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Michael - The Great Album Debate

ivy said:
I agree. It's ridiculous that people don't know me at all, thinks that they can predict my behavior. It's also ridiculous that people that would say "let others have an opinion" would be the first to be against me expressing "my opinions".
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I think you misunderstood what I was trying to say...When I said that, I wasn't trying to predict your behaviour in terms of your feelings on the Cascio tracks if you were a non-believer...I meant that you act/would act the same way when your OPINION is attacked, based on the things you've said throughout the thread regarding respect for opinions and what not....I also said to let Stella feel the way he wants and you can feel the way you want without feeling attacked...I pointed out the need for fairness on both sides...I'm not perfect, and I know that I can be guilty of the same thing at times :)

That's what I was trying to say...

But anyway, moving on now...
 
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Jesta said:
I recall asking Joe if he was going to talk about the tracks in the book a few months ago, and he said he would dedicate the time to "songs that were worth it" or something like that. It seems Joe believes what we do now. But I reiterate, if ANYONE knows something they're not telling, how can they expect us to be on their side?
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Yeah he said on twitter than since his review of the album last November, he has learnt a lot. He's in a difficult position as he has been working with the Estate to get info and contacts for his book so it must be hard for him. It seems to me that he is now a doubter as well.
 
StellaJackson said:
Yeah he said on twitter than since his review of the album last November, he has learnt a lot. He's in a difficult position as he has been working with the Estate to get info and contacts for his book so it must be hard for him. It seems to me that he is now a doubter as well.
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I'm gonna ask him about it in 2012. By that point, his sales would've peaked and he doesn't really have anything to lose for telling us his opinion and what he's learned.
 
I added that as a joke when SB leaked because everyone was comparing it to TDCAU. My other tag is "authentic :)"
 
Isn't it strange that we have members such as burn2nite, manutd and Daveo89 who join this forum just to see this thread, without posting at all in any threads? Hmm.. I wonder who they could be.
 
KingMikeJ said:
Isn't it strange that we have members such as burn2nite, manutd and Daveo89 who join this forum just to see this thread, without posting at all in any threads? Hmm.. I wonder who they could be.
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There's also nasty, who hasn't posted on anything.
 
Jesta said:
Arky, have you seen this? You'll like it!

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That's so cool! Too bad the graphics aren't as good on the other consoles....I was actually a little disappointed with the Kinect version..I thought I'd like it better than the Wii version, but the choreography and dancing are much slower-paced and not true to form in the Kinect version...So, I actually prefer the Wii...
 
Arklove said:
That's so cool! Too bad the graphics aren't as good on the other consoles....I was actually a little disappointed with the Kinect version..I thought I'd like it better than the Wii version, but the choreography and dancing are much slower-paced and not true to form in the Kinect version...So, I actually prefer the Wii...
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I like the Wii version's cartoon-like aesthetic, and the Kinect's stage aesthetic has its charms, but this just looks like it's on a whole other level! I like the end of the trailer when it goes all This Is It on Smooth Criminal! But this version looks like it has more faithful choreography... I guess the rhythm is easier to follow than the actual steps! I appreciate the Kinect version only for the rounded feeling of performing the song. For dancing, the Wii version is a lot better.
 
I wonder if Eddie and Jason showed Michael these songs intended for him and Michael was like "Wow, they sound good as they are, I don't think I need to do anything with them. It wouldn't be right. ;)" Eddie pouts. "Maybe one day."
 
As soon as it became clear 'Monster' was going to be used, fans tried to get in touch with Jamie King. For example by commenting on the Circue du Soleil YT channel where a YT of him (with in the background the words 'Monster') was posted. Can't find it anymore now, otherwise you could see the comments. Maybe he didn't read or hear anything, but that's hard to believe.

And to me it's not about the 40 seconds out of 2 hrs. It's the principle. It's the stain on the otherwise perfect and fitting tribute. It's sad that these songs also have contaminated that. You can say the same about these songs on the album. What's three songs out of the hundreds of songs Michael wrote/sang?
 
