New Fan and Thoroughly Addicted to Everything About This Man!

[zinniabooklover]

Picture of Michael from that 1982 Rose Bowl / Quincy Jones / Budweiser Superfest.

 

[zinniabooklover]

@filmandmusic

Don't want to derail your Jackson Family thread so am posting my question over here. Have never seen The Wiz, don't plan to watch it but am just catching up with You Can't Win which I really like. Had a quick look to see if there were any live YT clips, couldn't find any. There is some sort of performance at the MSG thing, doesn't seem to involve Michael and I don't want to watch the MSG shows in any case.

Do you know of any YT clips in existence? I can't find anything but you have skills so I thought I would ask.

 

[filmandmusic]

@zinniabooklover no there is no live performance. What version have you heard? The radio edit or the full 7 min freakout?
You didn’t ask but “ ease on down the road” with Diana is the only song of that movie he did live

Now that I got Diana involved here she is again performing rock with you with Mike.

 

[zinniabooklover]

@zinniabooklover no there is no live performance. What version have you heard? The radio edit or the full 7 min freakout?
You didn’t ask but “ ease on down the road” with Diana is the only song of that movie he did live

Now that I got Diana involved here she is again performing rock with you with Mike.

Cheers, mate. This is so helpful.

Not mad keen on Ease On Down - probably should take that over to heresy but too hot, too tired, lol.

re You Can't Win, no, I just heard the radio edit. Didn't see an extended version. Will go and look for that. Thanks for the heads-up. That Rose Bowl / Quincy Jones clip you posted - which I love - when I listened to You Can't Win it seemed to have a similar vibe. At any rate, I had never heard of it and I loved it so I need to immerse myself in it.

 

[zinniabooklover]

@zinniabooklover no there is no live performance. What version have you heard? The radio edit or the full 7 min freakout?

oh my bad. I did see the extended version. Sorry, forgot. Brain fried.

Mm, wasn't keen, tbh. Generally I don't love extended versions whether they are official or fan-made. I've always been into the radio edit. Maybe cos I grew up in an era still dominated by the radio. I dunno. Never really thought about it but it's definitely a 'thing' for me. If a song is supposed to be a long one - Close To The Edge by Yes, for example - then I'm fine. But a 3 or 4 minute radio-friendly song, that's all I want. I can't even cope with the longer version of Can You Feel It? and I love that song.

 

[filmandmusic]

@zinniabooklover you are not alone with preferring radio edits over extended cuts @83magic prefers them as well. Personally I'm the opposite, the longer the more I like it

Ease on down the road is pure fun and that performance makes it even better, your brain must indeed be fried
What was the max temperature in the UK, I heard 40 degrees was a possibility... We got to 38 today in Belgium

 

[zinniabooklover]

@zinniabooklover you are not alone with preferring radio edits over extended cuts @83magic prefers them as well.

Oh, I had forgotten that. Yay for us peeps who love the radio versions!! We are awesome, lol. For me, a lot of the impact is lost when the song goes beyond a certain point.

Personally I'm the opposite, the longer the more I like it

I noticed that! You are all over those long edits. You're doing it so I don't have to, lol.

Ease on down the road is pure fun and that performance makes it even better, your brain must indeed be fried

Nah, it's just not my type of song no matter what the weather, lol. And I have never been mad keen on Diana Ross, anyway. Perfectly decent performer who built herself an awesome career. But she's not for me. Never has been, really.

But my brain is truly fried. I am NOT good in hot weather. I was not built for this kind of heat. I need September and October.

What was the max temperature in the UK, I heard 40 degrees was a possibility... We got to 38 today in Belgium

I don't even want to look. I know 38 was predicted for yesterday or today but I keep away from weather forecasts as much as I can. I had heatstroke last week. I can practically get heatstroke just from looking at the weather report in the newspaper, lol.

Everyone is struggling, even the people who love heat are struggling. And I do not love it. Makes me properly ill. It is really intense, atm.

All of that said, I've got enough brain power left to enjoy Michael. I am still enjoying that Rose Bowl / Quincy stuff you posted. Man, I cannot tell you how much I am loving that. I had no idea of its existence, never heard of this Budweiser Superfest thing. And now with You Can't Win as well I'm having a blast. I'm also getting very emotional over I'll Be There. My man, Jackie.

