Not every unreleased song needs to be updated

[Bubs]

^^ lol
Zakk, will you explain how to update MJ's song, but not taking it too far. Who decides what is exactly amount of updating and when it is gone too far.



You just cannot please this fan base, no matter what.

 

[AlwaysThere]

You will never please every single fan no matter who you are. There will always be people who say that it should be done another way. What the Estate needs to do is focus on what most fans want.

Fans want a disc of demos and we'll probably get it.

But I may be in the minority that says that I'm glad the demo wasn't released on MICHAEL. Even though it sounds like a Michael Jackson song moreso than the album cut, it sounds like a demo as well. The only part of it that should have been released was the bridge, which admittedly is phenomenal.

 

[KOPV]

As far as updating MJ music!!

It's tricky because like where you are getting to - it's all a matter of opinion.. I could say it would be safe updating can mean many things, simply making the sounds clearer is one of them, some MJ demos are not clear sounds (sometimes because they are ripped and the masters are not that way, and sometimes the masters are lost and they have to use tools to try making it as clear as possible)

In addition, depending on when the songs were recorded there have been changes to more recent sound boards and they way they are used that would make a song sound less dated JUST from re-leveling things in the music.

Some songs (now this is where opinion will take a yes/no approach depending on the person) they could keep the same sound but use the more modern sound technology for it.. For example a base hit from the 90's sounds different than a base hit from the past 5 years.. they could use the new sound systems (music software) to dublicate the same exact sound which will create a new sounding version of the same instrumental..

They could make sure every string is still being used, every dumb hit, every guitar lick.. It would just slightly updated from the stylization of todays sound..

And for other songs that don't have a full instrumental, sometimes Michaels demos only had lets say 2 layers of sound with a 3rd that comes in while he would intend several more layers.. Basically if it's obvious the instrumental is not finished, they could try doing what they feel Michael intended with the music..



In the end of the day even if they make it GREAT or make it HORRIBLE, us true fans will want the demos so I'd say - let them have at it do there thing, make hits and give is the raw demos.

 

[Zakk]

^^ lol
Zakk, will you explain how to update MJ's song, but not taking it too far. Who decides what is exactly amount of updating and when it is gone too far.



You just cannot please this fan base, no matter what.

here's an example of what i mean, keeping the original structure but updating the instruments used during the mastering process.

Freddie Mercury's Barcelona old version, All the instrumental was done using a piano.

Orchestral Version.

see my point?

 

[Bubs]

^^ Zakk, that is a bad example because Barcelona was finished song by Freddie.
Your example it like somebody takes Billie Jean and makes full orchestra version of it, nothing to do with finishing or updating incomplete song.

I watched one documentary about Freddie, and somebody in it said that Freddie wasn't brave enough to do Barcelona with full orchestra, thus it was done after his passing with full orchestra and it does sound great thou. Maybe you mean that who ever did that to Barcelona, enhanced to song itself and want same effect on Michael's songs?

 

[bad25]

There are songs from 2013 that sounds like songs from the 90s. Infact, some of Lady Gaga's songs sound very 80s/90s and Bruno's Treasure actually sounds late 70s. It does not matter all that much as long as it sounds good. I just hate it when they update the song to make it sound like crap! THAT's the PROBLEM with MJ's songs now. STTR has so much potential to be no 1 but Timba just ruin it!!!! He makes it unlistenable. It really frustrates me.

 

[Birchey]

There are songs from 2013 that sounds like songs from the 90s. Infact, some of Lady Gaga's songs sound very 80s/90s and Bruno's Treasure actually sounds late 70s. It does not matter all that much as long as it sounds good. I just hate it when they update the song to make it sound like crap! THAT's the PROBLEM with MJ's songs now. STTR has so much potential to be no 1 but Timba just ruin it!!!! He makes it unlistenable. It really frustrates me.

Exactly, thing is with music, its the same as fashion and Hollywood remakes, the sounds and style just get recycled every few years, we really are in the time where releasing some of these original demos with the minimum amount of messing about with to make them releasable is possible.

