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MJs vocals on Triumph

AdeZ said:
For Dirty Diana, the leaked "pack" sourced from stream recordings is from stems, what i've heard is from the actual multitrack, it's not too much slower, but it definitely is a bit slower.

Speed Demon, pitch the album version down a key, and see how it sounds compared to the demo, you'll realize they should sound similar, since the strings sound the same on the chorus you can use that to compare, speed demon was definitely sped up quite a bit.
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Dirty Diana might be a bit slower but I can't hear a noticeable difference with the pitch & with Speed Demon the strings in the final version do sound a bit higher than the demo so it may have been sped up or they may have just recorded the final version in a higher key.
AdeZ said:
Let me correct myself, Your Ways is just slightly sped up, by around 2-3%.
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How did you find out the percentage for Your Ways? Do you know how much other songs were sped up by?
 
8th wonder said:
Dirty Diana might be a bit slower but I can't hear a noticeable difference with the pitch & with Speed Demon the strings in the final version do sound a bit higher than the demo so it may have been sped up or they may have just recorded the final version in a higher key.
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nah speed demon definitely was recorded in the lower key, then sped up later.

8th wonder said:
How did you find out the percentage for Your Ways? Do you know how much other songs were sped up by?
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I checked the multitrack for that, and well I know which songs for sure were sped up, but I didn't calculate any of the percentages, sorry.
 
8th wonder said:
The quality of Michael's voice on Triumph was amazing and was arguably his best however his tone sounded slightly different to Off The Wall which was only recorded a year prior. Not sure how to describe how it changed (maybe some tracks were slightly sped up or it sounded a bit brighter) but there was a slight difference which you can even hear on the late Destiny tour shows e.g. Oakland.
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I agree 100%, Triumph and OTW are my absolute favourite albums that MJ ever sung on. OTW is still my fave MJ album and Triumph, my fave with his brothers. His voice was at its peak at that period (my personal opinion). I wish the Estate would remaster and re-release the Triumph tour, he just looked and felt so at home performing with his brothers then unlike how seperate they seemed during the Victory tour.
 
all the speeding up shit is really sad. there isn't a track that I heard at real speed that doesn't sound better than the "original" speed-up version.
 
BlackAnon said:
Everybody on Triumph is pitched up....I did an edit a few years back and pitched it down to Michael's original tone and it sounds better that way
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That’s the one song that directly comes to mind. His voice sounds so unnatural here because of the speed up. Can you share your version where you pitched it down?
 
reconstructing the original speeds should be possible for most tracks by comparing the Linndrum samples
 
Interesting thread! I think the vocals on OTW are superior to those on Triumph.

Don't get me wrong there are some amazing performances especially time waits for no one and Heartbreak Hotel.

I've often wondered if MJ put more effort into say OTW over Triumph and purposely held back on the vocals? I'm probably talking rubbish ha
 
‘everybody’ is my favourite song on the ‘triumph’ album. I think it was worthy of the single/video/performance treatment.

it sounded perfect the way it was released. it only sounds unnatural when the vocals are tampered with. particularly when they’re lowered and the brightness is removed - which was supposed to be the overall mood in the first place.

whether the vocals were pitched up or not, and for whatever reason, michael didn’t need to do it. he had the range to sing it that way.
 
83magic said:
‘everybody’ is my favourite song on the ‘triumph’ album. I think it was worthy of the single/video/performance treatment.

it sounded perfect the way it was released. it only sounds unnatural when the vocals are tampered with. particularly when they’re lowered and the brightness is removed - which was supposed to be the overall mood in the first place.

whether the vocals were pitched up or not, and for whatever reason, michael didn’t need to do it. he had the range to sing it that way.
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The song wasn’t pitched up per se, the speed was increased and a byproduct of that was a slight change in pitch. I also want to stress that it’s not like he all of a sudden sang in a different key. To the average listener things like this goes unnoticeable but if you would try to play along to the song with an instrument you’d see that it would sound slightly off and it wouldn’t correspond correctly to what you’re hearing on the record.
 
