Estate, Cascio and Porte Sued Over Three Songs on the "Michael" Album - Vera Senova Class Action

[OnirMJ]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

it is not a fact.

I'm just saying that they didn't record anything in those 2 days between MJ's death and the registration. And nowhere in that registration it says Michael Jackson is singing on those songs or how many songs there are.

Authorship: sound recording, performance, production, compilation, LYRICS.

Sound recording, performance - it can be by James Porte.

Michael may have helped them with the production & LYRICS.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Specifics were filed on june 2009. So the title songs are menionned in the docs. You can not record 12 songs on less than 48 hours (lyrics, mix, find an impostor, and file docs)

i have a phd in signal processing. You can not perform a true analysis on altered, mixed recordings. You need the accapella.

You can, but we know these songs weren't recorded in 48 hours. They were around, mixed and mostly completed for James Porte's album. Those same songs were then supposedly given to "Michael" and were worked on with he, Eddie Cascio & James Porte.

We don't know what she had tested, assuming so is moot. Considering both her experts are named, and verified to be experts in that sort of thing, I'm not going to assume that they had no idea what to test and what not.

Same goes for The Estate, except their experts were never named, so there's nothing to go on.


Yet, that's another part of the issue, nobody ever accused Eddie of recording these songs in 48 hours. What we said was the fact that he waited until after his friend died, 48 hours to be exact, is suspect. As why weren't they filed before? Which means Eddie concocted this scheme and set it into motion well before Michael died, and simply sat on them in either hopes that he'd eventually be able to get them to Michael or whatever. Then once Michael died, he took what he had and mislead those who purchased them into believing they contained Michael's vocals. Which makes his "backstabbing" all that worse.

I'm just saying that they didn't record anything in those 2 days between MJ's death and the registration. And nowhere in that registration it says Michael Jackson is singing on those songs or how many songs there are.

Authorship: sound recording, performance, production, compilation, LYRICS.

Sound recording, performance - it can be by James Porte.

Michael may have helped them with the production & LYRICS.

Exactly.

 

[serendipity]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

i have a phd in signal processing. You can not perform a true analysis on altered, mixed recordings. You need the accapella.

Would be interesting to see how they obtained accapellas to make the tests.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Guys don't argue about recording 12 songs in 2 days, it didn't happen. Based on actual research and evidence, testimony from numerous unbiased sources my main idea on these songs.

we know at least Soldier Boy existed and was copyrighted with nothing to do with Michael in 2005. Also the MJSongbook#1 is more than likely exactly that! Just a collection of lyrics, compositions and vocals by James Porte which were to be presented to Michael in London a twist on Eddies "Michael said we would finish the songs in London" line, which is also funny because apparently MJ got him to deleted all the work in progress stuff. This would explain why the songs sound like such bad MJ ripofffs, copying his old ideas and melodies. Eddie was writing the most "MJ" songs he could think of.

Michael is too kind and no doubt like he has with other even bigger stars in the past, agreed to do something at a later date. Whether or not he would work on this material is not known, Its more than likely MJ didn't even know song titles. Between June 2009 and May 2010 Jason Malachi recorded the leads for the songs more than likely during his "all a sudden cancel a show for a 3 week holiday" time. Stuart Brawley worked on the material from at least January 2010, remember this guy is a specialist in vocal manipulation. Also numerous sources quote him as the guy who passed out Xscape in 2002, this has been confirmed by people Michael knew. Brawley was blacklisted by MJ, Eddie needed MJ vocals and knew Brawley needed the cash and production credits.

As for vocals and the state they were recorded in, well the vocals were recorded perfectly fine, multiple takes of leads and 4+ layers of backing vocals all credited to "MJ".

Whatever you believe, we are more than likely going to get a glimpse into the MJSongbook#1 in the near future

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Birchey, are you in conctat with the fan who is suing? I think the info you have and your case would be very helpful to her. Also evidences, informations and all other things Damien Shields, Stella & others managed to gather during this 3 years should be made available to her.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Birchey, are you in conctat with the fan who is suing? I think the info you have and your case would be very helpful to her. Also evidences, informations and all other things Damien Shields, Stella & others managed to gather during this 3 years should be made available to her.

I have spoken to them briefly, and anything that is needed from me is available as long as it goes through the correct legal procedures, which is the way this whole case is going anyhow. I am sure others are helping in anyway they can too.

 

[Petrarose]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

If it goes to court I don't think it will be just experts one side vs. experts on the other side. That would be a weak case. Obviously more evidence is needed to win a court case. But we are not yet in that phase.

