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A.I Michael - opinions

Wow! Guys it's so cool to talk with somebody who is from another world. I mean, if you worked in 80s you are probably genaration X. It means that you are now 50-60 years old! You are older than my mother! And still you are MJ fan like me. You had opportunity to live when Michael was here! You could go on his concerts, speculate which music he'll release next! God, I'm so jealous
 
Beano Wild said:
you going back two years is whip lash, jesus. i trained a 2 hour dataset for 40 hours.
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Oh, you mean it took your system 40 hours to process the data? That's not usually how this stuff is reported, but ok. (If you had a computer that was twice as fast, it would take half as long)

Yeah, training on the whole MJ catalogue should definitely be the goal. I dunno the exact length of every song, but it's gotta be about 20 hours of music. And as I said, speech and live singing could be additional data.

zinniabooklover said:
I'm currently reading a book called 'Mood Machine: The Rise of Spotify and the Cost of the Perfect Playlist'.
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I've heard of the book.

Yeah, those playlists are just there to increase Spotify's profits (ie by paying less money to artists). It's just a scam, that's all. But that's nothing to do with AI or the quality of AI songs.

zinniabooklover said:
How much cheaper can it get? The royalty situation with streaming is already deplorable.
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Free, obviously.

Maybe royalties aren't the way forward. What next, if you hang a door in somebody's house, you get to charge them a dollar every time they go through it?

zinniabooklover said:
Who's going to pay the artists?
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It doesn't matter?

Music has been around since before the concept of money was invented. There will always be people who make music, whether they get paid or not. You're focusing on the wrong thing.

zinniabooklover said:
Leaving aside TS and Jay-Z, most musicians won't end up as billionaires, that's true. But Daniel Ek, Spotify CEO, is a billionaire.
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That's just the business model of a company that wants to make money from music. Again, you're focusing on the music industry. Don't do that. Focus on music. It doesn't matter if the industry dies. Music is what's important.

Masonh said:
What? Human beings invented AI only few years ago. How could you do that in the end of 90s
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Um, no? AI has been around since about the 1950s, it's not new, lol. If you look hard enough you can find references to artificial neural networks going back to 1795.

Again, in 1999, as part of a masters thesis, when I was 22, I programmed a system (actually 3 systems) that could study a pattern, learn the difference between different categories, and categorize new data accordingly to what it had learnt.

Masonh said:
No way. Computers appeared only in 1990-2000s
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I got my first computer in 1982.

Please look it up. Even using a Google AI search will tell you computers were around in 1837!

AdhesiveAaron said:
So glad that it's much faster today. One tap and it's sent in a split second.
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I'm not, lol. Making it so quick/easy led to waves of spam so powerful they forever ruined the entire system. Email today is unusable. I never touch it outside of work.
 
something's changed in the past month with regards to people's view on AI, I think there's alot of ignorance going around at the moment. I hope that some people that are against it come to Tom & I's panel at kingvention because we are going to properly discuss the history behind it & the work that goes into the tracks as well as what genuine good it can achieve.

(sidenote, i hope you all know that i think "generating" songs itself is pretty shitty unless its used as a sample or something, right)
 
R1chard said:
Yeah, those playlists are just there to increase Spotify's profits (ie by paying less money to artists). It's just a scam, that's all. But that's nothing to do with AI or the quality of AI songs. [...]
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Well, that's why I said I was going off-topic, lol.

As for the rest, all I am doing is expressing some sympathy for the artists that are not well served by the system that currently exists.
 
Beano Wild said:
something's changed in the past month with regards to people's view on AI, I think there's alot of ignorance going around at the moment.
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See, I'm not so sure. To me it seems pretty much the same as it has done over the last 3 or 4 years. I could be wrong bc my interest in this ebbs and flows. But I don't see loads more ignorance (or panic or whatever) compared to previous years.

