Wembley DVD Critique /Quality and other prefered concerts over Wembley go here

[SmoothC21]

They said they had Yokohoma in HQ but did not consider releasing it because it was the first leg.

We know they have master for this show but another question is why they didn't use this master for the DVD release? Cuz IJCSLY/Bad that is added as a bonus to the DVD looks like restoration of the version that we already have. Even not close to the quality from 'The One'...

 

[DJ_OXyGeNe_8]

We have to ask to "The One" DVD producers; where did they get these footages (probably Michael gave) and what exactly they did for colors, lights. Super editing, restoring.

LA amateur restoration is more better than Wembley Pro restoration....

Sorry, but I don't believe them. They gonna try to sell again, and again, and again... Like before


So Estate manages Michael's legacy, but they can't find / know what exactly they have?


A couple days ago, watched JAWS witn new version (Universal 100th Anniversary)

There was a documentary about restoration on bluray; they did an amazing job. I really saw what restoration is.

Wembley is not a restoration. If it's a restored DVD, sorry but couldn't understand; what actually did they restored?

 

[EML]

I honestly was super excited for this DVD. But the quality in its restored form is no where near what the estate advertised. I think I would prefer a high quality U-matic with a front of the house mix audio. No more VHS's.

With that said I am glad a Bad World Tour concert has been officially released. The quality is not the best, but I love and truly enjoy watching it!

 

[Hunterr]

Didn't MJ not even perform DD and SC at the last L.A. show?
Not sure why urrybody would want that show (i guess because they used the footage from the promo tape in THE ONES and we have the 12 minute tape around now, so that's all we know to want), but I'm all for MADISON SQUARE GARDEN!!

Also, I don't see why people get upset when people voice their OPINIONS on what they would have liked to have had/still wish to have/etc etc.

Yes, the DVD turned out watchable, but it's nice to dream. Or something.

 

[qbee]

^^^ :hysterical:

 

[WiseGuy]

Didn't MJ not even perform DD and SC at the last L.A. show?
Not sure why urrybody would want that show (i guess because they used the footage from the promo tape in THE ONES and we have the 12 minute tape around now, so that's all we know to want), but I'm all for MADISON SQUARE GARDEN!!

Also, I don't see why people get upset when people voice their OPINIONS on what they would have liked to have had/still wish to have/etc etc.

Yes, the DVD turned out watchable, but it's nice to dream. Or something.

He didn't perform dirty diana. But did smooth criminal. Dirty Diana is not performed in the last 20 or so shows I'm guessing.

 

[Hunterr]

Aw, lame.
LAME!
What's up with that??
(and that seems a bit much.... Surely he did them at them Tokyo shows in December...)

 

[Ashtanga]

:fear:

 

[WiseGuy]

Well I might had stretched the 20 shows lol. But no if you watch the amatuer cleary Dirty Diana is missing and I doubt its just a coincidense.

 

[Frankyboy5]

The estate did say they would restore it, but they never said to anyone HOW GOOD it would look.

The thing is, most fans took the statement to be "that preview is not the final version, the final version will be MUCH better". I do agree there is some improvement but the Estate didn't really make a promise that the quality will be MUCH better. All they did was simply state that a "lab" was hired to restore the video and give some "background information" and an explanation for using the July 16 concert.

Also there is Dirty Diana in the amateur concert...

 

[Galactus123]

Re: Do you believe video quality?

I mean do you believe that Michael keep himself as VHS tape quality? Ok lets find true;

This footage is from The One DVD, and Michael was the Executive Producer of that DVD.

I don't know which performance is this. But looks like filmed super high quality. I think whole tour filmed like this. You can check "Brace Yourself" video. And also I noticed that, BAD, Dirty Diana videos on that DVD are super quality too. More better than any released official DVDs. And also Dangerous Tour performances are super quality too.

Do you really think Michael archived his performances as VHS?

Sorry, I don't.


So why did they release like this? Next year they'll find better source?

I hope they release that L.A. concert some day. It would be great to see it! Picture quality is amazing:

Watch in HD

 

[charismatic]

If you all look at the Japan footage we already had, you can see film (not video) cameras in the stadium so I know they had to have filmed the Yokomah shows. Also, the Colorist did make it seem like entire shows were filmed not just a couple of songs as I and some thought before.

One thing that is interesting is that the Estate never once mentioned anything about the tours being captured on Film or filmed in any other way aside from the Jumbo Tron footage. And they never mentioned why a concert as big as this would not be captured as a Film. So I think they know something that they aren't sharing and it would be great if we could get them to answer about the film. Branca said MJ fans are very smart and knowlegable and that is true!

