Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary - Estate Announcement Page 66

[SoCav]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

It seems that Spike Lee is doing only documentaries for underrated albums. BAD was a little underrated by critics, so it got it's own documentary to show the album's greatness. OTW is very underrated so it's getting it's own documentary too. Hopefully he'll do an documentary about the invincible album aswell...

It's perhaps not as well known among the general public as Thriller, Bad, Dangerous and HIStory, but I don't think OTW is underrated by critics. A failry common assessment among critics is that OTW and Thriller represent MJ at his best.

 

[barbee0715]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

It seems that Spike Lee is doing only documentaries for underrated albums. BAD was a little underrated by critics, so it got it's own documentary to show the album's greatness. OTW is very underrated so it's getting it's own documentary too. Hopefully he'll do an documentary about the invincible album aswell...

BAD was underrated but that was because the backlash had started in 85. The hydrobaric chamber, elephant man, Bubbles, looking like Diana among other things. That influenced the reviews.

But OTW was loved by critics.

I hope you're right in theory because I'd like to see one on the HISTory album. I don't love every song on it but I love most of it. It's his autobiographical album which would make an ideal doc and it got NO love here in the US. That's underrated IMO.

 

[Hess]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

It seems that Spike Lee is doing only documentaries for underrated albums. BAD was a little underrated by critics, so it got it's own documentary to show the album's greatness. OTW is very underrated so it's getting it's own documentary too. Hopefully he'll do an documentary about the invincible album aswell...

I think OTW is actually one of the albums critics likes the most.

It's perhaps not as well known among the general public as Thriller, Bad, Dangerous and HIStory, but I don't think OTW is underrated by critics. A failry common assessment among critics is that OTW and Thriller represent MJ at his best.

Agreed

BAD was underrated but that was because the backlash had started in 85. The hydrobaric chamber, elephant man, Bubbles, looking like Diana among other things. That influenced the reviews.

But OTW was loved by critics.

I hope you're right in theory because I'd like to see one on the HISTory album. I don't love every song on it but I love most of it. It's his autobiographical album which would make an ideal doc and it got NO love here in the US. That's underrated IMO.

I really hope to see a Spike Lee doc about each of MJ's albums. OTW now, next Dangerous - then HIStory (and in this doc BOTDF could be included since it does not make sense to make a doc about BOTDF only IMO) and especially a doc about Invincible would be great! - Lots of studio footage is available - many interesting things happend etc.

Bottom line - I just hope for many great documentaries about MJ !! :lol:

 

[analogue]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

It seems that Spike Lee is doing only documentaries for underrated albums. BAD was a little underrated by critics, so it got it's own documentary to show the album's greatness. OTW is very underrated so it's getting it's own documentary too. Hopefully he'll do an documentary about the invincible album aswell...

Off The Wall is not underrated by critics. Off The Wall is MJ's most praised album after Thriller by critics

 

[HIStory]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

OTW is not underrated by critics, it's considered MJ's best album besides Thriller by them. But IMO in the fanbase it tends to be somewhat underrated. As for the general public, well, the general public is always all about Thriller. It's always Thriller (and the two greatest hits albums Number Ones and Essential) that you will still find on Billboard 200 year after year - I'm happy about that, but no other studio album of MJ charts regularly, it's always Thriller. So I think any album besides Thriller can use a bit of extra attention and promotion - including Off The Wall. And I think some promotion for OTW would be especially due now that there are so many artists in current music who are massively influenced by OTW. That needs to be shown to their fans and this generation.

 

[JEMFTV]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Off The Wall is not underrated by critics. Off The Wall is MJ's most praised album after Thriller by critics

Oh,....didn't knew that :lol:

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

OTW is very underrated

That is not true. The album is not underrated at all, it is actually overrated in comparison to Bad, Dangerous, HIStory and Invincible.

 

[barbee0715]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

That is not true. The album is not underrated at all, it is actually overrated in comparison to Bad, Dangerous, HIStory and Invincible.

Ah, you can't overrate Off the Wall high enough in my opinion. To me it is the greatest album ever made.

 

[TheManinTheMirror]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Ah, you can't overrate Off the Wall high enough in my opinion. To me it is the greatest album ever made.

I actually agree with this.

 

[Zakk]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Ah, you can't overrate Off the Wall high enough in my opinion. To me it is the greatest album ever made.

We can all differ on opinions, personally i think the BAD album is Michael's most exquisite work of art he's ever done :heart:

 

[MJBT]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Off The Wall is one of very albums I can stick on and just listen to from beginning to end, please let there be an announcement to confirm this.

 

[Smooth72]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

I don't think any of the albums are underrated. I do think Spike Lee is overrated IMO. His only work I could stand to watch was his Mj work. Spikes work appeals to only certain people and races. I do however respect him. I appreciate how he cares for MJ.

 

[h0opman31]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

I don't think any of the albums are underrated. I do think Spike Lee is overrated IMO. His only work I could stand to watch was his Mj work. Spikes work appeals to only certain people and races. I do however respect him. I appreciate how he cares for MJ.

