Michael - The Great Album Debate

Hhyeah. But it's still there.

So? It's a line that we know for certain coming from 50 Cent. And even though it's added on, still Threatened is the main focus. No one would hear that one line and rush to buy the "Monster" song. They wouldn't even realize what it is, if they don't already know it. As we also saw not many realized that it was even added ( I realized it and waited for a day to see anyone would post it - no one did. I asked the people that saw the show, they didn't even realized that it was added). So it wasn't the end of the world IMO.
 
Hey everyone, sorry, I can't keep pretending anymore. I have something I need to say...

To the doubters, you are right, Michael Jackson did not sing on the Cascio songs. However, it wasn't Jason Malachi either!!!

No, I spent time with Eddie Cascio and James Porte and recorded these songs for Michael. It was me, listen, this is an audio recording my producer Cony Turtis recorded last night, about 4am after a lot of drinking:

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As you can see, this proves that Michael couldn't have sang these songs. It was me, obviously, and I fooled you all. :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D Hee hee! Hoo-oooooo!!!!!

I'm just kidding but I do think I do a fairly good Malachi impression?

Yeah, that's right, I'm the impersonator of the impersonator who says they're not an impersonator but actually is an impersonator!

This is how I do.

I take requests...

Want me to sing y'all some Mamacita, Let Me Let Go, Monster or Breaking News? Some Keep Your Head Up? I can do the whole Malachi catalog.
Really, I thought I sang the Cascio tracks???

http://www.box.net/shared/jivriia372slxexheh1r this REALLY convinced me that it's Mykyll Jaxxen singing!
 
So? It's a line that we know for certain coming from 50 Cent. And even though it's added on, still Threatened is the main focus. No one would hear that one line and rush to buy the "Monster" song. They wouldn't even realize what it is, if they don't already know it. As we also saw not many realized that it was even added. So it wasn't the end of the world IMO.
I thought I could hear some Monster drums or the instrumental mixed underneath it on youtube. I'm not sure since the quality sucks.

Anyway, doesn't matter if it's 1 second, it's still there.. Why choose it when there are so much more songs.
 
^^Although I don't see how the mix "king... the king... king.... HA! HA!" adds to Threatened, I overcame my initial disappointment and can live with it at this point.
 
Neither "ha! ha!" nor rap from the song Monster have anything to do with MJ's legacy. If they needed rap there are many rap snippets from other songs:

-Jam
-She drives me wild
-Black or white
-This time around
-2Bad
-Unbreakable
-Heatbreaker
-Invincible
 
Neither "ha! ha!" nor rap from the song Monster have anything to do with MJ's legacy. If they needed rap there are many rap snippets from other songs:

-Jam
-She drives me wild
-Black or white
-This time around
-2Bad
-Unbreakable
-Heatbreaker
-Invincible

They are fixated with the idea that Monster is the 2010 version of Thriller.
 
You may be right. Every time I hear Michael do that, though, I was listening to the Jackson 5 Live At The Forum, he does one in Ain't No Sunshine and it automatically makes me think of Monster.
 
^^Although I don't see how the mix "king... the king... king.... HA! HA!" adds to Threatened, I overcame my initial disappointment and can live with it at this point.

Neither "ha! ha!" nor rap from the song Monster have anything to do with MJ's legacy. If they needed rap there are many rap snippets from other songs:

If you listened to it, it starts with Rod Sterling speech from Threatened . You hear "The unknown monster is about to embark" and it seems like they wanted to add "Monster" just because of that word. Most of the songs are mash ups and that "monster" mention is a natural tie (none of the other raps are anywhere near to be relevant for threatened / thriller combo). Instead they removed the song , kept the "king has risen" 50 Cent line and tied it to the raising of the zombies for switch to Thriller.
 
Michael's music, performance, energy, and the overall person he is is so magical and amazing and beautiful, it touches me so deeply that it makes me cry, and I see so many people also being brought to tears over this... There's not one Cascio song that can touch me on this deep level, the level that HIStory touches me, Who Is It, In The Closet, Will You Be There, Smooth Criminal, Best Of Joy, Hold My Hand, Whatever Happens, We've Had Enough, etc etc etc etc...

Even the 10 second clip of I Am The Loser makes my day a billion times better because it's Michael singing. I wish I could feel that magic with the Cascio songs but I don't.
 
That would be amazing, I hope it's not kept from us for years or something, every day I wish to hear it. It sounds so good.
 
Huh... So THAT'S what that was. Eh, nothing that bad, 50's done nothing wrong, and it is to tribute MJ.
 
