Did MJ Find Love In The Dark (continued)

Antwort

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Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars.......

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Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.


It is not good for man to be alone (Ephesians 5:25-33)
 

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It was 30 springtimes ago that I got to see and hear for the very first time a most magical American boy called,,,,,,,Michael Joseph or was that Joe?

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Little did I know then just how much this man would change my life...........

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I suppose it goes to show just how clueless I've always been 😶‍🌫️ I never heard a single word about you..........certainly comes to mind 🎶

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SoS

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Your images are the bomb! Wish I could read the book...what is it I wonder..

30 Springs ago! 1992! It was a very good year. And how fast time flies!
 

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Your images are the bomb! Wish I could read the book...what is it I wonder..

30 Springs ago! 1992! It was a very good year. And how fast time flies!

Just so you know, the 'book' contains something indelible, but hardly intelligible.

I'm glad you like my choice of pictures. I do believe esthetics matter greatly - from buildings to nature, from the brilliance of mind to the authenticity of spirit, from the gorgeousness of a man's face to the sensuality of the ultimate dance, which is love - beauty matters and, as Dostoevsky said, beauty will save the world. I'm afraid we've gotten too well accostumed to the dreariness of life and the darkness of the world that we've forgotten the beauty and light which still do exist.

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Time does fly by - 30 years ago, 3 weeks ago - it's all the same, isn't it? Who's doin' any counting? As we all know, to Michael, time meant very little, if anything at all. He operated at a whole different level, the one with poems about timeless bliss and record-breaking music videos in space(ships).


 

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Had a dream about filming of some MJ cartoon :) where he was singing "I'm hopeless"
 
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SoS

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Magicgirl I was wondering what you thought it meant but I guess with dreams...it’s hard to say.

As it is Easter time when praises to the Christ Jesus is at an all time high I feel to make note about the Hallelujah song I mentioned that I binge on for comfort when the sense of loss is otherwise indescribable.

Someone mentioned to me in pm an “air of familiarity” the song seemed to have, however, the thing about that song that brings me comfort is the unusual melody that’s both haunting and comforting at the same time. I later keyed into the lyrics and was like, o my!

I also like it because I believe Hallelujah (Highest Praises to Jah) is the most powerful word in the universe.

I suppose it could be fitting lyrically as well all except the bit about “you don’t really care for music do ya”. As for the rest of the lyrics I suppose anything is possible...given MJ’s difficult situations of various sorts.

I guess I might as well post this special little song but warning it can be a drag due to its melancholic expression and so to aid in the comfort value and as a hug of sorts to MJ in spirit I will post the kid version for you to enjoy:

Hallelujah kid version in other languages enhance the melodic medicinal value..

 
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Antwort

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Magicgirl I was wondering what you thought it meant but I guess with dreams...it’s hard to say.

As it is Easter time when praises to the Christ Jesus is at an all time high I feel to make note about the Hallelujah song I mentioned that I binge on for comfort when the sense of loss is otherwise indescribable.

Someone mentioned to me in pm an “air of familiarity” the song seemed to have, however, the thing about that song that brings me comfort is the unusual melody that’s both haunting and comforting at the same time. I later keyed into the lyrics and was like, o my!

I also like it because I believe Hallelujah (Highest Praises to Jah) is the most powerful word in the universe.

I suppose it could be fitting lyrically as well all except the bit about “you don’t really care for music do ya”. As for the rest of the lyrics I suppose anything is possible...given MJ’s difficult situations of various sorts.

I guess I might as well post this special little song but warning it can be a drag due to its melancholic expression and so to aid in the comfort value and as a hug of sorts to MJ in spirit I will post the kid version for you to enjoy:

Hallelujah kid version in other languages enhance the melodic medicinal value..


^^^ The Russian kids were amazing, thanks for posting, SoS. Too bad the German youngsters sang in English. It would have been interesting to hear a German version of the song. The melody is indeed very haunting and beautiful. I can see why you like it so much and find it comforting, in spite of its melancholy. That makes a lot of sense, by the way – there is freedom in embracing one's brokenness and accepting life's perplexities and losses.

