Had the album that became "Invincible" been released in 1999

[JichaelMackson]

What exactly is it that fans love about "beautiful girl"? Those lyrics are cheese.

The 99 album judging from what I read here sounds as awful as the one we eventually got called invincible. I remember from Invincible in 2001 till MJ's death in 2009 I wasn't much of a fan anymore (read: I hardly ever listened to his music in that period). I made up for that since 2009 though especially the last 3 years.

 

[Fuzball]

This is from an interview he gave in April 1999 to the british "The Mirror"

"Yes I’m right in the middle of the album. I’m half way through and it’s just a cavalcade of wonderful just songs and I’m putting everything I have into it. I’m putting my heart into it because I’m not sure if I’m going to really really do it again as, you know, this may be my last one as far as an album. I may do – the next is doing soundtrack albums. Soundtracks and films but not just straight out pop."

[video=youtube;X4BzkoqpHrc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4BzkoqpHrc[/video]

 

[JichaelMackson]

This is from an interview he gave in April 1999 to the british "The Mirror"

"Yes I’m right in the middle of the album. I’m half way through and it’s just a cavalcade of wonderful just songs and I’m putting everything I have into it. I’m putting my heart into it because I’m not sure if I’m going to really really do it again as, you know, this may be my last one as far as an album. I may do – the next is doing soundtrack albums. Soundtracks and films but not just straight out pop."

[video=youtube;X4BzkoqpHrc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4BzkoqpHrc[/video]

He either changed his mind a lot or he got pressurized into doing things he didn't like to do.
-The bad tour was to be his last tour while 2 more followed each time bigger than the one before.
-Invincible was to be his last pop album while that statement is correct we all know he was working on a new pop album after the 2005 trial.
-He wanted to do films and soundtracks not much of that happened at all.

I'm sure he really wanted to step away from pop music but for some reason he never could, perhaps that's why he kept rehashing the same concerts and a bunch of tired uninspired tracks (imo, almost everything post HIStory sessions). If he was able to step away from his formula just once perhaps he would feel less pressure to perform commercially and perhaps he would get more critical respect.

I'm sure his bosses kept pushing him to release pop music, he wasn't given the freedom to reinvent and reposition himself on the music/entertainment map.

 

[Fuzball]

-Invincible was to be his last pop album while that statement is correct we all know he was working on a new pop album after the 2005 trial.

He was actually working on a post Greatest Hits album [was released as "Number Ones"] since late 2002.

 

[SmoothCriminal1995]

What exactly is it that fans love about "beautiful girl"? Those lyrics are cheese.

The 99 album judging from what I read here sounds as awful as the one we eventually got called invincible. I remember from Invincible in 2001 till MJ's death in 2009 I wasn't much of a fan anymore (read: I hardly ever listened to his music in that period). I made up for that since 2009 though especially the last 3 years.

One word : Harmonies

This is something that for me was sorely lacking on Invincible, Michael's solo background harmonies. They create a soundscape which is like a world of feeling, in this case a light and breezy, yet passionate feeling of love. It gives you that feeling only Michael's music can give you. Those harmonies remind me Liberian Girl

 

[Themidwestcowboy]

One word : Harmonies

This is something that for me was sorely lacking on Invincible, Michael's solo background harmonies. They create a soundscape which is like a world of feeling, in this case a light and breezy, yet passionate feeling of love. It gives you that feeling only Michael's music can give you. Those harmonies remind me Liberian Girl

Oh those harmonies are so lush and beautiful! I love how the harmonies continues throughout all the key changes.

 

[mj_frenzy]

A Place With No Name was never meant to be released. It was recorded just for the fun of it.

That is totally untrue.

‘A Place With No Name’ was one of the strongest candidates for inclusion on the album that was about to get a release in late 1999.

As Dr. Freeze put it, ‘A Place With No Name’ was one of their priorities:

“… I introduced him to many songs … The main songs on which we worked were ‘Break Of Dawn’, ‘A Place With No Name’ and ‘Blue Gangsta’. These three songs were our priorities … He adored them …” (Dr. Freeze)

Dr. Freeze’s above statement also confirms my information that ‘A Place With No Name’ was included on the early track list of the album meant for release in late 1999.