 

[Dorian]

One thing that is interesting is that the Estate never once mentioned anything about the tours being captured on Film or filmed in any other way aside from the Jumbo Tron footage. And they never mentioned why a concert as big as this would not be captured as a Film. So I think they know something that they aren't sharing and it would be great if we could get them to answer about the film. Branca said MJ fans are very smart and knowlegable and that is true!

Maybe this is from the same reason Michael rejected the soundboard recordings? He didn't like it.

 

[TheMan1998]

Re: Do you believe video quality?

I mean do you believe that Michael keep himself as VHS tape quality? Ok lets find true;

This footage is from The One DVD, and Michael was the Executive Producer of that DVD.

I don't know which performance is this. But looks like filmed super high quality. I think whole tour filmed like this. You can check "Brace Yourself" video. And also I noticed that, BAD, Dirty Diana videos on that DVD are super quality too. More better than any released official DVDs. And also Dangerous Tour performances are super quality too.

Do you really think Michael archived his performances as VHS?

Sorry, I don't.


So why did they release like this? Next year they'll find better source?

That's what I'm saying. back in the 80's "super high quality" was limited to broadcast standard, that is Super VHS of 480 lines for NTSC format. This is quite near DVD limits for NTSC. I do believe the entire tour was filmed in this fine quality. But for some strange reason, Sony did not get the master recording for the Bad25 release. Instead, they had to settle for a standard VHS copy, which they did the best to restore it.. That is what we got... The London 16th Dirty Diana was already broadcast back in the 80's on MTV Bad diaries in a much better broadcast standard quality with the exact same edit of the fotage.. Sony clearly used a low wuality VHS tape of the master copy of that concert.. maybe the estate denied them the masters.. We'll never know... I'm 100% sure that MJ's private video collection included all the masters to every one of the bad shows concert...

 

[WildStyle]

Re: Do you believe video quality?

That's what I'm saying. back in the 80's "super high quality" was limited to broadcast standard, that is Super VHS of 480 lines for NTSC format. This is quite near DVD limits for NTSC. I do believe the entire tour was filmed in this fine quality. But for some strange reason, Sony did not get the master recording for the Bad25 release. Instead, they had to settle for a standard VHS copy, which they did the best to restore it.. That is what we got... The London 16th Dirty Diana was already broadcast back in the 80's on MTV Bad diaries in a much better broadcast standard quality with the exact same edit of the fotage.. Sony clearly used a low wuality VHS tape of the master copy of that concert.. maybe the estate denied them the masters.. We'll never know... I'm 100% sure that MJ's private video collection included all the masters to every one of the bad shows concert...

You should read the letter from the estate on page 1. It answers most of your questions.

I do believe Bad tour shows were captured on film. Where that film is now is anyone's guess. I don't believe this particular show was captured on film.

 

[analogue]

I just came up with a crazy theory. Most us know that Michael never wanted Bad Tour released so does anyone think it's possible that Michael decided to hide the master tapes of the show to try and make sure that it never get's released?

 

[qbee]

That's what I'm saying. back in the 80's "super high quality" was limited to broadcast standard, that is Super VHS of 480 lines for NTSC format. This is quite near DVD limits for NTSC. I do believe the entire tour was filmed in this fine quality. But for some strange reason, Sony did not get the master recording for the Bad25 release. Instead, they had to settle for a standard VHS copy, which they did the best to restore it.. That is what we got... The London 16th Dirty Diana was already broadcast back in the 80's on MTV Bad diaries in a much better broadcast standard quality with the exact same edit of the fotage.. Sony clearly used a low wuality VHS tape of the master copy of that concert.. maybe the estate denied them the masters.. We'll never know... I'm 100% sure that MJ's private video collection included all the masters to every one of the bad shows concert...

We have known for months what the deal was - from when they first gave us the announcement. They didnt have any masters to give to Sony or they would have. They restored a 25yrs old personal VHS of Michaels. They were happy/lucky to find even that. They could have released 1st leg at much less expense but that is not what fans requested or wanted becuase we all have that footage any way and it only has 2 BAd songs in it. They wanted this to the the Best release possible for the fans. Plus they had the Best audio for Wembley.

FROM: JOHN BRANCA and JOHN McCLAIN
DATE: MAY 31, 2012
RE: BAD 25 RELEASE


It is great to see the overwhelming support and excitement in the fan community for the upcoming BAD 25 release. A few questions have arisen regarding the Wembley concert DVD. Although the press release wasn’t the place for background details, here is more information:

• We know that Nocturne captured on Umatic tapes the footage projected onto the JumboTrons at the various concerts including Wembley. These tapes were turned over to Michael’s crew and we have confirmed with Patrick Kelly (who headed Michael’s film crew for the European tour) that everything from Europe was sent to LA to be put in Michael’s storage facilities. The same procedures were followed for the US shows.

