Is it the truth that Michael was forced by Sony to release Invincible album as soon as possible, giving him no opportunity to finish really good songs like Blue Gangsta, The Way You Love Me and so on? I just found the information, that he had to choose the most complete songs for Invincible album, because Sony made him hurry... Can it be a truth?
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Invincible album track-list
- Thread starter Richard76
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Still The King
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Well not quite because MJ started working invincible in 98,99 and spent alot of money and time so sony was not happy then when the album came out in 2001.
SilkySnare
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Really good songs are already on Invincible.
so you're claiming that it is the truth?
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Still The King
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Well thats what I have heard, but there is alot in the whole picture.
Hess
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MJ apparently presented SONY for his finale track-list, but they (SONY) wasn't satisfied and had MJ make changes.
Also, the album was delayed over and over again. SONY paid for expensive studios for MJ to record, but then MJ didn't show up. I ave heard SONY spend many many millions of dollars producing Invincible, but MJ was not really commited to the album and did not deliver to the planned time. So finally SONY lost patience and demanded MJ to hand over enough songs for an album. - MJ then becam angry at SONY so he would not renew his contract with SONY, meaning he would go look for another label. SONY therefore cut promotion short. They had already spend A LOT of money on the album. So promotion stopped, MJ went on his SONY kills, Tommy Motolla is the devil tour. Very embarrising really...
Mistakes was made on both sides for sure. - But yes, I have heard the story about SONY interfering with the track-list becuase there was songs they did not like. - If it's true or not I do not know.
Also, the album was delayed over and over again. SONY paid for expensive studios for MJ to record, but then MJ didn't show up. I ave heard SONY spend many many millions of dollars producing Invincible, but MJ was not really commited to the album and did not deliver to the planned time. So finally SONY lost patience and demanded MJ to hand over enough songs for an album. - MJ then becam angry at SONY so he would not renew his contract with SONY, meaning he would go look for another label. SONY therefore cut promotion short. They had already spend A LOT of money on the album. So promotion stopped, MJ went on his SONY kills, Tommy Motolla is the devil tour. Very embarrising really...
Mistakes was made on both sides for sure. - But yes, I have heard the story about SONY interfering with the track-list becuase there was songs they did not like. - If it's true or not I do not know.
Sony Music had a say on the album's final track list because the record company wanted potential hits.
That is why, some of the first songs that the record company kept (for the album) were 'Cry' and 'You Rock My World' because these songs had such potential.
The starting point of the conflicts between Michael Jackson and Sony Music took place in 2000 when the record company ignored his request and it did not give back to him the masters of his songs (i.e., mechanical copyrights of his previous studio albums).
The delay (on the singer's part) to deliver his upcoming 'Invincible' studio album to the planned time seemingly did not play a role, after all Michael Jackson in the past used to delay the releases of his studio albums and Sony Music had no problem at all with that.
It has also been said that Michael Jackson's refusal to support the 'Invincible' album with a world tour added fuel to the fire, which eventually also led to Sony Music's decision to abruptly cancel the rest of the promotion of that album.
but he didn't have a chance to complete songs, that could be real hits.
Hess
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I do not know much about it really. - So maybe all you write is totally correct.
BUT - SONY thinking Cry would be a big hit? I don't understand them really. - I do like the song. A anthem song. - Surely MJ hoped for a new MitM or Heal the World. - But Cry is nowhere near their quality IMO. - And I do really like Cry.
R. Kelly was a big name in 2000, maybe that's why they thought Cry could be a hit, otherwise I do not see great hit-potential really.
There sure was many issues between MJ and SONY in 2000-2002, but no one can say it was only MJ's fault or it was only SONYs fault. Mistakes where made by both parties...
BUT - SONY thinking Cry would be a big hit? I don't understand them really. - I do like the song. A anthem song. - Surely MJ hoped for a new MitM or Heal the World. - But Cry is nowhere near their quality IMO. - And I do really like Cry.
R. Kelly was a big name in 2000, maybe that's why they thought Cry could be a hit, otherwise I do not see great hit-potential really.
There sure was many issues between MJ and SONY in 2000-2002, but no one can say it was only MJ's fault or it was only SONYs fault. Mistakes where made by both parties...
analogue
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R. Kelly also wrote You Are Not Alone which was a big hit. Sony probably thought it would happen again with Cry
Mister_Jay_Tee
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Unbreakable and Whatever Happens are big hits. Heaven Can Wait is becoming a big hit literally right now, this second. Every other song from Invincible is trending every day now, come on.
Mister_Jay_Tee
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This is a good spot for me to bring up this lil factoid:
"Break of Dawn", "2000 Watts" and "Threatened" were excluded from the original Chinese release.
