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Does anyone else think that the funeral arrangement has been messed up..?

hesiod

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Ok, I've been thinking for days about it and held it in, but now I feel I got to speak it out:

We're approaching the 10th day of his leaving us. And we don't even know when and where will he be burried, when and where will the actual funeral be -in my humble understanding the funeral is the ceremony before the actual burial-, or what, if any, spiritual character this ceremony will have...!

All we know is that they are going to hold a memorial-celebration of him in LA on Tuesday -something like a concert. Where most people who want to participate WILL NOT be able to go -not even outside as the police will close the streets around the area-, and where as we were told, Michael's body won't be there..
The idea to have a celebration is fair enough, but the way they picture it, it could happen any other day, it's NOT a funeral, and it does not even coincide with a funeral -since we don't know when that will be..

What I'm saying is that I guess I expected a more synchronous event, something like the farewell of Diana in the UK or other celebrities in the past, where there was one ceremony of farewell, where the masses could go and the deceased was there.. All of that is absent now. It seems they are so dazed and confused that they make scattered choices..

I don't know, may God bless them and enlighten them to do the right thing..
 
hesiod said:
Ok, I've been thinking for days about it and held it in, but now I feel I got to speak it out:

We're approaching the 10th day of his leaving us. And we don't even know when and where will he be burried, when and where will the actual funeral be -in my humble understanding the funeral is the ceremony before the actual burial-, or what, if any, spiritual character this ceremony will have...!

All we know is that they are going to hold a memorial-celebration of him in LA on Tuesday -something like a concert. Where most people who want to participate WILL NOT be able to go -not even outside as the police will close the streets around the area-, and where as we were told, Michael's body won't be there..
The idea to have a celebration is fair enough, but the way they picture it, it could happen any other day, it's NOT a funeral, and it does not even coincide with a funeral -since we don't know when that will be..

What I'm saying is that I guess I expected a more synchronous event, something like the farewell of Diana in the UK or other celebrities in the past, where there was one ceremony of farewell, where the masses could go and the deceased was there.. All of that is absent now. It seems they are so dazed and confused that they make scattered choices..

I don't know, may God bless them and enlighten them to do the right thing..
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I agree, I don't understand either. I think it is a mess, and a shame. It should be better for Michael. I'm sure there is a lot to consider and plan, but as you stated, this has been done in the past and they have had more time to do it then usual.

I think fans should travel to LA, because you never know what might change over the next few days and if things change to accommodate the fans, it may be too late for some fans to get there in time. If things don't change maybe all the fans can meet somewhere to be together? Maybe at the barriers they have blocking off the Staple Center?:smilerolleyes:
 
They have a different funeral plans than those of which were mentioned. The family want to do things differently. They are being very private. They are having a private memorial and public one without the body. I don't mind that.
 
jilliebean said:
I think fans should travel to LA, because you never know what might change over the next few days and if things change to accommodate the fans, it may be too late for some fans to get there in time. If things don't change maybe all the fans can meet somewhere to be together? Maybe at the barriers they have blocking off the Staple Center?:smilerolleyes:
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But the police ain't gonna let them wander in the streets, they said so and they won't change their minds.. They're actually pissed that nobody takes up responsibility of the expenses that this will mean for the city -which is broke-, and therefore in order to resolve it, they just close the streets alltogether.. I'm sure they will have closed the whole centre around the stadium..
If things were more organized on behalf of the family, it would also mean an arrangement that it would be easier for the public to participate. Now they've just messed it up all the way..

hope this changes, but I don't hold my breath it happens..
i'm very sad over this.
 
I think that people have to remember that this is a private family matter above all else. They are doing their best to accommodate the public because they realize the impact that Michael had on so many. But, their grief displayed at a funeral and burial is their right to keep private and personal if wished. And such should be respected.

There is no need for thinking things are messed up when things are simply being kept personal/private.
 
classic said:
I think that people have to remember that this is a private family matter above all else. They are doing their best to accommodate the public because they realize the impact that Michael had on so many. But, their grief displayed at a funeral and burial is their right to keep private and personal if wished. And such should be respected.

There is no need for thinking things are messed up when things are simply being kept personal/private.
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I don't think that is the point. I think Michael fans totally understand the privacy aspect of this, especially when it comes to his children, but if you are going to do a public memorial for the fans, then do it right. I think Michael would be upset to know there are fans who want to come and are being told to stay home. It's not right.