That's very stereotypical of you and you are obviously generalizing. Spike Lee's work doesn't just appeal to the African American community. Anyone who can relate to poverty, racial discrimination, racial stereotyping (you'd fit that label), violence, hatred, peace and war, inequality etc., will appreciate his work. I appreciate his work and I live in New York City and I'm not black.

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Ah, you can't overrate Off the Wall high enough in my opinion. To me it is the greatest album ever made.

The album is great, but I'd call it slightly overrated, especially in comparison to the quality of his other albums. All albums after Thriller are in my opinion better than OTW and all those albums are hugely underrated in comparison to OTW and Thriller.

 

[Petrarose]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

The album is great, but I'd call it slightly overrated, especially in comparison to the quality of his other albums. All albums after Thriller are in my opinion better than OTW and all those albums are hugely underrated in comparison to OTW and Thriller.

Onir I noticed that it was mainly after Michael died or when critics try to belittle Michael's success with Thriller that they stress the greatness of OTW. I can't remember seeing all this praise for OTW prior to Thriller or even during Dangerous. Did you see all this praise for that album pre 09?

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Onir I noticed that it was mainly after Michael died or when critics try to belittle Michael's success with Thriller that they stress the greatness of OTW. I can't remember seeing all this praise for OTW prior to Thriller or even during Dangerous. Did you see all this praise for that album pre 09?

Yes I did. With the media and with the gullible general public. For them it was always:

1. Thriller & Off The Wall
2. Bad
3. Dangerous, HIStory & Invincible

 

[Smooth72]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

That's very stereotypical of you and you are obviously generalizing. Spike Lee's work doesn't just appeal to the African American community. Anyone who can relate to poverty, racial discrimination, racial stereotyping (you'd fit that label), violence, hatred, peace and war, inequality etc., will appreciate his work. I appreciate his work and I live in New York City and I'm not black.

I'm not stereotyping anything. I just don't care for his work and he does make movies and such that pertain to a large majority to the black community. Just like people were saying on here that Taylor Swift was picked by the media because shes the prototype American white girl. I don't care for her or her work either. I am a white man and don't stereotype and I'm not a racist. My favorite artists are Michael Jackson and 2pac. Don't read to much in to my comments. I just don't care for Spike lees work. If I offended anyone I apologize.

 

[h0opman31]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

I'm not stereotyping anything. I just don't care for his work and he does make movies and such that pertain to a large majority to the black community. Just like people were saying on here that Taylor Swift was picked by the media because shes the prototype American white girl. I don't care for her or her work either. I am a white man and don't stereotype and I'm not a racist. My favorite artists are Michael Jackson and 2pac. Don't read to much in to my comments. I just don't care for Spike lees work. If I offended anyone I apologize.

Fair enough, thanks for responding back appropriately unlike certain fans who get all offensive and then all hell breaks out.

 

[Tygger]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

I will bow out of the discussion regarding OTW as being underrated or overrated in other's views. I would like to address this however:

I'm not stereotyping anything. I just don't care for his work and he does make movies and such that pertain to a large majority to the black community.

I appreciate you apology however, you are indeed stereotyping.

One of the issues Michael had with OTW was despite its popularity and overall success across R/B and Pop charts, he was regulated to R/B award categories. Despite being part of the black community, he did not create OTW or any of his art specifically for the black community. He made art that aligned with his culture and experiences for the masses to enjoy. That is what Lee has done.

I understand and appreciate if you do not feel a film like "Do The Right Thing" or "X" was made with yourself in mind despite being very well made films. I personally believe anyone, regardless of race/culture, would hopefully appreciate the amazing work a talented director can produce as Lee has done. If Lee did not produce such documentaries as "4 Little Girls" and "When the Levees Broke: A Requiem in Four Acts," I doubt he would have been approached for Michael's "Bad25." He simply was the best man for the job; just like Landis and Scorsese were for Michael's short films.

 

[Smooth72]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Race has nothing to do with my opinion of Spike Lee. I just don't care for his work period. You are trying to make more of my comment then what is there. I don't have to appreciate any of his work if I choose not too. There are plenty of people in the world who don't like Mj or his work either. Everyone has a opinion on what they like. I do however appreciate Spike support of Mj. Spike isn't the only good producer out there that could produce a good Mj film or documentary. This is my last post on this discussion. I will take the high road and not fight about this. Have a good day!!

 

[Tygger]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Race has nothing to do with my opinion of Spike Lee.

Smooth72, you clearly stated that Lee "make movies and such that pertain to a large majority to the black community" and I clearly responded he did not; same way Michael did not with his art.

No argument necessary.

 

[MJJuniorSinceMW]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

The album is great, but I'd call it slightly overrated, especially in comparison to the quality of his other albums. All albums after Thriller are in my opinion better than OTW and all those albums are hugely underrated in comparison to OTW and Thriller.

That's about my opinion which i tried to get across in this thread way earlier.

