither Jordan nor June saw anything alarming about
    MJ's interraction with Brett. this is just typical Gutierrez fantasy, Brett
    Barnes is one his obsessions.

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    1993 Civil Suit Settled by Insurance Co. against Jackson's wishes - Hot Doc

    Memo in Support of Objection to Subpoena for Settlement Documents

    Holy $@#!. In released court documents, it turns out that Michael Jackson's insurance company negotiated and settled the 1993 civil suit against his wishes.

    The following are excerpts from that recently released court document:

    Pg3
    The settlement agreement was for global claims of negligence and the lawsuit was defended by Mr. Jackson's insurance carrier. The insurance carrier negotiated and paid the settlement, over the protests of Mr. Jackson and his personal legal counsel.

    It is general practice for an insurer to be entitled to control settlement negotiations and the insured is precluded from any interference.

    …Under the majority of contracts for liability insurance, the absolute control of the defense of the matter is turned over to the insurance company and the insured is excluded from any interference in any negotiation for settlement or other legal proceedings (emphasis added).

    …An insurance carrier has the right to settle claims covered by insurance when it decides settlement is expedient and the insured may not interfere with nor prevent such settlements.

    Pg2
    Because insurance companies were the source of the settlement amounts, and the insurance companies make the payments based on their contractual rights to settle the proceeding without Mr. Jackson's permission, the settlement does not constitute an admission and cannot be used to create such an impermissible inference to the jury.

    Pg3
    The speculative suggestion that Mr. Jackson somehow made an admission when an insurance company required a settlement, and in fact paid for the settlement, creates an impermissible inference to the jury that would deprive Mr. Jackson of due process of law.
    This motion filed by T-Mez during the trial last year should clear that info:

    Hightlights: Memo in Support of Objection to Subpoena for Settlement Documents
    The following are excerpts from the court document:

    Pg3 The settlement agreement was for global claims of negligence and the lawsuit was defended by Mr. Jackson's insurance carrier. The insurance carrier negotiated and paid the settlement, over the protests of Mr. Jackson and his personal legal counsel.

    It is general practice for an insurer to be entitled to control settlement negotiations and the insured is precluded from any interference.

    …Under the majority of contracts for liability insurance, the absolute control of the defense of the matter is turned over to the insurance company and the insured is excluded from any interference in any negotiation for settlement or other legal proceedings (emphasis added).

    …An insurance carrier has the right to settle claims covered by insurance when it decides settlement is expedient and the insured may not interfere with nor prevent such settlements.

    Pg2 Because insurance companies were the source of the settlement amounts, and the insurance companies make the payments based on their contractual rights to settle the proceeding without Mr. Jackson's permission, the settlement does not constitute an admission and cannot be used to create such an impermissible inference to the jury.

    Pg3 The speculative suggestion that Mr. Jackson somehow made an admission when an insurance company required a settlement, and in fact paid for the settlement, creates an impermissible inference to the jury that would deprive Mr. Jackson of due process of law.

    Pg 4 It is unfair for an insurance company's settlement to be now held against Mr. Jackson or for the Settlement Agreement to be admitted as evidence of Mr. Jackson's prior conduct or guilt. Mr. Jackson could not control nor interfere with his insurance carrier's demand to settle the dispute.

    Pg9-10 Permitting evidence of settlement agreements or amounts would be speculative because there is no evidence Michael Jackson made the settlement. Settlements in civil suits many times are dictated by insurance companies who settle claims regardless of an individual's wishes.

    Although Jordan Chandler was interviewed "thereafter" by detectives seeking evidence to offer in a child molestation prosecution of Michael Jackson, "no criminal charges were filed as a result of that interview."

    This interview took place prior to the decision of the United States Supreme Court in Stogner v California, 539 U.S. 607, 613 (2003), holding California's retroactive extension of the statute of limitations to be unconstitutional.

    In other words, Jordan Chandler's statements were not sufficient even at that earlier time, to support child molestation charges against Michael Jackson, and to now permit the suggestion of a settlement agreement for some improper act is not only irrelevant, but also a speculative violation of the statute of limitations

    After this motion, the judge ruled that the prosecution were not allowed to allude to or include any information or suggested allegation that MJ paid the Chandlers because he didn't the insurance paid over MJ's and his lawyers objections...

    Another thing to note... when Evan was filing suit he included "negligence course of distress" knowing full well the insurance would pay for that which would pave way for the Chandlers to avoid the criminal trial. MJ and his team were pushing for the criminal trial, they filed a motion to stop the civil trial, put in on hold to wait for the criminal trial but they were denied that chance.....







    Last edited by ILoveHIStory; 11-07-2017 at 11:21 AM.

