Another idea for the Estate I could get behind

[filmandmusic]

So I was watching the Janet doc and when the segment came up of Janet and Michael writing scream there was a brief moment where Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis talked about Michael in the studio recording "scream". It wasn't shown but I'm pretty sure there is footage of that, the was my perception when watching the scene.
By now we should all just accept that the music has dried up, there are probably dozens and dozens of demo's and other unfinished recorded snippets but the Estate is clearly not very interested in doing something with those.

So what about a documentary of Michael Jackson the artist, in the studio. His natural habitat...
Over the years we have seen several small clips of Michael in the studio and we have heard a lot of people talk about how it is to work with MJ, we have heard dozens of anecdotes of what it is like. One thing always comes back. It is the complete commitment, professionalism and energy that MJ brought with him in the studio. Not once did I hear a producer not being in awe of watching Michael in the studio. Watching Michael laying down his vocals for all these iconic songs should all lift our spirits as fans.
Include as much as you can. The writing process, the discussions, jam sessions, interviews with people who worked with and on the songs and a lot A LOT of Michael singing. There are reports that Michael did a lot of full takes in the studio, singing his tracks from start to finish. This is as good if not better than any live concert… Focus on the artist and in my opinion genius artist.

We got glimpses on the 2 documentaries but it didn't focus on the music enough, it should be more in depth, stripping the music to its skeleton and building it up again, brick by brick. It is the only way to get into the mind of Michael the artist and to show the world he was more than that controversial figure.

I really hope there will be something that focusses on that after the movie releases and Taj's documentary drops.

 

[staywild23]

This would be absolutely amazing!!

 

[filmandmusic]

Absolutely priceless would be for example to have video of Michael getting Mick Jagger to do scales for hours before recording state of shock. You just know there is footage of that. That’s how boss Michael was, he had Mick right where he wanted, no half arsed quick recording, it had to be perfect, the way Michael heard it in his head! This is Mick Jagger we are talking about, one of the greatest artists in music history…
I wanna see how they interacted, how did this song came to be etc…

 

[Hiker]

Love the idea of focus on music making process rather than so much on his life. We don't get enough of that, just bits and pieces in interviews with other artists. They should have tonnes of footage of the sessions to make a documentary out of it. They can shift the focus from Michael in personal life, to Michael the artist. He is a flawless genius there. It would be so educational too.

 

[Hess]

It has always made me a little sad, that journalist never focused on the music. Most interviews with MJ is about him, they ask stupid questions about rumours, his lifestyle, plastic-surgery etc. Why on earth didn't the media focus on the creative proces. Made a documentary about the making of an album, studio footage, wathching MJ creating the masterpieces. It is so very sad that now MJ is dead we can never really ask him about all those questions that really mattered.

The media really had so many missed opportunitys wit MJ. Instead of showing him respect and be interested in the art, they focused on all the wrong things.

 

[zinniabooklover]

It has always made me a little sad, that journalist never focused on the music. Most interviews with MJ is about him, they ask stupid questions about rumours, his lifestyle, plastic-surgery etc. Why on earth didn't the media focus on the creative proces. Made a documentary about the making of an album, studio footage, wathching MJ creating the masterpieces. It is so very sad that now MJ is dead we can never really ask him about all those questions that really mattered.

The media really had so many missed opportunitys wit MJ. Instead of showing him respect and be interested in the art, they focused on all the wrong things.

Agree 100%.

Many things about Michael's life leave me sad, heartbroken, frustrated, angry. This right here, this is up there. I just don't understand it. I know Michael didn't like doing interviews. Perfectly understandable. Don't blame him at all. But he did do loads cos he had no choice. I accept that some of the interviews were probably kept deliberately short. Fine. No problem. But, even so, there would still be loads of opportunities to ask decent questions. And, presumably, if you asked some interesting questions maybe Michael would be more open with you the next time.

I don't identify as a fan and I have almost zero interest in his private life (it's none of my business). But where are all the great interviews? Where are they? There are dozens of great questions they could have asked him, hundreds probably. I actually make up interviews in my head, that's how frustrating this is for me. I'm not a journalist or any sort of writer. I could never have interviewed Michael for real but, seriously, how hard could it be? You've got this artistic genius in front of you, there are so many aspects to his work that you could focus on. My fantasy interview stretches to at least 2 - 3 hours! No, really, it's all there in my head. All filmed, of course, for the archives (I'm not mad, I promise, just frustrated). I never have romantic fantasies about Michael, I have interview fantasies!