 

[AlwaysThere]

But wasn't the leaked version of Slave to the Rhythm a "ruined" version? Given that it sounds nothing like the original demo? I personally think Timbaland's is closer to a Michael Jackson version.

 

[bad25]

But wasn't the leaked version of Slave to the Rhythm a "ruined" version? Given that it sounds nothing like the original demo? I personally think Timbaland's is closer to a Michael Jackson version.

You haven't even heard of the original demo. How do you even know which version is closer to the original?
Btw, Timbo's STTR instrumental isn't even in time with the vocals! It's complete trash. I doubt the it sounds anything close to the the original demo!

 

[AlwaysThere]

You haven't even heard of the original demo. How do you even know which version is closer to the original?
Btw, Timbo's STTR instrumental isn't even in time with the vocals! It's complete trash. I doubt the it sounds anything close to the the original demo!

You can just tell. Listen to Tricky's version and then listen to Timbaland's. Regardless of which one you like more, which do you think sounds MORE like something Michael would release? Even if you say, "He wouldn't release either!" Timbaland's still sounds closer to something Michael would do.

Also, the vocals are in time with the music. The insane synths make it sound off.

Additionally, HOW DO WE KNOW THAT THIS IS THE VERSION THAT WILL BE ON THE ALBUM??? WE DON'T. There is NO reason to get angry. Of course I don't expect everyone to sit back and take everything they're given with open arms, but until we hear final news or a full version we can't say that this version "sucks" or is "trash". Besides, odds are you'll be getting the original demo. So if you don't like the reproduced version, don't listen to it. It's not up to us how this album is put together. (Honestly, an album put together by the fans probably would have as many downsides as it would upsides.)

 

[MJshines4ever]

I totally agree with you,Analogue. I have an issue with people messing with Michael's work. If they are going to release an updated, remixed etc song, they need to also release Michael's original version at the same time. Michael's music, short films, etc were perfection. I want to hear a song exactly how he created it. Someone else making changes to his work, just doesn't seem right. Michael will always be the greatest entertainer of all time for a reason, why mess with perfection?

 

[OnirMJ]

why mess with perfection?

Because it's not perfection. It is unfinished work. Listen to I Am A Loser, People Of The World, DIG, Hollywood Tonight Demo. That's not perfection. Those are unfinished Demos. Billie Jean, Thriller, Smooth Criminal... pretty much everything he completed and released is perfection.

 

[Snow White luvs Peter Pan]

It's true we don't know if the version used in the commercial is gonna be released in the album or not but saying Tim's work or versions sounds closer to Michael is something reckless to day because we haven't heard the original demo either.

My problems when producers mess up with the songs completely. If we take DYKWYCA's guitars added later, the melody of the song wasn't destroyed or changed, those guitar's solos suited the song and the melody was kept intact.

 

[AlwaysThere]

I totally agree with you,Analogue. I have an issue with people messing with Michael's work. If they are going to release an updated, remixed etc song, they need to also release Michael's original version at the same time. Michael's music, short films, etc were perfection. I want to hear a song exactly how he created it. Someone else making changes to his work, just doesn't seem right. Michael will always be the greatest entertainer of all time for a reason, why mess with perfection?

Michael was not perfect. He was flawed, just as any other entertainer was. His music was great, but he did make a few bad tracks now and then. This is something some fans truly need to understand and accept. The Hollywood Tonight demo is pretty boring honestly. Days in Gloucestershire is incomplete. People of the World is uninteresting. These are not perfect songs. Just because Michael did something does not automatically make it perfect.

Additionally, the Estate doesn't NEED to do anything. The Estate is supposed to continue Michael's legacy. They don't NEED to release new songs to do that. The Beatles don't. Elvis doesn't. They only do it because they want the fans to be happy. To be quite honest, even if we only got reproduced versions of songs, we should appreciate it. I'm not saying we should LOVE it, because criticism is understandable, but regardless we're lucky to get anything.

I'm sorry, but some fans are so ridiculous. The Estate could give us a full album of untouched songs with not a single reproduction and there would still be someone complaining about it. Complaining because you don't like the songs is fine, but I KNOW I will see someone saying, "They should have released more songs." And that's just selfish.