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    Details of the civil case settlement are not private anymore, but statements made in a press conference by lawyers representing the plaintiff and the defendant shed some light.
    VERBATUM Transcript from the Michael Jackson/Chandler settlement press conference as taped from satellite on 1-26-94, unedited.

    Larry Feldman's statement-Attorney for Plaintiff:
    "We wish to jointly announce a mutual resolution of this lawsuit. As you are aware the plaintiff has alleged certain acts of impropriety by Mr. Jackson and from the inception of those allegations Mr. Jackson has always maintained his innocence. However the emotional trauma and strain on the respective parties have caused both parties to reflect on the wisdom of continuing with the litigation. The plaintiff has agreed that the lawsuit should be resolved and it will be dismissed in the near future. Mr. Jackson continues to maintain his innocence and withdraws any previous allegations of extortion. This will allow the parties to get on with their lives in a more positive and productive manner. Much of the suffering these parties have been put through has been caused by the publicity surrounding this case. We jointly request that members of the press allow the parties to close this chapter in their lives with dignity so that the healing process may begin."

    Johnnie Cockran's statement-Attorney for Defendant [Michael Jackson]:
    "In the past ten days the rumors and speculation surrounding this case have reached a fever pitch and by-and-large have been false and outrageous. As Mr. Feldman has correctly indicated Michael Jackson has maintained his innocence from the beginning of this matter and now, as this matter will soon be concluded, he still maintains that innocence. The resolution of this case is in no way an admission of guilt by Michael Jackson. In short, he is an innocent man who does not intend to have his career and his life destroyed by rumor and innuendo. Throughout this ordeal he has been subjected to an unprecedented media feeding frenzy; especially by the tabloid press. The tabloid press has shown an insatiable thirst for anything negative and have paid huge sums of money to people who have little or no information and who barely knew Michael Jackson. So today the time has come for Michael Jackson to move on to new business, to get on with his life, to start the healing process and to move his career forward to even greater heights. This he intends to do. At the appropriate time Michael Jackson will speak out publicly as to the agony, torture, and pain he has had to suffer during the past six months. Thank you very much. "

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

    From the very beginning, the 2003 case against Michael Jackson looked like a bad rerun of 1993 with essentially the same cast of ridiculous characters:






    To say that all of Michael Jackson's enemies have converged in Santa Barbara might be an understatement. Contrary to the flimsy observations of the likes of paperboy Dan Abrams of 'The Dan Abrams Show' as well as those of media ho Diane Dimond, this is a setup, folks. Just take a look at our chart below. One would have to suffer from cataracts not to see the 'pattern' of conspiracy perpetrated against Jackson, not by him.


    When persons involved with this project first resolved to do it, we took it on with the sole purpose of reporting what mainstreaming media appears to be afraid to report. For reasons still not clear (alright we think we know why), few if any news/media outlets have even touched on the subject of the suspicious involvement of virtually the same players from the 1993 allegations in the latest case against Mr. Jackson. It is our hope that persons reading this report will take the time to ponder what we have found, process the information, and decide for themselves. We are particularly hopeful that journalists interested in reporting the story as objectively as possible will consider this modest offering and perhaps decide to investigate both sides of the case for themselves. All we can do is hope.



    Sneddon and the Chandlers

    (1) District Attorney Tom Sneddon, who attempted to bring charges against Michael Jackson in 1993 and who is now prosecuting the current case against Jackson, is on the faculty at the Santa Barbara College of Law. Ray Chandler, (2-3) the uncle of the boy who accused Jackson of sexual abuse in 1993, studied law at the Santa Barbara College of Law and is currently a real estate lawyer.

    (4) Dave Schwartz, the stepfather of Jackson's first accuser, is the founder of Rent-a-Wreck, a car rental agency that is represented by the public relations firm Tellem. After Jackson was arrested in 2003, Tellem offered Tom Sneddon their services - for free.



    The Chandlers' Former Attorneys and their Ability to Find 'Victims'

    (5) Civil lawyer Larry Feldman represented Jordan Chandler, the boy who accused Michael Jackson of sexual abuse in 1993. (6) Feldman sent Jordan Chandler to see psychiatrist Stan Katz for an evaluation.

    (7) In 1993, Jackson's former maid Blanca Francia was deposed by civil lawyer Larry Feldman for the Chandlers' lawsuit. In the deposition, Francia claimed to have seen Jackson act inappropriately with other children, including her own son. She later recanted these statements but members of the District Attorney's office often refer to Francia's son as an alleged victim of Jackson's.

    (8.) After getting in contact with Larry Feldman, John Arvizo accused Michael Jackson of sexual abuse; the boy was then sent to see Dr. Katz (9). Note that less than four months earlier John Arvizo and his family had vehemently defended Jackson on numerous occasions.