How are they doing their best for the public???
 
hesiod said:
But the police ain't gonna let them wander in the streets, they said so and they won't change their minds.. They're actually pissed that nobody takes up responsibility of the expenses that this will mean for the city -which is broke-, and therefore in order to resolve it, they just close the streets alltogether.. I'm sure they will have closed the whole centre around the stadium..
If things were more organized on behalf of the family, it would also mean an arrangement that it would be easier for the public to participate. Now they've just messed it up all the way..

hope this changes, but I don't hold my breath it happens..
i'm very sad over this.
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Well I'm going anyway, if there are no changes, then maybe I will go to Neverland or maybe there will be a meet up with other fans. When I booked my flight, I was under the impression that there would be big screens outside for the fans who couldn't get in. I just feel like I need to be there. I wish they were handling it differently.
 
OK so I am going to make myself unpopular here. The news is increasingly full of talk of snubs to UK fans, fans in uproar etc. We know the media stalks our websites and maybe we could choose our words more carefully.

Frankly what do fans expect? This is not a time for us to start getting precious about ourselves. The Jacksons are a family in grief, and cannot mourn the way others can, they have to do it in public and they cannot be all things to all people.

There is no venue in the world that can accomodate everyone who wants to be there in person - fact. They are doing their best, as is AEG who are standing the cost of this, together with the LA authorities.

We don't have to be there to pay our respects, we can all do it in our own way at home. If people have the money to travel and are disappointed why not give the cost of the trip to Great Ormond Street Hospital, which is a place Michael donated money to, do it in his name, he would love that and it is a tribute he would be proud of.

All I am trying to say is let's not end up with the Jackson family being critisised for not working miracles. They do care about and respect the fans, lets not make a devistating time even harder for them. We can't act like spoilt kids, otherwise they may just do nothing in future because they can never satisfy people.
 
hilliver said:
OK so I am going to make myself unpopular here. The news is increasingly full of talk of snubs to UK fans, fans in uproar etc. We know the media stalks our websites and maybe we could choose our words more carefully.

Frankly what do fans expect? This is not a time for us to start getting precious about ourselves. The Jacksons are a family in grief, and cannot mourn the way others can, they have to do it in public and they cannot be all things to all people.

There is no venue in the world that can accomodate everyone who wants to be there in person - fact. They are doing their best, as is AEG who are standing the cost of this, together with the LA authorities.

We don't have to be there to pay our respects, we can all do it in our own way at home. If people have the money to travel and are disappointed why not give the cost of the trip to Great Ormond Street Hospital, which is a place Michael donated money to, do it in his name, he would love that and it is a tribute he would be proud of.

All I am trying to say is let's not end up with the Jackson family being critisised for not working miracles. They do care about and respect the fans, lets not make a devistating time even harder for them. We can't act like spoilt kids, otherwise they may just do nothing in future because they can never satisfy people.
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Grown folks talking.
 
Well if the family suspects any form of foul play, its not unusual to wait with the funeral.. seen this done many times.

They probably wanna wait a little longer in case anything shows up.
Otherwise they might have to exhume him to make more tests.
 
hilliver said:
We don't have to be there to pay our respects, we can all do it in our own way at home. If people have the money to travel and are disappointed why not give the cost of the trip to Great Ormond Street Hospital, which is a place Michael donated money to, do it in his name, he would love that and it is a tribute he would be proud of.
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OMG, yes! He would love that.
 
classic said:
I think that people have to remember that this is a private family matter above all else. They are doing their best to accommodate the public because they realize the impact that Michael had on so many. But, their grief displayed at a funeral and burial is their right to keep private and personal if wished. And such should be respected.

There is no need for thinking things are messed up when things are simply being kept personal/private.
Click to expand...

classic I fully agree with you and I was going to write this until I read your post. Also if you really stop and think about it the family really doesnt owe us fans anything. They are doing the memorial out the goodness of their hearts. Because when someone in your family passes away the way that you choose to have the final arrangements is a very personal thing for that particular family. I feel honored that hey chose to include us also.
 
I feel a little insulted here because I am going to go to LA. I am 33 years old and have been a fan since I was 6. I made the decision to go when I thought they were doing something that would include the fans, that was their words, not mine. The family and the media have not been very clear. I just wanted to be with other fans, and I know this will be one of the last trips(Michael Jackson) related that I would take with my mom. Being Michael fans is something we've always shared.

I don't blame the family at all. I don't really know what the problem is. I do believe that the family should have privacy and I know they've had to make some hard decisions, but let's also remember how many people came together in thought when Michael passed, he touched so many people, that I think a public memorial is fitting, and if it is not then don't do it at all. having something public doesn't mean that his body has to be there, it doesn't mean that his family can't have a private funeral and burial, it doesn't mean that there can't be different events planned around the world, whatever, however they want to do it, but I think it would be nice for the fans to be able to come together.

Michael Jackson is not the first famous person to pass away, and I just think this memorial is half a**ed. All I am saying is if you are going to do it at all, then let the people who want to come, come, I think Michael would have wanted it that way.

