Coroners Report released - GRAPHIC CONTENT (Threads merged)

Beachlover

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TWINKLE in your last comment, I think you were trying to urge people to stay with the facts. I THANK YOU FOR THAT.

I have read both topics about the autopsy on the board, and I am getting concerned because some people pick up three or more unrelated things, put them together and come up with alarming conclusions. My concern is that IF WE ARE MISINFORMED HERE, WHAT WOULD HAPPEN WHEN THE MEDIA STARTS THE UNTRUTHS UNTIL AFTER THE TRIAL? Given this, I ask that people PLEASE STAY WITH THE FACTS of the report when giving explanations to others. Maybe some people skip words they do not understand in the report, and make assumptions about what they know, which may be the cause of some of the strange comments.

We do not want outside when reading the comments to pick out the errors and use in their articles as truths either. Let us draw conclusions based on analysis of the facts.

Beach and Sound thank you for your knowledge. Everyone thank you for the factual comments.

You are welcome but I still don't appreciate getting thrown under a bus when I didn't say anything wrong. Its not easy sitting here reading this, then figuring out if it matches what we know, etc. I understand tempers are high and all but this is not the thread to come in and do that.
 
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KaReEnA88

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TWINKLE in your last comment, I think you were trying to urge people to stay with the facts. I THANK YOU FOR THAT.

I have read both topics about the autopsy on the board, and I am getting concerned because some people pick up three or more unrelated things, put them together and come up with alarming conclusions. My concern is that IF WE ARE MISINFORMED HERE, WHAT WOULD HAPPEN WHEN THE MEDIA STARTS THE UNTRUTHS UNTIL AFTER THE TRIAL? Given this, I ask that people PLEASE STAY WITH THE FACTS of the report when giving explanations to others. Maybe some people skip words they do not understand in the report, and make assumptions about what they know, which may be the cause of some of the strange comments.

We do not want outside when reading the comments to pick out the errors and use in their articles as truths either. Let us draw conclusions based on analysis of the facts.

Beach and Sound thank you for your knowledge. Everyone thank you for the factual comments.
Very true Petrarose, we need to remember to go by facts, I know that it's hard as none of us are actual doctors and while looking up definitions we tend to insert out our opinion or interpret actual facts differently, which makes it very hard to remain 'factual'. But we have to do our best, glad we have so many people who are willing to share their knowledge.
 

Ohood

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Re: Regarding the Coroner's Report...

thanx guys.
 

Beachlover

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Beachlover, what you did was not an ''educational guess''. You simply assumed things you do not know. You spin together two things that were mentioned and made a third possible issue up, all on your own.
I haven't even read what people said to you in this thread and quiet frankly I'm not even interested. I do feel sorry for you if, people trample on you for no reason, but that has nothing to do with you assuming stuff you don't know.
If the prostate had been the issue you make it you to be it would have been stated, which was not the case. Anyways carry on I'm out

I am calm Soundmind. Believe it or not.

Here are the facts you asked for:

Visual inspection of the room shows a bottle of urine near the bedside.
He is also wearing a condom catheter.

On Page 12 of 51 Toxicology Findings:

2. Nodular prostatic hyperplasia
A) Prominent intravesical median lobe enlargement
B) Urinary Retention

On Page 12 of 51 Autopsy Report

The urinary bladder is distended and trabeculated. It contains 550 grams of clear yellow-orange urine.

The prostate is moderately enlarged, with a prominent intravesical lobe.

On Page 2 of 51 Investigators Narrative

Included in the mediations is Flomax

On Page 36 or 51 Microscopic Report

3) Nodular prostatic hyperplasia
 

BillieJean84

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I just need to make it clear that I have said in my posts that I have not yet read all the details so if I am wrong, then please just politely let me know ; I have not jumped to conclusions about anything. thats why we all are posting here to clear the facts up. I will bring myself to read the reports and documents sometime, but I do not want ppl to think I am / was, posting just something I think I know, when I don't even have the source/s, alot online articles, in front of me.

thank you.
 

Rawr

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Sorry if this was posted earlier, but I'm hella excited about my friend reminding me about this...

There's some extremely good news coming out of all of this - even better than the official report of vitiligo...

MJ's penis! It wasn't circumcised!

The important thing about that?

