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[MERGED] MICHAEL JACKSON & PRINCE : Friends or Foes? (The Historic Rivalry)

Re: MJ & Prince [The Artist]: A competitive relationship ?

That diamonds and pearls line could have been about anyone
 
Re: MJ & Prince [The Artist]: A competitive relationship ?

mj_frenzy said:
The rivalry has been well established (officially or not) throughout the years.
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Why are you doggin me? You specifically said

"there were times when MJ feared that Prince was endowed (from God) with more inspiration."

What times? When was this? Who said this? Sorry but you're just making stuff up.
 
Prince MJ comparison

I always though it was a little odd that Prince gets compared to MJ when in my humble opinion they were distinctly different artists. Prince for me was more in the vain of Curtis Mayfield and Jimi Hendricks, whereas MJ was more in the mould of Sammy Davis Jr and James Brown. In other words MJ was the ultimate sing and dance man, and entertainer at heart with his combination great vocals and dance routine. Prince was more of a musician's musician that his primary focus was his as-tout guitar-playing skills and falsetto (though he could dance too). Untimely you wouldn't compare Bob Dylan to Elvis for obvious reasons since they brought different talents to the table.
 
Re: Prince MJ comparison

Psychoniff said:
I always though it was a little odd that Prince gets compared to MJ when in my humble opinion they were distinctly different artists. Prince for me was more in the vain of Curtis Mayfield and Jimi Hendricks, whereas MJ was more in the mould of Sammy Davis Jr and James Brown. In other words MJ was the ultimate sing and dance man, and entertainer at heart with his combination great vocals and dance routine. Prince was more of a musician's musician that his primary focus was his as-tout guitar-playing skills and falsetto (though he could dance too). Untimely you wouldn't compare Bob Dylan to Elvis for obvious reasons since they brought different talents to the table.
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I'm going to deviate a bit but I really admired prince for showing his respect to MJ in subsequent shows after 2009. Especially the one concert where he performed one of his songs called Mountains and then said " We want to do one for my friend right now" and started playing Shake Your Body Down. That was cool too see.

When you think about it, the media & industry were the ones that always tried to pit them against one another. The rivalry was never once acknowledged by either artist. They were cool with each other, and there are numerous of stories and accounts to back that up.
 
Re: Prince MJ comparison

Themidwestcowboy said:
When you think about it, the media & industry were the ones that always tried to pit them against one another. The rivalry was never once acknowledged by either artist. They were cool with each other, and there are numerous of stories and accounts to back that up.
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Except for that story (and who knows if it's true but I think it came from Branca) when Prince came to MJ's house and tried to voo doo MJ. Haha. I can't remember the exact story, but it was something along those lines :p
 
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Re: Prince MJ comparison

TinnyandOdd said:
Except for that story (and who knows if it's true but I think it came from Branca) when Prince came to MJ's house and tried voo doo MJ. Haha. I can't remember the exact story, but it was something along those lines :p
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Lol yeah i remember that story, Prince gave him a doll or something (during the meeting of the Bad project) like that and MJ was sure that he tried to put a spell on him lol.
 
Re: Prince MJ comparison

I think I remember somewhere reading that the feud between MJ and Prince was pushed into the media by....MJ & Prince lol

And I kinda believe that lol. It's a genius way to prop up both artists in a fun way. I love both artists. My fav story is always gonna be the one about Prince listening to Bad and MJ wanting to collab with him and Prince didn't want to do it cuz of the first line: "Your butt is mine" LOL

As if Prince hasn't sung/written more questionable lines than that LOLOL

I see the similarities though, I think Prince is extremely influenced by James Brown as well, you can see that in his live performances. Actually I see more James Brown-like stuff in Prince's live shows than MJ's. Prince is definitely leaning more into the funk territory, while MJ is....kinda all over the place lol

And honestly I think most people put them together because they both sing falsetto, both megastars in the 80s, and are triple threats (acting, singing, dancing). They just see all of this and figure they must be rivals lolol.
 