If you listened to it, it starts with Rod Sterling speech from Threatened . You hear "The unknown monster is about to embark" and it seems like they wanted to add "Monster" just because of that word. Most of the songs are mash ups and that "monster" mention is a natural tie (none of the other raps are anywhere near to be relevant for threatened / thriller combo). Instead they removed the song , kept the "king has risen" 50 Cent line and tied it to the raising of the zombies for switch to Thriller.

Michael combined perfectly well Threatened with Thriller and with Vincent Price's rap in This Is It with 3-D effects. He never mentioned wanting to do anything with any Cascio "pearl".
 
I still would like to see the original Behind the Mask video that the Estate scrapped in favour of the fan contribution version.
 
The following was posted in another thread, and I would like to take a minute to go through it

"You obviously haven't heard the original Cascio demos, nor the extensive research which has been done into those tracks. There is not one single piece of evidence to prove that Michael even knew of these songs, let alone recorded them. No one has been able to provide one single comparison to any song from Michael's 40 years of recording tht sounds like how he does on the Cascio tracks. However, the vocalist on the Cascio tracks has the exact same vibrato, accent and pronounciation as Jason Cupeta. He also makes snorts when he is taking a breath - the same snorts that can be found in Jason's own recordings. And it has nothing to do with the infamous processing excuse. The original unprocessed demos contain those same vocal nuances. So we are supposed to believe that just for these 12 recordings, Michael suddenly developed the exact same vibrato as Jason Cupeta. Michael supposedly wrote these 12 songs but there are no notes, no outtakes, nothing. They were all "destroyed" at Michael's request allegedly. Not to mention that these songs were not registered as invidual titles with BMI (copyright) until over a year after Michael's death. The first time that their existence was even known about was 11 months after Michael's death. The songs are comprised of backing vocals by James Porte, lead vocals by Jason Cupeta and copy pasted adlibs from previous records. For example - the first "whoo" in Breaking News is taken from YRMW. In fact, you can even hear the YRMW music in the background of the BN acapella at that point. Monster uses various samples including entire words pasted from the line "why ain't you feelin me" from Invincible to make "why you hauntin me". This is a clever way of fooling fans in to thinking they are hearing MJ all the way through. When you look at all this evidence, it makes a lot of sense. Eddie Cascio and James Porte saw an opportunity to make a lot of money and get themselves on full MJ songs. Unfortunately, Sony fell for it. The Estate tried hard to get the songs removed. John McClain desperately wanted them off the album but they weren't able to in time."

Alright, let's go through this :

"You obviously haven't heard the original Cascio demos, nor the extensive research which has been done into those tracks". Fans indeed have spent a lot of time making comparisons, all of which, by their very nature, only prove one thing : MJ impersonator Jason Malachi indeed sounds a lot like Michael Jackson. Which is not surprising, considering that's the only reason we even know of him.

"There is not one single piece of evidence to prove that Michael even knew of these songs, let alone recorded them." And how much evidence is there of somebody else singing those songs? I remind you of the point above : comparisons, by their very nature, only prove Malachi sounds like MJ, which we all knew.

"No one has been able to provide one single comparison to any song from Michael's 40 years of recording tht sounds like how he does on the Cascio tracks." The voice on the Cascio tracks sounds like MJ. Maybe to your ears, they don't, but they do to mine. In fact, even conspiracy theorists have to admit the "Cascio singer" sounds a lot like MJ, because if he didn't, there could have been no conspiracy to start with. The hoax was only possible if an impostor could be found that sounded like MJ. Hence, it must be admitted the Cascio singer sounds like MJ.

"However, the vocalist on the Cascio tracks has the exact same vibrato, accent and pronounciation as Jason Cupeta." Allow me to quote from a book here : "The conspiracy community regularly leaps from the most minuscule of discoveries, to the grandest of conclusions; and insists, as the late lawyer Louis Nizer once observed, that the failure to explain everything perfectly negates all that is explained."

"Michael supposedly wrote these 12 songs". No, that was never claimed by anyone. James Porte and Eddie Cascio wrote the songs, originally not even for MJ. Maybe MJ contributed lyrics afterwards, but chances are he just sang those songs, and didn't write them.

"They were all "destroyed" at Michael's request allegedly." That's just a rumor; we don't know that.

"The first time that their existence was even known about was 11 months after Michael's death. " Not true : Roger Friedman heard those songs when he did a piece on the Cascios years before MJ's death. They were songs Eddie Cascio had written and produced : he was an aspiring producer, and had his own studio when MJ visited there.

