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Book: Remember the Time: Protecting Michael Jackson in His Final Days / Review @pg8

Why is Liz's name the first one that comes up in this context? MJ was on good terms with her until the day he died, so obviously it's not her.
 
Snow White luvs Peter Pan said:
I hope it wasn't Liz, I'd feel disappointed but I know people have told stories of them keeping in touch even though they didn't/couldn't see each other.
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It wasn't Liz. Not only Liz Taylor's people reached out to Michael to attend her 75th birthday as a surprise (as I wrote), bodyguards also mention they (Michael and Liz) talked on the phone and Michael arranged to see her. Liz would be the last person to come to mind.
 
Snow White luvs Peter Pan said:
I hope it wasn't Liz, I'd feel disappointed but I know people have told stories of them keeping in touch even though they didn't/couldn't see each other. It was comforting tata Madiba remained friends with Michael and even if there were few people reaching out, I'm greatful they didn't leave him.
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Where did this even come from? Liz said on Larry King shortly after the trial that she talks to MJ often, and MJ went to visit Liz many times after he moved back to LA, he even took his kids to a Halloween party at her house, there are pics. Before he died she tweeted that her bags were all packed for London and she was really excited.
 
Questions please:

Was Mike Garcia the third bodyguard? Is this the book Mike Garcia is against?

ivy;3973223 said:
Ps: the name of "Friend" is mentioned towards the end of the book and the name reminds you of a certain person. However the physical description of "Friend" doesn't fit with the person known to fans. So it looks like they are two different people with the same name.
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Are they using the person’s real name and physical description thus, revealing that person’s identity? If not, it allows attention seekers to assume the identity of “Friend.”

Interesting “Flower's” identity was protected or lost an opportunity depending on how this is viewed.

AliCat;3973649 said:
This must have happened to him twice. The Nation of Islam bodyguard's were protecting Michael when this took place. Here's the story from 2004...
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Indeed!
 
Tygger;3973820 said:
Are they using the person’s real name and physical description thus, revealing that person’s identity? If not, it allows attention seekers to assume the identity of “Friend.”
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Great. 20 new random chicks every week will be claiming in some lame@ss esoteric manner that they were "friend", 99% of which will have never have had contact with Michael in their lives. I can't wait lol. :smilerolleyes:
 
Also, some of the "friends'" managers or handlers told them not to associate with Michael, so because some of the so-called friends were in the entertainment business, they were scared to associate with Michael--scared it affected their careers. Some of them did not say no to him, but they did not say yes either. They just stayed quiet.

Just make this book do better than Halprin, Sullivan, & Taboreilli and I will be super happy guys.
 
Re: Book: Remember the Time: Protecting Michael Jackson in His Final Days

respect77 said:
As for the book, I personally do not think such books are needed. I don't think as a fan I need to know about his finances in 2008, or whether he kissed girls on the backseat of his car or not. It's gossip and we will never know what part is true and what is not. I think sometimes friends telling little anecdotes about him have their place and do not harm, but these people weren't even his friends. They were just his bodyguards for a couple of months. Who most probably signed a confidentiality agreement. And now they are writing a book and try to make profit of it. Idk, something rubs me in a wrong way about it. I just wish the focus would go back on the music and not on gossip. Because whether it's positive or negative it's still gossip.
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I've just read back earlier in this thread and seen respect77's post. Yes, positive or not, this is how I feel about books about MJ. I love the anecdotes, but as for the rest, well, we can't know his side of the story because he's not here to tell it. And certainly anyone that promised him confidentiality shouldn't be betraying him after he's gone. However, it's done, and judging by Ivy's review, is an improvement on most of the MJ 'bio' books out there.
 
To answer a few questions:

- I don't plan to provide any more details from the book. If you are interested in anything - including the women mentioned - get the book when released.

- Mention of the these women are like 1% of the book (roughly 3 pages out of 330 page book) so I don't personally think it invades MJ's romantic life.

