Chris Rock Special - NPR Review critiques MJ joke

[staywild23]

Ok, so admittedly I did not watch the Chris Rock special on Netflix and have no intention of watching it. I actually don't even care that much to dissect it. However, for those who aren't in the know, basically Chris Rock made a joke about how people have "selective outrage" in that they will still listen to Michael Jackson music, while banning R Kelly's music for "the same crime" or something to that effect, simply because MJ's music is better. While it's obviously upsetting to have this kind of a joke thrown around casually in 2023, most of the discourse around this special seems centered on the Chris Rock/Will Smith debacle last year. I haven't seen too much written about the MJ joke. I'm off Twitter now, but I did do some public Twitter searches to get a general vibe and from what I've seen (in that very brief exploration, mind you) all of the widely circulated tweets about Chris Rock and MJ are pro-MJ. So that's cool.

The main reason I wanted to start this thread, however, is to share what I thought was an interesting review in a very mainstream publication.

In this NPR review of the Chris Rock special, the author Eric Deggans writes, "Some jokes just felt a little odd – like complaining about selective outrage by people who dance to songs by Michael Jackson but won't play songs by R. Kelly, who – unlike Jackson – is alive and was actually convicted in court of sex crimes."

This is the only mention of MJ in the review, but I think that's a really good thing. A few years ago, right after LN, NPR published an article dissecting if we should still be listening to MJ and it was all very dramatic, from what I recall. Heavy on the guilt stance. So I see this change in narrative in a mainstream, respected publication, however slight it may seem, to be a very positive sign. From everything I've seen, this is not the perspective that would have been offered 4 years ago.

 

[filmandmusic]

ah thanks, I went from being clueless to now knowing what the talk is about.
I even had to look up who Chris Rock was.

 

[Spider-Man]

That’s a fair observation made by Deggans that I wish more ppl were open to saying. Im actually surprised NPR was willing to publish that given their audience but I’m glad they did.

 

[staywild23]

That’s a fair observation made by Deggans that I wish more ppl were open to saying. Im actually surprised NPR was willing to publish that given their audience but I’m glad they did.

Yeah, I was surprised (and pleased) to see that!

 

[filmandmusic]

This show will get watched by millions again so this is not very good news for MJ unfortunately.
I’m still bewildered how much influence LN had on people’s conscience while the 2005 acquittal is completely forgotten. I have heard things like this so many times since 2019, there are no question marks any longer about the case. At least in the past there would be doubts about those claims. There would be debate, that debate is gone, people just chose to ignore it and still listen to his music

Chris Rock is right though, people are being selective. It is not the first time I hear it in tv or in real life how people unashamedly dance to MJ while they also state with a smile on their face that he he is pedophile.
This doesn’t even mean Chris Rock actually believes Robson and co, he just puts it out as an example.

How can you solve this? It is like swimming up a waterfall.

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

It is not the first time I hear it in tv or in real life how people unashamedly dance to MJ while they also state with a smile on their face that he he is pedophile.
This doesn’t even mean Chris Rock actually believes Robson and co, he just outs it out as an example.

How can you solve this? It is like swimming up a waterfall.

I hope you got a lotta time today.

The way I see it now, the tides had changed against MJ as soon as he bought those Beatles songs. You see the way they continue to place Paul as the victim of some crime or indignation when it was just, business. They didn't want a black man owning the "most important" catalogue in music history and they barely liked a black man achieving so much. We are talking about the nameless unseen rich men, possibly of all races, in the background of capitalism.

My point being, no matter what MJ did, they would've had it out for him and they would be doing all this like it was their life work anyway. It's inconvenient that it almost feels like the gloves fit. But that doesn't change anything, it's a set up anyway. It is a fact that certain entities do not respect black people in the arts. It's just too much. It's not just a conspiracy though. Some black people are trying to do it to Michael B Jordan right now too. Just cause they hate on him. At least the female artists are being treated better than Janet was. Maybe too much better.

Some of the unwashed masses will always laugh and make fun of people though, that's the truth. They suffer and make other people suffer. They are looking for the worst in people. No idea why when we all live die and suffer on the same planet together. MJ was attacked by the other powerful, that's the point. The common people loved him, but too many agree with the rich minorities who use him as their scapegoat. Maybe because of jealousy.

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

Anyway, Chris Rock seems kinda demented these days. I've always thought that before the slal but definitely now.

 

[PurpleThriller]

Has Rock ever made a funny or great joke though?

 

[filmandmusic]

Has Rock ever made a funny or great joke though?

I thought the act he did with Will Smith at the oscars was pretty funny

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

Has Rock ever made a funny or great joke though?

Everybody Hates Chris was funny. Don't think it has much to do with him.

 

[Robbsaber01]

I watched the special last night. While I agree with his overall point of "selective outrage" he used the worst example. Comparing MJ & R Kelly doesnt make any sense "Its the same crime!" but one was actually guilty though?. The joke was in the first 5 minutes of his set so it was easier to ignore afterwards. I dont get why he had to even bring MJ up at all. Agree with the premise, horrible example imo. Spike Lee was there so idk what his reaction was. This was the first time netflix broadcast live. So I feel like if this wasn't live it might of been left out. At least majority of the attention from this special is going to go focus on his situation instead of MJs for sure.