There are only a couple of songs that Michael sang in falsetto, but Prince regularly sang in falsetto.

CYNTHIA HORNER: I take credit for that [laughs]. Right On! was a fan magazine, so I could get away with some of the things that I did. Michael and Prince were not actually battling each other on a serious level. But because I knew that was something the public found fascinating and everybody always talked about it, I wanted to have both of them on the cover together to project that element of Prince vs. Michael.
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http://www.vibe.com/article/michael-jackson-vs-prince-oral-history-pg-3

AHMIR “QUESTLOVE” THOMPSON (Leader, producer and drummer for the Philadelphia hip-hop band The Roots): I have an actual theory on why we started connecting Michael and Prince together early on. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that both were born in the summer of 1958 in the Midwest and both basically represent different phases of the coming-of-age life of black youth. Michael captured the imagination of post civil-rights America as a youth and he was their guiding light. And Prince captured the same post-civil rights America when they became teenagers and helped them mature into adulthood.
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http://www.vibe.com/article/michael-jackson-vs-prince-oral-history
 
Re: Prince MJ comparison

I don't hate Prince at all. Just saying.
 
Re: Prince MJ comparison

Hmm I've always been of the mind that Prince's 1984 tour and 86 tour were better than MJ's live set. By 88 however MJ overtook him with the second leg of Bad.

Musically Thriller easily stands over 1999, not sure if I can say the same for Purple Rain, that's tough. Parade was better than Bad, but Dangerous is better than Sign of the Times and just about everything else Prince released in the late 80s (Lovesexy...ugh!)
 
Michael Jackson and Prince had one of the most epic rivalries in pop music history. When MJ moonwalked his way to instant legend status with the mega-sellingThriller, Prince answered back with 1984's multi-platinum Purple Rain soundtrack and the Oscar-winning movie. And that was just the beginning.

Beyond just who was the more historically important hitmaker, we've also reckoned with such enduring questions as, "zipper-accented red leather jacket or ruffled purple blouse?" Do we prefer our chosen musical icon skewered via Eddie Murphy stand-up set, or Charlie Murphy Chappelle Show skit? It all depended on whether you backed Team Michael or Team Prince.

But despite rich documentation of their beef, including this detailed Vibe oral history, there are still some delightful surprises to be found. The new book, MJ: The Genius of Michael Jackson , includes one particularly amazing example of the rivalry coming to a head in 2006, when Prince menaced the King of Pop by playing "aggressive slap bass" in his face at a Las Vegas concert.

This winning anecdote is brought to us courtesy of an Esquire interview with the author, Rolling Stone contributing editor Steve Knopper, who recalls how Black Eyed Peas ringleader and Jackson collaborator will.i.am got caught in the middle of a bizarre showdown between the two arch-rivals.

"Nobody really quite knows the full extent of their rivalry, and I think both of those guys had an interest in keeping it somewhat mysterious because they are both mysterious dudes," Knopper tells writer Dan Hyman.

"But when Prince was doing his Vegas residency around late 2006, Michael was living in Vegas. Will was a guest artist at the Prince residency, but he was also friends with Michael. So Will arranged it for Michael to be a guest in the audience at Prince's show. No one knew it really, but Prince knew it.

"There was a point during the show where Prince was playing bass and he came out into the audience with this giant bass—he knew where Michael was sitting—and he walked right up to Michael and started playing bass in Michael's face. Like aggressive slap bass."

"The next morning, Will went over to Michael's house for breakfast, and they're talking about Prince and the show. And then Michael goes, 'Will, why do you think Prince was playing bass in my face?'

"Michael was outraged. And then started going on. 'Prince has always been a meanie. He's just a big meanie. He's always been not nice to me. Everybody says Prince is this great legendary Renaissance man and I'm just a song-and-dance man, but I wrote "Billie Jean" and I wrote "We Are the World" and I'm a songwriter too.'"

