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Michael - The Great Album Debate

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

You might be interested to know that Malachi is now posting his own comparisons through his website (jasonmalachi.us). He mixed his own songs with snippets from KYHU and BN.

He said the truth was about to be revealed and now he is saying it

EDIT he took it down, this is the link he posted: http://banashare.com/3m42dhm6052w/welcome.mp3.html
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ I think being in the studio late 2007, all through 2008, he was rehearsing, is that not common sense? But not immediately after the trial ends. You'd obviously need some time off after that, wouldn't you think? No time for family?

@Barok: seems like another hack attempt. What is that comparison song being used? Sounds already released, or is it some track we haven't heard yet?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^^what do you mean, rehearsing?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Ok I just want to get back to the registration issue a second if that's ok. I was looking up the register and the following were registered between 2007 and 2010, What i find interesting is that they are all compilations....no individual tracks registered. So in 2007 we have a complation registerd by Porte alone and then in 2008 we have another one registered by Porte and Cascio. Then in 2009 after Michael died we have another collection (MJ songbook) registered and for the first time we have Michael included. Then in 2010 we have two compilations registered-one with just Porte and Cascio and the other with MJ. So obviously Porte and Cascio were registering stuff in 2007 and 2008....so why didn't they include MJ if he had recorded a 'full album' with them in 2007?
Another thing is that it doesn't say anywhere specifically what they submitted_just that it was an electronic file. The 'music and sound recording' is the category-it doesn't specify the form of what was actually submitted. Once things are submitted they are the property of the copyright office and the only way any third party is ever going to know the details are if there is a major lawsuit or if the people owning the copyright decide to release them. so i guess what i am trying to say is that unless that happens we have absolutely no idea what actual vocals if any were submitted. Also to consider is that although the sonbook was registered online two days after MJ passed they would have had more time to submit the 'hard' copies. I just don't get why they were in such a rush after he died when they apparently weren't bothered in the slightest beforehand? So here is the info below and i would like to hear others thoughts or observations on this info. I also would like to say that i just want the truth and the main reason i doubt that MJ did these tracks is because when i listen to them i just do not recognise the vocal as Michael and also the lyrics are very poor by Michael's standards. Secondary to that is all i have found out when looking for reasons as to why that may be. I wish this had never happened. I really feel it is unjust and it is deception and for that reason i cannot accept it.

The LA compilation I.
Type of Work: Music
Registration Number / Date: PAu003129587 / 2007-06-08
Title: The LA compilation I.
Notes: Words & music (collection)
Copyright Claimant: James Porte, 1972-
Date of Creation: 2007
Copyright Note: Cataloged from appl. only.




JPEC Collection 1.
Type of Work: Sound Recording and Music
Registration Number / Date: SRu000869594 / 2008-03-30
Application Title: JPEC Collection 1.
Title: JPEC Collection 1.
Description: Electronic file (eService)
Copyright Claimant: James Porte. Address: 198 Mapleton Forest Drive NW, Cleveland, TN, 37312, United States
Edward Cascio. Address: 883 Huron Rd, Franklin Lakes, NJ, 07417, United States
Date of Creation: 2008
Authorship on Application: James Porte; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: sound recording, performance, production, Music & Lyrics.
Edward Cascio; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: sound recording, production, Music & Lyrics.
Rights and Permissions: James Porte, 198 Mapleton Forest Dr. NW, Cleveland, TN, 37312, United States, jamesporte@gmail.com
Copyright Note: C.O. correspondence.
Names: Porte, James
Cascio, Edward
Names: Porte, James, 1972


MJ Song Book 2009 #1.
Type of Work: Sound Recording and Music
Registration Number / Date: SRu000911714 / 2009-06-27
Application Title: MJ Song Book 2009 #1.
Title: MJ Song Book 2009 #1.
Description: Electronic file (eService)
Copyright Claimant: Michael Joseph Jackson. Address: Unlisted, Los Angeles, CA, United States.
James Victor Porte. Address: 105 Camilla Lane, Murfreesboro, TN, 37129, United States.
Edward Joseph Cascio. Address: 883 Huron Rd, Franklin Lakes, NJ, 07417, United States.
Date of Creation: 2009
Authorship on Application: Michael Joseph Jackson; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: sound recording, performance, production, compilation, LYRICS.
James Victor Porte; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: sound recording, performance, production, compilation, LYRICS.
Edward Joseph Cascio; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: sound recording, performance, production, compilation, LYRICS.
Rights and Permissions: James Porte, Ghost Manor Music, jamesporte@gmail.com
Names: Jackson, Michael Joseph
Porte, James Victor
Cascio, Edward Joseph

ASon Compilation 4 of 13.