Also please don't insult me for my decisions, everyone has different opinions and feelings on the subject, and no one needs to be judged in a negative way.... "to each their own"
 
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jilliebean,

I agree. He is the biggest and the best entertainer in the world, in the millennium and forever, he deserves something much better and bigger, instead of the containment policy they are doing right now! They selected a mid week working day, they limited attendance, and all of what they are trying to do is to contain the event instead of highlighting it…
 
lets just accept it guys

its time to celebrate michael

i know we are all hurting and we want there to be room for all of us. but nowherre on earth would fit everyone. the state is broke.. they have to do what they can under the circumstances. At the end of the day none of this will bring michael back.. the only thing we can do is stay positive and make tuesday as much of a remembrance and celebration as possible
 
I think the family is doing the best they can given the enormity of the situation, no matter how much you try not to think about death when it happens there is so much to deal with and your life if forever altered add in having a relative the most famous person and there isn't any way they were going to do everything right that is okay for everybody.
 
There was a lottery for concert ticket presale codes and look how that screwed the fans over. Now there is a lottery for his funeral tickets too. AEG running the show - well that explains the above. This is just another SHOW for them and they stand to net more money than the concerts ever would have through his death as they have a captive market for the holographic tickets, a captive market for any future tribute shows at the 02, a captive market for the rehearsal footage, etc etc. Need I go on? This is a business transaction for them. a money spinner. A wolf in sheeps clothing. Which is why I have not gone.

This is not the end of this sort of behaviour now. I think the fans have a lot to endure in the coming months - people "coming out of the woodwork" all with a story to tell, and now Michael is not around the deny nor challenge any of it. I think the ugliness is building and we need to detach from it, maintain our love and strength for Michael and not allow our emotion for the man cause us to be sucked in by these wolves.
 
I find it just ridiculous all these people treating this like a concert event. Somebody even was all excited if his body would be there! Anyway....it's not an event for us. It's for his family and they have been gracious enough to allow a memorial service for their son/brother/father/uncle/cousin/friend.

If there is a place for us to go to pay our respects someday, that will be the time to go and do it. This is not that place nor time.


-D
 
I have a lot of time for Randy Phillips from AEG, when he first talked about Michael, I was cynical, another one who saw dollar signs, and I worried that if Michael even sneezed the wrong way this guy would be in to a lawyer.

But I see him now talking about Michael, looking genuinly bereaved, he has twisted arms to get the full ticket refunds together with the handling fee, he didn't have to do that, he doesn't have to stand the cost of the memorial, and he could charge for tickets to cover cost, but he doing none of that.

I have no critisism of AEG at all, they are doing their best to accomodate everyone, and to organise a massive event in a week takes some commitment.
 
I'm not angry at his family. Not at all. Nor am I about a private funeral. (Ok, a little annoyed that we don't know about burial yet, but that's just how it is.) Nor about a lottery system for tickets (how else could it be closest to fair? Someone on TV said she should get tickets because she's been hanging out there all week. Um, ok. Some people would be fired from their jobs and couldn't feed their kids if they did that. Does that make them less worthy of tickets?)

What I feel angry about is the police closing down the entire area and telling everyone to stay home for what I feel should be the biggest memorial service ever with hundreds of thousands lining the streets in tribute. And over 500,000 registered within a few hours? That doesn't mean something? I know things are a mess right now with funding, with the economy and all, but it hardly feels like a good enough excuse. We're talking about Michael Jackson - remember the news a week ago - Michael Jackson -- remember the reaction, Los Angeles? And he's not exception enough to the rule??! Somehow?! (Sorry, it's simply how I feel.)
 
hesiod said:
Ok, I've been thinking for days about it and held it in, but now I feel I got to speak it out:

We're approaching the 10th day of his leaving us. And we don't even know when and where will he be burried, when and where will the actual funeral be -in my humble understanding the funeral is the ceremony before the actual burial-, or what, if any, spiritual character this ceremony will have...!

All we know is that they are going to hold a memorial-celebration of him in LA on Tuesday -something like a concert. Where most people who want to participate WILL NOT be able to go -not even outside as the police will close the streets around the area-, and where as we were told, Michael's body won't be there..
The idea to have a celebration is fair enough, but the way they picture it, it could happen any other day, it's NOT a funeral, and it does not even coincide with a funeral -since we don't know when that will be..

What I'm saying is that I guess I expected a more synchronous event, something like the farewell of Diana in the UK or other celebrities in the past, where there was one ceremony of farewell, where the masses could go and the deceased was there.. All of that is absent now. It seems they are so dazed and confused that they make scattered choices..

I don't know, may God bless them and enlighten them to do the right thing..
Click to expand...

The funeral is private and frankly, for once, it's the privacy that Michael has wanted all his life. We just have to respect that now.
 
500,000 in a very small area, is just asking for trouble. It would take at least a week to arrange something for that many people.


