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The Discussion of MJ's Unreleased Tracks

MJ5 said:
"Unfortunately for diehard Jackson fans, it’s likely Musgrove will be one of the few people to ever hear these tapes. He and the attorney he brought on approached the Jackson Estate with their findings earlier this year. The estate, who Musgrove says did their own research into the tapes, declined to purchase the tapes for an unknown reason, but did provide him with an official letter stating that the estate does not claim ownership.

They make it clear in the letter, however, that he and anyone else who might purchase these tapes down the line do not own the copyright on the recordings or the compositions, the estate does. Essentially, these tapes can never be released publicly."
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When has that ever stopped a leak. We can make a entire album with the leaks we have alone. Branca ol stingy ass don't wanna give us nothing.
 
I gotta say, my interest for the Bryan Loren tracks aren't all that high but it's always nice to learn about new titles, and to hear they were in fact recorded by Michael on top of that. Seems like the estate has more than enough material to cover up to multiple Dangerous re-issues and that's with BL tracks alone, why have they shown zero interest in doing anything with all these songs is beyond me.

Getting confirmation on the state of completion of "A Pretty Face Is" is amazing news, probably the biggest highlight in all of this to me. Just goes to show how we'll never really know about what's in the vault, it's truly a bottomless pit.
 
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kelley said:
why did they refuse to buy them. They should be buying anything with michaels voice on it.

If they could pay millions for those crappy FAKE cascio tracks they should buy these.
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They are not buying the work tapes because they are in possession of the songs already.
Look at those tapes as copies.
Nobody is legally allowed to release / leak them, the estate has the publishing rights.
They have the masters for sure.
 
The reason why Branca keeps turning these tracks down is beyond me. Fine, they're far from being the best MJ tracks, but they're over a dozen legit tracks with legit vocals. If anything, they could make up one or two albums by themselves, allowing his old wrinkly arse to save the stronger, more important tracks in the vault for a later time.
 
MJbr2 said:
The reason why Branca keeps turning these tracks down is beyond me. Fine, they're far from being the best MJ tracks, but they're over a dozen legit tracks with legit vocals. If anything, they could make up one or two albums by themselves, allowing his old wrinkly arse to save the stronger, more important tracks in the vault for a later time.
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Exactly, MJ put much work into this songs, he liked them. Ignoring those songs is like ignoring a part of his life. They are maybe not as good as other songs, but they would be perfect for an Dangerous reissue to show the other direction the album went to originally.
 
SmoothGangsta said:
Pretty interesting. Hopefully the estate refusing to purchase them does mean they already have the original recordings.
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MJJuniorSinceMW said:
They are not buying the work tapes because they are in possession of the songs already.
Look at those tapes as copies.
Nobody is legally allowed to release / leak them, the estate has the publishing rights.
They have the masters for sure.
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Would be nice if they would just confirm that. 🤨
 
MJbr2 said:
The reason why Branca keeps turning these tracks down is beyond me. Fine, they're far from being the best MJ tracks, but they're over a dozen legit tracks with legit vocals. If anything, they could make up one or two albums by themselves, allowing his old wrinkly arse to save the stronger, more important tracks in the vault for a later time.
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Everything will be released at some point as long as there is any money to be made. With all other dead celebrities, everything always comes out at some point. What Branca says or does in 2024 is not a prediction of what the Estate will do in 2034, 2044, 2054 or beyond.
 
They really don't want to do a Dangerous Expanded Version like they did Thriller 40 and Bad 25 lol.
 
kreen said:
Everything will be released at some point as long as there is any money to be made. With all other dead celebrities, everything always comes out at some point. What Branca says or does in 2024 is not a prediction of what the Estate will do in 2034, 2044, 2054 or beyond.
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This is why I said Branca and not Estate. You're absolutely right. The whole gatekeeping problem comes from his management concept. Once he's out of the picture, who knows.
 
AlwaysThere said:
In 2024, I think Dangerous and Invincible have both gotten enough of a public reappraisal to justify a reissue treatment. I could somewhat understand the hesitation in the early 2010s, but TikTok has given those albums new life. I see no reason to not go all out.
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With all due respect, what the heck is there in terms of material for a Invincible reissue? Should they just recycle already used outtakes and put them as bonuses?
 
MJbr2 said:
With all due respect, what the heck is there in terms of material for an Invincible reissue? Should they just recycle already used outtakes and put them as bonuses?
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  • Demo/alternate versions of album tracks
  • Alternate versions of outtakes we’ve already heard (e.g., the 1998 demo of “The Way You Love Me”/“What You Do to Me” with yodeling, the original demo of “Another Day”)
  • Unreleased songs, whether or not they have vocals (e.g., “Monster,” “Bio,” “Ekam Satyam,” “That,” “Get Your Weight Off of Me”)
  • Other songs we likely don’t know exist (please don’t underestimate this—don’t forget that we just learned the titles of three new Bryan Loren tracks yesterday)
There’s plenty of material for an Invincible reissue.
 
Bill really should release his session calendar for Dangerous

Each of these songs/releases/leaks has a story that I've told. There are dozens of day roughs done after any experiment or overdub.

As far as I can tell, form my journals, IYDLM last mix was to 1/4" meaning I intended a serious mix - was 6-5-91
But I made "improvements" for Xscape in 2009, there is a serious mix done then.