 

[zinniabooklover]

"Be a lamp, or a lifeboat, or a ladder. Help someone’s soul heal. Walk out of your house like a shepherd."

A quote from Rumi, Persian poet, Sufi mystic.

Can't remember where but I'm sure I read somewhere that Michael liked his work. Even it that isn't correct, this quote here immediately made me think of Michael, especially the first part.

 

[LinLoveMJ]

Well...back to serious sh*t with my story to tell
I don't even know where to begin...(sorry for my wrong sentences sometimes )

I just joined the community, and boy....it feels like home. I can express myself, no one to judge me or say you are out of you mind.
I became a fan since I was about 10 years old, so about 40 years now. He is with me for so long, in my mind and soul.
Michael helped me in so many ways. It was not much fun in my life, he kept me going, I listen to his songs, study lyrics, listen to his speeches, interviews, phrases and he always help me get over things. Its actually magic to me. He helped me when I was a teenager and he is helping me still.

I can relate to him, I understand where he is coming from. Of course we are not the same, but the things he went through, his feelings, I can say okee, you're like me in a way. Being alone, lonelyness even when you have people around. Being shy and the need for friends, and people let you down all the time that trust is gone. People saying shit about you and get you in trouble. Or talk trash about you and false allegations, all emotions are mixed together. I can't even understand how he coped in his life, being famous and have all this shit, I felt for him.
I feel deeply sad for him, not to have the friends he needed and those allegations which broke his heart, it must me so so hard for him.
Why do people let him down so hard, such a beautifull man, wanted to change the world for the better
Thats why I love will you be there so much, its a deep song, meaningfull, close to his heart and also mine, the last phrase; I'll never let you part, for your always in my heart. Omg.

He teached me many things about life, about art, music, people, earth, everything. I learned a lot. He is so smart. He may be quiet but he saw everything, he soaked it all up like a sponge, and expressed it in his work. What a talent he is.
A sweet gentleman, sincerely, kind, true, honest, funny, sexy, he have it all.

I went 4 times to his concerts, which was so special, front row 3 times, he was that close. the 5th time he cancelled that one, I was devestated.
Now I know Im privileged to have seen him live, and it was perfect, what a show. I said before, I could smell his and his dancers make up, one time I got pulled out of the crowd when I stood 5th row, it was too hot, and I walked just right pass him, with my mouth wide open and stared.
Then I could walk back in the crowd aside and I managed to get almost in front again haha
I was going to this is it. Unfortunately.....well..you know,... I cant listen to it, I cant look at this is it.

Now, I recently went to lady gaga in concert, then a strange thing happened. (I never go to a concert, this was the first after michaels), she was standing on a top, music started, those hard bass that bonk into your body, and then I saw michael on stage...I was back in rotterdam, he was just standing there, looking at me, I was like..what???? Then gaga came down and it was gone. Back home I tought, now I am really crazy. I cried and cried a lot last week. I missed him already a lot but now I miss him even more, that it hurts my heart and soul.
When he left me, he took a part of me with him, my heart will never heal again.

I talk to him in my mind, sounds silly, but when I do it feels like he is here, listening and be with me. At the concert and after I feel like he was with me too and with my tears it was like he was saying don't worry I am here with you, I don't go anywhere. It was just strange, but in a way I believe when I talk he sometimes is here with me.

I can talk and talk and write a lot about my feelings and michael, but I'll leave it like this.
I am glad I am here with you guys, really kind of home

 

[filmandmusic]

@LinLoveMJ wait did you just say you are one of the women he called on stage?
what concerts did you go to?

 

[LinLoveMJ]

no I did not go on stage. I was just getting out of the crowd. I was so jalous of those girls...
I was at Bad and Dangerous.

 

[filmandmusic]

no I did not go on stage. I was just getting out of the crowd. I was so jalous of those girls...
I was at Bad and Dangerous.

Oh yes now I get it, because it was too hot. How does that work does someone points this out to security or do medics spot it when someone is in trouble?
How did you back in the crowd, does this happen from the front or do you have to start all the way at the back again?
How much did you miss when they took you out?

 

[Hiker]

Thanks so much for sharing @LinLoveMJ ! 4 times at concert! wow ! 40 years, what a journey for you. As you have probably read, Michael has that effect on people even now.

