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Murray Trial - Day 19 - October 27 2011 - Discussion

Beth Karas InSession
Court will resume in about an hour. The defense may recall briefly Mike Henson, the toxicologist who analyzed Jackson's stomach contents. The defense has dropped the argument that the stomach contents have four times the amount of lorazepam as other parts of his body. Their focus now, regarding lorazepam levels, is on the urine at the scene and at autopsy. Dr. Waldman, the addicition specialist, will probably interpret Dr. Arnold Klein's medical records since Judge Pastor is not allowing Klein to testify. Dr. Paul White is expected to be the last witness for the defense unless, of course, Murray decides to testify.
 
White and dr waldman are the last witnesses for the defence. although pastor has said he will ask murray after the above witnesses finish if he wants to testify or not. defence have stated he wont.court starts at 0845. today imo could be a tough day as its two witnesses that will actual ly support the defence which is a first. waldman is a detox drug expert so prepare for alot of crap. but once this day is over we are near to the end. the prosecutional rebuttal will then begin after the defence rests. not much to rebute other than the detox and white stuff imo.judge has said he will give both sides the weekend to write the closing speeches. so statements monday and hopefully the jury out late monday
 
Michael Jackson supporters on one side and Murray supporters on other 'debating' with each other reports in Session.
 
Prosecution should call dr. Steven Shafer again after White and Waldman because I think they will talk much crap today. And I'm very surprised that the prosecution never objected that that "scene urine" is from 7:30 how Murray said. That urine could be from any time that night or even earlier.
 
The fans should ignore these ppl and stop being bated
 
I'm really anxious to hear what White has to say to counter ALL his colleagues. Can't believe he is actually going to put his reputation and self on the line for Conrad Murray.
 
OnirMJ said:
Prosecution should call dr. Steven Shafer again after White and Waldman because I think they will talk much crap today. And I'm very surprised that the prosecution never objected that that "scene urine" is from 7:30 how Murray said. That urine could be from any time that night or even earlier.
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the prosecution have their own addiction expert according to reports.the urine is irrelevent as its historical
 
gerryevans said:
I'm really anxious to hear what White has to say to counter ALL his colleagues. Can't believe he is actually going to put his reputation and self on the line for Conrad Murray.
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I doubt he will defend murray in anyway. hes already said he believes murray lied about the loraz levels. imo he will say nothing other than the high concentration can be caused by self injection and say why
 
ivy said:
Beth Karas InSession
The defense has dropped the argument that the stomach contents have four times the amount of lorazepam as other parts of his body. Their focus now, regarding lorazepam levels, is on the urine at the scene and at autopsy.
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I wish they'd make up their mind!

this constant opinion change, makes them look like a right bunch of idiots and I'm sure the jury won't be impressed.

I'm sure the pathologist ( i think) said the urine level wasn't a good indicator...how is the urine sample supposed to help them?
 
elusive moonwalker said:
I doubt he will defend murray in anyway. hes already said he believes murray lied about the loraz levels. imo he will say nothing other than the high concentration can be caused by self injection and say why
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That makes sense. Thanks.
 
elusive moonwalker said:
the prosecution have their own addiction expert according to reports.the urine is irrelevent as its historical
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I know but level of lorazapam is higher in autopsy urine. And defense is telling that the scene urine is taken in 7:30 and that after that lorazapam level went higher. But that urine could be from any time that night! I think that prosecution need to highlight that.
 
About the with drawl thing you ever been sleeping at night and have the feeling that you are falling and wake right up? That is called a hypnotic jerk people who go through withdrawals ESP at night suffer from these alot and it keeps from sleeping. Murray said Michael only went to sleep for 15 minutes but was up all night so if he was going through withdrawal how come Michael was not falling asleep and waking back up?
 
volitional said:
I wish they'd make up their mind!

this constant opinion change, makes them look like a right bunch of idiots and I'm sure the jury won't be impressed.

I'm sure the pathologist ( i think) said the urine level wasn't a good indicator...how is the urine sample supposed to help them?
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well if they are dropping the tablet theory the only way the loraz levels got to where there did is becasue of murray! or i guess they are gonna now say mj self injected the loraz aswell!
 
Justthefacts said:
About the with drawl thing you ever been sleeping at night and have the feeling that you are falling and wake right up? That is called a hypnotic jerk people who go through withdrawals ESP at night suffer from these alot and it keeps from sleeping. Murray said Michael only went to sleep for 15 minutes but was up all night so if he was going through withdrawal how come Michael was not falling asleep and waking back up?
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so thats what its called. i get loads of them. i shake myself awake cause im having a dream about say a bee trying to sting me or falling.

if mj was in withdrawl he was in withdrawl since the beginning of 09 as he was seeing klien from them. he last saw klien on the 22nd. so the pattern was no different to when he had seen him the previous x amount of months. ie seeing him once a week or twice or maybe not seeing him for 2 weeks at a time. when mj didnt see klien for a week or two was he going through withdrawl then aswell? totally illogical argument
 
They also need to highlight that MJ had serious skin problems and that dr. Klein is one of the best dermatologists in the world and that MJ was his patient since 80's. I think that Klein should be allowed to testify. How can some other doctor (non-dermatologist) know what Klein was doing to MJ and why he gave him that drugs. That doesn't make sense to me.
 
How can some other doctor (non-dermatologist) know what Klein was doing to MJ and why he gave him that drugs. That doesn't make sense to me.
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unlike murray klien has medical records
 
Klein's records will speak for him. There is a reason why the DA does not object to the records being used. And lets not forget Klein is a :crazy so he is better off far away from the stand and under the bus he belongs under
 
exactly. talk about a lose cannon. even the defence werent stupid enough to call david adams for that reason
 
I just heard on In Session that the defense actually warned the DA before trial yesterday not to ask the defense witnesses certain questions. Namely, he told them not to ask them what they think happened to Michael because it won't end well. Apparently, the the DA went into those waters the witnesses would say some pretty interesting stuff.

Namely, from the witnesses' point-of-view Michael was the one who stole Murray from them. They believe Michael was an addict who took advantage of Murray's kindness and got himself killed.

Although I defended the witnesses and their beliefs yesterday, the above statement is incredibly selfish given that it was Michael who died.
 
I wont watch today. Dont wanna hear this BS. So thanks in advance for all the updates :flowers:
 
souldreamer7 said:
Michael Jackson supporters on one side and Murray supporters on other 'debating' with each other reports in Session.
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If they had to hire a PR firm to get the character witnesses I wonder if this Murray supporters are just paid anybodies?
 
specialise addiction medicine amongst other things. since 88 chernoss keeps saying ADDICTION and prouncing the word really obviously. dont think i can listen to this crap *sigh*
 
What if Michael was in withrdawal from the tons of lorazepam and midazolam he receiving IV from Murray ???? Remember what Dr Kamangar and Shaffer said about that.
I don't see any expert risking his reputation, Waldman's cross could be important.

I think White is going for self inection with a syringe (crazy as it sounds), and cardio vascular depression from a fast injection.

I'm :angry: I have to go to a medical appointment, and miss these important witnesses. I'll be back and take notes maybe after the first morning break (definitely not sure), I 'll be definitely be with you after the lunch break

I'll be counting on your updates !!!!

Be strong, and wait for the cross examination
 
I like how chernoff is asking his witness what he would do and he's going into detail how he would take detailed history etc.....surely that just makes Murray look like a complete prat.
 
the defense has no case. This is just a huge waste a time. Shame on Dr. Conrad Murray.
 
the drs going on about getting a complete history of the paitent getting them so fill surveys out. sounds familiar. everything murray didnt do
 
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