To be honest with you, when it comes to Leonard Cohen songs/poetry, not that I'm familiar with his entire body of work, I actually prefer Dance me to the end of love. I've also admired his anti-abortion stance, which is a brave and rather uncommon opinion to have, especially in the world of arts and entertainment.

It is indeed Easter time and the praises to the Lord should be very high, but according to some ignorants in newspapers, people should give up belief. What a shame some are unwilling or unable to grasp the beauty of the Gospel – there's no greater wonder and no greater miracle than God's love for us, made manifest through the birth, passion and resurrection of God's only begotten Son - Christ, the Lord. Nothing and no one is more important than this.

And I suppose that is why I have a slight problem with music lyrics like the ones in your 'soothing song' and in others – everything from Michael's very own tunes to Peter Gabriel, for example. From the theological point of view, romantic love should not be placed above the worship we owe to God. From that perspective, pretty much the entirety of Heaven can wait is problematic. If the Lord should come for me before I wake, I wouldn't wanna go..........Thinking about it now, it's probably for the best I wasn't around Michael when he recorded that tune. Cause otherwise, had I seen the lyrics, I might have whooped him a ghostly one over the head, goin' somethin' like ''Say what again, boy? You better choose your words more carefully, little one, or else you're in big trouble''. Before anyone feels the need to jump in Michael's defense and protect him from scary, little me, I would like to reassure everyone that I'd make sure the slap was applied most ghostly and quite gently. Wouldn't want to make a scene and end up in the tabloids now, would we? ;)

But seriously, leaving silly jokes aside, the lyrics about rejecting eternity with God because of a temporary human attachment, however enchanting, are problematic. The Lord's call and kingdom are worth infinitely more than any human affection and attention.

In a similar vein, Sananda Maitreya, back in his Terence Trent D'Arby days, sang in that otherwise amazing tune, Sign your name - I'd rather be in hell with you baby than in cool Heaven. Peter Gabriel also said In your eyes I see the doorway to a thousand churches. With all due respect to these artists, but they either don't know what they're singing about or pretend not to.

Eternal separation from God, which is the actual definition of hell, is no real option for anyone who understands that the One above is the source of all goodness, beauty and eternal love. I also think that anyone who needs the stare of another to see the beauty of God and of His faith, didn't have, perhaps due to no fault of their own, a proper introduction to Christianity.

There is so much purity in the truth of the Gospel, such wonder in the solemnity of the mass, so much wonder in the sacraments and such splendor in the sacred art which can surround believers, that I cannot help but feel sorry for those who miss out on such an amazing gift – God's enduring love and presence made concrete, albeit in sublime ways, in today's turbulent world. Ugly churches and far too contemporary praise music are the notable exceptions to the lines above 🥷

Some other problematic lyrics are those in IJCSLUmy life ain't worth living, if I can't be with you. Of course life is and must be worth living, even when one cannot be with the one they love or, worse yet, when there is no one to love. Life must be worth living because the author of life is God and His love for us is just like Him, infinite and unyielding. Even if the world hates us, even if people don't love us, He does and He always will.

Obviously, all of the lyrics I've mentioned are mere metaphors and expressions about the beauty and the grace which can truly be found in romance. They may also be cautionary lessons about taking things too literaly. They're just words in songs, right? Kind of like Michael in studio recording Fall again and musing over the lyrics about dying in his sleep. How did he put it? But it's a song, right?


What is also true is that God Himself has used the man-wife and parent-child relationships as the the templates for relating to humanity. We are to refer to Him as Abba, because He is our Father and we are made in His image, hence the immense value and dignity of any human life. And that has been exponentially increased by Christ's sacrifice on the Cross, who, like the Bridegroom He is, lovingly gave His life for His bride, the Church.

Furthermore, God made marriage a sacrament and thus, it became the means through which most people can sanctify their lives most readily. The domestic Church, the family, where we are supossed to spend the most time is the best environment in which to practice the virtues of Christian life – love, faithfulness, forgiveness and endurance. Not just for the sake of one other and as reward for the joy we share, but, above all, for the sake of the One who brings us together, loves us tremendously and asks us to walk in His ways daily.

