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Randall Sullivan's book "Untouchable"

Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

StellaJackson said:
TM gave interviews for the book but how do we know for certain that he wrote the review on amazon?
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You're right, i suppose we don't know for sure as he didn't refer to his amazon review in the email he sent to the website owner of reflections on the dance. But his email is similar in its support of randall's book and how he believes the book is supportive of mj in the issue of the allegations - which is so odd as that's not the case, randall's conclusions are ambivalent and convince noone.

I read tmez's email again and he said,

I believe that certain individuals who are criticized in this book are orchestrating a negative campaign. Some of the negative comments suggest that the critics did not even read the book. This is disturbing to me.
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He mentions elsewhere that these individuals are 'powerful'. Anyone who's read the whole book know what he is on about? The jacksons get absolutely slaughtered in the book but i don't think they're 'powerful' and i don't think anyone could imagine they have the wits about them to organise any typeof campaign. I've only read up to p148, but i know in the vanityfair article randall says negative stuff about the estate executors which he got from mrs j's lawyers, but it's lowrent oxman type criticisms like branca not returning mj's will when he stopped working for mj, and the estate dragging their feet and not giving mrs j 40% of mj's estate already. Tmez could mean aeg, i haven't got to that part.

It's such an unfair criticism from tmez as the reviews are clearly from well-intentioned fans with valid concerns, not sure if randall is feeding him some conspiracy angle to explain the negative feedback. Yes i'm sure alot haven't actually read all 700 pages, it's mind-numbing, but they'll have read the reviews, read the vanity fair article and seen his tv appearances so that gives a v good idea of what his book does, and doesn't do, esp on the allegations.
 
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"I have to admit I'm kind of disappointed and surprised by t-mez's response. He may think the other things such as "bleaching skin" are unimportant, but they are important because when people believe Michael was a pedophile, they tend to believe the other lies as well. It does not do to focus on only one thing to defend Michael."

Just a thing, in the book Sullivan said MJ used the Porcelana cream before his vitiligo started. I read that about Porcelana

“Back in the early 90′s a doctor told me to try a product called Porcelana. It’s a skin lightening cream that helps fade scars from acne, pregnancy and sun damage. It’s also supposed to fade freckles and other dark spots. Back then, the product was pretty costly so I never bought it. I had always wondered if it would work for me but at that time in my life I just couldn’t justify the expense and so I just went without.”

http://www.bellasavvy.net/archives/9719
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

WTH? Voodoo things are in the book? I don't agree with Tom's opinion but I do know that he wants people to see Michael was innocent. It's just this type of book is not the way to go in showing that. I never read Ian's book either. Aphrodite Jones book is a good one and that gets no attention.

I also have to say that katie couric having that guy on her show, disappointed. She should have higher standards than that. As fans we always have an uphill battle. I will always stand up for Michael no matter what people say. This book is trash and people are not interested in buying trash. I have to believe the more time passes that people will see the truth. Michael's legacy is stronger than this. It survived the crap before his death and will survive the crap now.
 
shelly_webster;3740663 said:
"I have to admit I'm kind of disappointed and surprised by t-mez's response. He may think the other things such as "bleaching skin" are unimportant, but they are important because when people believe Michael was a pedophile, they tend to believe the other lies as well. It does not do to focus on only one thing to defend Michael."

Just a thing, in the book Sullivan said MJ used the Porcelana cream before his vitiligo started. I read that about Porcelana

“Back in the early 90′s a doctor told me to try a product called Porcelana. It’s a skin lightening cream that helps fade scars from acne, pregnancy and sun damage. It’s also supposed to fade freckles and other dark spots. Back then, the product was pretty costly so I never bought it. I had always wondered if it would work for me but at that time in my life I just couldn’t justify the expense and so I just went without.”

http://www.bellasavvy.net/archives/9719
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Apparently it's used to entirely wipe out your racial identity.

It's a quote he got from Taraborrelli's first book, there's no named source, of course.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

"WTH? Voodoo things are in the book? I don't agree with Tom's opinion but I do "

He used the Orth article but I am not sure he believed the story.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

"It's a quote he got from Taraborrelli's first book, there's no named source, of course."