Jordy Chandler said it was.


CASE. CLOSED. HATERS BETTER SIT DOWN!
 

BillieJean84

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Sorry if this was posted earlier, but I'm hella excited about my friend reminding me about this...

There's some extremely good news coming out of all of this - even better than the official report of vitiligo...

MJ's penis! It wasn't circumcised!

The important thing about that?

Jordy Chandler said it was.


CASE. CLOSED. HATERS BETTER SIT DOWN!


well we all knew they were all lying anyway but thats good news to hear.
 

twinklEE

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Sorry if this was posted earlier, but I'm hella excited about my friend reminding me about this...

There's some extremely good news coming out of all of this - even better than the official report of vitiligo...

MJ's penis! It wasn't circumcised!

The important thing about that?

Jordy Chandler said it was.


CASE. CLOSED. HATERS BETTER SIT DOWN!
Fans always knew it wasn't.. logical thinking was all that was needed to come to the conclusion that it wasn't lol :D
 

Rawr

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Fans always knew it wasn't.. logical thinking was all that was needed to come to the conclusion that it wasn't lol :D

I didn't know. :unsure: What was this logical thinking? PM me if you think it's too inappropriate. :lol:
 

twinklEE

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I didn't know. :unsure: What was this logical thinking? PM me if you think it's too inappropriate. :lol:

lol money is required to get your child circumcised. Katherine and Joseph were poor at the time they had children, they wouldn't have had enough money to have 6 boys circumcised. A bunch of us fans on another board came to this conclusion years ago :lol:

We always assumed he wasn't and now it's a fact that he wasn't.
 

Rawr

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lol money is required to get your child circumcised. Katherine and Joseph were poor at the time they had children, they wouldn't have had enough money to have 6 boys circumcised. A bunch of us fans on another board came to this conclusion years ago :lol:

We always assumed he wasn't and now it's a fact that he wasn't.

Oh wow, I always assumed the procedure was free. :lol:

Plus, Jehovah's Witnesses usually follow Paul when he says circumcision of the physical body isn't required anymore, but instead of the heart.
 

twinklEE

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Oh wow, I always assumed the procedure was free. :lol:

Plus, Jehovah's Witnesses usually follow Paul when he says circumcision of the physical body isn't required anymore, but instead of the heart.
Really? I don't know if it's free or not :lol: I always assumed u goota pay for it :lol:
 

RainbowAngel

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I don't know what all I said that was bad. I have to go back and read my own posts now. I am really just trying to piece together all the pieces of this puzzle we have so that we know what really happened.

I don't think anyone had said anything bad or wrong. It's just that not everyone are able to seperate the medical information of a patient with the fact we are talking about very sad things on someone we love so much.
I guess those who are a bit sensitive to the medical information that shows how sick Michael was, to avoid reading those kind of post. Some of us don't feel very bad disscussing it because they have medical/phamaceutical background or is an experience or a strong person.
 

eighthnoterojo

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Ok, I couldn't read through the report; too painful. But I have managed to read the thread. I didn't see anything about hair samples. Were they either not included, or not analyzed? I know they were collected much later.
 

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Re: Regarding the Coroner's Report...

i don´t read it..not now...maybe i never will
it´s to hard, to sad....:no:
 

daisy

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i'm sorry diasy, but what Murray did was never a mistake , not after six weeks.all his patient said that he is a very good and competant doctor...

That's what I think exactly, and I'm curious whether the report results could somehow confirm it. I don't believe Michael ever asked for propofol and many of my posts reflect it ;)
 

TeharaMJ

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Re: Regarding the Coroner's Report...

I knew this report was out there and today I was extremely eager to read it because part of me is still very angry that so many those in the medical profession and yes even Michael's close family and friends just couldn't save him.

This report shows that the lethal combination of propofol and benzodiazepam just depressed his breathing and given that there was no monitoring devices present there was really no way to assist in any breathing difficulties...which is just sad sad sad.

Ive also heard the but, Michael is ultimately responsible for his own demons, he asked for it etc etc...and im just so sick of it. Does this mean I can go around asking for something that could potentially kill me and I get it so its my fault...whilst those in control did nothing to help me. It's a really difficult call.
 

MoeJack

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Re: Regarding the Coroner's Report...

