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Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Flying
email from raffles
can you post them?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Flying
email from raffles
The problems is that no one is putting their money where their mouth is - not the Jacksons not any of the fans.
sorry but that's just a cop out. Single handedly people brought down tobacco companies, biggest corporations. Have you ever seen Erin Brockovich? I don't care how big Sony is. All you need is one determined person and an actual crime of fraud.
Simple: raise enough money (only few thousand dollars) and get an expert to examine the vocals. If it comes back "fake" , file a lawsuit against Sony. Say that you are expecting it to turn into a class action lawsuit. Post on every MJ forum about the lawsuit and ask people to join your lawsuit. Shortly you'll have a class action lawsuit against Sony with millions of people. Share your expert report with other people and ask them to file similar lawsuit in their countries/ states. Then you'll have multiple lawsuits against them. It will be like a domino effect.
there's no such thing as getting away. If there's a will there's a way.
The problems is that no one is putting their money where their mouth is - not the Jacksons not any of the fans.
or perhaps they all know that they are just stirring the pot with no backing proof hence no legal action.
can you post them?
post them for what reason pls?
well, you made some serious accusation about a person, so I was asking if you could back them up with some proof.
Ivy, it's way too premature to say that.
I'd hazard a guess that if such an action were to be filed, it would be sometime between February and April 2011, or whenever any new evidence of substance might come to light notwithstanding the statute of limitations
I made no accusation at all, and yes, I can back this up 100% with unequivocal proof.
At least one mod here can confirm what I say to be true.
Ask Raffles, he should give you straight answer.
you want more than this, or is it just prurient curiosity on your part?
That's simply. The other tracks are typical studio recordings that Michael put his soul into, their production is superb and the songs are finished.
"We all want to believe it"? Okay, I assume you maybe want it, yes.
But from what "damien" or "tristan" & others are writing, I would say: No, they don't want it to be Michael. They don't like what Teddy Riley, Neff-U etc. have made with the songs, they don't like the production, they call it crappy. And they think the inserted ad-libs from older tracks would be a sign of fake, but it's a sign of fragmentariness.
They don't want to accept that Michael can be imperfect and they deny the existence of rough recordings that were done with the Cascios. They think it's fake because earlier demos or "Hold My Hand" don't sound like this. That's right, but they forgot about how these vocals were recorded.
I can understand their doubts though. But what I CANNOT understand is that they really want to associate these recordings with Jason Malachi.
They're saying they have listened to every song by Jason and still they can't distinguish between rough vocal takes (Cascio tracks) by MJ that have been heavily overworked for inclusion on "Michael" and the songs by Jason.
With all respect, the association with Malachi is the biggest BS ever claimed by fans. It's the only thing why I'm getting emotionally about the whole situation sometimes. I personally don't want to read anything more about the Jason guy.
Not only have I informed about him some years ago to stop the false tagging on youTube & Co., now I have to cope with the situation that some fans really think Sony, the MJ Estate and/or the Cascios would cooperate with this little underground "star" that is only known on some MJ forums.
Well, that's my take on this issue as an audio expert. Some (yeah, a few people) are saying I would have lost my credibility.
I would say I have retained and ensured my professional objectivity.
badly written statements and claims with no evidence don't mean very much...
All fans, those against the recordings and those who want to embrace them would like some proof if even to prove their point. .
The problems is that no one is putting their money where their mouth is - not the Jacksons not any of the fans.
or perhaps they all know deep down that they are just stirring the pot with no backing proof hence no legal action.
Bring on the proof then! No one has been able to show a single piece of evidence that the tracks are not legitimate. Not one single person.
The Estate made their statement and said that they had forensic evidence to back up the fact that these songs are Michael. They've done their part... if anyone continues to feel that the songs are not legitimate, then they need to FILE A LAWSUIT. Get a forensic expert of their own to analyze the tracks, and use their findings as evidence against Sony and the Estate.
Here would be a good place for you to start: http://www.owlinvestigations.com/
$3,500 minimum for digital voice identification between one known and one unknown.
I'm so tired of people saying that the songs are fake as though it's fact. It's not. No one has ANY proof.
... There's no point going back and forth on this and the "get a lawyer" argument is just childish and dismissive of people's genuine concerns... Until anyone buys a product that may, or may not be fraudulent, there is nothing than can be done...
Your argument is can also be reversed.
No one has been able to show a single piece of evidence that the tracks ARE legitimate...
I think my post was fair and balanced and accepted other people's point of view. There's no point going back and forth on this and the "get a lawyer" argument is just childish and dismissive of people's genuine concerns... Until anyone buys a product that may, or may not be fraudulent, there is nothing than can be done...
