Was "Al Capone" made before "Smooth Criminal"?


Their genesis goes back to the “Thriller” sessions, when Porcaro and other members of Toto — including his brother Jeff, the group’s super-virtuoso drummer — were part of the album’s small army of studio players. As work on the album neared its end, Porcaro said, Jackson asked him to collaborate on songs for his next project with his brothers, which became the Jacksons’ “Victory.”

“Of course I said yes,” Porcaro recalled. He handed Jackson a tape with an upbeat track he had been working on.

A couple of weeks later, Porcaro said, Jackson showed up unannounced at Paich’s home studio, where Porcaro was living. “I got a vocal idea I want to throw on our tune,” Jackson told him. He got on the mic and recorded nine vocal lines — lead parts, harmonies, backups — with lyrics referencing Chicago in the year 1945, like the Cubs losing the World Series. Jackson finished in about 40 minutes and abruptly left.
Steve seems to have mixed his story up. One minute it's after the album, then the next it's after the Thriller video since he said it was a few months before the brothers were to go on tour but that can also be 83 since that was the original release for Victory and the tour.
 
Michael & John Barnes did work on Al Capone in late October/early November 1984 at Criteria Studios in Miami; the session's engineered by Larry Janus. (source: old forum post of Larry on harmony central boards)
update on this matter:

found this post of Bill while lurking on his X, Bill has commented on the 2012 released mix of Al Capone.

The mix that got released was done during the Victory tour or even earlier.

That TX bass is pre Synclavier, pre Hayvenhurst.
This sounds like MJ wanted to record vocals and some details then I did a mix
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Michael & John Barnes did work on Al Capone in late October/early November 1984 at Criteria Studios in Miami; the session's engineered by Larry Janus. (source: old forum post of Larry on harmony central boards)
Any chance you could find the original link for this?? Thank you!
 
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Cool replies there. Can see the B-team/A-team rivalry here!
I think there was a comment from Larry Janus about John Barnes sampling James Brown vocals on a version of Al Capone. Also mentioned in one of Damien Shields’ books. That one was probably reposted on that long gone History continues forum if I recall right.
 
Cool replies there. Can see the B-team/A-team rivalry here!
I think there was a comment from Larry Janus about John Barnes sampling James Brown vocals on a version of Al Capone. Also mentioned in one of Damien Shields’ books. That one was probably reposted on that long gone History continues forum if I recall right.
John talked about this Facebook. Him messing around with Brown vocals was just for the fun of it; never intended being on AC & not kept on further mixes.
 
Worst thing about his 1980s work, many demos weren't entirely recorded on tape.

The way he's talked about this, I got the impression the estate rejected his help to transfer the synclavier files propperly on tape and/or hdd.
 
Worst thing about his 1980s work, many demos weren't entirely recorded on tape.

The way he's talked about this, I got the impression the estate rejected his help to transfer the synclavier files propperly on tape and/or hdd.
Right? I find it hard to imagine Michael working that way. Having the songs stored - partially or entirely - on Synclavier without recording to tape.

With the Synclavier, you could store sounds, programs, sequences or even arrangements. But not really a full guitar part, non-sequenced keyboard line or full vocal performance as the technology was not at that point yet.
So they would have recorded the Synclavier to tape in order to build on it… adding vocals & other elements.

They would have stored floppy discs of the elements & programs in case Michael wanted to change anything and do another recording.

But by now the technology is obsolete and the quality of the floppy discs would not be salvageable enough.
 
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But by now the technology is obsolete and the quality of the floppy discs would not be salvageable enough.
There are working Synclavier stations at the moment of course ! And the floppies, if stored correctly, should be functioning OK. So the people who did the Synclavier work at the time and still have the materials, should transfer the sounds/arrangements/songs, it is not too late. They could even team with Anthony Marinelli, his Synclavier works 100% as new…
 
There are working Synclavier stations at the moment of course ! And the floppies, if stored correctly, should be functioning OK. So the people who did the Synclavier work at the time and still have the materials, should transfer the sounds/arrangements/songs, it is not too late. They could even team with Anthony Marinelli, his Synclavier works 100% as new…
I know, but it is increasingly rare now to find working Synclavier units like any outdated piece of technology.

Plus, it’s unlikely there would be any finished songs stored on those floppy discs to load into the Synclavier. Let alone have any finished vocals on those as technology did not get that far yet.
The Estate is only really interested in songs with finished vocals.
 
I know, but it is increasingly rare now to find working Synclavier units like any outdated piece of technology.

Plus, it’s unlikely there would be any finished songs stored on those floppy discs to load into the Synclavier. Let alone have any finished vocals on those as technology did not get that far yet.
The Estate is only really interested in songs with finished vocals.
and songs only written and produced by Michael.
 
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