On the linguistics of Michael Jackson

[zinniabooklover]

Point taken @zinniabooklover, I have mostly included IPA transcriptions for my own sake. Although to be fair, I did write it out in “plain English”, too. But I will nevertheless keep the IPA stuff to a minimum henceforth. You’ll have to excuse me, I get carried away.

oh my goodness, haven't even read the whole comment and I'm jumping in already! Let me emphasise again, no criticism was intended. I understand perfectly why you include the IPA and if I don't understand it, so what? Other people will and, anyway, it's your comment. You write whatever you want, obvs!

Bc you write stuff out in plain English as well as using the IPA, of course your comments are perfectly intelligible to me. I was just whining bc I'm not mad keen on jargon. Even when I understand it - which is often - I still don't like it. That's just me! Thank goodness we live in a world where other reactions or opinions are available!

About the technical jargon in general, I will say this: I’m only human, and I guess you can read between the lines that I am ”on the spectrum”, as they say these days.

Same.

I get absorbed and fail to adapt my language to my audience.

Sort of the same and yet not. With me it's more that I over-compensate - to the point where everyone is either dying of boredom or just of old age!

When you point it out, I can see it, and that makes me think that there is some hope. I will try my best to tone down the advanced terms,

No, absolutely not! I disagree with this entirely. Peeps should write their comments how they see fit and as long as we are all respectful and so on, where's the harm in just being yourself? You are always gonna be more into this stuff than me. Don't dilute your comments just bc I was whining like a baby, lol.

That is indeed IPA (International Phonetic Alphabet). The way I can justify its use in this instance, is that we are on a multilingual forum.

Exactly so!

The language we use is of course English, but when a person that is not a native English speaker stumbles upon a morpheme for the first time, chances are he won’t read it the same way a native speaker would.

Indeed. I am acutely aware that the world exists beyond the English language. I did languages at school* but you would never know it, sadly.

* school in the UK means ages 5 - 18. After that it's college or university. I know in America 'school' also means college or uni.

Just to be clear.

“Shamone” written just as so, would in Swedish be something like “sha-må-nä”.
If we can pick up a few basics, the beauty of an international phonetic alphabet becomes clear.

ʃ	she
ʌ	other
ɔ	thought

Consonants are for the most part the same as the ones used in written English.

I really don't think it's going to happen. Honestly, I have tried to get my head around the whole IPA thing, multiple times. There are some things - music notation is one that comes to mind - that just will not go in. My brain just dumps them and then laughs at me.

In Swedish, that would be read as something like “äp-pi-tå-mä”, whereas the pronunciation you want to communicate (correct me if I’m wrong) is what we would write “äp-paj´toum”.

Svenska. That is the sum total of my Swedish language expertise. I love the way it looks as a written word. I cannot find a way of inserting it into my everyday life so am doomed to merely admire it in its written form, lol.

I also know Flemish. Tot ziens! Er, that's it. That's my full Flemish vocab!

I figured it was something along those lines

My humour is ridiculously childish. Heavy on the sarcasm. You know, in case you hadn't spotted that.

 

[zinniabooklover]

Never heard of this. And you say he did it often?

I'm sure I've heard / read it more than once. The main one is the 1999 MTV interview but I'm sure that's not the only example. I haven't got them fixed in my head, though.

I know Bruce Swedien always was ‘(the) Swede’ or ‘Sven’, but never knew Rod was ‘the German’!

I don't know if he called Rod 'the German'. I don't remember that. In the MTV thing he says something like, 'he's a German fellow'.

And as you say, Michael would’ve known he wasn’t actually German. So, what could be the explanation here? It reeks of internal joke from where I’m standing.

I hadn't considered that although it didn't come across that way to me. But then, if it's an inside joke, it wouldn't register with me at all, would it?

Would appreciate some background.

Don't really have any.

 

[zinniabooklover]

Michael interviewed on MTV 1999.

Time stamp for Rod being referred to as a 'German fellow' - approx 4m 37s

 

[flight85]

Michael interviewed on MTV 1999.

Time stamp for Rod being referred to as a 'German fellow' - approx 4m 37s

Thank you so much for this link! I loved every minute of the interview. Wish we had hours of MJ just talking about his music and art like this, I just love it! I also love how easy going he was here, he looked like he really enjoyed himself.

 

[zinniabooklover]

Thank you so much for this link! I loved every minute of the interview. Wish we had hours of MJ just talking about his music and art like this, I just love it! I also love how easy going he was here, he looked like he really enjoyed himself.