Beano Wild said:
I hope that some people that are against it come to Tom & I's panel at kingvention because we are going to properly discuss the histroy behind it & the work that goes into the tracks as well as what genuine good it can achieve.
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You did a big report when you went to Brad's seminar. Are you going to do the same after your Kingvention presentation? I know it's not for a few months but it would be interesting.
 
zinniabooklover said:
See, I'm not so sure. To me it seems pretty much the same as it has done over the last 3 or 4 years. I could be wrong bc my interest in this ebbs and flows. But I don't see loads more ignorance (or panic or whatever) compared to previous years.
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Being pro generative AI has never been a popular opinion, especially among the people who are actually artists and create entertainment.
 
zinniabooklover said:
See, I'm not so sure. To me it seems pretty much the same as it has done over the last 3 or 4 years. I could be wrong bc my interest in this ebbs and flows. But I don't see loads more ignorance (or panic or whatever) compared to previous years.
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I personally am seeing people just being completely against the idea specifically on here alot more compared to about a year ago, when we were sharing creations and such for the fun of it. I think the MIB situation caused alot of that goodwill to go away personally, as even I myself was tired of it.

my personal thoughts is that generative AI has a genuine place in art, but to generate entire pieces on its own is not art as there is no meaning to it, unless you take that meaningless mess of nothing and make it into something by using it in/making it a project, it will never be "art".

synthetic AI uses a previous performance and uses a model trained on a dataset of another singer to synthesise the tone from the original file to the model, which i feel is a different can of worms entirely, and is the premise of what Tom & I are discussing on the 24th, and how there is real artistic integrity there compared to the generative AI.
zinniabooklover said:
You did a big report when you went to Brad's seminar. Are you going to do the same after your Kingvention presentation? I know it's not for a few months but it would be interesting.
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I'm not sure as i think after i get all my college essays done i wont want to write any more paragraphs for a while hahah
 
SmoothGangsta said:
Being pro generative AI has never been a popular opinion, especially among the people who are actually artists and create entertainment.
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Totally agree.

I've said it before, I'm much more worried about AGI than plain old AI - although I don't like any of it, actually. But Beano said there seems to be a lot more ignorance around all of this atm and I'm just not really seeing that. Feels pretty much the same as always to me.
 
zinniabooklover said:
Totally agree.

I've said it before, I'm much more worried about AGI than plain old AI - although I don't like any of it, actually. But Beano said there seems to be a lot more ignorance around all of this atm and I'm just not really seeing that. Feels pretty much the same as always to me.
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go to like page 25 of the thread and you'll see nothing but excitement & curiosity in the tech.
 
Beano Wild said:
[...] I'm not sure as i think after i get all my college essays done i wont want to write any more paragraphs for a while hahah
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Fair enough :ROFLMAO:

Beano Wild said:
I personally am seeing people just being completely against the idea specifically on here alot more compared to about a year ago, when we were sharing creations and such for the fun of it. I think the MIB situation caused alot of that goodwill to go away personally, as even I myself was tired of it.
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OK, that's fair. I dip in and out of this thread so I'm not following it closely. I do pay more attention to AI stuff in the msm but it's still low-key compared to my interest in other subjects.

Beano Wild said:
my personal thoughts is that generative AI has a genuine place in art, but to generate entire pieces on its own is not art as there is no meaning to it, unless you take that meaningless mess of nothing and make it into something by using it in/making it a project, it will never be "art".
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I disagree but, otoh, also find all of this really interesting. I'm still all over your 'ship of Theseus' reference. It made me revisit all the hoo-ha over Adrian Brody getting the Oscar after it was revealed that AI was used to tidy up his Hungarian accent. Seems like AI was only used to a minimal degree but it kicked off loads of angst. Which I can understand.

Beano Wild said:
synthetic AI uses a previous performance and uses a model trained on a dataset of another singer to synthesise the tone from the original file to the model, which i feel is a different can of worms entirely, and is the premise of what Tom & I are discussing on the 24th, and how there is real artistic integrity there compared to the generative AI.
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Ngl, this is where I tend to get a bit lost, lol.
 
zinniabooklover said:
I disagree but, otoh, also find all of this really interesting. I'm still all over your 'ship of Theseus' reference.
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That's something that i didnt want to really say either, but it genuinely did confuse the hell out of me and i am still suspicious of that specific leak. Im only now claiming it to be real BECAUSE of how good it sounds and because i want to use it in a mix of the song, not because i think those discrepancies arent there. I still hear them, and i promise im not going crazy.
 