"For example - the first "whoo" in Breaking News is taken from YRMW. " It's always been known and admitted by all parties that the Cascio tracks use bits and pieces from previous MJ songs, to flesh them out, seeing as how it's not like they can get MJ to come back in the studio and add some ad-libs. In fact, the presence of those samples could be seen as proof they did not use an impostor, because if they did, they wouldn't need to flesh out the songs "artificially".

"When you look at all this evidence, it makes a lot of sense. " Actually, it doesn't. Such a hoax would be almost impossible to pull off, and it would be definitely impossible for everybody involved to keep it a secret.

"Eddie Cascio and James Porte saw an opportunity to make a lot of money and get themselves on full MJ songs. " Except that we have no reason to think that those two are criminal masterminds. Which is what they would have to be to even come up with such a scheme. In fact, MJ loved the Cascios, and they're among the few people in his life never to have done him wrong. So it's pretty rich to just assume those people we don't know would turn out to be the worst fakers since Barnum, and also run the incredible, criminal risks of trying such a hare-brained scheme. Surely there are easier ways to profit from a dead MJ, if that is what they are about?

"The Estate tried hard to get the songs removed. John McClain desperately wanted them off the album but they weren't able to in time". We don't know to what extent that is the case, and what reasons were involved. We do know there were politics involved in whose songs would make the cut. But I know this for a fact : if those songs were fake, there would have been lawsuits left and right.
 
Kreen, do you even know that they used WORDS from previous songs in these ones, literally to bookend phrases? The entire ad-libs of Monster in its final chorus are basically ad-libs and words from other songs. You don't think that the presence of these words would've thrown off the analysis just slightly?
 
Kreen, do you even know that they used WORDS from previous songs in these ones, literally to bookend phrases? The entire ad-libs of Monster in its final chorus are basically ad-libs and words from other songs. You don't think that the presence of these words would've thrown off the analysis just slightly?

You are correct,
BUT
What if MJ did record these songs, or parts of them, and did not finish the adlibs? I am a doubter, but what if Michael actually sang these, just Eddie and friends werent "satisfied" with his performance, and hired Jason or someone else to finish the songs?

No matter how much proof there is, no matter how many of the songs they release, no matter how long everybody argues,
I will not beleive unless I hear it from Michael himself. And that won't happen.
 
You are correct,
BUT
What if MJ did record these songs, or parts of them, and did not finish the adlibs? I am a doubter, but what if Michael actually sang these, just Eddie and friends werent "satisfied" with his performance, and hired Jason or someone else to finish the songs?

No matter how much proof there is, no matter how many of the songs they release, no matter how long everybody argues,
I will not beleive unless I hear it from Michael himself. And that won't happen.

If Michael did record the parts heard in the songs (even though they sound EXACTLY like in Invincible) it is still morally reprehensible to use an impersonator to re-record 95% of the lines.
 
It was me who made the post that Kreen is referring to. Let me go through this point by point.

"Fans indeed have spent a lot of time making comparisons, all of which, by their very nature, only prove one thing : MJ impersonator Jason Malachi indeed sounds a lot like Michael Jackson. Which is not surprising, considering that's the only reason we even know of him."

I was talking specifically about the member who made the original comment about the Cascio tracks, who, last I heard, had not heard the comparisons. What the comparisons show, and I'm talking about the extensive comparisons by TPI here, are a huge number of identical aspects to both Jason and the Cascio vocalist, but none to the vocalist and MJ.

"And how much evidence is there of somebody else singing those songs? I remind you of the point above : comparisons, by their very nature, only prove Malachi sounds like MJ, which we all knew."

No, the comparisons, at the very least, show that Cupeta is nowhere near the vocalist that MJ was. He is inferior, just like the Cascio vocalist.

"The voice on the Cascio tracks sounds like MJ. Maybe to your ears, they don't, but they do to mine. In fact, even conspiracy theorists have to admit the "Cascio singer" sounds a lot like MJ, because if he didn't, there could have been no conspiracy to start with. The hoax was only possible if an impostor could be found that sounded like MJ. Hence, it must be admitted the Cascio singer sounds like MJ."

Of course the Cascio vocalist sounds somewhat like MJ. But where in Mj's career does he have that pronounciation, vibrato etc? He doesn't.

"Allow me to quote from a book here : "The conspiracy community regularly leaps from the most minuscule of discoveries, to the grandest of conclusions; and insists, as the late lawyer Louis Nizer once observed, that the failure to explain everything perfectly negates all that is explained.""

Totally irrelevant. Those vocal nuances are in the songs. That is an undeniable fact, regardless of what one believes about the identity of the singer. Clutching at straws?

"No, that was never claimed by anyone. James Porte and Eddie Cascio wrote the songs, originally not even for MJ. Maybe MJ contributed lyrics afterwards, but chances are he just sang those songs, and didn't write them."

