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50 dates? no economic sense

MJJ2theMAX

MJJ2theMAX

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it has been really bothering me

I believe MJ never wanted to do 50 dates.. mainly cos it came from his mouth to a group of fans

but lets ignore whether he did or did not want / know about 50 dates

Why 50 dates in 1 small venue? if you wanted money, why not go to wembley stadium with a far bigger capacity, where youd only need to be doing a far smaller number of shows?

yes i KNOW the o2 has great accoustics etc.. but REALLY??? 50 shows at the o2??
 
AEG own the 02.they wanted the attention and money it would generate. like you say why do 50 shows there when u could do 10 at wembley to the same amount of ppl. it was all about £ and p.r for AEG imo. the amount of shows got out of hand because of the £ signs
 
yeh but if MJ were wanting to make the amount of money 50 shows generate.. wouldnt he not do a deal with AEG cos the o2 is a relatively small venue? wouldnt he have looked elsewhere...

urrrghhh NOTHING makes sense

and now ive just found out Mark lester is godfather to matt fiddes' kids... well that just took the biscuit
 
Knowing absolutely nothing about concert promotion I'll hazard a guess.

AEG were promoting the concerts and also own the o2. It'd have cost them (more) to hire Wembley?

I would imagine the cost of moving road crew, stage set and basically the whole shebang involved from country to country would be huge. Not so huge if kept to one venue - and if they could fill one venue fifty times why move around - not many could fill the same stadium fifty times over I would imagine so if someone can it would make financial sense to keep it in one place?

One venue would give Michael the chance to down some roots there temporarily. I'd say that was far more appealing to him than the thought of doing shows in different countries instead ... dragging the kids around with him from place to place too.

For what its worth thats what I think

Plus the supposed wish to beat Prince's record of concerts he did there too.
 
mischief said:
AEG were promoting the concerts and also own the o2. It'd have cost them (more) to hire Wembley?

I would imagine the cost of moving road crew, stage set and basically the whole shebang involved from country to country would be huge. Not so huge if kept to one venue - and if they could fill one venue fifty times why move around - not many could fill the same stadium fifty times over I would imagine so if someone can it would make financial sense to keep it in one place?

One venue would give Michael the chance to down some roots there temporarily. I'd say that was far more appealing to him than the thought of doing shows in different countries instead ... dragging the kids around with him from place to place too.

For what its worth thats what I think

Plus the supposed wish to beat Prince's record of concerts he did there too.
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and this is why it does makes perfect economic sense.
 
But Kenny Ortega said Michael wanted to do "many many" more shows, and talked about how excited Michael was about continuing his tour, taking it to India.

Kenny cannot be lying because Michael told us about how much he loves India and its people.
 
lovelymj said:
So Michael was supposed to do more shows? Not only in London?
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Of course. He was going to extend it. He was even planning on comming to the US. He was actually just teasin us to see how we would react and that's why he didn't say ANYTHING. That's sounds like something he would do. Cause we know Michael, he likes to tease sometimes.

My uncle who works in the industry spoke to someone who was with him before his death. And they told him of all the plans Michael had, such as 300 shows total(some of them Michael was planning to do in the US), new album, a clothing line, a museum...but that's all I remember. It was actually a list that Michael made.

And the news about the clothing line was just released recently.
 
kasume said:
Of course. He was going to extend it. He was even planning on comming to the US. He was actually just teasin us to see how we would react and that's why he didn't say ANYTHING. That's sounds like something he would do. Cause we know Michael, he likes to tease sometimes.

My uncle who works in the industry spoke to someone who was with him before his death. And they told him of all the plans Michael had, such as 300 shows total(some of them Michael was planning to do in the US), new album, a clothing line, a museum...but that's all I remember. It was actually a list that Michael made.
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300 shows??? hahaha yeah of course, that's HISTORY TOUR almost quadrupled (!!!) ... hello??
 
O my god, I didn't know that. I can't believe he was planning to come in the US, that would have been my dream come true.*Sigh*
 
yeah all the dancers, Karen etc were asked if they were free for the next 2 years

I see that having shows in 1 place is good for MJ cos you dont have to move the kids around.. but why the o2,.. why not wembley stadium.. where he could do far fewer shows but make the same money??

i know AEG owns the o2.. so why not sign with another tour promoter

(the only reason i ask is that it adds more weight to the argument that MJ didnt want to do 50 shows... that and the fact he said it himself of course.. which is pretty much conclusive! )
 
elusive moonwalker said:
AEG own the 02.they wanted the attention and money it would generate. like you say why do 50 shows there when u could do 10 at wembley to the same amount of ppl. it was all about £ and p.r for AEG imo. the amount of shows got out of hand because of the £ signs
Click to expand...