 

[MJJExpert]

I think it's relevant to highlight that the surgical procedure Michael had done in late 1999 or sometime in 2000 (on his face/mouth area) inhibited his ability to enunciate as he once had. This would absolutely have an impact on his singing.

To me, that's totally not true. Michael showed a great singing technique/voice also in 2001 sessions, at MSG (when live), on songs recorded from 2002 onwards, at This is it. He regularly trained with Seth Riggs.
In my opinion, a 2001 lower voice-rendition is due to MJ's decreasing interest in the Invincible project (or in its promotion), in favor of new movies-related ideas, and - most of all - in his sons' issues. And add also a terrible physical shape and you're there...

 

[mj_frenzy]

To me, that's totally not true. Michael showed a great singing technique/voice also in 2001 sessions, at MSG (when live), on songs recorded from 2002 onwards, at This is it. He regularly trained with Seth Riggs.
In my opinion, a 2001 lower voice-rendition is due to MJ's decreasing interest in the Invincible project (or in its promotion), in favor of new movies-related ideas, and - most of all - in his sons' issues. And add also a terrible physical shape and you're there...

The multiple botox injections that he was having during that period (from early 2000s) did have an effect on his singing and speaking abilities.

Due to those injections, his muscles around his mouth area (including his lips) became slightly paralyzed, which in turn hindered his singing and speaking abilities.

In events like, the two MSG shows (2001), the ‘Invincible’ album signing event (on November 7th, 2001), the ‘United We Stand’ Benefit Concert (2001), the ‘Private Home Movies’ (2003), his Award Acceptance Speeches, etc, you can clearly see how difficult he found it not only to sing (or lip-sync), but also to just speak and smile properly.

Michael Jackson went overboard with those botox injections around that time, not only because of his aesthetic reasons, but also because in some cases he was mainly interested in being sedated and without being able to find any other way to get that sedation he had to resort to such injections that require sedation.

Dr. Arnold Klein (in order to operate those botox injections on him) he used to get many sedative drugs for Michael Jackson using certain alliance names, a tactic that continued until Michael Jackson’s death in 2009.

 

[ChrisC]

Due to those injections, his muscles around his mouth area (including his lips) became slightly paralyzed, which in turn hindered his singing and speaking abilities.

In events like, the two MSG shows (2001), the ‘Invincible’ album signing event (on November 7th, 2001), the ‘United We Stand’ Benefit Concert (2001), the ‘Private Home Movies’ (2003), his Award Acceptance Speeches, etc, you can clearly see how difficult he found it not only to sing (or lip-sync), but also to just speak and smile properly.

Absolutely.

 

[ScreenOrigami]

Tabloid junk.

 

[analogue]

One word : Harmonies

This is something that for me was sorely lacking on Invincible, Michael's solo background harmonies. They create a soundscape which is like a world of feeling, in this case a light and breezy, yet passionate feeling of love. It gives you that feeling only Michael's music can give you. Those harmonies remind me Liberian Girl

A lot of Michael's trademark's were missing from Invincible. The harmonies, the ''Hee hee's'' the ''Dad gone it's'' and Shamones''

 

[Mikky Dee]

He even intentionally overdosed right after that interview (during the night) and they had to resuscitate him.

Please STOP. You have absolutely no idea what Michael Jackson did, intentionally or not intentionally, on any night and this is neither the time nor the place to re-hash speculations and recriminations such as this. How are these kinds of comments helping anything or anyone?

 

[Electro]

Michael Jackson went overboard with those botox injections around that time, not only because of his aesthetic reasons, but also because in some cases he was mainly interested in being sedated and without being able to find any other way to get that sedation he had to resort to such injections that require sedation.