"All this disrespect for Prince came out from Michael that morning. One day, I hope Prince sits down and tells the truth about everything between him and Michael. Before I die, I want to know what the full deal was between the two of them."
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Is the bolded part true? Words like meanie doesn't even sound like MJ in his late 40's. There has been so many contradictory stories about their relationship, I don't know what to believe anymore. Oh and he omitted the fact that Chris Tucker was present there as well.

http://www.maxim.com/entertainment/...-jackson-playing-aggressive-slap-bass-2015-10
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

Meanie. Yeah right.
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

Sounds like Will trying to be entertaining. Can't picture these words-doesn't sound like outrage.
Is it Knoepper questioning the real story of the 'rivalry'. If so, sounds like he doesn't buy the story either.
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

a child wouldn't even call someone a' big meanie' let alone MJ. Prince has always denied any beef with MJ. Surely it would have been in both of their interest to make public a feud (if there was even one) as it would generate huge publicity?
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

Posted on Instagram by Dr. Funkenberry. He has a blog where he posts all things Prince, among other things. He was actually at the show, so here's what he has to say:
"In short, this article by Maxim quotes Will.I.Am stating back in 2006 (actually it was NBA all star weekend in 2007.) that Prince played bass aggressively in MJ's face n the next morning MJ questioning why Prince did that n thought it was Prince being mean n always being a meany.
OK. I was there a few tables away. It was during "Black Sweat" n Prince grabbed his bass n played it in front of MJ's table n face along with Will.I.Am. and Chris Tucker. As someone who has had Prince play "aggressively" guitar, bass, and even air bass, Prince was being playful. It was moreso MJ's reaction. Prince will give his funk face n everything while doing it n expects it back but I believe MJ was caught off guard. Prince was being playful and showing off.
MJ was supposed to attend the aftershow with Michael Jordan but with festivities set to begin at 3 a.m, it was too late for Jordan so without Jordan being there, MJ passed.
Prince has nothing but RESPECT for MJ. Johnny Carson one said that he always felt like the loneliest person in the room. That everyone knew who he was but because of his shyness, it came off as arrogance how he would or would not approach someone.
After Hurricane Katrina, MJ reached out to Prince to be a part of a charity song for Katrina. Prince just recorded one on his own n playfully said, "If U can tell me where the USA For Africa money went, he would do it." MJ's untimely death took everyone off guard. Prince especially. We all grieve in different ways. Some are not meant for public consumption. I'm sure Prince eventually thought him and MJ would do something together when the time was right, putting it off. They were out of time before they thought they would be. Was there a rivalry? It depends who you ask? Was there mutual respect especially from Prince? 100%. He wouldn't have tried to show off on the bass that night if he didn't. #Truth."
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https://instagram.com/p/8lrzktnjAo/?taken-by=drfunkenberry
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

This "story" sounds like it should be posted in the Trials and Tribulations forum (this sounds like cartoonish tabloid fodder.) :coffee:
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

Themidwestcowboy said:
Posted on Instagram by Dr. Funkenberry. He has a blog where he posts all things Prince, among other things. He was actually at the show, so here's what he has to say:


https://instagram.com/p/8lrzktnjAo/?taken-by=drfunkenberry
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It was a playful rivaly and MJ definitely took it as such. Hence his remarks about having to write certain songs otherwise God would give them to Prince or the playful "Bubbles is wearing a Prince T-shirt" remark in Moonwalker. I am pretty sure both knew how to take it. Turning it into some bitter thing between them is just journalistic sensationalism.