Imagine:
Unbreakable
Heartbreaker
Invincible
Heaven Can Wait
You Rock My World
Speechless
You are my Life
Privacy
Don't Walk Away
Cry
The Lost Children
Whatever Happens
As a record. Is that better or worse by a lot? To me it is missing.
Also, You Are My Life instead of Shout was a mistake to me, imo.
"Break of Dawn", "2000 Watts" and "Threatened" were excluded from the original Chinese release.
Imagine:
Unbreakable
Heartbreaker
Invincible
Heaven Can Wait
You Rock My World
Speechless
You are my Life
Privacy
Don't Walk Away
Cry
The Lost Children
Whatever Happens
As a record. Is that better or worse by a lot? To me it is missing.
Also, You Are My Life instead of Shout was a mistake to me, imo.
I said somewhere that Invincible didnt have any hit? Get a brain, man.... Its my favourite album
So he had do to it in hurry? Sony are such idiots.... PWN, SWLM, BG, X, - these songs could be a hit for sure! And they deserved to be a single with videoclip
i dont agree with you. Cry is a very good song. Just like Man in the mirror and HTW. I think it is even better
You are my life is a masterpiece. Michael loved this song.... its much better than shout
thiron
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No, on the contrary. MJ took several years more than planned and did not seem very motivated for the album at all (missing recording sessions, letting others write songs instead of contributing own stuff).
Seems like music just wasnt a priority to him between 1999 to 2001.
But during Invincible era he made more songs than in every previous era... So you are not right :/
SmoothGangsta
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Don't really buy the whole "Sony forced MJ to redo stuff" thing. Was MJ's choice to start working with Darkchild and scrap stuff he had been working on up until that point.
analogue
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I never said Cry was a bad song though
Mister_Jay_Tee
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I said somewhere that Invincible didnt have any hit? Get a brain, man.... Its my favourite album
Maybe you're just confusing? Or pulling my leg.
Mister_Jay_Tee
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I like the song a lot too. But I could still take or leave it. It'd be a great posthumously, tbh.
Prince Of Pop
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I kinda tend to agree with many that he took too long to make the album. There were rumblings of new material on the way in 1999. There were several news articles released (from confirmed sources) about different songs being worked on...some that didn't make the final cut, as far back as 1999..maybe even 98.
Too many people worked on it as well IMO. I his biggest mistake on this album besides hiring Rodney Jerkins (I think he's extremely overrated), is the fact he told Sony he had no intentions of renewing his contract with them. That was the beginning of the end, and of course that whole feud we know all too well about.
But yes, to answer the original question, when he presented some of his work to Sony, they weren't happy about it, and asked for changes, and they really started setting deadlines for him.
Too many people worked on it as well IMO. I his biggest mistake on this album besides hiring Rodney Jerkins (I think he's extremely overrated), is the fact he told Sony he had no intentions of renewing his contract with them. That was the beginning of the end, and of course that whole feud we know all too well about.
But yes, to answer the original question, when he presented some of his work to Sony, they weren't happy about it, and asked for changes, and they really started setting deadlines for him.
PurpleThriller
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Not true when considering the Bad era
Mister_Jay_Tee
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MJ started working on the next album in 1997. It took a long, long time to get Invincible done. And then he scrapped most of it to start over in 2001. It was kind of a crazy process. But there was no drama with Sony. That was because of the debate over his master's.
ChanceToDance
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Worse, Break Of Dawn and Threatened are the highlights of the album. Remove Heartbreaker as well and I'll lose my will to live lol.
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Spaceship
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MJ himself chose to shelve "Blue Gangster". He stopped working on it after 1999 because he wasn't satisfied with how it was turning out.
The same with "Xscape"; according to Rodney Jerkins, he wanted that one to be on his next album which never came out.
He had full control over what songs made it on the album. Sony only meddled when they tried to get "The Lost Children" taken off the album, but MJ put his foot down so it stayed. And it was MJ's decision to replace "Shout" at the last minute with "You Are My Life", which was recorded just a few weeks before the album's release.
Sony never forced MJ to delay the album; it was originally slated for 1999, but MJ chose to delay it multiple times. This resulted in Sony spending a ton of money for it, which aggravated them.
The same with "Xscape"; according to Rodney Jerkins, he wanted that one to be on his next album which never came out.
He had full control over what songs made it on the album. Sony only meddled when they tried to get "The Lost Children" taken off the album, but MJ put his foot down so it stayed. And it was MJ's decision to replace "Shout" at the last minute with "You Are My Life", which was recorded just a few weeks before the album's release.
Sony never forced MJ to delay the album; it was originally slated for 1999, but MJ chose to delay it multiple times. This resulted in Sony spending a ton of money for it, which aggravated them.
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Agonum
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I wonder what the reasoning could have been for those exclusions?