- A basic physical description - such as tall, thin , long hair, beautiful (ps: not the actual description of any of the women btw, I made it up as an example) - isn't enough to identify anyone. Such descriptions are way too general to come to a conclusive determination.

- As I mentioned (alleged) name of "Friend" will be mentioned in the book and it would remind you someone but in a few seconds you'll realize the physical description do not match to the person that comes to your mind. So no one is identified.

- We don't know if they changed the description and/or name of the women to avoid any identification. For example in Frank Cascio's book some names, especially the women he mentioned , was changed to protect their identity. It could be the case here too, we simply don't know.

- Finally even without any definition from any book, attention seekers have been making claims of being MJ's secret girlfriend. So books aren't a factor in crazy. Just us - MJJC - has banned 2 members claiming to be MJ's secret girlfriend and there have been multiple people on twitter/ facebook etc debunked as well. I would think that most fans have the skepticism to not believe random people claiming to be close to MJ.
 
^^You have provided sufficient information for people to determine if they should buy the book or not anyway.

There were people claiming they were BJ, Michael's girl friends, and close friends of Michael's way before the bodyguard wrote this book, so I hope no one is blaming the bodyguards for any person's insane or attention seeking behavior. The insanity already existed in the people before the book was published.
 
Petrarose said:
There were people claiming they were BJ, Michael's girl friends, and close friends of Michael's way before the bodyguard wrote this book, so I hope no one is blaming the bodyguards for any person's insane or attention seeking behavior. The insanity already existed in the people before the book was published.
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Exactly my point. In the last 4+ years I personally interacted and/or heard/known 4 people who claimed to be MJ's secret girlfriend. such behavior isn't because of any book and it's not something new.
 
Ivy, do you know if this book has Estate approval? The cover photo is from the 2002 Vibe photoshoot, which MJ also used for promo photographs, so I assume the Estate owns the copyright on the photograph and must give permission for them to use it?
 
I find the title of this book to be ironic. Bodyguards have a very sensitive role as they are privy to their clients’ private lives in most cases. Private lives include much more than just one’s romantic life. Many in this profession do NOT betray their clients’ trust so these bodyguards are in the minority with this type of book and their previous interviews. This type of betrayal is not acceptable simply because they are discussing Michael Jackson (worst his children) and telling tales some may find pleasing because it conforms to their ideal of Michael Jackson and his relationships with his children, the Jackson family, and others. Maybe that is why there is minimal "drug talk" in the book as Ivy said but, they did speak about an intervention previously.

This is why I asked was this person’s real name and description used thus revealing their identity as that person could look forward to a successful lawsuit against these particular bodyguards if indeed so. It is not a situation like the one AliCat was able to debunk about “Wal-Mart.”

Ivy, from your answer, I see they are using the same device Cascio used. No one will be able to verify certain tales as the only people who can – Michael, the author(s), and in this particular situation, two women who may or may not even exist – are conveniently unavailable to confirm or deny the tales leaving the reader to decide.

PurdyYungThang84, exactly. “Friend” and “Flower” were introduced by the bodyguards (Garcia included; I found my second answer) to Michael Jackson fans as far as I am aware. I am sure anyone wanting to claim those particular identities can without too much resistance from these authors. The authors are going to leave it to the reader to decide what is fact or fiction as long as they purchase the book.
 
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I have a few of those women on my facebook, 3 of them. One writes every day about her relationship with Michael and how he tried to keep her away from everyone around him, specially Grace. Another have a lot of friends or followers who argue with anyone who doesn´t believe she was Michael´s secret girlfriend. They are not only on her facebook, but on youtube, twitter and so on, she herself hints from time to time but never answer anyone who asks, but her followers jumps on the person asking and saying they are rude for asking. The third doesn´t say anything really, I´ve only seen a picture one time and a few posts when there is something in the media. So I´m not sure that one is claiming anything.

