Estate, Cascio and Porte Sued Over Three Songs on the "Michael" Album - Vera Senova Class Action

[SoCav]

I do not interpret it as saying that Michel did not sing on those tracks.
It´s more like he probably didn´t sing but the expert wasn´t sure.

Scientists don't deal with absolute certainties. Statistical tests are based on likelihoods. I'd doubt the credibility of this guy if he'd say "this is 100% not MJ." That's not a scientific conclusion. Something like "the hypothesis that these vocals were sung by Michael Jackson is rejected at the a = 0.05 level" is. We'll have to wait for the full report to know what was done and what the exact conclusion was, but I expect the "very likely" to mean that whatever method he employed showed that it is not Michael.

 

[HIStory]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I think in all honesty they both took possibly the only way they could to make Money from Michael also. Frank aswell with his book..............god just mentioning that ****s me off thinking of all the other people who cashed in and screwed MJ over man

Scientists don't deal with absolute certainties. Statistical tests are based on likelihoods. I'd doubt the credibility of this guy if he'd say "this is 100% not MJ." That's not a scientific conclusion. Something like "the hypothesis that these vocals were sung by Michael Jackson is rejected at the a = 0.05 level" is. We'll have to wait for the full report to know what was done and what the exact conclusion was, but I expect the "very likely" to mean that whatever method he employed showed that it is not Michael.

Right. Just like at the Murray trial Christopher Rogers and the other experts did not say it's 100% sure MJ did not self-administer. But they said it's very unlikely he did and then they explained in detail why.

 

[LastTear]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I see talk on here of a possible/likely settlement and having read/researched further I ask how would people feel if this was settled in the form of negotiation which results in the tracks being removed from Michaels catalogue? Would that put this to rest?

 

[Annita]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Right. Just like at the Murray trial Christopher Rogers and the other experts did not say it's 100% sure MJ did not self-administer. But they said it's very unlikely he did and then they explained in detail why.

Yes but it is important to say even when MJ had admistered it himself Murray would be guilty. Shafer and Walagran made this clear for the jury.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Scientists don't deal with absolute certainties. Statistical tests are based on likelihoods. I'd doubt the credibility of this guy if he'd say "this is 100% not MJ." That's not a scientific conclusion. Something like "the hypothesis that these vocals were sung by Michael Jackson is rejected at the a = 0.05 level" is. We'll have to wait for the full report to know what was done and what the exact conclusion was, but I expect the "very likely" to mean that whatever method he employed showed that it is not Michael.

Exactly what I was just thinking about how Science works. It would go the other way also, with the Weitzman statement, if Musicologists for Sony and The Estate did test the vocals they could also not give a 100% confirmation.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

im not turning anyone into a villian. i dont know her name so its either plaintiff or accuser. as i said i never followed this whole fake song thing from the get go ad i really dont care one way or the other. but as an outsider looking in i find it strange she goes to the prem of bad 25 and poses with branca. certainly not something id do in attending an event and posing with someone i thought had committed fraud against mj and his fans.its kinda hypocritical to say the least

Are we really going to turn the so called "accuser" into a villain now? Gimme a break. They are doing nothing different than the vast majority of this board has done since the premier of Breaking News. Questioning the authenticity of the vocals. Only difference is they are doing something about it legally. And what is so wrong with that?

 

[Annita]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

but as an outsider looking in i find it strange she goes to the prem of bad 25 and poses with branca. certainly not something id do in attending an event and posing with someone i thought had committed fraud against mj and his fans.

I think it it possible to have a different opinions towards the Bad 25-project or other projects of the the Estate and the 3 Cascios-Songs. In fact I think there are many fans who hate the Cascio-Songs but does support other projects of the Estate. It is not all black or white.
Also it is important to say the fraud-claim is only against Cascio/Porte.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Oh idk, Michael hugged a lot of people who then went on to sue him....... They make a cute couple though.

i wouldnt say thats the same. it would be the same if mj was posing with someone and made an effort to go to an event they were hosting when at the same time hes accusing them of frauding during that time and later sues them for it. of course comparing mj and his actions to a regular girl like this.well u cant compair. but its like me attending a jackson family event and get a pic with randy then coming on here and saying what i normally say about them! lol it wouldnt look good

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I think it it possible to have a different opinoin towards the Bad 25-project or other projects of the the Estate and the 3 Cascios-Songs. In fact I think there are many fans who hate the Cascio-Songs but does support other projects of the Estate. It is not all black or white.
Also it is important to say the fraud-claim is only against Cascio/Porte.

Yup, even one of my friends who is against the casiocs 1000% went to the event and spoke with Branca. It was a chance meeting also.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

brancas named as a defendent though. i could understand it if they are saying the estate are innocent parties that were duped by cascio. but from whats been said shes not saying that.