Now, after this long Christian-inspired reflection, I feel the need to return to some other music lyrics. SoS, you were also mentioning Michael's 'difficult situations of various sorts'. Well, a few nights ago, I was reading some comments online and people were using the Depeche Mode tune Condemnation as a call for sympahty for some public figures who had become targets of the media, some of them for days, others for a few years.

Then the thought occurred to me – well, if Michael was around, he could sure help out with some advice on how to deal with the media's viciousness, given that he had decades of experience behind him, fighting so many. I'm pretty sure there were fans, back in 2005, who used the DM tune for confort during Michael's trial. And btw of life experience, I think them folks who could have used Michael's input into dealing with the insufferable ones and their masters, could have also offered Mike advice in other areas, where he might have benefitted from their ideas.

But then again, if one is open enough, they can learn worthwhile lessons from anyone, not just from fellow billionaires. The intrinsic value of people does not reside in their wealth, fame, social status or academic achievements, but rather in their dignity as God's children and their ability to use their God-given talents, whatever they may be, to build others up and praise God through it all. In terms of learning from others, I must say that I am completely inspired and I remain in awe at the grace of those who are able to carry their crosses with strength, dignity, resignation and acceptance, unlike me. I suppose I need to read the full version of the serenity prayer more often, so I can truly make it mine.

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Leaving irrelevant me aside, another Depeche Mode tune came to mind when thinking about Michael and his many troubles was Precious. He was indeed so very precious and the world put him through so very much, perhaps far too much. And beyond his claims at having rhino-skin and all his genuine resilience, perhaps he was also very fragile...........


As for Magicgirl's dream – who knows? I tend to think that dreams are just reflections of our thoughts, preoccupations and desires and they are not necessarily related to reality, but others give them a more profound meaning. They could very well be right.



P.S. Just to be clear – just because I wrote what I did about HCW, doesn't mean I don't love the melody tremendously or find the bridge section most poignant.​
 
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Music has always been a huge part of this thread that it is only befitting I would add some more tunes. I think some of them have already been posted, but perhaps others are novelties of sorts. Turns out, I love music a bit too much for the logistical abilities of the site, so much so, that I'm overloading and I need to separate my post in two, since we can't have more than five videos/post. So here goes part 1 😁

As the premise of the thread goes, Michael has been using, potentially for decades, his own songs in order to send out messages to some chick out there. Highly implausible, most improbable idea, but interesting nonetheless. I'm pretty sure that Killing me softly by the Fugees has been posted at some point in the thread.

Well, if that theory proved to be remotely true, then that gal should consider herself very, very lucky, if not blessed. Just think – who would be dumb enough to turn down someone as colossally famous Michael as was, with all his countless Grammys and his billions counted by business mags every year? No one in their right mind would, right? The prior question was actually sarcastic, but I am afraid I have to spell it out for people occasionally, otherwise they won't get my twisted sense of humor.

If the theory behind the thread is actually true and someone has been receiving musical messages from/on behalf of Michael, then she should indeed consider herself very lucky because of …..........his line of business. Can y'all begin to imagine what would happen if every man out there chose to use his day job as a means of communicating love? I can think of two or three professions that would make it really, really awkward, if not downright sumber. The dark recesses of my twisted sense of humor need not be explored though 😋 Therefore, that chick better thank her lucky stars that Michael was involved in such an exquisite type of job, hence a most sublime form of torture for her.

Since I am in a bit of a lazy mood right now, I'll go ahead and steal some of SoS' thoughts from the hoax thread. For efficiency's sake, I won't make yet another post there. Here's what she had to say

I guess my main concern at this point would be how life would be for him if he has to be in hiding and being even more dependent on the crew around him than ever before. That’s potentially a lot of leverage (power) others still would have over him seems to me unless he’s mastered the art of living incognito independent of others but then could Michael Jackson actually live incognito without the constant attention he knew most of his life? Such dopamine rushes could have even become addictive and whatever else he constantly had an over abundance of, his whole life.

It’s hard to imagine a totally different paradigm for him to live life from. Ordinary life might would get boring fast.