^True. Why stain an otherwise highly anticipated show with the controversial songs? Given the fact that there are so so many epic songs in the almost perfect Michael Jackson catalog.

Sometimes, I hate myself for not listening Best of Joy more often or like it more. The fact that the song is squeezed in between BN and M did affect me. It reminds me of the unpleasant experience I went through.
 
Jesta said:
The lead vocals might not even make it into the show, though.
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Michael is not singing on any part of monster, at all. unless you count the cut/pastes from already existing tracks. micahel's voice is not on these songs, and he had nothing to do with them. I'd doubt very much he ever even heard them--i actually doubt they even existed while he was alive, but who knows.

the fact that it's in the show at all is disgusting. i can't believe they continue to push this on us. they're totally disregarding the fans. whether you hear michael or not, it seems that all fans would rather avoid the controversy at something that's supposed to be a celebration of michael's music. the fact that they so blatantly disregarded our feelings as they have done, and as they continue to do, just blows my mind. I really don't understand it. they need to grow up and accept that they made a mistake. Fine. don't apologize for it or admit what you did. but at LEAST don't keep pushing this garbage on us. for the love of god, michael's library takes up GIGS of space on my hard drive, they couldn't find another way to fill 40+seconds? give me a break.
 
azsummergirl said:
Michael is not singing on any part of monster, at all. unless you count the cut/pastes from already existing tracks. micahel's voice is not on these songs, and he had nothing to do with them. I'd doubt very much he ever even heard them--i actually doubt they even existed while he was alive, but who knows.

the fact that it's in the show at all is disgusting. i can't believe they continue to push this on us. they're totally disregarding the fans. whether you hear michael or not, it seems that all fans would rather avoid the controversy at something that's supposed to be a celebration of michael's music. the fact that they so blatantly disregarded our feelings as they have done, and as they continue to do, just blows my mind. I really don't understand it. they need to grow up and accept that they made a mistake. Fine. don't apologize for it or admit what you did. but at LEAST don't keep pushing this garbage on us. for the love of god, michael's library takes up GIGS of space on my hard drive, they couldn't find another way to fill 40+seconds? give me a break.
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What I want to know is what everyone who was invited's response to the tracks being included? Did anyone bring it up with Branca and the creative team? If not, why didn't they?
 
We all know that Thad Nauden (Jasons manager) was contacted by the Estate on the 18th and 19th October last year, as per his blog, but there is another blog entry that intrigues me. It was made on 20th October:

Wednesday, October 20, 2010
Sony Records
October 20* -* Linked up with The VP of Marketing and A & R for Sony Music (New York).

John, it was great speaking with you!* I'm going to take you up on the face to face sooner than later.* I definitely look forward to linking up with you and your staff!

I'm here if you need me.**

Stage Recordings Loves SONY Music Group!
Posted by stagerecording.com at 8:38 PM 0 comments

From what I can gather, this would appear to be John Campanelli that he was talking to. It was obviously a phone call as he talks about meeting face to face later. Now what is that all about? He could have been questioning him about Jasons possible involvement like the Estate did, but still seems a little odd when they've already done that. I also notice that in his blog entry dated November 22nd entitled "No Statement Needed", he doesn't actually deny Jasons involvement. I know he did later on via TMZ, but it still seems strange. Obviously Nauden would have to be in on it. Here is the link to his blog:

http://stagerecordingspublishing.bl...-max=2011-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=34
 
After reading some previous posts I find it sad that fans have to justify why they are obsessed by the Cascio tracks. No matter medical condition or psychological diagnosis, the real issue here has been the fact that we do not hear Michael Jackson on those tracks and that there hasn't been any type of official communication since the streaming of Breaking News! Many questions have remained unanswered!