But then there is people who knew Michael, who were friends with him, non famous people, they say a different thing than the bodyguards. So it´s hard to know who to believe. We´ll never know what is true. But I guess most people will take what they say as the truth since there are cute stories there too. I know my fan friends who I can´t see as friends anymore will, since they seem to believe everything that is said these days about Michael. I still can´t accept they think that guy is his son.
 
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Petrarose said:
^^Gee Michael had a hard time going to the store. He should just wear a full beard and sideburns rather than a ski mask.
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I don't believe the story happened twice, where Michael was pulled over twice for going into a Walmart with a ski mask on. I believe these particular bodyguard's made this their story, to sell copy.

This happened in 2004 and these bodyguards, who just happen to be selling a book, have decided to make this story their own, because they did not work for Michael till the end of 2006!
 
AliCat said:
I don't believe the story happened twice, where Michael was pulled over twice for going into a Walmart with a ski mask on. I believe these particular bodyguard's made this their story, to sell copy.

This happened in 2004 and these bodyguards, who just happen to be selling a book, have decided to make this story their own, because they did not work for Michael till the end of 2006!
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I thought that was rather odd that the exact same thing happened as in Colorado in 2004.
 
Tygger;3973912 said:
I find the title of this book to be ironic. Bodyguards have a very sensitive role as they are privy to their clients’ private lives in most cases. Private lives include much more than just one’s romantic life. Many in this profession do NOT betray their clients’ trust so these bodyguards are in the minority with this type of book and their previous interviews. This type of betrayal is not acceptable simply because they are discussing Michael Jackson (worst his children) and telling tales some may find pleasing because it conforms to their ideal of Michael Jackson and his relationships with his children, the Jackson family, and others. Maybe that is why there is minimal "drug talk" in the book as Ivy said but, they did speak about an intervention previously.

This is why I asked was this person’s real name and description used thus revealing their identity as that person could look forward to a successful lawsuit against these particular bodyguards if indeed so. It is not a situation like the one AliCat was able to debunk about “Wal-Mart.”

Ivy, from your answer, I see they are using the same device Cascio used. No one will be able to verify certain tales as the only people who can – Michael, the author(s), and in this particular situation, two women who may or may not even exist – are conveniently unavailable to confirm or deny the tales leaving the reader to decide.

PurdyYungThang84, exactly. “Friend” and “Flower” were introduced by the bodyguards (Garcia included; I found my second answer) to Michael Jackson fans as far as I am aware. I am sure anyone wanting to claim those particular identities can without too much resistance from these authors. The authors are going to leave it to the reader to decide what is fact or fiction as long as they purchase the book.
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You are spot on. Maybe the pilot of the private jet that brought the 'secret' girlfriend's to Michael will come forward with a book, too. Come on, Michael could have jumped in a rented private plane and gone to some remote place without his bodyguards's to protect his relationship, knowing full well people have always sold him out!


Gulfstream-Gulfstream-V.jpg
 
Alicat well we will have a Q& A so you could ask the question about the Walmart.

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My thing is that many of the other Michael books are either trashy or they provide tons of the usual foolishness which give the media a party. Here is this publication that is more a book you will write about a person you like, and not the "weird" creature you hate. I think those who like these biographical types of books should really consider this one and make it go to number one. If you have any questions, you can get clarification in the Q & A.

We complain about the Halperin, Randall, Cascio, Latoya, Jermaine books. I think the only books most of us love is Vogel's and then Bush. We need to support certain books and get these types of books about Michael to the top. We are not going to get 100% accuracy from books because the books do not have Michael's voice in them. WE need to make a choice. Do you not support a book because it briefly comments on 2 girlfriends without sharing their identity or because the Walmart story belongs to another time frame, and then leave the door wide open for books to be written about no nose, hundreds of surgeries, a Pedo? Because if you don't support books like the bodyguards, publishers will just continue to push those trashy books which many people are willing to write and thousands are willing to buy. Don't complain then, when all the publications about Michael has the same foolishness.
 