I hope if he is free that he is free indeed and also can enjoy his freedom. I’d imagine for MJ being free for the first time might would be like a fish growing feet and walking for the first time

The idea that those around Michael, should he still be around, would have a lot of leverage over him, does sound sort of menacing. I've never looked at it that way. Quite on the contrary, I've always figured that if Mike had to get away, not only did he do it for very good reasons, but he also had a lot of help, from very good and decent people, hence my urge to always pray not just for him, but also for anyone who might be helping and protecting him, in the eventuality that he is still in this world. The other part of the prayer is about his soul, the children and the family and the ones who helped him till 2009, if he is indeed dead.

Don't know about folks around Michael, how well meaning or not they may be, but I think the idea that Michael Jackson could live completely alone, in absolute isolation from people is very funny. Can you imagine him doin' laundry or cook for himself? Come on, now. One thing he could do with his not-so-new found freedom would be the liberty to walk around on Halloween without any disguise whatsoever. After all, according to the media, he is dead. Therefore, people would automatically assume he is an impersonator. Didn't he lose a look alike contest back in the day, back when we all knew that he was definitely alive? I actually find that situation completely hilarious 😅

Ordinary life may indeed be very boring for someone like Michael, who lived for decades surrounded by flashing cameras and screaming fans. I would imagine even more so after 13/14 years now. One can wonder what on earth could Michael Jackson be doin' all day long while the world considers him dead. If 'he kept to himself' prior to 2009, as I recently read on Twitter, what could be said about the last 13 years, if the hoax is actually real? I guess, in a way, it would be a hybrid experience for him, a chance to see what life is like for commoners, like us, somehow, I guess......

But seriously now, if he was in danger and had to get away, then he needed to be protected and be provided for in the best of ways. If I remember correctly, one of the early theories in the hoax was that Michael had to enter the witness protection program because he was involved in a sting operation against pill-pushing doctors in Holywood. But then, in movies, common people who enter the program get a complete change of identity. I wonder what happens in real life, especially if the person of focus is someone as well known as Michael.

And btw of the idea of the involvement of federal agents, I think there was someone in this very thread who said that there actually was a chick in the dark for Michael and even she was under the discreet protection of benevolent forces, who were aware of her. Wasn't it proposed that a couple of BEP tunes - Just can't get enough and Meet me halfway - were actually about the two of them?



So, basically, Michael had to have......all the right friends, in all the right places in order to pull all this hypotethical thing off. It is a fact that he had plenty of enemies; and some of them very powerful. Hopefully, he also had even more powerful friends and allies.

Now, leaving fanciful scenarios aside, since SoS offered us a great tune last time around, I figured I would also post one of my favorite performances of all time. And it comes from Korea.


Won't go anywhere near the spelling of the names, since I must admit that Korean is not my forte, but I have to say that Yoon Min Soo and Shin Yong Jae have some of the most powerful, emotive and amazing voices I've ever heard, while the voice of the opera lady who accompanies them is absolutely etherial. In between the three of them, they truly provide one of the greatest performances ever. No wonder the audience is in awe. So am I.

And if we're talking awesome performers, obviously it doesn't get any better than Michael. Here are some of the loveliest scenes from that movie that was released so many moons ago

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💗

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Also, I think I shall add two of my favorite tunes of his, even if they are lesser known. I find them very poignant and touching, irrespective of how many are aware of them or not.



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Antwort

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2/2 On previous occasions, I've also shared photos, hence it's only fair I should keep the 'tradition' now.

Here are a couple of really beautiful quotes, from C.S. Lewis - there are far, far better things ahead than any we leave behind and from St. Paul - no eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has concieved, what God has prepared for those who love Him.

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They are great reminders that irrespective of the evil that happens and the good that doesn't, God is to be praised always, because He is good and worthy of all our praise.

Agnus Dei
by Michael W. Smith sums up that idea magnificently, especially when superimposed over movies.



Since I like symmetry a lot and circling back is/was quite fashionable, I think I'll also do a bit of a connection between my last three posts. For starters, I think it's a funny coincidence that there is a Depeche Mode tune which shares the same title as one of the BEP tunes I've mentioned - Just can't get enough. Different eras, different styles, but who knows – perhaps they are part of the very same story??