I think it it possible to have a different opinoin towards the Bad 25-project or other projects of the the Estate and the 3 Cascios-Songs. In fact I think there are many fans who hate the Cascio-Songs but does support other projects of the Estate. It is not all black or white.
Also it is important to say the fraud-claim is only against Cascio/Porte.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

yeah i agree im sure theres many who are against the cascios but support the estate as a whole because they blame the cascios for those tracks and not the estate.if they do blame the estate and say they were in on it and support them being sued but have no probs posing with branca etc cause they are either starstruck or whatever to me thats hypocritical but each to their own.but if shes sueing the estate interms of they were deliberatly involved then to me its strange she wants to attend their events and pose with them when its after the time the info about the fake songs came out. its not as if it was before.

Yup, even one of my friends who is against the casiocs 1000% went to the event and spoke with Branca. It was a chance meeting also.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

yeah i agree im sure theres many who are against the cascios but support the estate as a whole. many posters on here seem like that.but if shes sueing the estate interms of they were deliberatly involved then to me its strange she wants to attend their events and pose with them when its after the time the info about the fake songs came out. its not as if it was before.

Not everyone one followed the info about the fake songs, some people also did but were not convinced until certain things were spoke about/new evidence or speculation arose. She is suing Branca for the release, it doesn't matter whether or not he was involved or had prior knowledge of the tracks, I gather its simply because it was released and "represented" Michael. Eddie and Porte are being sued for the fraud portion and not Branca

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

So whens she saying she became aware of the vocals issue? when she bought the album? because unless as a fan u were living under a rock u had to be aware when it all first started up.and she attended the bad25 prem so she certainly was involved in the fan community enough to be at that event.so i cant for one min believe she wasnt aware of the vocal issue at the time of release.and yes i can totally agree that some at the begining may have been unsure until further evidence was shown to them.so that could be a reason for her attending and posing but to joe bloggs it doesnt look good her posing with someone shes now saying was involved in fraud

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

She is suing Branca for the release, it doesn't matter whether or not he was involved or had prior knowledge of the tracks, I gather its simply because it was released and "represented" Michael.
---------------
is she saying they were innocent bystanders or that they were in on it and lied in claiming they had experts check it

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

So whens she saying she became aware of the vocals issue? when she bought the album? because unless as a fan u were living under a rock u had to be aware when it all first started up.and she attended the bad25 prem so she certainly was involved in the fan community enough to be at that event.so i cant for one min believe she wasnt aware of the vocal issue at the time of release.and yes i can totally agree that some at the begining may have been unsure until further evidence was shown to them.so that could be a reason for her attending and posing but to joe bloggs it doesnt look good her posing with someone shes now saying was involved in fraud

The court documents are available and have been posted here, on twitter, facebook and numerous other sites. just read them, its easier than me explaining back and fourth, http://www.scribd.com/doc/229471634/MJ-Fan-vs-Sony-MJ-Estate-Cascio-Porte

Sidenote, not aimed at anyone but maybe everyone, theres a link to the docs is in first post, not trying to sound sh**ty or anything but there are answers to alot of questions which keep cropping up here, please read those docs before passing judgement on the fan involved.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Thanks. im only getting the first page of filing on that link where it says ray e gallo. The rest wont load. whether its becauae in on my phone,maybe?

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

not sh***** at all lol. knowledge is power as they say. you have been around along time birchey i have alot of respect for you.let me see if it will work on my chromebook and ill get back to you.although ill be honest with u i really dont know if i care enough to bother. ive had enough reading of court docs to last me a life time.

The court documents are available and have been posted here, on twitter, facebook and numerous other sites. just read them, its easier than me explaining back and fourth, http://www.scribd.com/doc/229471634/MJ-Fan-vs-Sony-MJ-Estate-Cascio-Porte

Sidenote, not aimed at anyone but maybe everyone, theres a link to the docs is in first post, not trying to sound sh**ty or anything but there are answers to alot of questions which keep cropping up here, please read those docs before passing judgement on the fan involved.

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Thanks. im only getting the first page of filing on that link where it says ray e gallo. The rest wont load. whether its becauae in on my phone,maybe?

It might be cuz its on ur phone, just checked they working my end

 

[Birchey]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

not sh***** at all lol. knowledge is power as they say. you have been around along time birchey i have alot of respect for you.let me see if it will work on my chromebook and ill get back to you.although ill be honest with u i really dont know if i care enough to bother. ive had enough reading of court docs to last me a life time.