I read the story from Will.I.Am before but I think the whole "MJ was outraged" and "meanie" thing is this author's addition. I don't remember it being in Will's original story. This guy who wrote this recent book apparently does it with a lot of stories in his book. Takes an innocent comment and then twists it into something more negative.
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

respect77 said:
It was a playful rivaly and MJ definitely took it as such. Hence his remarks about having to write certain songs otherwise God would give them to Prince or the playful "Bubbles is wearing a Prince T-shirt" remark in Moonwalker. I am pretty sure both knew how to take it. Turning it into some bitter thing between them is just journalistic sensationalism.
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I agree. If there really was a bitter rivalry he wouldn't have mentioned Prince in Moonwalker at all. One of the best lines. I laughed my head off at the time.
It also made me pay a little more attention to Prince. Obviously Michael thought he was great, so....
 
table tennis

barbee0715 said:
I agree. If there really was a bitter rivalry he wouldn't have mentioned Prince in Moonwalker at all. One of the best lines. I laughed my head off at the time.
It also made me pay a little more attention to Prince. Obviously Michael thought he was great, so....
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I've always liked that ping pong story. :D
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

Load of rubbish!

More likely MJ went to one of Prince's Vegas shows and he felt that Prince was playing the bass too loud and too close to him and MJ took offence. Remember that in 2006 MJ was all over the world and the story seems improbable as MJ was in Bahrain and Ireland most of that year.

Also trying to start a rivalry again, I think Prince was a bit stuck up and was angry with lazy journalists always comparing Prince to MJ, mainly as both were African American, and had a huge crossover appeal to whites rather than being stuck in the R and B chart ghetto. In reality Prince, a consummate musician and instrumentalist probably felt that Michael who sang and danced and only wrote was not on the same plane as him.

On the other hand, the mid 2000s was a time Prince was lampooning MJ, with a line from the 2004 song "Life of the Party" - My voice is getting higher and I ain't never had my nose done", plus the off hand joke on Indigo Nights CD (2007 02 Concerts) -"Prince, Just one photo of you and Michael Jackson together and I could retire". Maybe he was tired of all the headlines MJ was getting over the child abuse trial instead of people paying attention to his very boring play it safe music of the mid 2000s. Yet Prince should have counted his lucky stars he was not getting unfairly grilled by the press for no reason.
 
Re: table tennis

Plus I think Prince resented comparison with MJ, as he did not want to be the crowd pleasing pop star that Michael was, and rather be taken seriously as a proper Musician like Miles Davis and John Coltrane, rather than just making crowd pleasing tunes for teeny boppers.
He even dismissed the 10 million or so fairweather fans that bought Purple Rain, saying "They are just digging it because its a hit", whereas his later and earlier albums he made for the genuine 2 - 3 million Purple Fans who bought most of his output, "The 3 million who bought Around the World in a day (1985 album after Purple Rain) also bought 1999 (The album before it) and that pleases me"
 
Re: table tennis

mjprince1976 said:
Plus I think Prince resented comparison with MJ, as he did not want to be the crowd pleasing pop star that Michael was, and rather be taken seriously as a proper Musician like Miles Davis and John Coltrane, rather than just making crowd pleasing tunes for teeny boppers.
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What the hell are you talking about? So you're saying MJ was just making crowd pleasing tunes for teeny boopers?

mjprince1976 said:
Maybe he was tired of all the headlines MJ was getting over the child abuse trial instead of people paying attention to his very boring play it safe music of the mid 2000s.
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This is even more ridiculous than the article posted.
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

mjprince1976 said:
In reality Prince, a consummate musician and instrumentalist probably felt that Michael who sang and danced and only wrote was not on the same plane as him.
.
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That's Bull. Michael didn't only just write. He wrote, composed and produced. Michael was just as much of a musician as Prince is. You seem to be trying to reduce Michael to being just a song and dance man just to make Prince look better.

Themidwestcowboy said:
What the hell are you talking about? So you're saying MJ was just making crowd pleasing tunes for teeny boopers?.
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As we all know, ''Morphine'' was a huge hit with the teeny boppers
 
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Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

analogue said:
As we all know, ''Morphine'' was a huge hit with the teeny boppers
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Not to mention HIStory which was competing for the teen-bopper album of the year title with the Spice Girls. ;)
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

Respect77 - History was released in 1995, The spice girls were a 1996 phenomenon. Sure Wannabe dropped in very late 1995 in the UK, but they did not really hit big until the spring of 96.

