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The Michael Jackson Chart Watch

zinniabooklover said:
Ya think? Dang it! :(
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Yes because sales have only been tracked since 1991 and that is in the USA. Most of it just based on shipments.
Singles chart used to be compiled by contacting record shops who then would share what is selling well and what isn’t.

I especially find sales numbers of the 1950s and 1960s fishy. When you look at those charts it looks like only Elvis and The Beatles were popular which does not make any sense, there must have been more competition.
 
filmandmusic said:
Yes because sales have only been tracked since 1991 and that is in the USA. Most of it just based on shipments.
Singles chart used to be compiled by contacting record shops who then would share what is selling well and what isn’t.

I especially find sales numbers of the 1950s and 1960s fishy. When you look at those charts it looks like only Elvis and The Beatles were popular which does not make any sense, there must have been more competition.
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oh, I know all of this. Frankly, it depresses the hell out of me. I've said it before but I cannot get my head around the idea that it's shipment figures that seem to count and no-one really knows what the wretched sales figures are. I grew up in an era when a gold record meant you had sold 1 million copies (allegedly). It's crap having that shattered to pieces! 😖

Humans can build rocket ships but can't figure out accurate retail stats? It's crazy!
 
zinniabooklover said:
oh, I know all of this. Frankly, it depresses the hell out of me. I've said it before but I cannot get my head around the idea that it's shipment figures that seem to count and no-one really knows what the wretched sales figures are. I grew up in an era when a gold record meant you had sold 1 million copies (allegedly). It's crap having that shattered to pieces! 😖

Humans can build rocket ships but can't figure out accurate retail stats? It's crazy!
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They can now, sales figures are super accurate for decades now 🤓
I don’t think shipment numbers are all that bad to present sales numbers. If record companies have to keep pressing new cd’s or lp’s then it means sales are huge…
But of course in some cases it misrepresents, for example Invincible. It had a huge initial shipment because it was a new MJ record but it didn’t sell. I am sure shops are still selling Invincible albums shipped in 2001. When those eventually get sold you will not find Invincible in shops anymore because they never bothered pressing new copies.
 
filmandmusic said:
Thriller selling 1 million in The Netherlands is unlikely imo. It sold about 350 000 copies in Belgium and that is already a completely massive total only beaten by local artist Helmut Lotti and his Goes Classic albums.

BUT who’s to tell…
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Per Wikipedia, it sold 1.4 million there by 2001 with Pure copies.
 
filmandmusic said:
I know, I read it too but it seems an awful lot for a population of about 16 million and less in the 80s
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www.trouw.nl

Een ster in het land van lilliputters

Veertiger Michael Jackson probeert het weer eens. Het popfenomeen komt met een nieuw album, hoopt opnieuw gouden tijden te beleven, wil opnieuw schitteren. Maar wacht de wereld nog wel op het versleten idool uit de jaren tachtig, die al dertig jaar zoekt naar zijn verloren jeugd? Het publiek is...
www.trouw.nl www.trouw.nl

Apparently it sold 1,4 by 2001, which to me seems inflated since it was certified for 800,000 units in 1996.
 
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filmandmusic said:
I know, I read it too but it seems an awful lot for a population of about 16 million and less in the 80s
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It is not unlikely that it sold over 1 million copies.
Certified 8xplatinum, 800,000 back in 1996 and then Thriller 25th got a GOLD cert, 30,000 units in 2010.
It is a strong catalogue seller over there since 2001.
 
Piero said:
It is not unlikely that it sold over 1 million copies.
Certified 8xplatinum, 800,000 back in 1996 and then Thriller 25th got a GOLD cert, 30,000 units in 2010.
It is a strong catalogue seller over there since 2001.
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But the wiki article says 1.4 million and that is with 100% certainty false information.
 
filmandmusic said:
But the wiki article says 1.4 million and that is with 100% certainty false information.
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Ihave alaways thought that was an inflated figure anyway.

THRILLER is the best selling album ever in The Netherlands, btw.
 
@MJJSpotify2015

"SPOTIFY UPDATE! #MichaelJackson #KingOfPop "Invincible " (ALBUM) has surpassed 408M streams."

