Was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

Glanni

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was this the last appearance of michael where he wear his curls like this at american bandstand 2002?
 

Galactus123

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

I'm not sure what was the last time but he had them at Apollo theather later that year:
190424_MJ_OG.jpg
 

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Apollo shows were after American Bandstand I believe. The American Bandstand special was broadcast after the Apollo concert but that’s because it was on tape delay.

The 2002 curls have nothing on the Bad > HIStory curls and even the This Is It curls. I wish he never abandoned that look in the early 2000s.

I heard that he wore curls for the 2001 MSG show rehearsals before changing his hairstyle to the straight hair wig we saw; I hope we get to see footage of that in the Hamid Moslehi documentary he is supposedly making.
 

Glanni

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

i really would like to know when we sa him with his old hairstyle the last time in 2002/03
 

MichaelD

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

AB was on April 20th and Apollo on April 24th. The last photos I have with him wearing that curl-ish look is from mid-June 2002 when he was in London and Exeter, UK. Early July photos show him with that new hairstyle (Sony demo in New York City and other events in this time frame).

July 14, 2002 (Exeter football ground)
161554.jpeg
 

wonderouzmj

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Snek;4321635 said:
Apollo shows were after American Bandstand I believe. The American Bandstand special was broadcast after the Apollo concert but that’s because it was on tape delay.

The 2002 curls have nothing on the Bad > HIStory curls and even the This Is It curls. I wish he never abandoned that look in the early 2000s.

I heard that he wore curls for the 2001 MSG show rehearsals before changing his hairstyle to the straight hair wig we saw; I hope we get to see footage of that in the Hamid Moslehi documentary he is supposedly making.
Wait hold up... this is my 1st time hearing of this doc!! I need some details!

Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Tapatalk
 

Glanni

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

there doesnt seem to be a clean cut from curly to non-curly. he had straight hair in 2001 in NYC already:


But then in 2002 he had curls again at the Sony demos in London and NYC.
 

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

i always wondered why he ditched the dangerous era curls look where it was kind of an undercut in the side and the hair wasn't as thick as a whole,it was PERFECT
 

Whatever

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was this the last appearance of michael where he wear his curls like this at american bandstand 2002?

Also, if I'm not mistaken, this report features footage from the other yet-unseen performance of Dangerous (0:11-0:25)
since he did perform the song twice for American Bandstand's 50th Anniversary 'cause he was not satisfied with the first performance.
 

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Snek;4321635 said:
I heard that he wore curls for the 2001 MSG show rehearsals before changing his hairstyle to the straight hair wig we saw; I hope we get to see footage of that in the Hamid Moslehi documentary he is supposedly making.

That is not true because there are photos that show him rehearsing with his straight, short hairstyle and without wearing curls.

This suggests that he did not consider wearing curls for the two 2001 MSG shows.

Besides, at that time, Sony Music hired a team of designers and fashion experts with the mission of refreshing the singer’s image, while abandoning some of his old, stylistic trademarks and relics.

Sony Music wanted to present for the new millennium a new Michael Jackson, meaning that his curls (as one of his old, stylistic trademarks) had to be abandoned.

Even if he shot more music videos from his newly-released ‘Invincible’ album, he would not have worn his curls in those music videos (in order to comply with Sony Music’s orders at that time).
 

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mj_frenzy;4321653 said:
That is not true because there are photos that show him rehearsing with his straight, short hairstyle and without wearing curls.

This suggests that he did not consider wearing curls for the two 2001 MSG shows.

Besides, at that time, Sony Music hired a team of designers and fashion experts with the mission of refreshing the singer’s image, while abandoning some of his old, stylistic trademarks and relics.

Sony Music wanted to present for the new millennium a new Michael Jackson, meaning that his curls (as one of his old, stylistic trademarks) had to be abandoned.

Even if he shot more music videos from his newly-released ‘Invincible’ album, he would not have worn his curls in those music videos (in order to comply with Sony Music’s orders at that time)
.

We don't really know that... - It's true they wanted to re-fresh his image (at least I've heard that before)

BUT - I really don't think MJ waqs the kind of person anyone said NO to og dictated to what he had to do. I have a feeling MJ was always in charge of things regarding his art - be it songs, albums, concerts, musicvideos etc. - I think MJ was in control and had the last say always.