After listening to the recent multitrack/acapella leaks it can confirmed a lot of the songs were pitched/sped up e.g. Lovely One, Everybody, Walk Right Now. The Destiny tour show in Oakland I mentioned in the original post was also pitched/sped up.
 
I think it also depends on what format music is played on, as well as the earphones/speakers.

I initially heard the ‘triumph’ album on cd 💿 i believe it was the first pressing. the volume was low no matter how high i turned it up. i also remember the pitch being lower and the tempo being slower. I was disappointed - especially after hearing ‘lovely one’ on the radio where it sounded so vibrant.

i then heard the album on cassette, which is my second preference after digital streaming/mp3, etc. the pitch was even higher than today’s official version. the tempo was faster, and the overall sound was much fuller than the cd 💿

i once read a review that said michael sounded muted on the ‘triumph’ album. I think he actually sounded the best next to ‘thriller’. he was smooth and effortless whether he was expressing joy or anxiety. I think his falsetto was weaker compared to his work with quincy, however there’s less strain on his voice on ‘triumph’. it actually sounded the most natural like his speaking. i have a preference for high soft vocals💜
 
AdeZ said:
Most of the BAD album is sped up, TWYMMF given the worse end of things though, Bad is sped up a lot, the original sounds so much more groovier, meanwhile the album track sounds like a dance track, you cant dance to something that's not somewhat upbeat
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Brad Sundberg told Michael loved to push the button to speed up songs... on BAD, all songs are sped up, except – ironically – Speed Demon. At least that is what I remember from Brad's In the Studio with Michael sessions. Correct me if I'm wrong!
 
Piek said:
except – ironically – Speed Demon. At least that is what I remember from Brad's In the Studio with Michael sessions.
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No way the "you preachin bout my life like you're the law ..." isn't sped up
 
I wonder why in the 2012 remaster of Another Part of Me they restored the original speed, but not on others

take this:

 
Jaburu said:
I wonder why in the 2012 remaster of Another Part of Me they restored the original speed, but not on others

take this:

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They didn't, the speed on APOM stayed the same throughout every re-release and variant of the Bad album (on CD and LP, cassette is it's own can of worms but it should also be the same.)
APOM was only sped up in the singles haha
 
Off the Wall sounds more modern compared to Triumph, despite arriving a few years later.

To me it highlights just how well the production is on OTW with Q , Bruce etc. An absolute dream team made in heaven.
 
Blues_Away2023 said:
Off the Wall sounds more modern compared to Triumph, despite arriving a few years later.

To me it highlights just how well the production is on OTW with Q , Bruce etc. An absolute dream team made in heaven.
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I still wonder what Quincy would've did with heartbreak Hotel. Idk when Michael wrote it but he should've saved it for a solo album. It is a solo song by him
 
wonderouzmj said:
I still wonder what Quincy would've did with heartbreak Hotel. Idk when Michael wrote it but he should've saved it for a solo album. It is a solo song by him
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I can't see Heartbreak Hotel on a solo album....the closest would've been Bad but even then, it would've competed with Dirty Diana
 
Blues_Away2023 said:
Off the Wall sounds more modern compared to Triumph, despite arriving a few years later.

To me it highlights just how well the production is on OTW with Q , Bruce etc. An absolute dream team made in heaven.
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IMO opinion, Destiny >>>> Triumph.

Shake Your Body/ Push Me Away/ Blame It On The Boogie could have made it on to Off The Wall and I would have been perfectly fine with that.
 
‘triumph’ might be the only album where michael’s vocals didn’t contain a level of grit. that’s probably why I like them the most. yet they sounded effortless and natural. almost like his speech in some places. there was still something raw and unpolished about them though.. maybe it was the fact that the album was recorded so soon after ‘off the wall’, and without quincy’s guidance?
 
Blues_Away2023 said:
Off the Wall sounds more modern compared to Triumph, despite arriving a few years later.

To me it highlights just how well the production is on OTW with Q , Bruce etc. An absolute dream team made in heaven.
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It's only a years difference. But Bruce Swedien's mastering of Off The Wall, and even the subsequent versions, highlight the depth of the quality playing on that one.
 
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