I knew this report was out there and today I was extremely eager to read it because part of me is still very angry that so many those in the medical profession and yes even Michael's close family and friends just couldn't save him.

This report shows that the lethal combination of propofol and benzodiazepam just depressed his breathing and given that there was no monitoring devices present there was really no way to assist in any breathing difficulties...which is just sad sad sad.

Ive also heard the but, Michael is ultimately responsible for his own demons, he asked for it etc etc...and im just so sick of it. Does this mean I can go around asking for something that could potentially kill me and I get it so its my fault...whilst those in control did nothing to help me. It's a really difficult call.

There's no doubt that the doctors and people around MJ share a huge portion of the blame. But we also can't deny that ultimately Michael brought this upon himself. What on earth is he doing taking something so potent and so dangerous that needs to be monitored all the time..it's more like a handicap than a benefit. I don't know what was going on with MJ at home..but according to the dr, he'd been treating mj for this sleeping problem for 6 weeks..so it wasn't like a one time thing. Since he'd been doing it for well over a month, probably neither MJ or the doctor suspected that anything would go wrong, but simply putting himself in that position and taking that risk wasn't a very smart move in my opinion. But in the end, and this is just my personal view, everything happens at the exact moment in time that it's meant to happen. So, personally, I don't think that things could have turned out any different because MJ was simply meant to grace this planet for 50 years and move right along. We're just lucky to have been here during that time...
 

daisy

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yes , if he used it that night and that morning it would have been much higher in his urine . But we need hair sample to determine whether he was using it the prior days , weeks . From urine you could only determine the last hours , last night , that's it .

OK, it's interesting then, if they have hair test results concerning this - shouldn't it be then a part of the whole report?
 

emmah24

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Re: Regarding the Coroner's Report...

I read it last night and I couldnt really equate the information I was reading to the heart and soul of the man who was such a special person to me. It was distressing, he is so much more to me than flesh and blood.

The contents of the report saddened me, though healthwise I dont believe that Michael was unhealthy. He's been put through a lot and I guess the most emotional thing to read was just how much pressure and anxiety he obviously felt, hence the prescribed meds he was taking to get him through.

Reading it, I just hope he REALLY knew how much he was loved and appreciated.
 

Sunflowers

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OK, it's interesting then, if they have hair test results concerning this - shouldn't it be then a part of the whole report?

On the last page of the report you can read how they went to Forest Lawn in august to get hair samples. I thought it was one of the hardest pages to read, so please be warned.
 

daisy

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On the last page of the report you can read how they went to Forest Lawn in august to get hair samples. I thought it was one of the hardest pages to read, so please be warned.

ok thanks, I have the report open on page 50. If I went through all the pages I can manage to check the last one.

EDIT: But there are no test results...

anyway, by doing that I finished reading it :cry:
 

emmah24

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Re: Regarding the Coroner's Report...

There's no doubt that the doctors and people around MJ share a huge portion of the blame. But we also can't deny that ultimately Michael brought this upon himself. What on earth is he doing taking something so potent and so dangerous that needs to be monitored all the time..it's more like a handicap than a benefit. I don't know what was going on with MJ at home..but according to the dr, he'd been treating mj for this sleeping problem for 6 weeks..so it wasn't like a one time thing. Since he'd been doing it for well over a month, probably neither MJ or the doctor suspected that anything would go wrong, but simply putting himself in that position and taking that risk wasn't a very smart move in my opinion. But in the end, and this is just my personal view, everything happens at the exact moment in time that it's meant to happen. So, personally, I don't think that things could have turned out any different because MJ was simply meant to grace this planet for 50 years and move right along. We're just lucky to have been here during that time...

For me, the bigger question is what the hell is a medical professional (ie Murray) doing administering an anasthetic as a sleeping aid.

Someone at some point in Michaels life has suggested it and given it to him, and has led Michael into a false sense of security with it. Michael has been very vulnerable at various times in his life and people have latched to him without his best interests at heart. And I have to disagree that Michael "brought this on himself". Its a culmination of a whole heap of circumstances that neither you nor I will ever fully understand cause we've never experienced what he has.
 

