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Butterflies - autobiographical?

SolAura

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I don’t know if anyone else has read Shana Mangatal’s book, but it just hit me like a ton of bricks that MJ is singing this song to her. 😲 Yes, I know he didn’t write the song, but I do believe he kind of summoned the song to him. Even before I realized this I was always struck by his vocal performance on this song and just how passionate and sensual it is. I’ve often joked that he sings that song with his whole pelvis. 😂 and, indeed he does. Anyone else who read that book agrees with my analysis? Gosh, I wonder how she feels when she hears it. That’s gotta be intense! 😳
 
MJ first wrote that song for Bubbles's shelved solo album in 1989. It was originally called "Bananas".
 
I stand by my post. lol. The shade thrown at poor Shaba by the fan community is so interesting, and amusing, to me. Not a shadow of a doubt in my mind that he was thinking of her when he sang this.
 
SolAura said:
I stand by my post. lol. The shade thrown at poor Shaba by the fan community is so interesting, and amusing, to me. Not a shadow of a doubt in my mind that he was thinking of her when he sang this.
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Shana invented a lot of stories.
And MJ didn't write Butterflies.
 
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I’m sure she probably made some shit up, and I definitely think that her perspective of what happened between them is pretty naive, but I also believe that they really did have a brief sexual relationship that MJ insisted that she keep secret.

I think most of the fan hate stems from an intolerance of the idea that MJ would behave in the ways that she described, or this idea that if it did happen she has no right to tell her story since MJ had sworn her to secrecy. But MJ was not some angelic being, he was as a highly intelligent, sensual and complex man who had a complicated relationship with women.

His late ex-wife who was the last to leave his coffin described him as “controlling and manipulative”. I’m fairly convinced that the broad strokes of Shana’s story are true largely because MJs behavior towards her is in fact manipulative and controlling as LMP described. If she were making it all up I think she would have presented MJ more favorably to lend credibility to the idea that she really was his “secret girlfriend” as she imagined herself to be. Instead, what she actually describes is clearly a prolonged but intermittent flirtation that progresses to a brief sexual fling. However, her own infatuation is such that she can’t see the full picture of what’s really happening between them and the limits of it.

Personally, I don’t find it hard to imagine any of what she describes happening. I think MJ was very much the kind of man who would have cultivated a secret sexual fling that no one knew about and which there is little physical evidence for given his insane level of fame and his intense desire for privacy while off stage.
 
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Not sure about how authentic SM stories are, but I did always feel like she looked like a young Diana Ross, and knowing MJs obsession with DR I can certainly see that he would be intrigued by SM if nothing else.

And we do know he did in fact have secret girlfriends based on the bodyguards book, what MJ himself wrote in his autobiography, and based on what others such as Liza Minelli and Pharrell Williams have said they have witnessed in interviews 🤷

What does SM say about how it ended? Did he just ghost her?

And yes, MJ was going for a very different vibe with his voice in Butterflies 🫠.
 
jasmine.uddin said:
Not sure about how authentic SM stories are, but I did always feel like she looked like a young Diana Ross, and knowing MJs obsession with DR I can certainly see that he would be intrigued by SM if nothing else.

And we do know he did in fact have secret girlfriends based on the bodyguards book, what MJ himself wrote in his autobiography, and based on what others such as Liza Minelli and Pharrell Williams have said they have witnessed in interviews 🤷

What does SM say about how it ended? Did he just ghost her?

And yes, MJ was going for a very different vibe with his voice in Butterflies 🫠.
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After the fling, yes. In so far as Shana comes across as sweet, loyal, naive, and eager to please, I can see how he might have been tempted to indulge the fantasy, however briefly, of an easy, uncomplicated sexual relationship with her after the mess with LMP and DR. But, of course, MJ was wise enough by then to know that their affair could only be a brief one if things were to remain uncomplicated between them. But she didn’t understand that though by her account it sounds like he tried to be honest with her that their relationship had no future and was only of the moment.

I guess I’m intrigued by her narrative because it presents MJ more in line with how I imagine him to be, namely much more worldly and grown than people gave him credit for. I think he pursued the Peter Pan thing as an attempt to balance out the world weariness which he felt at an early age as he was consistently described as having an old soul when he was just a child.
 
It appears that Michael Jackson never had a genuine, romantic relationship with a woman.

For example, here is what a musician (who knew Michael Jackson personally for many years) stated about him:

"I've known Michael [Jackson] since he was fifteen. I've never seen him with a girl [or a woman] in the romantic sense. Not even one in all the years I've known him. Nobody that I know has ever seen him with one either" (quote from the 'Unmasked: The Final Years Of Michael Jackson' book)

Note also that women who approached him, they later described him (during these brief encounters) as intimated and uninterested.