Type of Work: Music
Registration Number / Date: PAu003465707 / 2010-03-18
Application Title: ASon Compilation 4 of 13.
Title: ASon Compilation 4 of 13.
Description: Electronic file (eService)
Notes: Collection
Copyright Claimant: AFFINITY-ANGELIKSON, Transfer: By written agreement. Address: 707 Surrey Lane, Franklin Lakes, NJ, 07417, United States.
Date of Creation: 2007
Authorship on Application: Edward Cascio; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: music, lyrics, musical arrangement, text, editing, Production.
James Porte; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: music, lyrics, musical arrangement, text, editing, Production.
Rights and Permissions: James Porte, Angelikson Productions, 883 Huron Rd, Franklin Lakes, NJ, 07417, United States, jamesporte@gmail.com
Names: Cascio, Edward
Porte, James
AFFINITY-ANGELIKSON


Type of Work: Music
Registration Number / Date: PAu003478985 / 2010-03-18
Application Title: ASON COMPILATION 9 of 13.
Title: ASON COMPILATION 9 of 13.
Description: Electronic file (eService)
Copyright Claimant: AFFINITY-ANGELIKSON, Transfer: By written agreement. Address: 707 Surrey Lane, Franklin Lakes, NJ, 07417, United States.
Date of Creation: 2007
Authorship on Application: Edward Cascio; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: music, lyrics, musical arrangement, text, editing, Production.
James Porte; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: music, lyrics, musical arrangement, text, editing, Production.
Michael Jackson, -2009; Domicile: United States; Citizenship: United States. Authorship: music, lyrics.
Rights and Permissions: James Porte, Angelikson Productions, 883 Huron Rd, Franklin Lakes, NJ, 07417, United States, jamesporte@gmail.com
Copyright Note: C.O. correspondence.
Names: Cascio, Edward
Porte, James
Jackson, Michael, -2009
AFFINITY-ANGELIKSO
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Aniram said:
You don't think the fact that the trials had just ended mid-2005 and he had been hospitalized several times, had serious back problems, was spending more time than ever with his children, was out of the country, etc. affected his voice whatsoever, 2007 being not even two years after all of that?

Michael was very strong, but he was also fragile and went through times where he just plain wasn't fit, physically, and that will affect your singing voice. You can't compare some demo from the 80's or 90's to 2007, really, after a recording career from the late 60's-now he could have been so exhausted after EVERYTHING that had been happening in his life, maybe it was taking a while to get his rhythm completely back?
Click to expand...

I understand all of the above. I can never imagine the level of excruciating pain, both emotional and physical, he suffered during the trial.

However, like many have pointed out, Michael recorded the WBSS remix around the same time he supposedly recorded the Cascio tracks. Michael sounded GREAT in the remix. I'm not a fan of the Thriller 25 remixes. But, I could hear the verse that Michael recorded in 2007 non-stop. It's that good. If anything, his voice sounded silkier in recent years than in his 20's. How do we explain This Is it then? Obviously, Michael was not in perfect shape during the rehearsal. He couldn't sleep. He's under a lot of pressure. He's a full-time dad. Still, his performance (not 100% of his capacity) of Human Nature, IJCSLY and I'll Be There blow me away. He never lost his ability to sing. I also remember the We Are The World performance during the 1993 Clinton Inauguration Gala. Oh boy... that was a performance I want to forget (but, he looked too damn cute there!) He sang out of tune and missed a line, but still sounded like Michael Jackson. I tend to believe Michael Jackson always sounded like himself even during his worst days.

Also, the Cascio recording sessions was not the first time Michael entered a studio after the trial. He started collaboration with will.i.am in Ireland in 2006. According to will.i.am, Michael was drop dead serious about each recording session. Michael would spend hours warming up his voice before starting.

Michael was a professional singer since the age of 5. He knew how to use and protect his voice. I have a hard time in believing Michael would record vocals of 12 songs if he knew he's not ready. If, like what you just suggested, Michael was not physically ready to go back to a studio, why would he force himself to record materials enough to fill an album?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Here's the difference though. With will.i.am they were in a professional recording studio on business. With Eddie, he was in a friend's house just messing around with music and writing what came to mind. Would you really try your best when you're just messing around. Plus, according to MJ's long-time painter:

"He was so much fun to be around. It wasn't all darkness. We'd laugh so much. He had a great sense of humor, loved practical jokes....We'd be walking along and he'd break out into song. But not like Michael Jackson. He would sing like it was a man in the shower, just singing. I hated to see that joy go out of his life because he was a very joyful person. He was a happy person and just great fun to be around."