Some people want this thread to be closed not because of some off topic posts but because they don't like to see people who here and there still consider this Cascio issue unsolved and the tracks fake! Some subjects are off topic, yet we are not forgetting and will never forget what they have done to MJ's first posthumous album! A wreck on which they stuck Michael Jackson's name!

If people come here to debate nobody's telling them not to! At the moment there aren't any new info about those tracks, so what do we do now? We put this thread under the rug and forget what happened?

For some of us, while waiting for more info about the forgery, it is crucial to keep this thread alive in any possible way. In the meantime, so far, we've shared more love than hatred, yet we have been criticized with such arguments as "kids are around" or "I can't open this thread at work". Since when kids are interested in debates? On the other hand, there are far worse insults among members in some threads than inhere. The irony, --except some immature people around-- many insults probably come from the kids themselves.

Those who surf on social sites like this forum at work, ask yourselves first if your boss would agree at all to surf on social networks while at work, with or without compromising pictures!

Regarding Cirque du Soleil, yes there are terrible things said and written about MJ here and there. As far as I am concerned I am defending MJ any time any place and mostly at work. I was among those to help Ginvid (or was it Qbee?) to write a letter to Aaron and the bullshit media. I am willing to report/translate the Murray case for French and former Yugoslav fellow fans whenever I have time. But I will not forget the Cascio tracks! And yes the 40 seconds of controversial material is extremely serious and concerning! The man gave his life for fans trying to perform as perfectly as possible with not a single note of any Cascio song on his last tour and the Cirque du Soleil all they can dig up from the man's life are the parts of songs with controversial vocals! I refuse to reduce to only 40 second argument! It is a question of principle and mostly respect to MJ's work for which he gave his life!

p.s. What some call sexual inhere is nothing compared to what children see every day on the news, not to mention everyday violence and non respect they show at school. Just to name one example, a 17-year old "kid" emptied the extinguisher in the corridor of the school and called his cousins and friends to beat the teacher because he was expelled from the classrom for disturbing others. And such acts of "heroism" are every year perpetrated by younger and younger "kids". Yeah talking about drama queen when it comes to off topic subjects in this thread... Give me a break...
 
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BUMPER SNIPPET said:
p.s. What some call sexual inhere is nothing compared to what children see every day on the news, not to mention everyday violence and non respect they show at school. Just to name one example, a 17-year old "kid" emptied the extinguisher in the corridor of the school and called his cousins and friends to beat the teacher because he was expelled from the classrom for disturbing others. And such acts of "heroism" are every year perpetrated by younger and younger "kids". Yeah talking about drama queen when it comes to off topic subjects in this thread... Give me a break...
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Apples and oranges ... this is not a pr0n site, nobody expects to see pictures like this anywhere on this board. And just because children see all kinds of stuff everywhere (if the parents don't protect their children) doesn't mean that this board has to make that worse.

Also:

http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/threads/83242-MJJCommunity-FAQs-And-Forum-Rules

4. Adult conversation can be wild and fun, but please remember that we have young members here. Try to keep all discussions at a PG-13 level. No nude pictures or sexually suggestive art work allowed.
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Milka said:
Apples and oranges ... this is not a pr0n site, nobody expects to see pictures like this anywhere on this board. And just because children see all kinds of stuff everywhere (if the parents don't protect their children) doesn't mean that this board has to make that worse.

Also:

http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/threads/83242-MJJCommunity-FAQs-And-Forum-Rules
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But kids watching MJ grabbing explicitely his crotch is not suggestive?

MJ kissing L-M Presley both naked in the video is not suggestive?

2000 Watts or In the Closet lyrics are not suggestive?


Come on, let's not have double standards in our arguments here regarding what is suggestive. I don't mind all this! But neither do I advocate all of sudden for a la-la-la land forum.
 
Bumper, you forgot the group of dancers "humping the ground" in They Way You Make Me Feel. . .

Oh yes, and Michael feeling himself and exposing his underwear through an open zipper in the Black or White video. . .
 
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