Controversial MJ Documentary Leaving Neverland [GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD]

Lightbringer;4255077 said:
Maybe I am not having this right. Is Mary from Jackson Passion the individual that is narrating the Michael Jackson And Wade Robson - The Real Story"? I mean, is she the female voice speaking through the video? Or is Mary only doing the video cutting and some other female is speaking in the video? I just felt the need to verify this.

Is it Mary speaking in the new video from the Michael Jackson Innocent project: Proving MJ's Innocence 'Fact by Fact' ~ Fact #2: “No Accurate Description"?

If thats Mary, then she definitely was in on the stream, first speaking about that she thought they should focus on the people defending Michael rather than whining about people that are not defending Michael. She also broke in asked that the other should stop swearing on the stream, as they have younger listeners. She did not speak much, she also said about Michael: "This is a man who would give you the shirt of his back if you asked him".

I immediately recognized her accent and voice when she started speaking in the stream.

I think Mary from the Channel "JacksonPassion" is the first woman you can hear speaking in "Michael Jackson and Wade Robson: The true Story".
This is not the same woman who speaks in the normal videos from the Michael Jackson Innocent Project besides the podcasts episodes.

But they both have a beautiful voice. 👍
 
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I didn't know Brett Barnes knew J. Chandler, those have a pictures with Michael.
 
I am seeing this online from Stephanie Mills (originally on Instagram). I don't think it's been posted before?

We live in this new way of life where being first is better than being correct! They slandered his name, they tried to ruin his image, they wanted the ratings, they wanted the likes and clicks and all they got was embarrassed and humbled for being ambulance chasers! #HBO, #Oprah and all involved, owe my friend #MichaelJackson, his family and friends an apology for what they did. I really want y’all to have that same energy to right what y’all know was so wrong when y’all took the word of two individuals that had zero credibility when y’all sat down with them. You can’t blame them for trying, however when the pros go low...we go high! #GodDontLikeUgly...and he ain’t that cool with pretty either. What y’all did was unprofessional and ugly! We have got to do better and we have to stop with the assignation of people who are no longer here to defend themselves. I love and miss you Michael. Go ahead my friend and Moon Walk into your greatness. Because NO weapon formed against you shall prosper������������������


https://www.iloveoldschoolmusic.com...h-hbo-mj-accusers-honor-ex-michael-jackson/3/
 
The writer of this article blocked persons who don't agree with her.
Go figure. She does not have hardly no comments it is just one who I want to response to (sound like a troll. Anytime u hear those talking about fans, it is often trolls. Never fails).
 
ManBehindTheMirrOr - Dona;4255079 said:
I think Mary from the Channel "JacksonPassion" is the first woman you can hear speaking in "Michael Jackson and Wade Robson: The true Story".
This is not the same woman who speaks in the normal videos from the Michael Jackson Innocent Project besides the podcasts episodes.

But they both have a beautiful voice. ��

I stand corrected my friend :)

It was the women narrating the following video that was on the stream: Proving MJ's Innocence 'Fact by Fact' ~ Fact #2: “No Accurate Description"?

Thats not Mary, I apologize for any confusion caused.

Does anyone know who she is btw? And whats her twitter?

She was the one that made most sense and wanted the broadcast to be professional without swearing etc. Its a shame she does not speak more during the streams.
 
New Episode from The Michael Jackson Innnocent Project

You must skip six min. before can hear anything


Mmm... The hosts have a point. Though Aaron said he'll always have MJ's back, he did say "he can't take away from people's stories".

If it's okay to say: "Michael was pedocriminal and raped those kids, etc. just based on those allegations, his love for those kids, the gifts, the pyjama parties, etc." (even though one wasn't there), then it's okay to say: "Based on my research, their lies and the inconsistencies in their stories, I know that those men are lying through their teeth!" (even though one wasn't there neither).

Those who believe Michael to be guilty, to have committed all those acts, weren't there, but they never backtrack, flip or attempt to "moderate" previous comments made. So why would Aaron Carter and Corey Feldman so strongly defend Michael, even suggest those men are lying, and then "moderate" their previous comments not to be seen as victim shamers when those are alleged victims, and there is evidence they are lying and not victims at all?