(C) Deborah L. Kunesh

http://www.reflectionsonthedance.com/interviewwithdavidnordahl.html

Does that make a bit more sense to everyone?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Michael 'trying his best' or not....He'd still sound like Michael Jackson....I can really hear Michael saying...'Oh, yeah, well, I was just messing around, not trying my best, which explains why I sound like a completely different person...'....
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

But we're all aware of MJ's vocal range. Just take for instance when he announced "This Is It". Was it shocking to hear him announce a tour with that voice? It barely sounded like him!
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Yes, I'm very well aware of his vocal range...We've heard it numerous times...Have you heard him sound like a different person, though? I haven't. You say when he announced TII it 'barely sounded like him'....But he still sounded like himself; he still sounded like the Michael Jackson we've been hearing all this time....I don't agree that he 'barely sounded like himself'...His voice was deeper, but it had been for years...What you've just said still doesn't explain why his singing voice in TII sounded like classic Michael Jackson...And, according to him, he was saving his voice, and not going full out...

Your type of argument just doesn't hold any weight, in my opinion. I know what you're trying to get at, but to me, there is absolutely no connection whatsoever...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

True, Jesta.

And no, Michael still sounds like himself. Just because he may sound weak in places, to you, doesn't mean it's not him. How can you honestly say you don't think it sounds like Michael Jackson? How did all those people, fans of Michael who worked on the album, get fooled if it's so obviously not him?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ Yeah, the voice on the cascio tracks isn't someone who can't be bothered to sing or is just going half-heartedly. Its clearly someone elses voice.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Jesta said:
Here's the difference though. With will.i.am they were in a professional recording studio on business. With Eddie, he was in a friend's house just messing around with music and writing what came to mind. Would you really try your best when you're just messing around. Plus, according to MJ's long-time painter:

"He was so much fun to be around. It wasn't all darkness. We'd laugh so much. He had a great sense of humor, loved practical jokes....We'd be walking along and he'd break out into song. But not like Michael Jackson. He would sing like it was a man in the shower, just singing. I hated to see that joy go out of his life because he was a very joyful person. He was a happy person and just great fun to be around."

(C) Deborah L. Kunesh

http://www.reflectionsonthedance.com/interviewwithdavidnordahl.html

Does that make a bit more sense to everyone?
Click to expand...

First, if indeed Michael was recording in the Cascio basement studio, I still have a hard time imagining Michael singing like he's messing in the shower. He's recording demos in a studio with the intention of potentially using them in the future; yet, he chose to sound not like himself? It doesn't make sense to me at all.

Second, if there is a tape of Michael singing in the shower, I'm quite confident I can recognize his voice. Afterall, his voice is one of the most distinctive ever. We recognize his uncharacteristic deep voice during the 1993 Superbowl speech. We recognize his voice in the Mexican Deposition when he's in pain. We recognize his voice in the 1994 Dangerous Deposition. The timbre of his voice never changed.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

@Arklove Really? Well if that's what you hear. However, when compared to any other sound clip of MJ prior to that announcement, you can at least say that he sounded radically different to what we all knew of him. Plus, another example of his range is as the "Mayor" in "Ghosts". Now he didn't sound like himself at all, proving that his voice has one of the most versatile ranges known in the world.

@love is magical, While his intentions were true, it doesn't mean that his vocals would've been used on the hypothtical album. They were example vocals. Plus, Michael did like to mess around and be silly, like the pie fight during the filming of "Black or White".
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Jesta said:
But we're all aware of MJ's vocal range. Just take for instance when he announced "This Is It". Was it shocking to hear him announce a tour with that voice? It barely sounded like him!
Click to expand...

Nope. It wan't shocking to me at all. Like I said, his speaking voice in the speech just before the Heal The World performance in the 1993 Superbowl was deep. Yet, it's Michael Jackson.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

It's been said an umpteen amount of times as well - the little bit he sings on an answering machine on ILTWYLM is muffled, quiet, and very short...But he still sounds like himself; it's not casted any doubt on anyone....

Even some parts of Best of Joy, he's using a style I've never heard him use before....But, STYLE, and VOCALS are two different things...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ Okay, you're kind of confusing me... you're comparing a speech he gave in 1993 at the Super Bowl to this album recording? What the hell?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

But was that phone message done while he was still recording a lot? While his voice was "active"? Don't forget, prior to 2007 he probably wasn't recording a terrible lot, his voice probably wasn't up to scratch and Seth Riggs wasn't there to help him warm up. Plus, he was in Bahrain prior to 2007, he could've slightly picked up an accent.