Yes, it's from Tarraborelli. I was just thinking it's a possibility.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

Do you think the 3 groups that Tom Messerau stated is accurate description of the people out there?
 
shelly_webster;3740663 said:
Just a thing, in the book Sullivan said MJ used the Porcelana cream before his vitiligo started. I read that about Porcelana

“Back in the early 90′s a doctor told me to try a product called Porcelana. It’s a skin lightening cream that helps fade scars from acne, pregnancy and sun damage. It’s also supposed to fade freckles and other dark spots. Back then, the product was pretty costly so I never bought it. I had always wondered if it would work for me but at that time in my life I just couldn’t justify the expense and so I just went without.”

http://www.bellasavvy.net/archives/9719
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ehehe such BS. I used Porcelana cream for years. One medicine I used combined with sun exposure had caused dark spots on my skin. I used Porcelana for 3 to 5 years regularly. It doesn't make you white or lose your pigment. It doesn't work overnight. Even a small spot requires over a year at least to really fade and even more to go away completely. And it definitely doesn't give you Vitiligo. I still have some a little darker than my regular skin tone blemishes on my skin, some are completely gone and still totally have all my pigment. (I had applied to parts of my skin that didn't have the dark spots and even my regular skin didn't get any lighter than it was or lose any pigment)
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

I was just thinking it's possible that he used it for his acne and not to bleach his skin.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

The book should really be called "Michael Jackson:Untrue Already Told Tabloid Bullshit",because that's what it basically is.
People really need to stop trying to make money off of him.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

If you read Tmez latest statement deeply, you would think he's talking about Frank Cascio's book o_O
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

I haven't read that book but I read Tom Mez statement and I disagree for the most part.

Yes, it's important to restore Michael's reputation and stop people calling him a pe.... with no argument whasoever but there has been so much bullshit spread by the media and many of us care every time Michael gets libeled, regardless his sexuality, his skin deseases or his alleged eccentricities or the human being himself. The right thing would be that all the truth comes to the light leaving aside the profit.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

Glad im not the only one dissapointed with t mez's response ......im totally stunned he would do this
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

la_cienega said:
I believed it was him when I first saw the review. Sigh.

I love and respect Mesereau, and I understand what he means about the people in the non-fan category, but he needs to realize this book is unconvincing in any regard to that.
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I have to agree. That is why I was saying before that TMez stated he will talk at small or large groups about Michael. It is my belief that he does not really care about the venue but what his comments/statements will be. Hence he gives his statements to this sleezeball because he thinks that people will be influenced by his statements and Sullivans about Michael not being a pedo. I do not think so.

Why I disagree with TMez is (1) Sullivan's book is filled with too much tabloid trash. Since the people who read it are interested in tabloid sensations, they are not going to take the part about Michael not being a pedo seriously since there are too many distractions in the book suggesting he is a pedo. Remember Sullivan played both to the fans and the haters. TMez is forgetting that many people equate people who are sexual deviants as pedos, so if Michael is a presexual who died a virgin, that makes some people think he is queer in some sexual way, and therefore, is more inclined to be a pedo. (Remember Oprah asked Michael if he was a virgin, and what do you think she was thinking? She was thinking-- this is a grown man who did not have sex, and plays with boys, so 1 + 1 = 4.)

(2) Sullivan's book is not doing well so his book will not meet a huge market that can be swayed, as TMez thinks.

(3) Books like Sullivan's and from people like Sullivan do not change people's views from negatives to positives. They are read by people who know there will be negative content, as a form of gossip, to be entertained, to be thrilled and not to be enlightened. It is usually more scholarly, well-written, factual information that change people's views. We know this because it is when we give people facts that they see that Michael is innocent; when facts were given to the principal at the school, he removed the boards that covered Michael's name; when Jones looked only at the facts and not merely sensations, she realized Michael was innocent. How about the juror who came into the jury room saying she knew Michael was guilty but once all the facts came in, she had to change her mind.

(3) TMez feels the worst thing said about Michael is the pedo charge, so he is more interested in that. OK, that is fine, but the surgeries, skin color, sexual orientation, and pedo charge are all connected together. Anytime the media mention one of these, like the surgeries, or skin color, or sexual orientation they will attach the pedo story. Rarely do you see someone talk about Michael surgeries or gayness and not include the pedo in the narrative. So I find it hard to separate the pedo from all the rest because in people's minds now if they hear Michael and surgeries, their mind make an association with pedo too. If they hear someone talk about Michael and his sexual orientation, their minds make an association with pedo too. It is like the psychological study where when the bell rings, the dogs salivate. This is the way the human mind works.

So, although I respect TMez as a great lawyer, one who has a great intellect, I differ with him here about encouraging people to buy this book. This book will do nothing to change people's views that Michael was not a pedo. All this book is doing is encouraging the stereotypes about Michael and his lifestyle.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

All those allegations in the 80's of MJ bleaching his skin, having all kinds of plastic surgery and being gay, made it easy for people to fall for the Pedo story when it hit the news in 93. That's why Sullivan book is a horrible thing because it does just that, combines all to make MJ look bad. Besides he totally does nothing to defend him of the 93 allegations that started this whole Pedo ish in the first place. So how is that vindicating MJ? To do that u have to start backwards and know and understand the facts of the 93 allegations first IMO.