Regarding Shana Mangatal, her book has many inconsistencies, loopholes and ambiguities in the sections about her alleged affair with Michael Jackson.

For example, she avoids to provide exact dates of her alleged romantic meetings with him.

If these meetings actually happened, these would have been some very important events in her life (where a female fan has a romantic encounter with her idol), so she should have remembered the exact dates.

Check for instance the section about the Universal Hilton Hotel (California) in which she alleged that one of these affairs with him took place (no exact date is provided by her).

This also clearly shows that Michael Jackson did not sing 'Butterflies' with Shana Mangatal in mind.
 
mj_frenzy said:
For example, here is what a musician (who knew Michael Jackson personally for many years) stated about him:

"I've known Michael [Jackson] since he was fifteen. I've never seen him with a girl [or a woman] in the romantic sense. Not even one in all the years I've known him. Nobody that I know has ever seen him with one either" (quote from the 'Unmasked: The Final Years Of Michael Jackson' book)
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Ian Halperin is a piece of shit and to bring his book as an evidence is unforgivable for a MJ fan. Next time you'd quote Martin Bashir and Tom Sneddon?
 
t1mber said:
Ian Halperin is a piece of shit and to bring his book as an evidence is unforgivable for a MJ fan. Next time you'd quote Martin Bashir and Tom Sneddon?
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Ian Halperin concludes (in his book) that Michael Jackson was not a child molester.

Is this also unforgivable for a Michael Jackson fan?
mj_frenzy said:
It appears that Michael Jackson never had a genuine, romantic relationship with a woman.

For example, here is what a musician (who knew Michael Jackson personally for many years) stated about him:

"I've known Michael [Jackson] since he was fifteen. I've never seen him with a girl [or a woman] in the romantic sense. Not even one in all the years I've known him. Nobody that I know has ever seen him with one either" (quote from the 'Unmasked: The Final Years Of Michael Jackson' book)

Note also that women who approached him, they later described him (during these brief encounters) as intimated and uninterested.
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This was also confirmed by other sources, as well.

For example, John Randy Taraborrelli wrote:

"No one believed [that] he'd had romances with girls such as Tatum O'Neal or Brooke Shields, no matter how much he insisted he had" (John Randy Taraborrelli, 2009)
 
mj_frenzy said:
"No one believed [that] he'd had romances with girls such as Tatum O'Neal or Brooke Shields, no matter how much he insisted he had" (John Randy Taraborrelli, 2009)
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Did he try to ask Lisa Maria Presley? Oh wait, it contradicts with his narrative.
 
Oh my... remember, there are always two sides to every story, especially concerning romantic relationships. Ask two people who aren't together anymore what went wrong and you will hear two totally different stories in most cases.
 
Spaceship said:
PR stunt marriage
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That's what I used to think. But I have to say the things Lisa Marie kept saying in interviews about their marriage, even long after Michael passed away, do make me think it was genuine.
 
mj_frenzy said:
It appears that Michael Jackson never had a genuine, romantic relationship with a woman.

For example, here is what a musician (who knew Michael Jackson personally for many years) stated about him:

"I've known Michael [Jackson] since he was fifteen. I've never seen him with a girl [or a woman] in the romantic sense. Not even one in all the years I've known him. Nobody that I know has ever seen him with one either" (quote from the 'Unmasked: The Final Years Of Michael Jackson' book)

Note also that women who approached him, they later described him (during these brief encounters) as intimated and uninterested.

Regarding Shana Mangatal, her book has many inconsistencies, loopholes and ambiguities in the sections about her alleged affair with Michael Jackson.

For example, she avoids to provide exact dates of her alleged romantic meetings with him.

If these meetings actually happened, these would have been some very important events in her life (where a female fan has a romantic encounter with her idol), so she should have remembered the exact dates.

Check for instance the section about the Universal Hilton Hotel (California) in which she alleged that one of these affairs with him took place (no exact date is provided by her).

This also clearly shows that Michael Jackson did not sing 'Butterflies' with Shana Mangatal in mind.
Click to expand...

t1mber said:
Ian Halperin is a piece of shit and to bring his book as an evidence is unforgivable for a MJ fan. Next time you'd quote Martin Bashir and Tom Sneddon?
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Pretty sure I've been attacked by people here for calling this person out as a hater/Guilter.

I believe (as usual) I was told I was being paranoid, aggressive and many other things.
 
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