It is claimed by Eddie in the making of the album video, and he is credited as co-writer on all 12 songs as per the copyright registrations and album credits.

"That's just a rumor; we don't know that."

If such things existed, they would have more likely than not been shown by now to stop the allegations regarding the songs. As they havnen't, I'm inclined to believe Taryll's comments on this that that is indeed what he was told.

"Not true : Roger Friedman heard those songs when he did a piece on the Cascios years before MJ's death. They were songs Eddie Cascio had written and produced : he was an aspiring producer, and had his own studio when MJ visited there."

So now we are using Friedman to support arguments? Oh dear. He only claimed that he heard them, and never mentioned it in his original 2007 article. It was 2010 when he first claimed to have heard them. He is the same "journalist" who revealed the existence of the songs and went to great lengths to prove their authenticity, which should speak for itself. No other journalist has ever claimed to have heard them. It should also be noted that he only claimed to have heard the Porte versions. He makes no claim of having heard the MJ versions prior to 2010.

"It's always been known and admitted by all parties that the Cascio tracks use bits and pieces from previous MJ songs, to flesh them out, seeing as how it's not like they can get MJ to come back in the studio and add some ad-libs. In fact, the presence of those samples could be seen as proof they did not use an impostor, because if they did, they wouldn't need to flesh out the songs "artificially"."

Michael managed to record multiple takes for 12 complete songs but failed to do any adlibs on any of them? "Sigh" The adlibs are there to fool you. If people hear genuine adlibs, it leads them to believe they are hearing MJ on the whole song.

"Actually, it doesn't. Such a hoax would be almost impossible to pull off, and it would be definitely impossible for everybody involved to keep it a secret. "

Eddie and Frank Cascio, their close family, James Porte and Cupeta. That's it. Why wouldn't they keep quiet when there is money involved? Have the Arvizos or Chandlers ever admitted their deception?

"Except that we have no reason to think that those two are criminal masterminds. Which is what they would have to be to even come up with such a scheme. In fact, MJ loved the Cascios, and they're among the few people in his life never to have done him wrong. So it's pretty rich to just assume those people we don't know would turn out to be the worst fakers since Barnum, and also run the incredible, criminal risks of trying such a hare-brained scheme. Surely there are easier ways to profit from a dead MJ, if that is what they are about?"

They don't need to be criminal masterminds. Eddie had the perfect circumstances to do what he did. Plenty of people have sold MJ out after his death? To trust the Cascio's just because of their friendship with MJ is naiive.

"We don't know to what extent that is the case, and what reasons were involved. We do know there were politics involved in whose songs would make the cut. But I know this for a fact : if those songs were fake, there would have been lawsuits left and right."

We know based on the informtion from Thad Nauden, the individuals at the listening party including Taryll and the extensive internal debate that was going on behind the scenes. Who do you expect to file a lawsuit? You simply don't know that for a fact.
 
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No matter any theory any of you put forward, there is one undeniable fact -- those songs may sound like MJ, but they don't sound MJ. Nobody has explained why so far. As far as I am concerned, without solid proof and explanation, those songs are fake.

Why wasn't there any controversy over DYKWYCA, BG, STTR,...?
 
If Michael did record the parts heard in the songs (even though they sound EXACTLY like in Invincible) it is still morally reprehensible to use an impersonator to re-record 95% of the lines.

True. But it also depends on what Mic and software they used. They could have accidently mixed the vocals wrong or converted them wrong. But if I was Jason Malachi and I really DIDNT sing the songs, and ecereybody though I did, i would be very upset.

It is odd that some of the songs sound like others...

All Right - Stranger in Moscow
All I need - you are not alone
Black widow - DS
Monster - Threatened
Water - Cry me a river by justin t
Ready to win - on the line
Fall in love - the backup vocals sound a little like fall again
Breaking news - tabloid jubkie
Burn tonight - mamacita
 
True. But it also depends on what Mic and software they used. They could have accidently mixed the vocals wrong or converted them wrong. But if I was Jason Malachi and I really DIDNT sing the songs, and ecereybody though I did, i would be very upset.

It is odd that some of the songs sound like others...

All Right - Stranger in Moscow = exactly
All I need - you are not alone = exactly
Black widow - DS + Superfly Sister
Monster - Threatened + 2Bad + Let me let go
Water - Cry me a river by justin t + Heaven can wait
Ready to win - on the line = exactly
Fall in love - the backup vocals sound a little like fall again = exactly
Breaking news - tabloid jubkie + You rock my world
Burn tonight - mamacita

Too many coincidences
 
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