If MJ had really wanted curld in 2001 I doubt SONY could have done anything about it.
 

dam2040

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

We don't really know that... - It's true they wanted to re-fresh his image (at least I've heard that before)

BUT - I really don't think MJ waqs the kind of person anyone said NO to og dictated to what he had to do. I have a feeling MJ was always in charge of things regarding his art - be it songs, albums, concerts, musicvideos etc. - I think MJ was in control and had the last say always.

If MJ had really wanted curld in 2001 I doubt SONY could have done anything about it.

YRMW wasn't his first choice Invincible single.
 

Themidwestcowboy

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

We don't really know that... - It's true they wanted to re-fresh his image (at least I've heard that before)

BUT - I really don't think MJ waqs the kind of person anyone said NO to og dictated to what he had to do. I have a feeling MJ was always in charge of things regarding his art - be it songs, albums, concerts, musicvideos etc. - I think MJ was in control and had the last say always.

If MJ had really wanted curld in 2001 I doubt SONY could have done anything about it.

I think there is some level of truth to this because I remember Rodney Jerkins talking about how he made, or wanted to make, MJ stop using his signature adlibs and kinda revamp himself for the new millennium.
 

mj_frenzy

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Hess;4321654 said:
We don't really know that... - It's true they wanted to re-fresh his image (at least I've heard that before)

BUT - I really don't think MJ waqs the kind of person anyone said NO to og dictated to what he had to do. I have a feeling MJ was always in charge of things regarding his art - be it songs, albums, concerts, musicvideos etc. - I think MJ was in control and had the last say always.

If MJ had really wanted curld in 2001 I doubt SONY could have done anything about it.

That is not true because in many artistic decisions Michael Jackson unwillingly did what others told him to do, for example:

Michael Jackson did not want to release the ‘Thriller’ song as a single with a music video, but Frank DiLeo persuaded him to do that.

Michael Jackson wanted to release a three-disc ‘BAD’ album, but Quincy Jones persuaded him to release just one disc of that album because that would make it sell easier.

Michael Jackson wanted ‘Streetwalker’ on the ‘BAD’ album (in the place of ‘Another Part Of Me’), but they persuaded him to include the latter eventually.

Michael Jackson wanted to use as a cover of his ‘BAD’ album the photo of his face with a lace, but Walter Yetnikoff (the then-president of CBS Records) rejected his idea and he persuaded the singer to use the one with the ‘BAD’ leather outfit which became the official cover of the album.

Michael Jackson did not want to include remixed version of his songs on his ‘Blood On The Dance Floor’ album, but Sony Music forced him to do that.

Michael Jackson wanted to release a three-disc ‘HIStory’ album (one disc of his old hits plus two discs of brand new songs), but Sony Music rejected his idea.

Michael Jackson wanted the gold, original ‘Invincible’ album cover (that was inspired by Albert Watson's Golden Boy photo), but Sony Music again rejected his idea.

Michael Jackson wanted to release ‘Unbreakable’ as the first single (from the ‘Invincible’ album) with a grandiose accompanied music video, but Sony Music again rejected his idea.

Sony Music forced him also to minimize the use of his hee's and hoo's in his new songs (on the ‘Invincible’ album), and as a result the singer used very few of them on that album.
 

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mj_frenzy;4321762 said:
That is not true because in many artistic decisions Michael Jackson unwillingly did what others told him to do, for example:

Sony Music forced him also to minimize the use of his hee's and hoo's in his new songs (on the ‘Invincible’ album), and as a result the singer used very few of them on that album.

can i get a source for that claim? never heard that before
 

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rolerprod;4321768 said:
can i get a source for that claim? never heard that before

This topic was covered extensively at that time in various news reports and certain fanzines.

Sony Music instructed all the producers that were working with Michael Jackson on his new songs (for the ‘Invincible’ album) to update the singer in terms of vocals for the new millennium.

Rodney Jerkins strongly hinted that he and his team of producers (LaShawn Daniels, Fred Jerkins III, etc) were given orders by Sony Music for that.

