I Am a Fan, But... (What Makes You Heretic Among Other Fans?)

[Michaels Lover]

Also, 'Michael should have not lived his life as he wanted and changed who he was', because of bullsh1te lies? WTF is that nonsense?

It seems time that some people wanted MJ to change his lifestyle to make life easier for themselves as 'fans'. Hmmmm.

I didn't love everything that MJ did equally but, "complete And utter hatred"? Or wanting MJ to change his caring attitude and lifestyle to suit me and the rabid media?

Some people seem to enjoy this thread a little more than 'natural' for me. That's obvious from some of the language used.

I agree...it seems some fans don't understand Michael, and so they just make their own assumptions

 

[Michaels Lover]

Fans hoping for any substantial re release of dangerous or HIStory need to calm down with their expectations. The Off The Wall re-release has shown what we can expect.

when did this thread turn into a thread about fans? let people expect what they want, that's none of your business

 

[SmoothGangsta]

when did this thread turn into a thread about fans? let people expect what they want, that's none of your business

I see nothing saying I can't talk about fans. This thread is about opinions that might make you unpopular among fans, if my opinion is about fans I can state it. I didn't say it was any of my business, and I don't really see how that matters. This thread in concept is about opinions, so I don't see why you keep telling people what they can say.

 

[Michaels Lover]

I don´t really know purpose of this thread, cause I don´t understand the thread name...

here's an idea...look it up before replying?

 

[BadTour87]

The set list of the second leg of the Dangerous Tour seemed... well, boring.

Removing WDAN and freaking Beat It from the set list was a bad move and really ruined the second leg for me. WDAN was a good halfway mark in the first leg but just making a short video interlude and Will You Be There of all songs the halfway mark in the second just felt empty and boring.

 

[Nite Line]

I dislike HIStory tour for two reasons. One was obviously the excessive lip syncing. I understand MJ's reason for doing it but it doesn't mean that I have to like it. Second reason was no Man In The Mirror. I can't believe that MJ completely dropped that song for this tour. Imo MITM was one of Michael's signature songs and seeing him spin and fall on his knees was one of the highlights of the BWT and DWT for me so him completely dropping MITM from the set list was a big turn off for me.

The 5 new songs on Blood On The Dance Floor are brilliant.

 

[LindavG]

There should have never been another child in his bedroom after those first allegations, period. I'm not talking about him being interested in childlike things, I'm talking about the fact he continued to have children sleep in his bedroom. It doesn't matter if there was another person there or not, he shouldn't have been doing it at all. Serious, potentially life ruining accusations and he continued to do it anyway.

From a distance it's hard to disagree with that. Michael certainly did not make things easier for himself when he admitted on national television that he allowed children to sleep in his bedroom and that there was nothing wrong with that. It's usually one of the first things people bring up when they claim Michael was a pedophile.

But I also believe that Michael just genuinely did not understand why people made such a big deal out of him letting kids sleep in his bedroom, even after the allegations. We know that Michael himself shared a bedroom with non-related adults when he was growing up; that was nothing unusual for him. We know that Michael found it very hard to refuse children anything - and to say no to people in general. We know that Michael's bedroom was not strictly a "bedroom" but more like a gathering place where all the guests would come together and relax. And we know that Michael had lived such an isolated life that he wasn't always aware what was considered socially appropriate or not. He just did what felt right to him. I think that he perceived the allegations and the witch hunt that followed as the tabloids targeting him (as they had been for years) and to change his behaviour would be to let them win.

Besides, there's no reason to think Michael could have protected himself from child abuse allegations if only he had never allowed children in his bedroom. If Michael really wanted to molest children, he had plenty of other opportunities to do so. The only way to really 'protect' himself would have been to stop inviting children into his home altogether. It would mean thousands upon thousands of ill and underprivileged children would be deprived of the joys of Neverland, just because Michael was afraid there might be one of them who could turn on him. Is that really worth it?

 

[Snow White luvs Peter Pan]

What is this? Are you saying Michael had to change part of who he was and what he stood for in order to avoid problems and fit people's standards of what's normal and right? Hell, no Michael was the victim! If the fans know the allegations, there's plenty of evidence exonerating him than otherwise.