Do you ever read what you write? So you claim to know he only went to doctors having botox injections in his face because he was keen on the sedation along the process? lol (...which in reality actually is not required for botox injections at all? lol#2)

I think Michael Jackson should have simply called mj_frenzy. Trash-fantasy-expert mj_frenzy could have easily sedated Michael Jackson with a small dose of his logic-defeating trash stories. Oh... I forgot, mj_frenzy was around Michael Jackson all of the time. Michael Jackson didn't even have to call mj_frenzy. And given that information, it is evident that it was mj_frenzy who sedated Michael Jackson to a degree that he could not properly talk and sing anymore. We can all see the result on video. Shame on mj_frenzy!

What? No proof, no source, no logic? You first!

 

[mj_frenzy]

A lot of Michael's trademark's were missing from Invincible. The harmonies, the ''Hee hee's'' the ''Dad gone it's'' and Shamones''

That was because of Sony Music’s orders.

Sony Music wanted to create a new Michael Jackson in the early 2000s, and so the record company gave very specific, strict orders for that.

They ordered his producers (who were working with him on the ‘Invincible’ album) to not let him record at all on that album (or, at least to minimize) some of his vocal trademarks again (such as, his ‘hee-hee’s’, his ‘hoo-hoo’s’, or even his ‘aaawww’s&#8217.

They also forced him to use certain modern, slang words (on that album) that the younger generation was very familiar with at the time especially in the hip-hop scene, such as the ‘shorty’ word that he sings in ‘2000 Watts’ which was a very popular slang term at the time that referred to an attractive woman.

They also wanted to change him stylistically, so they hired a team of new fashion designers specifically for him.

Sony Music wanted from him to get rid of the relics of his past glory (such as, his white socks, his sparkling boots, his fedora, the tape on his fingers, etc), and instead to create a brand new, modern stylistic image for him.

 

[Fuzball]

That was because of Sony Music’s orders.

Sony Music wanted to create a new Michael Jackson in the early 2000s, and so the record company gave very specific, strict orders for that.

They ordered his producers (who were working with him on the ‘Invincible’ album) to not let him record at all on that album (or, at least to minimize) some of his vocal trademarks again (such as, his ‘hee-hee’s’, his ‘hoo-hoo’s’, or even his ‘aaawww’s&#8217.

They also forced him to use certain modern, slang words (on that album) that the younger generation was very familiar with at the time especially in the hip-hop scene, such as the ‘shorty’ word that he sings in ‘2000 Watts’ which was a very popular slang term at the time that referred to an attractive woman.

They also wanted to change him stylistically, so they hired a team of new fashion designers specifically for him.

Sony Music wanted from him to get rid of the relics of his past glory (such as, his white socks, his sparkling boots, his fedora, the tape on his fingers, etc), and instead to create a brand new, modern stylistic image for him.

:hysterical:

Great sarcastic comment!






Wait, I think you're damn serious. It's still entertaining though.

 

[dam2040]

That was because of Sony Music’s orders.

Sony Music wanted to create a new Michael Jackson in the early 2000s, and so the record company gave very specific, strict orders for that.

They ordered his producers (who were working with him on the ‘Invincible’ album) to not let him record at all on that album (or, at least to minimize) some of his vocal trademarks again (such as, his ‘hee-hee’s’, his ‘hoo-hoo’s’, or even his ‘aaawww’s’).

They also forced him to use certain modern, slang words (on that album) that the younger generation was very familiar with at the time especially in the hip-hop scene, such as the ‘shorty’ word that he sings in ‘2000 Watts’ which was a very popular slang term at the time that referred to an attractive woman.

They also wanted to change him stylistically, so they hired a team of new fashion designers specifically for him.

Sony Music wanted from him to get rid of the relics of his past glory (such as, his white socks, his sparkling boots, his fedora, the tape on his fingers, etc), and instead to create a brand new, modern stylistic image for him.

I somewhat believe this due to the YRMW short film, but have you got any source for this?

 

[AlwaysThere]

They ordered his producers (who were working with him on the ‘Invincible’ album) to not let him record at all on that album (or, at least to minimize) some of his vocal trademarks again (such as, his ‘hee-hee’s’, his ‘hoo-hoo’s’, or even his ‘aaawww’s’).