 

[LinLoveMJ]

Oh yes now I get it, because it was too hot. How does that work does someone points this out to security or do medics spot it when someone is in trouble?
How did you back in the crowd, does this happen from the front or do you have to start all the way at the back again?
How much did you miss when they took you out?

If someone is passing out the people call the medics and they get pulled out, they come from far from the crowd as you can see in clips at concerts. I had many legs in my neck and over my head from people dragged out. Others call the medics/crowd controle themself. I was getting too hot and pushed too hard so I called them myself cause I couldnt see the concert well cause I had to be carefull in that crowd for myself. Where I was in guys were touching girls including me, touch breast and more, so I hated it there. You go to the side, there you get water and a check up and if you are clear to go you can go back in. They walk you to the side of the stage and you can mangle in the crowd, you dont go all the way back. I didnt miss much, a few minutes, cause I didnt faint or something, so I got some water and walked back in.

 

[MacMandy90]

@LinLoveMJ That was an absolutely lovely story girl, you're so lucky! His concerts had so much vigor and energy, he knew how to get the crowd pumped up for sure.

 

[zinniabooklover]

Bit frustrated. Found an old thread called 'Positive websites and videos that celebrate MJ'. Was gonna bump a couple of messages from there and also post this little video. But the thread is now closed (it ran from 2010 - 2013).

So I'm posting this little vid here. It's new to me - not the footage itself. That's from WMA 2006. I mean, the audio stuff from Howard Bloom and Wayne Dyer.

The first voice you hear is Howard Bloom. The second one is Wayne Dyer.

@staywild23 @Hiker @MacMandy90 @wendijane

 

[zinniabooklover]

This is the main comment I wanted to bump from the thread celebrating Michael. I haven't read Howard Bloom's book but I found his comments here to be interesting and insightful.


@MacMandy90 @wendijane @Hiker @staywild23


Howard Bloom - Remembering Michael One Year Later


Do you know the poem by William Blake -

To see a World in a grain of sand,
And a Heaven in a wild flower,
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand,
And Eternity in an hour . . .

The intense ambition of that poem, the intense desire for wonder, was alive in Michael. More alive than anything of the sort I’d ever seen. Michael saw the infinite in an inch. As Michael opened the page further, inch by inch, his knees and elbows bent even more and his ”ooohs,” his sounds of aesthetic orgasm, grew even more intense. Standing elbow to elbow and shoulder to shoulder with him, you could feel him discovering things in the brush and inkstrokes that even the artist never saw. By the time he’d opened the full page his body and voice expressed an ecstasy. An aesthetic epiphany. I’d never encountered anything like it. Michael felt the beauty of the page with every cell of his being.

I’ve worked with Prince, Bob Marley, Peter Gabriel, Billy Joel, and Bette Midler, some of the most talented people of our generation, and not one of them had the quality of wonder that came alive in Michael. He saw the wonder in everything. His quality of wonder was beyond anything most of us humans can conceive.

Look, above all other things I’m a scientist. Science is my religion. It’s been my religion since I was ten years old. The first two rules of science are 1) the truth at any price including the price of your life; and 2) Look at the things right under your nose as if you’ve never seen them before and then proceed from there. And that’s not just a rule of science. It’s a rule of art. And it’s a rule of life. Very few people know it. Even fewer people live it. But Michael was it, he incarnated it in every follicle of his being. Michael was the closest I’ve ever come to a secular Angel. A secular saint.

Look, I’m an atheist, but Michael was not. He believed he was given a gift by God. He believed he was given talents and wonders and astonishments seldom granted to us very fragile human beings. Because God had given him this enormous gift, he felt he owed the experience of wonder, astonishment, awe, and Blake’s infinities to his fellow human beings. But unlike other generous humans–Bill and Melinda Gates, for example–with Michael giving to others was not just a part-time thing. The need to give to others was alive in every breath he took every single day.

Michael Jackson’s entire life was receiving and giving and the whole purpose of receiving was so he could give. He worked with every cell in his body to give the gift of that amazement, that astonishment to his fellow human beings. Needing the adulation of crowds WAS Michael’s connection to others, his most profound connection, far more profound than family and friends (though those are indispensable), and far more healing. That act of giving keeps an iconic person, a person who never knows normalness, alive.

