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Thread: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

   
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    Default Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    This is something that has always interested me. I can't remember what scene it is, i think it's when the ghosts start walking up the walls and you can hear the beat of You Win Again being played as they're walking. I know Michael was a big fan of the Bee Gees but always found it curious why he used that particular song in Ghosts.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thriller_MJ View Post
    This is something that has always interested me. I can't remember what scene it is, i think it's when the ghosts start walking up the walls and you can hear the beat of You Win Again being played as they're walking. I know Michael was a big fan of the Bee Gees but always found it curious why he used that particular song in Ghosts.
    Lol he owned it....why not use it

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Idk but it sounds frikkin awesome.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Why not? lol

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    It fits well, I never even noticed until you mentioned it.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Did MJ own Bee Gees songs??

    I actually never notices MJ used the beat from You Win Again - and that is one of my favorite Bee Gees songs...
    https://www.youtube.com/user/Ahess/videos - me dancing MJ - many years ago.

    I would be really glad if you rated or/and commented the videos. Thanks

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Michael was a fan of the beegees and was inspire and influenced by them so it's no surprise.



    a female with major depression,generalized anxiety,behavioral and emotional disorder,ocd mild retardation, and learning disability. i'm not contagious but my smile is.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    A similar question would be... why is Roy Ayers "Hot" (from 1985) included so prominently in the TWYMMF video?
    There has to be a little bit more to it than that Michael just liked it?


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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Quote Originally Posted by Electro View Post
    A similar question would be... why is Roy Ayers "Hot" (from 1985) included so prominently in the TWYMMF video?
    There has to be a little bit more to it than that Michael just liked it?

    Hot Fever

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Quote Originally Posted by Electro View Post
    A similar question would be... why is Roy Ayers "Hot" (from 1985) included so prominently in the TWYMMF video?
    There has to be a little bit more to it than that Michael just liked it?

    I always thought that was supposed to be a unreleased mj track that was initially twymmf.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Quote Originally Posted by wonderouzmj View Post
    I always thought that was supposed to be a unreleased mj track that was initially twymmf.
    Michael's "Hot Fever" may be an early "TWYMMF"...
    but the credits to Roy Ayers' "Hot" (that's in the video) don't suggest any connection to Michael.

    Written by – B. Brice (Clarence Brice), J. Mtume (James Foreman), P. Field (Philip Hunter Field)
    Producer – James Mtume
    Co-producer – Philip Field
    Executive-Producer – George Butler
    Mixed By, Engineer – Andy Wallace
    Phonographic Copyright (p) – CBS Inc.
    Produced For – Family One Productions Ltd.
    Mixed, Engineered, Mastered At – Sterling Sound, NYC

    https://www.discogs.com/Roy-Ayers-Hot/release/199568
    Last edited by Electro; 26-10-2020 at 11:15 AM.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thriller_MJ View Post
    This is something that has always interested me. I can't remember what scene it is, i think it's when the ghosts start walking up the walls and you can hear the beat of You Win Again being played as they're walking. I know Michael was a big fan of the Bee Gees but always found it curious why he used that particular song in Ghosts.
    According to engineer Rob Hoffman (who worked on both the ‘Ghosts’ short film and on the ‘HIStory’ album), Michael Jackson used as a stomp reference (for this film’s scene) the ‘We Will Rock You’ drums beat from Queen, not the ‘You Win Again’ drums beat from Bee Gees.

    Rob Hoffman went on revealing that Michael Jackson never mentioned the ‘You Win Again’ drums beat as a stomp reference while they were working on that short film.

