Questions & Contradictions about TII The Film

[Moonlight]

I need to preface this by saying that I have not seen This is it, the film.
As such, some of the issues and concerns I have may be explained, by those who have.

I have read several articles, commentary and seen various video clips etc.. and now and then, I feel that there are contraditions between various statements about the film, or sometimes, I just get a feeling that everything is not what it seems. There are many such intances where things don't seem to add up to me, so I invite discussion of anything of that nature here, can we find logical explanations for things that don't seem to add up? Or do those things shed light on our suspicions that what we've been told so far, really is not it?

There are lots of these things, but I'll just start with one thing that struck me as being odd in a recent interview:

Recently, there has been an interview with Sandrine Orabona posted in the news entitled:

Behind the Camera with Videographer Sandrine Orabona
Full article here:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/trey-borzillieri/michael-jacksons-this-is_b_361311.html


There were two parts to this interview that have troubled me, one of which I've already seen mentioned (I'll come back to that later possibly as it fits with other things I don't have to hand just now).

But something else about the interview has really been troubling me and it's this:

TB: How did everyone deal with news of his passing?

SO: It was a very difficult day. I was actually there shooting at the time and I almost dropped the camera. I had to shoot on my knees through the better part of that moment. I was overwhelmed with the emotion and I was like, "Ok, I am going to pass out". But I couldn't because I had to film. The way I can describe it is... the entire world was mourning that day, imagine how it was in the rehearsal space. I have a hard time remembering it actually. I feel like I had an out-of-body experience.

Now I'm not sure how anyone else feels when they read that statement and particularly the part that I have bolded and underlined?
But for me, this suggests some sort advanced directive, or prior knowledge.

Let's be real here for a moment, picture the scene she is describing there. News suddenly comes in that the star of this show you've been documenting with your camera, Michael Jackson has died, apart from the underlined and bolded part, everything else she says would fit with the sudden impact and feelings anyone may probably experience upon hearing that news for the first time, it feels and probably is her natural reaction to such breaking news.

But the underlined and bolded part does not fit shock news and natural response at all, she couldn't follow her natural instincts, because she had to film
Why? Why, in that moment of learning about Michael's death for the first time, did she 'have to' carry on filming?

Filming what? What was she actually filming when the news was delivered?

Why couldn't and didn't she just follow her natural instincts to keel over or drop the camera, within the shock of the moment? With earth shattering news like that, wouldn't everything just stand still for all of them, at least for that moment? Wouldn't it have disrupted the normal routine of everyone, at least for afew moments?

If, she "had to film" in that moment, does that imply that she knew something in advance of that moment. How did she know in that moment already, that she 'had to film' it?

Does this imply some advanced knowledge and directive to film something in relation to hearing the news of Michael's death?

Or a different time frame for hearing the news and filming the news being given maybe?

I'm not certain yet exactly what this means, but I feel that there's just something not quite right about being unable to have a natural reaction to unexpected and tragic news, 'because I had to film'.

Thoughts?

 

[dirtydiana27]

I absolutely agree Moonlight! The filming of the rehearsals has always puzzled me. I know that Frank and Kenny contend that this was Michael's practice--and it was. However, the quality of that film--way beyond what Michael used to do--after all it would have only been for his own use. And Frank's statement that Michael couldn't AFFORD to film the rehearsals this time, so AEG decided to do it---WTH???? So, Sandrine's comment that you highlight---very, very suspicious. Michael was TII--with the news of that day--anyone would have just dropped the camera and would not even be able to think about continuing recording!!

Well, for me--this just strengthens the suspicions I already have regarding AEG and a lot of other corporations and characters!!! I know you haven't seen TII Moonlight, but after I saw the movie---I was devastated--I saw so many red flags jump out of the screen at me (don't hate me because I know a lot of fans saw Michael in a different light than I did), and it took me days to recover. When I did, my resolve was even firmer in my convictions. Michael did, indeed, have a lot to be afraid of.

 

[Magical journey]

Has anyone seen any footage of that "out of body" filming session? Even if it were done for the sake of preserving history, why wouldn't it be released in the past five months? What would be the point?

 

[ReneeM]

Has anyone seen any footage of that "out of body" filming session? Even if it were done for the sake of preserving history, why wouldn't it be released in the past five months? What would be the point?

I believe this would be a decision that would be left up to the family. Even if AEG owned it I think they would respect the family's wishes if they didn't want that aired.

In the U.S. a popular news host name Tim Russert died. He had just finished an interview with 2 authors of a political book. The family requested that they not show his last interview and the network respected their wishes.