Yeah I know we are not in that phase and that it may not get there. I still think this will be an expert driven case, unless someone has some photos showing specific things and handwritten notes.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Yeah I know we are not in that phase and that it may not get there. I still think this will be an expert driven case, unless someone has some photos showing specific things and handwritten notes.

Definately expert driven, but I think there are certain things which could really sway opinion, the copyright claims made by Porte and Cascio before and after Michaels death. Also if Antonio Montrone (name from memory probably wrong) is called might be one of the most damning testimonies against the songs.

 

[Petrarose]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Specifics were filed on june 2009. So the title songs are menionned in the docs. You can not record 12 songs on less than 48 hours (lyrics, mix, find an impostor, and file docs)

i have a phd in signal processing. You can not perform a true analysis on altered, mixed recordings. You need the accapella.

That is what I was asking about the first day of the thread. I thought it was said in 2010 that you needed the original music to do a test, but here we have an expert doing it on a cd. Does the expert know that is not the best medium? This is rather puzzling.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

That is what I was asking about the first day of the thread. I thought it was said in 2010 that you needed the original music to do a test, but here we have an expert doing it on a cd. Does the expert know that is not the best medium? This is rather puzzling.

There are family members with the Acapellas for at least 4 of the songs, I don't know if these were used. Also Breaking News acapella is available, plus there are alot of acapella snippets which have been extracted from the demos. Don't know of anymore off the top of my head.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I'd assume possibly Taj or Taryll, the ones that attended the sessions may have access to the acapellas, if anyone else. At least for the songs Teddy Riley produced.

Plus as mentioned, BN acapella is available. That's one out of the way.

 

[kreen]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

The vocals that were sold to Sony were recorded in early 2010. February if I remember correctly. That registration 2 days after MJ died contained what they actually had at that point. Lyrics, music of some songs (not all 12 - some were written after MJ died!) and Porte demo vocals.

Stop stating as fact some made-up theory you have not the slightest shred of evidence for. Unless you do have evidence, in which case shouldn't you be in court right now?

 

[kreen]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

He recorded 12 full songs (complete with full verses, choruses and ad-libs) while staying there for less than 3 months along with recording WBSS 2008 vocals and finishing For All Time. But in 4 full years after the trial he recorded only few complete songs and bunch of incomplete vocal ideas, melodies without vocals or choruses without verses and almost always without the ad-libs. It is obvious to me that you don't know what Michael's recording habits were.

If all of Eddie's songs were written beforehand, and MJ only had to lay down a vocal track, without adlibs or multiple layers of vocals, he certainly could have recorded 12 songs in several weeks. He had nothing else to do all day,as his kids were with their tutor. And he was basically mooching off the Cascio's for food and board. Recording these songs may have been his way of saying thanks.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Stop stating as fact some made-up theory you have not the slightest shred of evidence for. Unless you do have evidence, in which case shouldn't you be in court right now?

See this would be a problem, but for some its the same way for Eddie, stop stating facts without Evidence. I don't find it harmful if someone feels like its a fact to them and its easy throwing to people "you should be in court" not everyone is in a position to do that, fact is we have someone who has and need as much support as they can to get this case laid out in court properly.

and as a side note we know alost certainly there wasn't any sign or evidence of MJ's vocals around the time of registration, but there is testimony from someone who prepared the songs for Michael to sing to, who says they contained Portes vocals.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

If all of Eddie's songs were written beforehand, and MJ only had to lay down a vocal track, without adlibs or multiple layers of vocals, he certainly could have recorded 12 songs in several weeks. He had nothing else to do all day,as his kids were with their tutor. And he was basically mooching off the Cascio's for food and board. Recording these songs may have been his way of saying thanks.

I cant remember the exact timescale he had to record those 12 Songs, but its alot less than people think, after several of us researched what else he had done whilst at the Cascios. Either way he is claimed to have written them and there is a staggering amount of vocals, layers of backing vocals, and multiple leads. So by definiton you saying its only possible without those things, you kinda proved Onir correct :/

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

And he was basically mooching off the Cascio's for food and board.

Like I said in Great debate thread some times ago, you should be banned for all the disgusting things you said about Michael. Shame on you!

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I cant remember the exact timescale he had to record those 12 Songs, but its alot less than people think, after several of us researched what else he had done whilst at the Cascios. Either way he is claimed to have written them and there is a staggering amount of vocals, layers of backing vocals, and multiple leads. So by definiton you saying its only possible without those things, you kinda proved Onir correct :/

Also Michael often had songwriters writing songs/demos for him Darkchild production team, Babyface... but he never recorded 12 full songs with complete leads, backgrounds and adlibs (multiple takes) in less than 3 months.