Derailing, sorry Agonum!

Yeah, I love this interview. This and the 1987 Ebony Jet one, those are my faves bc he gets to talk about his art. When I first came across this one I was just a tiny bit peeved bc so much attention was on Thriller. Later on I discovered it was featured so heavily bc MTV had just run a poll of some sort. Top 100 videos? Something like that. Thriller wasn't even at No.1, I don't think. But they did this interview as part of the tv celebration (which I didn't see).

Also, I wasn't *that* peeved bc that story about the zombie dance moves! omg!! Awesome stuff. Lots of little anecdotes, lots of detail. So much good stuff in there. I wish it was a whole hour. Sigh!

I love his enunciation in this interview.

 

[wendijane]

gosh - nice @Agonum reading through itll take a while

 

[DangerousGal91]

@Agonum Please don't stop putting IPA transcriptions in your posts! I have a personal interest in linguistics and can actually read IPA. For people like me, it's very interesting and actually helpful. It actually tells me much more than just a regular spelling-based transcription, since English has so many different ways in which you can pronounce the language. IPA is much more objective in that regard.

 

[wendijane]

more videos

 

[Agonum]

Thank you so much for this link! I loved every minute of the interview. Wish we had hours of MJ just talking about his music and art like this, I just love it! I also love how easy going he was here, he looked like he really enjoyed himself.

Oh, but here — the way he says it — I get the impression that he just says “he’s a German fellow” in order to explain why he (Rod) would be at the hotel. Because he was German in the sense that he lived there (in Germany).

 

[zinniabooklover]

Oh, but here — the way he says it — I get the impression that he just says “he’s a German fellow” in order to explain why he (Rod) would be at the hotel.

oh sure, but I have come across mentions of this elsewhere but cannot remember where, unfortunately.

Because he was German in the sense that he lived there (in Germany).

Hm, I think we might now be in 'Lost in Translation' territory. I can't imagine ever thinking of someone as being German, say, merely bc they live there. Tina Turner lives in Switzerland but I can't imagine ever thinking of her as Swiss. Actually, that's a bad example bc she does now have a Swiss passport, I believe.

OK, let's say Michael had bought a house in Ireland (oh, I wish he had!). He would still be American. Wouldn't it be slightly weird to refer to him as Irish even if he was there for a couple of decades? Actually, that's also a lousy example bc the Irish people are so lovely who wouldn't want to be an honorary Irish person?

oh, I give up!

 

[Agonum]

Don't know if that fits into your 'Vocabulary - anomalies' section but I think this one does. In the MTV 1999 interview - which I completely adore - the interviewer asks about working with short film directors and how much input he has. Michael says he prefers videos with a story, a beginning, a middle and an ending. And then he says something like ... "But it depends on what the director wants, what his visionary is ..."

I assume he means 'vision' not 'visionary'. It doesn't matter bc it doesn't interfere with my understanding of what he's saying. But it intrigues me. I think there are a few other examples of this type of thing but that's the one I know best. As I say, it doesn't bother me, it's charming. But definitely intriguing.

It fits right in where you propose! Very interesting. I’ll have to ponder this some. If you have more related examples, please share!

 

[Agonum]

Hm, I think we might now be in 'Lost in Translation' territory. […]

You know, I think you’re right. What one would expect him to say would be “because he lives in Germany”. But the way he says it, it hardly can be some kind of internal joke, either.

 

[zinniabooklover]

It fits right in where you propose! Very interesting. I’ll have to ponder this some. If you have more related examples, please share!

It's not going well, lol.
1 - watched a few interviews, got hopelessly distracted by Michael's teeth, his hand gestures and his smile
2 - took a detour into GITM. That took a while bc multiple re-watches
3 - realised Beat It counts as an idiom, thought about looking for more examples but decided I needed to listen to Beat It first ...
4 - ... which led to IIS bc everything leads back to that, sooner or later!

 

[zinniabooklover]

Nothing really new here but it's nice to have it all together.

Michael's vocabulary (mostly ad-libs)

1m 51s

EDIT - @Agonum, just realised, you did say in your opening post this thread is supposed to be about the *spoken* word. Sorry! I'm derailing! Got confused, lol.

 

[Agonum]

Nothing really new here but it's nice to have it all together.

Michael's vocabulary (mostly ad-libs)

1m 51s

EDIT - @Agonum, just realised, you did say in your opening post this thread is supposed to be about the *spoken* word. Sorry! I'm derailing! Got confused, lol.