Ha ha tell me about court docs, I doubt the vaticans archive would have enough room to store the docs from my case I had with Sony................as it stands my house is extremely flammable xD

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

U could have an old fashioned tabloid burning but with court docs lol

 

[Petrarose]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

So whens she saying she became aware of the vocals issue? when she bought the album? because unless as a fan u were living under a rock u had to be aware when it all first started up.and she attended the bad25 prem so she certainly was involved in the fan community enough to be at that event.so i cant for one min believe she wasnt aware of the vocal issue at the time of release.and yes i can totally agree that some at the begining may have been unsure until further evidence was shown to them.so that could be a reason for her attending and posing but to joe bloggs it doesnt look good her posing with someone shes now saying was involved in fraud

These^^ are some of the odd things that make me think the fan did not initiate the case. I mean if something is so against what you see as right/legit that it moves you to sue, then you had to have some very strong emotions attached to the issue and people involved. However, there you are after the cd experience, deliberately getting a "I am with Branca" photo opportunity. I would like to know if the expert opinion was already known when she got her photo taken.

The next odd thing is, you heard about the controversy and then bought a cd. Did you buy it to test it only, or for your own pleasure? If you bought it for pleasure you were already warned by the controversy that this may be bogus material. If you bought it for testing, then you already knew there might be something wrong with it. Even odder, a fan who goes to a Bad 25 event and poses with Branca, will not buy a Michael cd long, long, long, after it comes out. A fan who seeks out these types of activities would rush to buy a cd the first week, first day, first month of issue. Why did she wait so long? The only answer is that she knew it was bogus, so stayed away from it. Therefore, she can't come now and claim she bought something that she thought was Michael singing and found out it was not.

This filing reminds me of how during slavery when the masters wanted to do something negative against a person of African decent, they would get one of the slaves, that is, someone from the same group to do the snitching, deliver the blow, cause the tragedy. In that way their hands were seen as clean and they could say look it was one of your own kind that did it. People are tired hearing estate attacks coming from one camp, so to avoid that it is easy to get a fan to do it because the fan is seen as being on the same side as the estate, since the estate represents Michael.

So to me this fan did not initiate this filing. I think she was approached by others, maybe some fans or some other entity. I admire her courage though, and I hope she is aware of the drilling that will take place if this goes to trial.

 

[#MJforever57]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

I see talk on here of a possible/likely settlement and having read/researched further I ask how would people feel if this was settled in the form of negotiation which results in the tracks being removed from Michaels catalogue? Would that put this to rest?

If something like this happen and the Casico 3 tracks are remove from Michael i would be very happy and like it was mention in this thread to release Michael again and just maybe the sales will be better. Those tracks cause Michael to flop there was to many question about the tracks no anwers to them and no proof that this is Michael singing on these tracks only what Cascio and the Estate have told us. Now it is time to bring forth the truth if their are so sure this is MJ like i said show us the proof their got to have it or do their have it that is the more important question.



As for your others question that remain to be seen.

 

[SoCav]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Where are all these theories about this fan being representative of an 'entity' or hidden group of fans coming from?

 

[WildStyle]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

This is ridiculous. I am 1000% against the Cascio tracks and I am very disappointed in how the situation was handled by the estate and especially by Branca. But I don't hate the man. I don't think he's bad or evil. And I don't think he set out to hurt anyone. I believe he never set out to do the wrong thing by anyone. I believe he's probably a nice guy. I believe he had love for Michael. I believe that he's a business man that got too involved in artistic decisions he really has no place being involved in. I believe he was duped. If I met Branca I would shake his hand and be cordial with him. I have nothing against him personally. I just feel he should stay in his lane. That lane is business. Not music. I'm sure this fan has nothing personal against Branca either. She went to a Bad 25 event because she's a Michael Jackson fan. She may have been one of the ones that spoke to Branca about the Cascio tracks when he said they would never release anymore. Who knows. But this isn't about "hating" the estate or Branca. I don't know why people don't get that.

As for Eddie Cascio. That's a different story.

 

[ivy]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Please do not fall victim to what some people are saying on twitter about the fan who brought this lawsuit.

Surprisingly or perhaps not surprisingly all the conspiracy theories about her is coming from extreme anti-cascio and anti-estate people. as a person who have dealt with that group and have been attacked and harassed by them, I can tell you with 100% certainty that they take a piece of information (such as a picture with Branca) and then create a whole bunch of fantasies and/or conspiracies and believe it as fact and spread them. Majority of such claims aren't true, they are simply lies.

As for the fan involved, she's a member here and some of us know her and communicated with her over the years. People change their minds - there have been many people who initially believed the songs to be legit / not legit and then change their minds. MJJC also doesn't have a lot of extreme fans. so there are people here who are totally against Cascio songs but also support other projects by Estate. So as others mentioned it's not black or white. It's possible for this fan to support Bad25 and not Cascio songs, it's possible for her to believe the songs are legit initially and later on change her mind.