Yes, the Arvizos came after him trying to get the same money the Chandlers got but hanging out with children and having sleepovers was not the problem, neither a crime. One of the problems is people's perverted mind that automatically assume children can be assualted every time they sleep with unrelated adults, by that same "logic," I commit bestiality every time I let my dogs to sleep in the bed with me then. The other problem was Michael being too trusting with people who don't/didn't have their best interests at heart, I believe that disgusting mockumentary caused the second allegations.

Sneddon wouldn't have known the Arvizos existed if it weren't for that SOB, Martin Bashit's abhorrent editing and twisting of Michael's words and actions. Why didn't he include the interviews Bashit did to Emmanuel Lewis or Dave Dave? Why didn't he have the balls to interview Elizabeth Taylor? Because he knew they'd adamantly defend Michael and clear him from any wrong doing.

 

[SmoothGangsta]

I'm purely talking about Michael, and how stupid it was of him to still let children sleep in his bed, I'm sorry but I'm not going to sugar coat it or make excuses for him. He was an adult and he should have not let children sleep in his bedroom after those first allegations. If it wasn't bad enough he then went on TV and said it was absolutely fine. What did he think people were going to think about that? Whether or not that perception is right is irrelevant, the general public are going to find someone who had previously been accused of child molestation saying he sleeps in bed with children weird to say the least. It's just common sense. I think he could have handled everything so much better.

 

[Snow White luvs Peter Pan]

Of course it's relevant because their perception is not always a fact, it's more important what it's true and proven. Although I admit Michael talking about sharing his bed affected him, it just shows his mind didn't work like yours or anyone else sharing your opinion. He genuinely thought that wasn't wrong, he wasn't embarrassed about it and he didn't have anything to hide. No matter how much people used his love for children against him, Michael remained pure at heart 'til the end.

 

[Michaels Lover]

Of course it's relevant because their perception is not always a fact, it's more important what it's true and proven. Although I admit Michael talking about sharing his bed affected him, it just shows his mind didn't work like yours or anyone else sharing your opinion. He genuinely thought that wasn't wrong, he wasn't embarrassed about it and he didn't have anything to hide. No matter how much people used his love for children against him, Michael remained pure at heart 'til the end.

that's exactly what I meant when I said, it seems some fans don't understand Michael, and so they just make their own assumptions. he didn't think like everyone else. yes, he was a grown man, but he didn't have a grown mans mind. it doesn't matter who you say you share your bed with, people will automatically think you're having sex. even when it's a child. and he didn't understand how people could think that way
I'm just saying I can see it from Michael's point of view, because I know what it's like to share a bed with someone in a pure, innocent way. and I really don't think he would have sat there and said it so openly like he did, if he thought there was anything wrong with it, or if he thought he would get accused of abusing kids once again. it's not like he was asking for it :'(

 

[AlwaysThere]

The Arvizo incident was almost entirely Michael's fault. He appeared to have learned absolutely nothing from the 1993/4 case - matter of fact, I would dare say his behavior towards his relationship with children intensified following the Chandler accusations.

I understand Michael's thought process and what he insisted was and was not happening. But he couldn't seem to grasp the fact that an overwhelming majority of the world did not share these sentiments and actively spoke out against them. So when heads began to turn when he was holding a child's hand and discussing sleeping arrangements on Living With Michael Jackson, he was almost begging for the paparazzi and news media to recall the controversy from a decade prior and revitalize it with new accusers.

Yes, I understand that Living With Michael Jackson was a manipulative and dishonest process, but that clip was not edited nor cut in any way that would falsely incriminate Michael. Everything that happened was shown, just with some added commentary.

I firmly believe Michael was 100% innocent, but the man did not make the situation easier on himself. There simply is no way to sugarcoat or play that down.

 

[Ms. BlueGangsta]

I'm purely talking about Michael, and how stupid it was of him to still let children sleep in his bed, I'm sorry but I'm not going to sugar coat it or make excuses for him. He was an adult and he should have not let children sleep in his bedroom after those first allegations. If it wasn't bad enough he then went on TV and said it was absolutely fine. What did he think people were going to think about that? Whether or not that perception is right is irrelevant, the general public are going to find someone who had previously been accused of child molestation saying he sleeps in bed with children weird to say the least. It's just common sense. I think he could have handled everything so much better.