Howard Bloom, an author (the whole story: thehappiestmedium.com/2010/06/one-year-later-remembering-michael-by-howard-bloom/)

Source: Facebook

 

[zinniabooklover]

Don't worry. I'm not going to copy over the entire thread, lol.

I just picked this at random as something to read for myself and now feel compelled to post it over here. In one sense, there is nothing really new here. You could say that these memories of Michael are fairly typical. And yet, there is something so lyrical and sweet and joyful in the way he talks about Michael. A couple of bits that I especially liked, I've put those in bold.


Remembering my friend Michael Jackson
By Al Bell

The last time I met with Michael, we saw each other from across the room and he made a point of coming over to say "hello." Instead of greeting me with something like, "Al - it's great to see you," he instead simply grinned at me and said, "By the time I get to Phoenix!"

He related to me by remembering the 18-minute song that I produced with others for Isaac Hayes' "Hot Buttered Soul" album.

Michael always had a great sense of humor and even more important, he had a great sense of love for all of his friends and family.

That, more than anything else, is what is important to remember about Michael Jackson -- The 'spirit of love' was at the forefront of all of his thoughts and of everything he did. (emphasis added)

In order to understand Michael Jackson, we must examine not just what he said, but what he did. When we do that, we see that it all was about love. While on earth, that 'spirit of love' manifested itself through him and influenced how he dealt with people, whether it was adults, children, musicians, producers, business associates, family, or friends.

Of course, because he arguably was the greatest entertainer of all time, he was always targeted by people who sought to bring him down to their level. I find it interesting how a person like Michael Jackson could envelope this planet with so much love while "contrary spirits" were determined to cause this man irreparable psychological and emotional distress. He did not deserve any of that, but I guess if there weren't controversy, perhaps he wouldn't have been as renowned and legendary as he is.

I personally choose to remember the positive attributes of Michael, those things we all know to be true about him. For instance, Michael was an absolutely awesome athlete, for he was an indescribable dancer. I'm sure those people who danced with him, and the choreographers who worked with him, had never seen or worked with anyone like him before - or since.

He also was a student of the arts. He studied motion pictures, including the old silent movies and the old musicals. Everything he saw, everything he studied, influenced every step of his dance routines and the totality of his creative thought processes. He studied the great singers, dancers, and musicians, and was an appreciator of virtually all genres of music. He loved jazz, opera, soul, and gospel, and was particularly fond of and inspired by some of the truly great artists of our times, including James Brown, Jackie Wilson, and the penetrating soul of Isaac Hayes and Mavis Staples.

As an artistic leader within the recorded music industry, Michael Jackson always pushed the boundaries, innovating new sounds and images that had never before been heard or seen. When he created the "Thriller" phenomenon, he sought out one of the greatest creative and artistic arrangers of all time, Quincy Jones, to help him with the music and production. Then he went to director John Landis to co-write and direct the 14-minute video. Through this collaboration, he birthed his greatest audio and video work of art. The video has consistently been called the best music video of all time.

In an interview with Brian Monroe of Ebony/Jet magazine, Michael Jackson said, "You want what you create to live - whether it's sculpture or painting or music." He quoted Michelangelo by saying, "I know the creator will go, but his work survives." That is why, Michael said, "I attempt to bind my soul to my work - that's how I feel. I give my all to my work. I want it to just live." (emphasis added)

Two months ago 'the spirit' that existed in that carnal body we called Michael Jackson transitioned from this plane to the next. But Michael Jackson's thoughts, his soul, and his spirit still live in his music, and thereby he lives through it - still among us.


Source:

http://www.thegrio.com/black-history/popular-culture/remembering-my-friend-michael-jackson.php

 

[zinniabooklover]