 

[arnspecs]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I hope this chick wins. About time someone paid for this mess. I just wish it was the main culprits that got the brunt of it,

 

[Petrarose]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Marc Vivien I asked you a question. when you log on can you answer it for me please.

 

[ivy]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I have been keeping a very close eye on this thread for that very reason. If I see anyone divulging her personal information and/or attacking her in any way, action will be taken. That could be anything from editing posts to remove such information to warnings or worse. This is not the place to allow such antics to be taking place, and MJJC will not allow it.

Spyce, I have no doubts that you are keeping a watchful eye and as I said luckily MJJC doesn't have such extreme people in it. That's why we all love MJJC isn't it? I was just trying to encourage people to maintain it.

 

[Tygger]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I was honestly elated when I first heard this news however; I am now skeptical.

I do not know what the future holds. I only know I wanted Michael to be the victor.

 

[kreen]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Like I said in Great debate thread some times ago, you should be banned for all the disgusting things you said about Michael. Shame on you!

MJ was broke and he was mooching off, sorry if actual reality offends your sensibility. Oh, and he had been mooching off that Bahrain prince before.

Personally, I don't want anyone banned, not even people who claim as a fact that people are criminals when they have no proof. Which to me is more un-Michael-like than using the phrase "mooching off".

 

[Spyce]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Spyce, I have no doubts that you are keeping a watchful eye and as I said luckily MJJC doesn't have such extreme people in it. That's why we all love MJJC isn't it? I was just trying to encourage people to maintain it.

Oh absolutely. I wasn't directing that post at you- now that I think about it, since I quoted you it might have come off that way and I apologize for that. I was just trying to reinforce what you said.

So far people have been respectful and there haven't been any problems and hopefully it stays that way.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

MJ was broke and he was mooching off, sorry if actual reality offends your sensibility. Oh, and he had been mooching off that Bahrain prince before.

Personally, I don't want anyone banned, not even people who claim as a fact that people are criminals when they have no proof. Which to me is more un-Michael-like than using the phrase "mooching off".

I wouldn't really call it "mooching" when you have those actually willing to look out for you. "Mooching" is you willingly half assing everything while the person providing for you is basically telling you to get your shit together. Pretty sure the Bahrain dude invited Michael, and he had a relationship that was so long and built upon with the Cascios that it got to the point where he was pretty much welcome to their home and everything in it whenever things got rough for him. Michael was never a person who couldn't do for himself, after finally moving out of Hayvenhurst at the age of 30, even when Michael DID spend time at the homes of others, it was a quick few months and he's gone for years sort of thing. That isn't really mooching.


And as mentioned the "facts" argument goes hand in hand, there are no facts to support the authenticity of these songs. So why get hung up on someone saying something that you feel should be presented with "facts", when at the core of the issue, there isn't one "fact" to support it as of yet.

 

[kreen]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

See this would be a problem, but for some its the same way for Eddie, stop stating facts without Evidence. I don't find it harmful if someone feels like its a fact to them and its easy throwing to people "you should be in court" not everyone is in a position to do that, fact is we have someone who has and need as much support as they can to get this case laid out in court properly.

and as a side note we know alost certainly there wasn't any sign or evidence of MJ's vocals around the time of registration, but there is testimony from someone who prepared the songs for Michael to sing to, who says they contained Portes vocals.

I'm the one who had the long email exchange with that Montrone (was that his name?) guy, and he said there was nothing suspicious about Porte's vocals being on the tracks, as that would be to prevent leaks. He also (when I wrote to him) believed it was MJ on the CD.

Cascio registering what he had recorded with MJ in the 48 hours after his death makes PERFECT sense, as those recordings had all of a sudden become extremely valuable, and the media were all over how everybody was going into MJ's house and taking hard drives and everything. Brad Buxer also registered a bunch of tracks after MJ's death.

The MJ songbook lists MJ as being a performer on the tracks. So either they had SOME MJ vocals to register, or they had already decided, 2 days after his death, to pull off the hoax. Which makes no sense.

And why is everybody talking about how the Cascio tracks feature complete adlibs? The reason they cut and pasted all those adlibs from other songs is precisely because the songs lacked adlibs. And multi-tracked vocals? I don't know about that either : I hear one main track and a lot of Porte on the choruses. Montrone has said that Porte does a killer MJ impersonation by the way...