Virre;3973951 said:
I know my fan friends who I can´t see as friends anymore will, since they seem to believe everything that is said these days about Michael.
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Agreed. I believe it is more of what one deems to be acceptable to the ideal they have of Michael. If it is not acceptable to the ideal, it is automatically fiction. If it is acceptable to the ideal, it is fact whether it is or not.

AliCat;3973967 said:
Come on, Michael could have jumped in a rented private plane and gone to some remote place without his bodyguards's to protect his relationship, knowing full well people have always sold him out!
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This is the problem I had and continue to have with this trio of bodyguards. They were not supposed to betray the trust of their client which included this client's children. This betrayal is acceptable for some only because their tales are of Michael Jackson and his relationships with others and those tales are deemed acceptable.

Example: these bodyguards have had time to determine what is considered acceptable by future purchasers as they have toned down intervention talks they had previously. If they had continued, it may have been unacceptable for future readers. Indeed. Whether truth or fiction, determined to be cute or not, those conversations Michael had the misfortune of having with his children in front of these bodyguards were their memories; not public entertainment.

Michael was a man and most men have pride. It is unfortunate Michael did not know every word and every emotion he expressed in front of this trio would one day be published for readers to dissect and judge. He could have saved his limited funds for the employment of more trustworthy individuals.

These bodyguards have been employed by other celebrities however, they have not written books about them (they have not passed).

Future clients should be warned to hire someone they can trust.
 
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Petrarose said:
Alicat well we will have a Q& A so you could ask the question about the Walmart.

_______________________________________________
My thing is that many of the other Michael books are either trashy or they provide tons of the usual foolishness which give the media a party. Here is this publication that is more a book you will write about a person you like, and not the "weird" creature you hate. I think those who like these biographical types of books should really consider this one and make it go to number one. If you have any questions, you can get clarification in the Q & A.

We complain about the Halperin, Randall, Cascio, Latoya, Jermaine books. I think the only books most of us love is Vogel's and then Bush. We need to support certain books and get these types of books about Michael to the top. We are not going to get 100% accuracy from books because the books do not have Michael's voice in them. WE need to make a choice. Do you not support a book because it briefly comments on 2 girlfriends without sharing their identity or because the Walmart story belongs to another time frame, and then leave the door wide open for books to be written about no nose, hundreds of surgeries, a Pedo? Because if you don't support books like the bodyguards, publishers will just continue to push those trashy books which many people are willing to write and thousands are willing to buy. Don't complain then, when all the publications about Michael has the same foolishness.
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I don't think it's fair to make it look like fans need to support this book and I don't think it's fair to blame it on fans not buying the bodyguards book if trashy books get published. It's not like trashy MJ bios do exceptionally well these days. There was a time when they did but that time has passed as Sullivan's flop shows. Only fans buy MJ books now, so trashy books will not do very well any more.
I'd rather have fans support books which focus on MJ's art than gossip books. Looking forward to Susan Fast's book on Dangerous. I'm buying that, not this one.
 
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That's why I am 50/50 about things. I want Michael to have his privacy and yet I want people to see who he really was and not the tabloid version or whatever unhuman version people like to portray him. Of course I want the focus to be on his work and music. Unfortunately so much was focused on his life that caused a lot damage and made people not focus on the music like they should have done.

So far I am liking what I am seeing and probably will get the book. If I choose not to get it that is okay too. It's up to everyone to do what they feel is right for them. If this is a positive book then I do hope it does well so it does show that people want to hear good things about Michael.
 