GVmQzr7WEAEwer3
 
filmandmusic said:
I know, I read it too but it seems an awful lot for a population of about 16 million and less in the 80s
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Well, the UK has a population of around 4.5 times the amount of NL, and sales of Thriller in the UK are around 4.5 million.
So, the NL sales figures for Thriller of 1 million are very similar per capita to the UK (and both countries are also very similar in terms of economic development etc.).

So, the 1 million sales figure for Thriller in the NL seems quite believable to me.
 
MonkeyCheater said:
Well, the UK has a population of around 4.5 times the amount of NL, and sales of Thriller in the UK are around 4.5 million.
So, the NL sales figures for Thriller of 1 million are very similar per capita to the UK (and both countries are also very similar in terms of economic development etc.).

So, the 1 million sales figure for Thriller in the NL seems quite believable to me.
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Good point
 
Hot Take: I don't really care about physical sales anymore. It mattered more in the pre digital age. But even then it was,, never actually a perfect measurement? Not really any different than streaming and the music videos


I pay more attention to those statistics.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Hot Take: I don't really care about physical sales anymore. It mattered more in the pre digital age.
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I go back and forth on this. My hot take is, idc about streaming figures bc it's all so nebulous (to me!). Someone picks a random number of streams and decides that is equivalent to x number of sales. And then the figure is changed. And then it gets changed again. One country includes radio play, another one doesn't. It's all meaningless, really. Plus, people streaming stuff for hours while they do other stuff? I know they have to engage more, now, and have a proper playlist so as to avoid the whole 'bot' thing but it still seems weird to me.

That said, when I see data for Invincible / Essential / Number Ones I do get madly excited, especially if the figures are for the UK. Or I get excited just bc it's so nice to see Michael still popping up in these charts but then I don't compare him to other legacy artists so I don't really know what it means. Elton John has got more monthly listeners on Spotify, iirc, but that's as much as I know.

Mister_Jay_Tee said:
But even then it was,, never actually a perfect measurement?
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Sadly, it would seem so. That said, it still rests on something tangible. If the sales were estimated based on shipping figures that still proves that a decent number of physical items were bought - even if some stock was left in storage somewhere not all of it would have been. Streaming something (often for free or for a tiny amount of money - does anyone even care about artists' royalties?) is very different to physically travelling to a record shop and putting down hard cash. It's just not the same thing.

Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Not really any different than streaming and the music videos
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Just so massively different I don't even know where to start, lol. The record you want is out of stock? Oh, you'll have to come back next week! And we did. :)

Mister_Jay_Tee said:
I pay more attention to those statistics.
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I don't usually pay attention to the actual stats but I do like to see Michael in a chart alongside Tyler, the Creator or Taylor Swift or whoever. I just find that so cool. He doesn't have any new products out. He's not around to tour, be on social media, do interviews or any of that. But he's still in the mix. With stuff like the Thriller Challenge to get a billion views for Thriller, it's more that I love the dedication and persistence of Michael's fans. I'll post stuff for that but it's more of a salute to his fans.

I've posted this before:

From a 1977 bio of Elvis, page 70 - 71:
"Fan clubs for Elvis at the same time were organised throughout the country with membership cards. The instructions to Elvis Fan Club members read: 'To be members in good standing each week you must send out five postcards to a disc jockey in your vicinity, and follow it up with ten phone calls a week to the radio stations, demanding Elvis' records.'

"Girls formed Elvis Presley clubs of their own which met at their various homes for Elvis - record sessions. They would scream and cry at every record with over-wrought emotions."

(The quotes are included in - 'Elvis: Lonely Star At The Top' by David Hanna - but originally come from a book by May Mann called The Private Elvis).

Here endeth my TED talk!
 
Also some monthly stats:

@kxthrills

"Michael Jackson’s most streamed monthly songs on Spotify"

*August 2024

Billie Jean: 36,526,569
Beat It: 25,369,378 (record)
Rock with You: 17,747,881 (record)
Smooth Criminal: 12,411,690
Chicago: 9,108,404
The Way You Make Me Feel: 8,316,185 (record)
Thriller: 8,282,744
Don’t Stop ‘Til You Get Enough: 7,246,527 P.Y.T: 6,440,659
Remember the Time: 6,155,394

x.com

x.com x.com
 
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