Also I do wonder why doesn't T-Mez just write his own book on the 03 case/05 trial already? Why rely so much in others to do it for him? Like Jones and this fool Sullivan? I would buy a T-Mez book about Just the allegations. Yes, we have Jones book but, it's still also about what she saw and felt. I wanna know that too about T-Mez. Especially because he was the lead defense attorney and was with MJ through that whole time and would have much more info to share. Something Jones couldn't do since she only saw MJ in the court.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

Blue I thought about that, but maybe he does not have the time to write. I was thinking that a book from the foreman of the juror would be good too, but again he might not get a publisher if he can't put in some usual trash. Do you know if any publication rushed to the jurors to have them write a book? I guess they would be more interested if there was a guilty verdict.

Right now I think the best thing is for someone or group of people to get the trial transcripts and show what facts caused the non guilty verdict. For the Jordan case, they will need to show all the circumstances of that case including the civil and criminal aspects, put all that together, and show how the shake down began from the beginning to the end. If I did not have such a crazy job, I would spend the time and do the research and take on this major but important project. I would even hunt down Jordan's friends who he told it was not true and include all that in the doc.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

Petrarose said:
Blue I thought about that, but maybe he does not have the time to write. I was thinking that a book from the foreman of the juror would be good too, but again he might not get a publisher if he can't put in some usual trash. Do you know if any publication rushed to the jurors to have them write a book? I guess they would be more interested if there was a guilty verdict.

Right now I think the best thing is for someone or group of people to get the trial transcripts and show what facts caused the non guilty verdict. For the Jordan case, they will need to show all the circumstances of that case including the civil and criminal aspects, put all that together, and show how the shake down began from the beginning to the end. If I did not have such a crazy job, I would spend the time and do the research and take on this major but important project. I would even hunt down Jordan's friends who he told it was not true and include all that in the doc.
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Juror #5 Ellie Cook A.K.A "Don't snap your finger at me lady" was the only juror already workin on a book before a verdict was in. Juror #1 Ray Holtman joined in on the book after the verdict with both of them saying they regretted lettin MJ free and yadda, yadda, yadda! Oh what money can to some SMH. Her book was to be called "Free as a bird, Guilty as sin." Luckily no publisher took her seriously after her verdict. She also was friends with one of the Pros witnesses Adrian McManus. When I found that out back then I was surprised she was allowed to even serve as a juror. I mean really, Look at the way she ended up turning out after the trial. Lying through her teeth that she was forced to give a not guilty verdict...GRANDMA PLEASE! :bs

Also yes it would be nice for us to have a short but to the point facts sheet of both the 93, 03 allegations + 05 trial! But, we would still have to be careful as to what things we choose to include if it happens? Because saying something like Jordan was given Sodium Amytal can be a problem. I for one don't think he was drugged to confess a damn thing. That IMO was just another excuse Evan Chandler had under his sleeve to get out of a criminal trial. That drugged is inadmissible in court.
 
suzynyc;3740723 said:
Sullivan's responses to critic's tweets regarding his appearance on Katie Couric's show are here (um including my own, heh):

http://www.katiecouric.com/features/untouchable-author-randall-sullivan-critics/
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Randall is an idiot. He says in one of his answers:
Randall’s Response: As I state in the book and on Katie, I do not know to a certainty, but it is the conclusion best supported by the evidence. The evidence would be that no one credible except Lisa Marie has ever said they were sexually active with him.

That made me laugh out loud:hysterical:
Ok, let me get this right, MJ and LMP both said they had sex, but we are not to believe them, because no one else "credible" came out and proved that MJ and LMP indeed had sex:rollin:
As far as I know, having sex is a "business" between the two people, and usually there isn't third person making notes and photographs for future use as a proof. Then again it is MJ, so everything he does, must be photographed or filmed, there has to be other people (credible) around to prove what ever is needed later use:doh:

As for this credible person Sullivan mentions, who would be this credible person? There isn't such a thing. Even if priest came forward and said he saw MJ having sex with some woman, that would not end up in the book, or is not enough credible source for this tabloid junkie Sullivan because it doesn't serve his purpose:smilerolleyes:


He also says he interviewed Katherine Jackson to this book. Shame on her for contributing to this scrap book. Did she even thought thinking of MJ's kids before opening her mouth to this idiot?
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

^ If Lisa Marie is not credible, nobody would be.

This nose stuff is getting more convoluted. So now it's because of autopsy photos that he feels this way? Except those photos show he had his nose. How many different stories does he have about this nose. The coroner said he had to cut away the prosthetic, there's a publicly available photo showing this prosthetic, he took it off at night, a jar of noses, etc etc etc keeps changing and it's all easy to disprove.