Look at how fabulous and animated he gets in the 1999 MTV interview when he talks about the choreography for the zombies. The bit where he talks about the shoulder shrug and then he does it. Look at his face at that moment. THAT'S what you would probably get if you bothered to ask him some good questions. I mean, I find that MTV interview slightly frustrating because they focus so much on the Thriller era. He did do other stuff, people! But I can't complain too much. It is a good interview compared to most and they do get that amazing exclusive. Or maybe it isn't an exclusive but I haven't seen anything like that in any of the other interview clips I've seen. The Ebony / Jet interview is wonderful, I just wish it could have been a little bit longer.

There should be a whole archive stuffed full of amazing footage of Michael talking about all aspects of his art. Nothing intrusive, just the stuff he'd wanna talk about. Especially if interviews had been done at later stage like that MTV one. You know, he's looking back and reflecting on stuff rather than being quizzed about it when he's still in the moment. If I was his archivist I would have asked him to talk to me just so I could film it and add it to the archives. I would approach it as if it was an Oral History Project (which it kind of would be). It might not turn out to be a great product but it would be better than nothing, better than this empty space. I mean, in reality I don't think Michael was terribly interested in his archive, lol, but, hey, this is my fantasy!

To be fair, I have no idea if Oprah covered any of the stuff the journalists didn't. But I can't bring myself to watch her thing. Not gonna happen. I'm talking about proper journalists doing proper interviews.

Yes, he was shy, he was very guarded, he didn't like interviews and found them intrusive (maybe because they are) but he does change when he talks about his work. Even going through that horrible Mexico deposition in 1993. He's hating every minute of it, I'm sure, but when he's talking about his songwriting process he's just so into it. He's in the zone.

There was a brilliant, brilliant mind inside that head of his and the journalists just didn't seem interested.

 

[mj_frenzy]

@filmandmusic, there is a problem regarding a big part of such footage with recording sessions.

Michael Jackson obliged his collaborators (via confidentiality agreements) that everything that is filmed (by them) to be handed back to him when the sessions ended.

Given the fact that the singer had a tendency to lose stuff, this means that the whereabouts of a big part of that footage are unknown.

The same thing seemed to have happened, for example, with certain footage of the 'Dangerous' album recording sessions.

Only a very brief snippet of that footage apparently exists and is still available (the snippet that shows Bruce Swedien and Michael Jackson arranging the order of the songs of that album).

@Hess, it appears that Michael Jackson did want to be asked about such things in many of his interviews.

Giving interviews about him, his life-style, his plastic surgeries, rumours, etc, seems that it was a perfect way for him to gain even more public attention, publicity and exposure.

Controversial topics in interviews almost always help an artist to gain even more publicity and thus even more success.

Besides, Michael Jackson generally liked to remain cryptic when it came to the creation of his music and the origin and true meaning of many of his songs.

 

[Hess]

^^^

I do not think it was MJ's idea to have that focus - not after 1993 anyway.

But he could have given interviews to music magasins, to people who cared more about the music than the artist.
Had I been a journalist and I was given the chance to ask MJ all the questions I wanted, not a single one would be about all the rumours and surgery etc. - I might wanna hear how it affected him and his life to become father and some stuff about that. BUT what I really wanted to know was the creative proces. Hear more details about the creative creation of individual songs. fs Little Sussie - apparently MJ first worked on the song in the late 70's? but it was first finished in 1995. What thoughts went into that, how come he remembered the song and worked on it again for HIStory? And many many more questions I would think many fans would find interesting. Also about live performances etc.
I might even be so unpolite and ask into play-back. Maybe he had some good thought and explanations about why he choose it.

 

[zinniabooklover]

^^^

I do not think it was MJ's idea to have that focus - not after 1993 anyway.