Michael didn't relate sex to being in bed with a child the way everyone else did.
To Michael sleeping in bed with a child was just that, sleeping, and nothing more, there was NOTHING perverted about it in any way.

Additionally, Michael was damned if he did and damned if he didn't, so I didn't expect him to change who he was when regardless of what he did his name was mud anyway, and chances are he would've still been accused (greedy disgusting people that want money will always find a way).

You have to remember that If someone wanted to accuse him they still could've even if another child never darkened to door to his bedroom because his bedroom was not the only place he was alone with children or around children.

So by your logic Michael should have turned down Make a Wish kids and impoverished children to avoid allegations.

 

[analogue]

The set list of the second leg of the Dangerous Tour seemed... well, boring.

Removing WDAN and freaking Beat It from the set list was a bad move and really ruined the second leg for me. WDAN was a good halfway mark in the first leg but just making a short video interlude and Will You Be There of all songs the halfway mark in the second just felt empty and boring.

This is one of the reasons why I don't want Dangerous Tour 1993 released on Blu Ray/DVD. A show without WDAN, and especially Beat It just doesn't feel right.

 

[BadTour87]

This is one of the reasons why I don't want Dangerous Tour 1993 released on Blu Ray/DVD. A show without WDAN, and especially Beat It just doesn't feel right.

The vocals on the second leg aren't the best either lol

 

[LindavG]

I'm purely talking about Michael, and how stupid it was of him to still let children sleep in his bed, I'm sorry but I'm not going to sugar coat it or make excuses for him. He was an adult and he should have not let children sleep in his bedroom after those first allegations. If it wasn't bad enough he then went on TV and said it was absolutely fine. What did he think people were going to think about that? Whether or not that perception is right is irrelevant, the general public are going to find someone who had previously been accused of child molestation saying he sleeps in bed with children weird to say the least. It's just common sense. I think he could have handled everything so much better.

I understand your point but we come at this from different perspectives. Your argument is essentially that Michael should not have allowed children to sleep in his bedroom because the general public finds it weird. Michael should not have defended the sleepovers on TV because it made him look worse. Michael was stupid to let children sleep in his bedroom after the first allegations because he should have known that people would judge him for it.

While this is all true, that doesn't make it right. Michael was eccentric. He had lived his entire life outside of the general public, isolated, an outcast. Even in the early 1980s, before he reached the height of his fame, he talked about how he found it hard to relate to people and felt strange and uncomfortable when he wasn't on stage. The things that were "normal" and "common sense" to him sometimes seemed absurd to the general public, and sharing his bedroom with children is one of them. We have been conditioned to associate "sharing a bedroom" with sexual activity because for most of us, that is the only reason we would sleep in the same bedroom as an adult who is not our relative. But Michael was used to sharing a bedroom with non-related adults when he was growing up so that was normal for him. He just did not make that automatic connection to sex and probably did not understand why other people would do so. In his mind, they were the perverts for thinking you must be having sex with someone if they're staying in your bedroom. It's also important to keep in mind that Michael never asked children to sleep over in his bedroom. Not even his accusers claim that. Some children simply asked him, after spending most of the day with their families in Michael's enormous bedroom, if they could stay there the night too. Michael did not see anything wrong with that as long as they got their parents' permission, because objectively there is nothing wrong with that. On some occasions kids fell asleep in Michael's room and he didn't want to wake them up so he let them stay there. Again, there's nothing objectively wrong with that. It's because of our social conditioning that we find such things suspicious. Michael had almost 3000 acres of land at his disposal, it's not like he needed to be in the privacy of his own bedroom in order to molest a child. And if he was aware of the sexual connotions of "sharing a bedroom" for the general public, he would not be openly discussing this on national television.

What I'm trying to say is that I agree that Michael's own behaviour and statements led to suspicion and ridicule by the public. Where we diverge is who should be assigned the blame for that. You blame Michael because you believe he should have adjusted his behaviour and statements in a way that was acceptable to the general public. I blame the public for not considering Michael's behaviour and statements in context and for not being more tolerant of those who are different. At the end of the day, Michael did not hurt anyone and he did nothing illegal. He had a unique perspective of the world around him and that's one of the reasons he was such a gifted artist. I admire Michael for always being true to who he was at his core, even if people mocked him for it and even if I didn't always agree with him.