Does he have just one credible story about it though? No. You'd think with the caliber he'd required for credible witnesses to his romantic life with women, including his wives, he'd have high standards of journalism which required fact checking. Now he changes his story about the nose with every interview.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

"(3) TMez feels the worst thing said about Michael is the pedo charge, so he is more interested in that. OK, that is fine, but the surgeries, skin color, sexual orientation, and pedo charge are all connected together. "

Sullivan did say MJ had vitiligo. His book is not worst than Tarraborelli.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

shelly_webster said:
"(3) TMez feels the worst thing said about Michael is the pedo charge, so he is more interested in that. OK, that is fine, but the surgeries, skin color, sexual orientation, and pedo charge are all connected together. "

Sullivan did say MJ had vitiligo. His book is not worst than Tarraborelli.
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Yes, I think some fans undeservedly and blindly glorify JRT's book when it's pretty bad too as far as innuendo and insinuations about the allegations go.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

la_cienega said:
^ If Lisa Marie is not credible, nobody would be.

This nose stuff is getting more convoluted. So now it's because of autopsy photos that he feels this way? Except those photos show he had his nose. How many different stories does he have about this nose. The coroner said he had to cut away the prosthetic, there's a publicly available photo showing this prosthetic, he took it off at night, a jar of noses, etc etc etc keeps changing and it's all easy to disprove.

Does he have just one credible story about it though? No. You'd think with the caliber he'd required for credible witnesses to his romantic life with women, including his wives, he'd have high standards of journalism which required fact checking. Now he changes his story about the nose with every interview.
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This coming from the man that keeps his own brain in the jar, thus this book:D

It's not the first time he comes out with crappy stories. I came across with this post about his so called journalistic work
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=1447
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

respect77 said:
Yes, I think some fans undeservedly and blindly glorify JRT's book when it's pretty bad too as far as innuendo and insinuations about the allegations go.
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My point is, the book is not a love letter but i's far from being an horrible one either. People need to calm down and read it.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

shelly_webster said:
"(3) TMez feels the worst thing said about Michael is the pedo charge, so he is more interested in that. OK, that is fine, but the surgeries, skin color, sexual orientation, and pedo charge are all connected together. "

Sullivan did say MJ had vitiligo. His book is not worst than Tarraborelli.
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Had vitiligo but hated his race (called black people "splaboos", cited Orth, who used Bob Jones/Stacy Brown as sources for that, then repeated in their own book, which Sullivan uses as though it were the Rosetta Stone) and bleached his skin so he wasn't black (Blanca Francia) and used bleaching creams (porcelena, JRT) in the 70s with Toya.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

I have to get back to Randall's reply on Couric show as I find it immensely amusing

"As I state in the book and on Katie, I do not know to a certainty, but it is the conclusion best supported by the evidence. The evidence would be that no one credible except Lisa Marie has ever said they were sexually active with him."

Conclusion is best supported by the evidence and evidence would be if other credible source come forward?
Ok, going by his words: if that is the case, I wonder he didn't come conclusion of the 93 case?
There were accusations from one person/family, and no other credible source came forward to back them up, so going by Sullivan's own words, he should have come conclusion MJ was innocent? Of course that doesn't suit to his agenda whatever that might be.

I suppose the above is his standard reply for people who questions his "credible" sources and even more incredible stories.
According to him, the women he interviewed for having sex with MJ, he found them unbelievable, so he comes to conclusion MJ didn't sleep with anyone, never mind what wife says:rollin:

Wonder did he applied the same theory to Lester part too? He said he interviewed Lester, but did he interviewed his wife too. She could have either refute or agree with Lester's claims but obviously he didn't find what wife had to say "credible" thus Lester's crap ended up in the book of tales.

He wrote stories that Mann provided him. I wonder did he get other people to confirm or support Mann's stories, or did he accepted his stories as they were. According to his own words, he should have, but I doubt he did.

I would not spend a penny for his conclusions or not know to a certainty, I have my own and they are free:)
If somebody is going to write a bio of MJ, they have to do better than that.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

la_cienega said:
Had vitiligo but hated his race (called black people "splaboos", cited Orth, who used Bob Jones/Stacy Brown as sources for that, then repeated in their own book, which Sullivan uses as though it were the Rosetta Stone) and bleached his skin so he wasn't black (Blanca Francia) and used bleaching creams (porcelena, JRT) in the 70s with Toya.
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Yes, he used court doc for the Francia, and he used stacy Brown. That book is not worst nor better than any other book available.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess [Threads merged]

Debra Jean Rowe Jackson was married to MJ, and it was not a brief relationship. They were a couple for over twenty years. Debbie said that she and MJ did have sex and they also had two children together. Debbie is extremely credible. It seems as though Sullivan copy/pasted from books written by others and also some fan's blogs. Or, maybe he just read fanfics...lol He seems like the type that might do something like that. Sullivan must have a large ego and wrote a large book (700 pages or so), but unfortunately also seems to be a small man when it comes to character and credibility.
 
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