But he could have given interviews to music magasins, to people who cared more about the music than the artist.
Had I been a journalist and I was given the chance to ask MJ all the questions I wanted, not a single one would be about all the rumours and surgery etc. - I might wanna hear how it affected him and his life to become father and some stuff about that. BUT what I really wanted to know was the creative proces. Hear more details about the creative creation of individual songs. fs Little Sussie - apparently MJ first worked on the song in the late 70's? but it was first finished in 1995. What thoughts went into that, how come he remembered the song and worked on it again for HIStory? And many many more questions I would think many fans would find interesting. Also about live performances etc.
I might even be so unpolite and ask into play-back. Maybe he had some good thought and explanations about why he choose it.

Yes. This is what I was trying to get at. MJ Frenzy makes some good points. And, yes, Michael was very media savvy. By the time of the Oprah interview he had more than 20 years of experience being interviewed. I'm sure he knew how he wanted to play the game.

But I would point again to the MTV 1999 interview as a decent example of what could have been. Not only is he talking freely about his work but he's offering anecdotes unprompted. It's not a question of getting Michael to offer up every minute detail of his creative process. I see no reason why he should be expected to do that. But I find it hard to believe that he wouldn't have been interested in talking about aspects of his work in more detail than usual.

Also, if there was a bunch of interviews in the archives, that would be part of his legacy. The real legacy is his art, of course, but all the peripheral stuff counts, too. The 5 warehouses full of costumes and ephemera, that stuff is all important and a bunch of interviews would be a great addition. I mean, I understand the Estate isn't really doing anything with all that stuff and I don't want to derail this thread with talk about the Estate. I just mean, in my ideal fantasy world, a series of high quality filmed interviews with Michael would have huge cultural value and interest. If Michael hadn't died so young maybe he would have been interested in doing some extended interviews. Paul McCartney has just done his book of annotated lyrics. I'm not saying that Michael would have to do the exact same thing, I'm saying there are various ways that people can approach the cultural value of their legacy and how they can add to that. There is loads of scope for things that Michael could have done, if only he'd had the chance to live out his life. And I don't know how much of any of this type of stuff he would have wanted to do but I'd love to think he'd have been willing to do something.

 

[staywild23]

It kills me imagining all the potential of what might exist in the vault! But hopefully some day we will find out?

Either way a totally music-focused release would be incredible! Right now I am dreaming of a theatrical release of the bad tour - maybe performance footage blended with some behind the scenes stuff? I can’t even fathom how incredible it would be to see that in a theater. And just imagine how many new fans Michael would get!! It legitimately pains me to imagine this not happening some days lol.

 

[zinniabooklover]

It kills me imagining all the potential of what might exist in the vault! But hopefully some day we will find out?

Either way a totally music-focused release would be incredible! Right now I am dreaming of a theatrical release of the bad tour - maybe performance footage blended with some behind the scenes stuff? I can’t even fathom how incredible it would be to see that in a theater. And just imagine how many new fans Michael would get!! It legitimately pains me to imagine this not happening some days lol.

I know. The vaults. I can't think about them cos my head would explode.

I saw a little clip of a journalist going into one of the vaults with the archivist and I just wanted to sob. The journalist was being shown 'The Glove' and I'm sitting there going, 'yes, yes, but what about all this stuff? Has it been properly catalogued? Is there a database? Are these precious items being properly stored? Is the temperature being controlled?' I'm sure the answer to all of that is 'YES' but ... I dunno, it all looked a bit untidy to me. I was a bit startled. So I can't even really get into fantasies about what could be done with that stuff (not that I think the Estate is terribly interested but let's not go there), I'm more concerned with whether it's all being properly looked after. Although I did wonder if the poor archivist had anyone to help her. That's a lot of stuff to look after. Archives are not the tidiest places but they do usually look very organised.

Sorry! Got up on my soapbox there. I'm just bothered cos I don't feel completely confident that the stuff is being cared for as it should be although I don't want to malign the archivist. I don't know what difficulties she might be up against. I can imagine there might be a few.

Anyway. Interviews. The other thing that bothers me about interviews isn't just all the interviews that we never got (and nothing can be done about that now). It's also the ones that do exist. Was the Ebony / Jet interview really only 13 minutes? I'm sure it wasn't very much longer than that, you can sort of tell from what the interviewer says, but I wonder if there are any more minutes buried away somewhere. What about the MTV 1999 thing? I would have thought that one would be quite a bit longer than just 12m 45s. I mean, wouldn't you at least want to do 30 mins? 20 mins? The Molly Meldrum interview from 1996 is tiny but I can understand that so it doesn't bother me. Also, it's completely adorable so no complaints from me! It's the MTV one I don't understand. (I know these various interviews don't belong to the Estate so they wouldn't actually be in the vaults with all of Michael's stuff. I'm sort of conflating two separate things here.)