marebear said:
That's why I am 50/50 about things. I want Michael to have his privacy and yet I want people to see who he really was and not the tabloid version or whatever unhuman version people like to portray him. Of course I want the focus to be on his work and music. Unfortunately so much was focused on his life that caused a lot damage and made people not focus on the music like they should have done.
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Yes, I understand that 50/50 feeling and I understand the point that the negative stuff claimed about MJ should be balanced out. I do have this dilemma myself, but it also rubs me in the wrong way to see these bodyguards, who more than likely signed a confidentiality agreement disrespect that confidentiality agreement like that. There is a reason why MJ's employees signed CAs which means that MJ probably would not approve of such a book. Let's not forget that when he learned that Bob Jones started to write a book about him he fired him. But well, at least this book does not trash him.
 
marebear said:
That's why I am 50/50 about things. I want Michael to have his privacy and yet I want people to see who he really was and not the tabloid version or whatever unhuman version people like to portray him. Of course I want the focus to be on his work and music. Unfortunately so much was focused on his life that caused a lot damage and made people not focus on the music like they should have done.

So far I am liking what I am seeing and probably will get the book. If I choose not to get it that is okay too. It's up to everyone to do what they feel is right for them. If this is a positive book then I do hope it does well so it does show that people want to hear good things about Michael.
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I agree with you- it's like, I want to respect his privacy, and for the most part I do, but curiosity definitely gets the better of me every now and again. I'm getting better at it though. I really do try very hard to practice what I preach.

As for the focus of a book being only, or mainly, on his music, I get what you're saying, but Michael was so much more than his music. I would love to see a book written (a positive, genuine book) about his other endeavors. His humanitarianism, for example. All the good things he did for the underprivileged, for the sick and dying children of the world, for the hungry and homeless and for the Earth. And yes, even for his fans- the only people in this world, aside from his children- who truly loved him and supported him and stood by him through thick and thin. I love reading stories about how he'd write letters, and how he'd write messages on pillows and throw them out window of his hotel. Or how he'd send down pillows and blankets to his fans who camped outside his hotel or Neverland, and how he'd even buy them pizza so they didn't go hungry just waiting to catch a glimpse of him. I don't know if these stories are true, but I like to believe that they are. It sounds like something he would do to show his own love and appreciation. I love hearing about these things because it goes to show, as I said, that he was more than just a musician and a performer.
 
ivy said:
Stuff from 2009 - when Michael moved to LA- is not much as I said now Michael Amir took over and Bill and Javon were in Vegas majority of the time.
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Does anybody know why the title of this book is 'Protecting Michael Jackson IN HIS FINAL DAYS'?
 
respect77 said:
I don't think it's fair to make it look like fans need to support this book and I don't think it's fair to blame it on fans not buying the bodyguards book if trashy books get published. It's not like trashy MJ bios do exceptionally well these days. There was a time when they did but that time has passed as Sullivan's flop shows. Only fans buy MJ books now, so trashy books will not do very well any more.
I'd rather have fans support books which focus on MJ's art than gossip books. Looking forward to Susan Fast's book on Dangerous. I'm buying that, not this one.
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At no time did I say Respect buy this book and don't buy Faust book.

The point is I am focusing on fans who like these types of books (original post), not fans who only like art books. Obviously you don't fall into that category. Publishers look at what sell. Thousands of fans like biographical books. It makes no sense for anyone to deny that. They have bought others that have been published. So why shouldn't fans who like such books consider buying this one and make it number one. If publishes see that books like the bodyguard don't sell well, but books like Halprin, Sullivan sell well, then obviously they will stress those types of books. It makes money sense.

At no time did anyone say that buying the bodyguard book precludes fans from buying books about art. However, if you look at the publications those about art usually don't get the most attention from buyers or the media, although there are exceptions. This means that there is a market for non-art books about Michael. We have to be realistic, so fans should help bring the Best of all the other types of books to the top. Of course if a type has no good in it, then there is no need to bring it to the top. Obviously Randall's is not the best.

Sullivan's book flopped only because of the fans' effort to have the book earn as little sales as possible. Fans were a driving force behind that flop. They contacted others. However, the mere fact that several fans including some on this board bought this book, shows there is still a market for this type of book. Since the market remains, I think it is a good ploy to promote the better books by buying them.

