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History Tour

A lot of places on HIStory and Dangerous were their first experience of Michael too, so it's not a surprise the "best-of" formula didn't change too much.
 
mj_frenzy said:
The answer to this question is very easy and it does not require deep analysis, if one takes into account his sleep problems during the HIStory Tour (and onwards).

Michael Jackson's levels of adrenaline were so high right after each HIStory concert, and this (along with his chronic insomnia that already existed) made it for him even more difficult to sleep properly later in the hotel.

Debbie Rowe testified that, at first, the singer was given certain sedatives (during the HIStory Tour), but they failed to help him sleep.

Debbie Rowe also testified that Michael Jackson then started to be given more powerful drugs (such as, Propofol) via Dr. Allen Metzger in order to get proper sleep right after each HIStory concert.

The fact that Michael Jackson was given so powerful drugs (while touring) led to him getting physically and psychologically sicker (because such drugs deteriorate one's physical, psychological, and mental health).
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I know, but the question is : WHY did his adrenaline or stress get so high that he couldn't sleep? Thousands and thousands of singers and artists tour and do concerts, often with just as much energy and using just as much adrenaline as MJ, and they don't need propofol to go to sleep every night.
 
Unless we take a full physical and mental health medical history of Michael there’s no way to explain that - some people are prone to high levels of stress, anxiety that can all play havoc on cortisol levels so perhaps he suffered with that throughout his life. Given the relentless pressures he faced and the public scrutiny I’m not all that surprised .
 
kreen said:
I know, but the question is : WHY did his adrenaline or stress get so high that he couldn't sleep? Thousands and thousands of singers and artists tour and do concerts, often with just as much energy and using just as much adrenaline as MJ, and they don't need propofol to go to sleep every night.
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To me it's telling of MJ pre and post 93 allegations, it changed everything about him.

The man had extreme mental health issues and was allowed to live in his own fantasy world that formed part of his downfall. He really lost touch of reality in my opinion.

Let's say you're the most celebrated, number 1 entertainer in the world with fame beyond even the A list and the only controversy is about your skin colour or how odd and mysterious your life is....

You're now accused of a hideous and disgusting crime that goes against everything you stood for and main inspiration.

MJ was a sensitive soul, how would you feel knowing the whole world knows what you were accused of. I'd be paranoid and worried that every person I spoke with thought I was an abuser.

I would most definitely be struggling to stay awake at nights with this alone throw in all the other crap and it's easy to see why he could not sleep.
 
kreen said:
I know, but the question is : WHY did his adrenaline or stress get so high that he couldn't sleep? Thousands and thousands of singers and artists tour and do concerts, often with just as much energy and using just as much adrenaline as MJ, and they don't need propofol to go to sleep every night.
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TeaMJ said:
Unless we take a full physical and mental health medical history of Michael there’s no way to explain that - some people are prone to high levels of stress, anxiety that can all play havoc on cortisol levels so perhaps he suffered with that throughout his life. Given the relentless pressures he faced and the public scrutiny I’m not all that surprised .
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Michael Jackson himself provided an explanation for that in the early '00s to his close friend Cory Rooney:

"Cory, I can't tour anymore. I'm not gonna tour anymore. Ok? ... Because it will kill me ... Well, remember when I was preparing for my [1995 HBO] concert and I passed out at the Sony Studio? Well, it's because when I get ready for a tour I get dehydrated. I don't eat. I don't drink. I don't sleep. I put so much of myself into preparing for a tour" (Michael Jackson)

That happened also during the Dangerous Tour, when for example he could not eat and drink at all, and doctors had to give him food and drinks intravenously (i.e., by means of a vein).
 
mj_frenzy said:
Michael Jackson himself provided an explanation for that in the early '00s to his close friend Cory Rooney:

"Cory, I can't tour anymore. I'm not gonna tour anymore. Ok? ... Because it will kill me ... Well, remember when I was preparing for my [1995 HBO] concert and I passed out at the Sony Studio? Well, it's because when I get ready for a tour I get dehydrated. I don't eat. I don't drink. I don't sleep. I put so much of myself into preparing for a tour" (Michael Jackson)