Your argument is can also be reversed.
No one has been able to show a single piece of evidence that the tracks ARE legitimate...
Your argument is can also be reversed.
No one has been able to show a single piece of evidence that the tracks ARE legitimate...
This one's @ Korgnex.. basically a copy/paste of my response at Max Jax considering u attacked me with copy/paste posts on both forums. My reply:
I DO want to hear Mj on all these tracks. Ask the member at Max Jax "tabloidjunk" who I was on the phone to right until the second Breaking News streamed. I was soooo excited for the first new legit Mj track produced by Teddy Riley. I was strong in the opinion that those who claimed the vocals were fake (the jackson's), were attention seeking, jealous angry outcasts who wanted to sabotage the album out of spite. I refused to believe the vocals would be fake and advised everyone to ignore the jackson's and wait for the songs as proof.
Then, I heard Breaking News and after hearing it, everything changed.
For me, it's not Michael. It's not our King of Pop. And that's based ONLY on LISTENING to the tracks myself. No outside influence.
I feel JOY when I hear MJ's voice. Makes me feel good. Always. And on these tracks, for me there is not only no joyous feeling, but the opposite. A sickening feeling. I am not hearing MJ's voice at all, as much as I want to! U think I WANT the album I've been craving for 9 years to be fraudulent? No, I don't. No one does. But I'm going to be true to my feelings and opinion. It won't sway.
I'm not going to pretend to hear his voice on a track (there's 5 tracks so far I've heard which I don't personally deem to be MJ singing) when in my ears AND my heart, his voice is no where to be found.
You don't agree with me. That's okay. We all have opinions. I will continue to express mine as you continue to express yours. We're all welcome to do that being that this is a DISCUSSION forum.
But don't call me out as the problem here. I don't care if you think i have influence over other members opinions. Or if anyone else thinks I do. I think it's outlandish to suggest so. People make their own mind's up. I think what I think for my own personal reasons. So do others. You think it's MJ. Thats fine too!
I'm a fan on equal level as all of you and although some of you believe it's MJ (which is fine if you choose to) MY heart is broken over what I believe to be a massive scam. Again, thats what I PERSONALLY think based on hearing the songs alone.
That's my thoughts.
Please don't suggest you know my motives, or thought process, or reasoning. You don't. I just post what I feel and believe.
Thank You!!!!sorry but that's just a cop out. Single handedly people brought down tobacco companies, biggest corporations. Have you ever seen Erin Brockovich? I don't care how big Sony is. All you need is one determined person and an actual crime of fraud.
Simple: raise enough money (only few thousand dollars) and get an expert to examine the vocals. If it comes back "fake" , file a lawsuit against Sony. Say that you are expecting it to turn into a class action lawsuit. Post on every MJ forum about the lawsuit and ask people to join your lawsuit. Shortly you'll have a class action lawsuit against Sony with millions of people. Share your expert report with other people and ask them to file similar lawsuit in their countries/ states. Then you'll have multiple lawsuits against them. It will be like a domino effect.
there's no such thing as getting away. If there's a will there's a way.
The problems is that no one is putting their money where their mouth is - not the Jacksons not any of the fans.
or perhaps they all know deep down that they are just stirring the pot with no backing proof hence no legal action.
“Best of Joy” is one of the very last songs Michael was working on
In 2004, Michael, with the help of his then-attorney, John Branca, ended his relationship with Sony Music and its then CEO, Tommy Mottola. In the intervening years, Michael had been working on music intended for a forthcoming release, drawing up its creative blueprints and recording tracks that would provide the foundation while, at the same time, the regime at Sony Music changed and Michael developed good relations with its current executives, working with them on the 25th Anniversary album commemorating “Thriller” in 2008. Michael was delighted to personally receive special multi-platinum discus for the project at a reception held by Sony Music in Los Angeles in February 2009.
Hey, Damien's a hell of a fan, he's got contacts with Sony Music Australia, and he's one of the people who actually contribute intelligently to these boards.
This.So, they are now resorting to a cute "sang through PVC pipe that's why it doesn't sound like Michael" story...?
Where are the snippets of him singing them before production? rough cuts, the extensive notes he wrote? where are the reports from the audiologists? why are adlibs from other songs featured? why do they need to overproduce the songs? why not release the fantastic genuine songs like BG? where is any proof that it's Michael? oh, that's right, there isn't any!
i want to hear him in the songs, so badly, but i dont and no amount of crud from the estate/sony is gonna change my mind until there is evidence, facts and proof, not just this guff they keep releasing.