Even I have books that is not my thing because the book showed a different side of Michael, like the Love book. I don't buy biographical books with the exception of Moonwalk back in the day. I was against the bodyguard book because of the same reasons. I made statements like they are talking about Michael's personal business; I hope they don't talk about the prof because they were not bodyguards at that time; and on and on. However, once brains get more information, the brains are supposed to reformulate thinking and do some more analysis, so when Ivy gave a glimpse into the book, my brain took that new information and recalculated. It seems the book is not as bad as I thought it would be. I am not going to read this book, but I know several fans like these types of books and can't afford to buy them. What I will do with the bodyguard book is buy a few copies and send to some fans who can't afford it. I am not saying fans have to do something like this either.

Mneme as usual you have the best question. I guess protecting was used because they are bodyguards. Final Days were used because they wanted to capitalize on what happened just before his death. Now is this book about protecting and the final days--the readers will soon find out.
 
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Blanket is so cute, asking for a hippopotamus as a pet. I bet if Michael would had the place for it he would have given it to him. What a sweet little boy.
 
^^I had a chuckle about that too. Of all things to think about--a hippo. The things kids ask for.....
 
Petrarose said:
At no time did I say Respect buy this book and don't buy Faust book.
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At no time did anyone say that buying the bodyguard book precludes fans from buying books about art.
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And I did not say you said that.

I'm not trying to tell other fans what to buy or what not to buy. I'm only saying you also should not suggest if a fan chooses not to buy this book then that makes him or her responsible for future trashy books because that is not fair. That's all I said. Some fans simply feel this is a gossip book that is disrespectful to MJ, even if it's "positive". And they have every right to feel so and be not supportive of this book without being made feel guilty about it.

Sullivan's book flopped because no one but fans buy MJ books any more and fans didn't support it. If the general public still bought MJ books fans could not have done anything to make them stop buying it and making it successful. It was different during the trial when negtive, trashy MJ books were bought by the general public and it was different around MJ's death when everything with MJ's name on it - whether good or trashy - sold. Those times have passed and most of the general public has moved on and MJ biographies are not in demand any more. So this book too will be mainly bought by fans. And I think Sullivan's book flopping already sent out the message to publishers that if you want to sell an MJ book you cannot write trash any more, because the main market for MJ books now are his fans.

Like I said, I understand the dilemma. It would not be great either if someone goes to a book store and wants to buy an MJ book could only choose from Halperin's, Sullivan's and Taraborelli's book or even more horrible books like Dimond's, Gutierrez's etc. But that doesn't mean fans are obliged to buy it and obliged to feel entirely positive about it.
 
respect77 said:
Yes, I understand that 50/50 feeling and I understand the point that the negative stuff claimed about MJ should be balanced out. I do have this dilemma myself, but it also rubs me in the wrong way to see these bodyguards, who more than likely signed a confidentiality agreement disrespect that confidentiality agreement like that. There is a reason why MJ's employees signed CAs which means that MJ probably would not approve of such a book. Let's not forget that when he learned that Bob Jones started to write a book about him he fired him. But well, at least this book does not trash him.
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I get what you say, but this time I do think that it is a good thing that bg's book is out (even thou they broke nda). There have been many books written about MJ, and mostly it is rubbish and from people who never met Michael, and there will be more books written in the future too. Even if there is one person in amazon wondering which book to read, bg's or cry babe Sullivan, and ends up picking gf's book, their book served its purpose. We cannot stop these cry babes from publishing their rubbish books, but we can support and write positive reviews for the books we think deserves to be picked up as worth of reading.

Btw, you mentioned that only MJ fans buys these books about MJ. I read tons of biographies of people I'm not fan of, and same goes with documentaries. I suppose there could be people that finds MJ an interesting character without being his fan, and wants to know more about him. I rather have that one person to pick more reliable book than lets say Sullivan's.

Btw2, I thought Randy fired Bob Jones, and after that he started writing the book?
 
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