 

[zinniabooklover]

At least majority of the attention from this special is going to go focus on his situation instead of MJs for sure.

I hope so.

I watched the special last night. While I agree with his overall point of "selective outrage" he used the worst example. Comparing MJ & R Kelly doesnt make any sense "Its the same crime!" but one was actually guilty though?.

As a 'joke' or as a performance I thought it was a pile of crap. Badly written, badly performed, illogical, made very little sense bc he just mangled the whole thing. But my concern was / is people won't remember any of that, they will just remember Michael's name being mentioned in amongst this hot mess.

The joke was in the first 5 minutes of his set so it was easier to ignore afterwards. I dont get why he had to even bring MJ up at all.

Exactly. It made no sense. Just badly written garbage, imo.

Agree with the premise, horrible example imo.

Exactly so. An intelligent observation could be made about all of this - although am unconvinced by live comedy as the best place to examine this type of serious issue but maybe that's just me. But, in any case, it didn't happen here, it didn't work. It just collapsed into garbled nonsense.

 

[wendijane]

Kevin Hart meets Michael Jackson on Make a GIF

_premium

makeagif.com

Rock your cancelled son.... its all about Kevin heart lol The gif is from when he saw a Michael impersonator he is being silly but is still a big fan i believe ?? yay for hart . (H|e was a big fan as a child , even had a Michael doll ! cos he said on twitter , hopefully still is . I loved Get Hard, don't make me not like you anymore mr hart
im sorry im going off topic but moral of this thread..... rock is irrelevant lol

Kevin Hart Visually Reacts to Michael Jackson Documentary 'Leaving Neverland'

Kevin Hart had a visceral reaction to our photog who asked if there was any equivalency between Michael Jackson and R. Kelly.

www.tmz.com

 

[DangerousGal91]

What I don't understand is how Chris Rock seems to be against cancel culture, yet still strongly implied that he believes Michael is guilty, essentially partaking in the very same thing. And indeed, R. Kelly was actually convicted, while Michael was acquitted. The entire thing just feels very hypocritical, I don't like that one bit.

 

[zinniabooklover]

What I don't understand is how Chris Rock seems to be against cancel culture, yet still strongly implied that he believes Michael is guilty,

This is what I mean about it being a god-awful mess. He's contradicting himself, undermining his own 'joke', comes across as desperately trying to be 'cool', perhaps. Trying to be funny, I assume. And failing on all counts, imo.

essentially partaking in the very same thing.

Exactly. And comes across as not even realising.

And indeed, R. Kelly was actually convicted, while Michael was acquitted.

This is the worst part of the whole thing. Making a crap 'joke', not even managing to deliver it well and managing to ignore the crucial fact of the entire thing but instead putting Michael into the same category as RK.

The entire thing just feels very hypocritical,

Unintelligent is the word that springs to my mind. Well, that's the polite version. But, yes, hypocrisy is running rampant through this also.

I don't like that one bit.

I don't like any of it. The entire thing is appalling, imo.

 

[PurpleThriller]

Not to be a "hater", but why do people consider this to be brilliant?
Anyone can make similar jokes if they have the slightest sense of humour. What's even worse though,I see nothing intelligent in his comedy/live comedy.

This is even more confusing. This is lack of maturity not comedy,at least in my view.

 

[analogue]

Chris Rock has been accused of rape himself

Chris Rock Settles Hungarian Model’s Pellicano-Related Lawsuit

The comic has denied that anything wrong happened between him and Monika Zsibrita, but the dispute triggered a paternity test, the involvement of jailed PI Anthony Pellicano and perhaps the filthiest lawsuit ever.

www.hollywoodreporter.com

Not saying Chris is guilty but those who shout the loudest are usually the ones with something to hide

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

Chris Rock has been accused of rape himself

Chris Rock Settles Hungarian Model’s Pellicano-Related Lawsuit

The comic has denied that anything wrong happened between him and Monika Zsibrita, but the dispute triggered a paternity test, the involvement of jailed PI Anthony Pellicano and perhaps the filthiest lawsuit ever.

www.hollywoodreporter.com

Not saying Chris is guilty but those who shout the loudest are usually the ones with something to hide

He certainly has no room to talk.

 

[analogue]

He certainly has no room to talk.

And there's photo's of him palling around with convicted rapist Harvey Weinstein. He's quick to attack MJ who was an aquitted man but stays silent on Weinstein. Selective outrage indeed

 

[Paris78]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1632820024166744064

Chris Rock has used my family as punching bags for his entire career. Yet I am supposed to feel bad for him getting slapped and humiliated on the Oscars. After seeing a new clip of him attacking my dead uncle in the first minutes of his “Retaliation-I’m still relevant ”special, I have 3 things to say. 1. What did my family ever do to you to warrant these decades of harassment and your constant bullying disguise as jokes? 2. Just because you were bullied early on in life doesn’t give you the excuse to bully others now. 3. Thank you Will Smith.