 

[FortéFord]

My unpopular opinion is the Bad, Dangerous and HIStory are all better than Thriller.

 

[Nite Line]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

Invincible album is better and more enjoyable than HIStory album.

Beat It is an overrated song. Very good song but MJ had many songs better than 'it'

 

[mj_frenzy]

Post whatever opinion you have about MJ, his albums, songs, etc on here. It should be very interesting. My unpopular opinion is the Bad, Dangerous and HIStory are all better than Thriller.

I think that you did not express an unpopular opinion.

I have a strong feeling that most of his fans regard all these three albums that you mentioned (‘Bad’, ‘Dangerous’ & ‘HIStory’) as generally better than the ‘Thriller’ album.

Now, one of my unpopular (?) opinions is that I would have liked more songs on the ‘Bad’ album. MJ was on top form at that time (in terms of songwriting & vocals) & I think he should have included several more songs, especially ballads/mid-tempo tracks. In that case, the overall result of that album would definitely have been more soulful & balanced.

 

[Rudolf]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

I don't like Dangerous album (except some songs) all too much. The New Jack Swing (was it called like that?) doesn't really appeal to me so I find songs in that vein sort of similar.

 

[MJMarty]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

Remember The Time is among Michael's worst songs and videos.

Smooth Criminal's MV is better than Thriller's.

 

[Nite Line]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

- You Rock My World is just a decent song. Nothing special. The intro of the song with Chris Tucker is just embarrassing.
- Can't Let Her Get Away is a very good and catchy song.
- Even though it's sung by an imposter, I like Keep Your Head Up.
- I prefer the PYT demo over the Thriller version of the song.
- Michael's brothers are underrated by a lot of MJ fans. They aren't as good as Mike obviously but they are very talented in their own right and should get the respect that they deserve instead of being constantly bashed by some MJ fans.
- Speaking of MJ's brothers, I think that the Victory album is very good. Songs like Torture, Wait, Be Not Always, One More Chance are fantastic songs.

 

[FortéFord]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

This is very interesting so far ?

 

[mjprince1976]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

The one that makes me wildly unpopular...

Prince is better than Michael Jackson in every way except for dancing and charitable works (Prince was very selfish later in life, while MJ was organising we are the world, Prince did a token canned food drive in Minneapolis and did a couple fo shows for deaf kids).

I really love Prince's music, I really love Michael Jackson's music too - but not as much as Prince's.
.
Other stuff

Michael got far too carried away with the Plastic surgery.
Part of me is angry for his dependence on painkillers and addictive drugs, necessary or not.
Off the Wall is a fantastic album
Invincible is almost as good as all the other albums
Michael should not have paid off the Chandler family, he should have gone to trial and won, so that would have stopped the muck being raked.
His kids are not biologically his. Prince and Paris look 100% white and Jewish and are likely Arnold Klein as the father and Debbie Rowe as mother. Blanket possibly could be, but he looks more Indian than Black and I think he may be Omar Bhatti's kid?

 

[mjprince1976]

I think that you did not express an unpopular opinion.

Now, one of my unpopular (?) opinions is that I would have liked more songs on the ‘Bad’ album. MJ was on top form at that time (in terms of songwriting & vocals) & I think he should have included several more songs, especially ballads/mid-tempo tracks. In that case, the overall result of that album would definitely have been more soulful & balanced.

1 or 2 more maybe, but I like it's concise size. I actually thought the 14 songs on Dangerous and 15 on History Now are too many and the latter 3 are true fillers (Childhood, DS, History), and the 18 trax on Invincible are tragic sign of Michael gaining Prince's ability to wibble on and weigh down an album of gems like Break of Dawn and Speechless, with un necessary filler like the Lost Children and Privacy.

Also we have that extra disc on Bad25:chillin: which is hot and has some amazing songs that did not make the cut. When I read he wrote over 800 songs for the Bad Project and 60 got the full recording and works, it just seems astounding what ewlse could be there, given the top notchedness of the 11 on Bad and the 8 out takes on Bad25.