I meant spoken as opposed to written, so vocals are absolutely game. However, @turtleneck_sweater has already posted this fine video (post #7).

Edit: Updated the OP to reflect the above.

 

[Agonum]

[…] I have lived in 4/50 states, but traveled to 34/50 […]

This gives you a very valuable perspective!

 

[zinniabooklover]

I meant spoken as opposed to written, so vocals are absolutely game.

OK.

However, @turtleneck_sweater has already posted this fine video (post #7).

oh, fgs! What am I like? Don't answer!

I should go back to being distracted by GITM. That is clearly my niche, lol.

Edit: Updated the OP to reflect the above.

Fab!

 

[zinniabooklover]

This gives you a very valuable perspective!

I agree.

Whereas in the Midwest, people are warm, polite, and kind.

This is so interesting. If politeness is an American characteristic - then Michael is getting a double dose bc of spending the first 9 or ten years of his life in the Midwest. That's before all the other influences kick in. Bc it does seem to be the case that Michael was kind, extremely so.

When I moved there from the south the difference was immediately noticeable to me. I have always felt that of everywhere in the United States that I have lived and traveled (I have lived in 4/50 states, but traveled to 34/50) that the Midwest has the most genuine and kindest people. That's just my experience.

 

[Agonum]

If I could direct your attention to Cheater for awhile: The song’s been a favorite of mine ever since I first heard it on The Ultimate Collection. But there are parts of the lyrics that I’m struggling to make sense of.

I wrote a letter for the ghetto of the CIA

I’m at a loss as to what this means.

I don't care a jack bone

Is this a common expression? And if so, where or by whom?

One blow to the head is all you need

Don’t really know how to interpret this in this context (it repeats with slight alterations in every pre-chorus).

I hurt my backbone, baby
I start to give it up
Life is an aggravator
Sometimes I part it up
I broke my radiator
I am indestructible
I pray to leave my body
Do not you ever call?

This whole bridge… with especially peculiar lines bolded. The radiator part – is that an American idiom?

 

[zinniabooklover]

If I could direct your attention to Cheater for awhile:

First time listening to this. In no fit state to reply.

Dead on the floor!

 

[staywild23]

First time listening to this. In no fit state to reply.

Dead on the floor!

FIRST TIME?!?!?!

I wish we had a reaction cam!

 

[zinniabooklover]

FIRST TIME?!?!?!

I wish we had a reaction cam!

Can't even.

Heart beat? Gone.

 

[staywild23]

Can't even.

Heart beat? Gone.

I was driving the first time I heard that AND Monkey Business!! When I say I'm grateful to still have my life today, I really mean it lol.

 

[Fuzball]

First time listening to this. In no fit state to reply.

Dead on the floor!

Are there any other songs you haven't listened yet?

 

[zinniabooklover]

I was driving the first time I heard that AND Monkey Business!! When I say I'm grateful to still have my life today, I really mean it lol.

I feel like crying but am too frozen.

 

[zinniabooklover]

Are there any other songs you haven't listened yet?

oh tons, probably. I take life at a steady pace! And I'm not a completist so, y'know ...

 

[Agonum]

The lyrics for Cheater were most likely not finalized. Yet surely I must have gotten them wrong above.

I just gave the bridge twenty-something listenings, but I can’t for the life of me make out some of the lines (bolded below):

I hurt my backbone, baby
I start to give it up
Life is an aggravator
Somebody call it and-a [?]
I broke my radiator
I live to start the phone [?]
I plan to leave my body
Know what you hear me call [?]

“I live to start the phone” doesn’t make much sense. Please help me out.

And am I hearing right – it sounds to me like a “dug [or maybe dud] gamit” at 2m 5s?

Edit: For heaven’s sake, did I get the verse wrong, too?

I don’t care a jack bone about what you do

￫​

I don’t care a jack wonderin’ ’bout whatcha do

I’m not sure?

And maybe:

I wrote a letter for the ghetto of the CIA

makes more sense as​

I wrote a letter for the getter of the CIA

But what’s a “getter”?

 

[zinniabooklover]

Monkey Business!

Over and out.

 

[Agonum]

It would seem I have a hard time letting this go. These are the handwritten lyrics for Cheater.

 

[staywild23]

It would seem I have a hard time letting this go. These are the handwritten lyrics for Cheater.

OMGGGGGGG

I adore all things related to Michael's handwriting. I am dying (dying) (DYING) to find the handwritten lyrics to WBSS and Another Part of Me for tattoo related reasons.

Thank you for sharing this. I.AM.SO.EXCITED.