    According to the engineer, the ‘You Win Again’ similarity (to the sound of the film’s scene) is therefore purely coincidental, and the stomps that they generally used on the short film are samples from the ‘HIStory’ album.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    In Rob Hoffmann's own words (in response to a fan asking about the Bee Gees and directing him to a video link of the 1997 version of "Ghosts"):

    "The Bee Gees thing is pretty remarkable, I had never heard that and MJ never mentioned it as a reference. His "stomp" reference was always "We will rock you" by Queen. So yeah, it's a coincidence. Those stomps are samples from the "History" album and custom samples we recorded at Royaltone studios with Michael's dancers."
    https://www.gearslutz.com/board/show...postcount=609&




    It's not fully clear what exactly "I had never heard that" refers to. Someone asking him about the Bee Gees in that context? Or him suddenly hearing the Bee Gees type beat in the video presented to him? Did he actually play the video or just reply from memory?

    You can see that Rob is not really spot on with all of his replies and doesn't seem to be aware about all the different revisions of the "Ghosts" film. That's clear when the fan asks: "were you involved in the slight re-mixing of "2Bad" "Is It Scary" and "Ghosts" for the short movie?" and Rob replies: "For all the remixes we would start with ... Then Mj would advise us on what he wanted to hear and for how long. MJ's notes would usually be done on Brad's micro-cassette recorder from the actual video set."

    Ups. As we know, "Is It Scary" and the song "Ghosts" were not part of the original creation process of the film that he describes there. Originally it was just a very long extended version of "Too Bad" all through the film. Parts of that got replaced with the songs "Is It Scary" and "Ghosts" only later in 1997.

    So Rob was involved in the initial production for sure, but seemingly not with every revision. That Bee Gees beat could have been overdubbed at some point after his involvement in 1996, just like the additional songs.

    The pure "stomp" rhythm he describes is definitly there. But underneath there is also something that sounds pretty much exactly like a loop from the "You Win Again" intro beat. Especially noticeable by that unique "wet" percussion sound. It's too close to be just a coincidence that noone noticed. Especially for Michael, as a fan of the Bee Gees music.


    Ghosts on Vimeo (beat starts at 15:40):
    https://vimeo.com/410706713#t=15m40s

    Bee Gee's "You Win Again":




    So the question remains... WHY?
    Last edited by Electro; 27-10-2020 at 06:28 PM.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    I love the Bee Gees. So sad that the twins have gone.

    That stomp rhythm is perfect to use when the ghosts walk up the walls.
    It's similar to the one from the Bee Gees' song, but not exactly the same.
    Michael's has a faster tempo and is made using different instruments entirely.
    Play the two simultaneously, through headphones and you'll hear the differences.

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    Default Re: Why did Michael use the beat from You Win Again by Bee Gees in the Ghosts short-film?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikky Dee View Post
    I love the Bee Gees. So sad that the twins have gone.

    That stomp rhythm is perfect to use when the ghosts walk up the walls.
    It's similar to the one from the Bee Gees' song, but not exactly the same.
    Michael's has a faster tempo and is made using different instruments entirely.
    Play the two simultaneously, through headphones and you'll hear the differences.


    Yes, the beat in Ghosts is formostly made of it's own stomping sounds. That's what you hear loud in the front. But underneath there is the BeeGees loop, layered below in lower volume.

    The percussion sound (the mechanical sounding stuff between the single stomps) is the big giveaway. It's the same as in the BeeGees beat. It's played the same way and it has a very distinctive unique sound (sound design) to it, which is probably why Michael liked it.

    And if you listen close you can also still hear the BeeGees cymbal (or 'sleight bell'?) in the Ghosts beat. (That high regular simple rhythmic percussion sound.) The rest of the BeeGees beat is covered under the loud stomping beat of Ghosts.

    I've chopped segments up and made a little demo to directly compare here:


    https://soundcloud.com/verkauf/4x-ghosts-beegees

    That's 1 bar Ghosts followed by 1 bar BeeGees (repeated 4 times).
    I sped up the BeeGees loop a slight bit (2 bpm) so the tempi fit together.

    Listen close over headphones to the percussion and the cymbal.
    Last edited by Electro; 03-11-2020 at 04:08 PM.

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