If I'm being brutally honest here, one of the main things we (or at least I) mentioned on "Great album debate" was how people were complaining about the songs over and over and over and was doing nothing about it. We kept mentioning "file a lawsuit, do something" a million times on that thread. Now we have a person who is actually doing something, who actually filed a lawsuit. Just for that alone she deserves a kudos. For example my opinion about these songs aren't a secret but I still respect this fan for doing something and I welcome anything that can bring a closure to this topic.

Of course there would be people who don't agree with this lawsuit - especially if you think the songs are legit and some people might have concerns/questions about it - such as timing and so on. But again please do not fall victim to what a small group circulating on twitter and turn this into personal attack / vilification against the fan who filed the lawsuit.

 

[Victory22]

Where are all these theories about this fan being representative of an 'entity' or hidden group of fans coming from?

They are coming from the incredibly, shamefully, aggressive history of fans and Jackson family members trying to overturn Michael’s will, overthrow his estate executors and ruin projects connected with his legitimate estate business. One can’t help feeling at least a little suspicious after the past 5 years of shenanigans staged by the granny nappers and friends.

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

This is ridiculous. I am 1000% against the Cascio tracks and I am very disappointed in how the situation was handled by the estate and especially by Branca. But I don't hate the man. I don't think he's bad or evil. And I don't think he set out to hurt anyone. I believe he never set out to do the wrong thing by anyone. I believe he's probably a nice guy. I believe he had love for Michael. I believe that he's a business man that got too involved in artistic decisions he really has no place being involved in. I believe he was duped. If I met Branca I would shake his hand and be cordial with him. I have nothing against him personally. I just feel he should stay in his lane. That lane is business. Not music. I'm sure this fan has nothing personal against Branca either. She went to a Bad 25 event because she's a Michael Jackson fan. She may have been one of the ones that spoke to Branca about the Cascio tracks when he said they would never release anymore. Who knows. But this isn't about "hating" the estate or Branca. I don't know why people don't get that.

As for Eddie Cascio. That's a different story.

Bravo! It's all about Eddie Cascio, Frank Cascio, Stuart Brawley, James Porte & Roger Freidman. They knew everything. Even Frank DiLeo may have been fooled by Cascios and Porte because he knew Michael stayed there in 2007, he thought that Cascios were MJ's friends & he was Porte's manager so he thought that his client wouldn't lie to him.

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Please do not fall victim to what some people are saying on twitter about the fan who brought this lawsuit.

Surprisingly or perhaps not surprisingly all the conspiracy theories about her is coming from extreme anti-cascio and anti-estate people. as a person who have dealt with that group and have been attacked and harassed by them, I can tell you with 100% certainty that they take a piece of information (such as a picture with Branca) and then create a whole bunch of fantasies and/or conspiracies and believe it as fact and spread them. Majority of such claims aren't true, they are simply lies.

As for the fan involved, she's a member here and some of us know her and communicated with her over the years. People change their minds - there have been many people who initially believed the songs to be legit / not legit and then change their minds. MJJC also doesn't have a lot of extreme fans. so there are people here who are totally against Cascio songs but also support other projects by Estate. So as others mentioned it's not black or white. It's possible for this fan to support Bad25 and not Cascio songs, it's possible for her to believe the songs are legit initially and later on change her mind.

If I'm being brutally honest here, one of the main things we (or at least I) mentioned on "Great album debate" was how people were complaining about the songs over and over and over and was doing nothing about it. We kept mentioning "file a lawsuit, do something" a million times on that thread. Now we have a person who is actually doing something, who actually filed a lawsuit. Just for that alone she deserves a kudos. For example my opinion about these songs aren't a secret but I still respect this fan for doing something and I welcome anything that can bring a closure to this topic.

Of course there would be people who don't agree with this lawsuit - especially if you think the songs are legit and some people might have concerns/questions about it - such as timing and so on. But again please do not fall victim to what a small group circulating on twitter and turn this into personal attack / vilification against the fan who filed the lawsuit.

Can you tell MJJC nickname of that fan who is suing if it's not a secret? I wanna congratulate her and thank her. Also what picture are you talking about? Can you post it here? Thanks.

 

[Victor]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Who's James Porte? :O

 

[ivy]

Re: Estate, Cascio & Porte sued - Forensic Analysis says MJ is NOT singing the 3 songs on "MICHAEL"

Can you tell MJJC nickname of that fan who is suing if it's not a secret? I wanna congratulate her and thank her. Also what picture are you talking about? Can you post it here? Thanks.

No I won't As I told and promised her I'll refer to her as a "MJ Fan". If she wants to disclose that she's the one behind the lawsuit, she'll do it herself.