That happened also during the Dangerous Tour, when for example he could not eat and drink at all, and doctors had to give him food and drinks intravenously (i.e., by means of a vein).
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Yes, but again, why? Other stars, artists and singers dont have the same visceral, physical negative reaction to the idea of touring. And he himself didn't use to be like that.
 
kreen said:
Yes, but again, why? Other stars, artists and singers dont have the same visceral, physical negative reaction to the idea of touring. And he himself didn't use to be like that.
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Because Michael Jackson also suffered from lung damage and chronically inflamed lungs (according to his autopsy report).

This also explains the fact that during the Dangerous Tour, and even during the 1992 leg, right after his Dangerous concert he used to be driven back to the hotel in an ambulance (with acute symptoms such as, severe exhaustion, shortness of breath, dehydration, and so on).
 
What is this obsession with second guessing and questioning Michael???

Why do you need to know his reasons???

It was 1996 / 1997. A very different time. Concerts were designed and created for the real time on the day audiences, and were never meant to be over anazyed by the digiatl generation.

Those of us who were there, had once in a life a time experiences, we experienced the shows as Michael wanted us to experience them.

Just let it go. He is dead, and has been dead for 15 years.

Enjoy the concerts or dont, thats an opinion, but to not understand the process, the way Michael thought, how he lived his life, how he created his art and wanted to share it with the public is wrong.
 
Moonstreet said:
Im always amused at the difference in views between those who experienced a History concert in real life and those who only have seen it on a screen.

The concerts were meant to be an experience, a real life event. They were never meant to be over analyzed and scrutinized, and the minute details zoomed in on.

They were of the the time, before the internet, before social media, before mobile phones. People went to the concert, enjoyed it on the day.

Afterwards, if we found a low quality bootleg video of the concert, we cherished it, as a way to remember a once in a life time experience.

It was seeing Michael on stage, hearing the music loud and sharing the experience with the crowd that made the concerts magical.
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Many HIStory Tour concerts were shown on TV at the time so I'm sure scrutinizing was expected.
 
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Moonstreet said:
What is this obsession with second guessing and questioning Michael???

Why do you need to know his reasons???

It was 1996 / 1997. A very different time. Concerts were designed and created for the real time on the day audiences, and were never meant to be over anazyed by the digiatl generation.

Those of us who were there, had once in a life a time experiences, we experienced the shows as Michael wanted us to experience them.

Just let it go. He is dead, and has been dead for 15 years.

Enjoy the concerts or dont, thats an opinion, but to not understand the process, the way Michael thought, how he lived his life, how he created his art and wanted to share it with the public is wrong.
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And it was the first time a lot of these countries got to experience MJ. So no wonder he did the classics as those people knew them.
 
One thing the HIStory Tour did better than the Dangerous Tour was the performance of Thriller. HIStory Tour's Thriller looked better visually and the instrumental outro sounded better too. Also the Thriller jacket being worn over the gold Dangerous Tour costume looked kinda silly.

Only downside to the HIStory Tour version of Thriller is that it's beyond obvious that it wasn't Michael performing under the werecat mask. Biggest giveaway is that Michael wore a short sleeve v-neck shirt and the impersonator wore a long sleeved shirt.
 
kreen said:
He toured because he had to, in order to promote the album. He hated doing it, and it could be argued his often-stated wish to quit the music industry in his later years was based entirely on his fear of being forced to tour in support of a new album.
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It's all about having respect for your audience. Charging hundreds of dollars for a ticket and then not singing is disgusting, no matter who does it and for what reason.

kreen said:
It’s also impossible to understand the failure of Invincible without taking into account MJ’s refusal to tour in support of it.
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Thriller didn't do too badly without a tour.
 
R1chard said:
It's all about having respect for your audience. Charging hundreds of dollars for a ticket and then not singing is disgusting, no matter who does it and for what reason.
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To correct this false information.

I was at History Dublin concert. The tickets were not hundreds of dollars. I paid £29.50 for my ticket. General admission was standing and I was in the front section.