I have an even better comparison now:
If we only think in MJ-universe, where only his work exists & where only his work is measured against each other i'd say that OTW is slightly overrated (especially in comparison to Bad, Dangerous & HIStory).

If we look at the whole music biz and the work of all other artists, then i think that EVERYTHING MJ did is underrated. But critics & nostalgic music fans tend to overrate Thriller & OTW to MJ's later work.

They degrade his later & better work because of what they themselves did think & publicize about MJ & his persona in his later years. In their eyes MJ wasn't true to himself anymore after Thriller.
He didn't want to be black anymore, "all those" plastic surgeries, the public picture he created for himself, the hoopla, the mystery... To them MJ wasn't the simple handsome BLACK boy, who could sing & dance, anymore. He became to big with Thriller & they had to take him down after that... That is what i think!
Thriller was to good & successful to tear it down after the media & public itself made it as bis as it is now. And OTW is his "BLACKEST" album & it's the album where he best fit's the picture of a young, handsome, black man who dances well & sings "appropriate" black songs...

Because of that I especially DO NOT understand if todays black artists say, that OTW is MJ's best album because he was pure & kept it to his roots at the time.

Dangerous & HIStory & BOTDF to me are very much more to MJ's roots than any of his other albums!

 

[analogue]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Yes I did. With the media and with the gullible general public. For them it was always:

1. Thriller & Off The Wall
2. Bad
3. Dangerous, HIStory & Invincible

For the media it's always

1. Thriller
2. Off The Wall

And that's it

 

[analogue]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

I also think that the media likes Off The Wall, because back then Michael was ''in his place'' as a black artist

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

For the media it's always

1. Thriller
2. Off The Wall

And that's it

Some of the media actually prefer OTW, that's why I said 1. Thriller & Off The Wall. And I put Bad at 2. because small part of the media likes Bad also because it was still co-produced by Quincy Jones and has Man In The Mirror on it. Then at 3. are all other albums.

 

[MJMarty]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

I'd take Bad over Thriller and OTW combined but that's just me. If we're going by underrated, nothing is more underrated than HIStory in his catalog to me. The writing on that record is his absolute best, bar none.

Anyway, so it's all but certain we're getting nothing this year then by the looks of it. Hopefully we get a re-release next year, or better yet shelve it to do HIStory 20 next year

 

[OnirMJ]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

In my opinion MJ's most underrated album is of course Invincible. Majority of people doesn't even know any song from it except You Rock My World. Then HIStory, Dangerous, Bad.

 

[barbee0715]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

They degrade his later & better work because of what they themselves did think & publicize about MJ & his persona in his later years. In their eyes MJ wasn't true to himself anymore after Thriller.
He didn't want to be black anymore, "all those" plastic surgeries, the public picture he created for himself, the hoopla, the mystery... To them MJ wasn't the simple handsome BLACK boy, who could sing & dance, anymore. He became to big with Thriller & they had to take him down after that... That is what i think!
Thriller was to good & successful to tear it down after the media & public itself made it as bis as it is now. And OTW is his "BLACKEST" album & it's the album where he best fit's the picture of a young, handsome, black man who dances well & sings "appropriate" black songs...

Because of that I especially DO NOT understand if todays black artists say, that OTW is MJ's best album because he was pure & kept it to his roots at the time.

I adore OTW. Its a personal thing. It's when I went from a hard romantic crush on Michael with the Jackson variety show to falling crazy in love. "Rock with You" seduced me and there was no going back.

I totally agree with you that these rumors affected all the reviews after "Thriller" and will also add that it totally killed any dream he had of a successful movie career too-which really makes me angry and bitter.

However, I was a little taken aback with your post about today's black artists. I never thought that before, but maybe that is true. Upsetting, but possibly true. It was my black colleagues that turned against him first about the skin and wouldn't lose an opportunity to make fun of him or tell me about the latest skit about it on "Living Color" or whatever. I took it as just giving me a hard time and laughed it off.

Diana Ross, Whitney Houston, Berry-lots of people had been accused of turning against their black roots so I just took it with a grain of salt.

But there is a lot of praise on OTW now and I would hate it if that was the real reason.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

Maybe black artists say its their fave album because 99.9 of black artists perform R&B music and like listening to it. its just a matter of taste? even more so today with the type of music pharell etc are doing

 

[Themidwestcowboy]

Re: Spike Lee announces Off The Wall Documentary

In my opinion MJ's most underrated album is of course Invincible. Majority of people doesn't even know any song from it except You Rock My World. Then HIStory, Dangerous, Bad.

Within the fan community Vince is def not underrated at all. It makes the discussion tables all the time. HIStory on the other hand, the writing on that album is incredible and songs like 2bad, stranger in Moscow and childhood is among his best songs ever made. Also the significance of the History album needs to be acknowledge as well. He came back so strong through all the tribulations he was faced with with pure art. To me HIStory is like a movie, I'm deviating a little but I truly feel that HIStory is his most underrated/overlooked album.