Lying about sexual abuse is not the same thing as experiencing sexual abuse but it's just as bad! It's basically making the abuse happen on a fictional level, in people's minds, and it may destroy a person's reputation for life, their career or tarnish their memory if they're dead. I'll always stand by MJ, and I do stand by AC. Let's wait and see, but he has better not turn on MJ.

He said he might say things the Estate won't like, but he loves them and wants them to stay strong. It's all very mysterious, and yes, it's a bit scary. I don't fully understand why Aaron is now doing this... What could he end up telling?
 
Okay, I couldn't figure out how to embed video's on my mobile so I had to get on my laptop to try and do this:laughing::laughing: I just found this great video of MJ that was published on April 9, 2019. What a great speech he made and he sounded so good.

Hope it worked and I embedded it properly?

Love, love this! It only did Michael sound good, he looked great!! :clap:Thank you for posting this.
 
Lightbringer;4255093 said:
I stand corrected my friend :)

It was the women narrating the following video that was on the stream: Proving MJ's Innocence 'Fact by Fact' ~ Fact #2: “No Accurate Description"?

Thats not Mary, I apologize for any confusion caused.

Does anyone know who she is btw? And whats her twitter?

She was the one that made most sense and wanted the broadcast to be professional without swearing etc. Its a shame she does not speak more during the streams.

The Woman you want to follow has the name Nina.

When you go to the last Michael Jackson Innocent Project Podcst episode you can find a comment where someone asks for the twitter adresses.
The woman who is the "Believer" in the crew responded and posted all four twitter adresses from the project members including Ninas.

I like Nina and Luna from the Michael Jackson Innocent Project.
 
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dont know if that was posted...


Hm... its difficult to understand.
I never followed Aaron Carter.
All I know from him are this two songs he sung when he was a child.
So I absolutly don't know his personal personna.

Why was MJ only sucessful to inspire artists musically and artistically but couldn't teach them other important things like this one lesson he presented his entire life trough his own example:

Don't talk shit or bad about other artists!
Esspecially when they were your friend you have to keep things in secret!
This is a important massage for every artist to lern esspecially in this LN situation.

Michael was too good for this world.
He was too ahead of his time and the development of the human kind.
He didn't fit in his time.
He sould be born 100 years later.
 
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The Woman you want to follow has the name Nina.

When you go to the last Michael Jackson Innocent Project Podcst episode you can find a comment where someone asks for the twitter adresses.
The woman who is the "Believer" in the crew responded and posted all four twitter adresses from the project members including Ninas.

I like Nina and Luna from the Michael Jackson Innocent Project.

Can you copy and paste the text with the twitter accounts here or via PM. I cant find that podcast place you are talking about to find it myself. Thanks!
 
Thanks. I found them now.

And also this gem :D

"Dnomyar Akunawik20 hours ago@The Michael Jackson Innocent Project hello! U r very smart. What he your background? Also, did the 1993 grand jury see the photographs of Chandler's penis??"

Haha. ?
Please tell them the thing with the park footage I have mention in a extra thread.
Maybe they want investigate this and can find the documentery it was used.

Does somewhere a list from all Michael Jackson Documentarys exist?
 
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Correct me when I am wrong with this but as far as I discovered it did Adrian McManus never mentioned James anywhere.
Is it then not very possible that James was then never arround Michael during the time she worked for him what was nearly every day?
This other employee in her twitter post said also that the Michael was not in Neverland when the Safechucks where there.
I don't know if this other employees ever mention James.
 
This is the source of the pictures of MJ photo with the Robson family
https://twitter.com/applexead/status/1117764444682182656

Hm..... this is very interesting cause in 2005 and in this beach interview when Wade talked about when he first met Michael again after the bad tour he said 1989 and not 1990.

Why want they fool us in LN that this second meeting and maybe also the first trip from the robsons to the USA did take place in 1990 and not in 1989?

What does Wades lawsuit say about this?
I haven't read it.
 
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Niether one of them were around as much as they portray.. theres a reason why Frank cascio was always known as a friend to Michael and James was only called "the kid from the Pepsi commercial".. until 5 years after Michael's passing..

Now Michael has kids that never exhisted, cousins that all of a sudden share his blood, and friends that were never there..

Even James makes it clear Michael pushed the Safechucks away himself... the narrative simply turned sinister with his financial motive.
 