"We all know Michael was a multi-faceted person. And I don’t want to speak for anyone else with this particular reflection, but sometimes I have struggled to understand how one person could be so many different things. For example, we hear about Michael being this childlike, excitable person full of wonder, who loved Disney characters and water balloon fights, etc. But then we (especially many of the women of us lol) also see this other side of him – the dynamically sensual, “sex symbol” of a performer side. I have spent time in enough fan spaces to know that a lot of fans struggle to see him in both lights simultaneously, with some fans living in massive denial of his sexuality and inherent masculinity, while other fans might overly sexualize him to the point of not seeing him as a full person. I was always somewhere in the middle. Though in theory I could hold both of these truths about him at once, I always sort of wondered how in the world those seemingly oppositional sides of a person could fit into one embodiment of a man without feeling…unnatural? I bring all of this to light because I can honestly tell you this footage in the studio, this was the first time I felt like I actually got it. I could really see him as a full person, when before I only really thought of him as one. Does that make sense? I don’t even think I realized how much I struggled still with that until this footage, actually. But in watching Michael in these moments, I feel like it finally all made sense to me. This footage was Michael just living his life, in the studio, being himself, not trying to impress anyone, not worrying about his image, not holding back in any way beyond the normal way we all kind of hold back when someone suddenly starts taking video of us. I don’t want to over-emphasize this part for the men reading (and those who just don’t see Michael this way) but God, he was just totally sexy. Just completely relaxed, completely comfortable. The way he embodied himself was magnetic. He made all kinds of facial expressions to the camera, funny, sexy smirks, along with little moments of authentic shyness. At one point he was sipping tea and didn’t seem to realize the camera was there. He glanced up, rolled his eyes all embarrassed, and smiled so small, like he had just realized he was being watched, or had completely forgotten anyone was there. I also noticed his voice was different. Just a little bit deeper, but so much more relaxed. He had more of an accent, spoke with more swing. While the point of the clip was surely to show us how detail-oriented both Bruce and Michael were, what it did for me was remind me of just how much of a man Michael really was. Yes, he was soft-spoken, unique, not like any other men. But he was also tremendously sexy in every movement because it all was so fluid. He moved and existed so easily in this footage. I really was overwhelmed by it. I can’t express enough how exciting it was to see him in this light."


This is as far as I've got. In fact, it's as far as I'm going today. Lot to take in. But just wanted to say, this right here, this is touching on how I see Michael, especially seeing him as a dancer. It's why I struggle to explain the whole, 'yes, he's sexy but that's so not the most important thing for me'. You got quite close to it here, sw23. We're still not there but we're closer.

I understand that you are saying that you found all of this *profoundly* sexy. Of course, yes! But for me it's something else. As per, I can't explain myself so can't tease out the small difference in our thoughts and reactions but I'm pretty confident you know what I'm babbling on about, lol.

I suppose all I'm really saying is, this is a great piece of writing and you really captured Michael.

 

[zinniabooklover]

Re my previous comment, I just did a really, really crappy job of trying to explain myself, didn't I?

Dang it!

 

[staywild23]

This is as far as I've got. In fact, it's as far as I'm going today. Lot to take in. But just wanted to say, this right here, this is touching on how I see Michael, especially seeing him as a dancer. It's why I struggle to explain the whole, 'yes, he's sexy but that's so not the most important thing for me'. You got quite close to it here, sw23. We're still not there but we're closer.

Haha well that's awesome to hear!! I should make it clear though, if it wasn't before, that seeing Michael as sexy is SO not the most important thing to me either. It's simply that it's inevitable. I don't know how anyone, male/female, gay/straight, could watch the clip I saw and not see him as sexy. He is sexy because he is so self-possessed in a particular way so few people are. In a way that is undeniably sexy. In my write up perhaps I focused more on my observation of his sexiness than I should have, because he was also other things. He was focused, dedicated, sarcastic, graceful, endearing, etc. But I felt a lot about his sexiness from this clip because it was so natural and he embodied it in such an obvious way, while also embodying a kind of playfulness that for sure could be read as childlike to some people, but really read more like just, again, a self-possessed adult who is unafraid of just being who they are. I think people too often read this kind of quality as child like, when perhaps they should just read it as honest.

I may not be explaining myself well. I read something recently about Ivana Trump, who apparently adored Michael, saying something like "I don't think he was a sexual person at all" and I see comments like that and I'm so irritated. Michael could be whoever he was and if that means he wasn't sexual at all, fine. But we literally have zero evidence of that and I don't understand why people reiterate it like that is something you can just tell by looking at someone. I have also never met a person in my life in which I thought, "wow, what a nice non-sexual person that is." People don't always reveal their sexuality/sexiness in general interaction, especially with people they aren't attracted to. So why anyone makes these comments as if they know I will never understand. Which I guess is why I wanted to share this observation. Even in a moment that was so not sexually-charged, I felt like Michael's naturally embodiment of himself was sexy as hell because it was so authentic and self-posesssd. How many times can I describe it that way? Lol I need new words...

