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Restitution discussion removed from Cease and Desist letter thread

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Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

@Tygger

Ron Goldman debunked your indirect profit theory decades ago. When OJ Simpson formed a publishing company in the names of his two kids - aka indirect profit - Goldmans was able to prove that it was a shell coporation to funnel money to OJ - aka fraud. Court has agreed with Goldmans.

Courts and jurors aren't as stupid as you portray them. If there was a restitution, and Murray tried to funnel the money indirectly such as through his GF a lawsuit would have been enough to uncover his schemes.

and honestly this never ending debate about restitution, direct indirect profit is a moot point right now. There's no restitution and Murray is profiting either directly or indirectly it doesn't matter. Are you okay with it? That's the only question remains. and honestly it sounds like you are making excuses for Murray. Do you expect people to be okay with Murray talking just because according to you there's no way to stop an indirect profit? Perhaps you should just let people be angry with Murray.
 
Ivy, you are the “legal mind” here so you know more than anyone that restitution does NOT hinder indirect profit. If you did not, you learned something new when I stated it months ago. If that was clearly understood it would only mean another reason would be used to continue to harbor distaste for the Jacksons instead of this persistent, incorrect, and misinformed reason.

Again, Goldmans prevented FRAUD and FRAUD only not an indirect profit. Monies going to Alvarez is not FRAUD. It is an indirect profit that is not hindered by restitution.

You would have to requote where I stated courts and/or jurors were “stupid” or portrayed them as such. Good luck because I never said such a thing.

This is NOT the restitution debate thread and insinuating/questioning that I support anything that killer does in Michael’s name is simply a diversion from the topic of this thread. Even with restitution this interview would exist and the doctor would have profited indirectly leaving the Jacksons with no legal recourse. This thread would still exist and still not one person would have posted directly from the transcripts of this killer's interviews how he is in violation as per the estate’s letter including you.
 
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Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

Murray would still profit from these interviews whether there was restitution or not. Unfortunately he still has a legal right to earn a living.
 
Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

Had Restitution been sought by the Jackson's Murray would think twice about doing these interviews knowing he wouldn't be able to profit from it. Simple.
 
Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

StellaJackson, the truth is as it is; one has to decide if they can accept it or not. Regardless, it is still the truth.
 
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Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

WhoIsIt89 said:
Had Restitution been sought by the Jackson's Murray would think twice about doing these interviews knowing he wouldn't be able to profit from it. Simple.
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Only if that profit was simply direct would restitution hinder it.
 
Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

Tygger said:
Again, Goldmans prevented FRAUD and FRAUD only not an indirect profit. Monies going to Alvarez is not FRAUD. It is an indirect profit that is not hindered by restitution.
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Dear tygger , what you don't get is that no money would only and only go to Nicole Alvarez, it would have been funneled to Murray through her. That is the exact same FRAUD situation that was happening with money looking like being paid to OJ's kids on a company in their name but eventually would be used to his benefit. A judge and a jury saw that in OJ's case BEFORE it even happened. If you suggest that a judge and a jury could not comprehend that money being paid to Murray's GF would eventually benefit Murray too, if they can't comprehend that is a scheme to get around restutition then you are claiming they are morons. Jurors and judge's are a lot more smarter than you give them credit for, they demonstrated it at Goldman- Simpson case. That case also demonstrated that even in the case of a indirect profit there's an option for a fraud lawsuit.

and I made myself clear long before. No one would hold it against Jacksons if they seeked restitution but couldn't stop Murray's talking, indirect profit or whatever.Everyone knows restitution isn't automatic or perfect, we aren't idiots. What angers many here is that they didn't even try and gave Murray a free pass to trash Michael for profit. So you keep writing about indirect profit makes no difference, and the end of the day Jacksons did not even try. Trying and failing to stop him would be acceptable, it's the free pass that annoys majority here. and sorry your never ending rant about indirect profit doesn't change that fact. It also doesn't change the fact that Katherine explained not seeking restitution as "financial reasons" and "wanted money go to Murray's kids". Nope she did not say indirect profit couldn't be stopped, she said she did not want to take money from Murray.

PS: One note. Back in the day Goldmans was on Oprah (I believe) and she asked them if there would come a day if they will ever forgive OJ. They were offended by such question. Goldmans are a wonderful example of making life a living hell for the person that killed your son. They couldn't touch OJ's pension or his house and so on due to the laws, they had to pursue a lawsuit against OJ's indirect profit scheme/fraud, they needed to go to court to take ownership of OJ's watch(which turned out to be a fake) so restitution hadn't been perfect or easy for them either but it did not stop them from trying and never giving up.
 
Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

Ivy, no. Either you do not comprehend fraud Fraud and indirect profit are not interchangeable terms and they are not synonyms. You also are continuing to distract from the topic of this thread by discussing restitution when the topic is the estate's letter.

When Alvarez receives payment, it is an indirect profit for the doctor. The monies go DIRECTLY and legally to her and hopefully she and her child benefit. Alvarez chooses where the monies go. If she wants to gift it to the doctor or purchase items for him, it is her legal right. It is NOT funneled through the doctor. The same happened with his criminal defense team and the documentary's producers.

Again, if the family sought restitution, these interviews would still exist and some would still be upset the Jacksons, as mere mortals, could not move heaven and earth when they simply would not have any legal recourse because restitution does not hinder free speech OR indirect profit.

Why is it so difficult to cite the obvious violation(s) of the doctor as per the estate's letter? The letter has been praised so, why distract from it discussing the Jacksons and restitution here?
 
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Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

Tygger said:
You also are continuing to distract from the topic of this thread by discussing restitution when the topic is the estate's letter.

Why is it so difficult to cite the obvious violation(s) of the doctor as per the estate's letter.
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Fascinating, the double standard displayed here. (Do as I say, not as I do?)

Tygger said:
....some would still be upset the Jacksons, as mere mortals, could not move heaven and earth ...
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I wouldn't be upset at all if she'd tried and failed. (Despite your repetitions to the contrary, no one here thinks restitution would be 100% successful.) The point is that KJ DIDN'T bother to make ANY attempt at all to prevent Conrad Murray, the man who killed her son, from profiting off his crime because it would have reduced an AEG payoff. THAT is why we are upset. Forget moving heaven and earth, she didn't bother getting up off the proverbial couch.
 
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Re: Update: Estate sends cease and desist to Murray / From Estate Of Michael Jackson, Re: Conrad Mur

krikzil said:
Fascinating, the double standard displayed here. (Do as I say, not as I do?)
Click to expand...

No. It was multi-tasking. There were two conversations that were distinct from each other and now, there is one.
 
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