They also forced him to use certain modern, slang words (on that album) that the younger generation was very familiar with at the time especially in the hip-hop scene, such as the ‘shorty’ word that he sings in ‘2000 Watts’ which was a very popular slang term at the time that referred to an attractive woman.

I don't know about either of these.

"2000 Watts" was co-written by a then-23-year-old and was never meant to be recorded by Michael; the usage of slang was almost certainly there to begin with. Furthermore, the only other early-2000s lingo on the album is in the "You Rock My World" intro ("She's bangin'! She's off the hook!"). Two instances of slang does not a pressured action from Sony make.

Also, while I do recall hearing that Rodney Jerkins tried to quell Michael's vocal trademarks (which, if true, is delightfully ironic seeing that the only two "hee hee's" on the entire album are on songs Jerkins produced), I don't quite believe that Sony requested it. Michael's vocal ticks and stylemarks are absent from most of the Invincible era recordings; I can only think of three off-hand ("Invincible," "Privacy," and "Another Day"). Seems to me that MJ was just not doing them as much.

 

[Electro]

... but have you got any source for this?

mj_frenzy does not need sources.

According to sources, it is a known side effect to an enormously inflated self, that enables to receive these kind of stories directly through the ether.

 

[ScreenOrigami]

 

[mj_frenzy]

:hysterical:

Great sarcastic comment!






Wait, I think you're damn serious. It's still entertaining though.

I somewhat believe this due to the YRMW short film, but have you got any source for this?

I don't know about either of these.

"2000 Watts" was co-written by a then-23-year-old and was never meant to be recorded by Michael; the usage of slang was almost certainly there to begin with. Furthermore, the only other early-2000s lingo on the album is in the "You Rock My World" intro ("She's bangin'! She's off the hook!"). Two instances of slang does not a pressured action from Sony make.

Also, while I do recall hearing that Rodney Jerkins tried to quell Michael's vocal trademarks (which, if true, is delightfully ironic seeing that the only two "hee hee's" on the entire album are on songs Jerkins produced), I don't quite believe that Sony requested it. Michael's vocal ticks and stylemarks are absent from most of the Invincible era recordings; I can only think of three off-hand ("Invincible," "Privacy," and "Another Day"). Seems to me that MJ was just not doing them as much.

Michael Jackson in the early 2000s was about to undergo a radical change of image in order to promote his new album.

That was a well documented fact around that time:

“…According to [fashion] stylists hired for recent Jackson photo shoots, Sony insists that fashion consultants sign a contract agreeing not to outfit the star in his old style relics…” (‘King of Pop’ Magazine, Issue 26)

Rodney Jerkins also confirmed that:

“…No more socks and gloves … he needs to change, come out totally fresh…” (Rodney Jerkins)

One of those stylists was also the American, female fashion stylist Tameka Foster hired by Sony with having a duty to make him look a bit more regular with a more subtle vibe.

Stylist Jamie Kimmelman was also hired by Sony in order to dump Michael Jackson's androgynous style and theatrics.

You can find that information also on issues (from that period) of the American ‘Entertainment Weekly’ magazine.

As those magazines reported, many of Michael Jackson’s fashion staples (military epaulets, single sequined gloves, etc) had to beat it from his wardrobe at Sony’s request.

Part of that change was also the abandonment of his vocal trademarks and at the same time the use of some modern, slang words on the ‘Invincible’ album (Rodney Jerkins confirmed that, as well).

 

[NatureCriminal7896]

To answer your question, i do believe it was suppose to came out in 1999 from hearing about it before. so i'm not really sure about it. but it was recording somewhat around 1999 i think.

I didn't know Invincible was gonna be his last album thanks for pointing that out. I wouldn't be surprise if it really was because it really felt like it was. it's all half of sony fault.

invincible is an great album in my opinion.

 

[NatureCriminal7896]

Remember Michael had two diseases. it wasn't his fault that sometimes he looked tired or sick not to mention he was on drugs for his head and sleep. I agree he didn't look good sometimes. but he had so much going on with him. I think getting ready the new millennium did kind of put a toll on him.

not to mention he was getting older.

