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Hot topic What unreleased demos and remixes do you think will be on Thriller 40 Disc 2?

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AlwaysThere said:
Already known to you. The general public and more casual fans (at least those who interact with the social media posts) have been commenting their excitement for these songs. Hell, I stumbled across a fan page who had never even heard “She’s Trouble”!
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Fine, let them be excited, let them pay for material they already own or could not even be bothered to listen to on Youtube when it was readily available for free for 20 years. I don’t care. I’m only interested in me. Am I supposed to praise a product even though it’s of no interest to me, because it’s of interest to others? It would be like praising political party A, even though I disagree with their policies, because they are favored by others.
 
Nite Line said:
Lol speak for yourself. Most people are glad that leaked songs are getting released on Thriller 40. Like I said, don't listen to leaked songs and they will be like never heard before songs for you.
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Aren't we all speaking for ourselves? That's my opinion and I stand by it. lol
 

1. „You shouldn't blame the fans for listening to leaks.“

Nobody blames fans for listening to leaks as long as they are able to live with the consequences. You seem to not be able.

You guys are the ones blaming the estate for releasing leaked material.


2. „I don’t care. I’m only interested in me.“

Speaks for itself. Nothing to add.
 
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Nite Line said:
Damien is really annoying.
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No, he is not. We need evidence that songs belong to certain albums. We can't just blindly believe their words considering their shady past, ignorance, laziness, etc.
 
The LNFSG demo is one of my fave MJ recordings. Im talking personal top 40. The sparse instrumentation elevates Michaels incredibly joyous feel good vocal performance, it becomes the focal point because of the piano as the sole instrument. Often MJ’s finished songs have so much sounds and instruments that his songs get overproduced. Michaels voice is more than enough to carry a song and LNFSG is as good an example as any for that.
 
OnirMJ said:
No, he is not. We need evidence that songs belong to certain albums. We can't just blindly believe their words considering their shady past, ignorance, laziness, etc.
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Except it’s not “their” word. It’s a whittle-down process based on the credits that have been available since 2004. What we actually need is evidence from everyone who insists that it wasn’t recorded in 1982.

Normally I agree that the estate should put their money where their mouth is, but this isn’t a case.
 
filmandmusic said:
The LNFSG demo is one of my fave MJ recordings. Im talking personal top 40. The sparse instrumentation elevates Michaels incredibly joyous feel good vocal performance, it becomes the focal point because of the piano as the sole instrument. Often MJ’s finished songs have so much sounds and instruments that his songs get overproduced. Michaels voice is more than enough to carry a song and LNFSG is as good an example as any for that.
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Wholeheartedly agree! May I add that I feel the exact same way about MJ’s solo demo of ‘There Must Be More To Life Than This’
 
kreen said:
Fine, let them be excited, let them pay for material they already own or could not even be bothered to listen to on Youtube when it was readily available for free for 20 years. I don’t care. I’m only interested in me. Am I supposed to praise a product even though it’s of no interest to me, because it’s of interest to others? It would be like praising political party A, even though I disagree with their policies, because they are favored by others.
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I am not going to pay for Thriller 40. I am going to listen to Thriller 40 in spotify. That is how I consume my music. And yes, I am very excited about Thriller 40.
 
Nite Line said:
I am not going to pay for Thriller 40. I am going to listen to Thriller 40 in spotify. That is how I consume my music. And yes, I am very excited about Thriller 40.
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If they put Chicago 1945 or buffalo bill or hot fun in summertime's or rolling the dice or any unreleased song instead of can't get outta the rain everyone will buy the album but this Sony or MJ estate are idiots
 
kreen said:
The Toy is just the demo to Best of Joy. The kind of thing you listen to once. How often do you listen to, say, the Beat It demo or the Shake Your Body demo? They’re interesting historically, but that’s it.

Same with Behind the Mask.
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The Toy is the song on its own. It's not like he just took that song from 1981 and re-sung that first line in 2008 leaving everything else the same. It's completely different vocals and completely different instrumental. So, technically not the same song and still unreleased.

I adore Beat It Demo and listen to it very often. Much often than Behind The Mask by McClain. Shake Your Body Demo I don't listen to very often but just because I completely forgot about it. I love that one too. But not the same thing as with The Toy (from 1981) and Best Of Joy (from 2008). The only comparable thing would be if they release Little Suzie Demo from 1978 and you compare it to Little Susie from the HIStory album. I would also be extremely excited if they decide to release that one one day, just as I am today for The Toy.

Also, I'm sure that I'll listen Mike's Demo of Behind The Mask much more often than McClain's butchered version of Behind The Mask. In my opinion his version is awful with that added sax, live Bucharest vocals, that girl screaming at the end of the song for no reason, repeated first verse...
 