 

[Paris78]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1632822053555298305

 

[Hess]

No matter what a fool Chris Rock is, and his joke is both factual incorrect and not funny.

But - saying Thank You to Will Smith for being violent and hitting a person?? - No, just no. That can not and should not be applauded.

 

[Paris78]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1633516821675483151

 

[DuranDuran]

But - saying Thank You to Will Smith for being violent and hitting a person?? - No, just no. That can not and should not be applauded.

What's the difference in that and people on reality TV shows or Jerry Springer fighting? Jerry Springer's show had been on the air for almost 30 years. A lot of actors on movie/TV sets and musicians have got into fights, and not just a slap, they just weren't on live TV. If the Will Smith & Chris Rock thing happened backstage, it wouldn't have gotten any press or very little. Just like the Janet Jackson/Justin Timberlake Superbowl. Janet had long been strapping guys onstage and getting on top of them and it wasn't made a big deal of.

 

[Nite Line]

Chris Rock has always been a dick. I remember watching his interview with Prince from 97, where he tried to bait Prince into saying something negative about Michael, but Prince was smart enough to not do that.

Generally speaking, I don’t find these comedians funny at all. Maybe I don’t have a great sense of humour, but I watch people like Chris Rock and wonder how they have a career making lame and cringe jokes.

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

No matter what a fool Chris Rock is, and his joke is both factual incorrect and not funny.

But - saying Thank You to Will Smith for being violent and hitting a person?? - No, just no. That can not and should not be applauded.

Yeah. There is way too much overlap between will Smith drama and MJ. And tbh, if he hadn't made MJ out to be a bad guy, I would probably be entirely on CR's side. Not really, tho.

 

[Hess]

What's the difference in that and people on reality TV shows or Jerry Springer fighting? Jerry Springer's show had been on the air for almost 30 years. A lot of actors on movie/TV sets and musicians have got into fights, and not just a slap, they just weren't on live TV. If the Will Smith & Chris Rock thing happened backstage, it wouldn't have gotten any press or very little. Just like the Janet Jackson/Justin Timberlake Superbowl. Janet had long been strapping guys onstage and getting on top of them and it wasn't made a big deal of.

Where have I said there is a difference? - And have I ever showed support for Jerry Springer? Or his (violent?) show? Never.

Violence can and should never be accepted. And to make it entertainment like JS did is all wrong. - Was it real or was it like wrestling totally staged?

I do not know how this turned into something like JS or fights backstage is OK?? Makes no sense. Violence is never ok, no matter when or where.

And Janet? - That was not violence, that was a show. And then the americans are weird and can't handle to see a nipple?? Weird.
Still I see no connection what so ever to Chris Rock being assaulted by a violent and disturped man.

 

[zinniabooklover]

Chris Rock has always been a dick. I remember watching his interview with Prince from 97, where he tried to bait Prince into saying something negative about Michael, but Prince was smart enough to not do that.

Off-topic, I guess, but I'd have to disagree with this. I'm not into Chris Rock at all, now or at any point in the past. He just isn't funny to me. But I saw that interview and I thought it was brilliant. I remember wishing he could do a similar interview with Michael. Yes, it was good bc Prince is always good in interviews but CR asked some awesome questions. Way better than the boring nonsense that journalists usually come out with. I honestly don't think he was trying to bait Prince. And I'm sure CR would already know that Prince was too clever to be tricked into that kind of competitive nonsense. Just like when people would ask Michael which artist he would most like to work with next. Michael would say Tchaikovsky. It was probably a true statement but it was also a clever sidestep.

EDIT - just to be clear, I know you didn't say the interview was crap. You were making a specific point about one specific question that was asked. Do I think he was hoping Prince would mention Michael? Yes, I do. Do I think he was hoping it would be something negative? I really don't. But that's just my take on it, obvs.

 

[mthalen]

It's a joke
People are too sensitive these days.

Can't event quote the actual text of an MJ song in my subtext below this post because of the same thing. People are becoming crybabies.

 

[zinniabooklover]

It's a joke
People are too sensitive these days.

I understand your point. Problem is, abuse of any kind is rightly a very sensitive topic. So making jokes around that is always going to be tricky - if it's even acceptable at all, which is debatable - and if your joke is badly written and incredibly badly performed that just makes a bad situation worse.

But mostly it's about incorrect information being aired on prime time tv. Michael was acquitted. This so-called 'joke' just feeds into the narrative that Michael 'got off' just bc he was so rich / a celebrity / got lucky. It's perpetuating the notion that he is no different than RK. That is all kinds of wrong. In theory I agree with the basic notion that comedians are always going to push the boundaries. But a man's innocence shouldn't be ignored and certainly not for so-called 'entertainment'.

I realise that CR was supposedly addressing cancel culture. He wasn't looking at abuse / csa specifically. But he used that as the hook for his opinions and the 'joke' in trying to make his point.

Can't event quote the actual text of an MJ song in my subtext below this post because of the same thing. People are becoming crybabies.

In some instances, maybe. On this occasion I think the outrage is justified. It's also interesting to me that all the anger is about his Michael 'joke'. Nothing about the awful sexism in his routine. But I guess that's a whole other conversation.