Yes, live stuff blended with backstage stuff, that would be great. I love behind the scenes stuff, can't get enough of it. I have my thoughts about TII but, overall, I did fall madly in love with it (not knowing all the stuff I know now). Watching a genius at work is amazing. Quite a separate experience from the live thing but just as legitimate, imo. I never saw Michael live (stadium shows are just not me) but seeing him bring his ideas into being is such a privilege. If we could watch him doing that when he wasn't under pressure from so many horrible problems and difficulties, that would be a beautiful thing.

You said, 'It legitimately pains me to imagine this not happening ...'

Yep, I hear you. My 'legitimate pain' is centred more around interviews that never happened but, yeah, same thing. And I'm not actually obsessed about this interview thing because there's no point. I'm not a crazy person. But the thought does occasionally pop into my mind and then, yeah, it's like you said, 'It kills me imagining all the potential of what might exist in the vault.' Couldn't have put it better myself.

 

[Hiker]

At risk of voicing unpopular opinion, I think Michael published his best work. What's in the vault either did not meet his standards or is still unfinished. As a fan of course I want to know everything that he was working on, the earlier versions of his published work, the songs in making, what direction he was planning to take for his music. Though I don't believe any mind blowing genius song is hidden in the vault.

The interview situation does sadden me. I would have loved to hear him talk more about his work, the creative process. Though, maybe he did not want to talk about it. At height of his career he could have commanded any channel to do a focus interview. Maybe I am just being naive, but to me it seems he chose not to talk too much about his creative process.

 

[zinniabooklover]

At risk of voicing unpopular opinion, I think Michael published his best work. What's in the vault either did not meet his standards or is still unfinished. As a fan of course I want to know everything that he was working on, the earlier versions of his published work, the songs in making, what direction he was planning to take for his music. Though I don't believe any mind blowing genius song is hidden in the vault.

The interview situation does sadden me. I would have loved to hear him talk more about his work, the creative process. Though, maybe he did not want to talk about it. At height of his career he could have commanded any channel to do a focus interview. Maybe I am just being naive, but to me it seems he chose not to talk too much about his creative process.

Yes, I'm OK with his lack of enthusiasm for interviews. There would be many reasons for that, all understandable. And when he was at the height of his career he had other stuff to focus on. I'm really talking about where we are now.

Michael didn't get the chance to live out his life and that's the worst part. Compared to that, the interview thing is completely unimportant. Nothing else would matter if Michael still had his life. But, if he was still here, I would like to think that, in time, he might change his mind about interviews and that type of stuff. I already mentioned Paul McCartney's book of lyrics. I think it's a great example. Paul M has always resisted doing an autobiography in spite of being asked countless times. Now he's done this book which is a much better idea. I have no interest in Paul McCartney but I think this is a fantastic project. Expensive to buy, more expensive than a conventional autobiography would be, but a fabulous thing to create. It got massive coverage in the UK press. I was gripped by all of it; I even kept one of the magazine features and I'm not even into his work. And then there's the Bob Dylan scrapbook. I haven't seen it but it sounds great. If Michael had lived I wonder if he, too, might have started to have similar ideas.

Yes, you could be right. Maybe Michael did actively choose not to talk too much about his creative process. OTOH, people do change, especially as they get older. Or his kids might have started quizzing him and he might have wanted to do something for them. Or Paris might have asked him stuff, now that she's a performer herself. I think Paul M is 75 or thereabouts. Maybe Michael would have to be that old before he'd be interested in documenting his career; artists do this type of thing when they get older. Michael did his two books but that was such a long time ago.

I agree. I doubt that there's an unreleased genius song lurking in the vaults. But my interest is more in how can the existing resources be used to add value and interest to Michael's legacy. And the regret that he's not here to take control of that.

I'll finish with an example from the MTV 1999 interview. I know I keep banging on about it but that's because we don't have too many others to choose from. Which is kind of my point.