Lotfi11k said:
If they put Chicago 1945 or buffalo bill or hot fun in summertime's or rolling the dice or any unreleased song instead of can't get outta the rain everyone will buy the album but this Sony or MJ estate are idiots
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Thats not gonna happen we will just get leaked songs
 
Ekans said:
Releasing HS and NL on it for example would be just dumb.
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Not releasing Hot Street and Nite Line on Thriller 40 would be extremely dumb. The dumbest idea after releasing fake songs on MICHAEL album. Those two songs, unlike The Toy, Lovely Way and Sunset Driver are actual outtakes from the Thriller album, songs that at some point were on the official tracklist. If MJ didn't gather enough courage to present Beat It Demo to Quincy and if they didn't accidentally found Human Nature Demo on the B side on that tape, one of those two songs would today be part of the Thriller album along with Carousel. They are not just some random songs from that era or songs recorded for some movies - they are actual Thriller outtakes, songs written and recorded specifically for that album.
 
AlwaysThere said:
Except it’s not “their” word. It’s a whittle-down process based on the credits that have been available since 2004. What we actually need is evidence from everyone who insists that it wasn’t recorded in 1982.

Normally I agree that the estate should put their money where their mouth is, but this isn’t a case.
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It may be recorded in 1982 but for sure ain't mixed in 1982 by Bill Bottrell. At least not that version they are re-releasing. Also that same Estate marketed that same song as Off The Wall era track in their video game MJ The Experience where they put Off The Wall album cover next to it and dressed Michael in 70's Off The Wall era clothes.
 
AlwaysThere said:
Except it’s not “their” word. It’s a whittle-down process based on the credits that have been available since 2004. What we actually need is evidence from everyone who insists that it wasn’t recorded in 1982.

Normally I agree that the estate should put their money where their mouth is, but this isn’t a case.
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I'm really puzzled by your position on this tbh. TUC booklet is literally full of errors. So if we're using that as proof I wouldn't say it's enough. It is not up to fans to clarify things like this. Especially considering the Estate's track record.
 
Lotfi11k said:
If they put Chicago 1945 or buffalo bill or hot fun in summertime's or rolling the dice or any unreleased song instead of can't get outta the rain everyone will buy the album but this Sony or MJ estate are idiots
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Most people consume music via streaming nowadays. Very few people actually physically buy albums anymore.
 
OnirMJ said:
It may be recorded in 1982 but for sure ain't mixed in 1982 by Bill Bottrell. At least not that version they are re-releasing. Also that same Estate marketed that same song as Off The Wall era track in their video game MJ The Experience where they put Off The Wall album cover next to it and dressed Michael in 70's Off The Wall era clothes.
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The general consensus seems to be that it was mixed much later, yeah. It would be much easier to tell if the announcement blurbs weren’t written by a fourth grader.

Yeah, the Off the Wall association in the video game was nonsensical. Dumb move there.
SmoothGangsta said:
I'm really puzzled by your position on this tbh. TUC booklet is literally full of errors. So if we're using that as proof I wouldn't say it's enough. It is not up to fans to clarify things like this. Especially considering the Estate's track record.
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The only errors seem to be in regards to the recording dates. The credits, so far as I can tell, are entirely spot on.

Even so, this isn’t a Cascio situation, where the estate shoulders the burden of proof. They’re referencing publicly-available materials, and fans are denying it based on personal opinion and books without citations. If Damien, Joe Vogel, Richard LeCocq, and others seriously believe it’s an earlier recording, they gotta prove it.
 
AlwaysThere said:
The general consensus seems to be that it was mixed much later, yeah. It would be much easier to tell if the announcement blurbs weren’t written by a fourth grader.

Yeah, the Off the Wall association in the video game was nonsensical. Dumb move there.

The only errors seem to be in regards to the recording dates. The credits, so far as I can tell, are entirely spot on.

Even so, this isn’t a Cascio situation, where the estate shoulders the burden of proof. They’re referencing publicly-available materials, and fans are denying it based on personal opinion and books without citations. If Damien, Joe Vogel, Richard LeCocq, and others seriously believe it’s an earlier recording, they gotta prove it.
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The estate own these recordings. They do not need to "reference publicly available materials". Would be very easy to give a clear explanation on the song. Instead they try to say it was written for Thriller, something that has never been considered and is not true, adding even more confusion for no reason.
 
SmoothGangsta said:
The estate own these recordings. They do not need to "reference publicly available materials". Would be very easy to give a clear explanation on the song. Instead they try to say it was written for Thriller, something that has never been considered and is not true, adding even more confusion for no reason.
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It has been considered for the better part of two decades. And it’s not true? What’s the evidence for that?