Again, just a shot-in-the-dark theory.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Jesta said:
@Arklove Really? Well if that's what you hear. However, when compared to any other sound clip of MJ prior to that announcement, you can at least say that he sounded radically different to what we all knew of him. Plus, another example of his range is as the "Mayor" in "Ghosts". Now he didn't sound like himself at all, proving that his voice has one of the most versatile ranges known in the world.

@love is magical, While his intentions were true, it doesn't mean that his vocals would've been used on the hypothtical album. They were example vocals. Plus, Michael did like to mess around and be silly, like the pie fight during the filming of "Black or White".
Click to expand...

Yes, he did indeed sound different as the mayor...But listen to the PRONUNCIATION of his words....When he says 'normal', he doesn't pronounce the 'L'...That's the way he speaks, it's not missing even when he's acting as the Mayor...Same with the way he says 'kids'...he says...'keeds'...His natural timbre, pronunciation is still there, even though his voice is very different and much deeper....
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Aniram said:
^ Okay, you're kind of confusing me... you're comparing a speech he gave in 1993 at the Super Bowl to this album recording? What the hell?
Click to expand...

Huh? No, I'm not...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

You're very smart, Jesta! Yet another great post. :) My thoughts exactly.

Arklove, sorry, post was directed to the one above yours.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

That's very good observation, but let me ask you this. Suppose the Estate DID hire an impersonator for the tracks. Wouldn't they be required to listen and imitate all of Michael's habits and pronunciations for this deal to go through? They wouldn't hire someone that'd do a transparent job of it.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ Exactly. You think they'd stop Jason and go, 'Hey... uhh... Yeah, sounds great and everything, but, could you tone down the vibrato a little?'
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Jesta said:
@Arklove Really? Well if that's what you hear. However, when compared to any other sound clip of MJ prior to that announcement, you can at least say that he sounded radically different to what we all knew of him. Plus, another example of his range is as the "Mayor" in "Ghosts". Now he didn't sound like himself at all, proving that his voice has one of the most versatile ranges known in the world.

@love is magical, While his intentions were true, it doesn't mean that his vocals would've been used on the hypothtical album. They were example vocals. Plus, Michael did like to mess around and be silly, like the pie fight during the filming of "Black or White".
Click to expand...

First, versatile is not the same as weak. I agree Michael's vocal range is versatile. He had a beautiful natural tenor voice. Yet, he could go deep and low. He opted not to most of the time. The vocals on the Cascio tracks are simply weak, not versatile.

Second, messing around and being silly is one thing. Recording demos is another. It's not like Michael was having a pie fight in the basement while recording. None of the demos I heard sounded casual. Actually, the vocals on the Cascio tracks sound forced.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

@Jesta: Yeah, you would think that...It's fooled some people though, but certainly not others...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

To me, the vocals sound very fun and casual, almost like a gift to the Cascios, I have thought at times.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

It's not like with Milli Vanilli where no-one knew what they sounded like. As previously said, MJ has one of the world's most distinctive voices. The Estate, all of their workers and Teddy Riley etc. would know his voice greatly, and therefore hiring an impersonator who'd do a bad job at imitating him when they know what MJ would sound like, even in a demo, just doesn't add up for me. It would be far easier for them to get caught.

@Aniram MJ often thought of his music as gifts, just look at "Elizabeth, I Love You". His gift to people was music. If he recorded music for Eddie just as a gift for private listening, he's not going to be completely strong, it's going to be pretty casual, because they don't expect strong vocals from him.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

And would it be worth 5 million to Eddie Cascio to put his entire career on the line to lie to all the Michael Jackson fans in the world when the family is already obviously well off?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Jesta said:
If he recorded music for Eddie just as a gift for private listening, he's not going to be completely strong, it's going to be pretty casual, because they don't expect strong vocals from him.
Click to expand...

And Eddie goes and sells this precious 'gift' for $5 million?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Aniram said:
You don't think the fact that the trials had just ended mid-2005 and he had been hospitalized several times, had serious back problems, was spending more time than ever with his children, was out of the country, etc. affected his voice whatsoever, 2007 being not even two years after all of that?

Michael was very strong, but he was also fragile and went through times where he just plain wasn't fit, physically, and that will affect your singing voice. You can't compare some demo from the 80's or 90's to 2007, really, after a recording career from the late 60's-now he could have been so exhausted after EVERYTHING that had been happening in his life, maybe it was taking a while to get his rhythm completely back?.
Click to expand...

Back to the completely outlandish theory that it's clearly Michael because it doesn't sound like Michael.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

No, I NEVER said that samhabib, Do Not twist my words!

It DOES sound like Michael Jackson, just weaker, less rehearsed, with at least three years off from recording. Is that so hard to understand?
 
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