Niether one of them were around as much as they portray.. theres a reason why Frank cascio was always known as a friend to Michael and James was only called "the kid from the Pepsi commercial".. until 5 years after Michael's passing..

Now Michael has kids that never exhisted, cousins that all of a sudden share his blood, and friends that were never there..

Even James makes it clear Michael pushed the Safechucks away himself... the narrative simply turned sinister with his financial motive.

Yeah ... I mean that Michael didn't send the Robsons a copy from his most personal album "HIStory" says much for me and his real relationship to Wade and his family.
 
Hm..... this is very interesting cause in 2005 and in this beach interview when Wade talked about when he first met Michael again after the bad tour he said 1989 and not 1990.

Why want they fool us in LN that this second meeting and maybe also the first trip from the robsons to the USA did take place in 1990 and not in 1989?

What does Wades lawsuit say about this?
I haven't read it.

Hm.... when this photoshooting with the robsons did take place in May 1989, the whole neverland abuse story maybe can't take place on Wades first trip cause Michael then maybe didn't live there or the Ranch was not finished to invite guests.
We should ask Taj when MJ moved compleatly to Neverland.
 
In May 1989 Wade would also be only six years old....
Wade is six years = NO SEXUAL ABUSE FROM MICHAEL DID HAPPEN!

Taj would say:
Timelines absolutly matter!
 
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I'm not going to post a link to the reddit thread where this happened, but I had such a frustrating exchange with someone last night. (On a post about someone's new Bad tattoo, of all things.) I really don't understand these people who claim to be fans, insist that Michael must be guilty, and when pressed for evidence or citation of sources, just fall back on "oh, it's obvious and you know it." *headdesk* The person ended up invoking Godwin's Law, and at that point, I was absolutely done.
 
dont know if that was posted...


The tape is a cut and paste job according to vindicatemj.wordpress.com, he never spoke about MJ there and he's always denied saying that about alcohol and drugs and what not. I'm assuming that's what this video is about. I can't watch it myself now.
 
I'm not going to post a link to the reddit thread where this happened, but I had such a frustrating exchange with someone last night. (On a post about someone's new Bad tattoo, of all things.) I really don't understand these people who claim to be fans, insist that Michael must be guilty, and when pressed for evidence or citation of sources, just fall back on "oh, it's obvious and you know it." *headdesk* The person ended up invoking Godwin's Law, and at that point, I was absolutely done.
Every one could say I'm a fan.
 
I'm not going to post a link to the reddit thread where this happened, but I had such a frustrating exchange with someone last night. (On a post about someone's new Bad tattoo, of all things.) I really don't understand these people who claim to be fans, insist that Michael must be guilty, and when pressed for evidence or citation of sources, just fall back on "oh, it's obvious and you know it." *headdesk* The person ended up invoking Godwin's Law, and at that point, I was absolutely done.

Those are NOT fans, those are TROLLS looking to create drama. I have ousted a few of them. A show was done to expose people who make a living at doing this. They go into what is the latest hot issue to create drama. That is why when someone is too difficult to a point, that is often a troll.
 
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Look Wade is saying here at 7:00 the first trip to USA happened in 1989


Listen closly what Wade is saying here about this FIRST TRIP to the U.S.

- It happened in 1989 ( what he also said in 2005 in court UNDER OATH)
- The WHOLE family met Michael at the Recording studio
- Michael invited the WHOLE family to Neverland and the WHOLE family stayed in Neverland for ONLY a week (then they seamed to fly back to Australia like he described it in 2005).
- Then the FAMILY stayed in contact with Michael FOR YEARS and then happend the SECOND TRIP the U.S.A for six weeks( what can be in 1990 or 1991)
- In Wades lawsuit Wade claims both trips happened in 1990 with only a few weeks/months timeperiode between them
- In LN the first trip went on and on and on for many weeks

It is also interesting that Wade said in the end of this Thriller 25 Special in 2008 that he becamed friends with Michael when he was NINE and AFTER his family moved to LA and didn't mention anything about the time between the bad tour meeting and this timpoint as if it doesn't have a meaning for him what happend there.