I also had multiple tickets for the London concerts in 2009. I paid £75 from Ticketmaster.
 
Moonstreet said:
To correct this false information.
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I didn't say HIStory was hundreds of dollars at the time, I mean for any singer, at any point in time, you should not be pretending to sing if you're not. It's dishonest.

Moonstreet said:
I was at History Dublin concert. The tickets were not hundreds of dollars. I paid £29.50 for my ticket. General admission was standing and I was in the front section.

I also had multiple tickets for the London concerts in 2009. I paid £75 from Ticketmaster.
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Do you really want to open that can of worms? Go to an inflation calculator. £75 in 2009 is worth over £100 in 2024.

Put it another way - MJ was always known for having expensive tickets. £30 in 1995 was approximately half the cost of a Glastonbury ticket. £75 in 2009 was... approximately half the cost of a Glastonbury ticket. In 2024, a Glastonbury ticket was £355 plus a £5 booking fee.

Put it another way, with all the theatrics and personnel, do you think an MJ ticket in 2024 would cost more than an Oasis ticket (which is basically just 4 guys and a handful of guitars)? Well, Oasis tickets were recently £355 ($472) on Ticketmaster.

The industry is trying to make people think "hundreds of dollars" is a normal price for entry to a concert. And for hundreds of dollars, you should most definitely NEVER be pretending to sing if you're not. It's just unacceptable, no matter who you are.

kreen said:
The Victory tour was basically the Thriller tour.
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It's almost like a tour doesn't actually make that much of a difference to album sales, especially for somebody like MJ, where the album doesn't sell most of it's copies in the first year.
 
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🙄🙄🙄 y’all don’t get tired of talking about the same thing over and over. It happened. It's over. It wont change. What are yall complaining about? Michael has done how many live shows from the 70s-1997? “Michael could’ve this or Michael could've that”…we know what killed him, we know he was using propofol on that tour to sleep, we know he had certain issue with laryngitis during some dates, and the issues with he’s had with vocal chords. We know he didn't want to do it and he did it anyway. We know about the adrenaline rushes and the stress of touring to the point he forgets to eat or loses a ton of weight yet yall still complaining as fans expect others to see the human side of him yet yall want him to be perfect in all senses. “Well he shouldn't have done it then” It comes with the job. We have all done something because we felt we had to do it and probably didn't like it or want to be there half the time. He had big bills and was a big spender and was about to be a father on top of everything else.

I get it,going to a “LIVE” show and playing the album track sucks when you have a certain expectation of an artist we get it. Where it lacked in “live vocals” it made up for in dancing, theatrics, and staging(altho i wish he had used the runway more than just for TWYMMF). Of course Michael could have prerecorded some live vocal tracks or used unreleased vocals or changed some of the pitching. But he didnt. Enjoy it or dont. Its that simple.
 
michaelsson said:
“Well he shouldn't have done it then” It comes with the job. We have all done something because we felt we had to do it and probably didn't like it or want to be there half the time.
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www.cbsnews.com

Aerosmith announces retirement from touring due to Steven Tyler's vocal injury

Massachusetts-based rock band Aerosmith has announced that they're retiring from touring and cancelling their farewell tour due to lead singer Steven Tyler's vocal injury.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com

That's an artist who respects their fans. And in return, the fans respect the artist.

michaelsson said:
Enjoy it or dont. Its that simple.
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In order to protect people from being misled, I feel like we need a law that requires artists to declare that they're miming before any tickets are sold.
 
R1chard said:
www.cbsnews.com

Aerosmith announces retirement from touring due to Steven Tyler's vocal injury

Massachusetts-based rock band Aerosmith has announced that they're retiring from touring and cancelling their farewell tour due to lead singer Steven Tyler's vocal injury.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com

That's an artist who respects their fans. And in return, the fans respect the artist.


In order to protect people from being misled, I feel like we need a law that requires artists to declare that they're miming before any tickets are sold.
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Although I agree with you I do think that (as I said before) that he purposfully chose to lip-sync the album audio instead of re-reecordings to actually make it obvious that he is not singing live!
Lip-syncing to your hits is accepted coming from his world (of tv shows) while faking it with new vocals might be not..?
 