Yeah AEG just want attention on the O2 like when Prince was there.
 
I heard talks that MJ was going to come to the U.S. (I'll have to find out where my cousin got that info), but I believe it was on the news after the response to his sold out shows for the first ten.
 
MJJ2theMAX said:
i know AEG owns the o2.. so why not sign with another tour promoter

(the only reason i ask is that it adds more weight to the argument that MJ didnt want to do 50 shows... that and the fact he said it himself of course.. which is pretty much conclusive! )
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why not sign with another promoter... is a good point. I think others wouldn't take the risk, we all know the insurance around this certainly 'seems' dodgy - but Dr Tohme Tohme's friend Tom Barrack who owns Colony Captial (the company who owns the majority of Neverland) set up Michael with AEG through its owner Philip Anschutz http://www.latimes.com/entertainmen...on31-2009may31,0,1441957.story?page=1(article from before Michael died) - as I know some people don't like clicking on links, the article I've previously pasted in full on this thread... http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=72708&highlight=tohme+colony
 
myfavouritewintercoat said:
why not sign with another promoter... is a good point. I think others wouldn't take the risk, we all know the insurance around this certainly 'seems' dodgy - but Dr Tohme Tohme's friend Tom Barrack who owns Colony Captial (the company who owns the majority of Neverland) set up Michael with AEG through its owner Philip Anschutz http://www.latimes.com/entertainmen...on31-2009may31,0,1441957.story?page=1(article from before Michael died) - as I know some people don't like clicking on links, the article I've previously pasted in full on this thread... http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=72708&highlight=tohme+colony
Click to expand...

When did he though? Because weren't rumours were flying about in respect to Michael doing concerts at the o2 upto a year before Colony became involved in the Neverland deal? And I seem to recall reading something about Michael turning them down at least once, maybe twice before Colony and Tohme Tohme made an appearance.
 
The O2 is smaller and so people are more likely to get a better view than being in a big stadium like Wembley, so it doesn't surprise me that Michael would choose the O2 over Wembley. He wanted his fans to have good views. Plus the fact that Michael had already done Wembley; the O2 is THE venue now.
 
yeah i do understand all that love.him, i realise o2 has better sounds, better view etc etc... but... financial reasons must have been the driving force behind this.. and if we are to believe MJ wanted the amount of money 50 shows at the 02 would bring... why not just do 15 at wembley stadium?

it just doesnt sit right with me

(i still dont think MJ wanted to do 50 shows anyway.. but thats for a sepearate topic)
 
myfavouritewintercoat said:
why not sign with another promoter... is a good point. I think others wouldn't take the risk, we all know the insurance around this certainly 'seems' dodgy - but Dr Tohme Tohme's friend Tom Barrack who owns Colony Captial (the company who owns the majority of Neverland) set up Michael with AEG through its owner Philip Anschutz http://www.latimes.com/entertainmen...on31-2009may31,0,1441957.story?page=1(article from before Michael died) - as I know some people don't like clicking on links, the article I've previously pasted in full on this thread... http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=72708&highlight=tohme+colony
Click to expand...

very interesting...
 
mischief said:
When did he though? Because weren't rumours were flying about in respect to Michael doing concerts at the o2 upto a year before Colony became involved in the Neverland deal? And I seem to recall reading something about Michael turning them down at least once, maybe twice before Colony and Tohme Tohme made an appearance.
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yeah you are right I think he turned down Randy Phillips before but once Colony/Tohme/Anschutz got to him they persuaded him to do it to help his situation - well thats what that article implies anyway - whether or not its true we don't know like many other things associated with all this :(
 
kenny ortega is still under contract w/ aeg...remember that.

and the dancers were too for two MORE yrs..not including this one.

aeg's venue in las vegas would b complete in 2011 and mj was supposed to end his run there.
 
i remember there was 10 initially but then it extended to 31. and then grew to 50 dates. they werent gonna be back to back shows. like 2 shows a week so he could go off and do other things.
 