This is what I mean. Sure, I’d love for the estate to clear up the confusion, but all the claims of “they’re lying” without a shred of counter-evidence is the only thing sowing confusion. Beyond that, if the credits for “Sunset Driver” are debatable, it stands to reason everything else is, too. Was “Cheater” really from 1987? Do we really know who contributed to “In the Back”? We can’t pick and choose what is and isn’t true.
 
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AlwaysThere said:
It has been considered for the better part of two decades. And it’s not true? What’s the evidence for that?

This is precisely what I mean. Sure, I’d love for the estate to clear up the confusion, but all the claims of “they’re lying” without a shred of counter-evidence is the only thing sowing confusion.
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I'm not really sure where you've gotten that the song was written for Thriller from (apart from the recent estate twitter post) but it was written for OTW and has been considered as such for a long time.
 
SmoothGangsta said:
I'm not really sure where you've gotten that the song was written for Thriller from (apart from the recent estate twitter post) but it was written for OTW and has been considered as such for a long time.
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I’m asking for the source on that. The only year that’s ever been concretely attributed to this song, before and after Michael’s death, has been 1982. And even if it was written in the 1970s, so long as it was recorded in 1981-82 (and all legitimate evidence says it was), it’s still a Thriller outtake.
 
According to Chris Cadman it was originally supposed to appear on the Off The Wall SE in 2001 (but withdrawn). That would seem to match the common belief that it was originally written and recorded in the late 70s.

The demo that was released on TUC always sounded more like something post-OTW to me, both due to the instrumentation and the vocal delivery. Seems feasible to me that version was recorded in 1982, but who knows.
 
SoCav said:
According to Chris Cadman it was originally supposed to appear on the Off The Wall SE in 2001 (but withdrawn). That would seem to match the common belief that it was originally written and recorded in the late 70s.

The demo that was released on TUC always sounded more like something post-OTW to me, both due to the instrumentation and the vocal delivery. Seems feasible to me that version was recorded in 1982, but who knows.
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This is also mentioned in the book All The Songs, along with it having been recorded in 1978. Just to clarify I was never arguing whether or not the version on TUC is from 82, just that it wasn't originally written or recorded for Thriller as The Estate is claiming.
 
OnirMJ said:
The Toy is the song on its own. It's not like he just took that song from 1981 and re-sung that first line in 2008 leaving everything else the same. It's completely different vocals and completely different instrumental. So, technically not the same song and still unreleased.

I adore Beat It Demo and listen to it very often. Much often than Behind The Mask by McClain. Shake Your Body Demo I don't listen to very often but just because I completely forgot about it. I love that one too. But not the same thing as with The Toy (from 1981) and Best Of Joy (from 2008). The only comparable thing would be if they release Little Suzie Demo from 1978 and you compare it to Little Susie from the HIStory album. I would also be extremely excited if they decide to release that one one day, just as I am today for The Toy.

Also, I'm sure that I'll listen Mike's Demo of Behind The Mask much more often than McClain's butchered version of Behind The Mask. In my opinion his version is awful with that added sax, live Bucharest vocals, that girl screaming at the end of the song for no reason, repeated first verse...
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About the toy Damien said it's same with behind the mask
 
SoCav said:
According to Chris Cadman it was originally supposed to appear on the Off The Wall SE in 2001 (but withdrawn). That would seem to match the common belief that it was originally written and recorded in the late 70s.

The demo that was released on TUC always sounded more like something post-OTW to me, both due to the instrumentation and the vocal delivery. Seems feasible to me that version was recorded in 1982, but who knows.
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Considering that “For All Time” wound up on Thriller 25, and “Someone Put Your Hand Out” was on an early acetate version of Bad, I feel like the categorization process back then could’ve just been a nightmare. Not sure this really sways the needle in either direction.

I completely agree about the sound. The funk/disco groove is far more present than in other Thriller outtakes, but I think it lends more to the 1980s than the 1990s.
 
Considering Quincy went through 800 songs, so the story goes anyway, I am quite sure sunset driver a 1978 song was at one point in contention even if it was just for a day.

The argument that it sounds too disco for thriller doesn’t make sense. Tracks like hot street or she’s trouble didn’t have the same sound of the tracks that ended up on thriller either. This doesn’t change the fact that both of them are definitely thriller outtakes.

Most songs on thriller appear to be timeless in sound and maybe that is why sunset driver, hot street etc eventually didn’t make it to the album because they were seen too much as a fragment of its time.
Luckily the world is still in an 80s nostalgia period so these dated sounding songs today sound quite fresh for the time being.
 
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