MB was 4-8-91 @ Toad Hall from 1/4" and as I've said, the estate released that one by simply looking for the last date, did not contact me about it. There should be dozens of other mixes some might be quite different.

I've told the heartbreaking story of Earth Song. The only version I support is the one that went to NY where MJ had that jazz guy "work" on it, and apparently didn't improve it because it' released essentially the same.
 
AlwaysThere said:
(please don’t underestimate this—don’t forget that we just learned the titles of three new Bryan Loren tracks yesterday)
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I'm starting to think there might be more titles out there that we don't know rather than ones we already know of. Just this year alone we learned of:

Climb The Mountain
I Love You
A Nice Day To Get Away
Hey Girl
Hich Hiker
Can't Come Back
Climb The Highest
Looking Over The Rainbow
Don't Talk Behind My Back
A Way With Words
Choir Song
Green Hornet Groove Soundtracks
She's Got It Baby
Scream-O-Blaster
Epic Song
Trash Can Song
Africa Groove
D.N.A
Circles
Tim & Bob Song #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7

And then in 2023 we got:

The Choice
Dancing For Love
Love Heals
Heaven With A Smile
Girls, Girls, Girls
Earth Love
Miami Vice



And I'm sure all of this is still just scratching the surface lol
 
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AlwaysThere said:
  • Demo/alternate versions of album tracks
  • Alternate versions of outtakes we’ve already heard (e.g., the 1998 demo of “The Way You Love Me”/“What You Do to Me” with yodeling, the original demo of “Another Day”)
  • Unreleased songs, whether or not they have vocals (e.g., “Monster,” “Bio,” “Ekam Satyam,” “That,” “Get Your Weight Off of Me”)
  • Other songs we likely don’t know exist (please don’t underestimate this—don’t forget that we just learned the titles of three new Bryan Loren tracks yesterday)
There’s plenty of material for an Invincible reissue.
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I'm not sure I agree with "plenty", but I see your point. While I don't have any interest in the stuff that are grooves or really unfinished vocally, I understand it does cater to some people.

I wouldn't mind having all the 1998/99 tracks compiled together in one place for convenience, which would also be a chance to make justice to songs such as Fall Again. It's so unfair such a beautiful track is lost in that pit called TUC.
 
MJbr2 said:
The reason why Branca keeps turning these tracks down is beyond me. Fine, they're far from being the best MJ tracks, but they're over a dozen legit tracks with legit vocals. If anything, they could make up one or two albums by themselves, allowing his old wrinkly arse to save the stronger, more important tracks in the vault for a later time.
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Prince's estate puts out crap songs all the time.

I'm sure anything Michael recorded is much better than most of that.

They should just release it all. Branca isn't getting any younger.
 
kelley said:
Prince's estate puts out crap songs all the time.

I'm sure anything Michael recorded is much better than most of that.

They should just release it all. Branca isn't getting any younger.
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I like the Loren tracks myself, but they're objectively below average.
Well, the Prince estate is run by people who see there's money to be made from archival, anthology-type releases, while Branca wants to focus on the mainstream public strictly, as if MICHAEL JACKSON needs any more publicity to get new people to listen to his songs and get to know his work.
Also, Branca getting older is amazing. Means less time until he's got to be replaced by some new heads.
 
MJbr2 said:
I like the Loren tracks myself, but they're objectively below average.
Well, the Prince estate is run by people who see there's money to be made from archival, anthology-type releases, while Branca wants to focus on the mainstream public strictly, as if MICHAEL JACKSON needs any more publicity to get new people to listen to his songs and get to know his work.
Also, Branca getting older is amazing. Means less time until he's got to be replaced by some new heads.
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I mean, not to be a pro-estate junkie here, but the fact that MJ’s posthumous projects have single handedly out-peaked and out-sold basically everything the Prince estate has done kinda speaks to the fact that their methodology is working.

Not saying that the estate shouldn’t also throw us a bone every now and then, or that every project has been good or worthwhile. But there’s absolutely and objectively value in doing things for the general public to sustain MJ’s legacy. That’s how you keep artists on top.
 
Not sure if I am just having a brain melt but I didn't notice this part in the article before.

In response, the Estate clarifies to THR that these tracks are not “new” as the master recordings are currently housed in the Estate’s vaults. “The Estate of Michael Jackson was presented with DAT copies NOT master recordings of Michael’s music, and we confirmed that the actual master recordings were in fact already located in the Estate’s vaults,” says a rep for the Estate. “It should be clear to all that ownership and rights of exploitation to the recordings remain vested in MJJP Records and that nothing commercial or otherwise can be done with the DAT copies.”
 
AlwaysThere said:
I mean, not to be a pro-estate junkie here, but the fact that MJ’s posthumous projects have single handedly out-peaked and out-sold basically everything the Prince estate has done kinda speaks to the fact that their methodology is working.

Not saying that the estate shouldn’t also throw us a bone every now and then, or that every project has been good or worthwhile. But there’s absolutely and objectively value in doing things for the general public to sustain MJ’s legacy. That’s how you keep artists on top.
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I've been there dozens of times, but here's one more: you can do things for the public AND for collectors/niche releases. One DOES NOT exclude the other. You can put projects to appeal to everyone. That is something the Prince Estate does: although they also stick to his 80s albums, every SDE reissue has bonus tracks AND a concert recording along with the main record.
You're an advocate of the Estate's current management, so we don't see eye to eye. I can only respect your views and say that I pray for the day I'll see Branca out.
 
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