 

[Themidwestcowboy]

Michael was not perfect. He was flawed, just as any other entertainer was. His music was great, but he did make a few bad tracks now and then. This is something some fans truly need to understand and accept. The Hollywood Tonight demo is pretty boring honestly. Days in Gloucestershire is incomplete. People of the World is uninteresting. These are not perfect songs. Just because Michael did something does not automatically make it perfect..

I understand what you mean but i do not wholeheartedly agree with this notion. Music is subjective. DIG, HT demo and POTW may have sound boring and uninspired to you but other people may actually love them. Hell i love them. Me personally, don't think that MJ did bad songs. Sure there are some songs i am not fond of and some that i skip, but bad to me equates to unlistenable. Never have i played an MJ song and been so dismayed that it made my stomach turn and i turned it off. At the end of the day that is my opinion. So you can't say people should accept and understand that he made some bad songs as it is a fact because it all boils down to opinions and personal preferences.

To be honest we need the new album asap. There is soon gonna be a riot in here

 

[AlwaysThere]

I understand what you mean but i do not wholeheartedly agree with this notion. Music is subjective. DIG, HT demo and POTW may have sound boring and uninspired to you but other people may actually love them. Hell i love them. Me personally, don't think that MJ did bad songs. Sure there are some songs i am not fond of and some that i skip, but bad to me equates to unlistenable. Never have i played an MJ song and been so dismayed that it made my stomach turn and i turned it off. At the end of the day that is my opinion. So you can't say people should accept and understand that he made some bad songs as it is a fact because it all boils down to opinions and personal preferences.

To be honest we need the new album asap. There is soon gonna be a riot in here

Very true. Perhaps "bad" was the wrong word to use - my apologies on that one!

I meant that not every single song that Michael has ever released is going to be good. As you yourself said, there are some songs that you personally want to skip. That just shows that Michael himself couldn't strike gold every single time. Which goes along with my point: perhaps reproductions are beneficial, so long as the necessary precautions are taken.

 

[Themidwestcowboy]

Very true. Perhaps "bad" was the wrong word to use - my apologies on that one!

I meant that not every single song that Michael has ever released is going to be good. As you yourself said, there are some songs that you personally want to skip. That just shows that Michael himself couldn't strike gold every single time. Which goes along with my point: perhaps reproductions are beneficial, so long as the necessary precautions are taken.

Yeah, thats the point i am trying to make aswell alwaysthere, i personally may feel that way about certain songs while other may love them. Just because a particular song doesn't hit home with me doesn't make it any less of a good song. There are some that love thriller from start to finish and there are some that uphold the idea that there are some filler tracks. It alls comes down to personal preferences and opinions.

Well, as far as updating and revising goes i will just have to wait and see. I sincerly hope that it will be a smash, but only time will tell.

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

The 2010 STTR was far less accurate than the 2014 version, to the 1990 version. The problem is the song is just kinda plain.

 

[Speed Angel]

The 2010 STTR was far less accurate than the 2014 version, to the 1990 version. The problem is the song is just kinda plain.

The 2010 version of "Slave to the Rhythm" is good, but the instrumental is more like a "Remix" than an "official song"

For me, the 2014 version is the best version of the song (but I prefer the live version mix from the Billboard Music Awards)

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

If the upcoming tribute album has songs from MJ's latter day career, then I would hope they are not updated. I want the original instrumentation.

 

[SmoothGangsta]

If the upcoming tribute album has songs from MJ's latter day career, then I would hope they are not updated. I want the original instrumentation.

Unlikely that they won't be totally changed imo. That's why I'm not really interested. Nothing MJ in there at that point.

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

Unlikely that they won't be totally changed imo. That's why I'm not really interested. Nothing MJ in there at that point.

I mean, maybe. It might be refreshed but not reworked. More like "Michael" than "Xscape".

It would still be MJ's words and lyrics for sure, his general aura hopefully coming through. Which is missing from radio, specifically in an anthemic sense. And tbh I think that's where MJ would be at these days, writing and composing. His performing would (maybe mostly) be done but creating would never leave, it was in his blood.