 

[NatureCriminal7896]

Everyone who keeps talking about all the drugs MJ was supposedly taking should seriously take a few minutes to look up “Lupus fog”.

Thanks. I didn't know it that was apart of his lupus. that explains a lot. and the drugs he was taking made it kind of worst. I didn't know he had it that bad. bless him.

 

[dam2040]

invincible is an great album in my opinion.

Agreed. Speechless & You Are My Life are 2 of MJs most beautiful songs.

 

[NatureCriminal7896]

We don't know Michael personally so we can not say if he was suicidal or not. he was depressed half of his life due to the lies etc. but I don't think he was ever suicidal. he had family, kids, friends, and fans who cared about him so I doubt he was suicidal but none of us was close to him.

he had a big number on this earth. I wouldn't he surprise if he did have thoughts. it isn't the answer but I know the feeling sometimes. may he r.i.p

 

[SmoothCriminal1995]

Getting back to Invincible.

I do believe Michael made a mistake, losing his own unique style in the shuffle. He had too many cooks in the kitchen

The songs on the whole are always missing something, whether it be his own background vocals, better written bridges lyrically and dare I say it even Mike's vocals aren't as on point as they always were. His 98/99 vocals are still amazing, especially the 98 vocals with Dr Freeze but his 2000/01 vocals feel so strained and forced at times. I do wish we had more tracks from 98/99 sessions because his voice sounded so cool and adult, it sounded effortless like a natural progression to what his voice was bound to sound like on a 40 year old superstar.

It didn't feel like a Mike album to me, I wish he would have continued working on the demos he had begun like, Hollywood, Beautiful Girl, Blue Gangsta (needed a bridge in my opinion) and a few others that were almost tossed aside for other tracks.
The album just felt like Michael trying to be MJ instead of him being himself (if that makes any sense) some of these songs just don't sound like were Mike, they sounded like an, Usher or Timberlake track.

I feel MJ needed to work smarter not harder, make more records like Whatever Happens, YRMW, Break Of Dawn and Speechless. More RnB/funk vibes and less computerised tech sounded because that's not the Mike I grew up knowing and loving.
Mainly focus on working on his self written tracks and finishing them instead of going with Darkchild written tracks. Work more like he did with Teddy on Dangerous, were he wrote the lyrics and started the songs and then brought Teddy in to make them more comtempary (to use MJ's words in the 94 deposition)

Just my thoughts, this is an interesting topic and I wanted to get back on topic a bit

 

[NatureCriminal7896]

Like others said I think it was because we was going into another millennium. let's face it Michael had to change up alittle because the world was changing. which I find pretty much normal because he did it the late 70's, the 80's, and the 90's. he couldn't keep using the same formula. yes Michael had his own style but he still had to somewhat get with the times.

invincible is a early 2000's album. it feels like one from listening to the album. while I feel it was good to change up his style just a little like he did with his other albums. I do feel he did kind of focused too much being relevant.

mostly all his fans was grow up with kids on their own and some didn't even know Michael until this album was made. sadly sony didn't promoted as much they should of have.

while i'm one those people who says stick what you are good with. i'm also one those people who says try to be alittle relevant.

early 2000's Michael feels like a different Michael but I love this era. he seem more "mature" which some fans called it. he in his 40's he seems more "grown up".

invincible did feel more of a early 2000's grown up album. if that what Michael was going for, he achieve it in my opinion. I just wish it was promote it more when it was release. it's good to know people are listening to it more etc.

 

[ChrisC]

Don't believe this about Sony's orders.

First of all, where does a record company get off telling a veteran world class singer how to sing?

But above all else, I believe the relics they act as if MJ was holding onto were all ditched post 1993 anyway. The music from HIStory and the music videos all dispensed with that in terms of style and image. The only place they were maintained was the HIStory tour. And it would be fair to say were evident again in the YRMW video.

 

[Electro]

Michael Jackson in the early 2000s was about to undergo a radical change of image in order to promote his new album.