Plus MJ was mainly a song and dance man, does not mean I like him any less. Prince plays 23 instruments, Michael sings, dances and apparently knows a few guitar and piano chords.

Michael released 7 solo albums as an adult and 15 more or so as part of the Jacksons or solo Motown ones. Prince has released 38 official albums and at least 2000 unreleased songs sit in his vault. Yes I love Michael, but not as much as Prince who is a musical quasar.
 
Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

mjprince1976 said:
Respect77 - History was released in 1995, The spice girls were a 1996 phenomenon. Sure Wannabe dropped in very late 1995 in the UK, but they did not really hit big until the spring of 96.
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Geez. It was a joke.

Plus MJ was mainly a song and dance man, does not mean I like him any less. Prince plays 23 instruments, Michael sings, dances and apparently knows a few guitar and piano chords.

Michael released 7 solo albums as an adult and 15 more or so as part of the Jacksons or solo Motown ones. Prince has released 38 official albums and at least 2000 unreleased songs sit in his vault. Yes I love Michael, but not as much as Prince who is a musical quasar.
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I like Prince but to me it's the other way around: I love Michael much more and in that I could not care less about how many instruments Prince plays or how many albums he has. This seems to be the thing Prince fans always bring up, so certainly this is an important point to them when comparing their fave to other artists (Typically they bring up MJ - he seems to be a lot on their minds on Prince.org as well. Cool, I guess. :D), but maybe it's just not equally important to everyone. At the end of the day, I enjoy MJ's music more regardless of who is on guitar in Billie Jean, and that's it. (That doesn't mean I don't enjoy Prince too.) There is nothing wrong with being a song and dance man (Michael was that but also more - songwriter, producer etc.) and the objection was not against that term but against this:

Plus I think Prince resented comparison with MJ, as he did not want to be the crowd pleasing pop star that Michael was, and rather be taken seriously as a proper Musician like Miles Davis and John Coltrane, rather than just making crowd pleasing tunes for teeny boppers.
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Maybe you didn't realize but the whole paragraph and in fact the whole post sounded like you were trying to shade Michael just to be able to elevate Prince.

Did Michael want to be popular? Yes, he did. No denying in that, but that does not make his music teeny bopper music. In fact, his music stood the test of time which is usually not the case with teeny boppers. On any streaming service Michael is one of the most popular veteran artists, if not the most popular. People just keep spinning and spinning his music even 20-30 years later. I am quite satisfied with that. That's how an artists legacy lives on not by a handful of critics, who think too highly of their own opinion, lauding him in some far away ivory tower. At the end of the day music is for the audience.

Michael achieved his goals artistically: all around the world his music is enjoyed by a large number of people of all colors, nationalities, creeds and it also stood the test of time. Also it keeps influencing younger artists until this day all over the world. I think his legacy is safe. I have no complaints.

Prince's goal was maybe not that level of popularity, he had maybe different goals. I hope he achieved his goals to his and his fans' satisfaction. Although, actually I am not quite sure he never really wanted MJ's popularity. I think back in the 80s he seemed pretty competitive with MJ. And if he really so resented the comparation maybe he should not have referred to MJ in song lyrics.
 
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Re: Prince and Michael story from Vegas 2006..

Let's look at the creative process for Black Or White. Bill Botrell said that Michael sang the main riff to him, and then he went off and played it on guitar. Would the song be any better if Michael played guitar for it instead? Of course not. It's still the same song. It doesn't make any difference who plays the instruments for it

I don't care who plays what. All I care about is the end result.

And, the fact that Michael couldn't play instruments, but still accomplished all that he did as a songwriter is really impressive.
 
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