    Feldman is not the only former attorney for the Chandlers who can't seem to stay away from the Jackson case. (10) The Chandlers' first attorney Gloria Allred has also made it her life mission to seek out other accusers. We're sure her efforts are solely motivated by justice and have nothing to do with the cut of the settlement that she would inevitably receive if one of her clients were to successfully sue Jackson.

    (11) In February 2003, after seeing a documentary that put a sinister spin on Jackson's relationship with John Arvizo, Gloria Allred contacted Tom Sneddon and demanded that he investigate Jackson. At the same time, 'media psychiatrist' Carole Lieberman also filed a complaint against Jackson. Sneddon responded to Allred and Lieberman's complaints by stating that although he would take the matter seriously, he could not reopen the Jackson case without a cooperative victim.

    Months later, John Arvizo told Larry Feldman that Michael Jackson sexually abused him. Once again, Allred missed out on the opportunity to represent a Jackson accuser. As for Lieberman, she made sure to advertise on her website that she was the first psychiatrist to demand that Jackson be investigated.

    (12) Not to be one upped by Feldman and Katz, Allred and Lieberman teamed up on another collaboration 'an accuser' named Daniel Kapone. After being treated by Dr. Lieberman, Kapone suddenly remembered having been abused by Jackson when he was just three years old. Once Lieberman helped him recover his 'repressed memories', Allred signed on as his attorney. Unfortunately for Allred and Lieberman, it was later determined that Kapone had never even met Michael Jackson.


    1993: The Media

    (13) During the 1993 case, many of Jackson's former employees cashed in on the allegations by selling salacious stories to the media. The most visible opportunist from the 1993 case was the aforementioned Blanca Francia, Jackson's former maid. She first sold her story to Diane Dimond during an interview on Hard Copy and later collaborated with Chilean journalist Victor Gutierrez on his book Michael Jackson was my Lover.

    (14) Aside from providing Blanca Francia with a platform for her sensational stories, Gutierrez and Dimond had something else in common; they were both were sued by Jackson for spreading a false story about him in the mid-90s. During an interview on Hard Copy, Gutierrez claimed to have seen a videotape of Jackson molesting one of his nephews; Dimond later repeated his story on a local radio station. It was eventually proven that no such tape existed and Jackson filed a lawsuit against Gutierrez and Dimond for defamation of character.


    2003: The Media

    While the mainstream media has been collectively irresponsible in their coverage of the Jackson case, NBC seems particularly intent on ruining Jackson's reputation by hiring several well-known Jackson detractors to cover the case. The following people either have an axe to grind with Jackson, have spread false rumours about him in the past or have connections to the Santa Barbara District Attorney's office. Take a look:

    (15) Despite the fact that Jackson sued her for spreading an irrefutably false story about him, NBC hired Diane Dimond to cover the Jackson case in 2003. (16) Dimond also admittedly receives information from the District Attorney's office and there has been much speculation regarding the nature of her relationship with Tom Sneddon.

    (17) Tim Russert, the senior vice president of NBC News, is married to Maureen Orth, a journalist who has written three slanderous articles about Jackson for Vanity Fair magazine. Two of these articles were written about the case and were full of half-truths and rumours.

    (18.) NBC hired Jim Thomas as a special analyst; Jim Thomas is admittedly good friends with Tom Sneddon.

    (19) NBC produced two salacious Dateline NBC specials about the Jackson case. The most recent one featured interviews with Jim Thomas and Ray Chandler and was heavily slanted in favour of the prosecution's version of events. (20) The special was produced by none other than Victor Gutierrez, who was hired by NBC to cover the Jackson case even though he still owes Jackson $2.7 million dollars from a defamation of character lawsuit that Jackson filed and won against him. Conflict of interest anyone?


    Gutierrez and the Chandlers

    (21) Many have speculated that Victor Gutierrez collaborated with Evan Chandler, the father of Jackson's first accuser, to write Michael Jackson was my Lover. The book contains personal photographs of Jordan Chandler and court documents that only somebody directly involved in the case could possibly have access to.

    (15) Victor Gutierrez and Ray Chandler recently worked together on the Dateline NBC special, which Gutierrez produced.


    Conclusion

    Is it merely a coincidence that all of the people who have accused Michael Jackson of acting inappropriately with a child are connected to one another? Every accuser, every professional who has worked with each accuser, every tabloid hack who has reported negative stories about Jackson - literally all of the players involved in both the 1993 case and the 2003 case are related to one another.

    Is it a conspiracy?

    Nah.

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    Default Re: 1993 - The Case Files Discussion **All Things Jordan and Evan Chandler Go Here**

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