 
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I am not sure if this video has been posted but it's very good and I will give this to any future doubters or even haters. It's a lawyer that covers Chandler, Arviso and LN. She says at the start of the video that she isn't a fan, she liked a song here and there but never was big on his music. But she started to look at these cases.

She covers all the details, the extortion, the settlement and why, it's just unfortunate that she doesn't cover the settlement with the Francia family. Especially now that I've been encountering folks that throw that at me. Either way, a very good thing to watch but especially to give to people that still believe Mike was a monster.

 
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A new update in the article about the differences between Leaving Neverland and the lawsuits:

8) The Safechucks are telling a completely different story in the film about how their relationship with Jackson started compared to James’s lawsuit. That Jackson and James first met during the shooting of a Pepsi commercial in late 1986-early 1987 is the same, but after that the stories dramatically differ.

In the film we hear Stephanie Safechuck say: “One day the phone rang and I picked it up: ‘Hi, this is Michael, I’m calling from Australia. I saw Jimmy’s commercial.’ I thought: ‘How touching, he doesn’t think it is his commercial, he thinks it’s Jimmy’s.’ So I put Jimmy on the phone and I could hear Jimmy say: ‘People tell me at school that you’re weird.’ Michael said: ‘Don’t listen to what anybody says. You know me, you know I’m not weird.’ And that started the relationship.

So Michael is still in Australia and asked if he could send a crew to our house to film Jimmy. So a crew came and Jimmy didn’t have any posters of Michael, so they put up posters of Michael all through Jimmy’s bedroom, so when they filmed it, you know, it was more appealing. It was exciting for all of us, for the the whole family.”

James Safechuck: “I sat on the bed and put all my memorabilia there and they just interviewed me. And then I did a little dance performance and they filmed that. Now that I look on it, it’s almost like an audition for him. He sends this film crew out.”

Stephanie Safechuck: “He didn’t explain that. I just figured he’s far away and this is part how he can be with people, and he made it clear that he was very lonely, he didn’t have any friends.”

James Safechuck: “And then his secretary or somebody called and asked if we would like to go to dinner at the Havenhurst house.”

So this is how Jackson’s relationship starts according to Leaving Neverland.

The story in James’s lawsuit, however, doesn’t even remotely resemble this. There the claim is that after the Pepsi commercial “Michael Jackson wrote a letter to [James Safechuck]” dated March 10, 1987. Notice how in the first sentence of paragraph 12 below the implication is that it was Jackson who initiated the contact. However, if you pay attention to the following letter that Jackson wrote to James, its first sentence is: “thank you for your letter”, which clearly indicates that Jackson answers to a letter that James had previously written to him. That initial letter is never mentioned explicitly in Safechuck’s complaint, though.



[3]

In the complaint after this letter (so shortly after March 10, 1987) the Safechucks are invited to Jackson’s Hayvenhurst home and by Thanksgiving Day (November 26, 1987) they are already good friends with Jackson.



[3]

This is a quite different story to what we see in the film, isn’t it?

In the film the Safechucks claim that the start of their relationship with Jackson was when Jackson, just out of the blue, called them from Australia. They claim that was their first contact with him after the Pepsi commercial. Jackson was in Australia in November 1987. Here are the dates when he performed in there during his Bad Tour:



In James’s lawsuit, on the other hand, by Thanksgiving Day (November 26) they already have a friendship with Jackson and Jackson spends Thanksgiving in the Safechucks home. Which is quite amazing because in reality he was in Australia, as we have seen above from the tour dates.

There seems to be a zeal by the Safechucks to portray Jackson as the initiator of the relationship. We can only learn that it wasn’t so, if we pay attention to the first sentence of Jackson’s letter to James on March 10, 1987. Perhaps this is why the film does not show or even mention this letter, but instead claims that the relationship started with Jackson calling the Safechucks from Australia in November 1987 and then Jackson immediately (while still in Australia) sending out a film crew to film James. The suggestion seems to be that Jackson did that to see if James is to his liking as a potential victim. Except, if he already had a friendship with the family before that and they already visited each other several times before, then of course this suggestion about the film crew does not make any sense.