 

[HemlockDevi]

I need to preface this by saying that I have not seen This is it, the film.
As such, some of the issues and concerns I have may be explained, by those who have.

I have read several articles, commentary and seen various video clips etc.. and now and then, I feel that there are contraditions between various statements about the film, or sometimes, I just get a feeling that everything is not what it seems. There are many such intances where things don't seem to add up to me, so I invite discussion of anything of that nature here, can we find logical explanations for things that don't seem to add up? Or do those things shed light on our suspicions that what we've been told so far, really is not it?

There are lots of these things, but I'll just start with one thing that struck me as being odd in a recent interview:

Recently, there has been an interview with Sandrine Orabona posted in the news entitled:

Behind the Camera with Videographer Sandrine Orabona
Full article here:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/trey-borzillieri/michael-jacksons-this-is_b_361311.html


There were two parts to this interview that have troubled me, one of which I've already seen mentioned (I'll come back to that later possibly as it fits with other things I don't have to hand just now).

But something else about the interview has really been troubling me and it's this:



Now I'm not sure how anyone else feels when they read that statement and particularly the part that I have bolded and underlined?
But for me, this suggests some sort advanced directive, or prior knowledge.

Let's be real here for a moment, picture the scene she is describing there. News suddenly comes in that the star of this show you've been documenting with your camera, Michael Jackson has died, apart from the underlined and bolded part, everything else she says would fit with the sudden impact and feelings anyone may probably experience upon hearing that news for the first time, it feels and probably is her natural reaction to such breaking news.

But the underlined and bolded part does not fit shock news and natural response at all, she couldn't follow her natural instincts, because she had to film
Why? Why, in that moment of learning about Michael's death for the first time, did she 'have to' carry on filming?

Filming what? What was she actually filming when the news was delivered?

Why couldn't and didn't she just follow her natural instincts to keel over or drop the camera, within the shock of the moment? With earth shattering news like that, wouldn't everything just stand still for all of them, at least for that moment? Wouldn't it have disrupted the normal routine of everyone, at least for afew moments?

If, she "had to film" in that moment, does that imply that she knew something in advance of that moment. How did she know in that moment already, that she 'had to film' it?

Does this imply some advanced knowledge and directive to film something in relation to hearing the news of Michael's death?

Or a different time frame for hearing the news and filming the news being given maybe?

I'm not certain yet exactly what this means, but I feel that there's just something not quite right about being unable to have a natural reaction to unexpected and tragic news, 'because I had to film'.

Thoughts?

I agree with you there is something very wrong with the whole film. MJ moved great but seemed to be wasting away; no one seems there to notice. Also Michael is constantly eating, he gets thinner and thinner. I believe he was being poisoned over a period of time.

Also I think Frank Dileo is lying about "Mike not have the funds" to document this. I think he was forced to allow them(AEG) to film everything(all the evidence). Remember Tohme magically returned $5.5 million of MJ's a few days after this murder took place.

 

[Zori]

For me to drop the camera at this moment is a reaction. you don't think, you don't follow any rules or obligations.... so, yes, sounds like you got the average daily news.

Moonlight, what is the other part from the intw that have troubled you?

Well, for me--this just strengthens the suspicions I already have regarding AEG and a lot of other corporations and characters!!! I know you haven't seen TII Moonlight, but after I saw the movie---I was devastated--I saw so many red flags jump out of the screen at me (don't hate me because I know a lot of fans saw Michael in a different light than I did), and it took me days to recover. When I did, my resolve was even firmer in my convictions. Michael did, indeed, have a lot to be afraid of.

would beinteresting to hear what red flags you saw?

 

[MrsMJ2007]

You guys sound more like you are part of the This Is Not It camp. I saw the movie and loved it! What some of you fail to remember is that there was over 100 hours of rehearsal footage. The agreement between the Jackson family, Sony, and AEG was that Michael could not be shown in a bad light, the movie had to be rated PG and it had to be at least 2 hours or less. There will be additional footage contained on the DVD. I think that many people are falling too far into conspiracy theories and non-facts and embellished interviews. Right now we are all in the dark as to what has happened. We don't know what information the authorities have concerning Michael's passing. Let's allow them to do their jobs before we jump to anymore false conclusions. That also includes members of the Jackson family who also have continued to interfere with the investigation. As far as parts where people heard an alleged lisp, Michael had candy in his mouth. You know how much he loved sweets.