 

[AlwaysThere]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

Off the Wall is his worst and least-enjoyable album.

*protects self from oncoming tomatoes*

 

[Scream]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

Off the Wall is his worst and least-enjoyable album.

*protects self from oncoming tomatoes*

*pelts with tomatoes*

Anyway:

Leave me Alone is the best video he ever made. It's also the best song on Bad.

Heal the World (though sincere in it's message) is nauseating and saccharine.

 

[analogue]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

Just Good Friends is an awesome song

I'm happy that Michael and Prince never did a duet together on BAD. But I would have liked to have heard a duet on another song

I don't like the Billie Jean video. For me, the Motown 25 performance is the true video for Billie Jean

I think the Triumph Tour is better than the Victory Tour

I don't like the Timberland produced songs on Xscape. The original versions are better

 

[HIStoric]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

-While I enjoy watching it, I don't think Moonwalker was that great of a film. I'd give it a like, 3/5 stars max and a solid star or two would be from the absolutely incredible music videos in it.

-I don't like the soft speaking voice at the beginning of the original version of IJCSLY and I'm really glad they cut it out for future reissues. To tell you the truth, it makes me uncomfortable (could be the fact that I'm straight and I don't find Michael attractive, perhaps).

-I think You Rock My World, while a good music video that I've watched countless times, was nothing new and essentially a rehash of what he did in the past. The intro for the song is really annoying too, should've just made it a separate track as an interlude so I could actually skip the damn thing all together.

-I rarely listen to anything he did with Motown, solo or Jackson 5. I do play The Jacksons a lot more, but even then it's mostly just their greatest hits. I have one of their studio albums on vinyl and their live album but I don't ever really feel like playing them. I have attempted to stream Victory but it didn't really grab me... so maybe in the future I'll give it another chance.

-The outtakes for Invincible were better than many of the final songs that made it. Ugghh seriously, how the F**K did APWNN not make Invincible but Don't Walk Away did?! Don't Walk Away is terrible! Terrible!!

-In saying that, 2000 Watts really isn't that bad of a song. It's retreading territory without adding much, perhaps, but generally I like it!

-While I've come to accept that the vocals are almost certainly not MJ's, Breaking News is catchy as shit.

-I actually like some of the BOTDF remixes haha. Oh and the remixes on Bad 25 are allgood (except Pitbull's one).

-He and Stevie Wonder could've done much better work on their duet for the Bad album. Get It (which ended up on Stevie's album) was great though!

-I prefer Girlfriend over the song Off the Wall. Teeeellll hiimmmm woo-hooooo!

-People find TGIM with Macca really cheesy but Idc I love it so much!

-While HIStory, BOTDF and Invincible good albums in their own right (with Invincible being the exception as simply 'eh'), I don't think their replay value is as high as the albums that precede it. Of course I have listened to all 3 of these albums immensely over the years, but for the last couple of years I have just found myself playing the songs off Thriller, Bad and Dangerous far more (all three of these just mentioned are utter perfection). My view on those final albums of his may change over time.

- When Michael started going white in 1986, he should have come out and said right then that he has this skin disease that destroys the pigmentation of the skin. Instead he waited till 93 to reveal the truth about his skin disease by which point the media ha brainwashed many into believing that Michael hated his race so he changed his skin colour. Even though it was shown in MJ's autopsy report that he had vitaligo, there are still many out there who believed that Michael deliberately change his skin colour and all of that could have been avoided if MJ had come out and said about his problems from the very beginning.

While I think it would've been best for Michael Jackson to release said detail much earlier than he did... it's hard to fault for him for not doing so. It's a situation where I can see both sides of the coin. At the end of the day, it is a private health matter and he shouldn't have to release that... but then again he's in the public eye and it's a very rare but obvious condition that'll get people talking and gossiping (especially if you don't talk about it).

Either way, it was lose-lose for Michael so whatever he chose, I could understand why he did what he did.

 

[Erandi]

Re: Unpopular Michael Jackson Opinions?

One very unpopular opinion: I would have loved Invincible much more, if it weren't for the many ballads on it