I mean, this thread is mostly for people who don't have a problem with ai related content. If you dont want to see it, feel free to check out literally any other thread on this forum lol.

Looking forward to many future projects. @Beano Wild. Ignore the noise. You did a great job on wbss Tokyo.
 
SmoothGangsta said:
Thread is literally called AI Michael opinions and the OP is asking for people's opinions on AI, but ok.
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True, but like beno pointed out earlier, thread was mostly positive before trolls/noise flooded this thread. Users Calling mods to ban ai supporters is rediculous. The idea that being anti ai is the "popular opinion" is also wrong imo.

Join any gen ai sub on reddit. It's not unpopular. I honestly only see hate on this subject from loud Twitter accounts lol.
 
Robbsaber01 said:
True, but like beno pointed out earlier, thread was mostly positive before trolls/noise flooded this thread. Users Calling mods to ban ai supporters is rediculous. The idea that being anti ai is the "popular opinion" is also wrong imo.

Join any gen ai sub on reddit. It's not unpopular. I honestly only see hate on this subject from loud Twitter accounts lol.
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thats what i was thinking too, i wasnt going to comment on that at all but to say to unmod me over something like that is just so batshit šŸ˜­
 
Robbsaber01 said:
True, but like beno pointed out earlier, thread was mostly positive before trolls/noise flooded this thread. Users Calling mods to ban ai supporters is rediculous. The idea that being anti ai is the "popular opinion" is also wrong imo.

Join any gen ai sub on reddit. It's not unpopular. I honestly only see hate on this subject from loud Twitter accounts lol.
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I think anyone passing AI as real could possibly be considered for a ban , but anything else would be silly.

If something is correctly labeled as "AI" and someone has a strong issue with it, they can just move along and ignore. I hate AI generated content but it's here to stay and I've to live with it - my biggest issue is AI passed as real.
 
Beano Wild said:
go to like page 25 of the thread and you'll see nothing but excitement & curiosity in the tech.
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Using AI to split tracks and stuff is incredibly exciting to me still - Moises is such a great tool for that on an android phone, for example. I use it a lot for playing music.

I don't think anyone was expecting things like MJ taking a selfie on a smart phone during the HIStory Tour. It's creepy as shit to either create it or want it IMO. And the bad far outweighs the good on Youtube from a promoted or highlighted point of view.
 
@Beano Wild Any way for you to work with Jike M and make a version of T-Pain's Stop Playin with Jike's vocals overlayed with AI? I know there's a version of Jike singing the middle portion of that song, but it came out before AI vocals became a thing.
 
zinniabooklover said:
As for the rest, all I am doing is expressing some sympathy for the artists that are not well served by the system that currently exists.
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Meh. It doesn't matter.

If being a singer is suddenly seen as a job that pays below the minimum wage, and if that's the reason somebody doesn't want to be a singer any more, good riddance, they won't be missed.

Literally 99.999% of all the musicians who ever lived, made zero money from it. The reason people pick up a guitar is because they enjoy it and they want to learn. It's never because they want to make a career out of it. And having fun is literally the only valid reason to become a guitarist.

We really need to stop worrying about how Taylor Swift will make her next hundred million. People are passionate about music. It's only recently that people have started to be passionate about the music industry. And I find that bizarre.

Masonh said:
WTH? I mean, when people still used horses as vehicle? Impossible
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Seriously, just look it up.
 
R1chard said:
Meh. It doesn't matter.

If being a singer is suddenly seen as a job that pays below the minimum wage, and if that's the reason somebody doesn't want to be a singer any more, good riddance, they won't be missed.

Literally 99.999% of all the musicians who ever lived, made zero money from it. The reason people pick up a guitar is because they enjoy it and they want to learn. It's never because they want to make a career out of it. And having fun is literally the only valid reason to become a guitarist.

We really need to stop worrying about how Taylor Swift will make her next hundred million. People are passionate about music. It's only recently that people have started to be passionate about the music industry. And I find that bizarre.


Seriously, just look it up.
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You are an expert at not understanding why people like things.
 
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