R1chard said:
www.cbsnews.com

Aerosmith announces retirement from touring due to Steven Tyler's vocal injury

Massachusetts-based rock band Aerosmith has announced that they're retiring from touring and cancelling their farewell tour due to lead singer Steven Tyler's vocal injury.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com

That's an artist who respects their fans. And in return, the fans respect the artist.


In order to protect people from being misled, I feel like we need a law that requires artists to declare that they're miming before any tickets are sold.
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There were many other factors other than vocal injury that were tied to his health that were mentioned. Michael is not steve tyler. He already had been plagued with “show cancelation” issues previously. He’s damned if he do, damned if he don’t. Even during ‘this is it’ he says ‘I have to conserve my voice so please understand’. His instrument was damaged. If he felt that he could have cancelled he would have but because he respects and loves us he went on and did it anyway. Had it been me, there would have been no tour. But I didnt grow up a stage addict or have the pressures of performing on my back so. But coming off the coattails of the allegations he had to get back out there and he did it the way he chose to do it.

As far as I know no1 is being mislead. A live performance = just that. The artist there in person live. Not a video or impersonator but the artist. So he indeed performed live.
 
Victorious said:
Although I agree with you I do think that (as I said before) that he purposfully chose to lip-sync the album audio instead of re-reecordings to actually make it obvious that he is not singing live!
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I'd love to be able to give him the benefit of the doubt. I really would.

Buy you've got to imagine that if there are 80,000 people in Wembley stadium, 79,000 of those people have never been to a website like this, do they're taking it at face value. Can you see how those people would be upset if they found out at the concert that it wasn't live?

Victorious said:
Lip-syncing to your hits is accepted coming from his world (of tv shows) while faking it with new vocals might be not..?
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Actually, most people agree these TV shows are the scum of the music industry, and that's why they're never taken seriously.

michaelsson said:
There were many other factors other than vocal injury that were tied to his health that were mentioned. Michael is not steve tyler. He already had been plagued with “show cancelation” issues previously. He’s damned if he do, damned if he don’t.
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As I said, if you're not fit enough to tour, then don't tour. It really is that simple. People will understand, nobody is gonna judge you for it.

Like, if you were a great guitarist and you had an accident and lost your hand, you're just gonna have to accept that you can't work as a guitarist any more.

If you were a great singer but you used to smoke and now your throat is shot from cancer, you're just gonna have to accept that you can't work as a singer any more.

If you were a great dancer but you broke your back, you're just gonna have to accept that you can't work as a dancer any more.

If you were a great live sound engineer but now you're 96 years old and can't stay awake past 9pm, you're just gonna have to accept that you can't work as a live sound engineer any more.

michaelsson said:
As far as I know no1 is being mislead. A live performance = just that. The artist there in person live. Not a video or impersonator but the artist. So he indeed performed live.
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I'm sorry I can't really reply to this in good faith.

Do you think Oasis are going to mime on their comeback?
 
R1chard said:
As I said, if you're not fit enough to tour, then don't tour. It really is that simple. People will understand, nobody is gonna judge you for it.

Like, if you were a great guitarist and you had an accident and lost your hand, you're just gonna have to accept that you can't work as a guitarist any more.

If you were a great singer but you used to smoke and now your throat is shot from cancer, you're just gonna have to accept that you can't work as a singer any more.

If you were a great dancer but you broke your back, you're just gonna have to accept that you can't work as a dancer any more.

If you were a great live sound engineer but now you're 96 years old and can't stay awake past 9pm, you're just gonna have to accept that you can't work as a live sound engineer any more.


I'm sorry I can't really reply to this in good faith.
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It’s not really that simple. Again not only do fans have expectations there are pple who Michael took care of. Not to mention coming off a big settlement, a new father and other business ventures, also paying the pple he employs including lawyers and who knows what else. Everyone knows that touring is where the money is. And it’s a great way to connect with the fans. telling someone that can’t do what they were born to do…be serious. But again…you do what for a living? Exactly.
 