also i remember reading that originally he just wanted to do a few shows in london and then take the show on the road. he was gonna even come to australia and do the usa last
 
myfavouritewintercoat said:
yeah you are right I think he turned down Randy Phillips before but once Colony/Tohme/Anschutz got to him they persuaded him to do it to help his situation - well thats what that article implies anyway - whether or not its true we don't know like many other things associated with all this :(
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thats VERY interesting.. thanks for this

something smells not quite right here
 
it actually makes a lot of sense to do shows at one venue. celine dion did a whole series of concerts in vegas. plus madonna had wembley booked i think for her shows. lugging around equipment stage to stage pushes up the $$$ for everything

MJJ2theMAX said:
it has been really bothering me

I believe MJ never wanted to do 50 dates.. mainly cos it came from his mouth to a group of fans

but lets ignore whether he did or did not want / know about 50 dates

Why 50 dates in 1 small venue? if you wanted money, why not go to wembley stadium with a far bigger capacity, where youd only need to be doing a far smaller number of shows?

yes i KNOW the o2 has great accoustics etc.. but REALLY??? 50 shows at the o2??
Click to expand...
 
eh but if MJ were wanting to make the amount of money 50 shows generate.. wouldnt he not do a deal with AEG cos the o2 is a relatively small venue? wouldnt he have looked elsewhere...
Click to expand...
well i guess mj wasnt that bothered interms of making the money.i mean interms of the facts are AEG went to mj about 3 times offereing him a deal to do do the 02. mj turned them down. so its not like it was his idea. like u say it would have been far easier for mj to do x amount of shows at wembley instead. but AEG brought the offer to him and not the other way around if u get me. its not mj decided i want to do some shows lets go talk to different ppl. AEG came to him with the offer.

AEG confirmed they had offered mj the chance to take the tour world wide after the 02. dancers had been asked if there were free for 3 years approx. but AEG stated mj had not agreed to anything other than the 02. mj was never gonna agree till until the shows in london were over.. everything else is just media speculation
 
it actually makes a lot of sense to do shows at one venue. celine dion did a whole series of concerts in vegas. plus madonna had wembley booked i think for her shows. lugging around equipment stage to stage pushes up the $$$ for everything
Click to expand...
celine spent about 3 years in vegas doing shows. wembley had other shows on but that doesnt stop you from booking dates. and if u do say 5 shows at wembley you arent lugging around anything. the bottom line is this was AEG's idea they own the 02 so put the offer to mj. they dont own wembley etc if it was mjs idea then yeah you might have had a few shows at the stadium and that was it. but AEG wanted the P.R of getting mj to the 02. hence why they made the offer to him.
 
krism said:
it actually makes a lot of sense to do shows at one venue. celine dion did a whole series of concerts in vegas. plus madonna had wembley booked i think for her shows. lugging around equipment stage to stage pushes up the $$$ for everything
Click to expand...

I agree, much easier to keep all the equipment in one place for a while and doing a few shows a week doesn't sound much, I think maybe in his head '50' just seemed so much ahead of him after not doing a tour in years(but thats just me guessing) That may have been the reason for insomnia coupled with the fact he was a perfectionist so would probably worry about every aspect wanting it perfect for London(and I don't blame him) but was he worried about his health too thats the question we all want answered... I think the fact that it was 10 then 31 gigs then 50 shows that AEG or his management wanted to the press to say he'd do more than Prince had.
 
In the real world Wembley would have been the best idea. Its a good location has plenty of hotels etc. And for a few nights the amount of people who could have seen the concert would have been easier than dragging it out over 50 nights.

In the money world being offered what AEG did, I mean lets face it they were picking up the bill for everything even down to the doc and accomodation. It was an amazing deal.

If it had been Wembley, MJ would have had to support himself monetary wise more because no other promoter would have offered what AEG did.

The 02 is out on a limb, I was surprised when went there. If you go on tube get out and go into 02 then fair enough. But we stayed at Holiday Inn Express up the road, which was the only hotel near the thing. Passing the scruffy car parks which have overgrown weeds everywhere. The 02 venue itself is great, but the location isnt so. And for a large venue not to be serviced by hotels aplenty is appalling - reminds me of Twickenham where theres hardly any accomodation close.
 
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