Also, given the previous I'll be there animation from TII feature big Mike, it's only fair i should do a quick time jump and also post the cute video retweeted by his brothers the other day, featuring of course, sweet lil' Michael 🤗


Lovely tunes and tHE loveliest of people. Who could ask for anything more?

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SoS

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Wow what a post Antwort!

Chock full of all sorts of good stuff which only a few do I have opportunity to note.

In no particular order I’d like to comment on a few of these beautifully well expressed thoughts.

I too had a similar reaction to HCW, particularly the “tell the angels, no” part.

I found the temerity of MJ rather amusing. I remember thinking, only MJ can get away with telling God, “no.”

Thanks for posting some This Is It.

This Is It is my new favorite film (since 2009). I think that one thing that caused me to wonder if he’s still with us was seeing the film’s title, Michael Jackson’s This Is It. The only time I’d ever seen the name over the title with an apostrophe “s” it was the director’s credit, maybe a producer? but the performer? not so much. Anyone else have input there? Maybe I’ve missed something.

I think I should clarify that it isn’t necessarily the quality per se or the decency or not, of the people who’d be with him, if he’s tucked away safely in some cute life in a cozy small town where he can wear his own choices of colors looking nothing like the character the world knows (same strategy he used for PPB to be unrecognizable in the street) or with some relatively small trusted group— it’s the “position” itself I’d be concerned about...it’s the leverage others would have over him, especially if they want to control him by constantly threatening to call the press etc.

Most especially if he’s restricted from easy physical movement which was his main leverage or semblance of freedom pre-2009—to be able to sky up up and away if and when he got ready. They say his cut off game was strong when he got tired of folks or needed a change of scenery as creative people often need, but if he’s stuck with anyone he wants to cut off ...it would seem that he can’t not to mention the slippery slope it could be for his dependencies for pain medication that he seem to have still had, as of frequently visiting Klein’s office near the end, which could place even more leverage over him...but I’m not being a worry wort ok yes I am...lol...well..

..Plus when a select few know your secret, it’s just a bad position to be in. And sometimes people you’ve known your whole life can show you whole new sides of them when you place them under new kinds of pressures especially with new kinds of power. js

Sometimes even married couples get some pretty rude awakenings about who the other person really is. I’d also I magine that he might would be depressed because of maybe feeling like he’s “imprisoned” in his obscurity just as he felt when he was “imprisoned” in his fame,

I reflect on that June Gatlin tape where he was calling her because someone had taken over his life with everyone watching! If it’s true he could never say no, I can only imagine people finding investments for him to make that would serve only them, then what could he do? Or say someone is finally too much to bear. . . say they’re verbally or physically abusive like Thome Thome was (we all saw how he grabbed MJ’s arm) just what on earth could he do? He can’t even leave! Just for leverage alone they could keep his “secret” hanging over his head. It’s probably not so but still...oh well let me get off this ..

That other Leonard Cohen song is quite cute! Thanks for sharing!

A far cry from Hallelujah!

I normally wouldn’t mix hallelujah meanings, just was trying to segue back to clarifying my reasoning for posting such a rather dreadful yet comforting tune. You expressed the power of the resurrection so beautifully thank you.

As I was reading I asked Siri to play Depeche Mode and she played Just Can’t Get Enough! Nice music!

Being an MJ fan is educational and inspirational

As for the “messages” in the music, I enjoyed that part of your post too.

I guess that like everyone, I view this whole thing through my “filters”So for me, I feel that this “love story” via song is most accurately told in hindsight...or backwards

Like any great movie.

Beginning with the end in mind.

Taking the last adult solo MJ songs into consideration and going back just before SITD - the J5/Jackson’s era which was a time when their music was prophetic-

- and the self fulfilling prophecy that some of that old music later became....in MJ’s adult stuff...if that makes sense.

If not ...know that if anyone asks I’ll explain at some point for sure
 

Magicgirl

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yes dreams, have nothing to do with reality, sometimes I can hear MJ singing in dreams, and it's always some new songs the words of which I can't remember when I wake up. Maybe MJ spirit still continues writing something in heaven :) But from the other hand I heard MJ singing in my dreams some new songs when MJ was still alive. So it's just dreams.
 
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