• Unfortunately, record-keeping in the storage facilities was sporadic, at best, so we do not know what happened to a tape once it was sent for storage. In most cases, once a tape was pulled from the box it arrived in, it was not put back in the original box and where it wound up doesn’t always make sense. As a result, 25 years later not all of the Umatic tapes from the various shows can be located, notwithstanding that we have conducted an extensive survey of all of the storage facilities. So while we believe that the Umatic tape for Wembley was initially sent for storage, we have not been able to locate it. And with regard to the Umatic footage of other concerts, the audio is extremely problematic and therefore these concerts are unusable.

• We know that VHS copies of the Umatics were made when Michael wanted to view a particular concert, but because of the lack of record-keeping, we also didn’t know which concerts existed on VHS. We ultimately did find Michael’s personal VHS viewing copy of the Wembley show attended by Princess Diana and Prince Charles, but not the Umatic. Even finding this VHS felt like a miracle to us!

• So while we continued the search for the Wembley Umatic master, we also researched the audio recordings that existed from all of the concerts including Wembley. Fortunately, the Wembley audio recordings were made using a sound truck, and appear to be the only multi-track recordings from the tour. The other audio/visual recordings that exist, whether Umatic or VHS, are “front of house” mixes, and therefore there are no separate audio recordings that can be used to create a high quality listening experience. It is for this reason that the Wembley audio is the only one suitable to create a live album.

• If we were going to include a live concert DVD in the BAD 25 release package, we had only one choice, Wembley. And there were only two options for visual – the Umatics for a different show or the VHS for Wembley. It would certainly be less expensive for the Estate to be able to create a DVD from a Umatic tape than to spend the time and money to painstakingly restore/enhance the VHS footage, but then we would not be delivering a truly authentic experience and we truly believe that watching this concert with the high quality audio will create a magical experience for all the fans as it has for us. We ultimately chose a lab that has developed its own proprietary technology for doing this kind of work (including restoration for NASA of VHS footage) in order to make the visual experience the best it can be under the circumstances.


We also could have chosen to release the Japanese concert from the first leg of the tour as there is a master of that show; but that concert was essentially a reincarnation of the Victory Tour with only two songs – “Bad” and “I Just Can’t Stop Loving You” – added at the end. It isn’t what we believe the fans would want.


We could have elected not to release a DVD as part of the BAD 25 celebration (and hold out hope that someday we might find the Umatic of the Wembley concert) or we could share with the fans the chance to relive that magical night with pristine audio. We made the decision to go with the latter and provide the fans with the most authentic viewing experience. We believe that the fans will agree it was the right choice when the package is released in September.

 

[ivy]

I just came up with a crazy theory. Most us know that Michael never wanted Bad Tour released so does anyone think it's possible that Michael decided to hide the master tapes of the show to try and make sure that it never get's released?

Michael famously said he prefers people to come and watch him and not being a fan of releasing concert videos.

you are seeing a lot of could have , should have on this thread but none of you are considering that for the 22 years after Bad - when alive - Michael did not release Bad tour - simply because he didn't want to. If that's the case there's no sense in holding on to the masters, film reels etc. Very similar to how it is rumored that he ordered IJCSLY French masters to be destroyed he could have destroyed other stuff too.

 

[WildStyle]

My thinking is that the possible reason that the reportedly planned Bad Tour film didn't come out back in the day was because Michael was simply focused on Moonwalker. We all know how he wanted that to have a theatrical release. There was really no room for a Bad Tour film as well as Moonwalker. After that, I'd say it was just that the time had passed and there was no real reason to release it anymore. Eventually, it was probably forgotten. Much like The Rolling Stones aborted "Rock 'n' Roll Circus" TV special from 1969, that wasn't released until 1996!

 

[DJ_OXyGeNe_8]

I don't agree with Michael wanted everybody come to live show. He came to Istanbul 2 times (dangerous era) First one canceled. Than came back 1 year later. And I remember before the concert (2 times) sponsored TV station did broadcast Bucharest Concert. One night before the show.

And he was perfectionist. Do you really think that Michael filmed his shows in bad quality? He could buy what he wants. He could buy latest techonolgy.

And I think everybody watched "Dangerous Diaries" There was a part about recording shows. They showed how did they film the shows. I believe Michael recorded all his performances in latest and best technology.



This is more better and earliler than Wembley, right?

 

[DJ_OXyGeNe_8]

And the Estate; they didn't ask "Michael, what about your concerts? What will we do?" Didn't they? If they didn't, how can they protect Michael's rights? How kind of dealing? Did they forget to ask "Michael, where is your live shows" Did they really forget to ask?