R1chard said:
As I said, if you're not fit enough to tour, then don't tour. It really is that simple. People will understand, nobody is gonna judge you for it.
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Now you are juts trolling.

You obviously have no clue.

You cant even be bothered to read the archives of this forum to back up your claims.

This forum and the fan community went into meltdown in June 2009 when it was announced that opening night would be moved to July 13 and the other shows moved to the end of the run. It was insane, there were fans who were cursing Michael left right and centre, and saying they were leaving the fan community.

Your constant claims about Michael are baseless and false. People really did not care, people wanted to see Michael onstage. You are just spouting lies and fake assumptions and have no understanding of the actual reality of the situations.

Jackson Reschedules London Opening Shows
Michael Jackson has postponed the first four nights of his "This Is It" tour, which was due to begin at London's O2 Arena on July 8th this year. The opening night has been pushed back until July 13th while the other three rescheduled dates will now take place in March 2010.

In a bid to appease those travelling from outside London and the UK, AEG expressed their hope that those with tickets would have enough time to change their travel plans.
"We do not want anyone to miss this once-in-a-lifetime experience. We understand the inconvenience this may have caused and for this reason we have secured some excellent hotel deals for Michael Jackson fans traveling to London on these rescheduled dates."

The dates have been rescheduled as follows:

The July 8th show will now take place on 13th July 2009
The July 10th show will now take place on 1st March 2010
The July 12th show will now take place on 3rd March 2010
The July 14th show will now take place on 6th March 2010
 
michaelsson said:
It’s not really that simple. Again not only do fans have expectations there are pple who Michael took care of. Not to mention coming off a big settlement, a new father and other business ventures, also paying the pple he employs including lawyers and who knows what else. Everyone knows that touring is where the money is. And it’s a great way to connect with the fans. telling someone that can’t do what they were born to do…be serious. But again…you do what for a living? Exactly.
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what a lackluster (if existent,at all) so called "argument" to their post,lmao..
 
Immortal MJJ said:
what a lackluster (if existent,at all) so called "argument" to their post,lmao.
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Nothing lackluster about my argument. Maybe comprehension is where you lack. Its easy to say what someone should have done when you’re not in their position or feel what they feel on a regular basis. You can't give a damn near 3hr show and take it around the world after performing hundreds of shows and you probably havent even faced 1/4 of the things Michael has. He had to work and he went to work. He did what HE FELT he had to do. Thats the end of it. Who are you or anyone else to tell someone when to do their job?
 
Moonstreet said:
Now you are juts trolling.

You obviously have no clue.

You cant even be bothered to read the archives of this forum to back up your claims.

This forum and the fan community went into meltdown in June 2009 when it was announced that opening night would be moved to July 13 and the other shows moved to the end of the run. It was insane, there were fans who were cursing Michael left right and centre, and saying they were leaving the fan community.

Your constant claims about Michael are baseless and false. People really did not care, people wanted to see Michael onstage. You are just spouting lies and fake assumptions and have no understanding of the actual reality of the situations.

Jackson Reschedules London Opening Shows
Michael Jackson has postponed the first four nights of his "This Is It" tour, which was due to begin at London's O2 Arena on July 8th this year. The opening night has been pushed back until July 13th while the other three rescheduled dates will now take place in March 2010.

In a bid to appease those travelling from outside London and the UK, AEG expressed their hope that those with tickets would have enough time to change their travel plans.
"We do not want anyone to miss this once-in-a-lifetime experience. We understand the inconvenience this may have caused and for this reason we have secured some excellent hotel deals for Michael Jackson fans traveling to London on these rescheduled dates."

The dates have been rescheduled as follows:

The July 8th show will now take place on 13th July 2009
The July 10th show will now take place on 1st March 2010
The July 12th show will now take place on 3rd March 2010
The July 14th show will now take place on 6th March 2010
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Exactly. A damn frenzy ensued. Pple were pissed off. And this was after years of planned and canceled things. Its always the post June 25th “fans” with these ridiculous takes.
 
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