Remember, at the middle of all this, is MICHAEL, they have to lay him to rest.
 
I think some people are confusing things here:

Noone ever questioned either the pain of the family or their right to grief privately. It was THEM who first talked about letting the public in to pay their respects in the farewell ceremony. My understanding is that they were talking about the funeral, not any event that would follow in Michael's memory -a concert or whatever. So, it was their words that the final farewell would be somehow accessible to the public. Precisely, however, because I understand that the final moments are theirs and only theirs, I realize that the burial would have to be separate, and private. Noone ever questioned that.

All we said is why don't they try to combine these two as it happens when such great people are leaving -and I mentioned Diana. Where you had the religious service at the centre of London with thousands crowding across the streets, and the burial at her paternal estate and away from any journalist or public. That's what I had in mind.

As for the body, it was never a matter of 'excitement' for anyone if it was present at the service. It's just the norm that in farewell-services people say goodbye to the remains as well. It is a way of paying respects -at least in the Christian tradition, to which I belong.

I repeat, an arrangement like that which has ocurred in other cases of great people deceased I think would combine both the privacy needed by the family and the ability that outsiders ask to participate.

And I'm not faulting the family solely. They seemed undecided for days, but now it's also the fault of the police that is refusing to make it easier for us. this is unprecedented -the first time an authority comes out and tells people to mourn somebody "from their homes", essentially forbidding them to pay farewell publicly. If it is a matter of money, then the family should have contributed and made it easier.
Either way, I hope they all reconsider and it changes..
 
PrettyYoungThang said:
There was a lottery for concert ticket presale codes and look how that screwed the fans over. Now there is a lottery for his funeral tickets too. AEG running the show - well that explains the above. This is just another SHOW for them and they stand to net more money than the concerts ever would have through his death as they have a captive market for the holographic tickets, a captive market for any future tribute shows at the 02, a captive market for the rehearsal footage, etc etc. Need I go on? This is a business transaction for them. a money spinner. A wolf in sheeps clothing. Which is why I have not gone.

This is not the end of this sort of behaviour now. I think the fans have a lot to endure in the coming months - people "coming out of the woodwork" all with a story to tell, and now Michael is not around the deny nor challenge any of it. I think the ugliness is building and we need to detach from it, maintain our love and strength for Michael and not allow our emotion for the man cause us to be sucked in by these wolves.
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PrettyYoungThang, your first paragragh is almost identical to what a friend of mine from another board was telling me over the phone very late lastnight!!!In regard to AEG and their handling of the memorial. Wow.
 
jilliebean said:
I feel a little insulted here because I am going to go to LA. I am 33 years old and have been a fan since I was 6. I made the decision to go when I thought they were doing something that would include the fans, that was their words, not mine. The family and the media have not been very clear. I just wanted to be with other fans, and I know this will be one of the last trips(Michael Jackson) related that I would take with my mom. Being Michael fans is something we've always shared.

I don't blame the family at all. I don't really know what the problem is. I do believe that the family should have privacy and I know they've had to make some hard decisions, but let's also remember how many people came together in thought when Michael passed, he touched so many people, that I think a public memorial is fitting, and if it is not then don't do it at all. having something public doesn't mean that his body has to be there, it doesn't mean that his family can't have a private funeral and burial, it doesn't mean that there can't be different events planned around the world, whatever, however they want to do it, but I think it would be nice for the fans to be able to come together.

Michael Jackson is not the first famous person to pass away, and I just think this memorial is half a**ed. All I am saying is if you are going to do it at all, then let the people who want to come, come, I think Michael would have wanted it that way.

Also please don't insult me for my decisions, everyone has different opinions and feelings on the subject, and no one needs to be judged in a negative way.... "to each their own"
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I completely agree with you and I understand what youre saying. I, too, am being insulted for trying to express my feelings as well.
 
I have no problem whatsoever in not knowing the ins and outs of Michaels burial/funeral. The less divulged the better, for the sake of the family. People are forgetting that first and foremost, Michael is a member of a family, and a very loving one at that. They need to do things their way.

For the public memorial, I simply feel that the family are unable to provide to the fans what they want because the authorities in LA are clearly against it. They dont want to be overstretched in terms of manpower etc etc and I think they have obviously relayed this to the family who are really trying to make the best out of an impossible situation. Its been hinted that there will be various memorials around the world for Michael at some point so hopefully fans can be happy with this.
 
personally i just feel its another dumbing down of mikes legacy
 
I agree, the powers that be are trying to play it all down. I dont think the family have the time or energy to challenge them either.
 
Ιf they can't do it in LA because the local authorities -reknown for their racism- won't let them do it properly, then they should do it somewhere else where they wouldn't have that problem, or contribute to the expenses that the city will have to pay to meet the security needs. as simple as that.
 
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