Anyway, I hope that makes sense!

I understand that you are saying that you found all of this *profoundly* sexy. Of course, yes! But for me it's something else.

And that's fair. I certainly have my own Michael lens. We all do. I observe him in a particular way and probably do filter for a particular kind of sexiness that appeals to me. I also do tend to view the world through a semi-sexualized lens (we were asked once in grad school in a lit theory course what we see as the root of so much of our individual curiosities about life and while other people said god, grief, class, etc, I said sex lol ). Still, I don't want to give the impression that this is the most important thing to me when it comes to observing Michael. It isn't and it never will be, but my god, I cannot help myself. It overtakes me!

I suppose all I'm really saying is, this is a great piece of writing and you really captured Michael.

Im glad you enjoyed it! I definitely over wrote this section quite a bit so I imagine most people skimmed through it lol.

 

[zinniabooklover]

And that's fair. I certainly have my own Michael lens. We all do. I observe him in a particular way and probably do filter for a particular kind of sexiness that appeals to me. I also do tend to view the world through a semi-sexualized lens (we were asked once in grad school in a lit theory course what we see as the root of so much of our individual curiosities about life and while other people said god, grief, class, etc, I said sex lol ). Still, I don't want to give the impression that this is the most important thing to me when it comes to observing Michael. It isn't and it never will be, but my god, I cannot help myself. It overtakes me!

OMG!! Now we're getting somewhere. I've never heard of this. Plus, I hate lit theory. With a passion. But this actually landed with me. I don't know what mine would be but ... god, this is SO interesting.

Actually, I think I *might* know what mine is. Or two, rather. Two, intertwined.

I'm not actually hopping up and down. Too hot. But in an alternative universe I am hopping all over the place.

My head is spinning!!! Where is Chic when you need them?

Im glad you enjoyed it! I definitely over wrote this section quite a bit so I imagine most people skimmed through it lol.

The over writing is what helped me.

 

[staywild23]

You crack me up sometimes I can predict what will get you excited, but I had no idea this would!! I love it!

OMG!! Now we're getting somewhere. I've never heard of this. Plus, I hate lit theory. With a passion. But this actually landed with me. I don't know what mine would be but ... god, this is SO interesting.

I also despise lit theory. I've only taken the required courses in it. Now rhetorical theory I am super, super about. That's what my doctorate is in (technically), but lit theory? Light me on fire (not in the good 'Michael' way either, just the dead way lol).

Actually, I think I *might* know what mine is. Or two, rather. Two, intertwined.

Oh for sure! My answer now would be sex, gender, and power, which are all totally intertwined anyway. It's a good challenge though to try to understand our lens through which we see the world, isn't it?? It definitely helps explain our various reactions to things here on the board too

I'm not actually hopping up and down. Too hot. But in an alternative universe I am hopping all over the place.

The over writing is what helped me.

It helps me too! Lol

 

[zinniabooklover]

You crack me up sometimes I can predict what will get you excited, but I had no idea this would!! I love it!

I also despise lit theory. I've only taken the required courses in it. Now rhetorical theory I am super, super about. That's what my doctorate is in (technically), but lit theory? Light me on fire (not in the good 'Michael' way either, just the dead way lol).

OMG!!!!!

I had to look it up! I found this for starters:

"What is rhetorical theory and criticism?

Rhetorical criticism is the process by which we discover how the things we see, hear, read, or otherwise experience affect us or those around us. It is, in essence, the practice of evaluating how colors, shapes, symbols, typefaces, constructions in language, and other rhetorical devices make meaning in our lives."

(just found it randomly online)

In the fullness of time I might decide that this is an inadequate explanation but as a starting point for me, it feels OK. There was a lot of stuff about ancient Greece, obvs, which I will consider at a later date but this will do me for now.

I am SO stoked. Too hot to be stoked but you know what I mean, lol.

Excitement city!!!!!!!!!!

Oh for sure! My answer now would be sex, gender, and power, which are all totally intertwined anyway. It's a good challenge though to try to understand our lens through which we see the world, isn't it?? It definitely helps explain our various reactions to things here on the board too

This is where I wanna go with this (" go with it, go with it, JAM!!") once I've got my head around the basics.