Anyway, in the interview at approx 6m 50s (IIRC) he talks about working on the Thriller choreography. He talks about how they made faces in the mirror, trying to figure out the zombie mindset. And then Michael says something like, ' ... and I'd go to the studio sometimes* with monster make-up on, I love doing stuff like that ... ' Now all you fans might have already known that but it was new to me. It's a brilliant detail. I know he's a perfectionist but to have him illustrate for me EXACTLY how a perfectionist approaches his work was amazing. It's one tiny detail but so, so brilliant. Just so interesting. And I don't see that as being intrusive because it's his work not his personal life and he offered that anecdote quite freely, it wasn't prompted by the journalist.

(* he probably said 'sometime' but, y'know ... )

 

[zinniabooklover]

So I was watching the Janet doc and when the segment came up of Janet and Michael writing scream there was a brief moment where Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis talked about Michael in the studio recording "scream". It wasn't shown but I'm pretty sure there is footage of that, the was my perception when watching the scene.
By now we should all just accept that the music has dried up, there are probably dozens and dozens of demo's and other unfinished recorded snippets but the Estate is clearly not very interested in doing something with those.

So what about a documentary of Michael Jackson the artist, in the studio. His natural habitat...
Over the years we have seen several small clips of Michael in the studio and we have heard a lot of people talk about how it is to work with MJ, we have heard dozens of anecdotes of what it is like. One thing always comes back. It is the complete commitment, professionalism and energy that MJ brought with him in the studio. Not once did I hear a producer not being in awe of watching Michael in the studio. Watching Michael laying down his vocals for all these iconic songs should all lift our spirits as fans.
Include as much as you can. The writing process, the discussions, jam sessions, interviews with people who worked with and on the songs and a lot A LOT of Michael singing. There are reports that Michael did a lot of full takes in the studio, singing his tracks from start to finish. This is as good if not better than any live concert… Focus on the artist and in my opinion genius artist.

We got glimpses on the 2 documentaries but it didn't focus on the music enough, it should be more in depth, stripping the music to its skeleton and building it up again, brick by brick. It is the only way to get into the mind of Michael the artist and to show the world he was more than that controversial figure.

I really hope there will be something that focusses on that after the movie releases and Taj's documentary drops.

This.

I always thought that what I wanted was a series of in-depth interviews with Michael. And, in an ideal world, that would be great. But I've realised that I really want something else. Footage of him at work is even better. Every tiny video or audio clip, every photo of him in the studio is so magical. If we could have a decent documentary built entirely around that. No talking heads apart from the studio techs and songwriters that actually worked with him. I don't want to hear from people who grew up listening to his music. I just need stories from people who worked with him and know how to assess his genius to help us understand it even more.

Just think. There would be footage of Michael working alone but also studio footage of him with other people. Stevie, for example. Is there footage of him doing his backing vocals? In a heartbeat I would trade 6 in-depth interviews to see that on film

f&m, you mention the many anecdotes that are out there. So bring all of that together in one piece of work, a coherent piece of work that gives a detailed picture of Michael the creative genius. It would be fantastic and so interesting, so exciting, imo. The type of thing Brad Sundberg did in his 7 Songs 7 Stories series has just popped into my head. I'm not saying a doc would follow that actual pattern. A solid 30 minute slab from one person wouldn't work, obviously. But the stories those guys are telling and the way that they tell their stories? That's the kind of content I want to see. A well-conceived, well-edited documentary would be such a treasure.

I think I know perfectly well I've always wanted this. I just didn't think it through.

 

[zinniabooklover]

So I was watching the Janet doc and when the segment came up of Janet and Michael writing scream there was a brief moment where Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis talked about Michael in the studio recording "scream". It wasn't shown but I'm pretty sure there is footage of that, the was my perception when watching the scene.

I'm guessing this is the bit when they described him as turning into a 'Tasmanian devil'.

oh god, to be able to see that ...

 

[Snowbunny Sorcerer]

This book should be used as the primary source for any ''MJ in the studio'' style documentary.

 

[SmoothGangsta]

I would like a doc that is just mostly footage and talking about the music with the people that can actually talk about it. I don't expect that from The Estate though, seems they don't want to make a doc unless they can have a bunch of unrelated stuff and interviews in there.

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

I would rather they endorse Brad Sundberg and take the ticket prices down lower. That's the perfect way to appreciate MJs craft work and a meaningful concept.