 

[WiseGuy]

The estate did say they would restore it, but they never said to anyone HOW GOOD it would look.

The thing is, most fans took the statement to be "that preview is not the final version, the final version will be MUCH better". I do agree there is some improvement but the Estate didn't really make a promise that the quality will be MUCH better. All they did was simply state that a "lab" was hired to restore the video and give some "background information" and an explanation for using the July 16 concert.

Also there is Dirty Diana in the amateur concert...

I was stating in the tokyo concert its missing. I'm guessing Tokyo and L.A. last concerts Dirty Diana was removed.

 

[qbee]

And the Estate; they didn't ask "Michael, what about your concerts? What will we do?" Didn't they? If they didn't, how can they protect Michael's rights? How kind of dealing? Did they forget to ask "Michael, where is your live shows" Did they really forget to ask?

When the Estate (Branca and Mclain) took over Michael was already passed away. So I dont understand your question. Michael was not around for them to ask. They were not involved over the years to know what happend to everything. They are contacting who they can now to track things down. Michael went though many managers, attorney and assitances. over the years. Apparantly there was no one person to oversee these things. Other famililar with these storage facilities stated that sometimes things would be checked out and not returned and that many were not labeled labeled correctly. Its not the Etstaes fault. This is the way it was turned over to them. They are trying to organise what they can.

 

[DJ_OXyGeNe_8]

OK let's say my mistake, I didn't know that Estate stuation.

But if they said true, means leaking is free...

Because, if they really don't know what they have, how can they say "this belongs to us"

Leakers and youtube uploaders can ask after this time; if you want us to remove videos, show us the original records and proove that belongs to you.

If you don't have anything (you said, we don't) so leaking is free. You don't have any rights on these videos...

 

[ivy]

OK let's say my mistake, I didn't know that Estate stuation.

But if they said true, means leaking is free...

Because, if they really don't know what they have, how can they say "this belongs to us"

Leakers and youtube uploaders can ask after this time; if you want us to remove videos, show us the original records and proove that belongs to you.

If you don't have anything (you said, we don't) so leaking is free. You don't have any rights on these videos...

they own Michael Jackson name, image and likeliness. So they can make a claim on everything that has Michael Jackson in it.

For example they won against Howard Mann because the logo he was using looked like the Smooth Criminal lean.

 

[ByReyberHDVideos]

Re: Wembley DVD content - Discuss Michael, his Wembley concert and performances

just edit the colors.

 

[zhelva]

Re: Do you believe video quality?

This footage is from The One DVD, and Michael was the Executive Producer of that DVD.

:bugeyed wow, if this is true, then... interesting, I must say! h34r:

after hearing all these stories about Michael not wanting to release BWT I cant help but wonder if maybe he really had some better quality source but just didn't want to use it and it's possibly still lying somewhere.

All I can say is.. I reeeeealy hope they find it one day. This BAD25 release made me wanna see more of BAD soooo BAD

 

[code753cr]

Well, I think we all know by now, saying this again, the estate is not trustworthy! And DJ! Where have you been throughout this entire discussion?! Good to have you in here and active in the forum or at all really. The work done on Jaws is what should of been done with the Bad Tour! That is a perfect example and the stuff on the Dangerous Diaries shows what happens "behind the secenes" almost. That is Nocturne Productions crew on the DWT! Same crew for the Bad Tour! They are actually still alive;
http://www.nocturneproductions.com/
I wonder how thoroughly the estate searched. I wonder if he went to Nocturne, or the film crews, or people who worked there, get into contact with people who helped run the tour, etc. I am sure someone out there has this stuff, I honestly doubt they were thrown out or put into a garbage. Someone out there has to have it or something better than Wembley. I don't buy a lot of what the estate says honestly. If we never get anything else from the bad tour released offically...then what a shame and shame to the fans. And honestly, if Michael were around now, I gurantee Michael would NOT have this released! He would not! It's not acceptable.
I am posting a video of a simple fan reviewing the Bad Tour Wembley, I think it would be great in this thread. He talks about the performance and also the quality and such. He is not quality freaks like us, but a normal MJ fan who seems to review DVDs and other Blu-Rays;

MJ Bad Tour Wembley REVIEW: The Good, The Bad25, and the Ugly

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vRZuW01g4Q

 

[rsggamer123]

Im still unsure as to whether to believe the estate or not, after the Michael album nothing would really surprise me. But the films for the concerts are out there somewhere, and surely they cant be that hard to find. Did the estate even contact noctune productions? Im sure somebody knows where these films are.

 

[Hunterr]

I wouldn't even mind if it was a mix of more than one show. It can be done.