Beachlover

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I don't think anyone had said anything bad or wrong. It's just that not everyone are able to seperate the medical information of a patient with the fact we are talking about very sad things on someone we love so much.
I guess those who are a bit sensitive to the medical information that shows how sick Michael was, to avoid reading those kind of post. Some of us don't feel very bad disscussing it because they have medical/phamaceutical background or is an experience or a strong person.

Hi. I'd like to comment on your post. First of all, Michael was not sick. Michael was almost 51 years old and he had were pretty normal things for someone of his age. He did look really good because he did have some procedures on his face and kept himself looking good.

Again, he was in great health. There were no signs of the Lupus that I could find anywhere. A little bit of arthritis, a little bit of vascular disease in his legs, but these are pretty normal and would cause him no major issues. The enlarged prostate I mentioned in earlier posts is also another part of aging and it happens to a lot of men. It is uncomfortable for them and they take medicine for it.

I am in the medical field and see these things all the time and they are just a process of aging for many people and they take a little Tylenol or anti inflammatory medicine and feel fine. The tabloids and some of the on line celebrity news factories often tell stories that are not true at all and this happens to a lot of celebrities, not just Michael. Don't believe them without facts first.

Again, some of the topics discussed unfortunately are a little hard to read for some and the wording may look scary. If you read something I wrote and you don't understand and want to know, just ask. I'll try my best to explain it better so that you can understand it.
 

Limonali

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I was trying to re-read the report yesterday but I had to close it at exactly the same page as before.
I just can't. When they start talking about cutting, I HAVE to stop.

Please carry on with this discussion it's even more important for me to read since I can't bring myself to read the full report.
Sticking to facts is necessary, and I always thought Beachlover is doing just that.
We all ARE going to make assumptions and guesses since we don't know anything for sure and many results are missing.
Maybe what's necessary is just to underline that a specific statement IS A GUESS - simple as that.
 
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Limonali

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There were no signs of the Lupus that I could find anywhere. (...) If you read something I wrote and you don't understand and want to know, just ask. I'll try my best to explain it better so that you can understand it.

I wanted to ask you: many people assume automatically that the inflamation of lungs is a proof of Lupus.
How would you comment on this given what you said above: there were no signs of Lupus?
 

bouee

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ok thanks, I have the report open on page 50. If I went through all the pages I can manage to check the last one.

EDIT: But there are no test results...

anyway, by doing that I finished reading it :cry:

Yes, and that made me wonder if the autopsy report we have is complete. Maybe the hair tests results exist but have not been leaked.

And thanks a lot Soundmind, Beachlover for your posts, they are really helpful.
 

APOM

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Re: Regarding the Coroner's Report...

i have a question about the anti- depression and anti-anxity....did MJ used them? and why a person used these medicine is called an addict , because they are not to make anyone high , but to help to stop the pain ?

A substance does not have to make people high for them to become dependent on or addicted to it. Usually, just giving them some form of relief, be it from stress or pain or the inability to sleep, is enough for someone to become dependent on a substance, which can eventually lead to addiction.

In MJ's case it seems he believed, or was made to believe, that he needed the propofol to give his body and mind the rest it required for him to be able to do the This Is It shows.

However, after reading the coroner's report and the information it presents on propofol, its use and the required circumstances and equipment for administering it to a patient, it should be abundantly clear to *anyone* that he should've never even had access to the stuff... Let alone have it administered to him as a medicine against insomnia and in such a casual and unprofessional manner. And for this -- for introducing him to it and giving him access to it -- his doctors should be held responsible and they should be punished, severely.

It is extremely irresponsible and a gross negligence on their part that things ever got this far and I honestly don't understand how any doctors or other medical personnel involved in MJ's life, who knew about this, can live with themselves.
 

daisy

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I wanted to ask you: many people assume automatically that the inflamation of lungs is a proof of Lupus.
How would you comment on this given what you said above: there were no signs of Lupus?

the whole section on lungs inflammation looks very serious.
 

RainbowAngel

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Hi. I'd like to comment on your post. First of all, Michael was not sick.

Err, to me the autopsy report does sound like he had been sick but not the kind of sickness that would put his life in danger. ;-) "how sick" doesn't equal to "life threathening sickness" ;-) I guess you must have misinterpret me. He had troubles with sleeping, eating and had catheters and balloon pump in the veins.
Btw, I'm actually a medical and pharmaceutical biotechnology graduate and I work in pathology lab. ehehe!
 
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