So, they had to teach him to use some new, modern slang words in his new songs (like, “banging” in ‘You Rock My World’, “shorty” in ‘2000 Watts’, etc), while making him abandon some of his old, rehashed vocal trademarks (such as, his hee hee's, hoo's and ahh's).

Part of the reason for those orders was also the fact that the record company wanted to make Michael Jackson appeal easier to younger listeners (because such new, modern slang words were very familiar to younger listeners at the time), which would also translate into more sales of his new album.
 

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There’s several “Hoo” and before the vocals come in MJ does his trademark breaths in You Rock.

There are several instances of Michael’s trademark sounds all over Invincible. The idea he was forced to “abandon” them and not use them on the album is bullshit. Listen to the record.
 

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dam2040;4321787 said:
There’s several “Hoo” and before the vocals come in MJ does his trademark breaths in You Rock.

There are several instances of Michael’s trademark sounds all over Invincible. The idea he was forced to “abandon” them and not use them on the album is bullshit. Listen to the record.

If i recall correctly that was Rodney Jerkins idea not Sony. He said that in an interview that I can't remember at the moment. When I think about it, I can't remember if MJ ever used the Hee-Hees on Invincible. Did he do that?
 

dam2040

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

If i recall correctly that was Rodney Jerkins idea not Sony. He said that in an interview that I can't remember at the moment. When I think about it, I can't remember if MJ ever used the Hee-Hees on Invincible. Did he do that?

Yeah he did
 

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Re: was American Bandstand 2002 the last time we saw MJ with curls (until TII)?

On what song/songs?

Off the top of my head: one at the very end of "Unbreakable", a few times near the end of "Invincible", one near the bridge I believe of "You Rock My World", a few times on "Privacy", a couple "hoo"s on "Threatened". He definitely still did these little ad-libs, but I do agree with mj-frenzy a tiny bit in that they were used less. But I don't think this was an intentional choice -- Invincible was sort of new ground for MJ's career, and he was breaking into new genres and styles. So I think that the reason he didn't use his "hee-hee"s and whatnot very often on Invincible was because that album went in a different direction than his other records.
 

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Well,
I listened to the Invinicble just right now and putted everything down.. Here is a complete hee hees, huu huus, Aus and Hous on the record and even on the uncutted versions of the songs... To me, it is just not enough for Michaels standarts....

 

king_of_style

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Well,
I listened to the Invinicble just right now and putted everything down.. Here is a complete hee hees, huu huus, Aus and Hous on the record and even on the uncutted versions of the songs... To me, it is just not enough for Michaels standarts....


Dang so that's only 4 hee hees, 12.5 huu huus, 5 Aus, and 15 Hous on all eleven tracks
 

dam2040

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Yes but my point was - some in this thread have said Sony made MJ stop and not use them.

If that’s the case why are they still all over the album?
 

Themidwestcowboy

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dam2040;4321835 said:
Yes but my point was - some in this thread have said Sony made MJ stop and not use them.

If that’s the case why are they still all over the album?

To be fair MJ frenzy said that they made him minimize the trademark stuff which he indeed did just looking at that list. I think the truth may lie somewhere in between. I wouldn’t be surprised if that was the case at all. It was a new decade and MJ always liked to reinvent himself.
 
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Galactus123

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dam2040;4321835 said:
Yes but my point was - some in this thread have said Sony made MJ stop and not use them.

If that’s the case why are they still all over the album?

Maybe they tried but couldn't fully stop him. I don't think they would ask them removed after recording.
 

lubyss

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Maybe they tried but couldn't fully stop him. I don't think they would ask them removed after recording.

Actually this is very possible... Just take the album version of Privacy and the uncutted acapella... There is a huge difference and the song with all the unreleased adlibs and his trademark hoo hooos would be much more appriciated in comunity...

And that it is only one song we have acces to the uncutted version... I can just imagine other songs... Maybe the first 3 smash songs looked a whole different...
Sorry but use only one Au in smash song like Heartbreaker is just pure crime.... but indeed, still it is my second favourite album of MJ...
 

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Maybe Michael was afraid that he was becoming a parody of himself, so that's the reason why he cut down on his trademark adlibs on Invincible?
 

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BUT - then again, many of the outtakes we've later heard have his trademarks all over - and they are amazing songs.

Many ended up on Xscape
 
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