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Victory 40th Anniversary

robotchicken14 said:
Hello @BlackAnon
Since you are one of few to have heard the Victory outtake 'Buffalo Bill', is there anything more you might be able to reveal about it's composition, lyrics, melody, tempo etc?
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I haven't heard Buffalo Bill.....only going by what I was told by John Barnes and a few others

It's a symphonic opening and a charming melody with more vocal sounds and the brothers singing on it. It's a dance track and was compared to R&B
 
BlackAnon said:
I haven't heard Buffalo Bill.....only going by what I was told by John Barnes and a few others

It's a symphonic opening and a charming melody with more vocal sounds and the brothers singing on it. It's a dance track and was compared to R&B
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It sounds cool by the way you describe the song
 
Alright Now might've been considered for Victory as well since it was written and recorded in 1983. Michael and John [Barnes] were creating magic during this time. The chorus reminds me of One More Chance from Victory

 
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JustinC2002 said:
Is Born To Love a Victory outtake?
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This was registered in May 1982 and was more than likely for a Jackie project since Michael was in the middle of recording Thriller but it's possible they were already in the talks of doing the Victory album since it was supposed to be released that next year but Michael was also scheduled to release another album in 1983

Type of Work:​
Music
Registration Number / Date:​
PAu000402944 / 1982-05-14
Title:​
Born to love / J. Jackson, D. Daniels, K. Wakefield.
Description:​
1 sound cassette.
Copyright Claimant:​
Siggy Music, Nealjon Music Company & Eliza M. Music
Date of Creation:​
1982
Authorship on Application:​
words & music: Jackie Jackson, Don Daniels & Kathy Wakefield.
 
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BlackAnon said:
This was registered in May 1982 and was more than likely for a Jackie project since Michael was in the middle of recording Thriller but it's possible they were already in the talks of doing the Victory album since it was supposed to be released that next year but Michael was also scheduled to release another album in 1983

Type of Work:​
Music
Registration Number / Date:​
PAu000402944 / 1982-05-14
Title:​
Born to love / J. Jackson, D. Daniels, K. Wakefield.
Description:​
1 sound cassette.
Copyright Claimant:​
Siggy Music, Nealjon Music Company & Eliza M. Music
Date of Creation:​
1982
Authorship on Application:​
words & music: Jackie Jackson, Don Daniels & Kathy Wakefield.
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I wonder if this song will be released one day
 
Themidwestcowboy said:
Where do I stand and Playin with fire with Michael singing the lead would have been terrific on Victory. The album could have turned out a lot better than it was.
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Be Not Always could've been omitted and replaced with Dream Away
Body could've been omitted and replaced with Power, which would've been a good album opener
Tell Me I'm Not Dreaming should've been on there too
 
BlackAnon said:
Be Not Always could've been omitted and replaced with Dream Away
Body could've been omitted and replaced with Power, which would've been a good album opener
Tell Me I'm Not Dreaming should've been on there too
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I can’t remember the exact track list of victory, but if it was up to me this is what I should have done,

Remove Body, One More chance, Be not Always and some others that I can’t recall at the moment

I would include Behind The Mask (why not? This would be the perfect vehicle for this song instead of giving it away to Greg), Playing With Fire sung by Michael, Where Do I Stand sung by Michael and also replace Jackie with Michael on Wait.
 
Themidwestcowboy said:
I can’t remember the exact track list of victory, but if it was up to me this is what I should have done,

Remove Body, One More chance, Be not Always and some others that I can’t recall at the moment

I would include Behind The Mask (why not? This would be the perfect vehicle for this song instead of giving it away to Greg), Playing With Fire sung by Michael, Where Do I Stand sung by Michael and also replace Jackie with Michael on Wait.
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so much potential. I hope we get to hear the outtakes and demos from the session one day
 
Victory is the biggest selling album of the J5/Jacksons.

The Jackson 5​

1969 Diana Ross Presents The Jackson 5 – 1,600,000
1970 ABC – 2,075,000
1970 Third Album – 1,900,000
1970 Jackson 5 Christmas Album – 3,075,000
1971 Maybe Tomorrow – 975,000
1972 Lookin’ Through the Windows – 1,150,000
1973 Skywriter – 325,000
1973 G.I.T.: Get It Together – 350,000
1974 Dancing Machine – 850,000
1975 Moving Violation – 300,000

The Jacksons​

1976 The Jacksons – 1,800,000
1977 Goin’ Places – 675,000
1978 Destiny – 3,150,000
1980 Triumph – 3,075,000
1984 Victory – 4,475,000