 

[Moddie777]

I absolutely agree Moonlight! The filming of the rehearsals has always puzzled me. I know that Frank and Kenny contend that this was Michael's practice--and it was. However, the quality of that film--way beyond what Michael used to do--after all it would have only been for his own use. And Frank's statement that Michael couldn't AFFORD to film the rehearsals this time, so AEG decided to do it---WTH???? So, Sandrine's comment that you highlight---very, very suspicious. Michael was TII--with the news of that day--anyone would have just dropped the camera and would not even be able to think about continuing recording!!

Well, for me--this just strengthens the suspicions I already have regarding AEG and a lot of other corporations and characters!!! I know you haven't seen TII Moonlight, but after I saw the movie---I was devastated--I saw so many red flags jump out of the screen at me (don't hate me because I know a lot of fans saw Michael in a different light than I did), and it took me days to recover. When I did, my resolve was even firmer in my convictions. Michael did, indeed, have a lot to be afraid of.

dirtydiana27, Please share wht you are referring to in regard to MJ having a lot to be afraid of? I truly would welcome the information and appreciate your insight greatly.

If you fear being attacked, by some can you please pm me? I won't attack, I want to know the real truth behind the murder!

 

[Moddie777]

I absolutely agree Moonlight! The filming of the rehearsals has always puzzled me. I know that Frank and Kenny contend that this was Michael's practice--and it was. However, the quality of that film--way beyond what Michael used to do--after all it would have only been for his own use. And Frank's statement that Michael couldn't AFFORD to film the rehearsals this time, so AEG decided to do it---WTH???? So, Sandrine's comment that you highlight---very, very suspicious. Michael was TII--with the news of that day--anyone would have just dropped the camera and would not even be able to think about continuing recording!!

Well, for me--this just strengthens the suspicions I already have regarding AEG and a lot of other corporations and characters!!! I know you haven't seen TII Moonlight, but after I saw the movie---I was devastated--I saw so many red flags jump out of the screen at me (don't hate me because I know a lot of fans saw Michael in a different light than I did), and it took me days to recover. When I did, my resolve was even firmer in my convictions. Michael did, indeed, have a lot to be afraid of.

Only those involved in the Prearranged Murderous Scheme and Plan to Bring Down Michael Jackson knew the significance of taping the rehearsals of a show, they Knew First hand, he would NOT make.

They knew before hand, shopping it around would give them triple the wealth of the doomed 02 London Shows they made him believe, he had to commit too.

They preplanned everything, right down to the reaction they felt the fans and world would "overall" have in seeing MJ's most recent and live work, inspite of the hand they played in him no longer being here.

 

[Autumn II]

You guys sound more like you are part of the This Is Not It camp. I saw the movie and loved it! What some of you fail to remember is that there was over 100 hours of rehearsal footage. The agreement between the Jackson family, Sony, and AEG was that Michael could not be shown in a bad light, the movie had to be rated PG and it had to be at least 2 hours or less. There will be additional footage contained on the DVD. I think that many people are falling too far into conspiracy theories and non-facts and embellished interviews. Right now we are all in the dark as to what has happened. We don't know what information the authorities have concerning Michael's passing. Let's allow them to do their jobs before we jump to anymore false conclusions.

This is the forum on MJJC for "conspiracy theories," and it's certainly not for everyone.

A gentle reminder for everyone to read the guidelines of the forum:

The Investigative Unit

In this forum we question Michael's death, the latest news and stories surrounding his death and the conspiracy theories - contains heavy speculation so please if you aren't able to respect the atmosphere of this section do not enter.

 

[Beachlover]

I agree with you there is something very wrong with the whole film. MJ moved great but seemed to be wasting away; no one seems there to notice. Also Michael is constantly eating, he gets thinner and thinner. I believe he was being poisoned over a period of time.

Also I think Frank Dileo is lying about "Mike not have the funds" to document this. I think he was forced to allow them(AEG) to film everything(all the evidence). Remember Tohme magically returned $5.5 million of MJ's a few days after this murder took place.

I do think if he was poisoned over time it will come out in the autopsy when it is finally released.

My opinion is that is not what happened.

 

[Beachlover]

This is the forum on MJJC for "conspiracy theories," and it's certainly not for everyone.

A gentle reminder for everyone to read the guidelines of the forum:

The Investigative Unit

In this forum we question Michael's death, the latest news and stories surrounding his death and the conspiracy theories - contains heavy speculation so please if you aren't able to respect the atmosphere of this section do not enter.

I think I am confused though about this.