That was a well documented fact around that time:

“…According to [fashion] stylists hired for recent Jackson photo shoots, Sony insists that fashion consultants sign a contract agreeing not to outfit the star in his old style relics…” (‘King of Pop’ Magazine, Issue 26)

Rodney Jerkins also confirmed that:

“…No more socks and gloves … he needs to change, come out totally fresh…” (Rodney Jerkins)

One of those stylists was also the American, female fashion stylist Tameka Foster hired by Sony with having a duty to make him look a bit more regular with a more subtle vibe.

Stylist Jamie Kimmelman was also hired by Sony in order to dump Michael Jackson's androgynous style and theatrics.

You can find that information also on issues (from that period) of the American ‘Entertainment Weekly’ magazine.

As those magazines reported, many of Michael Jackson’s fashion staples (military epaulets, single sequined gloves, etc) had to beat it from his wardrobe at Sony’s request.

All that - the "well documented fact" seems to be solely based on that ONE single Entertainment Weekly article:

Stylists plan Michael Jackson's makeover
It's out with the glove and in with the... cornrows?

February 26, 2001 at 05:00 AM EST
by Evan Serpick and Bob Cannon

As Michael Jackson prepares to launch version 4.0 of himself, many of his fashion staples — military epaulets, single sequined gloves — have beat it from his wardrobe. By mandate. According to stylists hired for recent Jackson photo shoots, Sony insists that fashion consultants sign a contract agreeing not to outfit the star in his old style relics. (Sony’s Michele Schweitzer downplayed the label’s role: ”Many artists have a standard contract when you do a photo shoot.&#8221

So what should the 21st century Jack0 look like? No more socks and gloves, insists Rodney Jerkins, who’s worked on Jackson’s new album. ”He needs to change, come out totally fresh.”

Tameka Foster, a stylist for Lauryn Hill and Toni Braxton, suggests a more subtle vibe. ”He’s always been larger than life. He needs to be a bit more regular.” Her suggestion? Cornrows and clothing that’s ”halfway between hip hop and haute couture.”

Jamie Kimmelman, an image consultant for Shania Twain and others, would dump the androgynous theatrics. Stealing a page from the recent men’s fashion shows, Kimmelman urges ”a return to gentlemanly elegance…impeccably tailored suits, but with a bright orange shirt and tie, and a lining [that] is bright orange satin, so it’s not a boring pinstriped banker’s suit.”

https://ew.com/article/2001/02/26/stylists-plan-michael-jacksons-makeover/
​

Even the quote you credited the 'King Of Pop' magazin for, actually comes from this same Entertainment Weekly article. But that might be down to good old copy & paste journalism by that British fanzine.


So let's take a closer look:

Reading that they write (in 2001) that "many of his fashion staples — military epaulets, single sequined gloves — have beat it from his wardrobe", and looking at the image to that article, it becomes clear that their visual perception of Michael Jackson was (deliberately or not) stuck in the 1980s Thriller days.

But had he looked like that in the previous decade during Dangerous or HIStory? Nope.

This ignorant perception might be expectable from non-fans and such USA-based boulevard journalists, but not from Michaels own record label, who definitly should know better.

You really believe Sony would intrigue to make Michael get rid of the single sequined gloves although he had not worn those (outside of the Billie Jean performance) since the BAD era? That makes no sense.

Michael by himself reinvented his look for every album with the help of talented designers/stylists. No need to force.

That Entertainment Weekly article offers the solution for a problem it creates.
And "According to stylists" is what it goes down to.

Before the HIStory album there were also reports that Michael was about to reinvent his image and look etc. This had become something to expect from Michael Jackson with every new album.

The comments from Rodney, Tameka Foster and Jamie Kimmelman are just that. Entertainment weekly probably simply reached out to them for a quote on Michaels style. They don't confirm anything Sony.

Part of that change was also the abandonment of his vocal trademarks and at the same time the use of some modern, slang words on the ‘Invincible’ album (Rodney Jerkins confirmed that, as well).

Feel free to provide reports and quotes that actually support this claim.
(At least hinting that it was not completely down to Michaels own will in the first place.)