Of course, it is difficult to tell what is true and what is false in each version of their story. That’s just the difficulty we have with people who cannot keep their story straight.

themichaeljacksonallegations.com/2019/03/17/differences-between-leaving-neverland-interviews-and-the-robson-safechuck-lawsuits/
 
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elusive moonwalker;4255120 said:
A new update in the article about the differences between Leaving Neverland and the lawsuits:

8) The Safechucks are telling a completely different story in the film about how their relationship with Jackson started compared to James’s lawsuit. That Jackson and James first met during the shooting of a Pepsi commercial in late 1986-early 1987 is the same, but after that the stories dramatically differ.

In the film we hear Stephanie Safechuck say: “One day the phone rang and I picked it up: ‘Hi, this is Michael, I’m calling from Australia. I saw Jimmy’s commercial.’ I thought: ‘How touching, he doesn’t think it is his commercial, he thinks it’s Jimmy’s.’ So I put Jimmy on the phone and I could hear Jimmy say: ‘People tell me at school that you’re weird.’ Michael said: ‘Don’t listen to what anybody says. You know me, you know I’m not weird.’ And that started the relationship.

So Michael is still in Australia and asked if he could send a crew to our house to film Jimmy. So a crew came and Jimmy didn’t have any posters of Michael, so they put up posters of Michael all through Jimmy’s bedroom, so when they filmed it, you know, it was more appealing. It was exciting for all of us, for the the whole family.”

James Safechuck: “I sat on the bed and put all my memorabilia there and they just interviewed me. And then I did a little dance performance and they filmed that. Now that I look on it, it’s almost like an audition for him. He sends this film crew out.”

Stephanie Safechuck: “He didn’t explain that. I just figured he’s far away and this is part how he can be with people, and he made it clear that he was very lonely, he didn’t have any friends.”

James Safechuck: “And then his secretary or somebody called and asked if we would like to go to dinner at the Havenhurst house.”

So this is how Jackson’s relationship starts according to Leaving Neverland.

The story in James’s lawsuit, however, doesn’t even remotely resemble this. There the claim is that after the Pepsi commercial “Michael Jackson wrote a letter to [James Safechuck]” dated March 10, 1987. Notice how in the first sentence of paragraph 12 below the implication is that it was Jackson who initiated the contact. However, if you pay attention to the following letter that Jackson wrote to James, its first sentence is: “thank you for your letter”, which clearly indicates that Jackson answers to a letter that James had previously written to him. That initial letter is never mentioned explicitly in Safechuck’s complaint, though.



[3]

In the complaint after this letter (so shortly after March 10, 1987) the Safechucks are invited to Jackson’s Hayvenhurst home and by Thanksgiving Day (November 26, 1987) they are already good friends with Jackson.



[3]

This is a quite different story to what we see in the film, isn’t it?

In the film the Safechucks claim that the start of their relationship with Jackson was when Jackson, just out of the blue, called them from Australia. They claim that was their first contact with him after the Pepsi commercial. Jackson was in Australia in November 1987. Here are the dates when he performed in there during his Bad Tour:



In James’s lawsuit, on the other hand, by Thanksgiving Day (November 26) they already have a friendship with Jackson and Jackson spends Thanksgiving in the Safechucks home. Which is quite amazing because in reality he was in Australia, as we have seen above from the tour dates.

There seems to be a zeal by the Safechucks to portray Jackson as the initiator of the relationship. We can only learn that it wasn’t so, if we pay attention to the first sentence of Jackson’s letter to James on March 10, 1987. Perhaps this is why the film does not show or even mention this letter, but instead claims that the relationship started with Jackson calling the Safechucks from Australia in November 1987 and then Jackson immediately (while still in Australia) sending out a film crew to film James. The suggestion seems to be that Jackson did that to see if James is to his liking as a potential victim. Except, if he already had a friendship with the family before that and they already visited each other several times before, then of course this suggestion about the film crew does not make any sense.

Of course, it is difficult to tell what is true and what is false in each version of their story. That’s just the difficulty we have with people who cannot keep their story straight.

themichaeljacksonallegations.com/2019/03/17/differences-between-leaving-neverland-interviews-and-the-robson-safechuck-lawsuits/

That is why Kathrine Jackson and LaToya ( who were living in Hayvenhurst the whole 80ies every day) needs to get involved in this whole thing.
They have to watch James parts of LN (or study the transscript) and study his legal documents.

Great work from "The Michael Jackson Allegations".
 
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