It is an 'investigative unit' meaning we are all investigating and throwing different ideas around. Of course, some threads may well be about conspiracy theories and I respect the wishes of those who believe those sorts of things too.

I just also see that some posters here become very defensive when another poster comes into a thread and says they disagree. I would think as long as they say so in a respectful manner, thats ok too.

It just seems to me people on this board want it censored and people silenced if they don't agree and that to me is wrong.

 

[Autumn II]

I think I am confused though about this.

It is an 'investigative unit' meaning we are all investigating and throwing different ideas around. Of course, some threads may well be about conspiracy theories and I respect the wishes of those who believe those sorts of things too.

I just also see that some posters here become very defensive when another poster comes into a thread and says they disagree. I would think as long as they say so in a respectful manner, thats ok too.

It just seems to me people on this board want it censored and people silenced if they don't agree and that to me is wrong.

YES, this is about "throwing ideas around." If anyone thinks the guidelines are "wrong," then that is really a question for admin? This is not about "agreeing or not agreeing," and it's not really about debate of who is right or wrong, or who is closer to the truth, or whose posts are fact-based, and whose are just speculation.

This has been a problem that cropped up when the unit first opened . . . then people seemed to understand . . . . and then there has been "slippage" again. That "slippage" has caused pain for some. I KNOW. I still get the PMs, even though I'm not on staff anymore.

What is NOT ok here are the constant demands, by a few, for "proofs", "URLs," and so on, or those posts that say, "Just wait for the police to do their jobs." NO. A theory or speculation is a "what if" situation, here. We really aren't here to say someone is right or wrong, but to share ideas. This truly is not a "debate" here, but a sharing of ideas? Hopefully? Some ideas may be far-fetched, and some may be closer to what the truth really is. We just don't know, but tolerance should be the order-of-the-day.

I'm sure there are private boards that people can join where there are more "facts" put forth. That type of material shouldn't be on an "open" board, anyway. . . .

 

[Autumn II]

I hope that the threads here can stay on track, and I think now that there's been clarification, they might? The guidelines of this forum are very clear and it had been more-or-less peaceful until recently? Whatever. I suggest, everyone, that if you think a post is off-base for this particular forum, use the "report" button?

This is not exactly a "think-tank," nor is it any sort of official "investigation." It's about brainstorming. We don't need to challenge each other here, or demand "proofs" for what really are only speculations. We need to just consider, with respect, what is written as part of a whole picture, more for our own sakes than anything else, for those who are trying to understand what HAPPENED to Michael? There are a lot of smart people here, and a lot of interesting ideas.

In case you guys haven't seen it, Trish posted this. I'm sure if everyone reads it, we can move on productively?

http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=83503

"This forum IS about speculation and conspiracy theories. It's not necessarily about PROVING the conspiracy theory or providing facts. It's not about debunking theories and members in this forum do not have to prove ANYTHING to ANYONE.

If you are not able to respect the atmosphere of this section, or would like to discuss more fact based news and information, then please use News & Happenings, or Michael Jackson Discussion.

This is the first and last warning that will given before infractions are handed out. And there is no point in challenging this either.

And a note to the frequent users of the I.U., do not place theories or speculations in News & Happenings. If you do, expect to be challenged to provide links and backing information.

Thank you."

 

[Beachlover]

I hope that the threads here can stay on track, and I think now that there's been clarification, they might? The guidelines of this forum are very clear and it had been more-or-less peaceful until recently? Whatever. I suggest, everyone, that if you think a post is off-base for this particular forum, use the "report" button?

This is not exactly a "think-tank," nor is it any sort of official "investigation." It's about brainstorming. We don't need to challenge each other here, or demand "proofs" for what really are only speculations. We need to just consider, with respect, what is written as part of a whole picture, more for our own sakes than anything else, for those who are trying to understand what HAPPENED to Michael? There are a lot of smart people here, and a lot of interesting ideas.

"This forum IS about speculation and conspiracy theories. It's not necessarily about PROVING the conspiracy theory or providing facts. It's not about debunking theories and members in this forum do not have to prove ANYTHING to ANYONE.

Thank you for explaining as this really does explain a lot to me now. This section of the board is not about proving any facts and we can say whatever theory we believe and are not to question others. Thanks so much for explaining that. Perhaps I will feel more comfortable to post my own theories here too now.

 

[Krshna28]

This is silly...........

For one thing why did Sony pay for the footage if it was made after Michael's death.


One second everybody is saying that the rehearsals should be released and now they wish that it was never released!!!!!!!!!!

People never actually know what they want!!!!!!!!