 

[kreen]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I wouldn't really call it "mooching" when you have those actually willing to look out for you. "Mooching" is you willingly half assing everything while the person providing for you is basically telling you to get your shit together.

well, if that's your definition, ok, but then it perfectly fits the description of what happened in Barhein! l'm sure of course the Cascios were happy to have MJ over, which brings another question : why would people so nice to MJ, so loyal, so trustworthy, would then become money-obsessed backstabbers and criminals in an instant, and not one or two, but the WHOLE family (because they'd all have to be covering up for Eddie). None of you would betray MJ like this, and you don't even know him. So let's show restraint before we assume that a whole family of ACTUAL, beyond-reproach friends are a bunch of monsters.

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

MJ was broke and he was mooching off, sorry if actual reality offends your sensibility. Oh, and he had been mooching off that Bahrain prince before.

Again?? Seriously banned! You had some pretty disgusting hateful comments about Michael and his health in Great debate thread just to fit your agenda why songs doesn't sound anything like MJ, but you've been proven wrong with The Last Photoshoots documentary.

And about money thing, MJ had enough money to live on its own. He couldn't live the lifestyle he was living in the late '90 anymore, but he could have lived alone for sure just like he did before and after the Cascios. He was there mainly for the emotional support, not financial, because he thought of them as friends (and they were just that in 2007).

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

why would people so nice to MJ, so loyal, so trustworthy, would then become money-obsessed backstabbers and criminals in an instant, and not one or two, but the WHOLE family (because they'd all have to be covering up for Eddie).

Why? Because of money. Simple. Many of his so called "friends" betrayed him for money. And there was never the whole family in question. Only Eddie & Frank. No one ever mentioned his father, mother, sister or younger brother. It was always the Cascios (Eddie & Frank) or the Cascio brothers (Eddie & Frank).

 

[HIStory]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Yeah I know we are not in that phase and that it may not get there. I still think this will be an expert driven case, unless someone has some photos showing specific things and handwritten notes.

Earlier in this thread I gave a couple of examples of what kind of evidence and testimony could be provided here. For example if it's true what some people here say that despite of what the Estate statement said it's not true that all producers and musicologists agreed it was MJ and they testify about that then it's more than just expert testimony. Then that would show that the Estate knowingly lied and mislead the public in that statement. As we know there was also a strong protest from the family at the time and Tarryll wrote this back then:

If this is true and these people would testify to this then that's more than just expert testimony. This shows at the very least that there wasn't an unanimous agreement from all who were present that it was MJ. As the Estate of MJ why would you push something that is so controversial? If there are question marks over these vocals there should be more due diligence done until those questions are resolved. Not to rush them to get published while there are people with strong doubts about those vocals.

Also in a court case Eddie would be forced to present whatever evidence he has if he has some. If he doesn't then that too would be telling taken together with all the other facts.

Like I said in Great debate thread some times ago, you should be banned for all the disgusting things you said about Michael. Shame on you!

I really find it shocking that some people can be so invested in taking sides with people around Michael that they end up throwing Michael under the bus to defend those people. Whether it's the Karen Faye fans or Cascio fans, or LMP or Debbie Rowe fans. Sometimes I wonder if these people are more fans of these people than Michael. Because they keep defending these people even at the price of throwing MJ under the bus. There was no need to to use words which are insulting to MJ such as "mooching off" the Cascios.

@Kreen. It's not like the Cascios never had their benefits from befriending Michael, so to say MJ "mooched them off" because he lived there for a couple of weeks is just out of line. For how many weeks, months and years the Cascios kept visiting Neverland and some of them basically lived there and invited all their friends and buddies there to have parties and what not? Michael also took them to trips and tours etc. But yeah, because MJ lived there for a few weeks let's insult him and say he "mooched them off" and somehow he owed something to the Cascios.

well, if that's your definition, ok, but then it perfectly fits the description of what happened in Barhein! l'm sure of course the Cascios were happy to have MJ over, which brings another question : why would people so nice to MJ, so loyal, so trustworthy, would then become money-obsessed backstabbers and criminals in an instant, and not one or two, but the WHOLE family (because they'd all have to be covering up for Eddie). None of you would betray MJ like this, and you don't even know him. So let's show restraint before we assume that a whole family of ACTUAL, beyond-reproach friends are a bunch of monsters.

Why did the Robsons, Safechucks etc. become just that? You act like this never happened around Michael, when in reality it just keeps happening over and over again. (Not to say this is as bad as what the Robsons and Safechucks pulled - nothing tops that in terms of betrayal and evil.) I actually don't think the whole family is on it. They may defend their own, which is natural, but they may be mislead too. It's about Eddie, not the whole Cascio family. I'm not mad at the whole family. In fact, I think they seem nice people. But those songs are not MJ.

 

[LastTear]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

^^^^^^^ Ah yes these family members with much to say but who take no action.