The Jacksons (without Michael Jackson)​

1989 2300 Jackson Street – 625,000
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chartmasters.org

Jackson 5 & The Jacksons albums and songs sales - ChartMasters

As the Motown wasn't affiliated to the RIAA, the Jackson 5 album sales are quite mysterious. Let's find out all about their success!
chartmasters.org
 
michael jackson and bruce springsteen interviewed each other backstage at the ‘victory’ tour. again, michael mentioned doing a movie with steven spielberg. this is also the same month that he would tell ‘jet’ magazine that wouldn’t be playing Peter Pan, out of fear of typecasting.
people.com

'How Do You Do It?' Read the First-Ever Exchange Between Bruce Springsteen and Michael Jackson (Exclusive)

PEOPLE was in the room when Bruce Springsteen and Michael Jackson met for the first time: see the photo and read the pair's exchange.
people.com people.com
 
Victory artwork by Michael Whelan. Michael was inspired by Isaac Asimov's novel Foundation Edge. The artist, Michael Whelan met with Michael and developed several concepts, ultimately settling on proposed layout #5 which was transformed into the album cover we know. Michael insisted he be placed behind his brothers, but that his glove and socks glow.

Jermaine is absent from a few of the early concepts. This must've been around the time they were trying to get him on board.


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The Victory Tour 1984. Victory Tour was my first wardrobe job and Tour. Bill Whitten hired me as an assistant and eventually suggested me for the job as Michaels dresser. I never saw that coming. I remember the first time I met Michael. We were at a rehearsal studio and I just said “it’s nice to meet you - I’ve heard a lot about you “ Thank God he laughed! What do you say that he hasn’t heard? Michael didn’t do a “Thriller” Tour. The Victory Tour was it. And it was the last Tour with all the Brothers. It was only 6 months and only the U.S. But all Sold Out Stadiums. Exciting doesn’t even begin to describe it. Bill designed 3 cases of costumes for Michael. Michael picked his favorites and rarely switched them up. But he did wear this red Elvis jacket only once. And threw it into the audience!! Bill got Michael to wear those black and white striped pants Opening night. Michael hated them. He said “take these and burn them - they make me look like Yanky Doodle Dandy”. Michael in the jacket he wore once, The sketch- we only had Xerox then, My Pass-the dots gave me access to the Brothers dressing room, Our Wardrobe Team. Me, Mary Jane, Janet and Greg. - Tony Villanueva

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Original Michael Jackson mock up from The Jackson's Victory Tour designed by Susan. This is part of a set of boards which depict each Jackson in various costumes. They were used to pitch the Jacksons on potential costumes for the tour. The brothers did use this designer for their costumes but MJ opted for Bill Whitten's designs.

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Initially, I just had the bass and drum groove. I sent him the demo and he said he liked it and would try to add a melody. Then I didn’t hear any more, and next thing I knew a Jacksons album called ‘Victory’ came out – and there was my groove! So like a sucker, I started writing another one for him, inspired by memories of him as a kid. - Thomas Dolby on writing "Interactive" for Michael.

Hyperactive is another song submitted but recorded for himself when he didn't get any feedback from Michael. Has a Victory sound to it
 
I agree with michael’s choice to ditch the ‘elvis jacket’ and continue working with bill whitten, who is severely underrated to this day.

the sparkle & shine ✨ combined with michael’s movement, created the magical overtone of the show.

I think the striped trousers were okay.. they looked better on michael than they did on randy.

I liked the pink jumpsuit for ‘working day and night’. I also liked the shirt with the pepsi inspired logo. loved the bedazzled red zipper jacket🤩

it would be interesting to see the unused outfits designed by bill whitten. it’s such a shame that michael spent the majority of the show wearing a plain white shirt & black trousers. jermaine’s solo set could’ve been the perfect opportunity for a costume change.
 
On which concert did he wear the red Elvis jacket? Sad that we don't have any footage from that concert.
 
BlackAnon said:
Victory artwork by Michael Whelan. Michael was inspired by Isaac Asimov's novel Foundation Edge. The artist, Michael Whelan met with Michael and developed several concepts, ultimately settling on proposed layout #5 which was transformed into the album cover we know. Michael insisted he be placed behind his brothers, but that his glove and socks glow.

Jermaine is absent from a few of the early concepts. This must've been around the time they were trying to get him on board.



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The second cover is great, I like the color palette a lot more than the cover they ended up going with. The outfits the brothers are wearing also looks better imo. I wish they went with that cover instead.
 
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